11:31am: The clubs have not been in touch “for a few days” and remain “apart,” Heyman now tweets.
10:31am: The Astros remain engaged with the Tigers about a possible deal that would send star righty Justin Verlander to Houston, according to Jon Heyman of Fan Rag. Verlander has cleared revocable waivers, meaning he can be freely dealt — so long as he is willing to waive his no-trade rights.
Verlander, 34, is among the many players that have reportedly cleared waivers in recent weeks. While several organizations surely had interest in him at the trade deadline, his large contract — which includes about $7MM in remaining salary this year, $56MM in guaranteed money for the 2018 and 2019 seasons, and a 2020 vesting option — remains an evident obstacle.
Prior reports had suggested that talks between these organizations had failed to gain traction, though obviously the picture is always susceptible of change. There’s still “a decent gap” between the teams at present, Heyman adds, though it remains notable that there’s ongoing dialogue.
Even assuming Houston and Detroit can work out the money and agree upon a prospect return, there remains the wild card of the no-trade protection. It’s not clear whether Verlander would demand any consideration for accepting a deal, though there has been some discussion of that possibility — including the potential that he could seek to pick up an opt-out opportunity.
While there are obviously still significant barriers to a deal, there’s also clear motivation for both teams. The Astros will easily win their division, but their rotation has shown cracks over the course of the season and they missed on their top targets at the trade deadline. Verlander, meanwhile, has turned things around of late after a middling performance to open the year. In his last seven outings, he carries a 1.91 ERA over 47 frames, racking up a 50:16 K/BB ratio while holding opposing hitters to a paltry .187/.258/.327 batting line.
That surge has helped to boost the near-term and long-term outlook on Verlander. After showing some signs of slowing down in prior campaigns, he turned in a monster 2016 season in which he ran up a 3.04 ERA over 227 2/3 innings — though he was also aided by a .255 BABIP-against. While it’s fair to temper expectations given Verlander’s age, he is carrying a 95.7 mph average fastball velocity that sits above his career average and a 9.8% swinging-strike rate that lands just below his overall mean.
This story has been going on for a while now, I just don’t see it getting done. I am a die hard Tigers fan and actually want this for him. Dude deserves another shot at a ring before his contract expires. One of the best to wear a Tigers uniform.
100% agree
They’ve basically have a month to play chicken on. If Heyman is saying the only gap is the salary money coming back in the talks that suggests they are close to a deal on both sides and they are going back and forth because they still have time to make a deal.
Deserves? Whatever happened to the idea of earning a shot?
He has earned another shot by what he has done and continues to do throughout his career.
Only 16 more days and all this Verlander talk will be over until the winter (unless Al is willing to give him away).
I cannot see how the opt-out truly creates a problem. He is still a damn good pitcher and gives two options:
Strong push for a contender, even if he opts out or a stable piece of a rotation.
I understand he has a hefty price and total deal and prospects are key. Just think he could be solid for a contender or in offseason a good trade for rebuilder near the cusp.
Anything Heyman reports should be taken with a grain of salt.
he already contradicted his first report after about an hour and said the teams haven’t talked for days. I guess he can just throw crap against the window and see if any of it sticks. Nice gig if you can get it……
If Verlander is trade-able with an OPT OUT, then why not Justin Upton too?
Astros need to pull trigger on Verlander deal, but the conversation will have to start with Tucker. If you are the Astros, you can’t pass up an opportunity to go for it to protect your future because there are no guarantees they will EVER be in this spot again.
There is no garutee this year either andkeeping Tucker gives the team the ability to compensate should they be unable to resign Springer.
It’s better to have 7 years of being a favorite with no garutees than to have only 3 years because the team tied up too much money in a trade that prevented resigning Keuchel, Altuve, Bregman, Springer, etc.
If I’m the Astros Tucker and Whitley are off the table, everyone else is fair game.
He is off the books when all but Dallas hit free agency.
I dont think the Tigers covet Tucker as much as they do Fisher.. The question is”who comes with Fisher?” It may have been Bregman but they traded for Lugo and later Candelario. They liked Paulino but then he was suspended. Either way, I dont see this trade happening either because the package they seek will not get any smaller than it is now and if JV pitches well tonight, then the price goes……pitches well on the 22nd, the price goes up….and so on
Fisher and Bregman won’t be involved in any trade right now. Neither would make through waivers unclaimed. Plus there is no way the Astros trade Bregman their starting third baseman.
Everyone has a price on his head!
The talk dies at Tucker. I think JV is a great arm and the Astros NEED him, but he has opt out clauses in his contract. That means the Astros would potentially give away a five tool player that they control for years to come for a few month rental. Yes, that is if JV opts out. But there is no protection for the Astros in that deal. No one gets Tucker in a trade.
verlander doesn’t have an opt out. There is speculation that he would want one to waive his no trade ability, but no one knows for sure yet.
If the Astros wanted to give up Tucker for Verlander they would have claimed him on waivers. You’re not getting any prospect like Tucker for a guy no one wanted for free (with his contract).
Just one more example how huge deals hardly ever work out for the teams. If MLB, and all other sports, would just adopt performance based compensation (so much $ per HR, SO, SV, etc), players would be paid based on actual production, and things would be more fair for everyone.
Elite hitters would flock to Coors, Wrigley, and Yankee Stadium. Elite pitchers would go to Dodger Stadium and Petco.
Verlander’s been great this year with a 4+ ERA. Not the best idea. Let the market determine a player’s value.
Why does Preston tucker always get brought up by stros fans. He adds nothing to a deal.
This won’t work. Teams don’t want to pay $60 million to one player in a year they have a very good season. They need to budget years in advance.
I’m thinking Kyle and Preston Tucker w/ the corpse of Jonathan Singleton + half of JV’s contract. Tne Astros have controlable cheap talent for the remander of JV’s contract. I don’t think the Cubs or there fans will ever regret trading Torres for a World Series. This trade makes so much sense on both sides it is ridiculous. Oh, before any Tiger fans complain about the money we eat, remember tickets aren’t getting any cheaper anyways! Its not your money!
Absolutely no way the Tigers get a extremely high ranked prospect like Kyle Tucker in a verlander trade
When you have a loaded team and organization like the Astros, you need to take a chance. No guarantees that Tucker pans out. Take a shot and win the series this year. (No guarantee) The Tigers traded two top ten players in 2008. Only took Maybin 8 yrs to be an avg CFer and Miller 5 yrs and a switch to the bullpen to be a major leaguer. With the outfield they have and the $ the Tigers would eat, it would be worth it. WIN NOW!
Big difference between trading for a 25 year-old Miggy and a 34 year-old Verlander.
The point isn’t Miggy. The point is do you hold on to a prospect that may or may not even have a major league career in 3 yrs or trading him for a guy that could put you over the top. I would have traded any prospect, save Trout, of the last decade for a closer in 2013 for the Tigers. I’ll take the shot at the title today.
Astros could get a better, cheaper pitcher than Verlander for Kyle Tucker.
Ok, but who right now. For a real run this season. I don’t understand fans and organizations that say” next year” When this year is available. Maybe thats why certain franchises never win titles.
Your opinion that they need to take a chance is irrelevant when the Astros have been reluctant to trade Tucker all year and called him untouchable
We can argue about whether or not the Astros were too frugal with their prospects but if they were going to trade Tucker it wouldn’t be for Verlander. If the Astros were willing to give up that good of a prospect for Verlander they would have claimed him.
There aren’t many pitchers playing better than Verlander right now.
I honestly don’t think any young pitchers who are playing as good as Verlander are on the market.
The win now mentality is great and all but that doesn’t mean you just make awful trades just for the sake of doing so. Tucker could get them much better players than verlander. Astros are smart enough not to trade their best prospects for a pitcher past his prime with a mammoth contract
In my proposal tigers would be on hook for 30 mill of the 60 and take 4 mill with Singleton. So you get an Ace that is HEALTHY for the postseason. For and increase your payroll by 12 mill next yr and 14 the following. Also, what young pitcher for Preston. Who is available right now. I’m not saying they will do it, I’m saying they should.
Verlander, “past his prime?” I think he is hitting his stride.
Why would the Tigers want Singleton? He has a long term deal but has not amounted to anything in the minors from what I recall.
For the other two prospects. By the way they only would owe him 3 mill next two yrs.
Haha Quintana isn’t available any more.
Astros weren’t willing to include Tucker as a headliner for 3.5yrs of cheap price on Quintana or 2.5yrs of Gray. Management would have to admit they messed up if sent to Detroit for JV. Luhnow thinks he’s playing a game of chicken when it’s been a strong sellers’ market all along for pitchers……as if clubs will fear injury so much they’ll accept a lackluster return.
Never let past mistakes ruin new opportunities.
Or they would have bask in the glory of a Championship with a guy who has a 2 ERA and a 1 WHIP in the second half and has a track record of stepping up for big games in the post season.
Lunhow probably has his values for every player in the majors and minors. If it doesn’t add up, he won’t do it.
So let us know if this trade is actually happening when it does.
Hold on I’m on hold right now with Houston and Detroit.
Houston is in a great spot but sometimes you need to give something up to advance. How much would a World Series be worth? No guarantees to be back in this spot this year or the next. Probably won’t happen and it will be funny to see them bounced in the first round by the Yankees. C’mon! Give the Tigers some prospects!!
Trade him before tonight’s start
Franklin Perez for JV. Throw in a couple high upside lower ranked guys and call it a day.
Its not like the astros don’t have prospects to give up,last i heard the system is loaded
Hmm. Did the A’s have reservations about trading Gray to a division rival? Clearly the Astros could use a starter and it wouldn’t have been hard for them to beat Kaprielian, Mateo and Fowler. Heck, I would have just kept Gray instead of trading him for Kaprielian, Mateo and Fowler.
JV isn’t going to be an Astro. It’s silly to even dream about it
Tigers messed up last off season by not pairing Verlander and JD Martinez together. Basically a you can have Martinez but you have to take Verlander’s contract too.
Houston has to make this deal. This second half of the season, the Astros have been playing mediocre ball – not like the first half – and require an “ace” like Verlander to put them into the World Series. Astros are loaded with young talent at the major league level and in their “farm system.”