Links for Saturday…
- MLB Network's Peter Gammons hears from an agent that the Pirates and Royals are "offering big" this offseason, and that the "Angels, Red Sox, [and] Mets could be left behind." (Twitter link)
- In a mailbag piece, Paul Hoynes of The Cleveland Plain Dealer says he doesn't believe Grady Sizemore has any trade value until he shows he can play after having microfracture surgery on his left knee. Sizemore will earn $7.5MM in 2011, then the team will have to decide between his $9MM option for 2012 or a $500K buyout.
- Jason Coskrey of The Japan Times passes along another report indicating that the Rakuten Golden Eagles have interest in both Kazuo Matsui and Kenshin Kawakami (Twitter link).
- Matt Gelb of The Philadelphia Inquirer says you can bet on the Phillies adding an "older pitcher on a non-guaranteed contract" to compete with Kyle Kendrick and Vance Worley for the team's fifth starter spot.
- MLB.com's Carrie Muskat lists some pitching coach candidates for the Cubs in the wake of Larry Rothschild leaving for the same position with the Yankees.
- Troy Renck of The Denver Post passes along some quotes from Felipe Paulino about joining the Rockies. Colorado acquired Paulino from the Astros on Thursday.
Take him Rakuten!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Pay half his salary and he’s yours!!!!!
Please Golden Eagles, take Kawakami!!! What NYBravosFan10 said…^
Get a life people, you talk like Kawakami tortures your children all day… I already like Golden Eagles, so it will be awesome to see Kawakami with their staff. Having a potential 1-2 punch of Masahiro Tanaka and Kenshin Kawakami would be awesome!
anyone crapping on KK should compare his stats and D Lowe’s when KK was demoted. Virtually identical except for W-L. At the time, the pitchers KK went up against had roughly 1.50 better ERA than the pitchers D Lowe faced.
The braves gave up on him far too early but that’s in the past now.
We don’t have to compare anything, Lowe had his best year with the Braves last season though, IMO it didn’t seem like it.Yes, 4.00 ERA isn’t good but it’s better than what KK would have gotten if he played a full season.
I remember that too, KK got no run support as well.But, come on, he just doesn’t belong here, no offense to KK, though.
I am aware Lowe had his best year as a brave. I’m saying at the time of KK’s demotion, his stats were identical to Lowe’s. And, Lowe makes 15 mill vs. 6.67 for KK. It’s interesting to me that KK takes such abuse on the message board.
We had Minor in the rotation at the end of the season and he posted close to a 6 ERA. It would’ve been nice to have been able to go to KK in that position. But hey, “he doesn’t know how to win!!!!!” :sigh:
Let’s not blow Minor’s numbers out of proportion here. He dealt with a tired arm after his first full season of professional baseball, advancing all the way to the big league level.
And as far as KK is concerned, no he didn’t torture my children, but he does torture the Braves ability to spend. I agree that his numbers and D.Lowe’s numbers at the time of his demotion were nearly identical. However, their salaries are not even close to being identical. Neither is their ability to pitch in the ML. Lowe is a proven commodity, and we saw him the last month+ after he tweaked his slider, dominant. I don’t know what happened to KK, but it sure seems like he had some problems with the coaching as well, for him to fall into the doghouse so fast. Remember, the Braves don’t like unruly players or players who don’t take kindly to coaching. Maybe KK didn’t want to do what Roger and Bobby wanted and now he’s on his way out. Just speculation, but something seems to have been behind the way he was treated.
And the braves are paying KK less than half of D. Lowe’s salary.
We’ve tried with him many times, he’s just not a fit for the different aspects of american pitching. The guy pitched for 13 years in japan and sometimes it just isn’t gonna happen over here when you’re given a bigger ball that’s made of different materialand forced into a 5-man rotation instead of 6. Yes he has been plagued by lack of run support but even when he gets support he’s bad. I don’t have a personal problem with him and the main reason I’m so adamant about getting rid of him is because I feel bad that he’s lost into obscurity here when he could be doing something useful in Japan.
I think he was fine. Slightly overpaid, but fine. Again, at the time he was demoted, his #’s were better than the #5 pitcher of at least 10 other NL teams and had better stats than a lot of 4 starters.
I’ll be happy to see him somewhere else. Hopefully he can go to a team where it’s fans appreciate him and don’t base his perception purely on W-L. ‘
Again, other than W-L, his stats were identical to Lowe when he was demoted.
Except here’s the thing. He was 1-9!!! You don’t get to 1-9 by having bad run support as the only culprit. Usually a guy that will get bad run support but is still effective will have a record like 7-9 or 10-11 or something like that but not 1-9. And unless you’re talking about Cardinals fans you can’t realistically expect fans to appreciate those numbers and when it comes down to it, you can’t let personal feelings towards a player get in the way of what really matters. It’s terrible that it’s like that but that’s what baseball is about sometimes.
Are you trying to say that I’m letting personal feelings get in the way? I’m looking at stats! You’re the one saying you don’t need to look at them. I have a feeling I’m talking to a wall but let me try to explain it this way – if Tim Hudson had to face Roy Halladay 10 times, Hudson would have a losing record over those 10 games. It’s not because Tim Hudson doesn’t know how to win. It’s because he’s facing a better pitcher.
Thanks for the laugh though. I’m going to work on getting my feelings out of the way and stop looking at those pesky stats.
Then you, please contact your favorite teams GM and tell him to trade for this guy. Give us $3m and you can have him. See how you like him at the end of the year.
I’ll also assume you’re not a big Hanson fan because even though he has great stats, his record was under .500 for the year. I guess he just doesn’t know how to win. K-Rod either.
I think we’ve hit a stalemate on this. We’re both right. Forget the personal feelings thing I think I worded that wrong. You’re looking at ERA which can sometimes show that a pitcher isn’t getting good run support and I’m looking at the thing that is a direct indication of the outcome of the game and is therefore a more important stat (wins) but can be misleading because of what you are looking at. So it all just goes in one big circle that ends in neither side caring anymore and just coming to the conclusion that he belongs in Japan and coming to America was a failed experiment. Sound about right?
Not really. I think he can do fine in the states. I wasn’t just looking at ERA. Since you think wins is the most important stats, I’ll take that to mean that you would take Paul Hughes, Justin Verlander, Jon Lester, Carl Pavano, etc. over Felix Hernandez.
or Phil Hughes even 🙂
Felix Hernandez is a special case. He and Zack Greinke. How they manage to get so many wins on trash teams is nothing short of a miracle. Kawakami was on a playoff team this year and he was bad during the time of year when the Braves were scoring runs in their sleep so you really can’t always compare the two
Can we compare Hanson & Lowe? Hanson had a sub-500 record. Are you saying Lowe is a better pitcher than Hanson?
Alright, I’ve got to get off here but you made my point for me. In your last line, you said you can’t always compare the two. However, you can always compare ERA, WHIP, K’s, BBs, etc.
You don’t seem to care that KK went up against MUCH better pitching than Lowe did, in fact over 1.5 runs per game better. I take it into account when I’m judging someone’s performance. As I said earlier, as good as Hudson was, if he had to face someone better than him 10 times, he’s going to be a losing pitcher.
Thanks, though, I enjoyed the discussion.
Are you looking at the stats? Kawakami had the worst WHIP of any qualifying pitcher on the team, and he allowed a whopping 10.1 Hits/9. OK, I get it. His strikeout and walk rates are eerily similar to 2009 when he wasn’t that bad. That doesn’t mean he doesn’t suck.
Kawakami was worth a whopping -1.0 WAR in 2010, making him the Atlanta Braves least valuable pitcher, and second least valuable player. Only Nate McLouth was worth less. Derek Lowe was the Braves fourth most valuable pitcher, with a 1.7 WAR, and the Braves ninth most valuable player overall.
If you look beyond the stats and actually watch some of his starts from 2010 you will see why he went 1-10. His pitching style actually hurts the defense and offense. His starts are excruciating. He throws tons of pitches, gives up on batters, allows tons of base runners and is constantly working his way out of jams. Every inning he pitches takes so long that the defense loses its edge, and we finally get to bat again the opposing pitcher is well rested and the hitters eagerly put the first pitch in play in nearly every at bat.
So let me get this straight. There is a posabillity that Sandberg’s whole staff in Tripple A might be on the Cubs coaching staff But not Sandberg!!! This just doesn’t add up!
As much as I dislike ignoring my inner voice of logic and reason, I agree with NYBravo. I know KK was every bit as good as Lowe in that time and I was as big a supporter of him as anyone. Heck, I defended him several times during discussions on the Braves games boards at ESPN’s site. But at a certain point, you put logic aside and do what the rawest of all stats says. And that stat says KK wasn’t winning games. He got less run support and lost for that reason, but how long do you keep stubbornly sending him out there, waiting for what SHOULD happen to happen while it keeps not happening?
What does “offering big” mean? And as long as it’s something good for my Royals I’m happy.
Great question, Span. Took the words right out of my mouth.
Means Moore is about to offer Franceour a 3-year deal for 21$M and the Pirates are offering McCutchen up to any team willing to part with three turds and a 100$ bill.
Braves should get McCutchen to compensate not getting Carl Crawford to sign for 4/$65 and kick McClouth outta there…
The Pirates would only trade Cutch to the Braves if they get Tommy Hanson or Jason Heyward in return.
Good call, and the Pirates would have to ask for one of those two…Maybe Kimbrel.
The Pirates would ask for both. There is no chance in hell that Clutch gets traded, come on people
Andrew McCutchen gets traded IF THE PRICE IS RIGHT. Period.
It ***won’t*** happen…but if Atlanta offered up Heyward+, that trade could happen. There is *ALWAYS* a chance, but it would have to be ML ready talent in excess of what McCutchen provides — not a bunch of “prospects”.
My deal for you: Heyward, Hanson, and Chipper for 1 season (Fav. Player, only reason) and you can have Clutch. haha
My deal for you: Heyward, Hanson, and Chipper for 1 season (Fav. Player, only reason) and you can have Clutch. haha
I’m not sure what the Royals would be offering big for. Most knowledgable fans realize 2011 is another throw-away season. Only thing I can think of is they’re trying to bring in someone to put butts in seats to buy another year of patience. It’s not like we’re only missing one piece…
For our sake, I personally think its best to give the in house guys the 2011 season to play their hearts out and give them one last chance to prove they are worth something. I’m primarily talking about Dyson/Gordon/Getz/O’Sullivan/Pena/Hochevar/Tex/Tejeda/
By the time they play or don’t play well, its Moose/Hosmer/Monty/Duffy/Coleman/Keating/Hardy/Giavotella time anyway, so we’ll see.
So they are in the same situation as the Pirates pretty much, except the Bucs may be a year ahead but with worse prospects. This year is all about the individual performances and growing into a team
Both teams have developing systems and should be in contention by 2013…I do agree that the Pirates have a more suited current Major League team, but the Royals minor league system in best in Baseball…It’s going to be awesome and interesting…
Because the source is an agent don’t assume it’s just about free agents. They seem to know when trades are going down too. Even if isn’t one of their clients. Greinke straight up for Upton, and maybe even another player going to the Royals.
Well, truth be told, I think the Pirates are in the better position. Im scared to say this…because its been quite some time since being able to think like this: The Pirates have tons of major league talent, unfortunately all of the talented pitching is still 1-3 years away.
But when this pitching is ready, this team has the potential to win a few central division titles.
the most amazing part is to hear that these two franchises might financially outbid the red sox and mets…amazing thought to be honest.
I like it, it’s never been this way for my entire life, actual hope! Can’t wait for the over .500 victory parade!
and let me add…”This year is all about the individual performances and growing into a team” I assume you mean for both teams, and you are absolutley right…It’s going to be the end of consecutive losing seasons for the two after ’11…Things will be exciting!
sorry double post
I agree, it was unclear what he means by offering big, money or players? Offering big money would be great but players, I dint even know who the Pirates can realistically trade
Maybe the pirates will sign their new LF/GM and new WR for the Steelers, Carl Crawford.
i wish the royals the best. Id love to see winning seasons for both of our underachieving franchises
pretty soon dude. Royals 2015 World Champions…2014 divison winners. 2013 84 game winners.
when you get a minute, go look at the pirates wins and losses at home and on the road from last year. I rack that up to terrible management. If Clint Hurdle gets more talent, and manages for 162 games…the pirates have a legit shot of playing .500 ball this year…and if he finishes with 82 wins…he will have a statue erected in his honor outside of PNC Park lol.
So the Royals and Pirates are going to bid heavily for Lee or Crawford? I definitely think Crawford would be great for the Pirates…
Only in a perfect world would they have a shot of signing him, cant help but imagining that outfield though.
Im becoming more at ease with Doumit, Jones, Bowker, Milledge, and Pearce splitting time between 1B and RF…
What I really want for Christmas is a real MLB SS and some capable pitching.
I think Cedeno is an issue that can hold off one more season, what people do not seem to be realizing is that the offense was second to last last year, and they need help big time there as well, although the young jitters should improve…main focus should be starting pitchers
I really believe Brandon Webb could be the best off season signing by any team…I really hope its us. That is just a gut feeling from a guy who has watched alot of baseball. IMO he can lose 1-2 MPH off his velocity and still be incredibly effective. His Sinker is just that nasty. I would love to have him.
He is another Ohlendorf. That said, I love Ross. When he is hitting spots, he is nasty
Steel: I loved Ross when he was throwing his 4-seam fastball. Kerrigan turned him into a sinker guy. The guy had a canon before Kerrigan…look after 2009’s All-Star break, when the decided he should use his 4-seamer AND sinker!
Steel: I loved Ross when he was throwing his 4-seam fastball. Kerrigan turned him into a sinker guy. The guy had a canon before Kerrigan…look after 2009’s All-Star break, when the decided he should use his 4-seamer AND sinker!
He is another Ohlendorf. That said, I love Ross. When he is hitting spots, he is nasty
Im sick of seeing the platoon in RF. I want a package put together to trade for one player, leave the rest on the bench to play on Sundays. It is difficult to play one day and then sit for 2-3, no rhythm can be started.
However, I am also ready for a new SS.
Im sick of seeing the platoon in RF. I want a package put together to trade for one player, leave the rest on the bench to play on Sundays. It is difficult to play one day and then sit for 2-3, no rhythm can be started.
However, I am also ready for a new SS.
Grady Sizemore gets that 500,00 buyout and watch him sign with Boston or San Francisco calling it right now.
Give me Sizemore anyday.
Agreed.
3 years Buck, Benoit. Pirates, Royals offering big. This is a great market. Angels, Red Sox, Mets could be left behind.
Ha ha…like the Mets getting “left behind” is actually news?! They did a pretty thorough job of that all by themselves these past few years.
If Sizemore were available like that, you know the Red Sox would be after him. It won’t happen though.
Not sure what to make of Paulino to Colorado and what his role will be. Would love to see him as their 8th inning guy who takes over for Street if/when his arm falls off.
Anything that any writer (even Gammons) heard from an agent has to be taken with a grain of salt. Gammons isn’t as bad as Scott Boras’s mouthpiece Jon Heyman in this regard, but I still would not put too much credence into this report.
The Pirates have no chance of getting the Crawfords, Werths or Lees of this free agent class. They will go after the mid-level guys that the Mets, Sox, and Angels should go after when they don’t get a top end guy. I can see the Pirates pulling in Beimel, Garland, De La Rosa, and maybe taking a run at a Carlos Pena with some power. They need someone in the middle. It would also be nice to dream of trading for a Garza or Greinke.
Tabata, Jones, Maholm for Greinke.
I dont want Pena anywhere near PNC Park unless he is on another team. I cant stand watching him strike out every other at bat. Yeah, I know he hits 40hr and 100rbi, so what.
I would take 40 hr. Last person to hit 40 hr for the Pirates? 1973 Willie Stargell
HR’s are nice, however Jones gives up 80 rbis and he is A LOT cheaper. I dont like him past next year but he makes more sense than Pena. No reason to spend the money on a one sided player.
Agreed. I just think they need someone with power. Whether it is a RF or 1B.
I want them to put Jones in RF and sign Dunn. Only bad thing is all of the left-handed hitters in the middle of the lineup. Alvarez, Dunn, Jones. However, when facing a lefty, if we make a run at Francoeur, he can platoon with Jones, I would not mind this platoon. Imagine…
Cutch, tabata, walker, dunn, alvarez, jones/francoeur, doumit/snyder, cedeno, pitcher. <<< Nice looking lineup
With that lineup and the addition of 2 mid-level pitchers to anchor the rotation, we would be over .500.
I dont want Pena anywhere near PNC Park unless he is on another team. I cant stand watching him strike out every other at bat. Yeah, I know he hits 40hr and 100rbi, so what.
Tabata, Jones and Maholm?? Royals looking more for McCutchen, Alvarez, and Lincoln
Tabata, Jones, and Maholm? THe ROyals are looking more for McCutchen, Lincoln and Darnaud
I want to clarify a bit. The Pirates are not going to compete for star level free agents…our stars will be produced internally. But we need above replacement level help at a few other spots…Those are the guys we need to get. We cant settle for replacement level or slightly below. Thats why us as fans are excited to see us try to do the right things.
When Gammons says we are spending big, the mid-level players is what he means.
It seems like there’s a lot of knowledgeable Bucs fans here…I have a few questions. What’s the probable long term outfield situation? Obviously, McCutchen is in CF for hopefully a very long time, correct? I’m assuming Tabata (and his sky-high ceiling) is in one of the corners, but which corner, left? Is the other corner pretty much going to be a platoon of Milledge and Jones for the short term, with possibly Milledge being the long term answer on his own?
Then you got Alvarez and Walker at 3B and 2B, respectively, for the long term? Everything else on offense is up for grabs?
You have Cutch in the OF. I think you give Tabata every shot to live up to his potential. However, one of your corner outfielders needs to produce some more power. Long term, you have Alvarez move to first. I think Milledge doesn’t make the team next year. Hopefully, Walker can produce next year like he did this year. Cedeno can be replaced, but only when they have someone else to replace him. We still have to get a look at Pressley and Bowker.
Agreed. Tabata is the real deal. I think next off season we will have our RF, whether through a trade or from someone within the organization. Our infield is going to improve next draft when we sign Rendon and move Alvarez to 1B. Pending how things pan out, next off season big moves will be a RF, SS, pitching. 2013, 2014, buccos will be on top of the division competing, FINALLY.
Thanks guys. I’m a Yanks fan, and I definitely feel like the Pirates really got something in Tabata. Yeah, he had his “attitude issues” or whatever people called it, but wasn’t he compared to being a similar player to Manny as a ceiling? That’s some serious raw talent right there, and I hope he pans out for you guys.
Hmm, so is Milledge possibly on the outside looking in for pure on-the-field reasons? It seems like he’d be at least a decent 4th OF/pinch runner/pinch hitter with lingering breakout potential…but maybe I’m wrong.
How close is D’Arnaud? I know he’s probably about the age of many MLB rookies, but is he ready yet? If so, is he the future at SS? Obviously Cedeno is not the long term guy (even though he does have value).
I’m quite ignorant about the minor league system, but when is Sanchez expected to take the reigns at C? I know missing so much time from that jaw injury might set back his progress some.
I love talking prospects from the perspective of “when will they help the major league team?” as opposed to “who can we trade him for?” Very refreshing…yup, even a lot of us Yanks fans are well aware of how tiring it is for other fans to keep hearing about even our mid-level prospects and who we should trade them for (Greinke, Upton, God himself, etc.).
Milledge is def. going to be a bench player unless he has an excellent spring training, if he is there. Him and Cutch are good friends, part of reason he is still on the team. D’Arnaud will probably get some time next September, he is still a couple years away yet. He is talented but I dont think he is the answer. Sanchez is also 2-3 years away, unless he has a great rebound season after injury. We have the talent that will turn our team into the NL Rays in 2013-2014. However, we have the ability to spend money and increase payroll. It is managements job to make sure we spend that money appropriately on the young talent we have and acquire the needs that will help us along the way. Management has been told they can play with around 40mm. That would put our payroll around 80-85 mm if all was spent. Time will tell how things will workout for us. Obviously all talent does not develop, we have enough now though that only 50/50 will turn us into an NL contender within 4 years.
What do you think about a Lance Berkman 1 yr 6 mill with a player option for 2012 of 5 millon if he has 450 or more plate appearances in 11? Switch hitting 1B.
We could DFA Milledge and platoon GI Jones and Doumit in RF.
All of a sudden this lineup looks deep.
I think you have a good idea there. Berkman is a household name, and def. has at least one more productive season in him, as a 1b’man. Makes more sense with him being a switch hitter as well. I still dont like Doumit in RF but playing Jones vs Righties and Doumit vs. lefties, even though Doumit hits better from the left side of the plate…hmmmm. I like the idea of Berkman, I still would like Jones to get the entire season in RF by himself, with Milledge filling in vs. Lefties when it makes sense.
Cutch
Tabata
Walker
Alvarez
Berkman
Jones/Doumit
Snyder
Cedeno
Pitcher
Bench of Argenis Diaz, John Bowker, Steve Pearce, Alex Pressley, and Pedro Ciriaco
(Obviously the bench needs work) They need someone who can play third to give Pedro a day off.
Milledge has all the tools, but cant seem to put it together. Its tough to watch. He works hard, and he hustles…no doubt about it. But the power numbers just dont seem to be present at all. His clutch hitting statistics I feel are quite lucky, and I wouldnt be heart broken to see a non tender either this year or next.
D’Arnaud regressed last season due to some nagging injuries, but towards the end of the year he started hitting again with more consistency. I feel he is 2 years away from being legit. But you cant hit .268 in AA and expect an MLB callup. Everyone here still has high hopes for Chase, but the proof will be in the pudding for him. Also he isnt exactly ozzie smith with the glove. Being a yankees fan, you will understand this comparison:
Chase’s Minor League numbers look alot like Derek Jeters minor league numbers…
Jeter went on to be a superstar, the same work ethic and drastic turnaround would be required from Chase, the question is can he do it. My own personal belief is that he will not. I invision his future being similar to a Ben Zobrist…utility guy for a few years until he figures it all out.
Thanks guys. I’m a Yanks fan, and I definitely feel like the Pirates really got something in Tabata. Yeah, he had his “attitude issues” or whatever people called it, but wasn’t he compared to being a similar player to Manny as a ceiling? That’s some serious raw talent right there, and I hope he pans out for you guys.
Hmm, so is Milledge possibly on the outside looking in for pure on-the-field reasons? It seems like he’d be at least a decent 4th OF/pinch runner/pinch hitter with lingering breakout potential…but maybe I’m wrong.
How close is D’Arnaud? I know he’s probably about the age of many MLB rookies, but is he ready yet? If so, is he the future at SS? Obviously Cedeno is not the long term guy (even though he does have value).
I’m quite ignorant about the minor league system, but when is Sanchez expected to take the reigns at C? I know missing so much time from that jaw injury might set back his progress some.
I love talking prospects from the perspective of “when will they help the major league team?” as opposed to “who can we trade him for?” Very refreshing…yup, even a lot of us Yanks fans are well aware of how tiring it is for other fans to keep hearing about even our mid-level prospects and who we should trade them for (Greinke, Upton, God himself, etc.).
Tabata had more hits after the all star break than any other major league batter…real deal could end up being quite the understatement. His age, speed, bat speed, defense, and raw power (despite being a smaller guy) is incredible. He is incredibly toolsy.
You have Cutch in the OF. I think you give Tabata every shot to live up to his potential. However, one of your corner outfielders needs to produce some more power. Long term, you have Alvarez move to first. I think Milledge doesn’t make the team next year. Hopefully, Walker can produce next year like he did this year. Cedeno can be replaced, but only when they have someone else to replace him. We still have to get a look at Pressley and Bowker.
long term outfield situation Is Cutch is CF, Tabata in LF, and Andrew Lambo/Sterling Marte in RF. That is the long term answer. I would assume a platoon in RF is most likely the answer for next year. I expect Doumit to play tons of RF in Spring Training.
If the pirates and royals out spend those large market teams then you can be sure it’s only cause they’re management is giving them largely over market deal that the big market teams don’t think are worth it.