The Yankees’ eight-year deal for Max Fried gave them one of the deepest collection of major league starting pitching in the sport. Fried joined Gerrit Cole, Carlos Rodon, Luis Gil, Clarke Schmidt, Marcus Stroman and the since-traded Nestor Cortes in a long line of Yankee rotation options. While the trade of Cortes to the Brewers loosened that logjam (and significantly bolstered the bullpen, bringing Devin Williams in from Milwaukee), the Yankees still have six big league starters, most of whom are earning significant salaries. With that in mind, it’s not exactly surprising to see Bob Nightengale of USA Today report that New York is “actively trying to deal” Stroman.
Stroman’s name has already popped up in trade rumblings since the Fried signing. The Yankees pitched a Stroman-for-Nolan Arenado framework to the Cardinals, which was rebuffed by St. Louis. (Arenado has a no-trade clause, but the scenario was reportedly not even presented to the third baseman, as the Cardinals weren’t interested.) Given those efforts, it’s only natural that the Yankees have explored other possibilities as well.
Stroman, 34 in May, is entering the second season of a two-year, $37MM contract. He pitched decently during year one of the pact, logging a 4.31 ERA in 154 2/3 innings, but his strikeout rate (16.7%) and ground-ball rate (49.2%) were a far cry from his typical standards. Stroman punched out 21% of opponents from 2019-23 and kept the ball on the ground at a robust 53.2% clip over that same span. Similarly, the velocity on his sinker dipped quite a bit; from 2019-23, Stroman averaged 92 mph on the pitch (91.4 mph in ’23). In 2024, he averaged just 90 mph on that sinker.
Left-handed hitters, in particular, proved problematic for Stroman. They tagged him for a .296/.372/.474 batting line. He fanned just 14.3% of lefties, compared to 19% of fellow righties. With Stroman playing half his games at Yankee Stadium, lefties took full advantage of the short right-field porch. He surrendered 15 of his 19 home runs at Yankee Stadium in 2024 and pitched to a grisly 5.31 ERA at home. On the flipside, he sported a tidy 3.09 ERA on the road.
That road production and a generally successful track record should create at least some interest in Stroman elsewhere around the league, though perhaps not at the full freight of his $18.5MM salary this coming season. Trade discussions are surely complicated by the fact that the highly durable Stroman also has a vesting player option on his contract. With 140 innings pitched in 2025, he’d gain a player option for $18MM. Were that a club option, it wouldn’t be quite so problematic; that it’s a player option means that even if Stroman struggles or incurs a late-season injury, he’d be able to lock in that $18MM payday in 2026. Stroman has averaged 159 inning across the past five full seasons in which he’s pitched.
That player option, presumably, only creates more urgency for the Yankees to find a deal. They already have Cole, Fried and Rodon locked in for a combined $85MM in 2026 (including Fried’s slightly deferred signing bonus, which is paid half in 2025 and half in 2026). Schmidt will be in his third trip through arbitration as a Super Two player, while Gil will be in his first arb season in 2026. In total, it could mean a rotation earning a combined $100MM.
Stroman is arguably the sixth-best starter in that group of six at the moment, and paying him $18MM in 2025 and potentially again in 2026 understandably may not be a palatable course of action for the Yanks. That’s especially true when considering the team’s luxury tax status; they’re currently in the top penalty bracket for luxury status. Moving Stroman would trim more than $35MM in 2025 spending. The Yankees will be on the hook for 50-110% penalties on their luxury overages in 2026, depending on where the exact payroll ultimately lands. Again, that could mean a savings of $27-37MM, depending on if his player option comes into play.
While the player option surely gives other teams some pause, Stroman’s contract itself isn’t necessarily all that far underwater. The offseason has already seen 37-year-old Alex Cobb and 41-year-old Charlie Morton command $15MM one-year deals — Cobb’s coming after he made only three starts in 2024. Frankie Montas landed two years and $34MM with an opt-out upon signing with the Mets. The price for starting pitching has generally exceeded all expectations. Stroman at a year and $18MM, even with the conditional player option, isn’t necessarily egregious. Plus, if Stroman hits the 140 innings and pitches more like his 2021-23 self (3.45 ERA in 454 1/3 innings), he could well turn down the option and reenter free agency anyhow.
The Yankees aren’t likely to extract any kind of notable young talent in return for Stroman, but swapping him out for another veteran on a contract of some note or eating a portion of the contract and acquiring some longshot prospect help could still be feasible. There are still five weeks until pitchers and catchers report to spring training, and the market in recent offseasons has produced plenty of notable trades even after camps open. There should still be time for a deal to come together.
Clofreesz
Oh wow. I didn’t know that they were going to shop Stroman.
sad tormented neglected mariners fan
I know right this is a shocker
178iq
No kidding. He’s a marlin quality. If anything, maybe a pirate. Who could actually benefit from having him in the rotation? Who can they get for him?
TJECK109
Pirates love taking on Yankee castoffs when the Yanks eat a substantial portion of the salary
Buckner
He’s (likely) wearing out his welcome on yet another team.
This guy’s reputation precedes him. Why wouldn’t the Cardinals take a guy like that? Part of the reason may be because he (appears to be) a whiner, a crybaby and nothing more than a league-average pitcher.
Captainmike1
Last thing the yanks need is to pay a big salary and have nothing to show for it
They need to either keep him or get something substantial back if they pay a big portion of his salary
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Buckner
I’ve heard nothing negative about Stroman in NY. I simply think he’s the odd-man out for a team with 6 SP and his numbers are likely the worst and he’s too expensive to keep on as a 6th man when you might have a position or two they might want to beef up but are already up against the harshest penalties. I tend to take these reputations with a grain of salt and I do think that sometimes the “flamboyant personalities (ahem)” tend to rub the traditional “play the game with enthusiasm the way WE think you should show it” attitude of baseball often clutches roo. I heard bad things allegedly about Jazz in Miami, but I’ve heard great things from his teammates and have yet to see anything negative about his personality. Maybe winning forgives a lot, vs. Miami, where they’re almost always non-competitive by July. But I think teams with ballpark that minimize homers and have a great defensive infield to vacuum up those groundballs should Halle a look if they need a 4th starter innings eater. Yankee stadium just allowed to many homers.
The_M4N
@Buckner, i don’t live in the NYC media market so I my not ne aware. But, I have not heard anything bad in re Stroman in the clubhouse. Am I uninformed?
joew
I was trying to justify him going to the pirates but just can’t. Pirates have the makings of a great rotation now adding him will take time away.
Only makes sense if they are just giving him away.
SonnySteele
It worked out well when the Bucs got AJ Burnett from the Yankees.
178iq
League average? You’re too kind.
Buckner
@The_M4n: Uninformed? Very.
Look it up. Other than Toronto, his stays have been shorter and shorter. He’s like a bad girlfriend.
Buckner
@KnicksFanCavsFan
Stop making excuses for guys like Stroman.
I stand by my comments about Stroman. He is not a nice guy, Not a team player either. The vibe he gives off is he is all about himself.
Stroman is an overpaid “league average” pitcher, with a lousy “me-first” attitude, nothing more.
He would fit in with some of the (recent years) NY Knick rosters.
There are (now) lots of overpaid league-average pitchers.
Buckner
@178iq — True
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Agree, Pirates need bats not arms
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Buckner
I made comments about Stroman. Who are “guys like Stroman “? NT is the most intense dirty digging headline hunting media in sports. If there were incidents where Stroman was wearing the clubhouse thin or a cancer I PROMISE YOU it would be reported. Instead, what I hear is him day nothing but great things about playing in NY, his hometown I believe, and enjoying it. He’s been called emotional, and he shows it both when he’s happy or when he messed up. But he’s hard on himself. It’s not like he put a teammate on blast for an error. Boone has never had to discipline him like he did Torres. He may have had issues where either he literally did something wrong or maybe his coach and teammates didn’t like his personality, but that’s very different than being a headcase. You can huff and puff and insist all you want but there’s not a shed of evidence that he was a club house problem in NY. People said Jazz was a problem, but that hasn’t shown itself yet.
larkraxm
He literally yelled at Torres on the field for making an error. I don’t think anyone cares about his emotions. That is all well and good when you are helping the team win, and wears thin quickly when you can’t get out of the third inning. It’s all about his inability to get their hitters out and our hitters up that is really the issue here.
stymeedone
If his contract this year and the option aren’t “palatable” for the Yankees, maybe they shouldn’t have given him that contract.
JackStrawb
@Clofreesz Right? Stunning news.
As for the Yankees having so much starting pitcher they can easily afford to dump their ‘Sunday Road Pitcher’ that’s foolishness. They were fools to dump Cortes when excellent relievers are available every offseason in FA, but that’s another thread.
Gil–nice pitcher to have, but a 4.14 FIP. Does Cashman even know what FIP, SIERA et al are?
Rodon–now 32, a disaster at 30, a mediocrity (4.39 FIP) at 31.
Cole–fine starter in decline, 95 IP in 2024 the Yankees just ‘re-signed’ for 4/144m for his age 34-37 seasons, as if he was almost Zack Wheeler. He really isn’t.
Schmidt–One good year out of 28, also fueled by the BABIP faery, but in only 85 innings. 4.12 FIP in 2023-2024
Stroman–lousy 2024 but can still give you 25 starts, 140 innings, and is one season removed from a 3-year stretch of 3.45 ERA, 3.60 FIP, 120 ERA+.
.
But, sure, let’s dump one of these guys for trivial salary relief. After all, we’ve got one or two guys in the upper minors who aren’t… terrible.
GriffGC
Funny thing is Yankees fans think Cashman is killing because he overpays for aging stars and collects has-beens that the Yankees will market. Then he pisses away inexpensive pitching and neglects or trades away prospects. The most anemic team is baseball
Scott Costello
This Yankees fan, and many others, thinks Cashman needs to be fired. He has not done a good job this offseason either. The guy keeps going by the same strategy…(1) Over spend on the 2nd best free agent.. Make trades for a teams bad contract (so he can give up as little as possible), then go dumpster diving.
That hasn’t worked for the last 10 years. The only time he did the right things were signing Cole and trading for Soto.
He continually tries to be the smartest person in the room and act like the Yankees are a team that players should be honored to play for. It used to be, but not anymore.
backmeupvito
if the Yankees trade away stroman then what happens if one of their starters gets hurt. They literally have no other starters other than Will Warren. The Yankees are legit one injury away from being a 500 team if that.
cuban1
Which yankees fans think Cashman is killing it? Pretty sure most of the fanbase has wanted the dude fired years ago.
Scott Costello
Because that 18 million is better spent on an every day player who could help for 162 games. How many starts is Stroman going to get? 10 to 15? and of those 10 to 15 starts I would say half will be decent. I think a prospect in the system or even an in season pickup could about match that production for much cheaper…and you’ll have a better 3b/2b the what is currently on the roster.
DavRz
100%..Cashman should have been jettisoned years ago.
178iq
There’s no reason to play for the storied Yankees lol. Other teams are paying the big number contract. It’s not the a million years ago lol it’s 2025. Players are getting the same money or MORE to play where they don’t have to shave. Shaving messes with streaks and slumps. Telling your players to shave is why players like Verdugo go from an all star caliber bat and glove in Boston to a bum for NYY. You gotta let grown men make their own decisions. They’re hitting don’t shave. They slump shave. Or vice versa. Making errors don’t shave for a week. Booted a play, shave. Those who have actually played at a high level including college ball as well as some states high school programs believe in things like wearing the same socks or stirrups or burning them lamo. Writers don’t know Bo.
The_M4N
@Costello, that’s hasn’t worked at all and the only reason Cash has had any success is because he inherited what Stick left him. But after all the Stick players were gone, Cash has been atrocious.
The_M4N
@1.78iq, this is by far the best argument I’ve read on this website. Ty.
larkraxm
I’ll give you one reason to play for the “storied Yankees, lol” over another team. Endorsements. The Twins might offer you the same money or more, but the off field earning opportunities that exist in NY and LA are not available in KC or Detroit. I’m sure if Verdugo had some scummy little beard, he would have been an All Star last year. Get real. Every job has a dress code.
178iq
Thanks. I hope you’re serious. Because I really believe in the past decade that several players (in addition to the ones that actually voiced their concerns about being told to shave) signed contracts elsewhere because the NYY think too highly of themselves. The think that because they require their players to shave everyday that it somehow makes the NYY a better organization than say, the Dodgers? Giants? Diamondbacks? I can tell you 1st hand why Randy Johnson went to the diamond backs before the Yankees. Same for shilling. There’s a reason they went to Arizona. Shining said, “I’ll shave every morning because I want to not because someone tells me to”. And he did lol he shaved every day. Even did shaving commercials lol all in jest of the NYY. He and Johnson went to Arizona for less money (not much) and stuck it to the Yankees in the WS. NYY is behind the time.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@griff @scott
“Overpays for aging stars.”
He signed Goldy for 1/$12? He also acquired Belli, who can play 1b, too. He has Ben Rice, who will start at AAA next season. All drastic improvements over DJ and Rizzo. All the other top 1b options LITERALLY would involve him doing exactly what you accuse him of but likely at a higher cost. Walker turns 35, Santana 39, and Goldy is 37. It’s a 1 year deal with backup contingencies already on the roster. In the last 2 years, the Yanks infused younger talent at key positions. Gold glove caliber guys at C in Wells, SS in Volpe, Jazz at 2b/3b, Gil and Scmidt in the rotation, and Soto in LF without giving up anyone that hurt. Yes, King went from bullpen guy to FOR SP. Yes, the prospects they have up for Jazz look pretty good this far. You have to give talent to get. Soto walked, and that sticks, but he was worth the risk. Cash had used the farm well, and depending on how JD does, they would have 3 homegrown kids up the middle (C, SS, and CF) and two SP. Cash made acquisitions that are defensible like Verdugo. He was in his prime, coming off a .750 OPS, had a reputation for having a solid glove, and had 1 year left in his inexpensive deal. What player on a bad deal did he acquire? Belli? I think most fans feel like that was a great acquisition. He’s under 30, a lefty, and can play 1b, LF, and CF?
I think Yanks fans are spoiled. Cashman mitigates some of the loss of Soto but have improved the defense and offense at multiple positions. Improved the SP and bullpen, too. Most teams haven’t don’t nearly as good of a job this winter.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@back
If the Yanks lose 1 pitcher, to my knowledge, they’ll still likely have the best pitching in 2025 with the 4 other capable starters.
You never know what might Jalen but the O’s lost Burnes and possibly Santander. The Red Sox improved slightly. The Rays and Blue Jay’s are iffy at best. The Yanks should be an easy 92 win team on the conservative side. I think a whole lot would have to go wrong for them to just be a .500 team.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@cuban
They would be idiots.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@178
That’s what you base your rant on? Superstition? If your beard is that impotent to you, then don’t come to NY but to suggest that players get in and out of slumps because they shave or don’t shave…. well…. that’s just stupid.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@lark
– Team that can pay you among the best. Yes, the Dodgers are the big bullys. He’s, Cohen makes the Mets real competitors in the FA market, but if he runs it like a business and based it on income, then the Yanks still gross millions more than every other team in baseball. And to be honest, having money doesn’t mean you’re willing to overspend. Since signing Soto for $800 mil the Mets have been shopping in the dollar store dented cans section on SP instead of going after more established pitchers. Yet still, $75 mil invested in Manae, Holmes, and the other guy I can’t remember.
Players know this team is trying to win a WS every year. Only one in the last 15 years can I remember the Yanks throwing away a season.
– Largest media capital in the world and best place to earn your money from endorsements.
– The lure of playing for one of the greatest franchises ever, and if you don’t think theirs cache in being a winner with the Yanks, Dodgers, or Red Sox, then you know nothing.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Knicks Fan Cavs Fan
You state that the Yankees will have “the best pitching” in 2025 without Stroman.
Better than the Dodgers with Snell, Yamamoto, Glasnow, Kershaw, Gonsolin and May (and maybe Roki)… I don’t think so.
Better than the Phillies with Wheeler, Nola, Sanchez, Suarez and Luzardo. I don’t think so.
Better than the Mariners with Gilbert, Kirby, Miller, Woo and Castillo. I don’t think so.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@mlb
OK, top 5?
As for the Dodgers…
*Blake Snell pitched 104 innings
*Yoshi Yam pitched 90 innings
*Ty Glasnow pitched 134 innings. First time in his career that he pitched over 120 innings in a season.
*Tony Goslin Injured and missed full season.
*Shohei Ohtani Injured and missed full season
*Dustin May injured and missed full season.
*Clay Kershaw pitched 30 innings and is currently unsigned.
7 SP that combined for 358 IP last year. What are we talking about here?.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Knicks Fan
Thanks for catching Ohtani as a pitcher, I have inadvertently left his name off my list.
Yeah, I would take the starting pitching of the Dodgers, Phillies and Mariners over the Yankees. (Assuming Roki is added to none of those four teams.)
With Fried, Cole, Rodon, Gil, Schmidt and Stroman, I think the Yankees would be fourth for starting pitching rotations.
Scott Costello
@The_Man, You are correct.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@mlb
You’re entitled to your opinion but to me, the best ability is availability and it’s amazing how ppl are doubting the Yanks rotation depth but in the same breath, are viewing the Dodgers to be better when only one of them threw more than 104 innings (140) last year and a few of them didn’t pitch at all. And Kershaw is still a FA if I’m correct. Shoot, if he doesn’t find a deal he likes with the Dodgers, I would go over the budget and offer him a 1/$10 mil invents deal to come out the pen and transform to the rotation as needed.
178iq
Come on! 25 starts from Slowman?!?! And what 20 L’s?
luclusciano
Some of this logic is really painting Stroman in a fashionable light. If we go off of 2024 FIP (the point of the story is that Stroman is in severe decline) his FIP was 4.62 WHIP 1.47. I am a fan of Stroman, but he is tbe 6th best pitcher on the team.
I agree – Yankees are 1 injury away from needing a solid starting pitcher, with no real backup options. But, you may have just as much luck gambling on Warren or Hampton rather than an $18 million dollar decline
jerseyjohn
luclusciano: agree 100%. Most teams are 1 injury away from needing a starter. Warren, Hampton, and Gomez are probably 6,7,8 on the depth chart.
If Hal weren’t always looking to be thrifty I’d keep Stro. Since he’s tight get out from under some or all of his deal and get someone for the infield. I can’t go into the year with a DJ/Waldo platoon at 3rd…
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Jersey
Hal bring thrifty? Did they not offer Soto $765 mil? Despite having dead money in DJ and Stro, did they not acquire another $300 mil in salary? They might be trying to avoid the 4th level of the luxury tax where they have to, in effect, pay an extra 100%+ above what the ticket price is, it would not shock me if they pounced on someone like Bregman if his price or years become more palatable. You can judge them on HOW they spend their money but calling them “thrifty” seems unbeatable unwarranted.
jerseyjohn
Knicks: Noted but… They always spend but haven’t had the top payroll in years. Moves like getting Stanton in part because the Marlins subsidy knocked his AAV down to 25 million stopped them from getting Harper. Going for Rizzo instead of Freeman etc. Stretching ALL the contracts (DJ, Hicks, Freid, and even the losing Soto offer). We use prospect capital to get teams to eat salary on trades and a host of other things George never did.
I’ll gladly be wrong but I think the remaining bullpen and infield moves will cost less than 15 mil AAV.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@jersey
Going after Stanton and not Harper was a huge mistake and I can’t believe Cashman didn’t think Harper was the better guy. I have to think he was pushed by sometime else to make that trade. Jeter was the GM. I know he didn’t like Cashman. maybe he went to Hal or Randy to get it done? I don’t think getting the Marlins to chip in to reduce Stanton’s deal is an example of being thrifty. It was a smart move because they had leverage and probably few teams wanted to take on the contract. I absolutely know the Yanks wanted Freeman but remember, he was holding out for a contract from the Braves. He didn’t sign until March 18 and allegedly he was offered a deal that Boras failed to mention to him from the Braves.
What prospects of note did we trade for salary relief, and is there any regret? I do thi, for the most part, that the Yanks trading pros to save money is a bad idea but it also depended on whether they’re legit guys or a guy that’s ranked 30th in the system with very little in-house evaluation of their likelihood to contribute at the mlb level.
jerseyjohn
Knicks: I see Hal’s fingerprints all over the Stanton deal. I think he wanted to plug the hole before he had to make an even bigger offer to Harper. Harper all but had the NY tattooed on his chest and we didn’t even make an offer.
We gave up extra prospects for Rizzo so the Cubs would eat 6 million. Kevin Alcantra is now a global top 100 guy so that move could end up hurting. We even managed to get money sent to us for the JD Davis trade. Anytime I see the Yankees getting money I feel they are giving up more talent than they needed just to buy some salary relief.
I’m probably on an island but I think Cash is still a good GM. I blame Hal for most of the stupid signings ( especially Ellsbury).
The_M4N
@JackStrawb, the rotation is horrible, so basically they should cancel the season.
A NYer
The Yankees have one of the best rotations in baseball. Gil is ROY and in your mind he’s merely a nice pitcher to have around? You are either a troll or ignorant.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Clo
Correction: Yanks are STILL shopping Stroman.
I do think Stroman ‘s performance isn’t as bad as the narrative makes us believe. Among RHSP with 150 IP + he talks around 38th in ERA and 41st in FIP. That indicates that if you sprinkle in a lefty on every staff, he likely be a 3rd or 4th starter on most teams. His numbers were interesting. While his career GB% feel from 56% to 48% it was still 5th among all qualified RH SP (150 IP+). His main problem was he gave up 15 he’s at home in about 85 IP vs only 4 on the road in 70 IP. If he were to go to a park that stifled homeruns with a solid infield defense they should take a look at him. I think the Yanks eating enough to reduce his 2025 Rajat down to $10 mil (eating $8 mil) and then down to $13 mil) if they let his incentive clause to kick in (if he pitched at least 145 IP in 2025) that should be fair.
side note: Which sind would you prefer become the at bat music for Jazz next year? Tribe Called Quest “We Got the Jazz” or Stetsasonic “Talking All That Jazz”?
Clofreesz
I’m not a big expert on walk-on songs. Also, the Yankees are definitely not my favorite.
rottenboyfriend
The Yankee current payroll of 303M is in the highest tier of the luxury tax penalty so every dollar over 301M is taxed 100%.
This is why the Yankee long term free agent contracts are killing them! Whoever they add at this point the cost is DOUBLE whatever you are paying them!
Rodan, Cole, Fried, Stanton and Judge will all be getting paid long after they are still effective! When Soto left Cashman panicked and gave Fried an 8 YEAR DEAL at 31 years old so we all know how that contract will end up.
Until Cashman learns to say no to these free agents the Yankee’s ability to construct a winning roster will continue to suffer. Even the Mets have quit giving out crazy long term contracts! It may be time for Hal to replace Cashman!
KnicksFanCavsFan
@rotten
Go tell the Dodgers to stop signing free agents, too, ok? It amazes me that ppl think they can dictate what SP demand. Either you shop like the big boys or you go bargain hunting like your the Oakland A’s. The greatest might the Yanks have is market size, financial flex and the lure of game and endorsements of NY. The Yanks offered $765 mil to Soto DESPITE having Cole, Judge, Stanton and others on the books. Signing Fried wasn’t about “panicking” it’s about the reallocation of money intended to increase run production to money intended to reduce runs allowed. And they did that also by improving the defense at 1B, LF, CF and RF. And they’re all trying to improve an infield spot. Signing Fried was a smart move. Burnes wanted $250 mil but didn’t have the same math’s that Fried had. Cashman has done a good job of off-setting large contracts by being in our banking up young cost controlled players. Wells, Volpe, Dominguez, Jazz, Gil and Scmidt are all relatively cheap but productive (Dominguez we hope) players at key positions. He’s traded a huge amount of prospects without any of them really becoming painful losses yet. Give the man credit for balancing player acquisitions between FA and use of the farm.
rottenboyfriend
We haven’t won a World Series since 2009 and only one pennant! With a top 3 payroll every year this is not getting the job done!. Soto didn’t leave over money as the Yankee offer was only 5M less than the Mets!
8 years for a pitcher who is 31 is a recipe for disaster. Burns who is 30 signed a 6 year 210M deal but with deferrals that equates to 193M.
Cashman has been there 19 years so it’s time for a different perspective! All the contracts Cashman has handed out will be under water well before they expire! The Dodgers are the new Yankees for sure but their free agent deals so far have worked out better than ours!
Cashman is so predictable we both know he will trade for Arenado and give some prospects to get St Louis to buy it down to 3 years 45M. But with our salary cap level the yearly cost is 30M per! It’s time to try someone new in the GM spot! The only thing Cashman is good at is spending Hal’s money!
rottenboyfriend
Arenado is Cashman’s next Josh Donaldson!
KnicksFanCavsFan
@rotten
Soto’s deal is absolutely going to end up being $805 mil. It was clear to EVERYONE that Cohen was intent on getting Soto. He literally told Boras to bring whatever the best offer is and he beat it by $50 mil. The Yanks started off around $500 mil and amazingly, almost like drunken tends with their parents’ credit card went all the way up to $765. Why? Because the Mets kept raising the bid. That’s obvi. WHO CARES WHAT HE SPENDS ON PITCHING? Pitching is so hard to come by. What’s the point of being the Yanks, the team query the highest revenue in baseball, if you don’t flex and take risks? So what they spread it over 8 hearts vs 6? The Yanks have been carrying Stanton’s deal in their books and STILL brought in/ back Cole, Judge, Rodon, etc. They can absorb a bad contract. But give him credit for using the farm to bring in Soto. To bring in Jazz, Williams, Belli, etc. Give him credit for knowing which prospects to keep and promote like Gil, Scmidt, Dominguez, Volpe and Wells. He’s not a wild GM but he’s a calculated GM that isn’t adverse to taking on SOME risks. And at some point is any the players preforming. I’m not gong to blame him because three usually good defenders made an error (Volpe, Wells and Jazz) are all above average gloves. And Cole is usually more engaged defensively. Had he made mistakes? yes but he puts together teams usually in the 92 +win total. They just underperformed.
cosmo1
Cubs
rondon
Rots a ruck
labial
A’s
Cmurphy
Been there, done that.
thegreatgoodbye
Didn’t pitch him once the entire postseason. Every Yankee fan saw this coming
KnicksFanCavsFan
@thegreat
Most teams don’t pitch their 5th starter in the playoffs. Because of the days off in between you go with your top 3 usually.
thegreatgoodbye
Should have put another pitcher on the roster and there were multiple instances where he could have been used. SPs can be used as relievers, LAD did it. Yankees ending up over using their bullpen. But, the point is, NYY had a fresh arm all postseason and never used him, especially after Hamilton got injured, so that showed how little confidence NYY had in him, which showed NYY fans he was never staying with the team.
lejamesbron
If Cashman can dump Stroman and his salary it will allow the Yankees to make 1 or 2 more decent moves. I just don’t know if a trade will materialize anytime soon. Thinking it may take an injury in spring training for a trade to happen if at all.
Joe says...
Seeing what some of these, let’s generously call them back of the rotation pitchers, are getting in FA, they should be able to move him but won’t get anything in return.
JackStrawb
@lejamesbron If they’re dealing Stroman (and I’m not a fan of his, particularly) those “1 or 2 decent moves” had better include a starting pitcher.
When they get something like 110 acceptable starts from Cole, Rodon, Gil, Schmidt, and Cole, where are the other 52 starts coming from?
vjwhitmore
You’re forgetting Fried, so that drops to about 20 starts
metsin4
Well he added Cole twice.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Jack
How many SP are they supposed to carry on the 25-man roster? There is plenty of time to add depth that’ll pitch at the AAA level. Those guys usually get flushed out over the next few weeks and spring training when guys get cut. There is no need to pay ANYONE over $1 mil or $2 to be AAA depth.
sad tormented neglected mariners fan
Arenado to the Yankees would still be a good fit but cashman really tried to lowball the cardinals so he might not be motivated to do a deal
Would stroman and either Everson pereira or Oswald peraza be enough?
FanDan
I don’t think doubling the level of garbage in a trade helps the cause.
YanksPhan42
If you think Pereira and Peraza are “garbage”, you’re an idiot.
LFGMets (Metsin7) #BannedForBeingABaseballExpertAGAIN)
@YanksPhan42 if these guys are so good, keep them instead of trading for Arenado. I personally think that they are garbage but since you love them so much, I’m sure that they can replace Arenados production
YanksPhan42
Clearly you know ZERO about baseball.
There’s a BIG difference between “garbage” and a decent prospect that’s appropriate in a deal like this. Arenado is 34, slipping offensively and has a big contract that the Cards want to dump. He’s not fetching a top tier prospect….that’s not how it works.
LFGMets (Metsin7) #BannedForBeingABaseballExpertAGAIN)
@YanksPhan42 Arenado is still a top 5 thirdbaseman in the MLB. He still was a top defender even though he regressed and his bat is still better than most players at his position in the league. Last year he had zero protection. His remaining contract isn’t bad compared to what other players are making right now. The fact that you think its fair for the Yankees to trade Stroman and 2 underperforming prospects that you don’t want speaks volumes about the typical Yankee fan thought process. Its the “I want your best player for my garbage” mentality
BITA
People keep saying the Cardinals want to trade Arenado and that’s not true. Arenado wants to be traded and the Cardinals want to do right by him. This is not a salary dump.
Chicken In Philly?
That’s not completely true, but certainly partially. The Cardinals have signaled through their lack of transactions this winter that they are moving towards rebuilding. They haven’t been linked to free agents of significant, and they declined 2025 club options on RHPs Kyle Gibson, Lance Lynn, and Keynan Middleton. Having only signed MILB free agents to this point is not a sign of a club that plans to compete, and while Arenado has voiced that he wants to play for a competitor, the Cardinals aren’t exactly clinging to him with the desire to win it all next season.
BITA
The Cardinals are not rebuilding. They have done literally NOTHING this offseason. They let the free agents go but they really didn’t need them Contreras is taking over 1b and the team has plenty of starters.
They are shopping Arenado because Arenado asked them to. That’s why.
YanksPhan42
AGAIN, the Cards are TRYING to move him because he’s underperforming his contract and on the downslide. If you follow baseball at all or read a single article on the subject, you’d know that. That’s why very few teams are even remotely interested in him. (he also has a NTC) At this point, he’s a league average bat with slightly above average D who is getting paid WAY too much. Sorry the truth hurts your feelings.
YanksPhan42
WRONG…..it’s 100% a salary dump. The Cards aren’t going to come out and say that in black and white or they’d get ZERO for him. It’s business 101.
BITA
They are trying to move him because he asked to be moved. That is the reason. You don’t seem to know what you are talking about.
BITA
If Arenado didn’t ask to be traded he wouldn’t be shopped around. They are only doing so because he asked to be traded.
Chicken In Philly?
That’s incorrect. The Cardinals were having so much difficulty finding a trade partner, they permitted his agents to try to help facilitate a trade. That could be to show him that his value is lower than he thinks it is. It also shows that they are willing to dump him for next to nothing.
BITA
You are making things up.
His value is what it is and I think he basically has neutral trade value. In other words they will trade him for nothing. Does that mean his value is next to nothing? Kinda depends on how you look at it right? He’s a good player that can help someone.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@BITA
“Cardinals president of baseball operations John Mozeliak stressed that from his Dallas hotel suite on Monday night and backed it up, not only proclaiming his intention of trading 10-time Gold Glove winner Nolan Arenado, but venturing to guess that not doing so this winter would likely limit any hopes that the Cardinals have of coming out improved on the other side of what he called a “reset” for 2025.
Arenando didn’t ASK to be traded, and this management is trying to appease him. The GM publicly stated he intended in trading him and once Arenando heard the trade rumors and their intent not to compete this year he made it clear his preferred destination and his willingness to move to 1b of that helped. If his trade value was so high and the market so strong them, why would he even consider moving to 1b???
“From a financial standpoint of trying to move our payroll – there are certainly other ways to do that, but [trading Arenado] would be a big help. It’s financial, but it also creates a runway for someone else.”
Clearly, this is a salary motivated move to not only clear money to spend elsewhere but to open up 3b for a younger and cheaper prospect.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Yanks
But they did. Their GM literally said it several times. Not sure why @Bita is arguing against this.
“Cardinals president of baseball operations John Mozeliak stressed that from his Dallas hotel suite on Monday night and backed it up, not only proclaiming his intention of trading 10-time Gold Glove winner Nolan Arenado, but venturing to guess that not doing so this winter would likely limit any hopes that the Cardinals have of coming out improved on the other side of what he called a “reset” for 2025.
“It’s my intention to try,” Mozeliak said when pointedly asked if the franchise would seek to deal the 33-year-old third baseman they worked so hard to obtain from the Rockies before the 2021 season.
“We both remain optimistic that both parties will remain happy somehow. [Arenado remaining with the Cardinals] is a possibility, but I’m not sure that puts us where we want to be. From a financial standpoint of trying to move our payroll – there are certainly other ways to do that, but [trading Arenado] would be a big help. It’s financial, but it also creates a runway for someone else.”
BITA
Knicks fan you don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
Arenado asked to be traded BEFORE Mozeliak made public comments about it. Why you think otherwise I have no idea.
BITA
You reposting the same garbage?
That part about Mozeliak in his Dallas suite has a quotation mark but it’s not a quote.
Venturing to guess?? What does that mean???
If trading him leads to improving the team in other ways then how is that a rebuild? That doesn’t make any sense at all.
Chicken In Philly?
These quotes come from MLB.com 12/9/24 and this very website. You are the clueless one. There was no trade demand. Yes, Arenado wants to play for a winner. But the article literally starts off with the Cards GM talking about their REBUILD.
BITA
Nobody has used the word rebuild. You just did in capital letters as if that word was used. It wasn’t. Making things up……
stymeedone
No, the Cardinals approached Arenado about being traded. He did not approach them.
BITA
No he approached them.
chiefnocahoma1
It’s more about the dollars STL would have to send with Arenado than the prospect return.
YanksPhan42
Exactly. Many on here just don’t get how this works.
JackStrawb
It’s absurd that Cashman has a job GM-ing, but for once he laid off the expensive old player in steep decline.
That he tried to get that player by dealing from a thin pool of starting pitching on the MLB squad and in the upper minors, though, was absolutely typical.
Apologies to their fans, but if the Yankees deal Stroman and can only get 80-90 starts from the guys remaining on the 26-man roster, they’ll have earned that fiasco through Cashman’s tireless work ridding the organization of starting pitching depth.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Jack
Dude, what are you complaining about? The Yanks, up to a month ago, had 7 pitchers from last year that threw for 1,000 innings. That’s an average of 144 IP x 7 SP!! Clearly, that’s untenable. They wisely dealt from depth to acquire an elite closer trading Cortez arbitration salary for another arbitration salary. Very little risk as they are both FA after the season. The Yanks had 5 guys that threw 150 innings or more with Cole and Schmidt coming back from injuries that don’t appear to be severe.
“ridding the team of pitching depth” NEWSFLASH: Most teams usually have a 5 man rotation and there “pitching depth” usually comes from a swing man or they’re stashed in AAA. There’s plenty of time for minor league deals that won’t add to the mlb salary lux tax. Anything can happen to ANY team, but it’s not like they’re the Dodgers where LITERALLY almost none of their starters pitched over 140 inning last year and a few mixed all or 80% of the entire season.
Were they supposed to convert 1of their starters into a closer and use the other as a bullpen arm?
BrianCashmansBurner
I suspect that if Peraza were valuable enough to offset the difference in value between Stroman and Arenado the Yankees are better off just starting him at 2nd.
BITA
Stroman is a headcase the Cardinals do not want him at all whatsoever. I still think Arenado makes a lot of sense for the Yankees but Stroman has nothing to do with anything.
Chicken In Philly?
Emotional ballplayers are not head cases.
BITA
Stroman is a doofus the Cardinals don’t want him at all. They don’t need him.
Buckner
@Chicken In Philly? In Stroman’s case, it is. That dude needs medication.
jerseystrongsports
Keep Arenado, longer contract. Donaldson 2.0. All it takes is one injury in spring training, and Stroman doesn’t look so bad
BITA
Arenado has been extremely durable in his career. Heck I think he was playing hurt last year but he was playing.
If my team needed a 3b I would want Arenado. Not sure why you dont.
carternico
Marlins need to get him… they will fix their payroll problem while getting a prospect in return… NYY also could get a reliever
Lombard and Stroman to MIA
Nardi to NYY
BrianCashmansBurner
The Yankees weren’t going to trade Lombard for Kyle freaking Tucker. They’re certainly not trading him in a salary dump.
SHARKmapiro
Would the Yanks have to attach a lower end prospect to dump his salary? I thought he was the odd man out last postseason? Who’s going to give up anything of value for an expensive 4th or 5th starter?
JackStrawb
If he’s a 4th starter, he’s not expensive at 18m.
FanDan
Depends on how much a team is paying their 1-3 starters. Its all relative.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Shark
I think the Yanks would need to eat $8 mil. A 4th starter giving you 150 IP and an era that should improve away from Yanks stadium. His GB% is still elite. However, 15 of his 19 homers allowed were at Yankee stadium. I think a move to a stadium that’s tougher to hit homeruns and a good infield defense could see his era take a dip below 4.
Susannah
Stroman for Rendon?
BrianCashmansBurner
Please, I just ate breakfast.
Susannah
🙂
AzMike
What if we say please
fansincethe80s
Rendon has a Full NTC. He’s not going anywhere.
dasit
actually he strained his NTC last week and it won’t be fully rehabbed until september
AzMike
Now that’s some funny stuff right there
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Rendon
I think he’s wave it to escape LA but why would anyone want him? he can’t play 50 games a year right now.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Rendon has a full No Trade Clause *and* he does not care. He openly admitted so very many times that he hates baseball, he does not care, it’s just a skillset he happened to possess that made him a ton of money and once he got the Angels deal he truly stopped caring, at all.
The Angels are stuck with him and I am genuinely amazed they don’t just outright release him- unless this is all a game of chicken, wherein Rendon does the absolute bare minimum to not be found in breach of contract and lose any of the remaining money, the way the Mets were able to prove that Yoenis Cespedes was blatantly making excuses to not play and just go live his life while collecting his paychecks, which lost him $15,856,497 of his 4 year/$110M original guarantee.
That’d be the equivalent of Rendon losing $35.317M or about one year’s worth of his Angel’s salary. Rendon already lost $22M of that $245M deal to the pro-rated COVID season in 2020, he did not want to lose a dollar more for any reason- so he has managed to make just enough effort to not allow the Angels to file a grievance.
I call this the ‘Jacoby Ellsbury’ method of fleecing a team.
Teamspirit
The Angels have a terrible training and medical team. They misdiagnosed Rendon and Trout for that matter, causing them more months of rehab than was really necessary. Get a new team that can keep the boys healthy.
Rexhudler86
@teamspirit. I’ll give you the trout injury being misdiagnosed. Rendon went to 10 doctors finally with the last one agreeing. he just doctor shopped to get time off. With his track record and him saying the baseball season should only be 40 games that’s 100 percent what happened.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
You’re missing my point though- I got so caught up with the Rendon vs Cespedes comparison that I forgot to mention that the Angels will never give Rendon what he wants, which is his outright unconditional release- which would allow him to not be forced to pretend like he is trying to play and be productive- again, it’s a game of chicken between a team that regrets the signing and a player who really does not want to have to play for the money- which is something the A’s cannot afford to take on, even if there wasn’t a No Trade Clause.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
@Rexhudler86 Yeah that was hilariously transparent of Rendon to say, because he was definitely implying he’d like to have to tolerate 75% fewer games per season without losing a single dollar in salary- and even then he likely would still doctor shop to find someone who would give him a diagnosis that would allow him to ‘rest’ due to an ‘injury’- the only difference being that he’d only have to keep up the charade for about 8 weeks a year rather than 26-ish weeks a year.
Rexhudler86
@trillionaire. Rendon is definitely staying. You’re right he wants the angels to release him, so he can retire. He won’t accept any trade angels would have to eat the whole contract so it doesn’t even matter. So the angels only position is to let him sit on the bench, and he can play his 40 games. He’s not a malcontent just doesn’t care. The best way to punish him is to make him show up every day and not play that way he can’t fake a injury.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Yup. I wonder how far into that deal the Angels realized it was fraud.
And again- I give Rendon credit for being a more sophisticated con artist than Cespedes was with the Mets and I give Ellsbury credit that it wasn’t fraud so much as disillusionment, with both team and player falling out of love with each other and silently moving on without formally breaking up. Ellsbury and the Yankees mutually ‘ghosted’ each other, while Cespedes did it one sided, which you can’t do while under iron clad contract- and the Angels are being vindictive (justifiably so) towards Rendon by not doing the Yankees thing and forgetting he exists while they continue to pay out the money.
And yes- I know the Yankees eventually filed a grievance against Ellsbury, accusing him of dragging out rehab assignments to avoid playing, which is kinda what Rendon does, but the difference is that the Yankees barely tried to fit Ellsbury back into the line up, whereas the Angels seem determined to find playing time for Rendon, even if he has almost no productive on field value at this point.
Oddly enough, for a guy who claims he wishes the baseball season was only 40 games a year, that’s approximately the number of games Rendon plays per season anyway.
I am sure it’s just the multi-multi millionaire version of when people have a job where they’re not really valued and don’t have a ton to do, but the employers doesn’t bother firing them and they can’t afford to just quit, so they go to work knowing they have no value and don’t really want to make the effort and sit around 75% of the time not being asked to do anything and hoping they’re forgotten for that day by the managers, but occasionally they do have to do something professional so that the employer feels like they’re getting *something* out of the person- but most of the time the employee just kinda counts the hours and adds up their income passively- like Rendon and the Angels.
Rexhudler86
@trillionaire. I’m sure they knew after the first year. He’s definitely not sophisticated just transparent. Angels should’ve vetted better, papelbon has said several times that Rendon acted like practicing and anything baseball related was like pulling teeth with him. Arte ripped up the wheeler contract and urged eppler to sign him. He’s a very expensive bench player but he still hits clutch doubles. Perry has said he needs to earn a spot in the starting lineup but currently he’s the 3rd baseman. I would say maybe newman, but that’s the only position he can’t play defensively.i wanted kim, maybe they get ha, and he can sit a month.
BobinTexas
LOL, the Angels would jump on that one for sure!
BrianCashmansBurner
This isn’t news.
hockeyjohn
No chance. Stroman has too much bad baggage to be worth anything. Peraza and Pereira are also quickly becoming the new Andujar Frazier trade package.
920falcon
I remember the “We’ll trade Andujar and Frazier for your best player” comments. Good times.
Begamin
Im still an Andujar truther lol tho im biased because i watched him play in A+ ball and it was a blast watching him rip an XBH everyday
Tom the ray fan
Delvi Garcia too
CleaverGreene
You must be a Met fan. The baggage only appeared in his Met days.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@hockey
Everson Pereia is 23 years old, has a career .855 OPS in the minors with only 300 AB at the AAA level where he posted a .850 OPS. He was called up and in 83 AB struggled. How is the worthy of comparing him to other prospects that failed? And keep in mind that Andujar had a great rookie season, missed a year to intro and came back and was never the same until years later with the A’s. Clint was great until he started suffering from numerous concussions that caused blurry vision?
Context please… one prospect had nothing to do with others. Every publication had Frazier as a top 25 with the Indians and Andujar showed signs of being a Robinson Cano/Melky Cabrera type of bat first prospect before he was injured.
hockeyjohn
Knicks fan, Pereira stuck out over 35% of the time at Triple Ain 2024 and over 43% of the time with the Yankees in 2024. He is heading in the downward direction just like Andujar and Frazier did. Yankee fans still pushed both Andujar and Frazier as valuable well past their usefulness. My point remains that Pereira and Peraza do not have the trade value that they used to have and that Yankee fans think that they have.
Baseball’s Topics on Baseball Today
One of these six guys is going to need TJ in March or April. Just keep him
GriffGC
Right. It’s as if Cashman thinks it’s 1995
mrmackey
Don’t the As still need to add some salary to avoid a MLBPA grievance? And they still want SP?
VegasMoved
This was my thought. This sounds like a job for the payroll-padding Athletics.
The Natural
Cashman is good at his job, but the Stroman signing was a huge mistake. Cub fans were elated when he opted out of his contract a couple years ago.
yankee766766
@The Natural. “ Cashman is good at his job.” ??? Why and how? He has been handed a perennial $275, million-$300 million budget year after year….. and has not won a World Series for 15 years !! And prior to that the last time they were even in the World Series was 2003. Tell me what’s the definition of good at his job ??
The Natural
Cashman took over in 1998 and the Yankess had 22 consecutive winning seasons from then til 2019,. During that span they won 100 or more games seven times with 4 World Championships, 13 division titles and had only missed the playoffs 4 times. That is pretty darn good. The five years after have not been as good, but last year was. ?????????
The Natural
In fact, in what? 25 seasons? They have never had a losing record under Cashman. MLB is littered with teams who have spent like crazy without those results.
YankeesBleacherCreature
For better or for worse, Stroman was an anchor in the rotation while Cole was our for half a season. Having him meant that they didn’t need to rush Cole back.
cwsOverhaul
Every team wants to offload as much as they can of bloated contracts to redirect money elsewhere or simply pocket it. They can compete with Philly trying to move Tajuan Walker, AZ with Montgomery, Hou with Pressly, etc.
Maybe mid-market/smaller market teams can go around offering lowball $ to everyone since they won’t care if turned down.
Rsox
Good luck with that. There’s a reason they outbid themselves for him and it’s not because he’s so good…
cooperhill
Good luck moving that contract!
TrillionaireTeamOperator
I’m not joking when I wonder aloud if the A’s would take on Stroman’s remaining money just to be in compliance. But– they’re still trying to get to that point with ‘cost effective’ deals, so I doubt it. The A’s would rather get 2-3 Stroman-esque over the hill players for a combined $24M or $39M or something like that- but, picking him up would more than get them over that hump- the problem is the A’s have “only” $8M left to get to $105M and Compliance, whereas Stroman would obviously push them well past compliance to $115M- but honestly- maybe that’d be a good move?
If the A’s do 9.5% more than the bare minimum it looks that much better for them and players might be more inclined to play there and who knows- one of their motley crews of cast off’s, has-been’s, etc. might coalesce into a real playoff contender if not the unlikeliest of World Series appearances.
920falcon
I think the vesting player option makes it problematic for a small market team, even one trying to get into compliance.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Meh. They wouldn’t be the first team to take on a bad contract with a couple years left on it, just to take a flier or gamble with their budget in order to publicly make an expensive splash, in large part due to having limited appeal for players with real options and multiple suitors, etc.
I am not in charge of the A’s finances, obviously and public perception (that they are now willing and eager to spend) isn’t really as important as good signings/trades, etc., but I think it’d be a good look for them, temporarily. Take on Big Money Bad Deal for a year or two and let players know they can get paid real free agent money by the A;s, then when the contract burns off after 2026, they can sign someone actually worth the money for a similar-ish 2 years/$40M or 3 years/$55M or whatever.
GriffGC
So Cashman overpays Fried two years after overpaying Rodon. Gives away two years of Michael King, one year of Cortes, and now shopping two years of Stroman. Cashman no understand value.
It’s no wonder the Yankees started Alex Verdugo in every playoff game and used a backup Catcher to pinch hit in biggest at bat of the season.
Dynasty
Cashman didn’t overpay by years because there’s no such thing as overpaying by years. Years are added to lower the luxury tax hit. You can still drop him after 6 years if you’d like. You can try and say he overpaid by dollars if you want, but never by years.
metsin4
Adding years just keeps you in a perennial luxury tax payer.
Dynasty
@metsin4 Yes, a perennial luxury tax payer at a lower amount. Which is the entire point.
metsin4
Not really. Adding 20+ million on a future payroll that the player isn’t a contributing factor just pushes it down the road when you have to pay an additional player to make up for their production.
Dynasty
@metsin4 Yes, and that is an unavoidable consequence of long-term superstars. Ironically, your team just did that themselves with Soto. The teams are pretty blatant about caring way more about luxury tax penalties than about overall dollars. Adding years has no way fewer negative implications and saves money overall. That’s the entire point. Giving 20 years is a good thing if it reduces the AAV of the team (not that any player would accept being paid over that lengthy a period).
metsin4
The Mets didn’t offer more years to avoid luxury tax. They offered him more years to sign him. They actually offered less years and a higher AAV than the Yankees did. The Mets and Yankees will both be in the highest luxury tax bracket for the foreseeable future and it’s not saving either team money as the tax money will be charged at one point or another. That is why the Mets gear for higher AAV salaries with less years except for the occasional superstar that warrants a long contract and is unavoidable.
Dynasty
The Mets could have just offered 10 years if they only cared to pay him during years they felt he’d be good. They offered more to avoid a painful luxury tax. Same reason the Yankees offered a 16th year. Every team does this. Once you reach the highest bracket, you’re paying $2 for every $1. So obviously by stretching out the years, and lowering the luxury tax hit, you save money. It’s just common sense to do it that way since you save money overall. Longer deals are always better. Than shorter deals for the same base salary because money is worth more today and it is tomorrow, and because you pay less in taxes. Not really rocket science.
metsin4
It’s really not rocket science. They will still be in the top tier and paying the same luxury taxes for the next 15 years. So at the end of it they will be paying two players instead of one mega money and their luxury taxes will be even more. Adding payroll down the road just pushes it and the bill will still be due. As Cohen has shown he could care less about the luxury tax and will even pay contracts off and pay more now if he thinks it will benefit him long term.
Dynasty
It’s not brain surgery either. They’re at the top tier today. They may not be at the top tier in future years, because they secured a lower AAV by using more years (something you seem to be unable to grasp).
Additionally, what is worse: Paying $1m at the top tier or paying $2m at the top tier? Obviously the second is worse. By lowering the AAV, you’re making it where you’re paying less money at the top tier.
A few other things of note:
1. Cohen hasn’t shown anything yet.
2. “Could care less” means you care. What you meant to say was “couldn’t care less” (though you’d still be wrong…but at least you would have gotten the phrase correct).
HatlessPete
Hoe did Cashman “give away” king when it got the yanks a mvp caliber year of Juan soto? Similarly how is it “giving away” a year of Cortes to get a year of Devin williams one of the best relief arms in the game?
Johnny U
Maybe a swap of contracts with Cincinnati for Jeimer Candelerio? He could play 3B move Jazz to 2B, Reds rumored to be looking for additional SP
BrianCashmansBurner
Candelerio is a terrible defender. While he’s better than DJ he may not be that much better to make the move worth it. A spare 6th starter in this case is probably more valuable than a redux of DJ.
ohyeadam
This actually makes sense
CleaverGreene
Not a big enough ‘name’ for the Cashman.
whyhayzee
Stroman, 34 in May, stinks.
YanksPhan42
Attach a prospect to him and get him out the door. We need the space to get another bat!
Viveleempireevil
Reds or Jays.
Canuckleball
I was about to say I couldn’t fathom the Jays having any interest, but with the current Jays management, who the heck knows?
jaysfansince1977
Canuck, “with the current Jays management???” Do you not remember It was the current management that traded Stroman. I highly doubt they would trade to get a lesser version of what they originally traded away.
terry g
They may be shopping him. Doesn’t mean anyone will buy.
soxprospectsroverrated
Stroman is better than a few of the mediocre arms who got comparable money this offseason, Montas and Cobb to name two
آلي مكبيل_.._.بيتزا بيبيروني آشتون كوتشر
Stroman for Ke’Bryan Hayes and some dollars exchanging or some low level prospects might do the trick for both teams.
آلي مكبيل_.._.بيتزا بيبيروني آشتون كوتشر
Yankees should also consider a low level signing like Edwin Rois. After looking at his spray charts, he might be a great fit for Yankee stadium.
LFGMets (Metsin7) #BannedForBeingABaseballExpertAGAIN)
The only way that the Yankees get rid of Stroman is either they take on another horrible contract like Rendon, Trout, etc. or including top prospects like Dominguez or Jones. I know that neither of these things will happen. Stroman is a below average pitcher who is way overpaid and he has an attitude problem to top it all off
backmeupvito
I don’t think cashman or Yankees fans understand that literally not a single team wants stroman because of his attitude. He literally bad mouths every team he leaves. He’s an awful clubhouse guy.
CleaverGreene
Aha! I read the attitude comment and thought “This must be a Met fan”.
Fernando P
@LFGM – This misses the whole point of trading Stroman — which is to clear money to use elsewhere. There is no point in adding another “bad” contract for him.
I get you don’t like the Yankees….but plenty of guys have gotten 15-18M this off-season to fill the 4th/5th slot. Some of those guys are much older and some have no MLB experience. Looking at that there is NO way that Yankees should have to pay Stroman’s full salary. I’d argue they might have to pay any (though that limits the return).
LFGMets (Metsin7) #BannedForBeingABaseballExpertAGAIN)
@Fernando P Your theory doesn’t take into account how teams see Stroman as a distraction. For example, MLB teams can sign Bauer tomorrow for nothing but no one wants him because he is a distraction (I disagree but thats how the GMs and Owners feel)
Fernando P
@LGFM – I get what you are saying but Bauer is a different kind of distraction.
Remember that Chisholm was identified as a distraction and clubhouse problem, yet he’s the one that was open to switching positions while Torres would not.
LFGMets (Metsin7) #BannedForBeingABaseballExpertAGAIN)
@Fernando P Chisholm at this point and time is twice the player Stroman is right now. Chisholm is young while Stroman is old. Take Yasiel Puig, he was a headcase but teams still gave him chances until he reached his early 30s. Same situation as this. Stroman has negative value
Fernando P
@LFGMets – Agreed Chisholm is a much better player. Don’t agree that Stroman has negative value. He’ll fare better outside Yankee Stadium. If Yankees eat 3M and leave him at 15M, he’s just as capable as Morton, Cobb, Sugano, Gibson, Lynn etc.
Sunday Lasagna
Trading Stroman is easy.
Contact all 29 other clubs and start the conversation with the Yankees will pay his entire salary.
In return the Yankees get an open roster spot and a low level prospect.
Trying to get a player or players of value and have the other team pay for Stroman…..well, then only contact teams among the other 29 that have foolish GMs.
NYG4246
I know stroman wasn’t great down the stretch last year but to think he couldn’t be a long relief or back end starter is a stretch for me. Not against moving him, just don’t see it as a necessity
Sorinotsori
Will stroman be a malcontent as a long reliever knowing he has an 18 mil option that triggers at 140 innings he’ll only hit as a starter? Probably. That’s the reason you just trade him
Buckner
@NYG4246 he might be decent coming out of the pen. But with that option hanging over this year, he would (likely) complain about a lack of innings.
What team would want that headache? He is not that great and is a whiner.
Salzilla
I said this signing was a mistake last off season and I was correct. Wasn’t a fan before, and he proved why. Now that said, as the article said, this contract isn’t as bad as others make it out and is comparable to others given this offseason. However the thing that makes him a hard sell is not the contract or his abilities, but the guy himself. This is the part that’s never ingratiated him with fans and I’m sure teams alike. Still, I think it can get done, but with another player going with him. I do think to the Pads for Arraez makes a lot of sense, but a revisit with the Cards for Arenado does as well. There’s gotta be something there for them to bite.
Longtimecoming
I could see a trade for Arreaz but NY will have to kick in a lot of money. 1-1 it’s adding about 4 mil to SD for Stroman and that isn’t going to happen.
fredweis
SD is a better park for Stroman to pitch in and he’ll have a better defense up the middle behind him.
Sorinotsori
I love Arraez as a player and he’d be a perfect leadoff hitter for us but we blocked him at 1B and DH. Everything I hear is he’s a terrible defensive 2B. It just goes against what we’ve been doing this offseason, focusing on fortifying pitching and fixing the defense. Jazz will either be improved at 3b with more reps or back where he thrives at 2B. Judge is back to being an asset in RF over Soto and his bumbling defense. Bellinger is a huge upgrade in CF. Torres and his laziness are gone. I wish it could work but I highly doubt we go for it
Salzilla
Honestly I think with all the upgrades you mentioned I’d take another Torres type defense at 2b for that kind of offensive output.
Sorinotsori
Yup even with the bad defense the thought of having him leading off makes me want to give it a whirl. There’s always the possibility that Goldy is old and G gets hurt and he can slide over to 1B or DH anyway.
the guru
nobody wants this guy
The_Porcupine
Hes still servicable, just not as good as he thinks he is. Can be useful as a 4 or 5 in the rotation and is salary isnt out of bounds considering what other 4/5’s received this off season. You just wont get more than a couple lottery pick type prospects or pitching depth to be stored in AAA.
hockeyjohn
You are still ignoring his attitude issues that many teams would want no part of.
Fernando P
@hockey – He’s been nothing but positive. Even when baited on Instagram, he’s talked about how he enjoyed playing and how he always wanted to play for Yankees. And if he gets traded, he understands.
YankeesBleacherCreature
I follow some of the Yankees players on Instagram. The young players gravitate. He’s also spoken candidly about maturing as a person. @Hockyjohn probably thinks Harper and Machado are terrible teammates bc people don’t change. I see the similar sentiments in the Alex Verdugo post.
Buckner
@Fernando P pay attention. That is not correct.
hockeyjohn
YankeesBleacherCreature, it is very rude to put words in another person’s mouth. Be better. The Yankees tried to dump Stroman back on the Cubs in the Bellinger deal and the Cubs had no interest. People who talk about maturing likely haven’t matured at all. Good luck getting rid of Stroman. Don’t plan on saving much.
RickEO
Yankees should hang onto him. That staff is old and fragile
LordD99
Stroman was hurt, certainly not helped, by the Yankees defense last year. A more solid defense behind him will likely help him tick back above league average. Best chance of moving him is to wait for a couple more starters to come off the board.
fredweis
Stroman traded for 2B with Yanks paying part of Stroman salry is likely outcome.
If Stroman pitches in a pitcher friendly park he’ll do well. He’s a groundball pitcher that needs good defense behind him. He’s also very streaky.
RotiniRick
If a team wants a large contract and is hoping for a rebound performance they’d get Montgomery over Stroman
Austinmac
The Yankees would have to eat at least half of his contract in my opinion..
JerseyShoreScore
Good Luck with that…
Sorinotsori
It’s not even that I don’t want him this year, I really don’t want him next year. He was not even usable the majority of the year last year. I’d have rather run a Cody poteet type out there every 5 days than what stroman was offering.
larkraxm
It takes two to shop…one to shop and one to buy. I’m not sure that there are a lot of buyers here.
Sorinotsori
Met fans, stroman for starling marte??
Gasu1
If Stroman triggers the player option, it means the resumed starting five failed and they really needed him. So I don’t see that option as a real problem.
adshadbolt
To the giants for yaz maybe a lower level prospect has to get thrown in there from the yanks. Straight across money wise and if he hits his incentive the yanks send 5mil would be a pretty reasonable deal. Gives the giants an innings eater and in that ball park the homer issue goes away. The yanks get a LHH outfielder with the capability to play all three outfield spots, though he’s much better in a corner than center, with some power that would play up with the short porch in NY
metsin4
Stroman and international bonus money to Mets for McNeil.
yanksallday
Swap him for an overpaid 3B w a glove?
thickiedon
If Houston didn’t have the glut of starting pitching it had, I’d love to see him at The Radish. Can we call it that? Yes, I know it’s Daikin not daikon.
Seriously though, if Seattle pulls off trading Castillo, would they swap for Stroman if his salary is drastically paid down?
danumd87 2
“Highly durable”. The guy has pitched over 160 innings ONCE since 2019! He is by definition NOT durable. That is precisely why his contract is not palatable. If he were durable he’d be a STEAL at 18 per. Do better mlbtraderumors. That’s just embarassing.
extreme113
He’s always on the trading block because one clubs figure out he’s a cancer in the locker room they try to get rid of him.
Fernando P
There are several teams that could use a 4th/5th starter with past success. He’s been much better on the road as noted in the article, so that should generate interest.
Some teams willing to take on money (A’s, Giants, Jays) and some teams looking for Yankees to eat some money (Braves, Reds, White Sox, Tigers, Nationals). There are fits for those teams depending on what Yankees ask for in return.
There is no fit with the Cardinals or Padres. Those teams are trying to cut salary, while Yankees are looking to move Stroman’s salary (or DJ, LOL that isn’t happening).
The Yankees need to focus on Brenden Donovan, Luis García Jr if they are willing to move prospects like Jones, Warren, Hampton etc. Not moving Dominguez.
And a guy like Matt Vierling (if Tigers sign Bregman) or even a Ramon Urías could be useful guys that won’t require much salary or trade capital.
larkraxm
I think what they are asking for in return is cash. I think that the player return could be nothing.
BurnerK
Shoo fly shoo.
A. Judge
Yanks just have to get that projected salary cap down, it’s egregiously high. Stroman is really the #6 starter on a very impressive rotation so if they could move him without getting something back, I’d take the deal. Is he worth $18M plus a player option at 34? Borderline, but if the Yanks pay down $4M there will be takers.
Mad Hatter
He wasn’t good with the Yankees last season, but he was an all-star the prior year in Chicago. Get him out of Yankee Stadium and he could be pretty decent.
dshires4
I don’t know the Yankees roster construction but if they need a backup C/1B platoon bat, would a Mitch Garver for Stroman swap make sense?
gorav114
A world exist where Fried and Rodon total less than 150 innings due to injuries, Gil needs TJ, Nestor is gone. Schmidt sucks. Only Cole. Might want to hold onto Stroman. You’re the New York Yankees. In for a penny in for a pound.
Scott Costello
@KnicksFanCavsFan
For the few positives additions he has done, I can name you multiple terrible ones.
I don’t agree that cash has used the farm well. In the last 10 years, how many home grown players have turned into above average players? Judge and maybe Torres. There have been the flash in the pans but nobody that has really turned into anything at all. Volpe and Wells have a promising future, but so did Sanchez and Torres.
How many prospects does he jerk around until they have zero value? You can’t say for sure they weren’t talented enough to make it, but i can say that they never gave those guys an extended chance. Let them fail and learn in the beginning and see what they can become. Or trade them when their value is highest. We all know the list of guys who fall into this category.
How many SPs has cashman traded for over the years that have been booed out of town?
I know he is limited by Hal, but most of the times he is allowed to swing for the fences, he whiffs.
I’ve been a fan since 1986, so i have witnessed Cashman’s entire career. I use to love him and thought he did a great job. But as the core 5 slowly faded away I realized how much his decision making and influence on the organization has dragged it down.
End of the day I just don’t think his skill set and player judgement matches up with todays game.
So to answer some of your questions about this years off season…
1) Goldy at 12 MM is not a bad signing value wise. It just has way to much potential to go south which wastes another year of Judge (already 32, how many more years can we waste?). I personally thought Walker for 3/60 is better. Goldy won an MVP at 35.
2) Belli is a fine addition in a vacuum. Good player, but not worth 28MM. Are we getting 2023 or 2024 version or worse? I think more 2023. But generally I like him.
3) Fried scares me and I’d rather have used that money on hitting.. I know the numbers, he makes the pitching staff better, but after losing Soto the SPs where not our weakness. Much rather have traded for Tucker.
I’m just salty that we didn’t get Soto. I think with a few small tweaks and Soto we would be right back in the WS. Now I don’t think we will be.
slider32
All teams know by this point what the worth of players are in their minds. Cashman is throwing Stroman out there because teams are looking to make their last moves for mid level pitching from Verlander, Scherzer, and others. Stroman fits into that group! All of these pitchers will be between 10-`15 million for one year! His biggest strength is he posts!
bravesfan
If the Yankees will eat some of his salary, then the Braves would be a good landing spot
GarryHarris
Trade Stroman to the Giants