The thinking that Teoscar Hernandez would sign early in the offseason or in the immediate aftermath of Juan Soto’s decision has not played out as such. The 32-year-old slugger remains unsigned, reportedly juggling interest from at least the Dodgers, Blue Jays, Red Sox and Yankees to this point in the winter. Hernandez and the incumbent Dodgers have been unable to bridge a gap in Hernandez’s asking price and the team’s offer. Mark Feinsand of MLB.com adds further context, reporting that Hernandez is seeking a three-year deal that’ll guarantee him $22-24MM annually.
A three-year deal in $66-72MM range would generally dovetail with expectations. Hernandez’s agent, Rafa Nieves, already stated earlier in the offseason that Hernandez had been seeking three years last offseason when they pivoted and took a one-year deal in Los Angeles. A three-year deal on the heels of the slugger’s rebound campaign in L.A. seemed (and still seems) reasonable, even though he’s now headed into his age-32 season after rejecting a qualifying offer (and thus attaching himself to draft pick compensation). That $22-24MM range would align with last year’s $23MM salary (though some of that was deferred, dinging the net present value a bit).
With Soto off the board, Hernandez and fellow slugger Anthony Santander are the top corner outfield bats on the free agent market. Santander is two years younger but is also reportedly seeking a five-year deal after swatting 44 homers for the Orioles in 2024. Both players rejected QOs. Hernandez is the more affordable of the two but is also older and more strikeout-prone. The presence of Cody Bellinger on the trade market and the recent emergence of the now-traded Kyle Tucker might’ve combined to slow things down for Hernandez’s market, speculatively speaking.
Hernandez turned in a .272/.339/.501 slash with a career-high 33 home runs last season before going on to hit .250/.352/.417 in postseason play. His 28.8% strikeout rate was an improvement over his 31.1% mark from 2023 but still sat about six percentage points higher than league average. His 8.1% walk rate was the second-best of his career but fell right in line with the 8.2% league average. At this point, teams can expect plus power, a below-average walk rate and more strikeouts than they’d prefer from Hernandez. He drew well below-average marks for his defense, but Hernandez has plus speed and above-average arm strength, per Statcast, so a team might think there’s enough raw talent to coax some better performance out of him.
The defensive concerns do make a multi-year reunion with the Dodgers a potentially problematic pairing, however. Hernandez has said he hopes to return — and the Dodgers are clearly open to a reunion. Beating the rest of the market when Hernandez is already 32 and there’s no DH opportunity thanks to the presence of Shohei Ohtani could make a long-term arrangement worrisome for Los Angeles in a way that’s not the case with other Hernandez suitors.
just_thinkin
This will never happen, but I’d love to see the O’s re-sign Santander and trade a package centered around Kjerstad for pitching.
Henderson SS
Rutschman C
Santander RF
O’Neill DH
Westburg 3B
Cowser LF
Mountcastle 1B
Mullins CF
Holliday 2B
metsin4
Why not keep the very talented young Kjerstad and just sign the pitching?
just_thinkin
That’s certainly an option, too.
Ben Jamin
Or keep both and sign the pitching.
Dodger Dog
Kjerstad for any of the Dodgers MLB ready young starters
VermonsterSD
Kjersted for Cease…..
SportsFan0000
Would take more than that to get Cease..
spirit of truth
Because they refuse to spend any real money. They have no choice but to trade and acquire mid tier free agents.
123redsox
He’s 26 this season. Play him or trade him
bigdaddyk
Kjerstad for Keller seems like a win win for both teams
metsin4
He would be the only pitcher available worth trading Kierstad for.
123redsox
Why would the Pirates trade their only proven vet starter that eats innings and mentors Jared Jones, Paul Skenes and Bubba Chandler?
bigdaddyk
Because they need offense. They have oviedo who is fine as an innings eater. Ashcraft will be in the rotation. Keller 29
letitbelowenstein
Kjerstad has 147 MLB plate appearances. He could be just another over-hyped prospect.
Elon’sDOGEbag
Keller for Clase, Naylor and Delauter from Cleveland minimum. Kjerstad for Keller is way too low.
bigdaddyk
I would be ok with Naylor. Horitz can split DH with Cutch. Ideally Keller gives them 2 or cost controlled hitters. Do we know what type of extension Naylor wants
Chrome 8550
Maybe for naylor. Not trading clase and delauter in that deal. Put down the crack pipe.
Elon’sDOGEbag
Chrome
If you think Mitch Keller for Josh Naylor is a fair trade, the pipe is likely in YOUR hands, sir!
kidbryant
That’s a ridiculous offer for Keller. Keller for Naylor straight up, possibly.
Elon’sDOGEbag
Kid
Nope. Starting pitching like Keller with CY potential in prime years is way more valuable than a somewhat-clutch, power-hitting, often-missing, Wario-looking first baseman.
wolf441
Cy potential?? You are thinking of Skenes on the Pirates. Keller is just another guy.. Three of his main BB Ref. comps are Brady Singer, Erick Fedde and Tyler Mahle. That ain’t Cy Young…
Elon’sDOGEbag
Just stop with the stat comparisons- they are irrelevant. Keller has plenty of CY potential and great stuff. Skenes has a higher ceiling, but Keller is in his prime.
I suppose if we are to invest in analytics let us all assume that Robbie Ray, Frankie Montas, Tyler Mahle, Carlos Rodon, Yu Darvish, Tyler Anderson, Jose Quintana, Alex Manoah, Martin Perez, Triston McKenzie, Jordan Montgomery (all “top 20 WAR” finishers from the years 2021-2023) are among the best pitchers in baseball? Or are we going to fall victim to recency bias and say that Paul Skenes is DEFINITELY going to win the CY next year??
Just stop. No way in hell Josh Naylor is equal in value to Mitch Keller or any other prime years starting pitcher, and yes Keller could be a top 3 CY vote getter this year, possibly a winner.
Stats are not always the answer kids! You’re in for a whole hell of a lot of disappointment if you believe in analytics like “BBRef comps” as scripture, because that ain’t it.
bigdaddyk
He is a controlled number 2 or 3 on a playoff roster. He is similar to Jack Flarriety
sonorawind
Holliday needs another year in the minors. He was completely overmatched in the bigs. The loss of Mateo, the long funk of Adley and the shorter funk of Westburg is what cost the Orioles the division. O’Neil doesn’t replace the production of Santander. They need another proven bat in case the kids get funky again.
iBleeedBlue
What is this website even offering anymore? Articles are pure conjecture and speculation and is now loaded with more pop up ads than a janky jack site.
just_thinkin
The “latest” on Hernandez, and they present no actual information or update.
bucsfan0004
With no real news, i’d be interested to know how much the Dodgers deferred on Teo’s salary, and what the present value of his contract was in 2023
norcalblue
Just_
Actually, this is one of the few information updates from MLBTR where there’s some insight. Until I read it here, I was not aware of the Dodgers holding firm at two years. Looks to me like they’re willing to go to about $55 million and two years with a third year team option and a buyout. Seems reasonable to me as a Dodger fan.
Chrome 8550
Guardians should go after him. They had a deep playoff run and made money. They also saved 97 million over 5years with gimmez trade. His agent is same agent for jose.
Brettlez
Its called mlb trade rumors and you can subscribe to remove ads.
VonPurpleHayes
It’s an aggregate news site, compiling multiple reliable rumors into one article. It makes it much easier to avoid the nonsense.
SHARKmapiro
“Reliable rumors” is a new one lol makes absolutely no sense.
VonPurpleHayes
Rumors reported by reliable sources as opposed to a random guy on social media.
Elon’sDOGEbag
Shark:
It does actually, otherwise we’d all be speculating about flights to Toronto.
spliffTONE
@iBleedBlue: How on Earth are you ignorant to the idea of using an ad blocker in the year 2024?
I’ve literally never seen a pop up ad while using MLBTR. Get it together, you whiner.
WadeBoggsWildRide
Brave browser. Boomer.
BPax
There is an ad at the top of the page featuring a beautiful and very busty woman holding a soccer ball. This I am fine with!
DroppedThirdStrike
Literally just scrolled to top of page to verify
Theodore
Forget it. I am a Blue Jay fan with these two guys at the helm nothing will be done .I do not know about how you but feel about all the stuff they brag about is the renovations to the stadium . What I care about is the players they put on the field to bloody compete . What have this fools done in 8 year , when they took over they cried that Anthopoulos left the cupboards bare , what have these Guys done or drafting in last few years to improve the team . Remembering that Vlad and Bo did not come via these two twits.
bullred
I hope the Jays pay Teo enough to get him. 3 years @ 72 mil total is fine. He should make the Jays pay a little extra for the insult of trading him. He was a calming influence for his teammates.
bullred
At 3.6 War per 162 game average over the last 4 years he should be asking for that. He performs when he plays.
bullred
Belli has averaged 2 War per 162 games over the last 4 years and is overpriced at 25 Mil a year.
bullred
Santander has averaged 2.4 War per 162 games over the last 4 years and is wanting 5 years. I would have a hard time doing 5 years at 20 Mil per but maybe 18 Mil. Desperate times.
friesTO
Teo would want to be reunited with Vlad though. As long as Vlad isn’t extended there’s no reason to come here
KnicksFanCavsFan
@!Bleed
The very nature of a site with the word “rumor” in it, is that partly, the content is going to be speculative or reporting possibilities and when facts behind apparent, then covering it.
Rick Wilkins
You do always have the option of not visiting this site anymore. Ads pay the bills, like it or not. The inconvenience of ads can be avoided by paying for a subscription, plus you’ll get extra content, you know, like every other website out there. I’ve been reading these articles for over 15 years, and the only thing that has really changed in that regard is the recent addition of “obituaries” of old ball players, which I don’t think anyone other than the trolls mind. If this reply comes off as kind of a smug, yeah no one wants to hear you whine kinda tone, then mission accomplished.
Seamaholic
They’re dependent on beat reporters and national guys for info. They don’t do their own reporting. It is what it is and always has been. Sometimes there’s just no information to report.
Baseball dude
It’s all about mentioning the Yankees and Dodgers to keep the comments coming!!
JoeBrady
iBleeedBlue
What is this website even offering anymore? Articles are pure conjecture and speculation
===========================
That’s basically what rumors are.
But past that, everything in life is stuff that has happened, or stuff that hasn’t happened. Since we already know what happened, there isn’t a lot of point in you signing into MLB-R if you don’t want to hear rumors.
And past that, if you don’t like ads, the $2.50/month they charge is like returning 50 bottles a month for deposit. You aren’t entitled to free stuff no matter what your college professors taught you.
Gator50
Well from a content perspective, I believe the term “rumors” in the name allows them quite a bit creative landscape.
AndyWarpath
Yeah this free website about baseball rumors providing us with free baseball rumors is the worst! Quit being so cheap and subscribe if you hate the occasional as so much. If anyone deserves the cash it’s these guys.
Salzilla
It offers you a place to chat and speculate with your fellow fans first and foremost.
Articles like this collect various mentions of the subject and collates into an article. You want more, click one of the links in the articles.
Otherwise it’s here so you engage. That engagement keeps the site going and makes it more valuable to sponsors. While there are plenty of ads, yes, it serves a purpose and since I like that purpose it’s fine. But like has been stated, pop up blockers are your friends.
numberoneslayerfan
it’s called mlbtradeRUMORS
averagejoe15
It is, and always has been, an aggregator site for baseball news and transactions. I don’t know what you’re expecting.
The article covers his contract expectations and some of the potential factors that may be in play for his slower than expected market development. That’s more the a typical aggregator provides. If you want to know what the guy ate for breakfast, try the site formerly known as Twitter.
As for the ads, well it would be great if running a business had no costs but the choice nowadays for websites, especially small ones, is either paywall or intrusive ads, so I’m again confused around your expectations.
StreakingBlue
Calm down
Elon’sDOGEbag
@MLBTR can we please get a downvote button already??
kidbryant
The website is named “RUMORS” …what more do you expect?
Fever Pitch Guy
I think the Dodgers are just playing on Teo’s desire to remain with them, they are probably figuring he will give a discount to stay. But make no mistake, he’s definitely asking for too much.
The Red Sox won’t sign him for 3 years to be a fulltime DH, not with them already trying to balance 3 DH’s in Casas, Devers and Yoshida.
enteluj88
Just because one team with too many bad defensive players won’t pay him doesn’t mean he’s asking too much.
Fever Pitch Guy
entel – So far no team wants to give him what he’s asking. That’s because he’s asking for outfielder money even though he’s not that good an outfielder. I’m talking about the entire market, not just one or two teams.
Uncle Pedro’s Dancing Kittens
Is he that bad defensively? I thought he was considered a decent fielder. If he is just a DH, I agree he would not be a priority as we have too many options for there.
Fever Pitch Guy
Uncle – I’m probably the wrong person to ask, but I wouldn’t mind having Teo in LF.
However this quote from Steve is in the above article: ” He drew well below-average marks for his defense,”
So yeah, well below means he was pretty bad.
Uncle Pedro’s Dancing Kittens
I completely missed that line in the article. Thought I had read it carefully. Funny because I thought I had read someplace that his defense was at least passable, but I may have misread it. I definitely don’t want it to get worse we need to improve in that area, but I think about the years with Manny in the outfield and that was some pretty weak defense. Maybe unpredictable would be a better way to put it. We still had some great and very entertaining years during that time.
Fever Pitch Guy
Uncle – I totally agree! There were quite a few highly entertaining Sox players back in the early 2000’s, but Manny was the most entertaining. He was must-see TV. Of all the memorabilia I have, he’s the player I have the most of.
So many great Manny memories, and two of my personal favorites I was right there in Baltimore to witness …. his 500th homerun, and when he scaled the outfield wall to make a sensational catch …. and then he high-fived a fan on the way down from his leap! Even when he was with Cleveland he caught my attention as I sat front row next to the Pesky Pole.
Anyway getting back to Teo, I’m in the minority here because several people insist that every Red Sox position player be fantastic defensively … but I don’t. As long as Duran/Rafaela/Abreu are covering CF/RF in Fenway, it doesn’t matter if the guy playing LF is below average.
So I’m totally fine with Santander or Teo playing LF, although I really don’t want to see Duran or Abreu go anywhere … which would mean Rafaela stays in the infield.
Uncle Pedro’s Dancing Kittens
I just want them to start getting more active. There have been so many rumors but so few actual moves. I do believe they are planning on being active this offseason, but I am losing patience. Still early, but fans deserve a few more Christmas presents (starter, closer, right handed bat, etc.).
Crochet was an important first step although I wish they were able to do it without giving up Teel. Yoshida needs to be traded so they can open up DH. Someone like Bregman seems like an impact player if they can move Devers (ideally to DH or see how he does at first during spring training).
I have a feeling there is a decent chance Abreu gets traded, although it may be Casas. Not sure that we want to lose either of them, but if it brings back the right player in return it may be worth it. Maybe there are some moves in the works that we don’t know about and we will get some surprise gifts under the Christmas tree this year.
sfjackcoke
Below average means that others may be higher on SFG’s list of hitters they are contemplating. I don’t think he’s Joc Pederson bad but given how quickly LAD pivoted to Conforto vs bring back Teo does speak to the roster fit for him there.
As for roster fit in SF the question about Teo is when does his glove force him into the DH role full time AND does SF want him in their OF which moves Ramos to RF. Their home park makes the fit tougher vs some of the other possible landing spots. The other x factor for SF is his QO tag.
lejamesbron
3 years at that AAV is an issue. High K rate guy with declining defense. Wish this off-season would move quicker I’m dying for the pieces to fall in line!
inkstainedscribe
Crickets from ATL, which oddly makes me think something could happen there. Start him in RF until Acuña returns, then move him to LF. When Ozuna’s contract expires, Teo becomes a DH/4th OF.
Seamaholic
They don’t have the money.
RodBecksBurnerAccount
This has been one of the fastest moving off-seasons in a long time.
BlueSkies_LA
Seems like we’ve seen a lot more major signings this December than last year. Not many big names remain on the board.
As for Hernandez, he’ll get somewhere in the neighborhood of his ask. His K-rate has always been high, and that just isn’t a big factor for a power hitter in today’s analytics game. I don’t know that his defense is declining, it was just never great — at least not very pretty to look at.
Jerry Hairston Jr's Toupee
Teo just doesn’t like to play the field. He shows his plus speed running the bases. But when it comes to chasing down a ball in the outfield, he’d rather jog….
BlueSkies_LA
Just in watching him play, I think he doesn’t get the good reads off the bat that the better outfielders do. This is what makes Mookie so good. It’s rare to see his legs take him to the wrong spot right off the bat.
DirtyWater04
Boston could hide Manny Ramirez in left field, we can hide Teoscar there. Given how desperately we need a big RH bat, I wouldn’t hesitate to call him up and offer 3/$75. Sounds like he signs on the spot if you do.
JoeBrady
And in two years, fans will be wondering how much salary we’d have to eat to get rid of him.
And if I am spending $25M per, I’d want a good #2/weak #1 SP. We can trade guys like Abreu and/or Casas for RH hitters. We still need SPs and RPs
DirtyWater04
In two years he’d be going into the final year of his 3 year deal. If he is already that bad at that point (unlikely as he has not yet demonstrated any signs of starting to decline), then you go the Hanley Ramirez route and DFA him to make room for the desired replacement. The Red Sox have very little money on the books that far out, for how bad they need to add a RH power bat for 2025, they can certainly afford to bear the risk of him suddenly being useless in 2027. And if you sign a bat, then you can trade Abreu for more pitching since the teams who have arms to spare seem to mostly want position players in return.
RodBecksBurnerAccount
$25 million per year doesn’t buy you a #2 or #1 anymore. Eovaldi just signed a 3/$75 at 35 years old and he’s more of a #3.
Fever Pitch Guy
Dirty – I agree with almost everything in your post, except the need for a RHB is a myth.
Story is a RHB who is due for a rebound season.
Grissom is a RHB who is supposedly a good hitter
Campbell is a RHB who will likely be on the 2025 team
Ref is a RHB coming off a .830 OPS season
Wong is a RHB who plays multiple positions
Rafaela is a RHB who will be on the 2025 team
Narvaez is a RHB who could be the backup catcher
And most importantly what people don’t realize, Anthony is a VERY good hitter against LHP …. in fact his .904 OPS against them was better than his OPS against RHP.
So acquiring a RHB is more of a “want” than a “need”.
DirtyWater04
But we lost our most dependable RH bat in O’Neill, as well as a guy who was a capable outfielder. That’s 31 home runs, 2.6 WAR, and a 132 OPS+ out the door so I do believe that’s significant enough that he needs to be replaced.
Looking at the meat of the lineup, our leadoff hitter (Duran) hits lefty. Our two biggest bats (Devers, Casas) hit lefty. Our (currently) best up-and-coming bat (Abreu) hits lefty .And our DH (Yoshida) hits lefty. And at some point in the near future, Mayer will be taking over shortstop from Story, which is another primarily lefty hitter.
Honestly I did not know that about Anthony’s splits so thanks for the enlightenment. That does make me feel a lot better for when it’s his turn to get called up. But Devers, Casas, Mayer, Abreu, Yoshida, and Duran is still too many lefties for my palate. Would much prefer to dump Yoshida and get a righty in there.
At this point I’m not assuming or expecting to get much of anything from Story or Grissom. Would love to be proven wrong, but from what we’ve seen there I think it’s far more prudent to plan on them not being major contributors than the other way around. Same for the rest of those guys minus Rafaela, I don’t think we should be building out the roster in a way that those guys will be counted on to provide significant run production. They are all very fine players in their roles, but I don’t envision any of them replacing a 30 HR guy.
Fever Pitch Guy
Dirty – I think it’s better to look at players as groups instead of individually.
Probably not all of Mayer, Campbell and Anthony will make a big impact next year …. but at least one of them likely will.
Probably not all of Story, Grissom, Whitlock and Hendriks will make a big comeback …. but at least one of them will.
And replacing O’Neill’s production will be a combination of players ….. Story and/or Grissom having a rebound year, Casas, Yoshida and/or Devers having a healthy full year …. Anthony and/or Campbell having a breakout year.
I know it’s hard to believe, but this year no Red Sox player hit better than .285 or drove in more than 83 runs. There’s plenty of room for improvement next year.
Dorothy_Mantooth
Hernandez fits in perfectly in Boston, but I think Boston is desperately trying to move Yoshida first so Hernandez can take most of his at bats as DH. He can play some left field vs. a tough left handed pitcher, but 75%+ of his at bats in Boston would most likely take place at DH.
I wonder if Boston eats some salary if they can convince Oak/Sac/LV to take on Yoshida. Nothing but a wild card needed in return. The A’s still need to spend another $20M+ to avoid a grievance so this could be a good fit for them. I don’t see Boston signing him unless they can move Yoshida first.
mlbnyyfan
Yankees need to go get Bellinger. They desperately need another Lefty. I wouldn’t mind Verdugo coming back for the right price
KnicksFanCavsFan
@mlb
Push come to shove, could you tolerate Joc Oederson or Jesse Winkler in LF?
itsmeheyhii
Definitely need a good lefty bat but I think its time to move on from Verdugo. At this point I’d rather see what Grisham could do if we somehow fail hard enough in acquiring a bat.
Seamaholic
Yankees fans are passionate but frankly just dumb. Bellinger sucks as an asset. He’s a league average player making $26m a year for two (likely) more years. That costs Steinbrenner more like $45m a year with lux tax (could be higher). Yes you need a left handed power hitter, preferably who can play 1B. But no you don’t need or want Bellinger.
YankeesBleacherCreature
Which is why he is still a Cub as they don’t want to send money. You’re trading for his ’23 4.4 bWAR and him being still 29.
KnicksFanCavsFan
@Seam
Then who? 34 year old Walker? 38 year old a Santana. You have to pay the lux tax. with all of them. Belli is only 28 and there’s reason to think that moving to YS from Wrigley and their deep RF wall should improve. Factor in his versatility on defense and he’s prefect for the Yanks.
JoeBrady
But no you don’t need or want Bellinger.
==================
But if the issue is money, how are you going to get a LH bat that plays CF and/or 1st without spending money?
DirtyWater04
Hell I’d rather live with Teoscar every day in left than Devers every day at third. I say sign him first and worry about Yoshida second, but if and when we are able to dump him I’d move Devers into that vacated DH spot in a heartbeat. Then try and sign Bregman or swing a trade for Arenado to play third.
I know I’m dreaming because that’s way too rich for Henry’s appetite, but it’s fun to think about while still theoretically possible.
JoeBrady
I’d rather live with Teoscar every day in left than Devers every day at third.
=======================
I think that’s a moot point unless they trade Duran, Rafaela or Abreu. Teo won’t start over any of those guys. Even if they trade Abreu, I don’t see Teo playing RF.
And even if he plays RF, it will only be until Anthony gets promoted.
I think Teo is almost a pure DH play.
DirtyWater04
Maybe, but I still think they’re likely to flip Abreu for pitching. He makes the most sense as a trade asset because he’s about to be made redundant by a higher ceiling prospect at the same position, has plenty of control left, and has already established that at worst he is a decent big leaguer, but coming off a nice rookie season could still improve plenty. That opens up a spot in the outfield at least until Anthony plays his way into the mix – maybe that’s in 2025, maybe it’s not until 2026. He is just 2020, so it’s not impossible to think they might slow-walk his promotion unless his play really forces the issue. And if the issue becomes all of a sudden having too many good bats, that’s a great problem to have in my opinion.
Joemo
Dorothy – Moving Yoshida is the easiest path to fixing a ton of Red Sox issues. Teoscar can play the outfield, but will benefit from days off at DH. This would also free up ABs at DH to other players.
And they wouldn’t have to trade for him! It makes too much sense.
So they won’t be doing it.
WaitTil2026
Agreed, Dorothy, but I think it will be tough to move Yoshida, and there is the additional problem of Devers – who is at 3B for now but won’t stick there forever. I’m not sure Boston is in the position to be making a multi-year commitment to a DH.
Uncle Pedro’s Dancing Kittens
What about Seattle? Couldn’t they use his bat. I was hoping he could somehow be worked into a trade with a West Coast team.
BlueSkies_LA
The Dodgers have the leverage of the QO, few budget concerns, and the stated desire of the player working in their favor. The only reason I can imagine for why they have seemingly not made Hernandez the most competitive offer so far is because they expect him to take a discount to stay with the team.
DirtyWater04
Probably trying to offer $70 million with $50M deferred hahaha
WadeBoggsWildRide
He also doesn’t fit their style of play. Dodgers like versatility and taking walks.
BlueSkies_LA
The knew who he was when they hired him a year ago, and the only known fact of his current free agency is he and the Dodgers are trying to come to terms.
shibbynotdude
I think the Dodgers are waiting for the money market to develop. If they are sitting at the same number discussed/ offered at the end of the season why budge until the market makes you budge? So far there hasn’t been a reason to budge. Every dollar over is pretty much double for them in cb taxes.
cwsOverhaul
Pay much older options Teoscar or Santander more guaranteed money and comp pick…. or cough up 1 notable headliner prospect for 3yrs of Luis Robert that stings.
drdback
DBacks should trade Montgomery and Alec Thomas for other needs (closer perhaps) and sign Santander. I think he could wreak havoc in that ballpark.
Wagner>Cobb
They should keep Montgomery as a prime bounce back candidate. See if Merrill Kelly draws interest in his final year. Or keep everyone and roll with a 6 man rotation to start the year. Let injuries determine when you revert to a 5 man.
1. Gallen
2. Kelly
3. Nelson
4. Monty
5. Pfaadt
6. ERod
Really good rotation assuming Monty and ERod return to norms somewhat and Nelson and Pfaadt take steps forward.
Give Santander his 5 year deal, but defer money off the first year. Suarez and Monty becoming FA’s after this year covers the money, as would Gurriel if he opted out. They need to replace Walker’s bat and Santander is a great way to go about it.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Weird how 1 year at $33M or so ($10M or so deferred) was a great value but more years at $23.5M flat is too much. I read somewhere that he’s valued in the $17M-$20M range and basically if he’d sign for like 2 years/$35M to 3 years/$63M or so teams would pounce and get it done ASAP.
Based on other players’ contracts relative to their production and their weaknesses (be it defensive or high K rate or injury prone or whatever) it seems strange to me that Teoscar Hernandez can’t land a straight forward 3 years/$60M offer from virtually all suitors that would turn into like 3 years/$75M due to competitive bidding.
Like I say-perception and “vibes” are like half of the valuation equation- some guys have an upside perception that gets them extra years and a few million over slot AAV’s and other guys have this “he will crater any year now” perception that limits them to 1-2 year deals under par AAV despite equal or better overall production, WAR etc than those guys who get dollars and years thrown at them willy-nilly.
WaitTil2026
Trillionaire, the ability to play passable defense is a key differentiatior.
shibbynotdude
It was 1 year $23 mil with a bit of that deferred
Lindor's Bodyguard
1/$23. Get real.
Yankee Clipper
I am curious if his asking price went up exponentially after the Soto signing, and he wants to be paid for excellent performance this past year, obviously.
He has 4.2 WAR, but averages 2.9 WAR/162 for his career. So, assuming last season was his best and he has one more like it, then regresses to his mean, he will be worth 10 WAR, which is approximately $80MM.
However, projections have him at only 2.3 WAR FOR 2025, which provides for a total WAR of only 6.9 for the next three seasons. So, that equates to an approximate value of $56MM.
SHARKmapiro
Teo projects to produce less going forward unless it’s on a stacked team like last season. Buyer beware.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
There’s a premium nowadays that is the new true value, though. If classic WAR evaluates him at 2.3 averaged over the next 3 years what was $18-19M can be safely and reasonably argued ti actually be worth $20-$25M. Why should others get that premium boost and Teoscar should have to settle for the technical value of his stats?
DirtyWater04
If the rule of thumb that every 1 WAR is worth $8 or $9 million is still true, and assuming he is roughly a 3 WAR player over the next 3 years, plus factoring in a slight premium because he’s a free agent, 3/$75 is very easily justified.
Let’s say year 1 he is a 3.5-4 WAR
Year 2: 2.5-3 WAR
Year 3: 2 WAR
Using the low end of that rule of thumb and calling it $8 million per WAR, then he’s worth:
Year 1: $28 M to $32 M
Year 2: $20 M to $24 M
Year 3: $16 M
So that pegs his production as being worth somewhere between $64 and $72 million. The Red Sox in particular do not have to worry about factoring in the value lost due to qualifying offer considerations, because they will receive QO compensation from whoever signs Pivetta to wash that out. Thus, Teoscar only costs money and given what you can expect to get from him carries a very reasonable ask price both for term and dollars. There is no excuse whatsoever not to get this done.
JoeBrady
Would you give any DH a $28-32M one-year contract?
DirtyWater04
Yes? If he’s creating 4 WAR worth of value that’s literally what his production is worth….
Even if that wound up being a slight overpay, it would still be worth it to not have to watch the alternative which is Cora and Breslow stubbornly trying to make it through the year with a platoon of Rob Refsnyder and Romy Gonzalez in left field when Rafaela inevitably has to go plug the hole at second base again and there’s nobody else capable of playing left on the 26 man roster.
Did you have a problem with it when the Red Sox paid JD Martinez $24 million a year, for several years, back in 2018?
YankeesBleacherCreature
Then you need to account for the luxury tax for teams over the line. His best market are the teams under it willing to give him 3+ years for a lower AAV.
JoeBrady
I’d be at least a little surprised if he repeated last year. In his two years prior to his walk year, he averaged 2.7 bWAR and a 117 OPS+. Given the likelihood of a 3-year decline, his ask of $66-72M wouldn’t interest me.
IMHO, he’s more like a $51-54M/3 player.
Rexhudler86
@yankee clipper. Probably doesn’t have much interest, and wouldn’t surprise me if the dodgers are checking on Santander. Seems like teams are looking for outfielders via trade. I’m wondering if that’s why the Astros did the tucker trade knowing they can get someone on a cheap deal.
Ma4170
That WAR valuation varies. Teams are paying less for 2+ WAR players last few years. I know the average over the last 7 offseasons has been $7.4M per 1 WAR. Frankly, what teams expect in performance is more like $6M per 1 WAR.
Either way, he’ll do well!
JoeBrady
Teams are paying less for 2+ WAR players last few years.
===========================
These calculations are also not linear. If you are expecting say, 2.7, 2.3, and 1.8, then the 1.8 can be knocked out right away since most team have some sort of 1.8 WAR DHs in the minors. Then it becomes more like 5 WAR for $64M+/-.
Joemo
I thought I saw an article saying he was looking for 3/70 earlier in December.
Just found this: x.com/Ralph_MasonJr/status/1863624260415099205
So I don’t think it took a huge jump.
slider32
This guy is a gamer, and comes up big in big situations, I don’t see the Dodgers letting him go.. They are first on his list!
toptimrubies
Yeah but it seems like it’s more like 10MM plus per WAR on the open market now.
WaitTil2026
The exact valuation seems to vary by position, but Fangraphs suggests that teams are paying less for the first two WAR than they are for production beyond that — which makes sense. You can often find +1 WAR position players on the waiver wire. Maybe $4M for the first WAR, $8M for the second WAR, and $12M for everything after that? For a +7 WAR player like Soto, that would come to $72M for the first year of the deal. A +2.5 WAR to +3 WAR player like Hernandez would be worth $18M to $24M on a one year deal. (His Steamer projection is for just +2.5 WAR, though I can see why some might hope for more than that.)
Ma4170
Like I mentioned, there’s an article that breaks down what teams are paying for players projected for 2+ WAR the past several years (using Fangraphs projections). It was as high as $9.3M in 2018 and 9.5M in 2020, and as low as 5.5M in 2021, 4.6M in 2023, and 6.7M in 2024. It averages out to $7.4M per WAR since 2018 for those players. Saying unilaterally though what people are worth per WAR almost doesn’t make sense because it varies year to year, but this is what teams have been paying. They’re getting smarter and more discerning in recent years clearly.
WaitTil2026
I would need to see the article to comment n the methodology.
BlueSkies_LA
I guess it’s okay for fans to noodle around with these sorts of calculations, so long as they realize that the teams don’t use them to value players.
YankeesBleacherCreature
Teams use a proprietary variant of WAR. It was proposed to use fWAR for arbitration during the CBA lockout.
BlueSkies_LA
All variants of WAR are proprietary by their nature. What they aren’t is secret. The analytical methods used by teams are secret, but I believe we can know that roster construction takes more into account than numerical representations of individual players. So while you can get away with using publicly available numbers to construct a salary model, the caveat has to be the knowledge that the teams are making these calculations differently.
SHARKmapiro
Count the Jays out. They won’t commit 3 years and $60 mil to an ancillary player.
Mickey Solis
Unlimited money from these desperate clown Dodgers, Dave Roberts leaves his vacation to pitch to Soto, just give this child Hernandez what he wants so he can come home to d*ddy already and spare us the saga.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
….H’what?
fred-3
Mickey, you make Padres fans look very bad
tikiagedola
He will come back. Everyone wants to play in la and for the best franchise in history
mlbnyyfan
@Knicks. Always wanted Joc but not sure he can play defense. If by some miracle Stanton is gone Joc a perfect DH for Yankees
DarrenDreifortsContract
I love Teo’s energy and passion but I feel like it would get old fast on a losing team. To the point where teammates and coaches would want him to shut up and sit down.
jimmertee
This was the problem with the Jays. Hernandez was traded to Seattle because of his antics and poor influence on Vladdy.
Digdugler
He was too happy and had too much fun for Atkins.
Doddsie
If Jays were smart they would offer Teo something like 3 years $72 million with opt outs after year one and two. That means great friends Teo and Vladdy can play together in 2025. And Jays go for it. If Vladdy then leave Teo can too. Or stay with the security of the three year deal. But Shapiro-Atkins likely aren’t that smart.
OilCanLloyd
Agree. It’s the right player for the Jays this year for the reason you stated. The fan base wouldn’t mind. I’m not sure Teo is interested….
Mikenmn
It makes sense for him to stand on 3 years, since he’s not likely to get another bite at the apple at his age, unless he gets a contract with multiple opt-outs. And, why would you want to give a player his age that type of security when you think you might be buying declining performance at the end?
Franx
It would be nice to bring Teo back to Toronto. Its sad because no major free agent is going to sign without an outlook on the future being bright. Vladdy and Bo won’t resign without testing the market and by late January if there are still no major free agent signings for TOR, they gotta pull the plug. Will they do it? Absolutely not, but the future is bleak for all Jays fans… Two big bats, 3 more bullpen pieces, an ace or rebuilt starter, sign Vladdy, and hope for some of your prospects to step up. It’s a tall order for the Boo Jays
swanhenge
Boston offered him 2/28 last year. I dont see how offers would be any different this year from them or anyone else. He’s gonna have trubbs getting 3 years.
KnicksFanCavsFan
I would rather they sign Profar or Santander. But how do others feel about Joc Pederson or Winkler? They both are poor defensively but they both crush righties and had great OBP.
Backup Catcher to the Backup Catcher
I’d like my Phillies to sign Profar for everyday duty in LF. The combo of Marsh/Rojas in CF won’t make anyone forget Willie, Mickey or the Duke, but I can live with that platoon playing good D and batting ninth.
StreakingBlue
Do the damn deal already Dodgers.
Mynameisnoname
When you’re talking a 30% K rate, any lost bat speed brings that into the slash killing mid thirties. Some players have steeper cliffs than others.
He could maintain for another few years for sure, but this is the sort of profile you get burned by.
AndyWarpath
Who would teams rather have as their DH?
Alonso 6/150
Santander 5/100
Hernandez 3/80
Sagacity
Andy – Or Devers 9/1 Billion?
Lindor's Bodyguard
Pete refuses to be a DH.
JoeBrady
Alonso
drdback
DBacks should sigh either Hernandez or Santander and trade away Montgomery and Alec Thomas for a closer and/or other pieces.
Rww59
Seen an interesting graph about free agents signing since 2020.Baltimore with very low payroll because of the kids they played also didn’t sign anyone.Owner is rolling in cash
slider32
yep, but they still haven’t; won a game in the playoffs in a long time!
jimmertee
We need to remember why the Jays traded him away in the first place. There was the problem with him and the Jays. Hernandez was traded to Seattle because of his antics and poor influence on Vladdy.
The Dodgers had other people in the room, more veteran, that would put his childish behaviour on pause.
I can’t see the jays revisiting the idea of acquiring Hernandez unless it’s for a severely discounted rate. Having said that Atkins and Shapiro are desperate and don’t know how to build a winner.
pepenas34
Get it done Dodgers.
2 years 50mm ( make it work to be 20mm/y lux tax )
SupremeZeus
Teoscar has a decision. He signs with the highest bidder. Or. He signs with the Dodgers who will not be the highest bidder.
Backup Catcher to the Backup Catcher
To think the Phillies passed o Teoscar Hernandez in the Rule 5 Draft a few years ago and chose Tyler Goeddel instead makes me ill. My Phillies need an everyday outfielder. Preferably a RH bat who can play either corner. Just not sure Dombro wants to pay the big cheese Teoscar will most likely receive.
Bdonnell
Can I just say Teoscar seems to me to be projecting somewhat close to Nelson Cruz. Teoscar should be in RF at this point in his career, and can probably give another year or 2 of 75% of his at-bats as a OFer, then have a nice 2-3 years as a 2-3 WAR DH only. Teoscar is athletic and can have a similar late career success that isn’t common for his age. Three years with Teoscar wouldn’t scare me at all, someone is gonna get a lot of performance out of him.
fox471 Dave
Agree. Teoscar brought immense value to the Dodgers, in a variety of ways. He is fine in LF defensively. Whatever antics he was involved in with the Jays did not emerge in 2024. Sign him!
rainbirdmuse
Dodger fan here. The Dodgers do not make the WS without Hernandez. Hard to believe they would hold tight to a 2 year versus 3 year contract. That is seriously penny wise pound foolish. They were willing to spend an absurd amount – $600 M – on the potentially disruptive Soto. They can afford another $20M on Hernandez. He’s not as big a negative on defense as Soto, compare their defense in the WS.
3 finger split
Every year it’s the same old game of musical chairs. FAs always ask for the moon and when the chairs available become less and less somebody will sign so they have a job…Profar comes to mind…opts out of a contract with San Diego and ends up signing with a terrible Colorado team late and not only lost money but then got released and the Padres picked him up for almost nothing and then signed him for a million dollars last year and he had a career year and now he is in the same boat as some of the others…waiting for an offer that he feels is commensurate with his ability. Hernamdez will sign for 22 – 24 million a year on a two-year deal with a club option for a third. Profar might get a two year 22-24 million deal total with a club option for a third…fewer chairs and the music is trending to stop shortly. Unless these guys come down on their “ask” or agree to a good portion of deferred money they are going to be waiting for awhile.
Personally I would have no problem as a player to defer money for down the road and have a significant source of income long after I was done playing…getting a check every year for 2-3 million would be pretty sweet for say 10-15 years.
This one belongs to the Reds
He would mash in the Reds ballpark.
Not that they will pony up the bread.
Bobcastelliniscat
It’s frustrating because the Reds can surely afford $69 million dollars over three years for Hernandez. Nick Martinez’s $21,000,000 dollar contract will come off the books after this season. There is no reason why the Reds should not be in on Hernandez.
cmanson
the latest news on Teoscar Hernández is that there is no latest news on Teoscar Hernández.
kylegocougs
There are literally details here, like his contract demands
gloves09
Isn’t it great to see the Jays in all this? Adkins Shapiro are killing an entire country, trade them both for a buckey of balls. Useless
bestone
It would be easier just to revoke their work visas….deport them back to Cleveland.
Sadface
With the Bellinger trade Yankees off his list.
Begottenson
That’s too bad
Bobcastelliniscat
The Reds should be able to afford a $69,000,000 over 3 years deal for Hernandez. It’s better than trading half their farm for Robert Jr. who has a hard time staying healthy.
AGS
That’s the issue—Teo will just take that offer back to the Dodgers. He doesn’t want to sign with another team.
kylegocougs
Better have a great batter’s eye or he’ll whine and K 40%
AGS
I wouldn’t bother increasing your bid for Teo. He prefers to sign with the Dodgers, so any offer will be presented to them to match or exceed.
Begottenson
Could the Yankees get either one of these guys or is that a pipe dream ?
SportsFan0000
Basallo, McDermott and Povich for Dylan Cease