Juan Soto’s free agency will be the primary narrative this offseason until he chooses his next landing spot, though there’s no indication that things are close. The 26-year-old superstar began meeting with teams this week but is still in the early stages of the process. For instance, Sean McAdam of MassLive.com reports that while the Red Sox feel their three-hour meeting with Soto and agent Scott Boras was “productive,” it was more introductory and informative than anything else. The two sides did not discuss years and dollars; the Sox pitched Soto on their plans for the future, their upcoming wave of high-end prospects and other aspects of the organization, while Soto sought to learn about their player evaluation methods, Fenway Park’s facilities, etc. It’s common for early meetings of this nature for top-end free agents to be introductory in nature, so this isn’t necessarily unique to Soto.
The Red Sox haven’t been involved in the deep waters of free agency in recent offseasons. Trevor Story is the lone nine-figure expenditure for the Sox in the past five years. Since signing David Price in 2015, the Red Sox have only gone beyond two years on a free agent four times (Story, J.D. Martinez, Masataka Yoshida and Nathan Eovaldi). Given that, it’s not surprising to see one of the elements Soto hoped to gauge (per McAdam) was the team’s “commitment to winning.”
That said, Rob Bradford of WEEI.com tweets that the Red Sox are approaching their pursuit of Soto with a level of “intent” that we’ve not seen from Boston “in some time.” Intent alone won’t win the bidding, of course, but the Sox have not been characterized as major players for top-end free agents in recent years. All indications this offseason seem to signal a shift in direction.
The incumbent Yankees and crosstown Mets are still perceived by many as the favorites to win the Soto bidding, once formal offers begin rolling in. To this point, it doesn’t seem the process has reached that point. Jon Heyman of the New York Post reports that the Yankees are comfortable going to 13 years and topping Aaron Judge’s $40MM annual salary in order to keep Soto, placing their baseline comfort level somewhere in the $520MM range overall. Most expectations are that Soto will exceed that mark by a fair margin, but it’s a notable starting point all the same.
Meanwhile, Ben Nicholson-Smith of Sportsnet takes a look at at the Blue Jays’ interest in Soto, noting that as was the case with Shohei Ohtani last offseason, ownership views him as an exception to any other offseason budgetary plans. Toronto’s pursuit of Soto is not an indication that if the Jays miss out on the star slugger, they’ll pivot and spend $500-700MM elsewhere in free agency. Within his previously referenced column, Heyman doubles down on prior reporting that the Blue Jays plan to be aggressive in their pursuit of Soto.
That’s not necessarily the case with all of his expected suitors. ESPN’s Jeff Passan wrote this week that the Dodgers “won’t chase after Soto,” having already committed to nine more years of Ohtani and thus potentially restricting them in the event that Soto eventually needs to spend more time at designated hitter. They’ll be opportunistic and perhaps jump into the fray if the market doesn’t develop as Soto hopes, though that seems unlikely, given the robust demand for his services and a potential Bronx-versus-Queens bidding war.
Up until last winter, with Ohtani and Yoshinobu Yamamoto, that was generally how Los Angeles had approached the market under president of baseball operations Andrew Friedman. Though they regularly fielded one of the game’s largest payrolls and most star-studded rosters, most of the Dodgers’ star power over the years was acquired on the trade market (e.g. Mookie Betts, Tyler Glasnow) or developed in-house (e.g. Will Smith, Clayton Kershaw, Corey Seager prior to his free agent departure). Freddie Freeman was the lone big-ticket free agent acquisition, and he came on board with a deferral-laden deal after an extended stay on the open market. That scenario almost certainly won’t happen with Soto.
As it stands, there’s still no expected timetable for when Soto might reach a decision or when offers might be presented in earnest. The fact that the Red Sox didn’t even delve into numbers speaks to the current preliminary stage of the bidding process. It’s always possible Soto could decide he wants to accelerate the process and have a team by the end of the month, but a decision at some point in December feels likelier.
I don’t see him deferring money.
If he does, he better be charging credit card interest rates, deincentivizing it for teams. Freeman, etc charging no interest on deferred dollars, while teams makes millions on that until time to payout is borderline criminal.
Run – The only thing is with Freeman, he probably would have been offered quite a bit less without deferrals. It’s all factored in.
Kinda like when you go to buy a new Tesla. You either choose financing at zero percent, or you choose all cash at a reduced price.
Same with housing, you can buy a house at a much better price if you pay all cash. As they say, cash is king.
When financing cash isn’t always king because companies make money off fees and interest. Buying cash can be easier because your kicking out finance company but often times they could have interest in financing because they have employees that strictly do financing part and they have to keep them busy too. Its like buying car cash at dealer they would rather you finance the car then sell car for cash because in the end they still get their money and tack on finance charges. Baseball teams can offer players more money when they do dereferrals, because they go by yearly profit loss of current year salary’s.
Freeman was offered more by the Braves when you take into account the referrals.
I’m sure Soto accepts Apple Pay
You aren’t getting many sellers that are dumb enough to take less for cash on a house. What difference does it make to the sellers. It hits their bank account the same if it comes from a bank or someone’s bank account.
“You aren’t getting many sellers that are dumb enough to take less for cash on a house. What difference does it make to the sellers. It hits their bank account the same if it comes from a bank or someone’s bank account.”
guaranteed cash in hand vs a mortgage that is contingent on a bank approval that can potentially due to pulling out because maybe paperwork, home valuation, permits, insurance, etc etc.
Imagine then having to relist which can cost more money . Also if it falls through did that money have contingency like perhaps purchasing a new home and that deal now falls through or have to pay for two homes. Guaranteed cash in hand creates certainty and peace of mind and is sometimes worth more than a couple of grand and having to wait on a middle man. Time is money. Cash cuts a lot of red tape and paperwork and items needed for a 3rd party not needed by just the individual.
Some will take the cash and cut the price. It takes way too long to process. Developers especially prefer the cash immediately, usually because they have eyes on other properties and got bills due now. Why would ya involve a financing company when it’s not needed?
To make more money. You all watch too many overpriced housing shows. Maybe you do that on a twenty million dollar home that another buyer might be hard to come by. For normal homes, why would anyone leave money on the table. But none of this has to do with Freeman. He knows the money was getting paid to him.
What about players like Mike Trout that sign these huge contracts and go missing in action? When these guys actually have incentive to play they tear the scene up but as soon as the ink dries on their huge extensions they become fragile as fine china I think the teams should be guarded against these scammers beyond insurance policies. That’s why prices for a couple to catch a regular would take almost a $1000! But not one person complains about the ridiculous number of times these guys scam teams into the exact same crap just so fans can whine and complain about prices all while players AND owners keep the scam going. The list of players is ridiculous that have been paid millions all while playing less than half the games a year. Sale, Rodon, Trout, Ohtani, and going back over the last 20 years the list is massive of the amount of players that aren’t worth the price of the paper used for their contracts but continue to get paid even when “injuries” forces them to retire the first or second year into a multiple year contract. Strasburg is a prime example! Stop crying about the owners when all these guys are scammers!
freak – I think with some athletes they know a serious injury might be coming, so they do everything they can to put it off and sign a big longterm contract.
I can’t speak for all those players you listed, but Sale definitely knew he was injured when he rushed into that extension with the Red Sox.
When has Ohtani missed more than half the games while being paid a ridiculous amount?
Ridiculous post, by the way. The owners sign players to these contracts because they can afford to. Stop crying about what other people get paid.
Right? And guess what, teams that spend lots of money on the best players usually win a lot of games! It’s like everyone watched Moneyball once and decided that’s how every baseball team should operate.
Can’t prove that at all unfair to say.
Rendon!
I’m all for players getting their money but nobody steals money like Rendon
freak, Trout has provided 86.2 WAR or about $732 million in value to his team over his career so far. When he retires he will have made $504 million.
If he gets paid through the end of his contract without playing another game it will have provided the Angels with more than $100 million in surplus value not including the extra tickets sold just because you have a talent like him in the lineup.
Kabong, they don’t sign players to long term, high dollar contracts because they can afford to. They do it because it makes them money.
Freak – $1000?! WTF are you talking about? Baseball tickets are the most reasonably priced of the four major sports. If you want to sit on the third baseline, then yeah, you’re gonna pay a higher price, but $1000 is ridiculously hyperbolic.
It’s no scam. When players get hurt, insurance usually pays for their salaries, not the teams.
Instead of consistently whining about the best players in the world getting paid like the best in their field, stop watching. Take up croquet.
Fever – The Red Sox have doctors on staff, don’t they? Contracts don’t get signed until a contract is completed, right?
Fever- Even if Sale knew, teams before finalizing terms have team doctors do physicals on players. So if the Red Sox didn’t catch that Sale was hurt that’s on them. It’s more likely the team doctor told John Henry “yes he’s hurt but in my opinion it’s not major”.
Remember the Mets didn’t finalize with Carlos Correa because they didn’t like how a previous injury healed back. That’s how he ended up on the Twins.
Because the can afford to?
It’s because some members of general the public keep paying these ridiculous.prices. They can afford to pay these ridiculous prices.
Most.of.them.dont even gomto.the game.and would even dream.of.giving some.kids.the tickets…..
Too much of status symbol. Too intrested.and.showing off.to their freinds they are rich.
Ever seen some kids sitting in Billy Crystals’ season ticketed.seat? OR ANYWHERE IN THAT SECTION, EVER?
The Billy Crystals of the world would just assume we don’t go to the game to dirty the air they breath.
We live in a generation of bass turds.
I would love to see how folks come up with these price per WAR valuations.
RunDMC
If he does, he better be charging credit card interest rates, deincentivizing it for teams.
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Why would one want to dis-incentivize any options? The more options you have available, the better for everyone.
Anything is entirely possible!!
No reason too since he’s not going to the Red Sox, he’s not going to the Dodgers, he’s not going to the Phillies, he’s not going to the Giants, he’s not going to some mystery team. He’s going to one of the two NY teams. Everything else is Boras building his market to get the most money possible. The Yankees don’t defer money. Not sure about the Mets.
The Mets gave us Bobby Bonilla Day.
That was the Wilpons, not Cohen.
Cohen will not be outbid for Soto under any circumstance
You wish lol
He’s going to be deferring money whether he wants to or not.
On a 14 year deal at a 45m AAV, the last year’s salary will be deferred for 13+ years, and that $45m will be worth something like $25m in 2038, perhaps as little as $17m given salary inflation on top of CPI-type inflation.
I suppose he can ask for a one-time, up front payout of $250m in return for 14 years of his services so that he can dive into a swimming pool filled with cash. He might even get it.
i think you are confusing deferment with valuation. Otherwise every contract including the ones signed just this week would be deferring money as they are paid i believe monthly. so whatever they signed for now is worth less at the end of the contract even on a one year deal. Maybe not that drastic but still worth less.
Red sox 2024 winter tagline has changed fr om “full throttle” to “Committed to Winning”!
“We’re super serious this time, Red Sox fans!”
Acoss –
January 15, 2025 – Red Sox season ticket renewal deadline
January 16, 2025 – Sam Kennedy announces none of the free agents they targeted “aligned” with what the Sox were willing to spend, but the team is confident with their current players going into the regular season.
But rest assured they tried really hard this time!
Did they hire the Reds PR guys?
Fever, the only difference maybe this time is Henry knows Sox fans are mad and if he doesn’t do something big, it will finally start to hit him in the wallet. it could be a mid free agent and one or two huge trades. Fans need to see a commitment.
Dewey – Pretty sure it’s already hit him in the wallet. Expect another decline in revenue for this year.
The proof is in the pudding. When they sign, we will know whether they signed with Boston or with another team. Until that point it is all speculation and fluff.
I would be very surprised if Soto were to land in Boston.
You mean “Super interested”.
Soto is doing the same method as Ohtani did. – Work all the clubs for as much AAV and term as can be had, and then leverage that against the team and city that he actually wants to play in.
And it isn’t Toronto.
Yeah one gets the sense that this is really just NYC vs NYC, and comes down to how much red ink Steve Cohen cares to spill. I actually believe the Yankees could easily pivot to, say, Walker and Santander, or Hernandez and one of the SP’s, throw in a trade acquired 3B and move Jazz to 2B and call it a fine day.
I do like the idea of Chisholm going back to 2b for the Yankees. If they miss Soto, I expect maybe Bregman and a pitcher. Dominguez-Grisham-Judge is a better defensive OF anyway.
You know that Soto was a finalist for a GG…
If they miss out on Soto I think Dominguez to CF and they acquire a LF. I don’t see them starting Grisham
Walker’s game and hitting style is an obvious fit in the Bronx and the Yankees need a 1B. I think that regardless of their success or failure in the Soto sweepstakes the Yankees will be going after Walker.
If the Yanks don’t sign Soto, I like adding Walker/Adames/ Bader/ and Scott. Infield Walker-Durbing- Volpe- Adames Outfield Dominguez- Bader- Judge.
Those are the kinds of moves the Mets should be making instead of saddling themselves with the most expensive player in baseball whose tier by overall value for their best 7-year stretches includes Goldschmidt, Votto, Arenado, or Freeman, not Betts, Trout, Ohtani, or Judge.
It’s a shame the Red Sox have become an unserious organization because on paper he is pretty much exactly what this team looks for in its superstars. And while the environment is certainly a pressure cooker not everyone is built for, if you can handle it and do well to endear yourself to the fans, there are not many cities out there who revere their athletes like Boston does. This could’ve/should’ve been a match made in heaven, but we all know they’re too cheap to do it. They’ll spend all winter bragging about how they were interested though!
he is pretty much exactly what this team looks for in its superstars.
=======================
Except that there are no open spots. It would be insane to spend $40M+ to have a 6.5 WAR player replace a 3.4 WAR player, especially since we need two #1 SPs, and maybe another BP arm.
How about a 7.9 WAR player to replace a non-existent player? O’Neill is gone. Red Sox have two OF.
They currently have 4 potential outfielders on the roster and more on the way up. Rafaela can move back into the outfield with O’Niell gone. Not that Soto would not have a major impact, but probably about .oooo9% they sign him.
Nice to see someone else is capable of rational thinking. When the season ended and the assessments of what the Sox needed going forward into 2025 started nowhere on any list of needs for the team was there listed a left handed power hitting OFer. Focus on the true team needs and leave Soto to the teams that actually have a spot for him.
Unserious lol. What they have done is masterful. Loaded with young talent and tons of money to play with. Redsox will be in playoffs next 10 years. Bank on it
And what happens if the big four prospects all live up to or exceed their billing and become superstars? Kiss ’em goodbye. You just watched this organization low ball and ship out guys who should’ve been lifers with their numbers hanging in the right field corner one day like Lester, Betts, and Bogaerts, but you think it’s going to be any different with this wave of youngsters?
It’s never Toronto
Toronto tax situation is brutal for them to compete for elite free agents.
William – True, but the exchange rate helps offset.
Currently 41% !!!!
Yeah, but try to explain that to players that would never live there off season, are on the road for the entire spring, and half the season. I had a conversion with one prominent guy about this that played for Toronto who I thought would never leave there, and he said it was the single biggest factor for why he left the team when he went free agent. He said it was on all the players minds that were looking to make that big security contract. The guys that didn’t mind tended to be guys fighting to keep jobs in the league, and guys Toronto controlled. The rest thought about it.
I agree with you that when you are talking monopoly money level salaries you factor it all in. Most guys are just trying to figure out where the hot club is for post-game.
100%. He’s already got 1-2 teams at most that he wants to play for, and will just leverage other interest to max out the years/$. I’d say we are about a week away from Boras proclaiming “we are entertaining offers from 10 teams” (even though it’s 4).
“You see fans…….we were in on Soto”
Zero chance he signs with Sox. Moreover, Sox gave their last 40 Man Roster spot to a 37yo journeyman reliever yesterday.
Sad – I’m thinking Pedro and Papi don’t believe the Sox will sign Soto either.
That’s probably why they didn’t bother to join the meeting, even though they are supposed to be the team’s “ambassadors”.
Nailed it. Also, when you have one hole to fill and this guy will plug it, you pull out the red carpet. The Red Sox are fully aware they are a burst dam of issues and need about 4 or 5 fixes. That moneys needs to go towards either solving 2 or 3 of the issues or adding a superstar in the one area they have under reasonable control.
Absolutely zero. Glad they went all out on the Powerpoint presentation, though.
And on a more serious note – I’m not too concerned about making room on the 40 man, that’ll work itself out. They’re in a bit of a roster crunch situation from all the youth they’ve been focused on acquiring. Very long list of rule 5-eligible guys in the system. It’s a good problem to have, but it means there will be some musical chairs coming. Trades will need to be made to consolidate assets. Spots will be open soon enough.
I agree, good problem t have a deep farm system. But, Rule 5 is next Tuesday, couldnt they have signed Wilson on wednesday and put a more valuable prospect exposed to draft on the 40 Man?
The Sox have two players to protect – Fulmer and Hunter Dobbins. If they want to protect Jhostnyxon Garcia, he’s the only other one worth considering. But he hasn’t even reached AA yet.
Yeah I suppose so. I’m losing track of time, I forgot the deadline is that close. We still have 4 of our top 30 prospects unprotected which made me think they must be cooking up a trade that’s coming, but it’s been all quiet to this point so it’s seeming less likely. Certainly running out of time on that so who knows anymore.
Sad – The Sox may have worried there could be more competition for Wilson after the draft. Impossible to know for sure, but highly unlikely.
As for running out of room on the 40 man, that’s poor roster management plain and simple. If there’s a chance the players will get taken, you trade them or clear space by trading other players.
Garcia has already reached AA but I don’t think he’s ready and highly doubt the password wil be able to stick on a 26 man all season anyway. Dobbins will be protected and I think they should also protect Monegro as well. He only pitched in high A but he was obviously ready for AA and based on his swing and miss stuff I could easily see a team wanting to add an arm like that. I think I would protect Fulmer, Dobbins, and Monegro take a chance on everyone else.
Agree on Monegro, of the 4 in our top 30 he is the most I want to see them find a spot to protect. He’s got plenty of work to do on his other pitches still but that curveball is a thing of beauty.
Unimportant. The important piece is who’s place did he take? If they had to cut me to make room for Wilson, it is probably the right move.
I’m pretty sure I read there was an open spot so he didn’t displace anyone in particular. Only the opportunity cost of not protecting a kid from the Rule 5 list.
Dobbins is 100% getting protected. Fulmer as well unless they think he’s damaged goods but most likely they will. The real question is if you protect Monegro if you do that’s three guys to protect. They have enough fodder to easily protect all three.
I do doubt the Sox pass on Soto so they can keep Mickey Gaspar on the 40 man.
I don’t think the Dodgers are really in on Soto. It just doesn’t make sense to spend 5-6 times more than they would resigning Teoscar.
Not to mention all of the injury question marks with the rotation.
They aren’t moving Betts back to the infield to make room for Randal Grichuk.
True but Soto isn’t long for the outfield much longer and I don’t see him improving his defense.. Dodgers likely checking in for due diligence purposes but who knows.
They were moving Betts back to the infield last season before Soto was even an option.
Well they did move Betts to the infield for Heyward, so they could do it for Grichuk.
It’s Dodgers or Yankees. I could see either
Darren – The money spent hasn’t caught up with the money earned so there is no reason to hesitate picking up Soto to be the team that buys championships like the Yankees from 1919 to 1962. The gimmicks with the cash flow provided by the commissioner assures the Dodgers of a big shot at Soto and based on age and skill, he’s a perfect fit for any team that can afford him.
The pitching issues proved irrelevant when you can hit like the Dodgers and Ohtani is back pitching in 2025.
Hands down. Soto goes to LAD unless he prefers to be the big fish then he goes to the METS who are the next richest team that doesn’t have a star more popular than him. Philly has money rolling off soon and is the long shot in the race. The Red Sox will get left in the gate on Soto.
Juan Soto for 13 years or two of Christian Walker, Teoscar Hernández, or Anthony Santander for approximately the same price on much shorter deals? Decisions, decisions.
shelling out for a generational superstar should be an easy decision
That’s counter-intuitive. If he takes the best offer, then the presumption is that the acquiring team overpaid by at least a little,
But more importantly, who you sign is probably more important than how much you paid. If Seattle signs Burnes instead of Soto, bad move. And just the opposite, if the RS sign Soto instead of pitching, one again, bad move.
I realize Soto is well on his way to a HOF career. There’s no doubt about it.
Can we stick a pin in that generational player thing at least until he wins an MVP? Ohtani had two before reaching free agency. Trout had two before reaching Soto’s age. Harper had one at 22.
How many generational players can there be in the league at the same time?
There are usually quite a few. Revisit any decade of baseball for proof. Mantles, Mays, Aaron, Mathews, Banks, and Frank Robinson came up virtually simultaneously. At the same time, the likes of Wiliams, Musial, Berra, Campanella, and Jackie Robinson were still highly productive superstars. All can be considered generational players.
Everyone on your list has an MVP award except one player.
Most of them have multiple MVP awards. I don’t think Mathews should be on your list. Not all HOF players should be considered generational. I don’t think it’s a lot to ask that a player have at least one MVP before being considered generational
I think every era has about half a dozen truly generational talents on average, but it was a little lower in the earlier decades and naturally has been a little on the higher side as the league’s expanded to so many teams. I’m probably forgetting a few names but it was a fun idea to think through so I thought it would be fun to hash out and write down: Of course some guys’ careers don’t fit perfectly into the buckets I made either but I mostly kept them in the one I felt they “most” belonged to.
Dead ball era (pre 1920’s): W. Johnson, Young, Cobb, Wagner, Speaker
Pre-war era (1920’s & 30’s): Ruth, Hornsby, Gehrig, Ott, DiMaggio
Integration: era (1940’s & 50’s): Williams, Musial, Mays, Mantle, Aaron, Banks, J. Robinson
Expansion era (1960’s & early 70’s): Morgan, Yastrzemski, F. Robinson, Gibson, Koufax, Ryan, Rose, Killebrew, Seaver
Free agency era (late 1970’s to mid 90’s):: Henderson, Schmidt, Clemens, Maddux, Boggs, Ripken
Steroid era (mid 90’s to mid 00’s): Bonds, A-Rod, R. Johnson, Griffey Jr., Martinez, McGwire, Sosa, Jones, Clemens again
Post-Steroid era (mid 00’s to mid 2010’s): Pujols, Cabrera, Ichiro, Verlander, Beltre, Kershaw, Ortiz
Whatever we’re calling the present era (mid 2010’s to present): Trout, Ohtani, Harper, Betts, Scherzer, Verlander again
I wouldn’t quite put Soto on the “generational” list yet, but it’s also hard to argue that he’s not on a trajectory that would put him on it.
Generational player has become a bad term. They called Caleb Williams that in Chicago before he played a game! I think of Michael Jordan or Tim Brady, not one of 50 players all in the league at the same time. It’s silly.
Bonds needs to be on your list. Even before he started using steroids, he was one of the best players to ever play the game. I get the animosity towards him due to the steroid use. I also get the anger he felt when other players using steroids were sucking all the oxygen from the room and being praised by everyone including the media and the commissioner. If they didn’t know those people were using, they were idiots.
I think the phrase also should mean different things in different sports.
Like for the NBA – we are talking what for a long time was a smaller league, with smaller rosters, and it’s been very dynasty-driven in terms of champions. So for the NBA I think it’s fair to say the only truly generational players have been Russell, Kareem, Wilt, Magic, Bird, Jordan, Kobe, Shaq, Lebron, and Curry. Most generations in NBA history have been so largely defined by just one or two players, a generational basketball talent is much more of a true one of a kind.
Baseball on the other hand is different. For one it’s a sport that has always been defined by its eras – as I tried to split it up into above – with each era having its own distinct flair. But each era has numerous defining players and teams so to me a generational talent in baseball is one of that special handful of guys who become synonymous with the times which is why they’re more plentiful.
And when it comes to football, yeah, we’ve gotta calm down with the rookie hype. It’s been out of control for a long time.
@dasit That would be almost true if baseball was a two-tool game, but it isn’t. In two-thirds of his full seasons Soto is a 5 bWAR player, peaking at 7.9 for his career, whereas the generational superstars Ohtani, Trout, Betts, and Judge have multiple 10 WAR seasons to their credit. Soto’s not in their zip code by overall value, which is all that matters.
For his 7 seasons to date Soto’s in the group with players like Votto, Freeman, Arenado and a dozen other contemporary guys—fine players, to be sure, but no one ever called them generational superstars or wanted to make them they highest paid players in the game.
But there *will* be some idiot front office (hey, Hal!) that’s in a bind or gets carried away and effectively makes Joey Votto, who was the Juan Soto of the 2010s, the highest paid player in MLB, all-time.
Like so many of their ilk Votto, as Soto probably will be, was done as an elite player at age 33, with just two useful seasons after 33. It won’t be pretty. Look at how Votto, Dick Allen, Miguel Cabrera, and Duke Snider aged.
I remember this one blue jays offseason where the jays were like guys don’t worry we let EE walk and signed Kendres Morales for half the amount isn’t that awesome. Fast forward to like 3 weeks into the season and things were in fact not awesome!
Soto. He alone makes Judge better. The three you mentioned don’t have that types of impact – combined.
Was Soto there in 2022 when Judge hit 62 home runs?
See, Soto WILLS Judge to be better. Just by thinking it.
Soto is going to wait until past the Winter Meetings next month when clubs are going to make more transactions and be more concrete about their offseason spendings.
Just wait for the mystery teams to jump in. So far, this hasn’t been a circus. Will it get to those levels or is this really the Yankees vs. the Mets and nobody else has a shot?
Mets vs Yankees
“Mystery” teams won’t make an appearance until January or February when Bora$ gets desperate.
I really think the Mets are being used to leverage the Yankees, but it is really Yankees vs. Yankees.
I kind of agree with this. The Red Sox publicly saying they are in is enough to drive those years and dollars up as is. The Mets are a bigger threat, yet I feel like they know that spreading that money around is probably the best route also. Anyway, the Yankees are bidding against hypothetically losing him (possibly to a rival), and that is what matters as long as the threat is SEEN as real.
“And look, Juan, our future projections have us staying under the luxury tax for years to come!”
Dodgers should still love Mookie, but might love Soto more, so trade Mookie back to the Red Sox, which frees up tons of $$ for Soto, and would bring back a huge return for Dodger needs now and a few years ahead.
Crazy idea?
Yeah. Mookie and his remaining contract are not going to get a great return and I’m pretty sure a trade will piss off their fanbase even if they do end up signing Soto. I’m not even sure where the Dodgers’ Soto rumors are coming from as they need to sign another starting pitcher.
They have like 11 already. They need more?
Glasnow, Yamamoto, Ohtani, possibly Sasaki, Gonsolin, May, Wrobleski, Knack, Casparius, Ferris is ready in the minors, Ryan and Stone are hurt, but you’re saying the Dodgers need MORE MLB ready arms? I don’t think the Dodgers NEED to sign any pitcher if they get Sasaki. There’s always the bullpen game as well.
I’ve given up on worrying about who and where with this Dodgers FO. They are heads and shoulders ahead of the game….and they have money.
They do have a lot of possibilities but they need more reliable arms, especially at the start of the season. Glasnow and Yamamoto (and Sasaki, if they get him) will be ready. Ohtani won’t be ready, Kershaw may not be ready. Gonsolin and May, you don’t know what you’re going to get in their first year back from surgery. I still see them signing at least one starter, two if they don’t get Sasaki.
I agree with much of what you say, but the odds are Sasaki goes to SD. Sasaki won’t be making much salary, and the endorsement pie in LA is finite. Ohtani and Yamamoto will get their share first. Yu Darvish and Sasaki are close. I’ve even read that Darvish was his hero. Sasaki may, or may not go to SD, but I’d bet he doesn’t go to LA.
Yes, crazy idea.
No way the Red Sox trade for Mookie or any player with that kind of contract. The only way anyone trades for Mookie is if the Dodgers eat a chunk of his contract. Mookie has been great for the Dodgers, and he looks like he could age better than most guys with crazy contracts. But it is an interesting idea to trade him if they are in serious pursuit of Soto and need to free up money to do it. I can’t see it happening but if the Dodgers were able to land Soto then maybe they could trade Mookie to the Yankees or the Mets. Seems like such a long shot that it could happen though.
nich – Mookie returning to Boston would generate massive revenue and go a long way in re-engaging the Red Sox fanbase.
Maybe for a little while but you’d be getting Mookie in his declining years. I don’t see anyone trying to pull that trigger unless the Dodgers eat a good chunk of that contract. And why would the Dodgers trade him now — unless they had someone better (and younger) than him to fill his spot?
Well, we don’t have Jeter Downs or Alex Verdugo anymore, so how about we send the Dodgers Connor Wong, Enmanuel Valdez, and Johstynxon Garcia for Mookie back and call it even?
Mookie will be on the decline soon. Good luck with that
If Mookie gets traded his contract becomes even more expensive. His contract calls for the deferred money to be paid out on a yearly basis. Current money is worth more than deferred money.
Darkhorses: Dodgers aren’t trading Mookie. Period. He is the heart and soul of the team. Soto is good but one dimensional – a great hitter. Mookie can do it all.
Yes.
No, although incredibly unlikely. This was a generational misstep in Red Sox history. It will not happen, but the Red Sox would be blessed if it did. Frankly, I thought Mookie was the best all-around talent we ever had in my lifetime, and I am old. Beloved. Absolutely deadly game changer in the lineup. The foundation of the team offensively and defensively, and we money pinched him away to only lose other stars and overpay for the least of the talent we had in pure panic. We don’t deserve him back. It is almost unfair for the Red Sox to be allowed to be redeemed for this mistake. I want him back, but no. The front office should live with this. I would say live and learn, but I doubt that at all.
Mets will outspend everyone and land Soto. They’ll also resign Alonso and sign a high tier starting pitcher.
“Mets will outspend everyone and land Soto.”
I agree.
“They’ll also resign Alonso…”
I disagree.
“…and sign a high tier starting pitcher.”
It depends on the pitcher. They probably re-sign Manaea, which, I think, would be a good signing, but probably not Burnes, or Snell. Maybe Fried or Flaherty though.
The least shocking thing to me is Alonso going, and Walker entering.
Juan, who? Never heard of the guy in all my years of baseball…
York – It’s Juan Valdez, interest in him is brewing.
You never heard of Juan Epstein?
Reds – Isn’t he the son of a woman legally named “Epstein’s Mother”?
He’s the reincarnation of Joey Votto, except he’ll inexplicably be made the highest player in the game.
There’s a better chance I sign with the Sox this winter than Soto inking a deal to play at Fenway.
Crazy to me how people are really counting the Yankees out here. Insane actually.
I know, right. I think they’re easily the most logical choice
WWS, If the bidding exceeds an AAV of $50M, do you really think the Yankees won’t drop out of the bidding? Soto would put the Yanks in the upper tier of CBT penalties. A $50M AAV would amount to an actual cost of that AAV to be between $90M and $110M. I don’t think it’s crazy at all that Hal would balk at paying that much.
Particularly since Cohen will have to overrule Stearns’ judgment to force him to overpay for Soto while taking year to year flexibility away from one of the game’s better GMs.
I have Soto signing with the Mets in the free agent contest. I mean good on the Red Sox for at least showing some initiative this offseason but I don’t see them landing Soto. I think Cohen gives him an offer the Yankees and Red Sox won’t top, at least that’s my opinion.
I went Yankees. Given my track record in that contest, it doesn’t bode well for a Soto return to the Bronx.
Signing Soto on paper is a great upgrade for nearly any team in the league. That isn’t the question for the Red Sox. The question for the Red Sox is why they would sign a massive contract for a lefty hitting outfielder in the only area they are semi ok in when they have massive holes elsewhere on the roster that they still need to deal with whether they signed him or not.
Soto is the best lefty hitter in the AL, but if I’m the Yankees and the dollars reach 600-700m, I pass. Too many holes to fill on the team. Grab Corbin Burns, Santander and Adames for less money while weakening the O’s too
I think he ends up back with the Yankees… but if they don’t win it all next year they could have a long wait before they get back to another Series. The payroll will be mostly tapped out; Judge, Cole, and Rodon are on the back 9; and the farm system is only OK. The Yanks will never be bad, per se, but I don’t know if they will be a true contender after 2025.
Giancarlo Stanton?
Yankee 2026 payroll is only 180 million, and 27 is even less while the cap will keep going up! The problem is the Dodgers have everything going for them.
“…is only 180 million…”
Only? That ranks 3rd highest in MLB. Holes need to be filled every year.
The Jays will definitely end up with some combo of guys like Profar, O’Neill, Pederson or Conforto. With Rich Hill bringing up the back of the rotation
Unless I’m reading your tone wrong, you sound disappointed?
Other than Rich Hill, that combo of guys you mention would improve the Blue Jays more than Juan Soto alone would while still allowing financial flexibility. Is Soto a good player? Absolutely. Is he hundreds of millions of dollars and ten years better than a combo of Profar,, O’Neil, Pederson, Conforto? I don’t think so.
I said some combo of, not all 4 players, So you think if the Jays end up with Pederson and Conforto or Profar and Pederson, that they will have had a better offseason then if they signed Soto?
What happened to the Jays?
If I were Soto I’d pick the Blue Jays. Being Dominican in America isn’t going to be pleasant for the next four years
Could you imagine if they rounded up athletes and kicked them out
Why would anyone in the country legally on a work permit be rounded up? That comment is beyond absurd.
Uh, did you get that on the View while they were busy discriminating against Hispanic males?
You do know that Latinos love Trump, don’t you?
Nice troll. Don’t fall for it folks. Lol
Prospect-wise, the Sox have a “brighter” future than the rest. Could mean something…right? I know it’s a long shot, but one can dream.
The theater of Soto going back to NY as a member of the Sox would be sublime.
If they can sign Soto , its basically making up for trading away Betts for nothing
The main return to the Red Sox in the Mookie Betts trade was the $48M that the Dodgers took on which was half of David Price’s remaining contract. When you take on that much money the player return is less.
Dodgers don’t like one dimensional players like Soto. They’re merely showing interest to drive his price up.
With a career -5.1 Defensive war Soto won’t be heading to LA. He needs to be a DH and that fits with the Mets or Nationals or ???
@Bluemarlin528
No speed and no defense pretty much makes him a DH. He might be worth $600 if he pitched but he doesn’t. Even Ohtani was stealing bases last year. Soto only stole 7. Not worth the investment. Price tag needs to come down. Spotrac is suggesting his market value is 14 years, $513,604,210, which still seems high.
14/513m is a $36.6m AAV, which is at least somewhat sane given Soto’s age, durability, and 5-win floor, not to mention that 14 years from now $36.6m is likely to be $20m or less in 2024 dollars.
Soto to be a LAD
Another reason Shohei got so much money deferred and another reason Betts is moving to the infield. The Dodgers bottomless pockets are ruining the competitive balance of baseball
Soto really isn’t a good enough all around player for the Dodgers to be interested in him. He’ll choose between the Yankees, Mets or Giants.
His bat is inner circle HOF caliber right now and he’s only 26. The Dodgers would be fools to not at least enter the auction for him just because he doesn’t run the bases or plays average-at-best LF defense. They stuck Teoscar Hernandez in LF a lot and he was real bad defensively, which didn’t seem to matter to them!
Teoscar was NOT bad defensively. He was average. Dodgers really have no need for a bat only guy like Soto. Dodgers could get Adames, Arenado and Burnes or Fried for what Soto would cost. Dodgers don’t do stupid.
Graceful he is not, but he makes the plays. And occasionally makes a great throw…
Easy with the extrapolating. Once upon a time Pujols and Cabrera were both tracking to be on pace for the home run record, and then their 30’s happened.
If only the game was called “Walks and Power,” not “Baseball.”
Strap it down boys, we’re in for a long ride. Nobody wants to be the first to make a formal offer because it’s only going to be used as a starting point to drive up the market. if they come in too low, they risk insulting Soto and not appearing to be a serious suitor. If they come in high, that won’t get him to sign, and it will raise the ceiling. At least that’s how I see it, but I’m no front office exec so
I think if it truly comes down to money, Soto is a met. Cohen has the most and seems willing to spend whatever it takes to get him. My guess is he will have a favorite team and will get the money close enough and go to whichever team that is.
I disagree , I think he ends up in Boston
I don’t think the NYYs are going to be in it. They can sell NY with all the endorsements that come with it, but so can the Met’s. They can sell hitting in front of Judge and Stanton all they want, but it’s going to come down to Money. Once the salary reaches the point where the CBT hit will result in the Yanks spending 90% to 110% of the AAV, I don’t see Hal being willing to do that.
I don’t know how high the Sox are willing to go, but I’d guess higher than the Yanks. But after the Met’s, I think the Jays are also willing to spend big, and have the next best chance after the Met’s.
Yankees didnt trade for him to let him walk. They’re going to try to sign him. He’s the only reason they even made the World Series
Well, the Yankees have that magnetic marketing of NYC and while the Mets guys do commercials, the big endorsement dollars go to Yankee players…..also, don’t think the Yankees, Mets, or Dodgers will be outbid by a smaller market team like the Sox (don’t troll me Boston fans….while the Sox rule NE, the Yankees do have a bigger TV market)…do you really think John Henry is prepared to spend that kind of money and ignore other needs for the foreseeable future…..and finally the taxation story of living and working in Toronto for at least half the year several affect the dollars involved in trying to sign him……just thinking.
For what it would cost for Soto.. the Redsox could get 2 starters And T.H .. I’ll take the later on this one….
Olm – I’d rather have TS instead of TH but JW probably means that ain’t happening.
The Blue Jays won’t get Soto and will piss off Vlad Guerrero in the process by offering hundreds of millions more to Soto than him. They they will be 0 for 2.
Good article Steve. Nice work connecting the dots and providing, me at least, with some new insights.
Seems pretty clear that all teams are being used to stoke the market to get the highest offers from the NY teams and everyone is being played. Typical Boras behavior.
You’re a bigger troll than I am if you think Soto signs with the Red Sox
How can you be bigger than biggest?
Boros will over price him for the market.
They’ll make an offer. It will be rejected. Then try to convince us they made an effort. Mookie anyone?
Soto is going to get 700 million or more! That’s the price take it or leave it! Don’t be surprised if Boston steps up and signs him! There ready to compete for the next decade or so! They need a stud
Trevor story has 90 RBI in 3 years for the sox
Love those fabulous long term high dollar deals !!
Captainmike1 – To be fair, if it was a one year deal it’s just as bad. It’s not the type of deal that is bad it’s the player.
The Red Sox must be doing this to try to drive up price.
Three reason I don’t believe this is serious:
1) They have shown ZERO willingness to spend on any big free agent the last few years. But they ‘show interest’. The fans have caught on to that BS line.
2) They are already deep in the OF. They have Duran, Abreu Rafaela with Anthony probably coming up sometime next year. This assumes they retain Yoshida and don’t retain O’Neill. MAYBE they deal from strength to improve another position?
3) They are already your three best hitters that are Lefty, Duran, Casas and Devers. You have two decent support bats that are also lefty in Abreu and Yoshida. Roman Anthony may make the team next year and he is lefty. They need right handed bats Rafaela is their only decent right handed bat that is signed. Story and Grissom can’t stay healthy and need to prove their bats.
If Yankees bring him back they better make other moves. The roster is still like Swiss cheese with him. Trade Stanton his value won’t get any higher. DH Soto more and put Judge back in RF where he belongs
For the umpteenth time, Stanton has a no trade which he supposedly won’t waive so he isn’t going anywhere…..
“Trade Stanton…”
The Marlins tried that 3 times. Stanton used his NTC to shoot down the first 2, so he could go to the Yankees. No way he accepts a trade out of NY.
Forget about Stanton, he hits well in the playoffs and can’t be moved!
@ Goose/ trying to look good in the eyes of the fans. No intention of breaking the bank for him.
I’m operating under the assumption that Abreu will be traded. Young, cost controlled, already solid but young enough he can still improve. Quality glove. One of our zillion left handed hitting corner outfield types so it’s dealing from a position of strength. I’m hoping they can find someone to take Yoshida too but that’s probably more of a pipe dream.
Soto is one of those players, where if I’m the Dodgers or Yankees, I’m saying “money isn’t an issue…name your price.”
Yanks will have a plan B in place if they don’t sign Soto I would like to see a more balanced team signing Walker/Adames/Bader and adding pitching. Add a starter like Burnes and add Scott..
The best fit for Soto is undoubtedly Detroit. An up-and-coming young team with potential all-star players at nearly every position along with the best pitcher in baseball and a slew of amazing talent in the minors.
Soto would be overshadowed in NY by Judge, in LA by Ohtani (& Betts), while NYM, BOS and TOR have nothing truly that exciting on the horizon… Detroit makes the most sense, especially if he wants to be integrated into a potential juggernaut team, the core of which will be together for years to come.. And for Chris Ilitch, it makes so much sense from a financial standpoint to pay Soto whatever he wants. It would be a similar situation to what they had with Cabrera, where he would become the face of the franchise for the next decade. I could honestly see this happening, it would be hush hush right until it was official.
Didn’t know that there was such a huge Dominican population in Detroit that would make Soto feel right at home….and as far as the best pitcher in baseball….yes he is now, but who knows when/if TJ lurks in the near future and the rest of the rotation is average at best…..and there are lots of teams with potential all -star players at many positions (the O’s come to mind there) with as much amazing talent in the minors as you say Detroit does…yet, betting against the O’s even getting involved.
What a load of nonsense this is rocky… the need for a Dominican population as if he’s going to become homeboys with them. And the threat of “if/when TJ lurks in the near future”… that can be said for EVERY SINGLE PITCHER in the league.
Can’t speak for Toronto but the Red Sox farm is loaded. The Red Sox window will open wide in 2026 but maybe next year if they address a tor pitcher. The Red Sox have a ton of high end talent coming especially on the position side. If they did sign Soto some of that high end talent would become expendable. The future is very bright for the Boston Red Sox.
Boston has nothing exciting on the horizon? You can’t be serious.
They have the 3rd, 7th, 10th, and 25th-ranked guys on the MLB.com Top 100 prospects list, who are all aged between 20-22 and all starting the year in AAA. Detroit doesn’t have a single MLB-ready position player in the top 50.
Boston is still a few years away from that point. Detroit is on the cusp of it right now and have a 6-7 year window… it’s the perfect time for them to sign Soto, it makes all the sense in the world. He should want to play for Detroit.
No Luke like I said Boston’s window can start as early as this year with decent off-season. It’s a moot point though neither team is signing Soto.
Bruin1012 – I know you are always optimistic but I think your statement could have been made in 2020 before Mookie was tossed. Boston’s window was closed with the Mookie deal and has stayed closed ever since. Nothing that has transpired has suggested change is coming during the off season. I wish it was to happen and please tell me if you see ANYTHING that suggests things are changing.
Yes, the entire roster is improving both at the MLB level and Farm System level because time is passing BUT all-star talent is increasing with a fan base that is so committed to futures (you are a big instigator in this thought process) that they are willing to trade the players who have overcome the odds and have become all-stars. The comments as of late about trading players like Duran show me that nothing has been learned from losing Mookie. Moving new found all-stars to other teams in hopes you can find something better is human nature and the grass is always greener theory. There is no guarantee that any of the top 100 prospects will be as good as Duran or Casas who I am still very impressed with. The entire fan base mentality is gaga over raw prospects that are not locks to be all-stars and the all-stars like Duran and Houck are treated as flukes compared to the next batch of prospects you’ve been preaching so hard the last year. I believe you have created a distorted perspective on the future. DirtyWater just suggested FOUR top 100 prospects are the future of the club, not the two current all-stars. What’s wrong with this picture? Is the cart in front of the horse in this scenario? This is precisely why I try to dampen the expectations you create with all your farm system hype. It’s not the Bloom factor, it’s the displaced allegiance to the actual players who overcome the odds and become all-stars and then are not celebrated because someone has promised them even greener grass.
I agree Boston won’t move on Soto or any other significant all-star level player this off season. I also agree that Detroit probably won’t get Soto over the alternatives of LA and NY. And I wish our home grown all-stars got a lot more respect that they are getting because we have hyped 4 guys into the top 100 prospects. Duran put up an 8.7 WAR in 2024 his first full season in the MLB. Had he not been disrespected by Cora and forced to hit 9th during his initial 2 call-ups maybe he would have had that season in 2023 or earlier. This is the problem with poor player evaluations. Just think what Rafaela might have achieved if Cora believed in him and batted him behind Duran and before Devers. He could have been ROY but now we’ll never know. We can only hope he can bounce back from the adversity caused by Cora and hope he responds like Duran did. His talent, like Duran’s, is far superior to players getting far more opportunities. That Houston connection for Cora continues to be strong and impactful to playing time.
For the record, Soto is a must try FA. His exceptional skills should be sought after but this franchise gave away a similar set of skills so the Dodgers could become a dominant team. I agree with you, no chance Boston will get Soto despite it being a critical way to upgrade the talent on the roster.
Is Luke right about Detroit? Absolutely. Are you right that it won’t happen? Absolutely.
Saga,
No question that Boston ownership made a huge mistake in letting Mookie go. There is also no question in my mind that Boston is going into a new era of competitive window opening. I have never advocated trading Jarren Duran he’s the engine that makes everything go and for the record I always liked Duran and was vocally against his swing change.
The Red Sox already have a very solid base of controllable players that imo are better than Detroits and one of the best youngest bases in baseball. Duran, Rafaela, Abreu, Casas are all controlled through at least 2028 and have already proven themselves. If you couple that with Devers, who’s a great hitter. You also have four guys coming that are already in the high minors in Anthony, Campbell, Teel, and Mayer. These guys are all excellent ball players and will be big leaguers. Will they all be superstars probably not but they will all make the big leagues and my guess is that three of these four will make their big league debut this season. When they arrive coupled with the core already in place the window swings wide open.
This is why I really want them to address the rotation with a tor guy and high end bullpen guy like Tanner Scott. My belief is this will allow the Red Sox a greater chance to compete if they can get a guy like Burnes, Fried, or Snell to lead this team as the guy. If they don’t get that guy then we are counting on improvement from Bello and Crawford and continued success from Houck. It could happen maybe Houck becomes a true tor guy or Bello and Crawford end up taking the jump like Houck did last year but imo it would be better to sign one of those big three.
For the record the big four weren’t hyped into top 25 prospects in baseball they earned it. These guys are ball players they play on both sides of the ball. One of the guys Mayer has trouble staying on the field so imo he’s expendable plus the Red Sox have Story signed thru 2027 plus the Red Sox have guys who can play short if Story gets injured again.
I still say the future is very bright for this Red Sox team regardless it’s just a question of whether the future starts this season or if we have to wait until 2026 it’s up to ownership.
Bruin1012 – Excellent response. I think you suggest many, many things that would make the team into what we both want it to be. The big difference to me is that I see a guy like Anthony coming up and hitting .250 or less this year with some hot streaks and some cold streaks and he needs to learn how to adjust like Duran did and I think Rafaela will. He will be the equivalent of a average to below average starter in 2025 much like Campbell would be or Teel. The key to Boston’s success will be how the big names adjust and develop in their first full seasons with the club. All three have the potential to do what Duran did. If that happens, I could see 2026 being a much better and more competitive season. I don’t see ownership spending the money for a top of the rotation guy or two like we need. That’s why I believe we are still at least a couple years away from being highly competitive.
If ownership does spend SMART money (Not contracts like Giolito or O’Neill) then success could come sooner. I still believe Devers moving to DH will be the turning point, especially if the new 3B fields and is a power hitting right handed bat like Jake Burger. At that point, only starting pitching will be left to supplement at the top of the rotation.
I think you are more optimistic than I am that ownership or Breslow will come through with our big needs:
1 – SP1 (lefty preferred)
2 – SP2 (either righty or lefty)
3 – 3B (power hitting right handed with a glove)
4 – Lefty Reliever (set-up man with closing capbilities)
If we could get two of the following SPs (Fried, Snell, Burnes, Bieber) along with Burger and Tanner Scott this team could compete for the Division Title in 2025.
It’s not going to happen but the light at the end of the tunnel can be seen now, It’s up to ownership and Breslow to make things happen so success comes sooner rather than later.
I wasn’t aware they were all going to pan out immediately, please tell me more. Bringing up 4 rookies on a great team is risky. Bringing up four rookies on a mediocre team with this many holes seems like an exercise in watching growing pains. Even spread out over a couple of years it doesn’t actually remedy any of the real problems we have outside of shifting existing players to other positions to shore up 1 position (2nd base). Just food for thought with the team as is.
The major problems are the rotation, bullpen, a right-handed power bat (or two), DH taken up by a contact bat, Devers owning a baseball glove on a major league team, and second base. Anything outside of upgrading those glaring problems means very little if we are trying to actually win the division or get a ring against what we know other far superior teams are running out there.
I personally can’t wait to see the young guys, but I know what that means if we do not upgrade the real problems. Hint, it’s not great.
William maybe I need to clarify my position.
I don’t believe all 4 of the big 4 will immediately pay dividends. My guess is one of the big 4 break with the team and the rest of the lineup should be able to carry a slow start from my guess Roman Anthony he’s the guy that makes the team out of spring training.
The other three will take some time at least one of them, assuming they aren’t traded, will probably not make his debut until 2026 or earliest would be a September call up probably Mayer. My guess is we will see Teel sometime in the June July area. I think he needs some time defensively to be the catcher for Boston defensively so that’s my guess. By that time Roman Anthony should have made his adjustments and should be solid hitter maybe even a rookie of the year candidate.
The wild card is Kristian Campbell. He is so versatile he could be a super utility guy as long as he hits my guess we could see him anytime from a month into the season to a September call up depending on if he needs some adjustment time.
To summarize I don’t think they will all be brought up together if they did that due to say massive amounts of injuries then the Red Sox will be in trouble. If they stagger their debuts that probably means the season is going relatively well and they should be able to weather the rookie inconsistency better.
Very good explanation. Posts are usually short, and you lose much of the reasoning behind something like “Trust the Red Sox brass,” ” Bloom=dumb,” or “Glasser and Westbrook for Crochet is a great trade.”
Mr. Soto, please don’t come to Toronto, as my cell phone bill is already too high. Despite you are in line to make $millions, some of us pensioners would feel the impact of a few extra dollars added on our bill each month.
I think the Sox are serious, but I also think they’ll be out bid. And I think that’s a good thing. I’d rather see major investment in pitching.
The whole Soto story is a scam. Last night the MLB channel had two idiots talking about the future of Soto and Boston’s interest. BS This type of story gets floated to the clowns at the MLB channel to propagate. Who benefits? 1 = Soto, 2 – Boras, 3 – Boston front office and ownership 4 – the team who is really pressing hard to close the deal without being mentioned 5 – the media by churning the story as if it’s real 6 – the players association members who will receive bigger contracts as the price gets bid upward 7 – the reporters providing bogus details fed to them from unknown sources or unidentified sources and lastly the industry because they are still in the forefront of many national discussions during the Football, Basketball and Hockey seasons.
Just a question for you all…If Soto signs for say 600 million for 13 years and that takes him through his age 39 season and it turns out that he is really already 29 years old and not the 26 that he reportedly is…what would happen to his contract ?
Would years be voided from a new contract ?
Would money have to be paid back ?
Then list goes on and on and the only reason I ask is because it was a topic on the radio this morning.
Doesn’t matter to me because I’m not a fan…good hitter…yes, gold glove outfielder…not a chance and I just don’t see this next contract aging well
Fraud. The contract would be in dispute. This has happened in the past. The team can either force the contract to be changed to reflect the new information, or it can be taken to court/league to void. Since the player has been caught red handed, it is more likely the player would ask for a revision along with the team to rectify it and end the matter (if they are worth the effort and in Soto’s case, he is), but in the end, the league would have to weigh in, and the players union would get involved.
It depends on whether his age is a material term in the contract, and whether the misrepresentation of his age was intentional fraud or inadvertent. Courts will void contracts or allow other remedies if there was a material misrepresentation to induce the other party to accept.
If you acquire proof right after the signing, I’d guess you have a legitimate claim. If you get 6 good years, and then he declines, I think you’re out of luck.
It is extremely rare that a person does not know his own age. So rare as to be a moot point.
In some third world countries it is not rare for outlying rural kids to not have paperwork drawn up till time has passed after birth. In Cuba, as an example, this happens. The kid may have been born, time passes, and the parents finally get paperwork on them issued to the date of reporting. A three-year-old is now 1 day old, etc. Not super often, but it happens. The question for the law is whether the paperwork (which is valid, but incorrect, has any meaning when the family and person knows that it is incorrect, and the victims (team) were misled by that paperwork and the player involved.
It is hard for any person under those circumstances to sit across from an arbitrator and say they honestly thought they were three years younger than they actually were, and that they didn’t think those years counted before paperwork. Interesting question though.
To compare Soto to Ohtani in any financial terms is ridiculous. Ohtani prints money. Yes the dodgers are “paying” him but he’s paying them too in merch sales and having a whole country behind him. Toronto could afford Ohtani cause what he brings in offsets the tax they’ll pay. Soto doesn’t have that bag with him. Great player please don’t anyone misunderstand what I’m saying but Toronto isn’t in on him. He’s a Yankee in the 12/500 range. Nothing deferred nothing fancy just paid.
I mostly disagree. I see the Met’s as the favorite. But, there only one MLB team in Canada. The Jays are a national team. Even when the Jays play in Seattle, Jays’ fans travel in numbers from Vancouver to root for them. The Merch with Soto in Toronto will be significant.
Hal Steinbrenner is not a profligate spender. He has always stressed at least a modicum of fiscal constraint. Not to say they won’t spend big, they absolutely will, But signing Soto means spending more than just big. With the CBT penalties, I think it’s more than Hal is going to be comfortable with.
I believe that Toronto could swing an Ohtani deal because of the additional revenue coming in to the due to TV deals in Japan.
I don’t think that Soto will increase the value of the Jays by additional TV coverage of the Jays in the DR.
The extra shirts sold doesn’t really compensate for the “investment”.
You’re trying to diminish the revenue value of merchandise sales by referring to it as just “shirts”. It’s more than just shirts. And again. the Jays have no other team to compete against in Canada.
The Jays have had some HoF players, but Soto would easily become the great Jay in history. That’s worth a lot.
Roger’s corporation could offer a personal services contract.He would be part ownership stake.
The Cubs will trade Bellinger to the Yankees and then sign Soto. You heard it here first.
And last.
I’m sure Heyman will soon be reporting, No No No sources tell me that the Dodgers are all in on Soto. So up your bids hint hint hint.
Soto has old player skills already. He may be much older than his ‘birth certificate’ says. Smart teams won’t touch Soto at near 600 million. No chance. He won’t sign in LA or Boston. A dumb financial team will buy him. 100%. He will sign in NY.
Useless information alert.
I was just looking at the Red Sox 40-man roster and I noticed something funny. Never looked at this, but I was actually shocked. I played for one of the best travel teams in the country when I was high school aged in the late 1980’s, and I was the smallest pitcher on my team at 6″2″ 235, and the 3rd smallest hitter in the lineup.
On the Red Sox I would be the second tallest hitter and second biggest built hitter when I was 17 years old. My high school aged travel team lineup was a more physically intimidating lineup then the Boston Red Sox. Not that it matters but was interesting to see what a collection of average sized guys we have throughout the 40-man roster for hitters. I always imagined these guys as mostly be bigger than me.
If you want the most rings in the next decade Juan, Nobody has more rings the last 2 decades at 4 (20%) and Boston is beyond stacked with 4 & 5 tool studs! We’ll win at keast 4 rings in the next 10 years. Why not do it where Babe Ruth won 3 and for your FAVORITE TEAM! Let that Dominican tradition in Fenway keep going! Devers & Bello & Soto, Manny, Papi, Pedro. You belong in Boston!
Boras plays all these teams. He does not leave a penny on the table. He never has. He plays one offer with the other and has been doing it for years. Breslow is also an amateur at this too.
It is true that Breslow is basically a rookie negotiator. Breslow will have his team put a number and years on Soto’s value evaluation. He will shoot below that and stick around till it surpasses that number. When it does, he will ask management once again what is reasonable to offer based on where the numbers and years have reached, and he will get a yes or no to continue. This is a franchise defining contract both positively and negatively. If anyone thinks he is calling the shots on this, they are insane.
It seems his clients left a lot of pennies on the table last off season.
The dodgers don’t need Soto. They don’t need the bat, they can do better than his glove. I’d rather give half the money for 2-3 more years. Plus we got two good outfielders coming up that will provide good bats and better defense. Friedman get pitchers not bats.
only thing red sox get out a soto meeting, is an MLB investigation. how can meeting a FA with no intention of signing him be legal?
Best 7 seasons, by bWAR:
–Chase Utley 49.3
–Juan Soto 36.4
First 3 full seasons, by bWAR
–Andres Giminez 16.7
–Juan Soto 10.4. In fairness, pro rate his rookie season and 2020 to full seasons, and he gets fairly close to Giminez. Not quite there, but at least it’s a race.
Soto, a terrific hitter who also manages to be the most overrated player in baseball.
2018-2024, total bWAR:
Marcus Semien — 37.4
Juan Soto — 36.4
Matt Chapman — 35.2
You’re comparing some players in their prime to one just entering it.
Ages 21-25
Andres Giminez – 18.6 bWAR
Juan Soto – 26.0 bWAR
Ages 22 – 25
Marcus Semien – 6.6 bWAR
Juan Soto – 28.4 bWAR
Since Matt Chapman didn’t play until he was 24:
Ages 24-25
Juan Soto – 13.4 bWAR
Matt Chapman – 10.8 bWAR
Sorry, I accidentally transposed numbers.
Ages 21-25
Andres Giminez – 18.6 bWAR
Juan Soto – 28.4 bWAR
Ages 22 – 25
Marcus Semien – 6.6 bWAR
Juan Soto – 26.0 bWAR
bro plz try using the reply button when replying to someone
I did. I’m not responsible for the glitches.
If Soto goes to the Dodgers I am going to be really really really sad. Hopefully that will not happen.
He’s gonna sign with Boston watch
“Toronto’s pursuit of Soto is not an indication that if the Jays miss out on the star slugger, they’ll pivot and spend $500-700MM elsewhere in free agency.”
Sounds like it’s all just kabuki drama for the Blue Jays. Lots of drama, but nothing is going to change? Or is it ‘Groundhog Day’, with Soto replacing Ohtani in the story this year? If they don’t add a few big bats, starting pitching depth, and a completely rebuilt bullpen this offseason, they are likely headed for another losing record.
Nats fan here with special memories of Soto’s earliest years in DC. He’s an enormous talent. But why doesn’t he stop whoring around? He’s 26 years old and now flirting with playing for a 4th team. That seems odd. And now he’s asking for his moonshot payday. Is he a hired gun, or a likeable, revered local hero somewhere? I guess things’ll be interesting no matter what he does or where he goes. But why don’t the Yankees just sew him up on a longterm deal? He’s one of the few guys around who’ll still be playing at a high level in 10 years.