The Pirates have placed Michael A. Taylor on outright waivers, according to Robert Murray of FanSided. It is important to note that Taylor was not designated for assignment, which means he is still on the team’s 26 and 40-man rosters, so he is eligible to play for the Pirates unless he is claimed by another club.
Taylor, 33, remains an excellent defender and a valuable baserunner in his 11th big league season. Unfortunately, he is putting up career-worst numbers at the plate. Considering he already had a career .683 OPS and 82 wRC+ entering the year, a career-worst performance means the righty batter has been all but an automatic out. He is slashing .196/.257/.284 with four home runs and 20 RBI in 1oo games.
With that in mind, it’s not hard to see why the Pirates might be looking for another team to take Taylor’s salary off their hands. The veteran signed a one-year, $4MM contract with Pittsburgh in the offseason, and he is still owed approximately $790,000 for the remainder of the season. However, if Taylor goes unclaimed over the next 48 hours, he will have the right to reject an outright assignment to the minor leagues without forfeiting any salary. Thus, it wouldn’t be surprising if the Pirates decide to retain him on the active roster. He still offers value as a veteran fourth outfielder and quality defensive replacement, even if he isn’t the everyday player the Pirates hoped he would be. On the other hand, the team might prefer to eat his remaining salary and give his roster spot to a more promising young player. Trade deadline acquisitions Nick Yorke and Billy Cook have both been hitting well at Triple-A lately; surely the Pirates will want to see what both of them can do at the big league level sooner rather than later.
Taylor has a .622 OPS since the start of July. That’s fine for a 4th OF/defensive replacement type. Someone will probably claim him. Wish h had done more here. He had a .693 OPS in 2022-2023 and hit 21 homers last year. Wonder what happened between last year and this year.
He had a career year and dropped off like so many players before him?
“ wonder what happened between last year and this year”
two words
Andy Haines
Lol blaming a hitting coach for Michael A Taylor not hitting? Or maybe he’s just not good? Insane how many casuals are on this site it’s actually pretty embarrassing
It’s insane to blame Haines for the struggles of a guy who was never a good hitter. Dudes don’t just forget how to hit because they have a new hitting coach anyway. Taylor’s xBA this season is only 11 points lower than his xBA last season (.211 to .222). Baseball is a finicky game. That’s all there is to his results.
And sometimes that doesn’t even work. A coach giving advice or trying to implement a mechanical change only does so much. It’s still up to the hitter to see the ball and drive the ball. There are so many factors associated with offense in this sport. It’s incredibly hard to be good at hitting a baseball. It’s why someone who fails 7 out of 10 times is likely still an elite offensive contributor. Although you know this.
Sometimes players just have better seasons; look at Matt Olson 2023 to 2024 not close tot be same player
what’s embarrassing is that the Bucs are near the bottom of the league in runs scored while people here think only defense wins games
Haines has been the hitting coach since 2020, he’s hardly new
Travis doesn’t watch enough of the Pirates to see that under Haines as hitting coach the Bucs have been awful offensively across the board.
Prospects with good stats in the minors NEVER seem to make the jump while most vets tank when they sign for Pittsburgh.
I’m in no way a TheMan3 apologist, but we both agree Haines’ record is abysmal.
It honestly does kind of surprise me that the MLBTR comment section gets so many low information comments.
If hitting coaches were that impactful, they’d make a lot more money.
It’s obviously not something you should pin on a hitting coach. I actually think it’s embarrassing how high brow people are because they know some stuff about MLB. I mean…congrats. Pat yourselves on the back. The tendency of intellectuals to believe they are the only ones with a right to speak (practically) is embarrassing.
I should note that I’ve been that judgemental guy most of my life. Hopefully you guys will find a bit of acceptance of the world and life in general one day. There are young people on here and casual fans. It’s not some private site. You have a lot in common. You both like MLB. The game is only afloat because of the “casuals”.
It’s a website called MLB trade rumors. It’s only an intellectual step higher in theory than MLB.com. This isn’t some analytics seminar or board for people playing high dollar fantasy sports. Sorry for rant and 3 posts everyone.
Put the drink down and go to bed, Rishi.
You’re adding nothing to this conversation.
I don’t drink. I’ll put my book down. IDC. It needs to be said on here. High brows abound. Certainly more important to say than speaking about the pirates hitting coach as the reason for a journeyman who can’t hit not hitting. I think you mentioned the vets they get not hitting. They are the Pirates. They don’t sign any decent hitters. I’m not saying the coach doesn’t stink. Idk. The Braves have a good hitting coach yet the whole team hasn’t hit, except Ozuna
Still nothing. Lots of words – no argument.
Good hitting and pitching coaches are very impactful,especially with young teams.
They are just not going to enable bad hitters to become good hitters.
There is a lot of information available on MLBTR. It surprises me how many people scroll past all of it just to make a low information comment.
The article tells you Taylor isn’t a great hitter long before he met Haines. Nobody is hiding the ball.
Not signing til March 16th and going right onto the active roster probably didn’t help.
That being said, poor hitting led to Taylor being replaced in Washington with (an arguably worse hitter in) Victor Robles.
Terrible hitting mechanics starting at his feet
Probably was listening to Andy Haines, the Pirates hitting coach. Andy really needs to go.
Taylor has been a poor hitter long before he got to Pittsburgh. His season in Minnesota was the exception
“Poor hitter long before”…You got that right. Michael A. Taylor is just one of those guys that never really improved as a hitter despite hundreds and hundreds of continued reps. Most guys will improve at least somewhat, if they manage to stay on the field long enough, but this guy just never really did.
Never expected him to be a Silver Slugger finalist, but he had an 86 OPS+ from 2021-2023 and is below 60 now. That would be a huge improvement if he could hit like he did in 2021-2023.
He barreled up a few extra balls last year which led to his slugging rise and now it’s gone back to reflect his career norms. He’s hitting more in line with his xstats from 2021-2023 than anything. This regression (if we can even call it that) should be expected, especially as he ages.
mlb f
“Most guys will improve at least somewhat, if they manage to stay on the field long enough”
Survivor bias. The guys that stay in the field are the ones who 1) are good enough as is 2) improve.
Most players don’t manage to stick around because they don’t manage to fulfill either of 1 or 2.
Taylor has stuck around because if 1. Despite not hitting he’s generally been above replacement level.
Above replacement level, DodgerBro?!? His 1.0 WAR is well below replacement level ratio, and his 52 OPS+ just screams “replace the f×$* outta me, Coach!” What are you seeing that everybody else isn’t?
Gwynn
1.0 WAR is above replacement level
He’s been worth about 11 fWAR in his career and at or above replacement level every season since 2015.
What is “everyone” seeing that I’m not?
2.0 is replacement level. And your screename is the worst ever. But have a nice day!
“2.0 is replacement level”
No.
WAR ° Wins ABOVE replacement.
2 WAR is 2 wins ABOVE replacement
“An average full-time position player is worth about 2 WAR, while average bench players contribute much less (typically between 0 and 1 WAR). Average starting pitchers also are worth around 2 WAR, while relief pitchers are considered superb if they crack +1 WAR.”
library.fangraphs.com/misc/war/
You’re welcome.
I having a decent day. Thx
“An average full-time position player is worth about 2 WAR blah-blah”
On his current trajectory, MAT might finish with 1.1 WAR. So, well below average, right? Replaceable, right? Semantics perhaps, but he’s not playing above replacement level, as you stated. Having positive WAR doesn’t exclude you from replacement. Now, explain his 52 OPS+? Cheers DB, I didn’t mean to come across as a jerk but that name haha!
If that’s to me Travis, yes I’m new to baseball. I’ll retort that we’re discussing MAT’s projected 1.1 WAR, so again- for those in the back, well below average. You know who gets DFA’d? Well below average players. Hence, they’re replaced. Negative WAR is a horrible player that should have been cut or Optioned awhile ago. You know who has 0.0 WAR? Everybody on Earth. Now explain his 52 OPS+.
Gwynn
“So, well below average, right? Replaceable, right?”
Average and replacement are not the same. So, no. I’m right. You are wrong.
He is above replacement. And has not been below replacement since 2915. As I said
The only question is if you have enough integrity to admit that or not.
“What are you seeing that everybody else isn’t?”
What I’m seeing, and you are not seeing, is the difference between two different things.
Per baseball-reference, Taylor has been worth 12.4. Wins Above Replacement (WAR) and 1.2 Wins Above Average (WAA).
baseball-reference.com/players/t/taylomi02.shtml
12.4 and 1.2 are different because WAR and WAA are different because replacement level and average are different
Here’s an article from a bit over a decade ago to get you up to speed if you’re still confused.
blogs.fangraphs.com/why-replacement-level/
“for a model that is attempting to answer how much value a player produced for his team in the past, average doesn’t work as the floor. It has to be lower than that in order to model the reality of playing time distributions, and replacement level provides a good barometer for the point at which a player should be penalized for continuing to take the field.”
If you have any further questions, don’t hesitate to ask
You just don’t get it, it’s cool! Aloha
I understand the point you’re trying to make here, Gwynning, but I feel that it’s not just semantics in this case. “Below-average” is still above “replacement level,” which is a critical note, imo, because “replacement level” and “replaceable” are not intended to mean the same thing. A team full of replacement level players would basically be slightly better than the collective White Sox roster, or about a 51-111 record.
Michael A. Taylor is below average but better than replacement level. It’s not like he’s been Andrew Benintendi who hasn’t hit a lick and has also been worth -9 DRS in the field and a negative baserunner. Benintendi has been below replacement level this season.
Tony- They are correct in their assessment,but it is almost certainly based wholly on his fielding,
His hitting is probably pretty close to 0 WAR which would make him a replacement level hitter.
The Pirates need hitting,which is one of the biggest reasons that he is getting waived.
Exactly Mendoza. And yet still they don’t want to explain the 52 OPS+, which is to the point you made. Cheers fellas!
Gwynn
‘Blah blah. I don’t understand WAR or replacement level but I’m going to argue anyway. Blah blah’
AKA: YOU just don’t get it. And act like you know a lot more than you actually do.
Noted
don’t mind Travis, he thinks he knows everything and everyone else are “ casual fans”
Oh I understand WAR and replacement level, chief. You still haven’t explained MAT’s 52 OPS+ though! Perhaps you don’t understand the significance of this, or it’s bearing on him being, ahem, replaced after being Waived?
Noted.
Gwynn
“Oh I understand WAR and replacement level,”
“2.0 is replacement level”
No. You, obviously to everyone who does understand it, don’t
Gwynn
“they don’t want to explain the 52 OPS+”
What do you mean?
WAR already includes Taylor’s hitting. What needs to be explained?
:remembers with whom I’m interacting:
Oh yes. Here you go
Taylor has been worth -17 runs with the bat. That’s terrible.
His base running has been worth 3 runs
His fielding has been worth 9 runs
He gets 1 run for playing CF
He gets a 1 run adjustment for his league
And 9 replacement runs
Add them all up and you get +6 runs above replacement.
fangraphs.com/players/michael-a-taylor/11489/stats…
It’s all there. Including the poor hitting.
Care to continue broadcasting to everyone that you don’t understand a thing about WAR?
Except that other players besides Taylor have regressed from last season
Do I need to list them?
Lol, you still don’t get it DB. Its fine if you don’t think MAT is replaceable with his horrible numbers, but projecting your insecurities on others is quite comical. Can’t ask for much more from Dodger fans! We’re done, I don’t have any more time for you. Aloha!
And I understand what he said. I’m done with you too, “Travis”/DB. You contribute nothing but snide arguments that are ludicrous to begin with. Go pound sand in your mom’s basement.
Geynn
Are you purposely being this obtuse?
Where, once, did I say that he’s “not replaceable”?
I obviously never once said that.
You either:
1) don’t have a clue about what replacement level is (and there’s ample evidence for that “2.0 is replacement level”).
2) Or you realize that you’ve lost the argument and lack the integrity to admit it
So, sure, run away from the discussion.
Everyone can already see that it’s you contributing nothing here but lane decades old tropes “mom’s basement” and the evoking of pity for someone who is so clueless.
Note that I use your actual words to prove my point. While you misconstrue (or misunderstand) mine.
You can run away from this discussion. But you can’t run away from knowing that you’re wrong.
Alhoa
The fact that you’re still trying to project that you “won” some “argument” that never existed is pedantic. Just shut it, or block me. There is nothing further to discuss here. You. Don’t. Seem. To. Get. It. And its ok. Now shoo! Fair travels, my friend.
Bye Travis. You’re worthless to any discussion.
“are you so obtuse that you don’t realize the discussion at hand? ”
Let’s review the discussion – using actual quotes
DB: Taylor has stuck around because if 1. Despite not hitting he’s generally been above replacement level.
Gwynn: Above replacement level, DodgerBro?!? His 1.0 WAR is well below replacement level ratio, and his 52 OPS+ just screams “replace the f×$* outta me, Coach!” What are you seeing that everybody else isn’t?
Also Gwynn: 2.0 is replacement level.
Also Gwynn: “Oh I understand WAR and replacement level,”
I made a completely true statement about Taylor. You trolled in with some nonsense either because you’re a troll or you don’t understand replacement level.
“And nothing else”…Jettisoning Michael A. Taylor makes sense on many levels. He’s not good, getting older and is certainly not in next year’s plans, so why not see if someone else wants him? Pittsburgh most likely will not make the playoffs so the at bats ticketed for Taylor can be better utilized developing someone else, who might actually be in next year’s plans.
You’re amazingly pedantic, DB. Reading comprehension is hard, huh! You’re either 8 years old or a m3th-head. Either way, I’ll enjoy the silence that wafts from your general direction!
You still don’t get it!
Pathetic
But keep liking your own comments!!
Lmao
Gwynn
“You still don’t get it!
Pathetic
But keep liking your own comments!!
Lmao”
You still haven’t learned to maybe be a little bit cautious about being less certain about things you only think you know?
“2.0 is replacement level”
“DB is liking their own comments”
These are products of your mind, not anyone else’s
In the 4 years of Andy Haines’ tenure as the hitting coach, the team batting average has never exceeded .235
In 2022 and under the tutelage of Haines, the team set the all time record for strikeouts with 1493
They are currently on pace to break that record this year
Blaming the hitting coach is beyond asinine. Something only a casual would do
Found Andy Haines’ account!
Every hitting coach gets too much credit or too much blame. I’m not sure why people even try to act like they know who is or isn’t good at teaching hitting.
Andy Haines isn’t good. Many pirates have said as much. Numbers seem to back it up.
Send along those quotes of Pirates players saying as much because I just googled it and I see zero quotes from Pirates players talking trash.
“Numbers seem to back it up.”
Is he hitting for them?
“half the people on this site have the IQ of a second grader”
And you’re a large part of that half, Woody.
Already posted on here.
Reds will probably add him to their collection of misfit toys.
What a shame for Taylor. He was great with the Twins.
Great? 21 homers with a .220 BA and 130 k’s isn’t exactly “Great”
DDC
Not great is trying to use batting average and strikeouts to measure a player’s performance.
DDC-Good post.Not great is thinking that a 220 average and 130k’s without hitting 45 homers does not portend to be “not great”.
Posers are running amok on this thread.
He was not lol
Back to KC maybe? Renfoe just went down. Their OF is a little thin anyway…
He’s excellent defensively, but I am thankful the Twins didn’t re-sign him. His offensive numbers this year have been quite poor.
I agree about his defense but I also remember his offense was good. Maybe not great, but I wished the Twinks would have kept him
6 months too late!!!!
Us mariners would take him as a replacement for victor, and victor was also a replacement
We have hitters that hit worse than .196 so he’d fit right in
I thought Victor was doing OK for you guys.
He’s hurt and slumping
He looks to be turning back into a pumpkin
Can’t see why they wouldn’t keep him as a defensive replacement and someone who can start against lefties. He’s a much better hitter against lefties. Are they just trying to save money here?
Yorke and cook should be playing everyday once called up from AAA and bae can be the 4th of defensive guy
I vividly remember a few years ago people on this very site bragging about what a good hitter Bae was
operative word: was
Bae is the only hitter in the lineup that can’t hit a fastball. He struggles with speed. Cruz Reynolds and Bart feast on them but can’t hit off speed stuff.
Yorke and Cook????
Bae is a lefty. Taylor is a righty.
Bae can’t hit much better than Taylor
Yeah Yorke in AAA could probably take over for Joe he is playing all 3 of spots 1st and 2nd. Cook can play all 3 of spots. Probably call up Nicky G and Davis September 1
I think Yorke will settle in at 2B (his strongest position) if they move Cruz off SS. Cook could be the guy to man CF. But they will call up Jack again for remainder of the season. The season is toasted and they are going for a top 15 draft pick next year.
Jack is hitting under 200 not deserving of a call up. Could see Ifk play cf
It’s becoming clearer by the day that they prefer to ride out Cruz at SS until the bitter end. You’d think they’d have learned the same lessons with Polanco in RF a few years ago but it’s headed in the same direction
As is, Cruz would make a fine DH
Don’t know enough about Yorke, but they are gonna have one helluva jam at 2nd with him, Gonzales and Termarr pushing.
have you checked out how Suwinski is doing at Indy since his demotion there?
Worse than he was here in Pittsburgh
Termarr was promoted to Altooma today
Termarr is 2 years out. Cruz is definitely getting an extension and going to be the ss next 2 years minimum. I think ifk will help him. York can kick joe off the team and be a super sub. They will be trading pitching for hitters guys like Harrington Oviedo maybe Ashcraft have no spot with Skenes Keller Jones ortiz and bubba
And you’ve hit upon the problem, big daddy
They have this love of stockpiling pitchers and middle infielders and have a difficult time making decisions on players
Remember the revolving door at middle infield last season? Everyone and their grandmother was on the shuttle from Indy at some point. That lasted well into this season
Finally, Nick refined his own swing and won the job at 2nd.
And moving forward, I suspect this is what they will do with pitchers. They’re about the only trade chips the franchise has but they’ll stumble around and option guys again
Agree about Cruz. I have to believe most front offices would have moved his position by now. Here, they don’t want to hurt his feelings
Harrington won’t be going anywhere but Oviedo and Ashcraft May very well be.
They need to get good starting players for each of them though.
Augment with minor leaguers.
DH cruz? One of the most athletic players in the league??? Log off dude lol
Do you watch Pirates games or is being a jagoff your thing? Why not just light some dog poop on fire, leave it on one of our porches, ring the doorbell and run away
Maybe you’re lost. The LL World Series message board is on the right
And draft college bats early and often next year and trust your scouts when you trade Keller next off season at 30
Huh? You’re the casual who said to DH one of the most athletics players in the entire league…. Quite possibly one of the single worst takes I’ve seen on this site and that’s saying a lot
Travis won’t-Have you ever seen Cruz play shortstop?
Top 15 is a lock. Should get top 10. I think they are going for top 7. I wish they could get to 5th or 6th but it’s go to take some serious tanking. We got the right management team in place though. It all comes down to the players.
I wish I could use an emoji for this but about the management team, this will have to do:
Eye roll
Yeah, Pittsburgh is the place young position player prospects come to stagnate
To Travis, anyone he views as beneath him, is a casual fan
Offering him an extension doesn’t mean he would accept one.
Their difficulty on selecting players has much to do with poor player development in the minors
Cruz’s strong arm is often errant. I’ve been saying for the last two years he’ll end up at first and will probably thrive there with his IF experience and huge wing span.
yes, he was better against lefties but still found a way to strikeout 96 times in 99 games and drive in a pathetic 20 runs
This is a team that has been starving for offense, he certainly didn’t help much in that department
He was the overpaid version of Jack Suwinski
Strike out or bust
“Better against lefties”…Unless I’m interpreting the baseball reference data wrong, Michael A. Taylor hit .198 vs LH and .193 vs RH so the difference is marginal.
His OPS is almost 100 points higher against lefties in 2024 and career it’s 80 something points higher.
that OPS didn’t do much to help the team so what does it matter?
This is like the Giants and Duval. Sure Taylor hasn’t lived up to his contract or expectations. But he isn’t worthless he’s still a decent bench option. He plays great defense it’s why he has a positive WAR with such a low OPS.
And you’re right. Ideally, that’s all he was. A late inning defensive replacement or occasional starter. But this is the Pirates, where the rebuild apparently didn’t include the outfield
I am pretty sure they are just trying to save 700k or whatever the remainder of his salary is. It’s just a weird move.
Taylor sucks at offensive production and this team is in dire straits for runs
jeez you’re like a broken record
Lol batting average…. Join us in 2024 maybe??
the rebuild didn’t include a first baseman either
And why would it include a 1b? The lowest position there is next to having to dh only. Just this article alone people have put Cruz Davis Bart and even Reynolds there. Oh wait Endy makes 5! Sounds like the problem at 1b is too many of them! Only need 1 and they got 5!
they are trying to win games and rank near the bottom of the league in runs scored
Taylor offers nothing to the offense
NOTHING
He’s a great defensive player. You should use WAR to judge baseball players not just look at offensive numbers.
You’re missing the point. He’s a luxury then that the worst hitting team in MLB can’t really afford. It’s like having two closers on a team that only wins every other day. Why?
You can win games with good defense just like you can win games with good offense. Heck Oliveras and Sanchez can’t hit or field.
I get your point. I believe in defense
But again, take a look at the lineups Shelton put out there this weekend. Look at the batting averages. Imagine these lineups playing SD, LA or AZ. It’s hard to win when you can’t score runs
That 10-game losing streak wasn’t a misnomer
The Pirates certainly need outfield help. I was thinking they could have got Chisholm at the deadline for Davis(Marlins need a catcher) but it didn’t happen.
Umm their season is over?? Why would they not see if someone else claims him? Why are there so many casuals on this site????
Or they are doing him a favor and giving him a chance latch on with a playoff team if one decides he would be an improvement at 5th OF.
I hope they were doing favors. Means Chapman Rowdy Grandpal will be gone soon.
This is probably just he isn’t anything much better than what they have and want to save $.
Finally the MORON closed with Chapman
So right an idiot would have made that move when Bender had issues.
Manger should be next slot replaced with hitting coach to follow
The Great One-Why not make a 2 for 1 deal right away and send them both packing at the same time.
GM BC needs to get rid of the hitting coach ASAP to see what the players are really capable of come September,
Shelton needs to be ‘let go’ in the off season.
Haines should have been canned at least at the start of last year.
You won’t see a difference now in the last month.
They should have at the very least fired both after the ten game losing streak which would have given them an excuse.
The question that I have is whether Haines is just following the direction of Cherington like Shelton probably is.
In that case Nutting could make it a trifecta if he is smart enough to do it.
I’d keep BC, but fire the other two and give Donny Kelly the manager’s job.
New- The Pirates only need one closer so this will not last.
Technically chapmen didn’t close he pitched the top of the 9th down a run
Good point
And Michael A. Taylor is a scrub…just hanging on for a paycheck…and black pinky it wasnt a salary dump…most of his salary is paid…so your comment is just as obsolete as you are
Name 5 outfielders on the Pirates roster better than Taylor. Go ahead I will hang up and listen.
After he does, name 5 teams a Pirates outfielder other than Reynolds could currently play for
I get your point. Dropping Taylor is just a butterfly bandage on a deep knife wound where the lineup is concerned. It’s great fun to see a daily batting order where two guys are hitting above .260 and the rest hovering around the Mendoza line
But hey, the rebuild is over. It’s just leaking oil in three places
Take it one step forward our 2 best hitters cruz and Reynolds wouldn’t even crack the lineup in Arizona Padres Dodgers healthy Atlanta.
Also wonder if Reynolds moves to 1st DH with Bart next season
I was one of the most famous hitters in baseball history.
Well, in Mexico anyway. You’re in their Mexican Baseball Hall of Fame
My name is consistently used on this site at least.
I did not say that 215 would rank as the best.
I can name 5 better posters than pinky who make sense…
you’re a broken record that never stops
Black pink you are such a casual lol
Just because the Mendoza Line was established in PGH does not mean we need to continue to play guys who cannot got over it.
No, the Mendoza Line was established while Mario played for the Mariners, by Bruce Bochte and Tom Paciorek.
Thank you Jimmy Wynn
Anecdotally, the odd thing with MAT is he always seemed to hit in the post-season, when he was with the Nationals. Go figure.
But but, his glove. Doh!
Don’t stop here. Chapman makes much more $. Rowdy Grandpal make some. Every little bit helps. $ not spent this year can be rolled into next. They’ll probably change the rule in future so do it while you can.
After not trading Chapmen at the deadline they can’t dump him. Just take his 10 Tellez 3 Perez 8 and Taylor 4 and get a real bat with that 25 million
Sure they can. Angels did it last year. At deadline they were contenders. Now they are not. Time to make Nutting more $ I mean invest it back into the team.
“I know for a fact that Nutting reinvests every nickel he makes back into the team.”— Buctober, August 2024
I still laugh uncontrollably when I remember this whopper
25 million isn’t buying you a real bat. 225 325 425 is what you need for a real bat. Even a older guy will want player options. Pirates can afford 25m but only for a year. Arbitration is coming. If anything they will extend their own players like Skenes or Cruz.
25 can buy some fun. Go for Christian Walker or Santander plus maybe Eugenio Suarez for maybe around that amount? They fit holes both in the line-up and in the field. Just thinking, Dream. There’s other options obvi!
I think when the extend Skenes the will just move Keller in 27 when he is 31
Pirates can’t afford any impact bats via free agency. They will try to hit on guys other teams don’t want as usual and hope to get lucky. Could trade for it. Max payroll is 120m. With Bob Nutting it’s closer to 100m. Arbitration and 3 extensions will eat up most of that. They would rather try to extend their own vs outbidding every other team in baseball on 30 something’s. They could afford 25m for 1 year. Anyone worth 25m will want multiple years. Eugenio Suarez alone could be a option but they got bad back Hayes at 3b. Pirates way is to hope he gets healthy.
I think Hayes is done as anything more than a bench player, Dream. The back issue isn’t going away as he ages and he’ll end up as an oft injured utility player who can only hit lefties.
Try him across the infield in spring training with a view to Cruz then Brannigan playing 3rd in 2025. At this point Triolo is probably as valuable because he’s already made the jump to SS/2nd/1st with a similar piss poor bat.
All could change of course if they fire Haines and try a new hitting instructor.
That people are attributing Hayes’s hitting problems to a bad back is ridiculous. He’s a glove. Nothing more and never was. Someone said his glove makes his salary worthwhile. What a joke. It’s funny that fans look at Alika Williams as being a fringe player. Hayes *is* the same type of player
I don’t believe the Cherington regime will ever move Cruz from shortstop no matter how poorly he plays there. It’s incredible that they are so worried about his feelings. He needs someone to teach him how to play baseball first and foremost
He’s not even a glove while on the IL with a bad back.
That’s my point.
Hayes back seems to be a problem. I don’t have much confidence in him. But they paid him so don’t see them giving up on him. If it becomes painfully obvious to them they will find a “internal” replacement. Would be surprised to see them sign a significant free agent to play 3b.
They have an internal replacement IKF or Trilo
He used to hit the ball hard. When called up he hit line drives and drove the ball the other way. Then we got our Haines on him. Then Nun got him hitting line drives again and going the other way. Then they fired him. Well first they made it so Hayes had to sneak behind their back to get outside help from a inside same organization guy then they fired him. Point is there have been multiple months sample sizes of Hayes hitting and not just average or above average but downright good. Now that hope of it happening again and for longer stretches with new coaching is gone. #NoJelly #HayesToast
When your best hitting can be encapsulated into a half season or a few good spurts, you can be called a fringe hitter
That’s the simple truth
I can remember when he was signed, someone saying they’d followed his career and the kid was not a power or rbi guy but rather, a lifetime .250 hitter. And that’s what he’s shown
Look, it’s not rocket science. This franchise has been downright desperate to have poster boys that will be the face of the franchise. And every time, it’s blown up in their face
Polanco was signed to a 5 year contract. And faded
They’ve trumpeted this kid. Suwinski. Bednar. Cruz.
It’s almost comical
Triolo is another good glove less than mediocre hitter
“They have an internal replacement IKF or Trilo” They absolutely do. But I think majority of fans want like a real MLB 3b, like ones that hit 30 hrs as it’s traditionally a power position. Not a pirates 3b all glove no power.
Bill Madlock on line 1. Bobby Bonilla on line 2
They don’t have to be 30 homer guys but Pirates fans *have* seen some 3rd baseman here with some ability at the plate
Suarez is not an option.Too up and down.
Otherwise A+ post.
Bobby Bonilla was a 30 hr guy or close enough.
3b doesn’t have to be a power position but they need to get power from somewhere. Can’t have multiple nothings. 3b 1b rf are obvious ideal power spots and absolutely nothing.
Agreed.
But how?
Really
Unless I’m wrong, Bobby Bo had one season here over 30 homers. But he, Bonds and VanSlyke in the same lineup? Even Jay Bell hit 16 homers one year. One of my favorite brief eras in Pirates baseball history
Triolo’s value is that he is a fine defensive player at all infield positions.
He is fundamentally sound unlike a shortstop that we know.
I think that if he could just hit 240 with 8 home runs a year he would be a fairly good ML utility man.
He even made a great catch in RF several weeks back.
I’m sorry there’s just no world where Skenes is signing an extension with Pittsburgh.
Cherish him while you have him.
Why not? Is Skenes a idiot? Risk taker? Doésnt care about $? Most players jump at a good extension unless their name is Juan.
Big daddy- They won’t dump Chapman but a wealthy team may take the remaining $2+M off their hands.If none do they can still keep him.
Dream- I doubt that anyone will pay for Grandal or Rowdy.
The Pirates would save $115,000 for each if they were picked up after being released.
I think your maths off as they don’t make the same amount. No idea what other teams would do. They are ran by people with low intelligence. They passed on much better players than these 2 but both these guys could help and should be on a contender.
Math is perfect.
They would both be paid a pro rated portion of the $573,000 minimum salary for the rest of the year.
What I am saying is that no one would pay the pro rated portion of their salaries.The Pirates would have to pick up the difference.
Your boy Grandpa has really picked it up though and can serve as a teacher to Davis if they really think that Davis is a catcher.
I think Taylor could be a good pick up for a team when the rosters expand so a late inning defensive replacement and a base runner
Ben- He I’ll be picked up by someone if the Pirates release him but they are trying to eliminate the remaining contractual obligation now that Bae has shown that he is a better CF than before he went down to AAA.
1oo games
Andy Haines is the new Matt Canada.
Fire Haines. We’ve had enough, Ben.
Fire Shelton. Fire Ben. Fire Travis. Bob fire yourself if you don’t fire these guys.
They may fire Haines to take the fall but they love him. Share his philosophy. Probably hire someone with same philosophy again just hopefully a better teacher. They all need to go. They saw the may june slump last year. Heard the players quotes but brought Haines back anyways. They all need to take the fall.
In reality, it starts with Nutting
Most of it is on him
He’s a finances hall of famer and he knows that in professional sports, money changes everything. But he’s astute enough to know spending money in a small market means money he will never recoup.
But you said it yourself, Dream
Good GMs, player development folks, scouts don’t grow on trees. And with a tightwad owner, hiring the best is a no go, too
Shame. Market is dying for a winner. Beautiful ballpark and fireworks nights will have to suffice
Actually,I think that it is more that the best GM’s do not grow on trees and Dream is right,maybe they cannot get anyone better than Cherington.
I think that Nutting would overpay for the best GM but the ones with a good reputation do not want to put in a career with a small market team.
They also tend to stay in one place for a very long time.
At a certain point,and I have said this for a couple of years,change for the sake of change can be the only alternative.
What you see is what you get with this group.
But again, it comes down to the owner, doesn’t it?
Baseball execs are as smart as players and their agents. Do they really want to come to the Pirates with what are obvious financial restraints?
My problems with Cherington come down to his poor scouting and player development departments, but isn’t even that gripe a reflection of Nutting and his operating procedures?
It’s hard to get a complete view of Cherington’s body of work without knowing the restraints he is under. Hard to tell if he’d be that much better if he had more payroll abilities
You must have a problem with Cherington personally or misinformed. His scouting is as good as anyone’s. Not that he should be celebrated for it. With all the video and data available today scouting has never been easier.
Going Up
Seven MLB organizations have added to their scouting departments or maintained since 2019.
Pirates +17
Blue Jays +5
Astros +4
Twins +3
Rangers +3
Red Sox +0
Mets +0
Going Down
And there are seven MLB organizations that have cut 10 or more scouts since 2019. Numbers include directors and assistant directors of scouting departments, special assignment scouts and assistants, pro, amateur and international departments and are based on media guides.
Mariners –23
Angels –23
Cubs –20
Giants –13
Dodgers –13
Rays –10
Brewers –10
Pirates are only team in baseball that significantly added to scouting. Not that it matters. Exclude the Angels and the teams drastically cutting scouts have some of the best farm systems in baseball and are considered some of the best teams at scouting. Certainly don’t have the 27th ranked farm system. Scoutings been just fine. Don’t take my word for it just ask the Astros Rays Yankees. They all very much enjoyed players Pittsburgh scouted and aquired. Cherington significantly added to a already good scouting department.
So the failure to produce even one impact player here under this GM rests solely on player development. Seems like a stretch
Yes. Producing talent is what development is.
You seen or heard about the top 100 prospects. So they had incredible talent at some point right? That’s it for scouting. There job is done. Go watch Connor Griffin. Kid’s incredible. If he fails it’s not on scouting. They are finished with him and onto the 2025 2026 2027 draft classes.
And you love yourself so much ..for a guy who claims he’s a dream GM..maybe more you are just a nightmare in your own mind.
With that low of a Batting Average, the Rays are sure to sign him!
Considering that the Pirates will not be getting a free agent CF this coming offseason (Bellinger + a bunch of nothing on the market), it makes perfect sense to clear playing time for internal options – as poor as those seem to be.
It would seem possible that this move was done because they’ll need the roster spot for either Billy Cook or Nick Yorke (or both). Both have spent time in CF in Indy, at least Yorke will require a 40-man spot in the offseason – I’m not certain on Cook – but Cook also has time at 1B, which makes me lean toward seeing him first.
Taylor wasn’t going to change his stripes no matter who was coaching him, he’s always been a low-contact, can’t-see-spin strikeout guy, his “good” seasons were marked with high BABIP numbers. Not really defending Haines, in Taylor’s case the skills have never really been there.
Better to stop wasting ABs and money on him at this point, he’s not part of the future.
2017 NLDS hero.
Thanks for the memories MAT.
I have a .572 mute average for this article. 87 mutes so far. HOF baby!
So you think it’s clever to ignore differing opinions?
America is so totally effed up, you can’t even grasp the general premise of democracy.
Shame on you, Human Being.
88
What a loser
He’s a human bean
IF Suwinski would have hit better & not have a huge regression from 2023 – MAT could have been acceptable as a late inning defensive replacement
Twins should bring him back and dump Margot.
An argument can be made that the pirates should make 5 to 6 roster changes today. Williams, Bae, and possibly Triolo need to be sent to AAA and Gonzalez and Yorke need to be on the major league roster. Yorke can DH since Bart is hurt. Why wasn’t Gonzalez on the roster this past weekend? On the pitching side why was a 33 year old career minor leaguer brought up instead of Mologinski and Holderman?
Happy to see this move, Taylor has been painful to watch at the plate this year. The Bucs routinely start 3 or 4 guys hitting right around .200.. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. I know it is against their grain to eat a contract – but this is a step forward.. Give the ABs to someone that can develop instead of forcing the fans to watch this mess. Grandal should be next .
Yasmani Grandal has a batting average of .279 with 17 hits, 5 home runs, 8 RBIs and 9 runs since July 5th.
They should never have signed him in the first place. Guy might be a gold glove in the outfield, but he’s a rubber bat hitter. Defense and pitching always beats good hitting, as the old saying goes. But these buccos have so many holes in their bats. Need runs to win. Like the man3 says Haines is the main culprit for the pirates hitting woes. He tries to change the hitters when they are going good. But his philosophy is that of a little league dad trying to teach his son the hitters manual.
I truly believe that if they fire the MORON and his failing coaching staff, you will see a difference next year with new blood.
Haines is the main culprit? I’d say it’s the 2nd lowest payroll in baseball. Nutting has and is the problem. Shelton could fire Haines, Cherington could fire Shelton and Haines, Williams could….. All starts at the top. Haines isn’t the problem at all. Guy’s just collecting a pay check probably doing the best he can. Just like he did in Milwaukee before they fired him.
Haines is a MORON like the other MORON. And the best he does is ruin a hitter with his philosophy of knowing nothing about hitting.
I guess the St. Louis Cardinals will sign him. He fits their portfolio old and can’t hit.
Taylor’s swing is ridiculously too long for the frame of his body. Can only really hit fastballs on the outer half of the plate and he always tries to pull them. He’s strong for his size but it seems like he’s thinking home run every at bat and he really shouldn’t.