The Pirates placed right-hander Jared Jones on the 15-day injured list on Thursday, and manager Derek Shelton gave the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette’s Andrew Destin and other reporters some details on the lat strain that has put the star rookie on the shelf for the foreseeable future. Jones suffered a Grade 2 strain and isn’t likely to throw for the next two weeks, so the team can allow him to rest and recover before checking on his progress. If all goes well and Jones is able to restart a throwing program at that time, Jones could be on track to return perhaps by early August, based on past timelines for other pitchers who have suffered similar injuries.
It wouldn’t be surprising to see Jones get a bit more recovery time, both as a precautionary measure given his importance to the Pirates’ future, and because the team was already taking steps to manage the workloads of both Jones and Paul Skenes in their mutual. Only two of Jones’ 16 starts have come on the standard four days of rest, as the Bucs have used a six-man rotation for the majority of the season. Jones threw a career-high 126 1/3 innings combined between Double-A and Triple-A ball in 2023, and he is up to 91 innings in the big leagues this year.
Jones’ last start on July 3 came after an 11-day break, as he had a turn in the rotation skipped in order to help keep him fresh. Shelton didn’t think the layoff played a role in Jones’ injury, as the Pirates still had Jones take part in a live bullpen session (“We did ramp his intensity up, we still did make sure he threw“) during his 11 days between starts, and instead chalked the lat strain up the vagaries of baseball.
While it’s good news that Jones’ injury isn’t overly serious, missing him for even a month is a hit to Pittsburgh’s postseason hopes. The Pirates are 42-45 entering today’s play but are still four games out of a wild card spot, so there is time for the team to still mount a run — or, if things go south before July 30, to explore selling at the trade deadline.
David Bednar’s status is a key factor in how the Pirates’ July might play out, and the closer made progress in his injury recovery with a live batting practice session today. As per MLB.com’s Alex Stumpf (X link), Bednar faced five batters over the course of 21 pitches, with Bednar using his entire arsenal. A left oblique strain sent Bednar to the 15-day IL on June 20, and while he has already missed beyond the 15-day minimum, today’s throwing session is a good sign that he might not be too far away from a minor league rehab assignment or even a straight-ahead activation. The closer has 16 saves and a somewhat deceptive 5.17 ERA over 31 1/3 innings this season, as Bednar has been lights-out following a rough April.
Speaking of bullpen injuries, Pittsburgh called right-hander Ryder Ryan up from Triple-A today after righty Daulton Jefferies was placed on the 15-day IL. Jefferies is dealing with discomfort in his right elbow, and the injury comes just under two months after the Pirates claimed Jefferies off waivers from the Giants.
Jefferies has a 9.82 ERA split between 10 innings for Pittsburgh (6.30 ERA) and 4 2/3 frames with San Francisco (17.36 ERA), and both clubs have optioned him back and forth from Triple-A on multiple occasions. This marked Jefferies’ return to big league action after missing all of 2023 recovering from both a thoracic outlet syndrome surgery and then a Tommy John surgery within a six-month span in 2022. Considering that Jefferies also had another TJ procedure earlier in his career, it isn’t a good sign that he is experiencing another bout of elbow soreness.
Skenes is just so darn good. He’s really the best young pitcher I have seen since Strasburg no doubt. This is not the Pirates year but I hope starting next year they sign some guys to fill out the rest of their team.
This is absolutely the Bucs year. Bob Nutting isn’t going on a huge spending spree. The same team will back next year. Bottom tier signings like Taylor Tellez Perez Gonzales will be replaced with new bottom tier signings kike these ones replaced Hill Santana Choi Velasquez.
What will change next year is that the rest of the NL should be much better. And the Pirates pitching health. No major season long injuries and until Jones know the 4 best starters have been healthy. Odds of that happening next year? Yes 2024 is the year. If not 2024 when? This is as good as it gets until the next gm and next rebuild. When you have an opportunity to make playoffs you should seize it. They should have opportunities the rest of the decade but they have it right now! Hopefully the Nats sell. Grab Winker and a CF, maybe a reliever and go for it.
you should have included Connor Joe of bottom tier players. Despite your assertion that he isn’t in a slump, he’s 0 for 3 today with a strike out,
Reynolds on the other hand has 2 hits and Cruz a 2 run homer
He wasn’t in a slump at the time I said it so shows what you know.
But 0 for 3 you say, yep he is in a slump again.
someone forgot to tell the Pirates that their slump was over
6 hits in 8 innings, yes it’s back to normal
I realize he wasn’t in a slump before this game but he contributed nothing to this game offensively
nothing
Lots of guys are in a slump. Jarren Duran 103 hits this year but 0 for 5 today. Pirates should claim him when he is dfa.
Yankees had 14 hits today but none by Soto yikes 0 for 5. Awful slump. As you would say he contributed nothing to this game offensively nothing. You think he would in his free agent year. Might have to settle for qualifying offer. That’s if NY even offers him one. Nutting might be able to sign him to a cheap 1 year bounce back deal. I am saying it right now. Juan Soto should be the Pirates #1 free agent target.
That’s just 1 game. So depressing seeing all these slumps I ain’t looking at anymore games.
yeah, lots of players are in a slump, certain Pirates make being in one an ongoing problem
Hayes can be included as can Triolo and if Hayes’ problem is back related, he should be on the IL, not in the lineup every game
Comparing Soto not getting a hit in today’s game against the collection of hapless players on the Pirates is a joke
There’s not one or even three players on this team who has contributed at least as much as Soto has this entire season
“Comparing Soto not getting a hit in today’s game against the collection of hapless players on the Pirates is a joke” I agree
yeah, it’s their year alright. Near the bottom of league in average and runs scored with no end to their pathetic offensive performance in sight
Yes the bats broke out in last night’s game but they need to be consistent if they want to make the playoffs and so far, about the only thing they are consistent at is striking out
Add another 9 to their season totals after today’s game
The Pirates are 4 games under 500 and their 2 best players are on an innings limit. This isn’t the year bud.
plus they only have at best 3 players who hit with any consistency
There’s too many players in recurring slumps, ( despite what Dream says )
That’s why the Pirates are the joke of the sport. Their fans just accept losing. Nutting can put out a 50 million payroll and a bunch of van meters and you guys keep going to the games and paying your cable bill. Not just a one year thing or 2 years. He can do it 5 10 15 doesn’t matter and you just say here Bob take my $. Skenes innings are fine. He had them limited in Spring training and minor leagues. LSU rode him like a rented mule. The difference between 150 and 170 innings isn’t making a difference. I would think fans would be sick of making excuses for this organization. Pitch Skenes 5 innings instead of 7 then. Innings aren’t the problem. It’s workload. Shows how stupid and dated the Pirates front office is. Just gobble up their stupidity though and give them a excuse to kick the can down the road. Jones innings are fine. They are being limited right now. Nuttings interns are reading comments just like these. They are still watching mr Nutting. We sold them on the limiting innings bs. We got them brainwashed into the benefits of hoarding all our junk overrated prospects. Nutting right now is laughing all the way to the bank at you clowns.
And it was never going to be
You’d like to think the baseball geniuses in the front office know this. I mean, there’s no reason to push for a playoff spot when 100 games in, it’s clear they can’t hit
Their moves with pitchers tell me they like to throw things at the wall and see what happens
Here’s hoping they’re careful with Skenes and Jones. That Burrows and Oviedo come back strong. That Bubba, Ashcraft, Harrington et al show some real maturation to contend for spots
But if they’re going to bring in guys like Tellez, Grandahl, Taylor and Olivares—as I think they will either now, at deadline time or in free agency, what does it matter?
Friday’s game was a sellout, Saturday’s game drew over 36,000 fans
70,000 plus people in the stands means only one thing to Nutting
$$$$
Yes they are a joke of this sport and the young gullible fools, excuse me, fans buy into the hype that upper management sells
Tickets to home games aren’t cheap by any means. They range from $ 39 to $179 depending upon the location
A family of 4 sitting in the cheapest seats plus the cost of refreshments and parking costs easily surpass $200 if not more
That’s why Nutting loves sold out games
It’s money in his pocket
One more thing, I admit that I do my share of complaining about this organization
If they showed any semblance of a competitive baseball team, I would happily praise them instead but that’s not likely to happen this year or anytime under the current regime
Someone said that we need to be patient
I have been losing mine for almost 20 years. How long are we supposed to wait?
There is a process with a rebuild. Typically there is the year where the bad team for years gets to 500. Then the next year they are a contender but loses because they don’t have experience. Then after that they are a legit WS contender. Hopefully for Pirates fans this is the get to 500 and be respectable year. I think that’s realistic and an important step in becoming a good team.
You nailed it early on. They have what will be among the best starting rotations in the game, health permitting. They have pieces that will flourish with a couple big guns around them. This is where the rebuild failed. Guys they figured would make impacts never materialized.
But unlike the Brewers, who’ll pull the trigger on augmenting their kids with good players or pitchers, this franchise will look for bottom tier guys and click their heels together three times in hopes they’ll come alive
It never works that way
Dream is right. The rebuild is over. Other than Termarr—another guy who may or may not put it all together—the cupboard is bare
They’ll keep pumping the “compete” angle with the wild card berth in mind. And true believers will say that in a short series, Pirates starters might make the difference. Problem is, in the era of 5-6 inning starts, that’s a fallacy when you can’t score runs
they don’t have enough offensive pieces to be WS champions or serious contenders
Good pitching isn’t enough
Ben Cherington said that the rebuild was over after last year and other than really good pitching, the offense hasn’t improved
Hayes and Suwinski, both starters, have regressed this year and they were both being counted on to help take this team to the next level
I think if they add a 1b and an outfielder in the offseason they could be much improved on offense.
“There is a process with a rebuild. Typically there is the year where the bad team for years gets to 500. Then the next year they are a contender but loses because they don’t have experience. Then after that they are a legit WS contender. Hopefully for Pirates fans this is the get to 500 and be respectable year. I think that’s realistic and an important step in becoming a good team.”
Holy heck. Ben Cherington himself has graced us with his presence. If he doesn’t buy at the trade deadline this right here is what he is going to say!!!!! Just keep kicking the can Ben. Not all fans are ok with it but the majority are. Looks like another 2 million attendance year. I was obviously being really sarcastic about signing Soto. I know as well as you and Bob that fireworks and bobble heads are much cheaper. Tell Mr Nutting he is a amazing business man. I never seen such a brainwashed fan base. Thanks for reading my comments Mr Cherington.
“they don’t have enough offensive pieces to be WS champions or serious contenders
Good pitching isn’t enough”
You got em right where you want them Mr Nutting. When you kick the can and sell them on 2025 they aren’t even going to question you about the dozen other teams who don’t have enough offense trading for it before the deadline. They just wanna know what day in 2025 is the free Hawaiian shirt day?
Lol
You would think being a Pirates fan you would have learned how to be patient.
I’m ok with a .500 team that plays its heart out game in and game out. In that regard, they’d win games they likely shouldn’t have
This one doesn’t and it’s within my gripe with management. They’d rather coddle than kick some tails. So be it
.500 is what I’m resigned to. I don’t know if that’s patience, per se, just the reality. You’re right. A corner outfielder and 1st baseman —not lower tier guys, mind you—would solve a lot of problems. And they’d take some heat off guys like Reynolds and Cutch. Even Cruz, who they refuse to push where overall on field persona is concerned
But we all doubt they’ll open the wallet.
You’re not going to find the players needed now when only five teams are out of the race
The off season free agency period is where a good GM, with the backing of ownership, would make some noise
As is, I’ll enjoy watching Skenes, Jones, Reynolds now, as they likely won’t finish their careers here
Shame. We can carp “small market” all we like but it comes down to priorities. Here, it’s about profits and nothing more
Like I say Nutting is incredible. In a world where everyone wants it now and on demand Nutting somehow made his customers patient.
Tired are you now seeing why I said Nutting is such a good businessman?
I am patient. But I don’t need to be. I don’t have a cable bill. I don’t buy tickets. Here’s how patient I am, I don’t even watch the games. I am waiting for them to put a product out on the field that deserves my attention. They can kick the can til 2030 2040 I don’t care one bit. If they ever stop kicking the can I will pay closer attention. I love a good entertaining baseball team. Fun to watch Skenes Jones Keller but the 3 or 4 hits 1 or 2 runs ruins much of the experience for me.
Agreed about Nutting. I really doubt that he knows much about baseball. Or even cares
Why should he when his interests lie in dollar figures
This town is hungry for a winner and Nutting provides it in increments. It’s all he needs to do
Throw in some fireworks nights. Cheap T-shirt giveaways and the highlight of it all, pierogi races, and enjoy a night at the nicest ballpark in the MLB.
“As is, I’ll enjoy watching Skenes, Jones, Reynolds now, as they likely won’t finish their careers here” Awesome. Lots of fans feel the same way. The majority of the fan base I would say. Don’t need to spend hundreds of millions. Go and see that beautiful park. It is gorgeous. Not a bat seat in the house. Bring out the whole family. They can play in Pirate ship, watch the perogies race, get their picture taken with the Parrot. Don’t just bring them once though. They gotta see the fireworks! But the same night they have fireworks they can’t run the bases so have to come to a Sunday day game for that. For all the collectors you gotta come to every bobble head day. It’s a good fun affordable experience. And for the very very extremely small percentage of fans who actually want to see winning we have the Pirates hall of fame! Relive all your favorite memories from when the Pirates were good. Unfortunately that doesn’t leave many people who will actually remember those times because they either have dementia or weren’t born yet but don’t let that ruin your good times. Go see all those legendary players of pirates past!
They added both this past offseason, Tellez at first and Olivares in the outfield
adding lower tier players isn’t going to take this team to the promised land
We long time Pirate fans have been patient since Kevin McClatchey said that if a new stadium was built, they would be competitive in 5 years
That was 17 years ago
Out patience is running out
They need to add good players next year. Christian Walker would make sense.
Agreed but given what Walker has been doing lately, it’s hard to imagine a tightwad owner going that route
I hope so too but Nutting doesn’t want to pay for free agents
which is odd considering that he gave Chapman $10 million for a one year deal
That was a surprise and out of character for him.
No need to pay the remainder of his 10.5m Pirate fans have already accepted defeat and looking forward to the off-season. Trade Chapman now and make a bigger profit Mr Nutting.
I am looking forward to the off-season as well. Pirates fans will throw out names like Hoskins lol and wait for it Bellinger lmao rofl hahaha omg Montgomery Gray lol LMAO. And I have to be friends, I say friends, please friends hear me out, I hate to have to tell you the heartbreaking news but you aren’t getting those guys. You are getting Rowdy and Perez. I know I know. I told you all this before instead of getting multiple years bigger free agent you would be getting 1 year Santanas and Velasquezs. I know I know I tell you the same thing every year. Don’t hate the critical thinker who sees this organization for what it is. Then it happens just like I been telling them it would and they are all depressed. I love these guys. Hurts me to see them so disappointed. I let them vent their frustration on me to cheer them up as they hoot and hollar and laugh in my face about the A+. I end up being the one laughing in July when they trade off those A+ to actually playoff teams while my friends look forward to next years season and we do it all over again. You can set your clock to it. The circle of life.
You’ve finally expounded on your “A+” ratings. It’s not so much “A+” where all of baseball is concerned but rather, where the keystone cops running the Pirates are concerned
Took me two years to understand all of this
I’ve also grown to understand that really, you’re no different than the “grumpy old men” group that takes the owner and GM to task. On this thread, you’re echoing what we’ve all said since he stepped into the forum of love.
Your explanation of Nutting and his embracing the Rays model was Hall of Fame worthy. It still explains what they’ve been doing under Huntington and now, Cherington. But a funny thing happened on the way to the league championship series: a number of their guys just didn’t pan out. And that’s the conundrum they’re in but will never admit to. Mr Potter is their owner but Bedford Falls needs George Bailey. That is, they need a white knight that can save the day
But the cavalry isn’t going to show up here unless someone can convince Nutting, the other-worldly business genius, that filling in those gaps with big contracts makes good sense
And that’s not going to happen. So while the rebuild is over, it’s akin to building a high rise and leaving a couple floors unfinished. To Nutting, why finish when all the other floors are rented and profitable?
Someone said that no GM could get the job done here under the auspices of such an owner. That could be true. Certainly however, some re-thinking of how to scout and better yet, how player development needs to be a top to bottom strategy with all on the same page needs to be undertaken.
Just don’t see many positives in a car that’s continually spinning its wheels
Yes and no. I don’t just give A+ because of my low expectations. I give a honest grade. So here’s the deal. If the Pirates dfa a cole tucker or van meter or anyone of that type that those players stink, pirates aren’t going to improve them, well any warm body making league minimum will get a A+. Why not? They can’t possibly get a better player. But if a better player does become available then guess what? Another A+ because they dumpster dived for a player who is more promising than the previous dumpster dive. Nowadays it’s mostly just to humor you. But you will notice sometimes I just don’t drop the A+ and that’s it disappear for a week until the next article drops. When I expand on that A+ with some commentary you should take it as I seen something and really like this move.
Buy yeah. If I call a 1 year deal for 3 or 5 million a A+ do I mean that player should be as good as Ohtani or Cole? No. I just means that they didn’t over pay. I see what the Pirates see in this player. And I have no problem with this signing. Everyone knows my love for Perez. Unfortunate that he got hurt but when healthy he has been exactly what I hoped and thought he could be. He isn’t supposed to be a ace or even a 2 or 3. He is supposed to be what a 8 million dollar pitcher on a 1 year “bounce back” deal should be. I always said there was nothing to bounce back from because he was just fine last year. I believe Pirates seen the same thing I did and I am not going to elaborate on it any further because I expect them to do the same thing next year. Same with Rowdy.
“doesn’t want to pay for free agents”…You can blame guys like Javier Baez, Kris Bryant and Anthony Rendon for smaller market teams being reluctant to compete for the more expensive free agents.
Also we can’t forget Derek Bell
Well stated. And agreed. But I’m not even talking about the upper tier guys, really. It’s a pipe dream here so why contemplate it?
The next level down is where the shopping should take place. Even there, they would find huge upgrades to what they have now
Instead, they’ll look to the Tellez-types.
It’s profit over serious competitiveness and then screaming “small market” while franchises like Milwaukee and Baltimore flourish. Even KC spent a little and is having a better season
If it occurs to fans that surrounding Reynolds, Cruz, Cutch, Hayes and Endy with a couple bats—real bats—solves a great deal of problems, it occurs to them too. Especially when they’re going to have stud starting pitching
They just don’t want to spend. Period
They probably figure that having stud pitching, the gullible ones will pack the stadium just to watch the strikeouts add up while ignoring the lackluster offense without question
Jones hasn’t pitched 130 innings in a season as a pro and he’s already at 91 this year. They’ll probably try to keep him around 150-160 this year, which seems like that’s what he’ll be on track to pitch if he returns late July or early August. Jones injury might not be as bad as it’s being made out to be anyways. Jones even said he could have went another inning if he absoutley had to in his last outing. That could ovbiously be the adrenaline, but the Pirates have been extra cautions with Jones so far. Guess only time will tell when he returns.
David Bednar returning soon will be huge for the bullpen in the second half of the year. So will getting Ryan Borucki back. Bullen hasn’t been bad recently and some guys like Kyle Nicolas have really stepped it up recently.
I hope they are smart in their usage of Jones and Skenes moving forward. This team as constructed now is going nowhere
I’m an old school, starters should go 7 guy. But I’m not so much a dinosaur to understand that arms break down and careers are ruined via stupidity
I know you can’t predict injuries but the lack of depth options at SP is really a bad look for GMBC. Priester looks like a long reliever. If not for Jones and Skenes this team would be a bottom feeder.
The use of a bullpen game is just abuse and neglect. How you call yourself a GM with the lack of pitching and quality hitting is beyond me.
I don’t see one positive spot out of any of the money GMBC spent this offseason.
If the Pirates were serious about THIS season they would have addressed their incompetent lineup and poor depth of pitching
The reason this team has stayed afloat is their pitching depth. Priester hasn’t been awful. He’s looked like an average #5 starter for the most part this year. But Luis Ortiz has been stretched out and pitched very well when he was used as the bulk guy and a starter. They have Braxton Ashcraft who might get the call if Jones is out for longer than expected. He’s gone great this year and is on the 40-man roster. Bubba Chandler and Thomas Harrington may also make their debuts.
Priester never lasts more than 4 innings before caving to the hitters. He’s better at being a long reliever
So much for yesterday’s offensive performance, they seem to be back to form in this game
“ if the Pirates were serious about this season”
Signing has beens and nobodies in the offseason is their forte
Their player development is well below average and there’s really no one in the minors to promote that could contribute offensively to make this team competitive
They do have a few pitching prospects but they probably won’t see any major league games this year
Ashcraft will 100% see the majors this year. He’s already 24 and is on the 40-man. Chandler and Harrington might get a September call-up
if they keep pitching anything like they have so far for Altoona.
With Falter potentially injured, and depending upon how long he’s unavailable, Ashcroft could see some major league action after the break but no matter how well this team pitches, it’s their offense that is questionable
Other than Reynolds they really don’t have any players that hit with any consistency
Paul- I think that Falter is nearing the maximum number of innings he has pitched in his career also.They may need to keep Perez and maybe start Ortiz like Tired wants them to do.Gonzalez got bombed in his second start in Indianapolis so we will see if he progresses too.
Priester will probably get another shot towards the end of this year after pitching in AAA for a while.
I didn’t get the usage of Ortiz from the start, especially after his finish from last season. Now you have Falter out, Jones out, and a staff of Keller, Skenes and Perez, with two spot starters
We’ve seen what Marco is all about. And mlb can profess his appreciation of Priester until the cows come home but it’s telling that when the convo turns to starters of the future, he’s never mentioned
In the end, their starting staff is going to be very good. But this is looking like another August to October run where the Pirates can best benefit by finally making decisions on which position players should stay and which just can’t in assessing younger players, especially
They already know what they have. Not much to assess. Cherington already has his plans for 40 man and rule 5 and off-season wish list. Not set in pen but unlikely to change. If they don’t buy and try to contend then August September is just going through the motions, hoping to keep guys healthy. Sure playing time is beneficial but remember they use analytics. They already know what the got.
So not much really as far as assessment goes. But development absolutely! Unfortunately Haines is the hitting coach so no development either. And I changed my mind and want Haines back next year. Fans don’t care about the product on the field and a large chunk of fans just watch games because they mostly like to complain. So bring Haines back. Keep Joe as a everyday player. Keep throwing Jack out in CF. Call up Gorski so after he goes 0 for 4 they can complain about that. Give Shelton a few trash relievers so when he has no choice but to use them the fans can call him a Moron or THE MORON. While the rest of the fans can stare up at the sky mindlessly watching the fireworks.
Dream- I would like them to call Gorski up but they know better than us on some things at least.
He is striking out at an almost 40% clip IN AAA.
then he’d fit in with the likes of Taylor and Suwinski, though no one is close to matching Cruz’ 100+ strikeouts
Excellent work above bright eyes about Jones innings. Good thing you can’t get someone for plagiarism in a comment section though as it sounds like what I just read in the article.
“David Bednar returning soon will be huge for the bullpen in the second half of the year.” Excellent insight! Spot on there. Impressive! Credit where due. No one else in here would have came up with that one. Thank you for the education.
Except that you forgot Mitch Keller who is hardly considered a bottom feeder however you are spot on about the incompetence of the General Manager
Pirates pitching depth is among the best in baseball. If you said the best I wouldn’t argue.
Yeah, if you count the farm
Look, they’ll finish with 78 wins or so this year. They’ll have to evaluate who their pitchers are next season
But if they refuse to sign a couple bonafide hitters, they’ll be running in place again
And guys like Winker aren’t what I’m talking about
Open up the checkbook. Surround the pieces with some real talent. Fans of the Pirates deserve that
Winker Joe is a all star. That’s exactly what I am talking about. At least for the next 3 months. Next year they can aim for better as Winker is older and has many weaknesses. But he is perfect right now or someone similar.
He’s not the answer, Dream. Not if we’re speaking about the same goals.
Look, if you’re a “push for the wild card” kind of guy, hey great, sure. He’s markedly better than whomever they are putting in RF these days. But jeez, you’re going to have an A+ pitching staff and some good pieces in place. How Winker makes a huge difference is a mind numbing proposition
We don’t have the same goals. My goal is building a team to make the playoffs. I don’t expect you to think Winker is that guy, if you didn’t see the Joe Jack all star platoon you can’t see Winker either and in a 2 month sample he might not be. If he goes in a slump they just gave away a unlikely to hit lottery ticket. But it’s only a lottery ticket and if he doesn’t slump he is a difference maker. But I said other pieces as well. If you are just going to add a Winker type and nothing else then don’t bother. Trade Chapman Taylor Rowdy Gonzales Perez Borucki AND Bednar.
TJ-Cherington tried to get starters but the ludicrous prices paid negated that plan.
The extra money budgeted was used for Chapman to provide a much needed second closer.
Nutting spent money in the middle of the last decade and NH was smart enough to get some deals.Nutting will never spend money on any high priced free agents,but will pay to extend his own young players.He expects his GM to develop internally.
BC has done a fine job in selecting and developing young pitchers.He has been a failure otherwise.
His biggest failure too has been not recognizing that he needs new coaches and a manager,
It will be interesting to see if and when Nutting gets involved in that because BC is stone cold in seeing the need to make those changes to get them out of their mediocrity.
“Trevor is waiting”..There’s really no incentive for a family business like MLB, that relies on the good will of the general public, to employ someone who’s been accused(but not convicted) of sexually assaulting an unconscious woman. I personally doubt that Trevor Bauer violated the law, but he made his own bed with his incredibly bad lack of good judgment and forfeited his opportunity to play professional Major League baseball.
Waiting, well at least he isn’t desperately begging anymore so it’s an improvement.
I have great news. Primate1225 is ordered and should be arriving by Wednesday. I will finally have the assistant dream gm I have dreamed about.
And here I thought you had dreams about other things
I would say I have dreams of Pirates winning a championship but that’s more of a fantasy than dream. As pink black Cherington put it we should be happy with flirting with 500 then getting a bit better then maybe get a wild card then when Skenes Jones are nearing free agency have 1 year with a legit shot. I dunno about you but that got me all excited. Got the champagne on ice. Hope they are bringing back the dollar dog days to pair with my champagne.
So you agree that the 5-year plan is actually 7 or 8. Yeah, patience is a virtue especially when your best players are nearing free agency.
100 percent wrong viewpoint of me tired. I see the plan as Mr Nutting taking advantage of his sucker fan base. That’s the only plan I see.
You’re going to regret this when I take my services to Miami and make the Marlins a contender
Didn’t see the game today. What happened to Falter? Guy had been talking about being exhausted
I didn’t watch either. 6 hits 8 innings I got more entertaining things to do. Will watch when they trade for a bat or in 2025 when they sign one or 2026… Whenever if ever they stop kicking the can. Cutch will be back at dh again next year. He will sell tickets. That’s good enough. I will watch condensed game tonight. But left posterior arm discomfort according to pirates x.
Dream- Do you think that your new simian will go “ape”
over working for you?
Are you going to teach it everything you know so it can eventually take your place?
Will it’s moniker be Asst Dream GM?
Moniker or Monkier will be Primate1225. Just a totally random username having no relevance to any known person living or deceased.
Primate1225 will be have total access to my account. So if some rare occurrence happens that I am wrong it will likely be Primate1225 who said it.
Primate1225 will be doing a lot of my former tasks. However close longtime friends like you Mendoza I might still associate with once in awhile. But the majority of commenters like Paul and Tom will be handled by Primate1225. And I fully expect Primate1225 to be more than capable of conversing with the likes of them.
Like Mr Selleck I will teach it everything that it knows but not everything that I know. It will know very basic things like how Nutting is trying to be the Rays but also hopefully know more advanced things like how combining two players such as Jack and Joe or Joe and Winker creates All star level performance.
I fully expect Primate1225 to be a chimp off the old block!
Dream-As always,I appreciate your detailed response to my question.
I have always known that you were not just another pretty face.
Perhaps this hire could set a tone for MLB and especially the Pirates,They could stop “monkeying around” by hiring a protege of your hire.
What do they have to lose really.
I will look forward to the banter with Primate in the same manner that I have had with his/ her mentor.
The Pirates’ recent moves seem a bit too coincidental. Jared Jones’ lat strain and extended rest period might be more serious than they’re letting on. David Bednar’s injury recovery feels rushed, especially with the trade deadline approaching. Ryder Ryan’s call-up and Daulton Jefferies’ elbow issues raise questions—did they know about these injuries beforehand? The timing of these events just seems too convenient, don’t you think?
They’ve done some strange things with pitchers this year, for sure. Bednar isn’t the same stud he was and can’t place his spin pitches consistently. They’ve given up on guys like Hernandez and Contreras—and some would argue rightly so—while bringing in guys off the waiver wire who get whacked here
Falter talked about being exhausted two weeks ago. The Jones situation
You wonder who’s at the steering wheel here
Who is steering the wheel, you ask?
An incompetent smooth talking BS artist that holds the title of General Manager and his staff of other incompetent employees that both manage the team and coaches
I listened to Cherington during an interview yesterday and the question was asked if he was considering drafting a first baseman since there’s supposed to be a number of them available in this year’s draft class
He punted on the question and changed the subject quickly
The last two power hitting first baseman this team had was Kevin Young and Jason Thompson that I can remember
Apparently he will be looking for a middle infielder which seems to fit into his “ plans “ for the future
I don’t read much into it. They got a legit excuse to rest Jones and cut down his innings in case, what for it, don’t drink anything while reading this or you will spit it out all over your keyboard, in case they make the playoffs!!!!!! If they kick the can down rhe road they will all the sudden be extremely worried about Jones injury so they can keep him in the minors, shut him down and gain the extra year of team control.
No need to rush Bednar. They could hold him out until after the break, pitch him 3 times to show he is fine and trade him. Whoever misses out on him can have Chapman so Nutting doesn’t have to pay all of his remaining $.
@Tired Replying here so we can close the book on the previous article. I am just as much a movie expert as I am a baseball expert. I got free to watch movie recommendations any time you need entertaining. And I looked at xbox ones for a friend and they are cheaper than I thought. $80 Not only can you play games but it has all the movie and tv apps like Netflix on it. And it plays blu rays dvds. My friend was looking for a blu ray player. Same price so get a new device that just does one or a used device that you can do other stuff besides watch movies. He went with the Xbox. He said he is going to drive big rigs and go fly fishing in Australia no cdl or passport required.
I don’t watch movies much anymore and when I do it’s background noise so if I find one that ends up distracting me I will save it for later when I can pay more attention. I would rather jump on mlbtr. I can do it easily any time anywhere. I hate work. Eventually found a way to make a living doing things I didn’t hate so now I love to work. That’s the key. I am greedy though so glad most people haven’t discovered it despite the saying if you lobe what you do blah blah.
No need to retire as I don’t mind it but say someone was forced to retire or did because they didn’t like what they did there is still time. As long as you are still capable you do something. Or even just have a side hustle or even hobbies that make $. I have tons of ideas and advisement if you ever want them just ask. No reason to ever be bored. Not that you are bored. Just saying if you want to see if you can do something else you should give it a try. I talked so much about gaming that one day one might think I am huge gamer but I am not. Might do it for 2 or 3 hours one night and not touch it again for a week or two. If the Pirates kick the can though don’t be surprised if see a lot less of me until off season. I usually take August September October off. So the few times you do see me enjoy!!!! Lol. Off season I am around a solid amount. Someone has to type A+. Although after Wednesday I will have Primate1225 for that. Go back to limited activity Spring training. Might catch the opening day fever and increase then drop off until now. July is my month. There is enough sample size I can pull out my told you so’s. But the real prize is trades. Don’t care about All star game. Don’t care about stretch run. Don’t care about playoffs or even world series. Like don’t watch much of or any of the world series. I have work and hobbies I’d rather do. This will change when Pirates are playing in it!!!!!! I was more of a Rays fan in the past so that got me into more playoffs than normal. And I enjoyed Cueto dropping the ball as much as the next guy. But there hasn’t been much reason to follow the Pirates after July. I watch some minor league ball so I already seen the September call up prospects before. Love the deadline. Lots of people are excited already but nothing much is going to happen until July 20 something. It’s usually the last 2 or 3 days but could be more early action this year but not until after the draft. Sure might see a big trade or few decent ones. Hope so. But not close to peak.
Edit. Reading my comments is a job! Holy heck I have been long winded.
I’m open to any ideas about side hustles, Dream. I just don’t wish to work for anyone else. That’s usually a deal breaker
Most people have in their house thousands of dollars of merchandise they have no use for. I used to sell mine every few years on ebay. Much worse option now because you used to be able to sell up to 200 items under 20 grand and not get a 1040. 2 or 3 years they past law to change it to $600. That’s not much selling. Everything I sold I lost $ on. I don’t have receipts for a dvd player I bought in college or a video game I bought as a kid. Or those jeans I bought and wore 1 time. Don’t wanna be an accountant. Just wanna get rid of my junk. But craigslist Facebook you can just meet people at mall WalMart starbucks whatever. Or like get rid of furniture they can come to your house and pick it up. Just make sure to have some people around or have the furniture in your garage or driveway so they don’t have to get into your house. Flea market yard sale.
Fantasy sports. It’s entertaining and you watch sports already so might as well put that knowledge to work and make some $.
What hobbies or skills do you have? If you hunt and have access to land you can be a hunting guide to out of towner’s. If you have a boat a fishing guide. Be a pitching coach. Craigslist has a services section so list your experience and a competitive rate. Write a ebook and sell it on Amazon. Anything that you have superior knowledge of compared to most people you can sell. Via book, internet course, seminar, private classes. If you are in Pittsburgh you can be a tour guide. Even specialize in sports to separate yourself from other guides. Show them where 3 rivers was, that lil wall remaining of forbes field, grand finale of going to game at pnc. Be sure to walk across the Clemente bridge. He have a museum maybe? Negro league museum? Sell what you know. If you make your own flys for fishing sell them. Good at math be a tutor. Know how to wield then fix other people’s stuff. Are you handy? Be handy for someone else. Like for real. My handy man makes like $200 a hour. I only use him for harder stuff but people actually pay him to change a lightbulb bulb or install a smoke detector. If you have a truck and combine it with a ladder or lawnmower or pressure washer you can do a lot of stuff. Cut grass, pressure wash siding or patios. Mobile car washer. Just brainstorm. What can you do that 50 percent of other people can’t or won’t do. Sell your skills. Rent your equipment. I want my siding washed every 3 years. I don’t want to buy a pressure washer that I think cost more than it actually does. I will call mr selleck and give him a 100 bucks to do it.
I like all these ideas and have contemplated many.
I am not bored
I actually loved my work but felt my attention to detail was slipping a bit. Like an athlete, it was important for me to go out at the top of my game rather than cling to it. That’s not me
And there were family health issues I had to become involved with that I won’t detail here. Sometimes life gets in the way
I’m not whining—I had a couple of rewarding careers in which I sweated blood and “left it all out on the field”. I’d just love a nice remote, work from home job but these days, it seems that what one sees as openings on indeed or LinkedIn are the kinds of things you run away from, not walk. No way you enter something to lose money
Thanks for the input. Much appreciated
YourdreamGM, Sheesh, your compulsive babble and ignorance really makes zero sense throughout this whole post. 90% of these comments has your name on it. And nonetheless, you never made one reasonable and intelligent comment throughout your endless effort to call all fans “a sucker fanbase” or how BC is a “failure”. Majority of us lost several IQ points and lost valuable time reading your meaningless thoughts that don’t hold facts or has any reverence to the current state the Pirates are at. You went as far as saying that all prospects are trash and began to foam more at the mouth like a rapid dog.
When you get like this, you remind me of that one (every family has one) family member who sits in a corner sucking down all the beer and rambling uncontrollably with nonsense. At the same time yelling at the kids for getting to close. My suggestion to you (like Aunt Mary Ann would say to that drunken family member) is, put down that beer and go home. Sleep it off and don’t come back until you’re sober. We and our young children don’t need this embarrassment.
If you don’t like my comments then don’t read them. Just read the 10 percent and move on or mute me. I didn’t force you to read them. Didn’t even ask you to read them. I do find it interesting that not only did you continue reading them but even took the time to tell me you read them.
This is a low traffic article. Most people have read it and the comments long ago. You are late to the party. Just me and the pep boys until the next Pirates article arrives.
It’s unfortunate that zero of what I said didn’t make any sense to you. But I can’t say I am surprised to hear this.
“You went as far as saying that all prospects are trash and began to foam more at the mouth like a rapid dog.”
I don’t believe I ever said all prospects are trash. If I did it was a error because I don’t feel that way. I like Jackson Holliday and don’t believe he is trash. And anyone who follows the Pirates knows how much I love Skenes and always have and never thought he was trash. I believe he is no longer considered a prospect by some outlets so that’s why I included Holiday. But I would like you to quote me where I said it so I can verify if I made a mistake and need to correct it or that you are just lying. The next part of your quote is proven by science to be a lie.
The foam is not coming from the dogs mouth as you said it was. It’s actually coming from the rapids. Whitewater is formed when a river’s gradient increases enough to disturb its smooth flow and create turbulence, i.e. form a bubbly or aerated, and rolling current so the frothy water appears white. I hope that makes sense to you.
Primate1225 just sent me a text. It said. After fact checking PiratesFan1981 comment “90% of these comments has your name on it.” my research finds this statement to be untrue.
It looks like your math skills are just as awful as your knowledge of science.
Dream- You are close.As a hydraulic engineer I have studied the river question in advance much as you have done with monkeys to select the perfect ape to be your assistant.The ground slope changes to steeper in specific areas which create supercritical flow,but the frothy water is created by the change of water
momentum when it hits the rocks in the stream bottom.The addition of air creates the sensation of frothyness.
By the way,1981 was as you state incorrect.Your posts only account for 80% of the total for this article.
A great deal of his comments were in reference to a conversation we were having on another thread. Perhaps it only made sense to those who followed it in its entirety over there
That said, I get a great deal of insight from Dream. We often disagree but what you’ve posted is simply in error and in general, a character assassination. Lighten up. It’s a message board about billionaire owners and millionaire players. It’s actually healthy to go off topic every once in a while and have a catharsis
if we couldn’t get off topic, there wouldn’t be anything to say
There’s only so much that can be said about Jones and Bednar
Dream wasn’t wrong about BC being a failure or that the younger base aren’t fools and suckers
Long time fans see this management for what it is
Throwing anyone out to play and expecting a contender in return
1981- As a fine Bucco poster I think you are owed a response to your post from a non biased poster.
The Man,Tired,and I probably account for another 15% of the total volume of posts.
Dream sometimes says nasty things about Pirate fans,because he is not actually a fan.
Your screen name belies the fact that you are not a debutante when it comes to rooting for a losing team.
The aforementioned three posters including myself think that you are a very young man though.Dream has called us “The old heads”.
One must take Dream with a grain of salt.
His posts are quite often entertaining for those of us who do not have anything better to do.
He was a BC disciple for several years but has turned on him.
You must admit though that the Pirates have serious problems if they are to ever become a very good team under this regime.
Some of us have not lost any IQ points because we did not have many left to lose.
Dream’s posts quite often though are very good and insightful,more so than just about anybody’s else’s.Yes,he can be a legend in his own mind.But if one has patience,the will,and the time,one can sift nuggets out of many of them.He responds to every retort.For the most part,he does not put forth dumb things.(Except for Jesse Winker!).
Dream is right.Just mute him or do not read his ramblings.I gloss over some of them.
I do have to correct you on one thing,and that is I feel sorry for your family if you must keep your children away from one family member sucking down beers in the corner.Contrary to what you say,not every family has one.
In two years, the only regulars that will still be here are Reynolds, Cruz, and Gonzales. That ain’t much to work with.
Hayes will still be here, no one will want a player who has recurring back problems and a regression in offense production and Keller signed a long term contract last year so he will be here in another 2 years
If there’s one position player that’s a huge disappointment, it’s that guy. The cornerstone of the franchise? Really?
They misfired on so many draft picks that it’s outrageous.
Meanwhile, you’d think the Pirates won yesterday with so much blather about Cruz hitting a ball into the Allegheny. Sheesh.
Tired- I think that the Cruz hype is actually detrimental to both him and the Pirates.Just because he can do the things that he can do does not mean that that makes him a complete player.It is a selling hype point for the Pirates and the younger generations get excited because it is more data points to show how good he is.
The fact that he is powerful enough to hit baseballs into the River just enables the Pirates to gloss over their and his many failures.
Like I have said, my friend, he reminds me of Gregory Polanco in that regard. And since there’s been no push to sign him to a long term deal, perhaps they’ve learned the hard way
Lots of upside to him but he could use a different set of manager/coaches to push him
Interesting point about hype. They’ve tried this “face of the franchise” thing with he, Hayes and Bednar.
The run totals for today’s game should be in line with what long time fans have become to expect from this lineup of hapless players
That is, of course, Joe, Hayes, Triolo and Taylor are up to the task of being productive
And Ottiz is getting the start
I do think that Shelton and Cherington do try their best,and are working in limited financial conditions.But it has been increasingly obvious that both of these guys are mediocre,and that is reflected in the results of the rebuild that,for any obvious reason,should produce at least a winning team.Why have a rebuild otherwise?
Pirate fans can at least be happy that the team’s mediocre record has at least kept the arrogant Yankee and Dodger fans away from their inane troll posts.
Doing their best shouldn’t just be about Ben and Derek’s ability to make up a lineup
I will forever ( until he’s gone) believe that some of these players would be better off hiring their own hitting coaches.
Reynolds changed his stance at the plate in late May and has been a far better hitter. Haines had him crouched down in the batter’s box
Rowdy admitted that he contacted an agent he’d known since he was a teenager and changed his approach at the plate
Both players have turned their seasons around because Haines’ approach to their offense wasn’t working
You can’t do more than your boss and budget prescribe
I do think Cherington has limitations. But I don’t share your views on scouting. To me, it’s part and parcel of what the overall problem is here. A lot of guys they misfired on from the jump
Player development has produced no impact player since Cherington began. They’re a big reason, too, but if the guys coming to them really aren’t the upper level types you’d expect for a team drafting so highly, what can they produce?
Shelton is an offshoot of what Cherington wants, to be sure. The nurturing, nice uncle approach. That can’t excuse the lineups, the situational blunders, the strange in-game decisions
How do Bucc’s fans feel about the direction this team is headed?
most of us long time fans have seen this movie before, JG
Management builds up the fans’ expectations during the offseason, sign a few free agents who are either past their prime or never had one, increase the hopes of a competitive season and realize around now actually that it was all a ruse and that unless a miracle happens, they have zero chance of making the playoffs
There have been a few bright spots but you can’t win games only with the best pitcher in baseball and one good hitting outfielder
You can read all about it above in the comments.
To sum it up in one sentence. Like a rapid dog desperately trying to make it’s way to the shore with little hope but refusing to completely give up.
A rapid dog? You mean, like a greyhound?
Or rabid dog, like a pit bull ?
I’m trying to glean whether you are looking for speed or brute power here
George-They have barely achieved mediocrity.
Their management and upper management is mediocre.
Their pitching is above average,with several fairly impressive pitchers in the minor leagues.
Their hitting has either regressed or the current staff has developed no one.
The scouting is fine.Player development other than pitching is poor.Fundamentals are flawed.
The manager and hitting coach have needed to go for at least a year.The development coaches should have been fired a couple of years ago.
I am generally not a negative person but if Nutting does nutting this franchise is doomed to mediocrity.
and the perpetual slump continues…
No one can confuse this team with the Lumber Company of the 1970’s
More like the Slumper Company