The Tigers’ signing of right-hander Jack Flaherty has proved to be one of the best moves of the 2023-24 offseason through the first half of play this year. The 28-year-old has looked nothing short of fantastic since signing with Detroit on a one-year deal over the offseason. In 89 innings of work across 15 starts, Flaherty has posted a solid 3.24 ERA (129 ERA+) with a 3.04 FIP.
That’s a quality performance that virtually any club would like to have at the front to middle of their rotation, but his underlying metrics have been even more elite. Flaherty has struck out an eye-popping 33% of batters faced while walking just 4% this year, giving him the league’s second-highest K-BB% behind only White Sox lefty Garrett Crochet. While home runs- which have been an issue that has plagued Flaherty throughout his career- have remained an issue as 18.3% of his fly balls have left the yard this year, the right-hander has also generated grounders at a full-season career best clip of 44.2%. All of that has combined to give Flaherty an MLB-best xFIP of 2.29 and a SIERA of 2.45 that trails only Crochet.
Unfortunately for the Tigers, they aren’t particularly well-positioned to make the most out of Flaherty’s time in the organization. While fans in Detroit are surely dreaming on the right-hander pairing with Tarik Skubal at the front of a playoff rotation, the Tigers are sitting at a record of just 37-45 headed into the second half. The AL Central division already appears more or less out of reach for the club as they’ve fallen 15.5 games behind the Guardians, and even an AL Wild Card berth would take a herculean climb up the standings as the club currently sits 7.5 games behind the Royals for the third Wild Card spot.
Between that reality and the fact that Flaherty would surely be the most attractive rental pitcher moved at the deadline if the Tigers were to deal him, it may seem like a forgone conclusion that the right-hander will be changing teams next month. That might not be the case, however, as Chris McCosky of The Detroit News reported earlier this week that president of baseball operations Scott Harris and his front office are preparing not just for a potential sell-off, but also for a hypothetical scenario where the Tigers look to add at the deadline.
While the club’s weak position in the standings makes that possibility appear extremely unlikely at first blush, McCosky notes that the club figures to have plenty of control over its own destiny between now and the trade deadline on July 30. Prior to that date, Detroit will square off against the Guardians ten times and the Twins six times. That could give Detroit plenty of opportunities to not only cut into their massive deficit in the AL Central, but also make up ground in the AL Wild Card race; Minnesota holds the second of three spots and currently sits eight games ahead of the Tigers in the standings.
Even as the Tigers have an interesting opportunity to play their way into contention over the final month before the deadline, however, it still appears more likely than not that Flaherty is pitching in another uniform when the calendar flips to August. If that comes to pass, the Tigers will need another arm to step into the rotation alongside Skubal, Reese Olson, Casey Mize, and Kenta Maeda. According to McCosky, that next man up was once thought to be right-hander Matt Manning, but the club’s first-round pick from the 2016 draft has struggled to a 6.00 ERA at the Triple-A level since last being optioned to the minors and has pitched to below-average numbers across five spot starts in the big leagues this year.
That, per McCosky, could lead the club to consider right-hander Beau Brieske for a rotation spot at some point. While the Tigers haven’t formally broached the possibility of swinging between the bullpen and the rotation with Brieske, the right-hander would reportedly be the top option for the role should the club decide to utilize a pitcher in that role. Looking at the righty’s work during his time with the club, it’s easy to see why that would be the case.
Brieske, 26, was a 27th-round pick by the Tigers in the 2019 draft but made it to the big leagues fairly quickly, starting 15 games in the majors during the 2022 season to roughly league average results. He’s been used almost exclusively out of the bullpen since then and has taken to the role particularly well this year as he’s posted a 2.35 ERA (180 ERA+) and a 2.24 FIP with a 24.4% strikeout rate in 13 multi-inning relief appearances totaling 23 innings of work. Those strong multi-inning performances have seen Brieske throw as many as 53 pitches in relief over three innings of work, making him a prime candidate to move into the rotation from a workload perspective.
In other Tigers news, Hinch told reporters (including McCosky) this evening that veteran shortstop Javier Baez, who has been shelved since early this month due to lumbar spine inflammation, is not only improving but has reached point of feeling “the best he’s felt with his back in some time.” Hinch noted that the Tigers are hoping to get the 31-year-old out on a rehab assignment next week with an eye toward a return prior to the All Star break, which begins on July 15. The veteran has struggled to a .183/.209/.247 slash line in 53 games with the Tigers this year, but despite that meager offensive contribution the Tigers still figure to look forward to his return because even that offense is still an improvement over the bat of Ryan Kreidler, who has replaced Baez in the lineup and is currently slashing just .148/.258/.148 in 13 games with the club while filling in for the veteran.
SewaldSwansonSwoon
Won’t last. Flaherty will choke eventually
Motor City Beach Bum
Based on what?
egrossen
It’s pretty baseless. In my opinion the only concern would be his workload
Unclemike1525
Scott Harris is doing a nice job like I thought he would. He’ll build the team up around your solid young P’s and he’ll take care of them the way the previous management wouldn’t. I don’t know if Flaherty fits into that plan or not but I can guarantee you whatever he does he’ll get the most out of that signing. I wish he had stayed with the Cubs right about now as Hoyer is ruining a perfectly good farm system. Harris’ biggest problem right now is trying to figure out how much of that bad Baez deal he has to eat to move on and how that effects his ability to sign more people. The Tigers arrow is pointing up while the Cubs arrow is pointing sideways at best. Enjoy it.
CubsWS2016
how is he “ruining a perfectly good farm system”? One he helped build in the first place? He hasnt traded ANY top prospects yet.
tigerfan4ever
Unclemike1526, you’ve broken STYMEEDONE’s heart by saying Harris is doing a good job. Keep up the good work with obviously knowledgeable, unbiased posts like this. I’m glad I’m not the only one who can see the truth about Scott!
Unclemike1525
I’d explain it to you but you wouldn’t get it. OK I’ll try. 2 years ago we had a sell off and I thought we were going to be like Tampa Bay. Young controllable pitching and smart move. Almost immediately Hoyer went out and started signing FA’s to over priced over extended deals. Suzuki and Happ? Why? NMC’s-Why? Goes out and signs Tallion-why? Re-signs Hendricks-Why? Signs Immanaga-Why? Big money deals that now block the whole Farm System. Why? Bellinger- Should of just said thanks and have a nice day.Now he has no money, Has a bunch of clowns he can’t or won’t drop, We don’t know why but they’re still there. If you want to move people from Tennessee to Iowa- You have to move out the people from Iowa- Or don’t you get that? You can’t tell me the guys at Iowa are any worse than the scumbags they stuck CC with. I hope I didn’t ruin your day, But I have a feeling I did.
durhamsboner
Hindsight is 20/20. No team is going to rush prospects up en mass because the big league club sucks, or to appease fans. Or don’t you get that?
And for what it’s worth, I’m having a wonderful day 🙂
SportsFan0000
Many of the top young players and prospects being promoted by the Tigers were drafted and traded for by former GM Al Avila.
Don’t get me wrong, it was time for the Tigers to move on from Al Avila
If fact, the Tigers could have hired Mike Elias anytime before November 2018 (He built the Astros and current Orioles pennant contending teams).
Ham3131
Really? You clearly haven’t paid much attention to the Detroit Tigers over the last 12 months to make these comments! SMH!
CBeisbol
MCBB
Based on nothing
People just be trolls
TJG88
Tigers cant have nice things.
Mike56
He as Flaherty muffled himself on social media. He kinda rubbed a lot of people the wrong way in his time in St Louis. The man has a right to his opinions but seemed to always to come at wrong time
TheMichigan
They gotta trade Skubal and Flaherty ASAP if anyone is willing to pay the price.
tigerfan4ever
They’d be stupid to trade Skubal. Flaherty is as good as gone.
Jm207* 2
Why not trade Skubal? They clearly are competing while he’s under team control
tigerfan4ever
You trade both Skubal and Flaherty, the rebuild continues for several more years. Would you like that? I know I wouldn’t. I don’t think Harris want that either.
Jm207* 2
I meant aren’t competing*
I don’t want that but the rebuild has failed… Again. Keeping Skubal doesn’t change the outcome of this terrible team. They aren’t competing. They need bats. Trade Skubal for bats because he’s not going to stay after his contract is up.
Simm
They should extend Skubal. If they don’t think they will then they should definitely consider trading him. He would bring back multiple elite prospects. Yes that would mean they would likely be facing another 3-4 years of not contending but are they going to contend during that time anyways?
The tigers are in a tough spot right now. My guess is they keep him for another season in hopes that next year the results are better than this years. If not then they trade him then. Of course there is a massive risk that he has an arm injury in the next year (all pitchers have this risk) and they get near nothing for him. Organizations have to make tough decisions the ones that make the right ones separate themselves from the ones that make the wrong ones.
Jm207* 2
Agreed. I don’t want them to trade Skubal. But if they could trade him for a haul from a team like the Orioles or Dodgers it could change the direction of the franchise. I’m confident the Tigers can buy or develop pitching. They’re barren in the hiring department and have been for the last 10 years.
Melchez17
Based on previous trades… Harris will trade Flaherty for a prospect who has no position and has trouble hitting a ball.
Motor City Beach Bum
Lee seems to be doing pretty well Melchez. I’d still take Malloy in that trade last year any time.
Ma4170
I’m not sure they could get back the value from one team for Skubal that he would warrant. He’s arguably the best pitcher in baseball right now. Maybe the Orioles if they “give up the farm” but they haven’t shown they’re willing to do that.
Motor City Beach Bum
Melchez…thoughts on who they should target in trade for Flaherty? I like what Atlanta and Arizona have to offer.
Tigers3232
@Melchez Vierling hasn’t been all that bad and Malloy looked great in Minors, he’s struggled thus far on big league roster but it’s way to early for a final verdict on him.
All and all the Tigers have not made any major trades, so expecting him to have received any massive haul is kind of a stretch.
The only knock I have on Harris is ERod and the trade deadline. I feel he should have had something else lined up to fall back in the event the deal with a team he had a no trade clause with fell through as it had. That’s assuming he did not attempt to have one lined up and it just had not been reported.
Tigers3232
@Beach Bum I love the question you asked. That’s not how Melchez operates though, he likes to be critical in hindsight. Which is much easier than any type of critical thinking.
I like what Harris has done thus far. Was a little frustrated with 2 things however. ERod at the deadline and Max Clark over Langford. The jury is still out obviously on the latter. I just feel with where Tigers are at they should ve went with Langford the safer pick, hopefully time proves me wrong.
Motor City Beach Bum
Melchez has some good ideas when he is not hissing about Harris 😉
I agree the Langford vs Clark issue won’t be decided anytime soon, but in weighing which was the right choice we have to consider that it also allowed them to sign McGonigle and I expect others from that draft class (Wilson?, Hamm?, Cerkownyk?) with the savings. Getting Anderson underslot in that draft could prove to have been another good choice. Like you say time will tell.
Tigers3232
I believe Langford signed for $8M and Clark $7.7M. I’d say the impact might have affected one of the players you mention. However, they could of sought savings elsewhere and still came up with those picks.
SportsFan0000
If the Tigers get back young major leaguers and/or top prospects @ AA and AAA who are almost major league ready and/or blocked from the majors by other players, then the rebuild could be done much sooner.
SportsFan0000
Scott Boras is his agent.
See what is going on with Juan Soto.
Boras won’t negotiate extensions with the home team.
He prefers his clients go onto the open market for bidding wars.
SportsFan0000
San Diego may want Flaherty. They are looking for veteran pitching to get them to the playoffs and start in the playoffs.
Some of their starters are IL. Others were FA and signed elsewhere.
Padres are barely holding the last NL Wild Card spot with a loaded batting lineup.
SS prospect Devries and another starter like Mazur or ?
would get Flaherty
Motor City Beach Bum
Or…they could extend them both.
My preference would be for them to explore and extension with Skubal now, trade Flaherty and then circle back a re-sign him in the offseason. He has pitched well in Detroit and is obviously comfortable there. He chose the Tigers over other suitors for a reason. Opportunity…and Chris Fetter.
Harris/Greenberg are test driving the kids in the minors to see who will be part of the long term solution (next up Jung, Dingler and Round 2 for Meadows)and once they know that then those gaps (more offence, C, SS) need to be filled by trade or FA signings next year (i.e. Go get Kim for SS or Bregman for 3B or Janssen for C or a young monster bat like Alonso). They told us at the start of the season this is what they were doing. The improvement they need can’t all come from within. They tried FA signings that worked this year (Flaherty, Canha) , some were meh ( and some haven’t panned out (Maeda).
I don’t see a rebuild coming or needed. Keith has had growing pains but has come around. Greene and Carp are awesome. Fill in the gaps. They have good young players like Clark and McGonigle developing in the minors and are trying to build a “next man up” system like Houston ot TB. It’s the right thing to do.
tigerfan4ever
My rebuild comment was based on if they trade both Skubal and Flaherty. I love your scenario and agree 100%. To add to your thoughts, I am hoping they can get Meadows and Torkelson straightened out. I haven’t given up on either as of yet and feel we should be seeing them up with the big club later in the season.
Motor City Beach Bum
I was responding to the original posters plan to blow things up.
If they traded Skubal I’d be pissed but they better get a boatload. Fansided had a scenario with Sawyer-Smith, Dodd, Baldwin and Alvarez coming back. I’d say that not enough. Get Nacho Alvarez (SS) and Drake Baldwin (C) for sure…they will be great players and fill a need. I’d make them give up two injured players in Michael Harris and Hurston Waldrep as well. Add in some small pieces in Detroits end. If someone wants a controllable number 1 starter they should pay for it. Baltimore, the Mets and Arizona have the prospects to do it. I’m not real taken with the Dodgers prospects. I 100% hope they do not trade Skubal, but if they did, drain the other team and fix all the problem areas (SS, C, bats) with long term solutions.
I missed Tork in my post and agree he is not done.
Motor City Beach Bum
Thoughts on players they should look at in any potential Flaherty or Skubal trades?
Ma4170
Do you think they can turn Tork around? There was an article on his swing and how hes struggled to handle velocity and they have to do considerable work to fix it. He showed flashes so hope they do.
Skubal is young, controllable, and dominant. The package should include a system’s top prospect or close to it. And im a met fan so have no stake in this.
Ma4170
As a met fan, a package for skubal would have to include Jett and Sproat plus two other high upside (i.e., Jeremy Rodriguez, jesus baez) or detroit should hang up.
Jm207* 2
Braves don’t have enough near ready talent to trade for Skubal. Tigers need a haul. Braves system isn’t good
Motor City Beach Bum
I’m a fan of Parada too. The Mets have some players who would match up with the Tigers needs.
As for Tork I have read he is stubborn and won’t change his swing. Just what I have read. Hopefully this will be a wake up call.
Motor City Beach Bum
JM 207…I agree. That’s why they should target someone like Michael Harris as part if the package if they were to do the unthinkable and trade Skubal (plus Waldrep, Nacho Alvarez and Drake Baldwin). Lots of needs filled there.
SportsFan0000
Do not give up on Tork too soon.
Rizzo was with the Padres and struggled as a young player. They got impatient in San Diego and traded him to the Cubs for a mediocre starter.
And, Rizzo’s career took off like a rocket in Chicago.
SportsFan0000
Don’t give up on him.
Padres did that with Rizzo and dealt him to Chicago.
stymeedone
Greene will be a FA before Clark arrives. Clark will be his replacement. There has been no urgency on the ownership to take advantage of the current roster. Twiddling thumbs, and wait til next year are easy on the budget.
Motor City Beach Bum
Being impatient and just throwing money at the problem doesn’t work either.
tigerfan4ever
Another gem posted by STYMEEDONE. I see your little break from commenting hasn’t improved the quality of your posts at all. Get over your obvious and baseless hatred of Harris, moron.
stymeedone
Name calling is a sign of someone with no argument. Let me know when Harris actually does something.
Motor City Beach Bum
Stymedone…stop telling half the story when it comes to what Harris/Greenberg have done. You just focus on the negative in your posts. The Flaherty signing for instance was a coup. You campaigned repeatedly for Urshela and he signed him and Gio has been meh. Gotta take the good with the bad.
tigerfan4ever
I’ve made my argument, but you refuse to read or acknowledge it, STYMEEDONE! You know not what you talk about. Again, drop your hatred of Harris and look at the whole picture. If you can’t, don’t post here. You’re making yourself look worse every post you make.
Jm207* 2
I don’t understand people’s optimism with this rebuild. Our number 1 picks Mize and Tork are busts. There’s only 2 hitters on the team who are above average and one of them is a platoon player in Carp. People tout Veirling and Ibanez like they’re more than bench players on a good team. Most of the time guys they’re testing have failed. Keith might be okay in the long run but he hasn’t shown much out of a couple week stretch of avg production. Dingler has a very meek profile with all the strike outs. Jung is hitting like .150 against fastballs thrown harder than 93 in the minors. Meadow’s hasn’t shown anything except excellent defense. Nobody on the infield can play defense. The starting pitching is solid but the pen is a mess. There are just so many holes on this team.
Motor City Beach Bum
Young players aren’t always good from Day 1 and there are a lot of young players on the team. They need to be mixed with veterans FA signings and trade acquisitions. Urshela and Canha were just placeholders to see what they had internally. This offseason they need to fill the remaining gaps not ticketed for an internal option by signing FAs and trades. SS, catcher and an impact bat or two.
tigerfan4ever
Jm207*2, way way too early to call Tork or Mize busts. You seem to be a glass completely empty kind of person, not an intelligent poster. Just because a player hasn’t performed up to your standards after a year or two doesn’t mean he’s got a bleak future.
DonOsbourne
It’s good to hear that Baez will be back in time for the All Sar game. It wouldn’t be the same without him…….oh wait!
Motor City Beach Bum
Baez needs to go or at minimum be benched. They need to go get a young replacement at the trade deadline who can jump right in, like Nacho Alvarez from Atlanta.
tigerfan4ever
Baez will be DFA’d or outright released during the offseason.
moteus
Well, all I can say to THAT is: LET IT BE SO!!
GarryHarris
The only way I trade Tarik Skubal is if Javier Baez gets packaged with him. Even then, it’s a hard call to make.
Michael Chaney
As bad as Javy’s contract is, I don’t think it’s worth selling off one of the best pitchers in the league for less than he’s worth just to get rid of him
Simm
Yeah this would reduce his value to near nothing. The tigers have the money to just release him.
cooperhill
Good luck with that, LMAO!
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Then there is no point.
GarryHarris
It’s what the Mariners did to rid themselves of the Robinson Cano contract. They packaged him with Edwin Diaz and received Jarred Kelenic among others.
However, Tarik is a top pitcher in MLB so, it would take a lot more. Still, I would simultaneously rid myself of Baez.
Motor City Beach Bum
It would lessen the return unless they just ate the whole contract, or took on a similar type contract (i.e. Bryant, Story). I hope they don’t trade Skubal but IF they did and IF they attached Baez to it I’d prefer they maximize the prospect return by eating the contract or swapping bad contracts. I’d rather have Story or Bryant than Baez. Fresh starts can work sometimes. I think its more likely they just cut bait on Baez.
tiger9
Agreed my friend. The Dodgers have nobody better than Baez at short. Eat some of the deal, maybe 30 million and then be becomes 14 a year for the next three years. Palatable for any contender. Add Skubal to the deal and we can really get into that Dodger farm system. I am not in favor of trading Skubal however. Extend him asap. And for those who think Boras clients never sign extensions….look it up.
Strasburg..Altuve…Bogaerts…Gonzalez.
It can be done. Get it done lads. Harris has constantly said the money will be there. Let’s see the evidence this offseason. Put up or shut up Chris.
SportsFan0000
I had thought of that with the Dodgers also.
Trade Baez and eat half of his salary every year
Only if they still get a very strong package of young major league players and almost ready prospects in AAA and AA.
Baez could be a “change of scenery” candidate
who produces much more in LA that in DET.
TroyVan
Kreidler has looked looked a little better over his last couple games. I believe that he will be a serviceable player eventually. He was doing good in his development until a couple injuries derailed his career, resulting in almost 2 seasons lost. He’s still ramping up and TBH, he should be doing that in Toledo. But, this is probably a lost season, so why not give him MLB at bats.
tigerfan4ever
TroyVan, I feel more comfortable with Kreidler at short than Baez or McKinstry. I think the latter two are gone at the end of the season anyway, as I’ve stated previously.
I know it’s Toledo, but why not promote Andrew Navigato? He’s got a BA in the high .280s, OPS approaching.900 and is a power bat down there.
Motor City Beach Bum
Go get Nacho Alvarez from Atlanta at the deadline. Great defense and offense has come around.
None of those three is a solution and I’d rather see them try Navigato like you say.
TroyVan
I think you’ll still have growing pains with Navigato, especially since he’s only played 1/2 a season in AAA so far in his career. I wouldn’t call him up unless there was some sort of emergency. Would like to see him get some MLB ABs later this season.
Motor City Beach Bum
Good point. Rushing someone can ruin them. Plus Harris/Greenberg seem to bring their prospects along slowly.
Leonard might be worth a look too since he can play SS and is in AAA. I don’t think he’s had a great season so far in AAA but he was hurt. Again maybe a test drive later in the year.
Hopefully they pick a young SS up at the deadline and either cut or bench Baez.
tigerfan4ever
There IS an emergency in the fact that there are not any truly serviceable shortstops at the major league level. Kreidler is the best of the three but not good and not nearly major league caliber. McKinstry and Baez are horrible. Why not give Navigato a try ASAP?
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Because we’re paying good money to watch MLB caliber baseball and do not feel like being taken advantage of by a billionaire who refuses to hire MLB caliber baseball players?
tigerfan4ever
Hi Stuperfife! No lobotomy for you yet? Schedule it and let us know how it goes!
TroyVan
There’s no doubt in my mind that Illitch will spend when the club has a core of decent MLB ballplayers, particularly hitters. It didn’t help matters when AA signed Baez. If im Illitch, for sure I just tightened up a little seeing this alleged core Avila had in place and substantial payroll going to one player who hasn’t really produced anything but a league worst hitting performance. I’d be like no more money until you (at least) get a real core in place. That what any of us would do if it were our money.
Motor City Beach Bum
TroyVan…you are bang on. Can’t blame the guy for being a bit gunshy after that.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
My point exactly. They have sold this GM strategy to the fans……all these key words..”rebuild”, “core”, “the holes” and used it as an excuse not to pay MLB caliber players and field a competitive MLB team….for 10 years now.
AAA is where the tryouts happen, not the MLB. At this point hearing the words “prospect” and “hopeful” in the same sentence makes me want to puke.
My apologies, I know you guys don’t like to hear this….Jack Nicholson made a movie…just like this.
Motor City Beach Bum
I think next year will be a different story. I know no one likes to hear that either after 10 years. It’s hard not to be frustrated.
Avila did some stupid things but he also did some great things (Skubal). I don’t totally blame him for the state the team is in. Next year Harris/Greenberg need to fix things now that they have had time to diagnose the problems.
tigerfan4ever
You have made no points at any time, oh toothless one, except you probably drool all over yourself before you type your absolute gibberish. I get that point.
TroyVan
I wouldn’t give Avila credit for drafting Skubal. It would be one thing if he drafted him in the first five rounds. After that, it’s basically a crapshoot. Probably 90% of those guys won’t see or throw a MLB pitch. Skubal was drafted in the 29th round of 40. Given the odds, let’s be real about what was expected out of Skubal. Avila got lucky af and scratched a winner with Skubal. He probably never even met him and probably wouldn’t have recognized him on the day he was fired.
SportsFan0000
Agent Boras called Avila based on his past relationship with Dombrowski and Avila and sold him on picking and signing Skubal in the draft.
TroyVan
I think you mean Scott Chiamparino called David Chadd. Skubal wasn’t the player they were originally planning to draft, but that player was drafted while they were on the phone. When that player was drafted, Scott then recommended another pitcher by the name of Tarik Skubal.
SportsFan0000
Part of the problem with Detroit’s delayed rebuild was former Owner Mike I who refused to let Dombrowski do his job and trade some of those veterans for bunches of top young players and prospects while they still had high trade value.
Mike I and Dombrowski parted ways on that very issue.
So the Tigers real rebuild was delayed until after Mike I’s passing.
By that time, the trade market had changed and the Tigers best chips were either in decline, injured or struggling on a very bad team which was the double whammy causing their trade values to crater(along with every GM in both leagues smelling desperation on the part of the Tigers and Avila hawking declining veterans past their peak value expiration dates).
Timing is everything in making trades and building MLB rosters.
Tigers3232
@SaberTooth Who should the Tigers have signed during the off season that was willing to come here?? It is easy to say just spend, but how about we hear how.
GarryHarris
I would keep Kreidler and let him work things out as they have Colt Keith.
TroyVan
For sure, that’s what they have in mind. This lost season belongs to Kreidler to get some MLB ABs. Perhaps if/when Javy comes back, he moves to Toledo. But, that experience will be put to good use, even if it’s in Toledo (temporarily?).
The Saber-toothed Superfife
They should have hired the right person, at the right time, and you know who that is……
Face it.
We’ve been reduced to a farm club for the Cohens’ and Steinbreners’ and Dodgers.
The only way to win is to operate like their farm club. (or have a zealot for an owner = face it = that is something WE DON’T HAVE).
FLYING PIGS APPROVED THIS MESSAGE.
tigerfan4ever
A flying pig named toothless Stuperfife made this comment so of course flying pigs approved it. Face that, you moron.
Dogs
As you can see from my profile picture, Animals is my favorite Album. Dogs is my favorite song, but Pigs On The Wing is not bad either. It is all about Big Business. To be successful, you have to “Build” a winning Team & that takes time.
I hope Harris & Illich are Dogs, not Sheep or Pigs of any sort.
GarryHarris
Smart ones at least.
cooperhill
Baez contract an unmitigated disaster, when will the Tigers ever learn???
Motor City Beach Bum
That was Avila who signed that. The Tigers have learned, that’s why they are developing their own players.
GarryHarris
I believe the owner wanted Baez.
stymeedone
All those young players they developed, came from the Avila years. Harris has chosen not to be aggressive. If Baez had been able to hit .240 with 20 HR power, while playing his usual solid defense, no one would be overly dissatisfied. He’d be serviceable. It didn’t happen.
Harris hit with Lorenzen, and Flaherty on one year deals. He missed with Boyd and Meada. Neither McKinstry or Canha are lighting up the scoreboard. Two of the three players he traded his closer for are no longer with the team. Do we even need to mention last trade deadline and the trade that wasn’t made? Its early, but Malloy has shown little. I’m still hoping for Harris to put things together, but as long as the only team that takes his calls is the Phillies, I’m not optimistic.
tigerfan4ever
Boyd got injured. Maeda isn’t a miss quite yet. Canha isn’t either. The one player left from the Soto trade is Vierling, who has been decent this season. Malloy, you’re basing on a small sample size. The Phillies aren’t the only team he calls, moron. You’re blinded by your infernal hatred of Harris and you really don’t hope for him to put things together. You’ve wanted him fired from the moment he got hired. That’s when the cheese slipped off your cracker, STYMEEDONE. You’re pathetic.
Motor City Beach Bum
Your last sentence sums it up Stymedone…”I’m not optimistic.” You focus a lot on the negative. The Flaherty signing mote than makes up for Maedas results.
Show me a GM or POBO who bats a thousand and doesn’t make mistakes. They don’t exist.
Check back after this trade deadline and then offseason an we’ll see if you feel the same.
stymeedone
Signing Lorenzen was succesful, but it too was only a one year contract. Lorenzen was then traded for a light hitting 2B prospect, and then he signed Keith to a long term contract. That just doesn’t show a lot of forethought. (just watched Malloy hit his inside the parker)
I hope the Flaherty signing works out better. I don’t expect any GM to be perfect, but Harris really hasn’t done anything to be positive about yet. If he signs Skubal long term, gets a top prospect back for Flaherty, manages to move Baez’ contract, or signs a FA to a least a 3 year contract that works out, then then praise will be warranted. He is being handcuffed by his budget.
tigerfan4ever
Who is this “light hitting” 2B you speak of STYMEEDONE? If you’d do your friggen homework before you post your useless comments, you’d not be such a fool. Lee is raking at AA.
Motor City Beach Bum
Stynedone…A couple things.
1. Harris is not the GM. 2. Lee, as Tigerfan4ever just stated is raking and has at least 10 homers. 3. No GM can get rid of Baez’s contract, unless it is for a similarly worthless hitter. 4. Keith was in the convo as a dark horse for ROY when they signed his contract and wellbregarded 5. How could the Flaherty signing have worked out any better? 6. “Harris hasn’t done anything positive”? Ibanez, Vierling, Flaherty, Lee, Lorenzen, Chafin, Canha, , Malloy, Leonard, Kelly, last year’s draft et al… 7. They do need to sign Skubal long term OR trade him for a massive haul. 8. They do need to sign some free agents this offseason, or make trades to fill some holes (C, SS, big bat). 9. Handcuffed by his budget…Ilitch and Harris have both said the money is there when they have a core and are ready. Do you blame him for being gunshy after Baez.
You wanted him to sign Urshela. They did and he is meh. You bitched when they signed Flaherty, Kelly and Canha short term and they have been somewhere between alright and awesome and all three should be good trade bait. You keep talking that Harris wants his own players, but then point out that he is developing players drafted by Avila. You are like a dog chasing his tail with that argument!!! You criticize for mistakes Harris made but you have been way off base too dude.
I respect your opinion, I really do, butnot when all you are doing is “Harris hating” as Tigersfan4ever calls it.
If nothing changes after the trade deadline and this offseason maybe I’ll join you in being a little negative, but until then I’ll give Harris, Greenberg and Hinch a chance to right the ship and keep building the team for the long term like they have been doing.
TroyVan
Some random Cubs fan told us on here what to expect from Baez. A knack for making big plays at short with a tendency to boot some routine plays. Flashes of big power, but a lot of frustrating strikeouts. He was so right. And looking back at his stats, it was all right there. I always wondered how that random Cubs fan could make a spot on prediction of Javy Baez (backed by stats) and Avila still gave him a huge contract. Damming, in my eyes, to the competence of Al Avila.
Motown is My Town
Tigers lost again last night as the bullpen blew another game…9 games under .500 and 16 games behind Cleveland. It’s not even July 4th and the season is over…this is what Chris I gets by refusing to bring in some hitters this year and he can think about it as he looks around an empty Comerica Park the rest of the season
Dogs
If you don’t want to freak out, don’t look at the July Schedule. It is horrid looking for the Tigers.
Motor City Beach Bum
Hopefully the can get ack some of that magic they had last year against AL Central teams when they play Cleveland and Minnesota.
TheToasters
I think Flaherty would be great for the Orioles, and they have a lot to potentially offer the Tigers, but I don’t think he was well liked during his brief stint here, and this a friendly bunch. Which may not matter if he keeps pitching like this, but my guess is nobody enjoyed having him around, and I wonder how much that is part of the conversation. Do you trade for an Ahole?
The Saber-toothed Superfife
We deserve an equal opportunity and we get the job done. We feel, that’s what counts and all that really matters.
Dogs
Are you a Union Rep? We can call the Tigers Team, as constructed right now, as an “Equal Opportunity” Team!
tigerfan4ever
Stuperfife is suffering from a brain bleed. Don’t try to make sense out of anything he posts.
Motor City Beach Bum
Baltimore is stingy with their prospects and other than Bencosme they don’t seem to have much in the way of SS prospects to offer. I highly doubt they could pry Basallo or Mayo away.
Atlanta has Nacho Alvarez (SS) and Drake Baldwin (C) who are both really good players and defenders and look like they will be starters when they get to MLB. They might be able to grab players like that in a deal. Or Arizona has Cerda (C), Torin (SS) and Barrosa (OF) who are a little further from MLB but also look solid. All those players seem to fit the hitter profile Harris/Greenberg have been targeting and would be long term solutions at problem spots.
stymeedone
The problem is Atlanta is in need of a future SS.
tigerfan4ever
The problem is, you continue to post drivel.
Motor City Beach Bum
And yet Fansided listed Nacho Alvarez as trade bait. Perhaps they feel the need for a top starter outweighs the need for a future SS?
TroyVan
MLBTR staff covered this in a live chat. Very unlikely that he will return to Baltimore due to the fact that they had a chance to re-sign him and didn’t. Now, they’d be giving up valuable prospects to get him and that makes the GM look bad. “Not good optics” so the GM will pass so it doesn’t raise these questions.
SportsFan0000
Flaherty signed with the Orioles last year and did not have a good year.
The Tigers probably get more from Flaherty from another team because he is having a good year this year.
Skubal would be a great fit for the Orioles and the Orioles have the top hitting prospects that could help the Tigers right away:
Holladay, Basallo, Kjerstad, Norby Bradfield Jr and more
Motor City Beach Bum
The O’s traded for Flaherty last year, they didn’t sign him. You are just reading off the list of the O’s top prospects from MLB.com without looking at team needs.
SportsFan0000
No. I am summarizing their best prospects
and trying to cut to the chase as one of my professors used to say lol!
I am fully aware of the Tigers needs and the top prospects of the Orioles: Holladay SS (Tigers need) Bassallo (catcher 1B who can hit=Tigers need ).
Kjerstad and Bradfield Jr are OFs who can hit. Tigers need a few hitting OFs to help Greene especially a CF.
Loading the team up with more talent then opens up trade possibilities to patch other holes on the team.
Keep the Orioles players who produce and have the option use some of the current Tigers as backups or trade bait to patch more holes on team.
Tigers big needs are foundational position players who can hit and field. The Orioles are loaded with that type of player.
SportsFan0000
I left out Orioles 2B prospect Connor Norby because Tigers have given 2B to Colt Keith and 1B /3B Coby Mayo
since Tigers have Torkleson and a few others targeted for 3B and 1B.
Motor City Beach Bum
I agree on the CF front. Perez and Meadows to me look oike backups. Greene could always shift back to CF to accommodate and OF like Kjerstad, although he’s always an injury risk the way he plays CF.
Holliday will never get traded. Basallo offers some upside for sure.
You are right they need some more foundational hitters to add to Carp and Greene. I’m hoping they can find their SS in the Flaherty trade. The only one Baltimore seems to have available in trade is Bencosme who I don’t find very interesting. McGonigle is currently a SS but the experts suggest he will shift to 2B eventually and he is not close to MLB.
gotigers68
The Tigers will be sellers. They’ve had all year to upgrade their offense, why wait till the trade deadline ?
By the way, isn’t it about time for Skubal to have TJ surgery, like the rest of the staff ?
Motor City Beach Bum
Don’t jinx him! Him winning the Cy Young will help soften the blow of no playoffs.
SportsFan0000
I hope he wins the Cy Young in an Orioles uni
and that the Tigers land at least 3-4 great young, major league ready and almost major league ready players and prospects for him at the trade deadline or sooner.
Motor City Beach Bum
Do you really think the Orioles will sell the farm for any one player? You just went on about how Elias is such a great GM in the post below. They are not going to pay the cost.
SportsFan0000
Elias is smart. Some of those Orioles players are blocked by other young Orioles prospects who have broken through as stars at the MLB level with the Orioles
And, Elias picks up new players in early and late rounds of each years draft that are also winners.
Like some other loaded farm systems, they have to make trades or they may lose some of their players for nothing in the Rule 5 Draft.
Besides, the goal is to win the World Series at least once if not multiple times.
At some point when your team is knocking at the door,
your GM has to make a few deals to throw that door open. and go for the World Series Trophy and rings.
That is what Elias did when he gave up 2 very good young prospects and a competitive balance draft pick for a 1 year rental of Corbin Burns.
Skubal is worth at least 2X that with 2 1/2 years team control at a very reasonable salary.
Motor City Beach Bum
I agree they should but I just wonder if they will. If I’m the Tigers I’m asking for one of their MLB OF, Mayo, Basallo and Bencosme. I just don’t see them sacrificing that much even though they should because prospects just don’t always work out.
TroyVan
Skubal already had Tommy John surgery in college. That’s why he was a 29th rounder. There was limited info on him because he was still in the recuperation/rehab phase.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
I think the FO attitude is just plain wrong.
Help the players maximize their salaries.
Nothing wrong with getting Skubal to the team that is going to pay him $35M/year…or Tork to the Yanks where he gets paid $20M/year……
I don’t think anyone will see that in Detroit……
They are being selfish pricktoids and that will not ever work out.
Motor City Beach Bum
Miguel Cabrera and Prince Fielder come to mind for players who have seen that in Detroit. They can afford player salaries, they just need to be smart about how they portion it out. Only teams like the Dodgers and Yankees can go crazy with salaries and when’s the last time they won something with that mentality (other than the 2020 Covid season). Player development coupled with smart trades and FA signings wins championships.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Mike Illich has passed.
Motor City Beach Bum
He was a good owner but he just threw money at the problem and that didn’t work. How Houston built a long term contender works.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
He used his money and contracts as advertisement. Always made the news. Very smart, generated a lot of publicity and interest. He was at the forefront of doing just that. Very smart, indeed.
And….here I am, today.
tigerfan4ever
You’re barely here, but not coherent.
stymeedone
Houston seems to be coming to the end of their contention window. Mr I, may he rest in peace, and DD were able to keep the team in contention for a decade by throwing money at FAs, and smart trades. They just never won the big one.
tigerfan4ever
Christ, more drivel from STYMEEDONE, please someone make it stop. The Astros are far closer to competing than the Tigers are. You’re pathetic.
SportsFan0000
Orioles have a 45M payroll with a 100+ win team and a loaded farm system.
If Tigers had hired Mike Elias (Strohs and Orioles)
then they would be in the same boat as Orioles.
Motor City Beach Bum
If all the other teams didn’t show up then the Tigers would be 162-0. If they cloned the 1984 team they might win the world series this year. They didn’t hire Elias so your what if is just annoying.
SportsFan0000
This is a baseball forum.
Don’t like my comments, then just skip by them.
My point is very valid,
Phillies were struggling after what many baseball experts and local Phillies fans were calling a “failed rebuild” that was stalling out.
Ownership/John Middleton was firing the Front Office and resigned to a complete teardown and another rebuild.
Then, the Baseball Gods smiled on the Phillies
and Owner John Middleton refused to give up, refused to take “no” for an answer
and, finally, convinced Dave Dombrowski to take
the Phillies President of Baseball Ops job.
In a few short years, the Phillies now have one of the best teams in baseball.
So, Yes, It matters who is in charge of your Front Office drafting, building, trading, free agents, and skillfully constructing your team.
Motor City Beach Bum
I agree that it matters who runs your team. You are right but we have Greenberg as GM and Harris as POBO and the combo has been together less than a year. Give them a chance is what I’m saying and maybe they become like Elias because thats the kind of team they are trying to build.
Apologies for being snotty dude. Cheers
TroyVan
There’s not really many clubs that will give a player a raise before they are eligible for arbitration. Colt Keith is a rare exception and TBH that move may come back to bite Harris if he doesn’t become a serviceable MLB player.
Ma4170
What teams are the likeliest to be in on Flaherty? Dodgers, Orioles, Braves, Astros, Padres? Others, realistically?
Motor City Beach Bum
Those were the ones I’ve seen listed. Yankees, Arizona, St Louis, Milwaukee, Cleveland I’ve seen listed too.
Ma4170
Lots of competition… he crashed and burned with the Orioles after the trade last year, so I don’t see them going down that road again
Motor City Beach Bum
Yeah TroyVan said it was discussed on a trade rumors discussion recently. I can see how they would be gushy.
Boston was mentioned in relation to Flaherty as well.
Dogs
Phillies, Mets
GarryHarris
Jack Flahery sweepstakes: Yankees 1, Phillies 2, Braves 3, Astros 4, Brewers 5.
Motor City Beach Bum
Yankees prospects scare me.
Ma4170
Phillies dont seem like they need him between wheeler nola suarez sanchez
Motor City Beach Bum
It was curious but after Walker got hurt they came up in a trade rumors linked to Flaherty.
Dogs
Plus, Turnbull went down injured last week too. Running out of Starters.
SportsFan0000
SS De Vries would be a very good get for Flaherty
and maybe a young starter like Mazur.
BigFishPike
I remember when Jack couldn’t avg over a K an IP.
What happened?
Motor City Beach Bum
Chris Fetter the pitching coach in Detroit happened.
BigFishPike
Jack started averaging over a K an IP in 2018.
Chris Fetter wouldn’t have a job without Roger Beshens.
Beshens is consulting right now with Strom.
In 2018, Matt Blake, Ethan Katz, Fetters the Gotham guy in Phila had no clue what a Roger Beshens Football SLider was.
Google Football Slider and click images and there’s your answer.
Motor City Beach Bum
Everyone learns from someone else. I don’t know of Beshens but he sounds like a good mentor from what you say. Glad Beshens was able to add to all their arsenals as pitching coaches because they are some of the best in the league.
BigFishPike
Chris Fetter has been in Detroit a long time and he’s done nothing.
Same for Ethan Katz.
Motor City Beach Bum
Fetter has not been there a long time and he has turned around a lot of pitchers, most notably Lorenzen and Flaherty.
BigFishPike
Lorenzen in 2019 learned the Roger Beshens Football Slider. Flaherty couldn’t avg over a K an IP until 2018 when he learned that same football slider.
stymeedone
Do you know any other topic? Do you get royalties for typing that phrase?
tigerfan4ever
LOL @ STYMEEDONE calling someone out and hurling insults! No argument points for you? Hypocrite!
Motor City Beach Bum
Not sure what you mean dude. My response about Fetter?
tigerfan4ever
Nobody is ever sure about what STYMEEDONE says. He fantasizes about knowing anything about Tigers baseball but that’s as far as it goes.
Hot Corner IJ
Tigers likely will not be able to extend Skubal. Boris takes 99% of his clients to free agency. That being said and the fact the Tigers are not close to contention they need to maximize his trade value now. Does say the Tigers choice of any 5 prospects a team has, the Tigers choice of the acquiring teams next 2 tradeable draft picks assets, and $5 Million of international signing access move the needle in a Skubal trade?
Motor City Beach Bum
Ti disagree. They are not that far off from competing. Their pitching is top notch and they have a core of young hitters.
IF they were to trade him they HAVE TO address the shortcomings on the team now (SS, C, a big bat). They should keep him though unless someone offers the moon.
Ma4170
So would basallo westburg norby be in the ballpark? Not that baltimore would do it, just curious
Motor City Beach Bum
I’d say tests a pretty competitive package with the way Westburg has played this year. I will admit to being wrong in my assessment of him last year.
Motor City Beach Bum
Lost in all the talk about Flaherty is that the article says Brieske could get some turns in the rotation. He is good in the pen and maybe his stuff is not ideal for the rotation but he has done well when he has pitched as a starter. Nobody in AAA has looked that great this year and most have seemed to take a step back unfortunately (Madden, Montero).
tigerfan4ever
I wonder if it’s time to call up Manning once Flaherty is traded, to just truly see what he does have at the major league level. I am not sold on Brieske as part of the rotation going forward. Spot starter or opener, yes, but he’s a good long guy in the bullpen, something the Tigers don’t have other than him.
Motor City Beach Bum
Manning seems to have lost confidence and is struggling in AAA. They said that’s why Montero got the nod over him. I guess it one of those two or maybe Madden as the next man up?
tigerfan4ever
Madden isn’t doing all that great at Toledo either. Next man up might be the lesser of three “evils”.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Trade ’em all for pukes!
tigerfan4ever
I think you puked all over yourself, Stuperfife.
sabres3277
When you have a young number one starter with a great future you don’t trade him you extend him. I like Flaherty a lot but this years team is going nowhere so deal him and try to acquire a bat or two and I don’t mean some Double A or Triple A project, we need bats now. If you look at the lineup the Tigers put out every game there are very few that aren’t expendable. Canha, Urshela and a few bullpen pieces are likely to be moved and the position players that should stay are Greene, Carpenter and Keith. I would DFA Baez, send Malloy back to Toledo for more seasoning and bring back Tork and Meadows and play them the rest of the year and see if they have improved from there minor league assignments.
tigerfan4ever
sabres3277, I agree with your comment. However, it’s improved from *their* minor league assignments not *there*. Just me being nitpicky.
Motor City Beach Bum
You are bang on about Skubal and Flaherty. I’d be good if they resigned Flaherty in the offseason but trade him now for bats. I also agree re Tork and Meadows. Let them play and if they can’t cut it then those are just more spots to fill next year. I’m not sold on Meadows as a full time player. Malloy got his feet wet, bring up Jung and let him do the same as well. If they trade off Kelly then let Dingler get at bats too.
SportsFan0000
Scott Harris be bold and make franchise changing trades this trade deadline:
1) Tarik Skubal is the most valuable trade piece for teams seeking to go deep in the playoffs and to the World Series. Skyubal is a Cy Young
candidate who is a lock for the All Star Game.
I have read many, many teams are seriously interested in Tarik Skubal and would engage in a “bidding war” for his services. A team acquiring Skubal would get 2 1/2 years of Skubal until he becomes a free agent in ’27.
Skubal is not signing an extension, His agent is Boras.
It would take a number of top young prospects and players to get Skubal
The Orioles have serious interest in Skubal and a top farm system.
The Orioles have top rated prospects blocked by other former top rated prospects who are “breaking out as stars” in the majors.
SS/3B Jackson Holladay, C/1B Samuel Basallo, 3b/1B Coby Mayo. OF Heston Kjerstad, OF Enrique Bradford Jr.
AND major league ready starters Chayce McDermitt and Cade Povich
Put together a package of 4 or 5 of those players and it would be a “win-win” for both teams and the Tigers would be plugging numerous holes on their team at once.
It would take a number of top young prospects and players to get Skubal
The Dodgers have a very deep farm system and a very strong interest in a starting pitching upgrade because of injuries.
The Dodgers are specifically interested in Skubal.
Dodgers are also have shown interest in Garrett Crochet of the White Sox who is coming back from injuries and has never pitched a full season of innings and would be on an innings limit.
The Dodgers told the White Sox to pick whoever from their deep farm system and present them with a package since no one is off limits.
Skubal, if available, would be a better play for the Dodgers since he is stretched out as a starter with 2-3 years experience pitching more innings and higher workloads.
Dodgers have C/1B Dalton Rushing, OF Jose De Paula
starters Frasso, Ryan, Hurt Farris, SS Joendry Vargas and more.
The Tigers could surely put together a very competitive package with one of these teams or others who would jump into the bidding as soon as Skubal was made available.
Yankees have always like Skubal also.
Astros would be knocking at the door also.
A Skubal trade would be a major jumpstart of the Tigers rebuild and could make them a LEGITIMATE pennant contender in ’25 or ’26.
2) Jack Flaherty RHSP
He is pitcing back to form like he did with the Cardinals.
JF is still young and very effective.
He would be a rental, but the shortage of viable starters could
make him a valuable piece that would return 2 great young players/prospects.
Tigers and Harris should jump on making these two deals.
As the Tigers are playing and structured now, they are not a playoffs team. Even if they were to surprise and sneak in, they would be “one and out.
Their talent is not even on the same level as the Royals, Twins, Guardians, Orioles, Yankees etc…
Motor City Beach Bum
They would be foolish to trade Skubal because us fans would be pissed. If they did they better fill all their bedds (SS, C, big bat) with a package that blows not just Harris and Greenberg away, but the fans. No team is going to pay that except maybe the Dodgers…I am not all that impressed with what the Dodgers have to offer and much prefer what Arizona or even Atlanta might have in trade. Why would you even mention Jackson Holliday? No way they trade him.
Flaherty should be traded. And then they should circle back to him in the offseason because he is obviously comfortable in Detroit.
They are NOT that far behind the other AL Central teams. This was always meant to be a year to assess what they have for prospects and figure out where the gaps were. They told us that and have continued to tell us that. They are out if it now but next year have a good chance for the playoffs with a mix of good pitching and a core of young talent.
Rome wasn’t built in a day. Chill out.
SportsFan0000
Skubal is their “best play”.
Compare the Tigers lineup and Roster and you will find they are really not in the same talent level as most of the other playoffs teams.
They could be closer to that level with promotions from the minor leagues, more great Drafts and a few key trades like Skubal and Flaherty..
The Tigers would get hitting and pitching back in these deals.
And, the Tigers have some good looking pitching on the farm like Jackson Jobe, Ty Madden and others.
Go for it.
I doubt Skubal is a Tiger in ’26 or ’27.
Be a shame to miss a great opportunity to jump start their rebuild.
It Scott Harris and the Tigers get the right package of players and prospects for Skubal, then Tigers fans are smart and they will understand
The Saber-toothed Superfife
You didn’t mention Reece Olson.
Many of “we”, Tiger fans, don’t consider 16 games out of first place before the end of June, as being “close”……..
I just live in this fantasy land of negativity and have no grasp of reality……
(yep. I think that’s their best move)
The Saber-toothed Superfife
We is us and us is we.
tigerfan4ever
Your grasp of spelling is impeccable, Stuperfife. It’s R-E-E-S-E, you moron! Get that lobotomy. Your brain bleed is getting worse!
tigerfan4ever
Makes sense…..NOT!
tigerfan4ever
We is us and us is we?
Motor City Beach Bum
I didn’t say they were close this year, I said they are close to having a contending team. NO ONE is overcoming a 16 game deficit and with an offence that routinely gets 5 hits a night they are likely not overcoming a 7.5 game wild card deficit. Like I responded to YOU in this post previously “next year.”
Motor City Beach Bum
Here’s the issue. I AM a Tigers fan and I look at what they have and need every day. I am not a GM or knowledgeable enough that my opinion would count for anything more than a fans opinion. I’m tainted when I make some suggestions because I like the player (I.e. when I suggest getting Arozarena who is hitting .190). Baseball experts suggest the Tigers will NOT trade Skubal.
Their rebuild is nearing an end. A few hiccups this year with Tork, Meadows, Keith and some others not hitting well but hitting is down across the league and two of those players are rookies. Keith has come around, Malloy’s another rookie whose sample size is too small to judge by. That’s called growing pains. The team has auditioned young hitters all year which is what they said they would do. Next up are Jung and Dingler. Pitching wise Jobe is a stud and can slip into Flaherty’s spot if they dont resign him in the offseason, but the others in AAA including Madden have taken a step back this year. Most positions are spoken for and they will fill the others by trade or FA signing in the offseason. The rebuild is close to done. They are also building a sustainable minor league system to address future needs, like Houston or TB.
Not all of their young players will pan out but right now the only position that doesn’t have someone either in place or auditioning is SS. Should they trade their best pitcher to get a young SS and maybe fill another gap that they could just fill in the offseason? They can likely fill the SS position by trading Flaherty (get someone like Nacho Alvarez from Atlanta).
It would be stupid for them to trade Skubal. UNLESS someone blew them away and filled all their needs in one fell swoop. I can see some trades like that they could make but I highly doubt even the Dodgers are going to pay that price. It’s not happening.
SportsFan0000
Padres are also looking for starting pitching and still
have some gems in their farm system
1) Catcher Ethan Salas (will be a big leaguer before he is 20 years old)
2) LHSP Robbie Snelling
3) SS Leodalis De Vries (San Diego is a shortstop factory
they traded prospects Trey Turner and CJ Abrams)
4) Adam Mazur RHSP just promoted to big league rotation and is pitching well
And more
Motor City Beach Bum
I’m not sure on Mazur but the others you named are not playing well this year. Salas seems off limits in the estimation of most. I like Dylan Kesko more than a y other SD prospect bit hrs not having a good year either with all those walks.
The Tigers need a big bat, a SS and a young catcher (unless Dingler suddenly becomes Superman). Teams like Atlanta and Arizona have young players who fit the bill with the type of profile Harris/Greenberg look for. I’m sure other teams do as well, but not SD.
SportsFan0000
Padres and other teams have those players with either Campusano or Salas(catchers who hit well and play defense), SS DeVries, Robbie Snelling looks like a younger version of Skubal, Mazur or Waldron could slot right into the Tigers rotation.
SportsFan0000
Cubs also have a top farm system with many multiple top prospects enough to make a Skubal deal:
SS Roja, SS Cruz
RHSP Horton,
OF Caissie, OF Shaw
INF Moises Ballesteros
C/1B
And more than enough to match up with the Tigers in a Skubal deal.
Motor City Beach Bum
Personally I see SD as a poor fit in a trade with the Tigers and hope they don’t trade Skubal but your point is well taken that there would be a huge market and return for him if he were available. If they decide to do it I hope they target assets who fill needs and are close to contributing now as the primary pieces of the teade, now low level A ball players. Thanks for the chat. Cheers dude.
Motor City Beach Bum
Any team in baseball COULD make a competitive offer for Skubal and tick some boxes. The problem with prospects is they are unknowns. Look at Torkelson who was so highly rated and now back in the minors or Spencer Howard who is floating from team to team. It’s rare when a megadeal works out for a team…Soto to SD is an example of a trade return that has worked out very well so far and filled a lot of holes for Wash.
Like I said if the Tigers got a Soto to SD type return that filled holes and actually worked out no one would complain in the long term. But the Tigers are looking to compete NEXT year not in 3 or 4 years.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
As a fan, I would be into seeing former Tiger players succeed. I know most of you are not like that. I am.
I would love to see Olson pitch for the Dodgers vs Skubal for the Yankees in the World Series…..maybe see other Tigers (former) play in the World Series as well…..
Plus it’s OK with me for the players to make their money….
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Harris should be playing, “King Maker”, deciding who goes to the World Series.
Motor City Beach Bum
Or he could intelligently build up the team that hired him. Pretty sure that is the POBO’s job, not getting magic beans there Jack.
tigerfan4ever
Gahhhhhhh! That brain bleed has turned into a Stuperfife gusher. Such an idiot the toothless Saber wonder is!
SportsFan0000
Olson is not going anywhere.
He is a young pitcher with many years of control who will be on the Tigers next contending team.
The Saber-toothed Superfife
I still think of Breiske, Faedo and Vest as pitchers converted to relief roles through injuries curtailing activity, need and deference to other pitchers. All three of them could do well as starters?
Motor City Beach Bum
I think Vest is cemented in the bullpen and Faedo seems more of a maximum 5 inning guy, but better in shorter stints than that. Brieske I’d like to see get more innings as a starter, but he’s been great in the pen too. Maybe a Tyler Alexander role for Brieske?
SportsFan0000
I respectfully, disagree.
The Padres signed the top International Prospect the last two years
catcher Ethan Salas and SS Leodalis De Vries are foundational pieces of a contending team.
The Padres have a number of very good young starters one of who could immediately slot into the Tigers rotation.
Mazur or Waldron ( but may not be ready for a long playoffs run this year because of innings limitations).
Top pitching prospects RHSP Dylan Lesko and LHSP Robbie Snelling are also very interesting prospects with huge upside.
A package for Tarik Skubal headlined by Salas and/or DeVries
with Lesko and/or Snelling in the package and at least one of their major league rotation ready young pitchers like Mazur or Waldron to slot right into the Tigers present rotation is a the start of a very strong package for LHSP Tarik Skubal.
OR The Padres and the Tigers could pivot to a smaller deal sending
RHSP Jack Flaherty for promising young prospect (SS De Vries? and/or a young promising starter Mazur or Waldron?
The Padres know the Cardinals, their players, and Jack Flaherty and would really have interest in the still young Flaherty as a rental who could strongly consider a contact extension with the Padres.
That may be more palatable for the Padres and Tigers at this time.
SportsFan0000
Disagree in part.
Not any team in MLB could make a strong enough offer for Tarik Skubal.
Only a team with a very deep, “Top Ten” Farm system (or close to it) is likely to have the breath and depth of young talented players on their farm and major league club to bid on Skubal.
Teams in the bottom 15 of MLB farm systems are unlikely to have enough top rated talent to make a deal that would satisfy the Tigers for Skubal..
The further you get down the list the less talent those teams have available. And, their top prospects, very often, rate lower than teams with loaded farm systems.
Motor City Beach Bum
I agree and can see a fit with Flaherty there for sure. Dylan Lesko is a pitcher I really like, despite the issues with walks this year.
Devries and Salas are highly rated and fill a need in Detroit if they continue to develop, but they are both in the low minors, that’s why I don’t see a fit. The Tigers need players who can fill needs now, not 3-4 years from now. The Tigers are looking to compete next year (or so they say) and that type of trade wouldn’t accomplish that. Those players might help later but they’d have to go find some players to help now in the offseason.
I don’t want them to trade Skubal, but I look at someone like TB who are the masters of trading young pitchers and filling needs in the trade in irder to remain competitive, and Tampa would likely do just that. If the Tigers trade Skubal I would see them looking for players who can address needs now, mixed with some for the future. If they really do want to try and compete next year.
Motor City Beach Bum
Here’s one as an example. Number 26 ranked farm system is Atlanta. If they shipped Nacho Alvarez SS and Drake Baldwin C who are good defensively and offensively and the type of player Harris/Greenberg favor, along with the inured Michael Harris and Hurston Waldrep why would the Tigers say no. Maybe the Tigers have to ship back Canha, Perez or Meadows as well and that adds in another flier to the deal from Atlanta. Fills most of their needs with solid MLB ready players. Atlanta doesn’t have to just rely on their minor league system.
Other teams on the low end of the minor league rankings might actually match up to Detroits needs better than some at the top. Arizona is 16th, kind of in the middle, and I see them as a better fit than some others near the top.
84LeFlore
I agree with your sentiment Rome wasn’t built in a day as a metaphor for the Tigers.
Harris hasn’t even been on the job 2 years yet and people seem to think the Tigers should be contending right now. That’s not very critical thinking about a team with as many holes as the Tigers possess.
Fans have wanted the Tigers to bring up & play the kids, and that’s exactly what they’ve been doing – skillfully, IMO.
Rome was not built in a day, but we know at this point Riley is a keeper (and should be made a Tiger for life).. Kerry Carpenter is a keeper. Colt Keith is obviously a keeper and is slowly, steadily showing the potential that made the Tigers sign him.
I would add to the keeper list Vierling and Ibanez. Both have proven to be valuable bench pieces worth keeping.
I’d like to see Meadows come back up, but I think they’re just giving Baddoo a long, last look. I think Baddoo & McKinstry are dead men walking, as is Baez. Verdict is still way out on Tork.
While people moan about another year of the Tigers not contending, I wonder on what planet they thought they would compete this season. To me, this is the perfect time to give long auditions to Perez, J-Hen & Kreidler.
I would only trade Flaherty for a great return, otherwise, give him a qualifying offer in the offseason and collect a good draft pick. He will NOT re-sign with Tigers under Boras. I think we can get good value for Canha, Kelly & Urshela,
sabres3277
Well Wyatt Langford hit for the cycle last night and Max Clark is hurt again. I have had an issue with this since last years draft. The Tigers needed offense in the system and quickly and we passed on the college player Langford and took the high school player Clark. I understand Harris has a plan but to me this was a huge mistake and we will be talking about it for awhile.
Motor City Beach Bum
Still a long way to go to decide whether Clark was the right choice. I’ll admit I was campaigning for Langford last year during the draft but Clark’s potential has grown on me, as well as the fact that we got McGonigle with the savings. Time will tell.
sabres3277
Good point. But I thought Langford was a plug and play player and after a slow start he has showed it. Clark is at least two years away.
SportsFan0000
Like they passed on Shortstops Jordan Lawler and Marcelo Meyer
Motor City Beach Bum
They got Jobe the second ranked pitching prospect behind Skenes. Word is Mayer didn’t want to play in Detroit.
SportsFan0000
I am aware they picked up Jobe.
He looks good, but lets reevaluate when he pitches in the majors.
Lawler may be better than Mayer, only time will tell.
It is just that they wasted so many draft picks on starters that were going to be the next Verlander or Scherzer and many of them have not panned out as advertised.
The Tigers Front Office should have been “hedging their bets” and picking up impact position players along with pitching.
And, the Tigers need to, consistently, find talent in the later rounds and in the trade markets.
Motor City Beach Bum
They have had sone good luck in the later rounds with their draft pucks the past few years. Carpenter and Bigbie come to mind. Agree on previous SP picks and a need to focus more on position players. I was pretty impressed with their draft last year.
Hard to walk with four balls
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD TRADE SKUBAL!!!
It is time for him to go!
Motor City Beach Bum
You must be a Yankees fan or maybe Baltimore. No 😉
SportsFan0000
Or a Chris Farley fan lol!
tigerfan4ever
Hard to walk….read today’s MLBTR chat as there is a question about Skubal regarding the possibility of his being traded. I agree fully with the answer.
Motor City Beach Bum
I agree as well.
Hard to walk with four balls
his value is never going to be higher and a guy with two tommy johns under his belt is not a long term signing IMO
Time to cash in now.