Considering the Dodgers’ need for pitching, it isn’t surprising that L.A. was linked to White Sox righty Dylan Cease in trade rumors on multiple occasions this winter. There hasn’t been much in the way of new reporting on the Dodgers’ interest in Cease for over a month, however, and The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal writes that a trade may be less likely because the Dodgers have since fortified their rotation with other arms.
Yoshinobu Yamamoto’s twelve-year, $325MM contract was the big free agent strike, and Los Angeles swung a big trade with the Rays to land Tyler Glasnow and outfielder Manuel Margot. Yamamoto, Glasnow, and Walker Buehler now project as the top three starters in the L.A. rotation, with Bobby Miller as the fourth, and a collection of candidates (Ryan Yarbrough, Emmet Sheehan, Gavin Stone, Michael Grove) battling for the fifth starter job. Dustin May is expected to make a midseason return from elbow surgery, and a reunion with Clayton Kershaw remains a possibility even if Kershaw will also be sidelined until around the middle of the year as he recovers from shoulder surgery.
There’s still some room here for the Dodgers to further solidify things beyond a potential new contract with Kershaw, so a Cease trade can’t be entirely ruled out, even if may be less likely. It’s safe to assume that the Dodgers will continue to monitor the market for any bigger-name possibilities, yet Rosenthal writes that Los Angeles might now be “looking for future value” in any further trades, such as Thursday’s swap with the Cubs that saw the Dodgers acquire two teenage prospects in exchange for Michael Busch and Yency Almonte.
In one particularly novel scenario, Rosenthal reports that the Dodgers even considered acquiring Cease from the White Sox and then flipping him to a third team. The specifics of this arrangement aren’t clear, yet it would’ve been a fascinating way for both the Dodgers and White Sox to obtain some high-level young talent for Cease, in a mix-and-match of prospects each team might’ve had their eye on in the Dodgers’ organization or within the pipeline of whoever the third club involved might’ve been.
Busch was also part of some of the Dodgers’ offers for Cease, Rosenthal writes, so the young infielder might’ve found himself on the south side of Chicago rather than landing in Wrigleyville. Without knowing what the rest of this trade package to the White Sox might have included, it makes sense why the Sox might have not been too enthralled with Busch as a key piece. While Busch has been crushing minor league pitching, his defense is considered a weak point — if first base ends up being his ultimate position, the White Sox already have Andrew Vaughn in place.
It isn’t any secret that the White Sox have put a very high price tag on Cease, so while Busch is a top-100 type of prospect, the Sox might’ve viewed him as a secondary or even tertiary piece in an acceptable trade package. Several highly-regarded prospects have been reportedly on Chicago’s radar in trade talks, and USA Today’s Bob Nightengale adds Yankees pitching prospect Chase Hampton and Orioles outfielders Heston Kjerstad and Colton Cowser to the list of young players drawing interest from the Southsiders.
Since the Yankees just signed Marcus Stroman this week, they could perhaps be out on Cease, since naturally New York isn’t keen on the idea of moving Hampton or slugger Spencer Jones, who is also reportedly of interest to the White Sox in a Cease trade. Considering how the Yankees already dealt a lot of their younger pitching depth to the Padres to obtain Juan Soto, moving Hampton in particular might be something of a non-starter.
Kjerstad (the second overall pick of the 2020 draft) and Cowser (fifth overall in 2021) are two of the many up-and-comers in Baltimore’s loaded farm system, and both players made their Major League debuts this past season, though with only 110 combined plate appearances. The duo might well be lined up as the Orioles’ corner outfielders of the future, and it wouldn’t be a shock to see pending free agent Anthony Santander dealt at some point this season if either Kjertsad or Cowser prove themselves capable of being MLB regulars right away.
Of course, it’s not out of the question that the O’s might deal from their deep minor league pipeline at some point this offseason, perhaps to obtain a front-of-the-rotation pitcher like Cease. Baltimore might be more willing to come closer to Chicago’s asking price due to the sheer number of quality prospects the O’s have on hand, yet considering how many of those youngsters have barely reached the majors or even Triple-A, the Orioles might want more time to evaluate their options before deciding on who might be trade bait.
99CaptainJudge99
I’m sure the Yankees could match up well in a trade with the White Sox, if Chicago stopped insisting that Spencer Jones be part of the package back.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
It will take Jones or Dominguez plus Hampton plus a lesser player. Any team can match up with the White Sox if they just wanted scrubs.
martras
Spencer Jones straight up would be lopsided in favor of the White Sox. It won’t take a package. It’ll just take time until the White Sox come down to Earth on the price. Or the White Sox can just waste another year of him playing on the worst team in baseball.
RunDMC
They could wait until the Deadline, and if he pitches better than last year (97 ERA+, wasn’t even average), they could actually get their asking price.
martras
Cease would have to pitch to his potential, not just better than last year. We’re talking an ERA/FIP/xFIP all in the 2s. It’s possible, but equally possible, he has another down year and is then loses almost all his trade value.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Martras
Jones is roughly a top 75 prospect, no more and no less. The Dodgers or Reds could offer much more.
RunDMC
I wouldn’t expect him needing to pitch to his potential (like 2022). As long as his advance metrics are there (like 2023), every team will give him some grace playing on that team with that defense (unless it vastly improves).
MacGromit
@martras
A’s and Rockies take objection to your claim that the White Sox are the worst.
Smacky
A sub-800 ops out fielder?
roob
Wanna bet? They will get a haul for him.
Melchez17
Martas – Why? Is Spencer Jones the next Greg Bird?
misterb71
This sounds like another case of Yankee prospects being dramatically overvalued. Jones is very talented, but remains a strikeout machine before he’s even reached triple-A. Until he gets that aspect of his game under control or fixed outright he will require 2-3 more years of development to become a regular MLB outfielder. With Jones as the centerpiece of a deal the White Sox would be getting ripped off in a deal for Cease even if Cease pitches to league averages in ’24 & ’25.
Cardsfanatik redux
Yankee fans always believe they have the next Babe Ruth. One moron even suggested Jones is an overpay. lol. gtfo Cease would EASILY cost Jones ++ If I’m the Sox, I’m asking for Jones AND Dominguez and more, and we’ll go from there. And I’m not a White Sox fan. Yankees farm isn’t that good either. But no one tell them that.
99CaptainJudge99
Manny- let Cease go to the Reds or Dodgers then, no problem
99CaptainJudge99
Hopefully the Reds or Dodgers offer more and put all this nonsense to rest.
99CaptainJudge99
That’s all fine & dandy because Spencer Jones will never be offered for Dylan Cease, so no worries there.
Spotswood
RunDMC – the advanced analytic numbers for ’22 are the outlier. His ’23 numbers fell back more in line with his previous years which indicates that ’22 was the anomaly. Hard contact jumped, line drive % jumped, chase rate fell, value on his slider a monster drop off. Hitters didn’t go after his slider and hammered his fastball. K rate down, BB rate up. His fastball has dropped from 97.6 (’20) to 95.8 (’23). Early projections are out and they aren’t kind, 4.13 ERA/4.30 FIP.
richardc
@Spotswood – This is the precise reason I didn’t want the Braves trading for him. Plus, Cease has had one of the heaviest workloads the past few years, and it looks like it is starting to take a toll on his arm.
The Sox would be smart to take the best package they can get, before his stock drops even further or worse he succumbs to an injury.
Cease is a quality pitcher, but he isn’t an ACE on a playoff team, and that’s the type of return Getz has been demanding.
Reportedly, Getz asked for Grissom, AJ Smith-Shawver, and Hurston Waldrep…Heck NO!! lol
Just Rob
They’ll get 3 above average prospects and 1 filler. They’re not getting any mlb top 10 prospects, nor any counterparty’s best prospect. He’s just not worth it and is a depreciating asset to the Sox. Every other GM knows that and eventually the young GM Getz will accept that reality too.
PinstripedPride
Not for a player with his peripherals. He’s good but he’s not ace caliber. This isn’t Burnes we’re talking about. There’s a reason every single team has balked at Chicago’s asking price– it’s way too high.
avenger65
Metrics aside, Cease is an ace and would be on several teams. He just needs to get away from the Sox’ negative culture, work with an actual catcher so he doesn’t HAVE to call his own games, and not work with a pitching coach who is frankly out of ideas. People focus too much on last season instead of looking at his progress until then. A lot of top pitchers would have had a hard time pitching through all the turmoil that has been part of the team since 2021. I hope he goes to the Red Sox with Gio, but as long as he’s on a contender, that would take some of the sting out of him leaving.
nrd1138
Cease is not an Ace, not yet, if ever. The White Sox, and many of their fans, like to prop up guys by calling them Aces just like Giolito was an.. ahem… “Ace”. Aces do not get blown out of games by the 5th inning and have bloated ERAs to show for it, they do not walk 4 or more hitters in a game. An Ace’s ‘bad outing’ is about 4 runs earned, and they are rare (maybe twice to three times in a season). They also do not have mental lapses during an inning where maybe something happens to them or the defense, and they promptly give up 3 or more runs (to be fair the entire Sox rotation does that, probably because of their inept pitching coach). Cease also showed, at least right now, he cannot handle the big games as he folded in 2022 when they needed him to just be average (including his attempt at a no hitter). Could he be an Ace? Maybe, but Teams sure as hecka re not going to pony up for a guy who had about 3/4 of one good season, surrounded by a lot of mediocrity.
Unclemike1525
nrd- Good people can be found in any organization. I don’t know about any of those guys and quite frankly neither do you. They might be good they might suck but you have to at least see before you talk. The Sox have a chance to have a sneaky good rotation. Cease-Kopech-Soroka-Crochet-Fedde-Noah Schultz might be at worst decent. The pen is pretty weak but if Montgomery comes up, Nicky Lopez settles down 2nd base and Moncada and Vaughn show up there’s a lot of potential there. If Jimenez doesn’t stub his toe in the clubhouse and miss 5 months the offense might surprise and the Catching is pretty solid. Obviously there are a lot of if’s but that’s why they play the games. I have no faith in the Manager, They should of gone after the guy in Houston before Girfol. But I don’t see him being there long term anyway.
Unclemike1525
How is that Clown Boy? Way to put out a stupid statement with no defense at all. You’re a fool.
Unclemike1525
Give a 12 year old a computer………
Viveleempireevil
Lost us at “Cease is an ace”. No…he’s not.
Spotswood
Speaking of stupid statements and being a fool…
“The Sox have a chance to have a sneaky good rotation. Cease-Kopech-Soroka-Crochet-Fedde-Noah Schultz might be at worst decent.”
You obviously haven’t watched any White Sox games. Kopech is a mess. Even his decent ’22 year he was erratic. Crochet hasn’t thrown 65 IP since his soph year in college. Jr year he had arm issues. Then TJS with the Sox and then shut down last year because if shoulder issues. Ill bet your CDL that Touki throws twice as many innings as Crochet. Noah Schultz, are you huffing again? He threw 27 IP in A ball at 19. What world is he part of the rotation.
Montgomery is likely back at AA to start the season. Nicky Lopez…what? Moncada is part of the clubhouse issues. You should have kept going with those “it’s”… If Colas can turn into Juan Soto, if Wilkow can turn into Trout and Sean Burke can turn into Verlander.
Aiden Awe
Colson will start at triple A.
Spotswood
Nrd, I lean more to your thoughts on Cease. My biggest issue with Cease is that he throws too many pitches, Kinda like a Rich Harden, All the pitches and he doesn’t go deep into games and that’s always been his profile. Part of the role of an ace is to give to you 6-7 IP. Last year, 18 of his 33 starts ended after 5.1 IP. And only 2 starts went 7. Compare that to Steele 22 of his 30 starts went over 6.0. There’s no doubt that he has the stuff, but he tends to get in a lot of deep counts.
Spotswood
To clarify… “Last year, 18 of his 33 starts ended after 5.1”
Cease went 5.1 or fewer IP in 18 of his starts.
Spotswood
Aiden, I appreciate your continued optimism. It’s certainly possible Montgomery starts in Charlotte. No reason to rush him. Approx 150 PA’s weren’t nearly as dominating as he had been in A/A+. I’d think the smart thing to do would be to put him back at Birmingham, and if he is crushing it in mid May, you promote him. He’d still get nearly a full year in AAA and you go from there. All with the plan that he arrives in 2025.
drasco036
Ceases body of work does not suggest a regression, it suggest he had a bad head. So did Giolito and everyone else on the White Sox. I think it shows more that the staff didn’t game plan properly, plus outside of Robert, the defense was awful.
If you remember Steele early last year, he would waste a ton of pitches. He’d get ahead in counts and then try to wipe everyone out. He spoke with Jon Lester who convinced him to be more aggressive in the zone, trust his stuff to induce weak contact and his defense to make the plays behind him.
That is where I feel Cease should be. He has amazing stuff but like you said, he wastes pitches driving his pitch count up and then occasionally loses a guy like Snell and offers him a free pass. Cease is really a lot like Snell, some seasons the free passes don’t catch up to him (like this year for Snell) sometimes they do.
I’ve always been of the philosophy that the odds are always in the pitchers favors as long as you throw strikes. It’s a sport where the very best, elite, fail 70% of the time and you can really up their fail rate if you give them less chances (throw less pitches) bios are even lower than the 30% success rate. If you can ingrain that in a guys head, then the sky is the limit for them.
Aiden Awe
I hope the white Sox are at least somewhat exciting in 2025/2026. We hope:). Been a fan since 2016:(
martras
Not to mention Cease struggled even in the AL Central…
Unclemike1525
The group with the most potential on the White Sox is by far the Starters. Cease, Kopech and Crochet all have great arms. Schulttz isn’t far away. Unfortunately I have no faith at all in Katz. He’s horrible. Hopefully Bannister will upgrade that part of the Farm anyway. Kopech has head problems and just needs to work at his craft, Crochet just needs to be healthy. Fedde coming back from the Orient – Who knows ? I just meant I can see potential, Whether this manager and Pitching Coach can figure it out I have doubts. Should of hired Espada when they had the chance.
martras
@Unclemike1526. I’m not sure if this is just extreme optimism or absolutely delusional?
Kopech as a starter should be put to bed already. How many years of failure is needed? This is his age 28 season. Dominant reliever. Fringy starter.
Cease profiles as a #2 ceiling.
Crochet is a reliever, not a starter. He’s never been viewed as a full time starter. Not even at college.
Schultz? The guy is 19 and played in Low A. He certainly won’t be in MLB in 2024, and that’s far enough to be out of any kind of consideration as part of the “rotation” right now. By the time Schultz is ready for MLB action, Cease and Kopech will likely be free agents.
I mean… come on, man.
NYCityRiddler
Getz is a fool & a clown just like Hahn. Next! Ahahaha!
Unclemike1525
Getz has actually done a nice job of adding pieces that might make nice trade deadline trade pieces. And in that division they might be able to compete if a ton of things go right. Cease is good. Kopech finally grows up and pitches to his potential. Soroka makes it back. They stay relatively healthy. The list is endless. But at worst I think they acquire some more talent for the minors and they’re drafting high and can get more help there. Getz has done a nice job with basically no money.
nrd1138
I have no faith in Getz. Im also not impressed with him taking pieces from another miserable org (the Royals) and bringing them into this org like that is going to improve anything. However, to be fair, we all know who is pulling the strings in that org anyway.. The amazing ‘Chairman’ who destroyed this team in ’21 by stabbing Renteria in the back only to ruin their window to win and have to start this next rebuild. Getz is doing what he can based on limited resources. When he is able to make a big splash will be the ultimate test of this guy. Whether its getting players for Cease or a big FA signing.. and I mean legit big FA signing, not ‘big’ to the White Sox or most of their fan base.
Aiden Awe
A ton of things must go right for the Sox in 2024. Maybe clubhouse improves, some guys like AB(he does have a track record of being consistent) and especially LRJ needing a good season, less severe injuries throughout the year.
Aiden Awe
His resume is shaky at best. At least Getz has brought outside candidates, something RH or KW didn’t. His front office hires have been the best thing about him so far, just my opinion. We as fans don’t know what truly happens in a front office, all we do is judge and criticize the organization.
99CaptainJudge99
@Manny- It will not take either Jones, Dominguez or Hampton in any trade to land Dylan Cease. I see the Orioles aren’t trading Jackson Holiday for Cease and nor they should. Everson Pereira, Will Warren and Clarke Schmidt. That’s as good as it’s going to get for the White Sox, and they should consider themselves lucky getting that kind of package considering what a bad season Cease had last season.
sfu13
Pereira Warren and Schmidt, that package might get you Jesse Sholtens or Touki Toussaint.
Very Barry
I think Jones, Dominguez and Hampton with a couple of lower tier pitching prospects added in. Yankees system ain’t great. Got to have ALL three, or no deal.
Now, we can talk about replacing Dominguez in the deal ….. but you would then have to take back Benintendi, and his salary back.
99CaptainJudge99
@Very Barry- No Benintendi, no Moncada. The Yankees still have really good prospects. No Jones, no Dominguez, no Hampton. Let’s stop pretending Dylan Cease had a great year when he just didn’t. Everson Pereira, George Lombard, and Will Warren are all in the top 10 Yankees prospects though that can be had for Cease nothing more.
99CaptainJudge99
The White Sox are not getting Spencer Jones or Jasson Dominguez for Dylan Cease. When did Dylan Cease become Corbin Burnes all of a sudden? Smh. Pass on Cease.
Brettlez
Thing is,Yankees farm is overrated trash.
Bob Sacamano 310
This. If Dominguez, Jones, and Hampton are off the table, they can’t make a deal.
FunkyButtLovin
I mean who’s the last Yankee prospect to pan out? They are always overrated and their fanbase thinks they’re all top 100 prospects.
Rupert
There’s that Judge guy, but probably won’t pan out.
Joe says...
Neither will that Jordan Montgomery either.
rocky7
Hey Butt funny or whatever your name is….ever hear of Aaron Judge…..guess not….get your head out of you know where before commenting something as stupid….
99CaptainJudge99
Yeah where have you gone Jordan Montgomery? Oh yeah that’s right Joe, he was traded for a guy in a walking boot! Lolololololol!!!
Yankee Clipper
How is the Yankees farm system overrated? I mean, if you said Cashman overrated his prospects I’d completely agree. But I don’t see how their farm system is completely overrated. Overall, it’s a middling farm system and I’d agree.
Keep in mind, nearly every non-Yankees fan was saying the *exact same thing* regarding a Soto trade, yet Soto was traded for these “trash players” that nobody would ever want.
I think the anti-Yankees response is….to use your words….just as “moronic” many times.
Joel P
Yeah Padres fans were trashing the Yankees system and then the next day Soto was dealt to the Yankees.
Most teams have prospects they can trade and that includes the Yankees. It just comes down to whether they want to trade them or not
rocky7
Clip….the Yankee farm system, just like the big team are just the butt of every Yankee haters comments…….the farm system, while not top 10, is certainly not bottom 10….these idiots just like to crow…guess their mommas didn’t spank their butts growing up even though they needed it…..often……
towinagain
So the Padres traded a generational talent for midling prospects?
towinagain
It’s because MLB forced the Padres to trade Soto to the Yankees.
Yankees are the face of MLB, large market and needed a headliner.
Enter the Padres, using the excuse of Seidlers passing to justify shedding payroll and viola, there you have it.
I would have rather traded Sosto to the Dodgers over the Yankees anyday.
Joel P
Yes the Yankees had Judge and Cole but they needed a headliner lol.
And yeah the owner died Padres just making excuses lol.
Dude come on.
towinagain
The Yankees needed a left fielder, needed a major upgrade. Needed a left handed hitters.
Come on dude! Your own NY media was saying that all offseason.
Yanks didn’t want to pay for Bellinger but wanted to make a splash.
The NY media, in conjunction with MLB and an eager Padres ownership geared towards profits pushed for this trade.
They forced Soto out of town. NY was not the best fit prospect wise.
Yankee Clipper
Towinagain: I think you may have misunderstood my point. I believe the Farm System (meaning top to bottom) is middling. That doesn’t mean they don’t have excellent prospects, which they do, just not like some other teams, like the Dodgers, O’s, etc.
I want to clarify, however, that I do not feel Soto was obtained for middling players. Michael King is an excellent acquisition. If he succeeds as a SP and the Yankees don’t Re-sign Soto, I think you will see many people arguing that the Padres took the Yankees to the woodshed (because of the value of good SP) and they wouldn’t be wrong. Additionally, they received decent prospects.
Joel P
Nobody forced Soto out of town. It’s not a conspiracy. Padres didn’t want all prospects they are trying to compete in 2024 that’s why they wanted King.
towinagain
That’s a fair point. And I appreciate the fact the fact you dialogue Yankee Clipper.
Kudos my friend. I do hope this trade works for both parties.
Am I frustrated, yes.
As a Padres fan, the organization forced its way into respectability, put itself in the conversation with the Dodgers and then seemingly undid everything in one offseason.
Been a tough offseason.
MacGromit
@tow
“…because the MLB forced…”
I think your aluminum foil hat fell off, better get it back on before the aliens get you.
Come’on.
Yankee Clipper
Towinagain: I hear you, man. I get how tough this is for diehards and I know you’re one of those Pads diehards. I really feel for your fanbase because if PS were still alive, this offseason would be completely different.
It’s sad, but we Yankees fans understand your position (to some degree). When the Boss died and Hal took over, we saw the restrictions on spending, the business-over-winning mentality, and overall decline of the organization. I think Hal finally is starting to release that and has partially corrected it, thankfully.
As for the Pads….man, I hope they realize they don’t have to continue operating like this (restricted) and go for it again.
Joel P
I dont think ANYONE was going to be able to compete with the Dodgers and their offseason spending.
The Padres are certainly still respectable they just aren’t as good as the Dodgers.
Joel P
How many teams had a lower payroll than the Yankees and Padres in 2023?
Most of them.
Spending isn’t always the answer.
Brettlez
Yankees prospects are always overhyped because they’re in NY. A 60 grade prospect in their system is 50 grade in less hyped markets.
99CaptainJudge99
@Clipper- regardless these deadbeat delusional White Soxfans on here want 3 top prospects for a pitcher(Cease) coming off a lousy year, never going to happen. Pereira, Warren/Lombard and maybe Schmidt. It wouldn’t get any better for the White Sox then that truthfully. I would just rather the Yankees sign Monty or Snell instead. If Jones or Hampton is offered in a trade then I’m expecting Corbin Burnes back instead of Dylan Cease.
drasco036
The are certainly overrated by their fan base. They think any of their prospects in the top 100 are “untouchable” and teams should just take Yankee interests in one of their players as a privilege and a honor to their organization.
Yankee Clipper
Drasco: I agree with you there, but I don’t think that’s unique to the Yankees fanbase. I try to evaluate them objectively, but it’s very difficult when we have heard about these same prospects coming up and they have tantalizing potential (ie, Spencer Jones).
That said “our guys are better than your guys” will always be a thing when discussing trades. It’s also why almost no fan accurately predicts trade pieces…
I could see the Yanks doing a Jones-for-Cease if they feel they need the SP (hopefully they do realize this, but I doubt it). I do not see the Yankees doing a Jones- and Hampton-for-Cease because I know Brian Cashman. I also think that would be an overpay.
rondon
Every fan base overrates their team’s prospects.
99CaptainJudge99
What team doesn’t overrate or overhype their prospects?
drasco036
Cease fangraphs value over the past three years are 35 million, 35.5 million and 29.6 million. Cease has two years of control at 8 million next year, say, 15 million the year after, if he pitches a combined average of the past two years it’s 42 million in surplus value so you’re looking at 42 million plus two years of control of Cease. That’s going to cost.
The given rate of a 55 FV prospect is 42 million, meaning you’re giving up someone like Hampton or Jones for the surplus value plus in addition to a prospect(s) to make the trade happen.
Given that Jones and Hampton rank in the bottom third of the top 100, it’s going to cost both plus more to get the deal done. If you don’t like it, don’t ask about Cease.
I don’t know if people follow trades but the going rate for a 55 guy, which is Cease, is a 55+ in return and that’s for a year, add a year and then add 42 million surplus value, you’re giving up two 55’s and 2 50’s pretty much at a minimum
Spotswood
Drasco, I believe the key on the FV is the most recent number $29.5M. using that with his analytic numbers from ’23 there’s significant dropped off in several areas, and indicate potential issues. His early ’24 projections highlite that.
Spotswood
Drasco – to add, Cease would fit perfectly into the Cubs rotation considering his salary. What prospects package would you build to send to the White Sox for 2 years of Cease? Sox want an arm. Are you willing to start with Horton and Alcantara? And then adding in McGeary and Wiggins?
drasco036
Cease isn’t a perfect fit with the Cubs and I wouldn’t be interested in trading for him.
Horton no, Brown I would or Wicks.
Spotswood
The Cubs certainly need a #1/#2 to go with Steele. Why doesn’t Cease fit?
Cease is very affordable and if Cease truly is an ace, why wouldn’t you make the trade? That would allow Hoyer to spend on bats.
Again, Getz wants 2 top prospects (1 arm) and an additional 2 in the 10-20 range. And you appear to agree that is a reasonable ask.
drasco036
Easy, first, the Cubs have plenty of pitching as it is. Steele, Imanaga, Hendricks, Taillon, Wicks, Assad with Brown and Horton in AAA. Additionally they have Wesneski and Smyly for spot starts.
Second, the Cubs are not an Ace away, or a two away. For them to be that close, Imanaga will have to be a two that also negates the need for a two.
Third, Horton is close as it is and he has the same upside as Cease. If the Cubs wanted to be Uber aggressive, they could start the season with him in Wrigley if he puts up a strong spring.
If the Cubs were pushing all in this season like the Dodgers and Yankees then sure, I’d consider shipping prospects, if they were close like the Diamondbacks I would as well.
Fourth, the Cubs have money to “go after bats”. With the team they have, they really only need one to start the season.
Cubs still have 50 million or so to spend if they chose to do so, that is Bellinger plus Hader if they wanted to go crazy, it’s Chapman and Hader, it’s Hoskins, Robertson and Hader…
The Cubs needs are not on the mound, at least not in the rotation. Wicks is one of the top LH pitching prospects in the game, Assad has been fantastic for two seasons in a split role. Cubs will address pitching, if need be, at the deadline or next year when Hendricks is a free agent.
kylelohse
Typical moronic Yankee fan response for ole captain. We’ll make a trade but won’t give up any of the very small amount of prospects that actually have value. But Clint Frazier and Miguel Andujar are well worth your TOR starter with multiple years of control.
WiffleBall
You’re not wrong about typical Yankee fan responses. BUT, the Frazier/Andujar jab is actually not an example of that. I would argue that the biggest mistake Cashman ever made wasn’t trading for Stanton, or signing Jacoby Ellsbury — it was NOT trading Frazier and Andujar for Gerrit Cole after the 2017 season because they desperately needed a legitimate ace (admittedly Cole still hadn’t quite become that, but he was very close).
Both Frazier and Andujar were at the peak of their value, so I understand why he hesitated. But even at the time I was screaming for them to meet the Pirates’ demand of Andujar. Instead, they didn’t just miss out on two additional years of Cole, they lost him to the rival Astros, who beat them (with Cole) in 2019.
Salzilla
Agree on this. I think it’s Cashman who overvalued his system–or did, this offseason feels different–and has burnt us in the past, especially with Cole, not the fans.
We don’t rank the prospects, MLB does, so we go by that. If we have guys in the top 100, we treat them as such as would any other fanbase.
NYY will perpetually be villains to other fans from the FO, the team, to our “trash system”, to us the fans, nothing new. Folks here can’t even have a civil conversation without being mocked and berated a NYY fans.
drasco036
Then stop asking for Dylan Cease.
99CaptainJudge99
Stop pretending Dylan Cease is Corbin Burnes, he isn’t as good.
Fred Lingenfelser
Chicago would clearly rather have Andujar and Frazier, but they no longer play for the Yankees. Sad.
Yankee Clipper
Well, the Reds and Pirates wanted Frazier and Andujar for Castillo and Cole, respectively. Cashman declined on both. Obviously injuries cost these guys their professional success, but Andujar was legit at the ML level. His hitting was excellent.
I think the Frazier/Andujar trade proposals are so often misapplied based on a fundamental misunderstanding of how those two were brought up in the first place. It wasn’t the Yankees offering them for a trade, it was other teams demanding them in a trade.
dasit
i appreciate your efforts but the uninformed andujar/frazier/bird posts will never stop. they’re like death and taxes
99CaptainJudge99
Who Said Fred- I really don’t care what Chicago would rather have, give it a rest with your stupid, boring lame jokes that aren’t funny anymore.
tuck 2
Another in a long line of overhyped Yankee prospects that amount to nothing once traded
Yankee Clipper
How many prospects amount to something once traded? Not many…
Rob Schumann
The Yankees still have Jasson Dominguez MLB ready for CF. They are getting close to the point where it could be just one missing piece to finally get them back to the World Series. Jones is a great prospect but with Dominguez, Judge and you know they will give Soto a blank check if he lives up to expectations their OF is set for several years. Is 2 years of a solid #2 behind Cole worth their best prospect? Yep… The Dodgers spent over a billion dollars this offseason. Hal can’t get away with pinching pennies anymore with the Dodgers spending money like that. So, it’s either Cease or paying Snell or Monty. Personally, I would prefer Monty but Cease isn’t far behind.
99CaptainJudge99
I would definitely forget about Cease, especially with all these boneheads on here overrating the heck out of him. Monty apparently doesn’t want to play in New York, and the Yankees won’t give Snell 6 years for $180-185 million to sign him or whatever.
Yankee Clipper
Jim Riley of Ballcap Sports (for the record, he’s an avid Blue Jays fan) just went on a rant about how the expectations for Cease are far too high from both Getz and the fanbase.
I do take that into consideration because it’s more objective than I can be as a Yankees fan. He said Spencer Jones alone is an overpay, which seems valid considering his explanation.
Dogbone
So it says here, there was a report that the Dodgers considered acquiring Cease from the White Sox and then flipping him to another club.
What might that say about how Getz is perceived, by other GMs around the league.
dshires4
It might say a lot, or *gasp* nothing at all.
martras
Absolutely nothing.
iml12
Isn’t that basically a three team deal?
Dotnet22
A ménage?
I.M. Insane
Hey Brandon! I talked to Chris Getz. He’s into it!
NYCityRiddler
..and the roommates into it too
EatingReagan’sSkeleton
@nycriddler glad you asked your mom.
drasco036
The White Sox want guys closer to being ML ready, the Dodgers are willing to make trades like they did for Ferris who has a sky high ceiling but are still very far away.
Typically that is how three team trades work.
Aiden Awe
Sox should absolutely go for ML ready prospects.
DonOsbourne
I wish he would finally get traded. The speculation is getting ridiculous. He’s good, but he’s not THAT good. He’s going to be a #3 or 4 starter for most of the teams supposedly interested. That’s not franchise altering.
ASapsFables
LOL! Dylan Cease would be at least a #2 on most of the teams that have been connected to him this offseason including the Yankees and Orioles. With the recent trade of Chris Sale, Cease would slot in as their ace ahead of former White Sox rotation mate Lucas Giolito. If the Cubs were interested in re-acquiring Cease he would be a co-ace with Justin Steele. Cease would only slot in as a #3 or #4 with the Dodgers or Braves at this point of the offseason.
martras
Of 127 pitches who threw at least 100 innings last year, Cease ranked #92. On the edge of the bottom 1/4 of starters.
His xFIP of 4.08 was ranked 61st.
He did not pitch like a #2 last year for a competitive team, and that’s what teams are trying to get. A #1/#2 type of pitcher, with limited team control and a modestly high price.
He’s got upside, and that’s the only reason teams are willing to part with more than a couple mid-level prospects for him.
ASapsFables
Upside? He’s already got a great track record for durability not having missed a start due to injury since his White Sox MLB debut in July of 2019. He did have a tough year on a crap White sox team last season but finished #2 in the AL CYA race in 2022.
Cease just turned 28 two weeks ago and has 2 years of cheap arbitration eligibility remaining. Despite his regression last season tell all of us that Cease wouldn’t slot in #2 behind Gerrit Cole on the Yankees or be the Red Sox ace. Who’s the Cub starter slotting ahead of Cease aside from Justin Steele as we post? The Orioles had a couple of successful young SP’s last season but if they acquired Cease I’m guessing as a “veteran” he’d slot in no worse than #2 behind Kyle Bradish to start the 2024 season.
rondon
Except of course, when he’s on IR or having another off year… in which case he’d be a “#2” in a different context.
Zerbs63
He would be a 4 or 5 on the Dodgers
dshires4
Cease is 8th amongst all pitchers in cumulative WAR post-COVID shortened 2020. BELOW him on that list are names like Ohtani, Snell, Gallen, Luis Castillo, Bieber, Framber… So yeah Cease is pretty darn good.
RedFraggle
He had one amazing year which boosted those numbers.
dshires4
Do you even look at stats? 4.5, 4.4, 3.7… That’s not boosted by one season.
Fred Lingenfelser
You could say similar things about Blake Snell. Before 2023, you’d have to go back to 2018 for his last amazing season. Starters with any sort of decent track record are highly prized.
rocky7
And the bottom line is he’s coming off a bad year with no guarantees he’s the same guy as 22……reality is he’s a 12 WAR pitcher over 5 seasons…..he needs to prove all over again “he’s pretty good”! and the package his current team is asking for will keep him on a mediocre White Sox team for the next 2 years……
ASapsFables
“Reality is he’s a 12 WAR pitcher over 5 seasons.”, one of which was his midsummer debut in 2019 (14 starts) and the second being the shortened 2020 COVID season (12 starts). Every SP had reduced WAR in 2020.
Fact is, Cease has accumulated an 11.7 career bWAR with an 11.8 metric covering his last 3 seasons over an MLB leading 97 starts. That includes an AL leading 6.4 in 2022, besting AL CYA winner Justin Verlander (5.7).
ASapsFables
You claim Cease is “coming off a bad year with no guarantees he’s the same guy as 22”.
Cease’s bad still consisted of an AL leading 33 GS along with 214 SO’s in 177 IP’s. I’d call his 2023 a “down” season compared to 2022. He also had an MLB leading 17 no decisions in 2023, some of which can be attributed to a weak White Sox offense and diminished bullpen with closer Liam Hendriks missing most of the year.
What Cease did provide in 2023 certainly trumps most “bad” seasons including the production of any SP’s who couldn’t even take the ball much. Those would include both Carlos Rodon and Nestor Cortes who combined for 26 starts. I’m guessing the Yankees would have welcomed Cease’s numbers last year. They might have actually earned a wild card spot with Cease in their rotation.
Other team’s who were connected to Cease at last summer’s trade deadline or this offseason would have undoubtedly reached the postseason last year with him in their rotation. The NL Central Cubs and Reds come to mind.
iml12
Honestly, Eloy and Cease are the most over hyped players in mlb. It has to stem from the cubs trade.
mike127
IML——I think there is a ton of validity in what you say. I don’t think anyone would care about either or them as a package if the White Sox got them from the Padres or any other team not named “Cubs”.
A lot of Sox fans take a lot of pleasure in that “heist” for Jose Quintana and even are more happy about both those playoff wins (games, not series) in the six, now seven, now years since.
Yankee Clipper
I agree completely, Don. He performed to a #3 level last season (97), therefore he will be considered a 3 or 4. If we ignore last season in favor of his prior seasons we’d have to do the same for Rodon and Cortez, in which case Cease would still be a number 3, imho.
Cease has great potential to be a 2 or a 1, but I respectfully disagree that he is right now, in this context.
DonOsbourne
That’s exactly how I see it Clip.
rocky7
Cease is coming off a year that isn’t something to write home about and is a 12 WAR player after 5 seasons…..the While Sox did the same thing with Quintana several years ago when he was on the block…..advertising him as a bonafide #1 0r 2…..and where is Quintana now on the radar screen……
Simm
Plus his fell dropped last year which is never a good sign
Fred Lingenfelser
The White Sox as a whole had a terrible year last year. I would compare them to the Orioles in the year (I think it was 2018) when everything fell apart. I think a lot of individual pieces would have had much better seasons if they were on teams with a winning clubhouse culture. I would lump Cease in that group. So I think teams will in fact view him much higher than his 2023 stats showed.
Braves Butt-Head
I’m hoping he doesn’t get traded and he stays the next 2 years with the White Sox and they get nothing for him lol
King Floch
I could absolutely see a German Marquez-like ending to the Cease Saga if Getz stubbornly holds onto him past Opening Day in hopes of finding a more favorable market at the deadline.
Joel P
Flock you are just mad because your team needs a starter. Predicting injury to a player is kind of lame.
King Floch
The Orioles don’t “need” a starter though. We have 7 perfectly solid options for the OD rotation (Bradish, GrayRod, Means, Kremer, Wells, Irvin, and Hall) and a wave of promising pitching prospects that should start to arrive in 2024 (Povich, McDermott, and Johnson).
Cease (or another #3ish SP) is a luxury, not a necessity, which is why Mike Elias has not caved to Getz’s absurd asking price.
And I am not “predicting” anything, just pointing out the very real risk Getz is seemingly willing to take by not accepting reality.
Joel P
If the Orioles don’t need a starter then stop showing up in every Cease thread and putting Cease down.
He’s not a number 3 starter that’s ridiculous.
Is Jordan Montgomrry going to play in Japan next year? Is Cody Bellunger going to the KBO? Nope they sure aren’t. That’s reality.
King Floch
It’s a story involving my team, why wouldn’t I participate in the comments?
Also, there’s really no need to get this mad about it. You don’t have to keep sliding into my DMs like this if it upsets you this much, you know.
Joel P
Every thread involving Cease you act like he isn’t good when he is and tell everyone how great the Orioles pitching staff is. It’s like you think you are the one negotiating.
King Floch
You sure love strawmen, don’t you?
Joel P
Dude get a life
RedFraggle
Maybe “Bellunger” will
Unclemike1525
KingFloch- Joel is the biggest idiot here and has never won an internet argument with anybody. Ask him to back up his argument and you get a stupid statement like that. He’s 12.
Fred Lingenfelser
@Floch
O’s don’t need a pitcher, but I would say that at the upper levels (MLB and AAA), they don’t have many pitchers blocked, but have a lot of infielders and outfielders blocked. If I’m the Orioles, I’m looking to trade at least one of Santander, Mountcastle, or Hays, along with prospects for more pitching. At the MLB level, the core should be Mullins (CF), Adley (C), and Gunnar (3B) and Holliday is probably kicking on the door to be starting SS. So that leaves just 4 positions for a whole host of players, with DH being a rotating spot to keep Adley in the lineup. No way they can give adequate playing time to all of Kjerstad, Santander, Hays, Mountcastle, Westburg, Stowers, O’Hearn, Ortiz, Cowser, Norby….and on and on. The good news for the O’s is that all these guys are just about MLB ready, which should be enticing to teams in need of hitters.
Yankee Clipper
K. Floch: That’s an interesting analogy. I hadn’t thought about Marquez in quite a while, but Colorado did seem to take a similar approach. They weren’t committed to moving him and kept him until his value lowered and he was injured. I bet there’s an awful lot of teams glad they didn’t pay the asking price for him.
I completely understand why the WSox are asking for a lot of top talent – they’re looking at his potential and control. On the other hand, I would also balk at that asking price because his performance didn’t match his potential. Imho, they are overvaluing their ability to move him.
Joel P
Marquez got hurt. Was the Montas trade a bad idea because Montas got hurt? No not really that’s hindsight. It’s lame to use hindsight with injuries as a reason to say a trade was a bad one. And why would anyone predict Cease would get hurt? He’s been as healthy as anyone the last few years no injury concerns whatsoever.
Yankee Clipper
Joel, I think your points are valid, but that’s what makes the risk of keeping him so much greater for the White Sox. In other words, if they keep him and he does get injured (injuries for SP are obviously unpredictable), then his value drops like a rock and Chi-town doesn’t improve at all.
It’s the same type of mistake Brian Cashman made when evaluating Andujar & Frazier. He could’ve had Cole or Luis Castillo. It was a HUGE fail in retrospect. It’s not that the Sox are unreasonable; rather, it’s that this is an inherent risk when holding out for players to return to their peak form and setting the trade price accordingly.
Only history will tell us if the Sox are right or wrong if they hold out for their Cease price.
Joel P
I would bet anything Cease is traded before the season starts. There are loads and loads of free agents still out there. The offseason isn’t over not even close. Just because Cease hasn’t been traded yet doesn’t mean the White Sox are wrong or have made a mistake.
Cease could get hurt anyone could get hurt. But if he bounces back to his 2022 form his trade value will go up not down. So it’s not crazy to keep him until the deadline eventhough I don’t think that happens.
Yankee Clipper
Yeah, I agree with you completely, Joel. I’m not sure I see him being traded before the season starts, but I admittedly would not be the best gauge there, so I trust your instincts with that. I just don’t know enough about how Getz operates to make an educated guess.
Joel P
You could make a case for keeping Cease until mid season. And it’s possible thar happens.
I think we get impatient with the offseason sometimes. And some of it is probably justified there are a LOT of players left who haven’t signed. Hopefully things get moving here soon.
Simm
If he pitches like 22 sure his value goes up, if he pitchers like 23 his value goes down. Pretty simple math after a great year followed by a bad year. Hi value right now is in the middle. Sox want value of 22 right now and nobody is giving that.
Aiden Awe
Chris Getz clearly said he has no urgency to move him.
Aiden Awe
Yeah your right.
stripes46
If the White Sox cant get Spencer Jones then the Yankees wont get Dylan Cease!
Bobcastelliniscat
The Reds can make a better offer.
titanic struggle
But I’m glad they haven’t..
martras
But they won’t because they’re not that stupid.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Cease and desist
ctguy
Unfortunately for Cease, the White Sox may probably end up
keeping him.
King Floch
Yankees: “Okay”
LordD99
And the Yankees have decided that’s ok.
PinstripedPride
Where have I heard something similar? Oh yeah. “If the Padres don’t get Jasson Dominguez then the Yankees don’t get Juan Soto.” Pffft haha.
User 1413108128
I can’t count how many times I heard that about Jones or Dominguez in the Soto comments. Yet somehow they did get Soto without Spencer Jones or Dominguez. Hmmmm
Simm
Padres wanted pitching, so who knows if they pushed either of them.
dutchdestroyer
There could only be so many Dylan Cease rumours you would think. Guess not. My lord.
King Floch
I doubt that Mike Elias has any intention of trading Kjerstad or Cowser (both top 5 overall picks that he tanked so hard to acquire) for 2 years of a mid-rotation starter like Cease.
Sooner or later, Getz is going to have to accept that no one is going to meet his ridiculous asking price. The market has spoken and it said “call me back when you get serious, Chris.”
Joel P
Dude you are acting ridiculous. You aren’t the one negotiating here. Stop acting like Orioles prospects are great and Cease isnt.
King Floch
Cease is a solid mid-rotation starter and that certainly has value.
Just clearly not as much value as Chris Getz believes.
Joel P
Cease would instantly be the ace of the Orioles staff. The same Orioles that got bounced in the first round last year
King Floch
Cease isn’t an ace.
Deal with it.
Joel P
He would be the Orioles ace.
King Floch
No, that’s Kyle Bradish.
Cease would slot in behind him.
MacGromit
@Joel
Come on, Cease and Bradish have the same number of great years. One. Cease’s most recent season was lackluster.
“Instantly be the ace” might be a bit of hyperbole. “Arguably be the ace” would be more appropriate.
If Elias is overvaluing his prospects, explain other teams not taking Getz up on his amazing ask? The reported ask from the Reds included the GM’s firstborn and family dog too.
We’ll see how this works out, but my guess is that Cease doesn’t Garner a single vote for the Cy Young next year and that Bradish does.
I don’t disagree with you that the O’s would be well served to sign a SP with a higher floor (please other than Paxton) but the current ask from the WS is too rich for my tastes for Mr Mustache.
Joel P
Bradish has 1 good season on his resume. He might be really good in 2024 but a contending team wouldn’t call him their ace.
What is the current ask for Cease? You don’t know you have no idea. Obviously the White Sox are asking for more than a team has been willing to give at this point but that doesn’t mean it’s too much. There are loads of free agents left who have yet to sign. The season isn’t starting tomorrow.
RedFraggle
Kyle Bradish is better. GRod is possibly better.
kwolf68
You have no real idea what the ask is. No one does. It’s all BS. And it’s also mid January, Cease can be traded at any point over the next 6 months. As teams find their pitching staff is wanting or injuries creep in as division desires fade away Cease’s value may actually INCREASE, at least initially. Getz has no reason to take a piddly offer at this time.
King Floch
“You have no real idea what the ask is.”
Well, we have the reported ask from the Reds, which was obviously silly and unrealistic, and the fact that pretty much every team that has been reported to have interest in trading for Cease has since pivoted to other SP options.
Some reasonable inferences can definitely be made from those data points.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Floch-king
bad take.
Getz probably is not thought highly of as you suggest.
Not having traded Cease yet is not an indicator of that. I am sure he has to run such a deal by ownership and they are waiting for the right offer. They hold the cards right now.
Nor do I agree with the poster who thinks that Fodgers might have traded for Cease and flipped him means anything. Dodgers could have top prospects who are pitchers and catchers and White Sox could want infielders or outfielders so involving three teams is not an indication of Getz’ shortcomings even though they may independently exist.
King Floch
I am not entirely sure how your response relates to my post, Manny.
MLB Top 100 Commenter
My first two paragraphs respond to you and the last one to dogbone.
Getz is not impressive nor is his owner.
But it is fully logical for Getz to have waited for the right offer, they have no hurry, once Snell and Monty sign the time may be ripe to pull the trigger, Cease will get (Getz) a good return.
Motor City Beach Bum
Baltimore overvalues their prospects. Between Kjerstad and Cowser I’m betting one flops and the other is a solid regular at best. Cowser did not look great last year during his callup. When I look at who I’d want my Tigers to ask for from Baltimore in a hypothetical trade for Skubal (which is never going to happen hopefully), neither one of their names stand out to me. Cease was a Cy Young candidate in 2022 and had a middling year in 2023. He is still at least a #2 or 3 on a good team.
King Floch
“Baltimore overvalues their prospects.”
And so does everyone else apparently, since no GM has been willing to give Getz what he is asking for to this point.
Motor City Beach Bum
Very true. The Reds are guilty of that, along with the Yankees and others, although the Yanks went ahead and dumped a bunch of young arms to SD for Soto. The price for Cease sounds like it is too high, but if you want the person you think is the right player then it costs what it costs. If Baltimore pulls the trigger on a trade or signing for a solid starter I see them in the World Series. If not, they can hook up with the Dodgers on the golf course 😉
King Floch
“Guilty” is an odd choice of words for GMs not intentionally damaging their talent pipeline by drastically overpaying for a flawed player.
Motor City Beach Bum
Floch…A) How is Cease flawed? Last year at this time everyone was talking about him as a potential Cy Young winner in 2023. He had a bad year, that doesn’t make him flawed. B) How are they damaging their pipeline by trading off extra infielders who have no spot to play? Sounds like what a GM is supposed to do. Fill holes n your lineup by trading your surplus.
RedFraggle
Trout was awful his first year as well.
Motor City Beach Bum
Yes Trout and Cowser there’s a good comparison.
King Floch
It wasn’t really a comparison per se, more just pointing out that even future HOFs sometimes need some time to adjust to the MLB level, so using Cowser’s SSS from his 2023 debut to make any meaningful pronouncements about his future is kind of silly.
Joel P
Even if Cowser ends up being good where does he play? Kjerstad, Fabian, Bradfield, Beavers where do all these guys play?
King Floch
You asked this the other day and the answer is the same now as it was then- Cowser is the Orioles LF of the future.
Joel P
Beavers and Bradfield are both former first round picks. Kjerstad is really good. Fabian has a lot of talent.
These guys all don’t fit on the same team.
King Floch
And some of them will eventually be traded, just probably not Cowser or Kjerstad since those were 2 of the big prizes for the years of tanking.
Beavers is a guy I have included in a bunch of proposals for Cease BTW.
Joel P
Ortiz, Norby, Beavers and Fabian. Perhaps add a pitcher and take Norby out. The White Sox could use the depth so I dont think the Orioles would have to trade away their top top prospects.
King Floch
That is actually pretty similar to some packages I have proposed here. I’m not sure if he is actually available (he should be IMO) but Westburg is another guy I would be willing to discuss in relation to Cease if I was in charge. I think he is an absolute stud but Gunnar, Holliday, and Mayo are probably our OD 2025 infield so Westburg is theoretically expendable.
King Floch
I wasn’t a huge fan of it at the time (or now, obviously) but the Flaherty move itself was fine in theory since Elias & Co. have put together a solid track record of fixing pitchers, it just didn’t work out. It happens.
And there would still be a place on the team for Westburg even with Gunnar, Holliday, and Mayo as the starters because he is versatile enough to play all of the infield positions plus corner OF. He could basically be a non-switch hitting version of Ben Zobrist for us where he has no real set everyday position but still gets ~500 ABs a year.
But if he can get us a solid SP with more than 1 year of control that would clearly slot in ahead of Kremer and Means, that’s fine too.
178iq
Yankees still need a pitcher. And a couple of infielders that can hit and get on base. The Yankees were not able to score runs last season right now it’s gonna be exactly the same situation. No bass runners Soto.or AJ.
Slider_withcheese
The White Sox need to move this guy before the start of the season. Granted, they still have the trade deadline and all next offseason to deal him, but they aren’t going anywhere with him. Why risk injury or a drop in his performance? His value is as high as it’s ever going to be.
Go Go Power Rangers
I think his value would be higher if he bounces back and is flipped at the deadline. But either way, their asking price is and will be too high.
Slider_withcheese
Waiting until the deadline limits the prospective teams. That’s always been my view. I think teams get more and can maximize the return having a bigger pool to swim in during the off-season, no?
Go Go Power Rangers
I don’t necessarily disagree but in this instance I think last season’s performance has a lot to do with teams even coming near their asking price. That and the asking price itself lol.
westcasey
I lean toward your opinion. Ceases value at peak now, 2 years at reasonable salary and several teams in search for solid #3 ish SP.
there are a few options out there but not with his combination of cost, talent and potential.
but ChiSox need to be less ridiculous in their asking, though it is their choice to ask for all they can get. Teams are not giving up 4 MLB -ready or near ready guys for 2 years of Cease. Those teams need some of those guys.
Sox have to accept bottoming out in 2024 and develop from there.
Balt, Cinci stand out as best match due to their variety and depth of prospects.
Probably making up Sox mind on time frame of next contention stretch is key.
Then , if 4 is magic number of players, their ETA can be spaced appropriately.
rocky7
My answer to the White Sox, would be one word….Quintana….who they exhaustingly trumpeted as an Ace when he was on the block several years ago…..where is he now…….the package they’re asking for, regardless of which team is ridiculous……keep him……..
MLB Top 100 Commenter
West Casey
Note the difference in meaning between “Cease’s value” and “ceases value”
avenger65
True. What would be the point of an ace like Cease pitching for a 100+ loss team? Someone with his ability shouldn’t be wasting it on what will turn out to be the worst AA team in history. He needs to pitch for a contender. Another season with the Sox might drive him insane.
nrd1138
The problem here is you consider him an Ace. He may well be on this roster, but by name only as the rest of the rotation is a joke. Cease, as he sits now is maybe a #2 on another rotation, and its fairly clear that, currently, he has a hard time with pressure situations, which real aces typically thrive on. Could he get better? Sure, but teams are not selling their farms for a guy who has been on a major league roster for 5 seasons and has had 3/4 of one great season in his career. Teams see this, and they know it. They also know the Sox are over a barrel as its clear they are rebuilding and not going to want Cease on the roster for much longer especially since Slider pitchers tend to watch their elbow go ‘boom’.
Aiden Awe
I hate seeing the Sox in another retool… rebuild… re whatever. Same thing. LRJ could still be on the next decent sox team.
Aiden Awe
The farm system would jump to maybe 15-17 depending on the offer. But they aren’t urgent to move him whatsoever.
Aiden Awe
They aren’t urgent to move him.
178iq
The price tag to trade for him is too steep so the Yankees are out. A trade is the only way they’re going to acquire anybody no one wants to sign with the Yankees a combination of lack of desire to play for New York and New York. Not willing to pay anybody anymore, New York’s main goal is to sell tickets and merchandise and hope to make the playoffs, but they play Moneyball still other teams are now playing baseball
The real Oscar Gamble
Tool bag
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
Why don’t the Dodgers buy the whole league?
Take the players they want to create a Mega Team and then give the excess back to the Peasants
Joel P
Maybe the Orioles should give back all their prospects they “earned” for being terrible for years.
Lefty_Orioles_Fan
Well, when was the last time they put into the Revenue Share?
avenger65
Joel P: At least they were smart enough to acquire top prospects. Just look at where they are now. A WS contender and a farm system loaded with major league-caliber players.
Joel P
Hey I like what the Orioles have done to rebuild the team. But there is a next step that’s needed and that’s spend money to supplement the prospects. Or in the Orioles case trade some prospects because there isn’t room for all of them. And they refuse to take that next step.
cencal
Hoping Kershaw finds his way back to LA and gets the 3000 strikeouts on the mound in Dodger stadium.
Another WS be great as well as a good way for the HOFer and overall good man to go out
James Midway
Rosenthal would mess himself if this actually happened.
RSmith
Hard Pass: Cost outweigh Production.
White Sox want Fort Knox for 4.58 ERA, 1.418 Whip, 4.0 BB/9,
14 WPs. Yes, Im ignoring a few good stats, but those are pretty bad stats for a guy you only have for one year.
The price in hopes of a bounce back year are just too great.
King Floch
Cease’s FIP was 3.72 last year, so some positive regression should be expected if he goes to a team that is better than the White Sox defensively.
That still doesn’t make him worth 3 top 75 prospects (and another decent prospect or two) though, which is what Getz reportedly asked for from the Reds.
Ra
Didn’t happen for Kyle Gibson so no reason to expect it with Cease. Gibson’s ERA was close to a run higher than fip in both 2022 with crappy defense Phillies just like it was in 2023 with Baltimore. A mirage is created by excluding 80% of data points.
kwolf68
What is Fort Knox they are asking for?
Spencer Jones is Fort Knox? You mean a kid with a 30% K rate in A ball is Fort Knox? That Fort Knox? Did someone steal all the gold.
The ask of Jones + is very reasonable. If the Yankees wish to not part with Jones that’s well within their rights and the teams should just move on. If the White Sox are willing to take a player in A ball with certain hit tool questions as the primary piece for Dylan Cease then I think they are actually being quite reasonable.
It’s just fans either don’t understand true market value or they just hope they can get a guy like Dylan Cease for total trash. Which is, or should not, happen.
RSmith
Chill dude. It was an expression.
Take a walk outside
slider32
I think the Yanks are done with the price for Cease, Jones could be a starter for them next year along with the Martian. Both could be stars. The Yanks are going to build up a super pen which is what all contenders do now. The Dodgers, Braves, and Phillies rely on their pens. I think they add Neris and Peralta.
rocky7
Cease is a 12 WAR player after 5 seasons, the most recent of which wasn’t something to write home about…..this is just the White Sox playing their games again trumpeting a player, who while might be the ACE they keep talking about, might not be…….in reality they did the same thing with Quintana and lets see where he ranks 4-5 years down the line…….
kwolf68
Spencer Jones is not starting for them next year. He had a 30% K rate in A ball. How the hell do you surmise he can survive 3 levels higher. Do people actually know to look up the very basic stats here or are they just using the force.
leftcoaster
The Dodgers do whatever they want to do and control the market. They’re the Godfathers of MLB. Leave the prospect, take Cease.
norcalblue
Interesting article that points to some real reporting by Rosenthal and the Athletic.
That the Dodgers were hoping to turn Busch (and other prospects) into something more substantial in a three way deal is not surprising. Unlike MLBTR, Rosenthal has first hand sources and the Athletic is not a rumor site—real information direct from actual sources is being shared there.
What seems clear and has been clear for months, based upon the rumors planted here, is that Cease is being actively shopped and the price has been TOO HIGH for any number of teams pursuing starting pitching. WS are going to have to drop their price or start the season with Cease in their rotation AND take less for him at the deadline. Unless the guy turns his metrics around, Cease will have far less value in mid summer than now. Several teams (Orioles, Giants, Yankees) would pay a fair price for him now. I still believe WS will trade him before season starts —just not for the ridiculous return they have been seeking.
BlueSkies_LA
I can’t see the logic behind this talk of the Dodgers trading for more starting pitching. They’re in an excellent position to evaluate their rotation options again in July. They don’t have to make any further moves now.
norcalblue
Rosenthal’s reporting provides excellent analysis and additional information on why Cease (and Luzardo) are perfect fits for teams like the Orioles and Reds now—-not so much in July. The White Sox should really take advantage of the market as best they can now. If they wait much longer, the return is going to be less robust, not more.
rememberthecoop
Yes, it’s about time Elias trades for, or signs, a top of the rotation piece. It’s actually past time to do that.
King Floch
Is it though? The team led the AL in wins last year.
Also, Bradish and GrayRod both look the part of a TOR SP right now. I’m not sure that Cease would outperform either of those guys in 2024.
LambchoP
Twins will give you Polanco and a prospect for Cease, we could sure use more starting pitching:)
kwolf68
White Sox are not going to do that. They have no use for Polanco, they want to use Cease to restock the farm with 3 or 4 prospects, not to take a guy from the Twins they really don’t even want anyway.
LambchoP
Would much rather have Luzardo though. Give Miami Brooks Lee and get it done!
Motor City Beach Bum
Twins are well on their way to a 2nd place finish behind the Tigers with their inactivity so far this offseason.
SupremeZeus
Michael Busch dodged a bullet.
Gumby82
Of course Farhan and the extremely rich Giants are nowhere to be found on this
mostlytoasty
It’s always telling when defenders of a particular player rely more on stats from several years ago than the most recent season. The White Sox are not going to get the price they’re demanding for Cease because Cease wasn’t particularly good last year. YES, the upside is absolutely there, and I think a change of scenery out of CWS will do most players well… but unless they hold onto him and let his value rebound with a strong 2024 start, he’s not going to get three top 100 prospects right now. It’s just laughable. That’s why he hasn’t been traded so far.
And of course, they’ll need to balance out how much value he loses after teams are no longer getting a full season out of him for ‘24. If they believe in him rebounding though, I’d hold onto him through until the TDL and try to extract some extra value from a desperate team.
DrCox
I’m not as high as others on Cease. Imo he isn’t the #2 that the Yankees are looking for….
kwolf68
#2s all all over the market, should be easy to get one of them.
DrCox
They have to sign Snell or trade for Burnes to get a co #1. And as long as Biebers Velo remains between 91-92 mph, he won’t be an Ace again.
DrCox
They should have signed Yamamoto, even for 12/380.
Red Shift 10K
The Sox should be in no rush to move Cease, he’s being undervalued right now in most of the reported trade packages. They’re not going anywhere with or without him and they suck at developing prospects. Might as well wait for the right deal.
King Floch
The White Sox could get a very nice package of young talent for Cease right now, but there is no guarantee that he stays healthy and performs well enough to be worth more than that at a later date.
If Getz doesn’t lower his asking price to a more reasonable level, and he goes into 2024 with Cease still in Chicago and he gets injured or has another mediocre season and his value drops below what is available right now, Chris’ stay in the GM chair will likely be short-lived.
Aiden Awe
Who knows how long Chris Getz stays as GM.
Ra
Exactly which “reported trade packages” undervalue Cease? Rhett Lowder, Chase Petty, Connor Phillips, Edwin Arroyo and an unnamed prospect? What others have been reported, not speculated?
dankyank
Getz’s mandate seems to be rebuilding as fast as possible, which involves importing prospects through trades instead of also fixing the broken player development program. Even if Cease wasn’t coming off a down year the asking price would still be excessive.
A number of the flip candidates they’ve signed such as Chris Flexen and Paul DeJong are lousy gambles. Others players like Lenyn Garcia and Romy Gonzalez have shown nothing to warrant a spot on the 40 man roster.
There’s so much more Getz could be doing around the margins to meaningfully advance the rebuild, but won’t because he’s an ownership loyalist.
PinstripedPride
I want Snell and still do, but if this is the asking price, it’s no wonder that nobody has signed him. The Yankees offered 5 years/$150 million, which I think is definitely reasonable, but this…. wow.
msn.com/en-us/sports/mlb/blake-snell-s-270-million…
King Floch
$270 million for Blake Snell, I’ll have some of what Boras is having lol.
DrCox
I think the Yankees would offer him 7 years at most. How many times did he pitch in 150+ Innings?
99CaptainJudge99
Snell would be lucky to even get 6 years from the Yankees. I could see him getting an opt out after 3 years though. I feel $180-185 million for 6 years is definitely fair for Blake Snell.
Moneyballer
White Sox should take the Orioles seriously as they have the young guns to make it happen. This could be a great trade for chicago if baltimore decides to make the move!
Atloriolesfan
The Os will make a move as soon as Getz realizes he isn’t getting Mayo, Holliday, or Basallo or both Cowser and Kjerstad. Maybe one of the OFs, Ortiz or Norby, plus a better pitching prospect than anyone the Chisox have and Chicago would have to add a CB pick.
CluHaywood
So many bad takes on here. Cease isn’t moving anywhere without a top 5 organizational prospect, a top 3 organization pitching prospect and at least 1 more low A player.
Everyone saying the Sox need to lower the price tag…Why? He is a 28 year old, with 2 years remaining, who misses a ton of bats and doesn’t miss starts. That affords the trading team some leverage. Saw a comment about the Yankees signing Snell to a 7 year deal. Did you not learn anything with Rodon? Also, the overevaluation of prospects is insane. Especially in baseball. Bottomline, if you can trade from a position of surplus to acquire a position of need, do it. If it gets you a WS, or extended years of a playoff run, then it was worth it.
As for the multitude of O’s fans not believing Cease would be an upgrade, you are very much wrong. You are adding a guy who will K 200 batters, saving some defensive workload, and go 200 innings, which will help your RP workload.
The market for SP was completely saturated to start, but there are still bigger names that haven’t signed. Some of those players like Snell would be a complete torpedo financially to some of these clubs like Atlanta or Baltimore. It’d make more sense to get a comparable pitcher, albeit not as experienced, as Snell in Cease for a return you can live with.
Ra
“Top 5 organizational prospects” are not comparable across organizations, so that is a foolish way of speculating what makes a valid trade.
As for why Getz needs to come down in value to make a trade is that he has an expiring asset whose only difference to the team is whether it loses 95 games this year or 90. In other words, he helps the team more by being traded than by staying.
You do realize Cease has never thrown 200 IPs, right? Or maybe you don’t.
Cease is not a comp for Snell. LMFAO!
I think you got the market cornered on “bad takes” here.
nrd1138
I have little faith in Getz. I just see this blowing up in his face. I get they want good prospects for Cease, but teams are not fooled.. In Cease’s time up in the majors he had about 3/4 of one good season, and a lot of mediocre or average for the rest. Teams are not selling their farm system for that. What i would like to see, and it will not be clear probably for at least 1 season or two, is how the prospects he got in trades already done pan out. What I would like to see is some of these fringe guys develop into good players. That is what separates the good from the bad systems. Anyone can trade their high priced talent for a bunch of ‘cant miss’ prospects (many of which do miss or are only average). I want to see the org hit on the fringe players they get, and the lower draft picks they select.
I just worry about Getz ego (or maybe its ‘the Chairman’s’) trying to get the best and not moving him before pitchers report and watching Cease blow out his arm for TJS and the Sox getting nothing for him. Yeah, I know Cease already had TJS, but we have now seen pitchers getting two ligament swaps to their elbow , and in some what short order. The Slider is wicked, its also wicked to what it does to the elbow.
BaseballClassic1985
White Cox asking for the moon for Dylan Cease lolz Gen Z thinks he’s worth 4 top prospects because he has a “cool” mustache
msqboxer
As long as he stays healthy having Martin Maldonado behind the plate will make Cease that much better. If a team waits until the trade deadline they will be competing with everyone else all over again..unlike currently some teams have backed off thinking they are ok.
kwolf68
It’s really sad reading these comments:
-No way should the Yankees deal Jones for Cease. Cease was bad last year. NEVERMIND Jones has played exactly ZERO games above A ball and has a 30% strike out rate. If people are gonna hold Cease’s poor ERA over the White Sox, then why can’t the White Sox hold Jones’ poor K rate over them? Is Jones a good prospect? Absolutely. Is Cease a fantastic MLB starting pitcher? Absolutely. Both have some drawbacks, both have good upside, but Cease at least has made it past A ball and nearly won a Cy Young.
-Orioles would never trade a package including Cowser or Povich. No way. Except Cower also has elevated K rates and was bad in his SSS time in Baltimore. Povich had a +5 ERA in AAA. Are Cowser and Povich good prospects? Damn right they are, but the White Sox can easily point to their numbers and downgrade them.
If you insist on ignoring basically everything that Cease CAN provide a team and focus on his uneven 2023 where his ERA was inflated then you can’t ignore the inherent flaws in your own prospects. I have not see the White Sox ask for Jackson Holliday, Jackson Chourio type prospects here. They are asking for very good prospects (Cowser, Norby, Jones, Hampton), but certainly not prospects that are generational can’t miss guys.
I get why the Yankees want to keep Jones, IF (BIG IF) he figures out his hit tool the power is insane and the speed is good. But I can also see why asking for Jones is NOT UNREASAONBLE for the White Sox as they are not getting a proven player in the least here. And the Yankees are not going to get a SP-3+ upside arm who is 27 years old who is DURABLE for a bunch of filler and fluff, an intriguing upside prospect with certain flaws (Jones) is well within the ask and anything less would be unreasonable for the White Sox to consider.
Ra
You did not read that the WS asked for Jackson Holliday in return for Cease at the deadline last year? You must be new to MLBTR.
Also, how do you know Getz has asked for Cowser or Norby? Those names have not been reported. Norby hasn’t even been speculated, though he makes sense. Are you an “insider?” lol
acoss13
Cease will probably get traded at the trade deadline with the way things are going. If Cease is putting up good numbers, I think he gets a decent package back.
sfu13
The price on Dylan Cease is whatever the White Sox say it is because they are in charge of the desired asset, and the other teams are free to either counter offer or walk. Bitter fans of other teams keep saying to me “well then you can keep him”, and I’m like ” um okay? Is that a bad thing?” He’s one of the best pitchers in baseball with absolutely filthy stuff and I love watching him pitch so I have no qualms if the White Sox keep him, possibly extend him or get a free draft pick when he leaves. Better than trading him for some of the junk I’m reading on here. As I said in another thread, Heston Kjerstad is an overrated bust waiting to happen, so Baltimore can keep him.
sfu13
As an addendum, I hope they don’t trade with the Yankees because I don’t want any of their overrated crap either. I remember “top prospects” like Jeff Gray,Blake Rutherford, and Ian Clarkin. No thank you. Hard pass.
King Floch
Cease’s value is whatever the market deems it to be and it has deemed it to be far less than what Chris Getz believes it to be.
Like, I can declare that the half-eaten turkey sandwich from my lunch is worth a million dollars, that doesn’t mean I’m going to get a million dollars for it.
sfu13
How do you know what the market deemed it to be Nostradamus? Nobody knows what Chris getz has asked for, it’s all just been speculation and guesses. I can take a dump in my left hand, and it has more value than your opinion or hypothetical guesswork.
King Floch
Copy and pasted from another reply I gave to someone else who said that:
Well, we have the reported ask from the Reds, which was obviously silly and unrealistic, and the fact that pretty much every team that has been reported to have interest in trading for Cease has since pivoted to other SP options.
Some reasonable inferences can definitely be made from those data points.
sfu13
All the teams that reportedly have pivoted away are still in contact with the White Sox daily. Chris getz said himself that he never asked anything from the Reds, it never got that far. The Reds were just doing due diligence, not actively looking to trade. So some teams want to negotiate in the media, that’s fine, but it doesn’t make it fact.
And me personally, I don’t think the “reported” ask from the Reds was silly and unrealistic, I don’t think it was enough. Jonathan India is not a centerpiece. Lowder and Petty are not that good.
King Floch
India was not part of the reported ask from the Reds. It was 3 top 75 prospects plus one or two more top 10 organizational prospects. Cease isn’t worth that at this point and is unlikely to ever be.
We’ll see how it all works out but it sounds like you are setting yourself up for disappointment.
sfu13
I’m not going to be disappointed at all, let me reiterate my stance:
“Bitter fans of other teams keep saying to me “well then you can keep him”, and I’m like ” um okay? Is that a bad thing?” He’s one of the best pitchers in baseball with absolutely filthy stuff and I love watching him pitch so I have no qualms if the White Sox keep him, possibly extend him or get a free draft pick when he leaves. Better than trading him for some of the junk I’m reading on here.”
Though I’m sure you’ll be disappointed when the Orioles get their sht pushed in again next year if they even make the playoffs. They may be due some massive regression and could potentially not even make the playoffs considering how tough the AL East is. Good luck.
Aiden Awe
His contract is cheap and team friendly. I don’t hate Getz offer, he’s trying to get the best offer which shouldn’t be a bad thing.
King Floch
I’m simply saying that the return you seem to think you are going to get for Cease is going to be pretty disappointing for you if you really think the reported ask from the Reds was fair or even a little light.
No one is going to pay for 2022 Cease after his middling 2023, nor should they. He simply isn’t worth that kind of haul right now.
Aiden Awe
Getz should ask for a large package, would help the farm a lot.
MacGromit
@sfu13
That’s impressive, but why again do you take dumps into your own hands? Seems kind of unsanitary. But you do you.
Viveleempireevil
Lost us at “he’s one of the best pitchers in baseball”. No, he’s not. Is he in the same class with Cole, Snell et. Al.? Nope. Does he have the potential to be a front of the rotation starter? Yes, he does. So do a lot of guys. He’s also 28 years old (will be 29 this season). So, if he doesn’t figure it out soon…
King Floch
I don’t disagree that Getz should get as much as he can for Cease, Aiden, but I do think it would be in both his and the organization’s best interests to cash that chip in prior to the start of the season.
If Cease gets injured or has another season like 2023, his value will be a fraction of what it is now.
Aiden Awe
He just turned 28 two weeks ago.
Aiden Awe
Your right, Sox aren’t guaranteed to avoid 100+ losses in 2024. I say between 90-103 losses tbh. But he has to nail this trade in order for the Sox to compete in 2024/2026. Chris said no LRJ trade. LRJ, AB, AV aren’t FA til 2027 so there’s time to build around these 3 players.
Aiden Awe
*2025
sfu13
Since Dylan Cease came into the Major Leagues, he’s 8th in all of baseball in fWAR so yes he is one of the best pitchers in baseball. Yes he is in the same class with Cole and Snell look at his K rate, ERA+, FIP, and other Analytics for example.
sfu13
Says you. And a market that pays Lance Lynn 15 million per year, Frankie Montas 16 million per year, Gerritt Cole 334 million, and a guy who’s never pitched in the major leagues 325 million and Dylan cease is only going to make 20M for the next 2 years, his value is only going to go up exponentially. Like I said before, teams can pay up or don’t; I don’t care. I’d rather the white sox keep him and try and be competitive and act like a major Market team instead of our Scrooge of an owner ripping off Illinois taxpayers and not putting any kind of money or effort into the team on the field.
Aiden Awe
Sometimes taking a risk is necessary. I wished they can be competitive despite a weak division. But they have 8-9 holes in their roster. Sox can’t compete in 2024. But in 2025, I have mid expectations. The Sox competing in 2025/2026 is reasonable as long as LRJ isn’t traded. LRJ could be on the next decent Sox team.
sfu13
Believe me Aiden I agree. There are more holes on the White Sox roster than a golf course. I’m just saying it shouldn’t be that way. I’m glad I got to witness 2005, because I doubt I live long enough to see the White Sox Championship contenders again.
Aiden Awe
Jerry will eventually sell the team, it’s a matter of time. Maybe new ownership can turn the Sox from a mediocre franchise to a good franchise.
CluHaywood
Not sure you understand how the market works. You don’t say, “I want this guy, and you need to come down in price or else I won’t trade for him.” White Sox have all the leverage, multiple teams asking on him daily. If you miss out because your organization wanted to keep Kjersted or Cowser, that’s a huge miss.
CluHaywood
He came within an eyelash of winning a Cy Young against an improbable year from Verlander. That is a farcry from “figuring it out.” Lord the takes on this have been tremendously stupid.
Ra
Sox don’t “have all the leverage.” They have an expiring asset that will do nothing for them for the remainder of his contract UNLESS they trade him.
Viveleempireevil
“Takes on this have been tremendously stupid”. Well, Clu…you would know about tremendously stupid. And your boy is going to stay on the south side b/c Getz’ asks (of all potential trade partners) is ridiculous.
Ra
Yes, keeping Cease would be a terrible thing for WS. Getting nothing while they lose 190 games over the next two seasons – except for a comp pick if they QO him for ~ $22MM – would be a colossal failure. And if he takes the QO for a 4th place WS team in 2026, he walks and you get ZIPPO. See Angels and Ohtani, Shohei.
The WS do not hold all the cards here. They hold a fish that they need to sell before it rots.
Ra
You have not watched Kjerstad play, it is obvious.. But yeah, keep yammering about things you don’t know about. Really builds your “credibility.”
Lionhart
Screw the BBWAA for what? miss information/fake news, Rosenthal/Morosi & Heyman have no journalistic integrity. Ken your so full of it you and Russo should retire.
cwsOverhaul
Is Cleveland’s return expectation for rental of Bieber “outlandish” to the buyers?
How about rental of Burnes (who Milwaukee unlikely to deal but will listen)?
How about 3yrs of Luzardo (who Marlins unlikely to deal but will listen)?
How about Valdez (who Astros not likely to deal but will listen)?
It is almost as if demand is far greater than supply with Cease whether buyers like it or not. They can keep paying considerable guarantees to guys with far more concerns like others have with Montas/Giolito/Stroman/Lynn…..maybe Paxton……..but WSox aren’t going to take the best of lackluster offers when the market alternatives aren’t good outside those who pay a fortune for Snell & Montgomery.
sugoi51
Interesting take in the LA Times about how the Dodgers have success in turning pitchers around. Using Evan Phillips and Alex Wood as examples, the article also says it doesn’t always work with the obvious case with Thor. There might be a paywall but people get a few free stories a month. One can also skirt that using a different browser like Duck Duck Go or the like. latimes.com/sports/dodgers/story/2024-01-14/dodger…
Rightout
Sox will hang onto Cease trying to get more at the trade deadline…then watch Dylan blow his arm out in May…
Aiden Awe
Cease has 2 years left on his deal. They aren’t urgent to move him per Chris Getz.
MacGromit
@Aiden,
I’d say that Getz is probably right, until the trade deadline this year when Cease starts to become a depreciating asset. short of an big bounce back season, this time next year will likely net less prospect return than now only based on control. he then becomes a lesser version of Burnes. except Burnes helped his team achieve something this year. the WS have pretty slim hopes for equal success for the 24 season.
Aiden Awe
But he has to nail this trade to help the Sox in 2025/2026. It seems like their FO is aiming to compete in those two years.
Aiden Awe
If they keep Cease assuming healthy with improved defense, something Getz fixed. Then his value might go up. If he returns to 2022 form, then good for the Sox.
nrd1138
I see a lot of ‘hope’ here:
A) That Cease has a ‘bounce back year
B) That his Ligament does not go BOOM before the deadline (or some other injury)
But I get it, a lot of Sox fans drink that hope ‘kool aid’. After a while though most finally realize that when you have to ‘hope’ every season that the team or player will do this or that, then most times its just a bad team. I for one would like to see a Sox team going into the season that is going to be good, players that have consistently been good at pitching or fielding, or driving in runs effectively, not just hoping ‘this’ or ‘that’ breaks their way.
Aiden Awe
That’s what I’m hoping for 2025 and beyond tbh.
tjg25
Vaughn is another White Sox fail.
Aiden Awe
He’s been ok, not great. White Sox have time to build around him, AB and LRJ. All three of them aren’t FA til 2017.
Aiden Awe
*2027.
nrd1138
Build around Vaughn? The guy at first who regressed with his bat and looks awful defensively after finally getting into his ‘position’?
Aiden Awe
This is only his 4th season. He didn’t have a bad season in 2022. I’m not saying he’s the best 1B in MLB. Maybe Marcus Thames can him, maybe the entire offense. I would like for him to reduce the strikeouts and increase his walk rate. He did hit 20 homeruns last season.
Aiden Awe
*fix
msqboxer
It’s just supply and demand..Snell and Montgomery for example are still not signed. Teams will have to way do you pay Snell or Montgomery $40-50M over the next two years or Cease $20M and what your prospects are worth.
cwsOverhaul
You are being nice. The AAV for Snell and Montgomery are likely 25 on the low end.
tuck 2
All this planted by Sox trying to inflate his value. Next will be a rumor that Os are considering sending Rutschman and Henderson. They are not trading Kjerstad any more than they’d trade those two.
Aiden Awe
The sox could take the gamble that his value goes up. Cease has 2 years left on his contract. An injury completely destroys the value.
NoNeckWilliams
The Sox will hold on to Cease and get even more at the deadline than they are asking now. A couple real catchers and an upgraded defense will improve his stats.
Aiden Awe
Your right, they improved defensively. The Aaron bummer trade improved the defense. But no offense though, avoiding 100+ losses isn’t guaranteed though. I just hope the team has better chemistry than last year. Sox did sign some positive clubhouse guys.
Bruce wulff
What makes cease so special? He had such a crappy year last year. He’s so overrated.
TheStevilEmpire1
The more time passes, the more likely that this backfires on the White Sox. He’s coming off a bad season and the Sox are asking for a return that’s indicative of Cease having a career year. They need to look at this objectively and realize there is an unknown factor here.
If he comes back and has another season like the last, his value is going to be worse. The return will never be better than now. The White Sox missed their big trade opportunity with Cease after 2022. It’s just facts.
yankee766766
With the SP and all thats going on with these crazy contracts, number of years, really high AAV’s….as a Yankee fan, maybe a month ago I would have never thought of giving in to Jordan Montgomery ask of 6/$170m. But now I ask, is he not deserving of that kind of contract ??….he is consistent (look at his last 3 years), he does not miss a start, his ERA has gone down 4 straight years, he pitches deep into games, ..In other words he has gotten better each year……..I still not crazy about 6 years…BUT…..5/$150m…definitely. And with the addition of Stroman the rotation would be SO deep..IF IF IF either Rodon or Cortes comes up big……..Cole, Monty, Stroman. Rodon, Cortes…and on the perimeter Hampton, Warren, Schmidt, Gil, Beeter, , to name a few…..whew !!!
yankee766766
I meant BEETER..not better..sorry