8:57pm: In a separate column, Rosenthal reports that Miami and the Royals discussed the framework of a trade that would’ve sent the southpaw to Kansas City and first baseman Vinnie Pasquantino to South Florida during the Winter Meetings. It doesn’t appear that those conversations are still going, as the Royals instead addressed their rotation with free agent adds of Seth Lugo and Michael Wacha.
Pasqunatino, who owns a .272/.355/.444 slash in 558 career plate appearances, saw his second big league season cut short by surgery to repair a labrum tear in his right shoulder. He remains under team control for five years.
12:28pm: Marlins left-hander Jesús Luzardo is drawing trade interest, per a report from Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic.
The Miami rotation has been a frequent nexus point of rumors in recent years, which has continued into this winter. Just last month, Rosenthal reported on the same concept, highlighting Edward Cabrera and Trevor Rogers as possible trade candidates. At that time, Rosenthal portrayed Luzardo as likely off-limits, but his report from today seems to suggest it may not be totally off the table after all.
Rosenthal suggests that Peter Bendix, the club’s new president of baseball operations, might have more willingness to consider a trade than now-former general manager Kim Ng. As Rosenthal points out, Bendix came to the Marlins from the Rays, a club that has generally been unafraid to trade players at peak value. For instance, in 2018, they traded Chris Archer to the Pirates for Tyler Glasnow, Austin Meadows and Shane Baz. They later sent Meadows to the Tigers for Isaac Paredes and are in the process of trading Glasnow to the Dodgers at this very moment.
If Bendix has any intention of bringing a similar operating style to Miami, then considering a Luzardo deal can become plausible in that light. He has three years of club control remaining, with MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz projecting a salary of $5.9MM in 2024. He will be due raises in the two following seasons before he’s slated to reach free agency after 2026. Since he’s going to get more expensive as his control dwindles, his trade value right now is likely as high as it will get.
Of course, beyond the contractual situation, there is the on-field stuff to consider. Luzardo posted a 3.32 earned run average in 18 starts last year, then a 3.58 ERA in 32 starts here in 2023. He struck out 28.7% of batters faced over those two years while walking just 7.9% and keeping 40.1% of balls in play on the ground. That kind of performance, along with his relatively modest salary and years of control, should combine to give him a tremendous amount of trade value.
But that also makes him incredibly valuable to the Marlins and it’s worth pointing out that their situation is more precarious than in past years. Sandy Alcántara underwent Tommy John surgery at the end of the most recent season and is slated to miss all of 2024. The club also subtracted Pablo López from the mix by flipping him to the Twins last offseason. If they were to trade Luzardo, they would be down to Eury Pérez, Braxton Garrett, Cabrera, Rogers and Max Meyer.
Pérez and Garrett make for a strong front two, but Pérez might be on a workload limit next year due to his youth and quick ascent. Cabrera has significant control problems while Rogers struggled in 2022 and then missed almost all of 2023 due to injury. Meyer has just two MLB starts and missed all of 2023 due to his own TJS. The club is reportedly planning to stretch out relievers A.J. Puk and George Soriano in the spring but there’s no guarantee that transition will work.
Given the uncertainty in the rotation, they may not want to subtract a talented pitcher like Luzardo, and there’s nothing to suggest they are actively shopping him. But if the right offer comes in, the club may have to consider it. Roster Resource currently projects the club’s 2024 payroll at $98MM. Bruce Sherman bought the team at the end of 2017 and, per the data from Cot’s Baseball Contracts, we can see the club’s Opening Day payroll dropped from $115MM that year to $100MM the year after. It hasn’t been higher than $93MM since.
The club could use some upgrades to its lineup, particularly in the middle infield, and may not have many resources available to do so. Even if they were willing to spend a bit more money, the best free agents available are guys like Whit Merrifield, Tim Anderson and Isiah Kiner-Falefa. While trading a pitcher would come with the risk of further weakening the rotation, it’s possible it could be their best path forward. Clubs like the Reds, Twins, Rays, Cardinals and Orioles are flush with position players and could use some pitching, perhaps allowing them to line up with the Marlins.
TAKERDBACKS
Would have loved him in Arizona but it’s to late. Definitely a good pitcher.
Dumpster Divin Theo
Meh. Jesus is just alright
chiefnocahoma1
He’s alright with me.
99CaptainJudge99
Hey if the Yankees don’t get Yamamoto, you never know.
YanksPhan42
Cashman should look into him Yamo or not! I keep reading the Marlins want a young SS. I could see a deal based on Peraza and Schmidt +
99CaptainJudge99
I’ll give ‘em Schmidt and Beeter/Gomez/ Warren but not giving them Peraza though, except Peraza to start hitting now, and continuing to play gold glove defense.
YanksPhan42
I think Peraza can be a .270 15 homer 30 steal type of guy…..but Luzardo is a young, controllable lefty arm that misses bats. We’re not getting him without giving up a nice piece like Peraza. I’m cool with it too…..because as you know, we just lost like 10 pitchers!
Cole, Yamo, Lazardo, Rodon and Nestor has the potential to be filthy
frankpr21
Yankees, dream on. Best team for the Marlins to trade with, the Reds. They can maximize their package Reds have infielders , outfielders,pitchers. They can get a tremendous group of long term talent that will put the Marlins in a longterm position as a serious contender. Luzardo will bring way better talent than Castillos or Glasnow. I will do this trade in a New York minute with the Reds if the package is right. Others to consider Mariners and Toronto, San Diego, Dodgers, Cubs, Rays, Yankees in my list would rate 8 out of ten.
99CaptainJudge99
@frankpr21-I don’t care what you say the Reds and their deadbeat fans are still crying about not getting Jasson Dominguez in a package for Luis Castillo a few years ago. I hear them still whimpering. At times the trades you don’t make, are truly for the best.
99CaptainJudge99
@YanksPhan42- Yeah trading Peraza will comeback to bite us in the long run, especially if you think he’ll hit like your saying. I’m fine with Lazardo, or without him, we must keep Peraza though.
This one belongs to the Reds
Not one Reds fan has cared about not getting that Dominguez guy all Yankees keep trying to deal. I wonder why?
Not to mention they got a better deal for Castillo from Seattle but Yankees fans still cry two years later about not getting him despite being told that every time they whine.
99CaptainJudge99
@Reds- The Yankees are not trying to deal Dominguez at all, not sure if you are aware but the lst prospect the Padres asked for was Dominguez in Juan Soto talks. The answer: No. I feel really bad for the AAA team you root for, and wish them my absolute best! I guarantee you Cincy will regret not getting Dominguez for Castillo when they had a chance to a few years ago. Castillo isn’t even an ace on the Mariners! Lol. Jasson is a future switching hitting Julio Rodriguez. You’ll see. Cheers!
jbryant0693
@Judge Noelvi Marte > Dominguez by a mile and Arroyo better than whatever else the Yanks were going to throw in for Castillo. Krall hung up the phone on Yanks when Seattle called. Very smart move.
WrongVerb
LMAO As a Reds fan, I guarantee you, we’re all fine with the return from Seattle. Marte looks like a stud. Arroyo may be the best of the bunch. And Williamson is already flashing middle of the rotation stuff. You’re still crying that the Reds wouldn’t send you Castillo for Frasier and Andujar.
99CaptainJudge99
@WrongVowel- no sorry Vanna, the Yankees nor I are crying over nothing. Luis Castillo was not the ace the Yankees were expecting, glad he went to the Mariners to become that #2 or #3 pitcher that he became, glad the Yankees still have Dominguez! Thanks but no thanks.
99CaptainJudge99
@jbryant0693- Hey so glad the Reds are so happy with their return, just let me know how last place feels in 2024. Good day and good riddance!
octavian8
Last place? Try to follow baseball a little closer. It seems to be leaving you behind.
99CaptainJudge99
Thanks for the laugh. The only thing the Reds will be contenders for is last place in the NL Central. Go back to sleep!
The619MetroPadres
Can anyone see a starting rotation of: Yu Darvish/Joey Musgrove/Mikey King/Randy Vasquez/and Jesus Luzardo for my San Diego Friars? That would be an LA Dodger Dragon Slayer right there.
99CaptainJudge99
Who are the Friars giving up for Lazardo? Thinking Marlins need some much needed offense.
The619MetroPadres
Cronenworth OR Kim for Luzardo. (One, and or both of them are confirmed to be moved).
thenewf
Cronenworth has negative trade value. Keep dreaming
99CaptainJudge99
That’s definitely not going to be enough. Obviously you are just kidding around.
The619MetroPadres
Kim, Vasquez and a single A guy for Luzardo and a reliever.
Slow day at work
The Fish have no interest in Kim, unless he’s a throw-in and the Padres pay his salary. Merril plus low level prospects is what it will take to get Luzardo. You may think it’s an overpay, but that’s what it takes to get a front of the rotation type pitcher with 3 years of control.
BTW, I don’t think that Kim has no trade value, it’s just that the Marlins don’t want him. The Padres can get a couple of decent prospects for a 1 year rental of Kim to a contending team in need of a SS
Pads Fans
Are you f’ing kidding me? If the Padres were stupid enough to dangle Kim, almost every team in baseball would be chomping at the bit.
5.8 WAR. Can play SS/3B/2B all with exceptionally good defense.
The Padres WON’T dangle Kim, so its a moot point.
frankpr21
Sorry but Cronen_ will not be in the conversation. He is not worth the money invested on the Marlins roster. Kim, maybe but they need to add way more. Two of their top 5 prospects and some rank among their 10 and 15, plus Kim. Reds, Boston and Mariners are way better trading partners.
frankpr21
Excellent reply. Not a starter, not even to have in the conversation. They need to pony up 2 of their top 5 prospects and 2 from their 8 to 12 top. Anyway, Reds and Boston would be way better partners. Add Mariners, Toronto, Dodgers, Cubs.
frankpr21
You are right,moot for the Marlins to even start a conversation about a trade for Luzardo. Reds, Boston would make way better partners. Today it is about pitching, pitching and more pitching and Luzardo is top 3 in any rotation.
BaseBall Bob
No. Not even close.
BaseballisLife
Frank is on crack. A Model City denizen to be sure.
El Niño
Jackson Merrill, SS, top 10 overall prospect in AA.
Pads Fans
Not necessary. Luardo is not an Ace and won’t require a top 10 prospect. A couple top 100 prospects like Thorpe and Zavala plus a couple others in the Padres top 30 will be enough.
The619MetroPadres
Thorpe is a top 10 prospect.
frankpr21
I think you are forgetting this is not Lorias team anymore. The days of giving up, Castillo, Gallen are over. Pitching is premium. What happened to the Padres last year with all that hitting. Luzardo, and only Luzardo all by himself would have put the Padres on the WC. So, rethink, Padres have good talent but Reds and Boston can put together a way better package of ready now and future prospects.
BaseballisLife
Thorpe is the #99 prospect. mlb.com/prospects/top100/
99CaptainJudge99
The Reds. Lolololololol!!!
Pads Fans
Already covered that. Thorpe, Zavala, Pauley, and Lamar King. Two top 100 prospects, an MLB ready 3B/2B, and a lottery ticket at a position of need for the Marlins.
El Niño
I’d rather keep Thorpe. The only way we compete with the dodgers is by developing pitching.
The619MetroPadres
I agree TG19.
BaseballisLife
The only way the Padres compete with the Dodgers is to maximize their roster while they have Machado, Bogaerts, Kim, Tatis, Musgrove, and Darvish on the roster.
Every year they wait moves them further into their window. They don’t have the luxury of waiting to see which one of their top prospects move from the suspect stage to the productive MLB player stage.
That is why trading a couple of those top 100 for a good, young middle of the rotation starter with several years of control makes so much sense for them.
frankpr21
It will cost them a lot but I can see the Padres as a 4 or fifth partner. Reds for me have what Marlins. Then Mariners, Toronto, Boston also could be a great partner. Cubs and Padres also havesome good talent in the minors. Reds have infielders, outfielders, pitchers so the Red Sox and Padres. If I was the Marlins I would trade Luzardo. They can do that and stay competitive and get in as a WC. So Marlins go for it. Reds, Boston Mariners, Toronto have what it takes.
99CaptainJudge99
The Reds. Lolololololol!!!
Brew’88
Randy Vasquez. has only pitched 37 ML innings in his career, starting only a handful (in bullpen games). Pegging him into starting 5 would be an element of surprise I guess on the Dodgers. Might not go so well.
Joel P
Vasquez and Brito appear to be the number 5 and 6 starters in 2024.
Brew’88
You know this Joel?
Joel P
Why else did they trade for those 2 guys?
I remember you telling the world Soto wasn’t getting dealt. Then he was dealt. You remember that?
Brew’88
why else? They need RP help too, they lost Hader, Barlow, Martinez, etc….and Brito especially seems a good fit to step in there. Vasquez may well project as a SP, but not at all proven. They have several other guys internally (Waldron, Morejon, Iriarte, Snelling even) who will try to crack the roster this year. But the team has been quite public about their goals to add at least one more front line SP.
You’re misinformed or confusing me with another commenter. I never said they wouldn’t trade Soto, I said the FO was saying they didn’t want to and were trying to extend him. Those public statements were available to you as well.
But they traded Soto to free up payroll to acquire pitching (as even you must be aware). FO says they have $55 to potentially spend on FAs or work with trades, and their top priority (as stated by FO this week) is to add another SP (or two). But we’ll see, I won’t know, and you certainly don’t know, until it happens.
Joel P
Vazquez and Brito are 2 pitchers. 1 will make the rotation and 1 heads to the pen.
The Padres DID trade Soto.
You think they are spending 55 million? I bet they won’t. The Padres will get 1 more starter and some outfielders. Perhaps a bullpen piece. But that won’t add up to 55 million that’s for sure.
Brew’88
Joel, I agree with you on the Pads not spending the entire $55M, I sense there are serious financial issues behind the seens, but hope not true.
Joel P
The Padres never had the money to support their payroll from the last couple years. It never added up. As a fan you see this giant payroll and think it’s the new normal but it was never sustainable.
Pads Fans
#6 and #7 starters. They are pen pieces that will take the place of Martinez in that LR/opener/swingman role.
Avila is more likely to step into the rotation than either of them.
King will be the Padres #5 taking the place of Lugo. .
Padres still need a middle of the rotation starter, preferably a lefty.
Pads Fans
The Padres lost, traded, or non-tendered 8 pitchers this offseason. They added one in De Los Santos. They needed 3 more for the pen including in that LR/swingman role. Brito and Vasquez fill the role that Martinez had before.
When Soto turned down 15/542 extension, his trade became inevitable.
Pads Fans
Brew, you missed Avila who is now likely to step into the starting rotation regardless of who they add.
They did try to extend Soto. On the Gwynn & Chris show, they said that the Padres offered a 15/542 extension. Soto declined.
That pretty much says that the FO was trying and made a huge offer, but Soto wants more. Once they knew for sure they could not keep him beyond one year, they filled 4 spots on the MLB roster and got a top 100 pitching prospect to boot
The FO has said NOTHING about how much they have to spend. At all. Not once. That $55 million is still based on the BS number from Acee.
Brew88
Yeah, forgot about Avila
Pads Fans
Joel, YOU parroted the line that they only had $200 million to spend many times. As of today their actual payroll is at $150 million. So are you saying you were wrong about how much they are going to spend?
I thought so.
Joel P
I said the Padres were cutting payroll. And that’s exactly what they are doing. You and Simm and a couple other guys argued with me all day about this and the very next day Soto was dealt. That’s the truth.
frankpr21
Okay. Luzardo. Well can be possible, but need to pay and give up ready now talent and 2 out of top five prospects. And no, expensive bad contracts unless they pay for it. In that case if I am the Marlins I would not even get into a conversation.
Pads Fans
YOU said they HAD to cut payroll to $200 million. Now you are saying they won’t spend $200 million. So you are saying you were wrong.
Pads Fans
Frank,
It depends on what system you are talking about. The Padres have two or the top 10 prospects in baseball and neither will be traded. Especially not for Luzardo.
Still might get 2 of the top 6 in the Padres system both of whom are top 100 prospects, just not any of their top 3.
Joel P
If the Padres thought King was a number 5 starter they wouldn’t have traded for him. I think King and Musgrove are the top 2 starters and the Padres will look for a number 3.
Joel P
I never said they HAD to cut payroll to 200 million I said they would. And that appears to be EXACTLY what they are doing.
What are you talking about man? You are a fan. It’s weird to get defensive of your teams payroll like this.
C'Bad Jeff
Kim, Vasquez and a single A guy for Luzardo and a reliever.
Simm
I don’t think Kim is going to be traded and even less so to the marlins.
Merrill is worth way more so it’s not going to be him.
Zavala, iriarte and prospect or two should about do it.
Brew’88
@Simm. I’d go for that!
Joel P
The Marlins need a shortstop but not a soon to be free agent they need a long term shortstop. Isn’t Merrill a shortstop? Him for Luzardo or Garrettt could make sense.
Simm
Merrill is worth more than them. Luz is good but he isn’t f getting the number 9 prospects that basically major league ready.
Joel P
No he’s not. And he’s probably not a top 10 prospect anymore either once they update the list. That’s a fair deal for both teams. Luzardo or Garrettt either one.
Pads Fans
I think it will take slightly more. Thorpe, Zavala, Pauley, and Lamar King.
That is a slam dunk. 2 Top 100 prospects, an MLB ready 3B/2B, and a lottery ticket catcher which is a serious area of need for the Marlins organization.
Pads Fans
Merrill is #5 on the updated BA list. He is definitely a top 10 prospect overall. Why you think you know better than the experts is beyond me.
Luzardo is a middle of the rotation starter, not an Ace. He will get a return that includes a couple top 100 prospects, but no one close to Merrill’s quality.
Longtimecoming
Ditto!
JudgementDay
I won’t do that trade @pads fan. If Thorpe continues like he is he’ll be another max fried where we could still have In our rotation.
Look at the big picture..reset the luxury tax, and spend big next season when burnes, Bieber, etc. are free agents to fill out rotation. In the meantime don’t do another Xander deal just to waste money and fill out roster accordingly.
For one year, it’ll be hard to digest but I’m
Willing to wait for the long term of the franchise. Just hope they are foolish and do another stupid trade that will cause havoc….ex. Matt Beaty for Ryan rivers now #10 prospect of dodgers, the rich hill trade, even Hader giving up gasser and Ruiz(could have been in outfield), etc.
Longtimecoming
I’m not sure why it dropped down but my “ditto” was for SIMM’s proposal not Pads Fans.
Joel P
Remember when you said Soto was worth a ton and then he was traded for less?
That just happened man.
Pads Fans
Long, I think the Padres would do Simm’s trade proposal too. Iriarte is not the prospect that Thorpe is, so giving up less.
Pads Fans
4 MLB players including a high leverage reliever or back of the rotation starter and the Yankees #1 catcher, plus a top 100 pitching prospect that you said was not available at all. Preller did well Better than the prospects I thought would be involved. Adding Grisham actually lowered the Padres return, so there is that too.
Since we found out that Soto turned down an extension that was more than $100 million more than the Nationals offered, that made it inevitable that he would be traded.
Joel P
Grisham had positive trade value.
MARLIN POWER 18
No. But I’ll deal Luzardo for Thorpe, Pauley, King, and Merrill.
BaseballisLife
Marlin Power. We all like to play fantasy baseball, but you are taking it a bit far.
Longtimecoming
C – depending on which single A guy (not an high prospect) and which reliever (maybe a 7/8 inning guy with some control to replace Vasquez), I’d be open to that.
frankpr21
Say what? Kim not even a starter. Not in my plans as a Marlins GM. I need long term prospect and ready now controllable assets. How about 2 top 5, and 2 out of their 8, 15 list. Anyway Reds, Boston, Mariners would make way better partners.
Pads Fans
Frank, Kim is a 5.8 WAR player that can play 3 positions better than almost any other player in baseball.
You are not the Marlins GM, so YOU don’t have any plans. I agree that they are going to want prospects. Its the Rays way and Bendix won’t venture far off the path he is used to.
No one is trading a top 10 prospect for Luzardo. Maybe not even a top 30 prospect. But two in the top 100 is a definite possibility.
There are 4 or 5 teams that would make great trade partners. The Mariners are not one of them. The Marlins need an OF, an IF, and a catcher, plus a starting pitching prospect to replace Luzardo.
Javia135
@frankpr21
You shoot down every trade proposal and call them all ridiculous. Some of them are, I grant you. You say 2 of top 5 prospects and 2 in the 8-12 range for the Padres. Why don’t you go ahead and give us some names? I would love to see what you would consider a fair deal.
BaseballisLife
Javia, isn’t two top 5 Padres prospects and another in their top 8-12 plus one more prospect almost exactly what Pads Fans proposed?
Dumpster Divin Theo
No
Wagner>Cobb
Not expecting it, but I’d be delighted if St. Louis got him. Gray and Luzardo as the 1-2 punch would be outstanding.
Joel P
Edman and Herrera is getting somewhat close to Luzardos value. But Matz would have to be dealt and I doubt the Marlins would want him. And Edman would need to be replaced.
Wagner>Cobb
I’d be thrilled with that deal. I bet Miami wants more though.
If that’s all it took, I’d just put Carlson back in CF. Palacios becomes the 4th OF.
Joel P
I think it would take more than that for sure. Adding Liberatore could make it work. Carlson and Nootbaar could handle center until Scott is ready but we would need a backup shortstop.
Wagner>Cobb
I would still make that deal and laugh my way to a Division title. Bring in IKF to be the infield utility. There are a bunch of FA SS’s who are suitable to back up.
BreezyB
What don’t people realize that Miami isn’t trading Luzardo just to trade him. They want young and controllable players. Edman has 2 years left Miami would have no interest
frankpr21
Sadly Cardinals don’t have enough talent to make a good partner unless they are willing to give up Nootbar, Winn and top 2 from their list among 4 to 9 top prospects. Then and maybe thay can start a phone call. Reds,Boston lineup better for they have what Marlins need.
Joel P
Nootbaar for Luzardo 1 for 1 is about right but that doesn’t help the Cardinals. Winn simply isn’t available at all. Are you a fan of the Cardinals rival? Sure sounds like it.
Cardsfanatik redux
You should change your name to “idonthaveaclue”
Cody1981
Royals could be in on it ..they have guys like Melendez and Garcia they could dangle
Roidville Slugger
Plus Wacha, Renfroe and Lugo…
Cody1981
If the royals had wacha luzardo ragans singer and lugo that would be amazing
Pads Fans
Luzardo is not a former Padre, lol
BreezyB
Lmfaooo those guys are bums Miami isn’t trading their best pitcher for two scrubs
CreeksideFantasyBaseball
Luzardo has really blossomed into a front of the rotation pitcher. His development took a bit longer than we expected but he’s as good as advertised. I could see Arizona going for him.
drdback
Would like to see that too.
Pads Fans
3.58 ERA and 3.55 FIP is not an Ace
frankpr21
What they can offer. Cause Reds and Reds Sox have plenty of what Marlins need.
Ma4170
Of course he’ll draw a lot of interest, but I’d thiink a team would have to blow them away, so seems unlikely. Id love for the mets to go for him.
frankpr21
That won’t fly cause they play in the same division. Now they can trick the Marlins by using a third team giving up some prospect to this other team with the intention of them getting back Luzardo. It would take a very created mind but I think Stearn can do it. Very smart baseball mind.
Longtimecoming
I’m going on record as offering HSK for Luzardo straight up or maybe attaching a 20-30 on the prospect list.
Don’t come at me fellow Padres fans because I have always been a huge HSK fan. We have Merrill and even Eguy for utility. HSK is likely a goner in FA so, fill a big need at the 2/3 spot for 3 years and trade from strength.
Miami might prefer Merrill – could maybe go that way because of the anticipated international signing next month, ie the mega talented top SS.
2 teams trading from strength to fill a big need for each.
Brew’88
Kim has one year of control while Luzardo 3, so I doubt this would be a fair trade for Miami, but Preller can try it and see if they bite! Merrill would be more realistic, but I hope the Pads keep him.
Longtimecoming
HSK for what he offers at his cost / premium position / leadoff bat, is more than just the typical 1 year guy.
I did allow for a 20-30 prospect to be added in.
Longtimecoming
I think Merrill 1 for 1 is an overlay for SD. Miami will have to sweeten that pot but yeah, they would ask.
Javia135
Actually, BTV says that Merrill for Luzardo straight up is a fair deal. I don’t think the Padres should do it, but it is a fair deal.
Pads Fans
Luzardo is not Soto. He is a middle of the rotation starter. He will not require a top 10 overall prospect.
He will require a couple of top 100 prospects plus a couple more in the Padres top 30.
See my other post.
MARLIN POWER 18
@Longtimecoming
What you may not realize is that the Marlins have medium decent internal SS options like Xavier Edwards, Jacob Amaya, and Vidal Brujan. All of them are capable. So, if the Padres want Luzardo, they’d better get ready to seriously overpay. Merrill is a given, but we’d want to strip mine your farm system of several more assets. Trust me, the Fish may deal, but they’re not desperate. Not at all.
Longtimecoming
X was traded to Marlins a few years ago. Very familiar with him and if he is your comparison to HSK or even Merrill, that explains why thee writer suggests that Miami needs middle inf help.
The other guys I admittedly don’t know – just started with what was written.
Pads Fans
BTV said that Grisham for Cole of Judge was an overpay by the Padres. It says that Merrill for Lindor is an overpay by the Padres that they would reject.
There is a reason that no one pays any attention to BTV.
Pads Fans
Merrill is not even in the discussion. Neither is Salas even though the Marlins have a serious need for catchers and neither is Snelling.
Thorpe, Zavala, Pauley, and Lamar King gets that deal done. Its a strong return for the Marlins.
frankpr21
They are no longer the Lorias fish. No more giving away the likes of Castillo and Gallen. Pitching is premium. Look what Royals just paid for their 2 new additions 45 plus 15 are you kidding me. Look what Cardinals paid Matz and their 2 new additions. Luzardo alone would have made the Padres a WC team. Luzardo would have made the Reds a WC team al by himself. So want Luzardo Marlins control him for 3 more seasons they don’t need to trade him. Unless Reds,Red Sox, Padres are willing to pay with ready talent and 2 of top five prospects then there is not nees to waste time on a conversation. Padres need him desperately. Snell will cost them over 160 for 5 years and is not even a sure thing. Luzardo for 3 years that is priceless. On payroll savings alone wow. Besides Reds, Boston Padres need to win now. So, remember Dodgers gave up 2 ready now propescts and took 20 mil, plus add another 130 mil for a talented pitcher that us more hipe than results. Luzardo lefty younger and cost effective for 3 long seasons. What Luzardo put up your best package to start a conversation.
Javia135
Make a trade proposal Frank. Give us some names. It’s is easy to complain about other people’s trade ideas when you never give one of your own. Stop Monday Morning Quarterbacking, complaining about what other people have done, and show us what you have. Make a trade proposal.
BreezyB
Lmao you’re just a Homer for the padres. Miami absolutely views Luzardo as a their ace with a lot of potential still untapped. It would require a significant haul and would cost more than what the Mariners gave up for Luis Castillo
Pads Fans
Even their GM said when he went down that Alcantara was the Ace of the staff. If you don’t think Perez is better, you are not paying attention.
Luzardo has had a 4.30 ERA the last 3 season and has been exactly league average. In 2023 he ranked 36th among starters with at least 100 IP. He is no where near an Ace of any decent staff.
The Marlins were willing to send Luzardo to the Royals at the Winter Meetings for Vinnie Pasquantino, a DH/1B, and the Royals backed out according to Rosenthal. So not sure what kind of haul you think he will bring in.
The trade I proposed is a huge return for Luzardo. TWO top 100 prospects, a power hitting MLB ready prospect that hit .308 with a .931 OPS last season including a .321 BA with a .931 OPS in AA, and a lottery ticket 18 year old catching prospect.
Ma4170
2021 he was still very young and coming back from injury. Last two years he’s 28th in mlb in xFIP, 24th in siera, and 12th in k/9 so there is some very high level stuff there. He’s no ace (though he has the talent), but is a very strong 3 who pitches like a 2 for long stretches. Luzardo for Vinnie would have been a bad trade for marlins IMO, but they’re desperate for offense.
MARLIN POWER 18
@Longtimecoming
The Marlins love the fact that Edwards is an excellent high-average contact hitter who can play multiple positions and figures to be in the lineup most days, partnering with Luis Arraez as a table setter at the top of the order. In the event the Fish don’t land a SS, X will be given every chance to win the job outright in Spring Training.
Longtimecoming
Good luck to X – I actually like watching him in ST.
frankpr21
Think about this point of view from a baseball writer and insider.
Steve Adams
1:56 Santander is a one-year rental who’s corner only. That’s not close for Luzardo, who should have higher trade value than any of Dylan Cease, Shane Bieber or Tyler Glasnow because he has three years of club control remaining.
frankpr21
What aay you about this point of view from a baseball insider.
Steve Adams
1:56 Santander is a one-year rental who’s corner only. That’s not close for Luzardo, who should have higher trade value than any of Dylan Cease, Shane Bieber or Tyler Glasnow because he has three years of club control remaining.
frankpr21
From a baseball mind and and insider and expert in the field
Steve Adams
1:56 Santander is a one-year rental who’s corner only. That’s not close for Luzardo, who should have higher trade value than any of Dylan Cease, Shane Bieber or Tyler Glasnow because he has three years of club control remaining.
Longtimecoming
I think Glasnow had agreed to an extension prior to the trade (or it was contingent upon it) so what LA gave up for Glasnow (with 4 years of control) and MM is not what it appeared to be when first reported on day 1.
So, not so sure that Luzardo is worth a lot more than Glasnow based on their stats and the 4th year of control for Glasnow.
Glasnow has been a TOR guy – Luzardo at best only projects to develop into a TOR guy.
Not quite the same.
Don’t give me the injury history because: (1) Luzardo haven’t pitched as long at mlb so you can’t yet say what his injury history after 5 years will be; and (2) in this day every pitcher is one pitch away from TJ (ok not the soft tossing lefties but still) so they are all susceptible to an injury on any day.
Beyond this, I say I’ve moved on and so should you.
frankpr21
Well. How much the Dodgers are payung fir what you called Control. Well let ne put the crooked number, $110.000 millions plus. So, Luzardo would guve you 3 for max 30 and that my friend is not including an extention for another 3 years that could be another 75, max 80. So do the math, 30 plus 80 = 110 for 6 years. Add to that, he will be in his prime years of production. So at the end of the 6 years he will be 32. Think for a moment lefty with a 90 plus fastball, nasty change up and slider. Look around you tell me how many lefty 26 years-old with his upside you see around. So as an old saying goes, No ticket…
Merry Christmas. Go Marlins
reno24
Trade simulater has that deal 63 to 18 in favor of San Diego lol
Longtimecoming
The same one that had Grisham for Cole as a good trade for NY?
We’ve been thru this already.
Sid Bream Speed Demon
That is an absurd offer that get the Padres number blocked.
El Niño
It’s not that absurd. I do wonder how pitching injuries, the unpredictability, factors into real life GM values – not the fantasy video game simulators.
Pads Fans
I have been saying for weeks that the Padres have been in negotiations for Luzardo. Its too bad the Bow Tie won’t mention the Padres.
But not for HSK. Bendix comes from a system that doesn’t trade for relatively expensive players with 1 year of team control. They trade for prospects.
The Marlins want prospects and the Padres picked up another starting pitching prospect that will appeal to the Marlins.
The Padres can get a trade done sending 2 top 100 prospects to the Marlins plus a quality MLB ready player at a position of need, and a lottery ticket and not even need to touch their top 4. The system is so deep it would be an exceptional return for the Marlins.
The Marlins will want a pitching prospect. a 3B/MI prospect, and an OF prospect that are pretty all close to MLB ready. They also have an organizational need for catching really badly.
Think about this one. Thorpe (SP), Zavala (OF), Pauley(3B/2B), and Lamar King(C).
Two top 100 prospects plus a MLB ready 3B/2B that is just outside the top 100, and a lottery ticket at a position of serious need in the Marlins organization.
THAT gets a trade done. Strong return for the Marlins and the Padres get the middle of the rotation starting pitcher they need with 3 years of team control
Padres get a starter that is better than Wacha, Lugo, or Martinez.
Joel P
Padres fans are kind of silly and ridiculous. It’s lame when you try to talk about a trade and fans of the team think their gius are super valuable and the other guys are not.
Someone called Luzardo a middle of the rotation starter. Lol what on earth are you guys talking about???
Longtimecoming
Joel – I don’t think it was me but just looking at the stats of his young career he sure doesn’t have stats that compare to guys that you generally call TOR. I’d call him a really good 3 right now.
El Niño
#3 starters are super valuable.
Joel P
If you think Luzardo is a number 3 starter then there is no point in discussing this trade whatsoever. Because he’s not a number 3 starter.
It just gets old when teams fans overvalued their own players and then put down the ones that are potentially going to be traded.
El Niño
Who would you consider a #1-2 starter that luzardo compares with?
Joel P
I actually do my own starter rankings. I did my latest list a couple months ago and put Luzardo at 35. For reference Glasnow was 34. Eury Perez 37. Pablo Lopez 32. Grayson Rodriguez 38. I would say he’s a solid number 2 starter.
El Niño
He had a really good year, and by WAR (both FG and BR) he’s actually top 20. Id say he needs to pitch deeper into games to be a #2 though.
El Niño
Also aren’t you “devaluing other teams players” by saying Merrill isn’t a top 10 prospect when that’s his ranking across most platforms?
Longtimecoming
Joel – Blake Snell was SD’s projected #3 a year ago. You can do all you like and feel how you like hit his stats are not Verlander/Kershaw/Cole/sherzer/Musgrove and any guy that you want to pick in the past 30 years thst has finished in the top 10 in CY voting.
He has upside and may not be a 3 6 mo this from now but come on dude his stats are what they are.
Joel P
He pitched like a borderline number 1 last year but he doesn’t have the track record some guys do. Many pitchers don’t pitch deep into games these days. Snell won the Cy Young he doesn’t pitch deep into games.
El Niño
I guess we just have different definitions of a #1. I need 7 inning out of you every night at least to be a #1.
Joel P
Merrill had a sub 800 OPS at both high A and AA last year. He’s not great defensively. He’s not particularly fast. What makes him a top 10 prospect? Don’t tell me what other people say and think look for yourself.
El Niño
Have you scouted him in person to say he’s not great defensively? Its silly to say “don’t listen to the experts who do this for a living” haha come on guy.
Joel P
If you think Luzardo is a number 3 starter then why do you want the Padres to trade for him?
Come on dude. I enjoy discussing things with fans from other teams but this gets old. I am not a Padres fan or a Dodgers fan. I have no bias here.
El Niño
Not sure who you’re talking to – I’d love having him in the padres rotation.
Joel P
How many guys in 2023 averaged 7 innings per start????
Look it up
Joel P
Yes. I have. He’s decent. When I say not great i mean he isn’t an amazing defender that would cause people to ignore his lack of hitting skills.
What makes Merrill special? You tell me. What does he do that other guys can’t do?
El Niño
Exactly.youre just throwing around labels. What’s a #1/2 to you?
Joel P
I am talking to 2 different people dude. Figure it out.
El Niño
I think you’re lying and I’m muting you.
Joel P
I am not the one throwing labels around another guy said Luzardo was a number 3 starter. He’s not and I explained why.
Joel P
What a loser. Good lord people. Do you want to talk with nothing but Padres fans and have them tell you how right you are? If so go ahead. Again I am not a Padres fan. I am not a fan of their rival. Unbiased opinion here just a baseball fan.
Longtimecoming
Joel you lost of credibility when you suggest we should disregard various experts for you. There just isn’t any defending this.
Longtimecoming
Joel – because padres need a 3 with some upside to fill out their rotation – that’s why.
Joel P
I didn’t say anyone should disregard the experts. I said WHEN THEY UPDATE THE RANKINGS MERRILL WILL DROP. That’s what I said. And he will.
Trade values says Merrill for Luzardo is fair. That’s a completely unbiased source.
You want credibility? Go to the Juan Soto post a day before he got dealt on this site. Look at what I said was a fair trade. Countless Padres fans, and I am pretty sure that list included you, said the Padres would get more. And I was right. Look it up. Go ahead I will wait.
Pads Fans
Joel, you are the one that said the Padres HAVE to get to $200 million and on this thread you are trying to say they won’t spend any more than the $150 million they have on the books already. You are wrong almost every post and your opinion doesn’t matter when you are almost always wrong.
YOU said that Thorpe and King were too good to be involved in the trade for Soto. Guess what? The Padres got BOTH plus the Yankees starting catcher AND 2 other MLB pitchers.
So we are supposed to believe YOU have any clue what you are talking about? Seriously?
Luzardo is a #3 on any contending team. He is good, but his 4.30 ERA over the past 3 seasons and 3.58 ERA last season are not TOR starter numbers. If Alcantara was not out all of 2024 he would be the #3 on the Marlins. behind Alcantara and Perez.
Last season for the Padres Luzardo would have had the 5th best ERA among starters. Only Darvish would have finished behind him.
Among starters with 100 IP last season, he ranks 36th.
He IS a very good young starter that the Padres can slot in behind Musgrove and Darvish.
So we should be asking, WTH are YOU talking about Joel.
Pads Fans
Long, you hit the nail on the head. Luzardo is a really good #3 starter right now.
Pads Fans
Yes they are. Just not Merrill or Salas type of valuable.
Javia135
@Joel P
You keep saying that Merrill’s ranking is going to drop when the new prospect rankings come out. I am just wondering, do you have an inside source? I have seen nothing, NOTHING suggesting his ranking will drop. Do you have some evidence, or does just repeatedly saying something make it true?
Joel P
Pads fans what the heck are you talking about? I never said anything that specific about the Padres payroll. Never once said that. I have no clue why you are arguing about something I never said.
It’s lame that you are getting weirdly defensive about the teams payroll. Thats weird man.
Again trade values says Merrill for Luzardo is fair. They are an unbiased source unlike you who clearly has a bias.
Javia135
You can see above that I already commented a while ago that Merrill for Luzardo was fair according to BTV. Now, what makes you think Merrill’s ranking will drop?
Joel P
Java look at his stats. They don’t warrant a top 10 ranking. That’s why. He had really good numbers in 2022 in a short period of time. In 2023 his numbers weren’t that good. Just compare him to other top shortstop prospects. It’s clear he’s a bit overrated at the moment.
Does it really matter? People get defensive about weird stuff. I am a Cardinal fan I will tell you to your face Jordan Walker was and is overrated. Not gonna lie just because i cheer for the Cardinals.
Joel P
Ok then we agree Merrill for Luzardo is fair. So who cares what I think about Merrill and his current prospect ranking?
Pads Fans
WAR is a counting stat. The more starts you make, the higher your possible WAR.
Luzardo has a 4.30 ERA the past 3 seasons and a 3,58 ERA last season. He has been EXACTLY league average the last 3 seasons. That is a #3 starter.
He ranked 36th among starters with at least 100 IP last season. Since there were a bunch of people that are considered better that didn’t throw that many innings like Musgrove, Fried, Skubal, Manning, Perez on his own team, Quintana, Buehler, May, its pretty easy to say that he lines up as the #3 on most teams.
Javia135
The team Merrill was playing for had their season end 1 month after the rankings were last updated. His numbers have actually gone UP since then. Try again.
Pads Fans
You do realize that Merrill has numbers that are similar to the kid that the Brewers just locked up for 8 years and $80 million before he played a game in the majors, right?
.282 .338 .467 .805 44 SB
.277 .326 .444 .770 35 SB
Merrill plays SS and is great on defense to the point he is expected to stick at SS if not blocked by a superstar.
That YOU don’t realize his value is on you. Everyone that is an actual expert says he is one of the top 10 prospects in baseball. All of the major scouting services have him in the top 10. So what does it say when all of the guys that are paid to rate prospects agree, but you think something different? I will leave that up to you to decipher.
Pads Fans
Joel, you are trying to say that a consensus top 10 prospect is not very good, but a guy that has a 4.30 ERA over the past 3 seasons is a TOR starter. Do you REALLY think we will value your opinion enough to discuss it further?
Joel P
Look at Masyn Winn. He’s a year older than Merrill so look at his 2022. His 2022 was better than Merrills 2023. And Winn was never a top 10 prospect. And keep in mind Winn is a far superior defensive shortstop.
Again who cares?
Pads Fans
Javia, he is making stuff up. BA has an updated list out and Merrill moved UP.
Pads Fans
Yes, you did. More than once. Lying is not a good look.
Javia135
I apologize for being a bit rude in my last comment.
Pads Fans
So you are saying that Chourio’s stats don’t merit a top 10 ranking or the contract he just got?
Joel P
Pads fans you are weird. You are making things up and then arguing against them. I don’t get it.
Chourio is younger.
Longtimecoming
“Don’t tell me what other people think” in direct response to your being told where he ranked on various list.
Oh yes my friend, you said it.
Joel P
There is 1 unbiased source here that attempts to provide value for both Luzardo and Merrill in a trade scenario like the one that’s being discussed. It’s the trade values website if you aren’t familiar with it I recommend checking it out. Now it doesn’t make it fact but that’s as good as we got.
Luzardo 63.3 million surplus value
Merrill 58.3 million surplus value
They actually have Luzardo being more valuable but I am not sitting here saying that. I am saying it’s a fair trade. The same thing the guys who make a living determining trade value are saying.
Now you can tell me blah blah blah. But that’s where we are at here.
Joel P
Who cares if I think Merrill should be ranked 19th instead of 9th on the prospect list?????
Who cares??????
It makes no difference at all. I am a stranger on the internet.
Pads Fans
Joel, You mean the Same BTV site that said that Grisham was an overpay in a trade for Cole or Judge. The same site that says that trading Merrill for Lindor is an overpay for the Padres? That site?
That is why no intelligent person ever tries to pass off BTV as a site worth bothering with. Then there is you.
Pads Fans
It makes a HUGE difference. That you don’t know that Joel tells us ALL we need to know about your lack of knowledge of the game and prospects in particular.
Joel P
Nobody is trading for Cole or Judge because they make gigantic sums of money. That’s the reason they don’t have a lot of trade value not because they are bad players. Figure it out fella.
Pads Fans
Joel, quit while you are behind. Cole had 7.4 WAR and $30+ million in surplus value last season alone. Using the standard age based regression, he will provide $112 million in surplus value over the next 5 seasons. To say that Grisham is worth more in surplus value than Cole is ludicrous. BTV is a joke. A bad joke. So are your opinions.
Joel P
And what about Judge? How could Judge possibly have any trade value? I think Cole is worth more than Grisham sure bit Judge isn’t his trade value is negative.
Pads Fans
Starters with a 4.30 ERA and 100 ERA+ over the past 3 seasons are middle of the rotation starters.
In 2024 he was ranked 36th among starters with 100 IP. Considering how many pitchers that are considerably better didn’t have that many innings, that puts Luzardo squarely around #45 for that one season and teams rarely make huge trades based on one season.
But then you think that BTV has value, so that tells us all we need to know about your lack of knowledge of this subject.
Pads Fans
Chourio is 1 year younger. So tell me what you think I made up. I posted the actual stats.
YOU on the other hand never have. You post opinions. Some based on the most ridiculous site on baseball I have ever seen. THEN you try to justify their lack of relevance. Its time for you to leave the discussion of baseball to the adults in the room. People that actually understand the game.
Pads Fans
Joel, Who thinks Winn is superior other than you? Point us to any of the scouting services. Did MLB say that? Did BA say that? Did BP say that?
Nope. They all say that Merrill is the superior player. So why should we believe your opinion when you never, ever back it up with any kind of facts? When ALL the real experts say you are wrong. Tell us that Joel.
BaseballisLife
Considering what Rosenthal said the Royals offered, that is the most realistic trade suggestion I have seen.
HBan22
Merrill for Luzardo is definitely a very fair trade in my opinion.
Pads Fans
Merrill is not in the conversation. Now that we know that Rosenthal said they were talking about a Pasquantino for Luzardo 1 for 1 trade at the Winter Meetings, we know that Luzardo is not worth nearly what even I thought he was. Merrill is far too much to pay for Luzardo.
beyou02215
Ask yourself – If the roles were reversed and the Pares had Luzardo and that Marlins had Kim, would the Padres trade 3 years of Luzardo for 1 year of Kim? Of course not.
Longtimecoming
Complete the actual situation: if the Padres had a surplus of SP and no middle INF and needed a 5 + war SS they only cost 8 mil.
Also, I had a prospect attached which could net a high upside LH SP like Jagger Haynes or a C they they also need from back 10-15 of SD top 30.
This was presented by the writer as a need based scenario so I went with that motivation.
rotofool
I would imagine young teams on the verge of contending would be ideal fits, with AL teams especially likely trade partners with MIA. BAL would be an ideal landing spot for both player and club.
O’sfan222
As an orioles fan this is the guy I want. We have Ortiz Westburg Norby and more outfielders available to make this happen
Joel P
The Marlins need a shortstop and a catcher. Those I believe are their biggest needs. Also perhaps an outfield/DH type like they lost with Soler.
MacGromit
totally agreed Elias needs to stop talking to the White Sox about their insane ask for 2 yrs of Cease and flip prospects and maybe a major leaguer like Mateo for Lazardo. A trade that would benefit both teama.
Joel P
Mateo is basically a throw in although I think the Marlins would want him. Kjerstad is the guy I think the Marlins would want.
MacGromit
marlins need a defensive plug at SS, Mateo is that guy. O’s have a myriad of prospect bats to headline the trade. wish O’s could get Tanner Scott back in a blockbuster prospect package deal for Luzardo and Scott. I realize they signed Kimbrel, maybe he gets packaged with Mateo and a prospect or two. wonder what the trade o matic scores that.
Poolhalljunkies
Send him to boston they have the young controllable hitting mia could use
kasey
Angels get on the phone !
MLB Top 100 Commenter
Rays hardly traded Archer at “peak value” although they received a “peak return” that helped them and hurt the Pirates for years to come. The Rays are now even getting Ryan Pepiot out of that deal.
rangers13
With Scherzer down perhaps some combo of Duran, Taveras, Huff, and Crimm for Luzardo ot Garrett
jvent
McNeil for Luzardo, the Mets can put Jett Williams or Acuna at 2b and lead off giving the Mets some speed, moving Nimmo and Lindor down a spot, gives them speed at the top 3 ?
Gives the Mets 3/4/5 Senga/Luzardo/Severino than we just need a 1 & 2 lol
Sid Bream Speed Demon
LOLOLOLOL
Seaver rules
Good job Jvent. McNeil is expendable and has a friendly contract and the Mets have done big deals with Marlins before when getting Piazza and Delgado.
Slow day at work
@jvent Maybe if the Mets pay for 90% of McNeil’s contract
rememberthecoop
What? Bemdix would hang up the phone so fast that it would burst into pieces!
MARLIN POWER 18
I like McNeil, but who else are you offering? Jeff alone isn’t going to get it done.
beyou02215
Not close.
DTrainSTA
With Sandy out and Eury only entering his first full season in the Majors then it will probably take a lot for us to trade Luzardo. But if some team is willing to blow us away with an offer we should definitely consider it.
evilroyslade
Gleyber Torres for Luzardo
wvsteve
Where is Torres playing? One year of him for 3 of a starting pitcher?
rememberthecoop
Thanks for the good laugh.
wvsteve
Only a few teams have the goods to get him
reno24
Man there is a lot of disrespect for Luzardo wit these suggested offers. Apparently he is only worth older, middle of the road 2nd basemen? I’m thinking something like Mayo and Westburg for Luzardo or Lowder, Arroyo and Collier for Luzardo.
Wire to wire 2024
How about marte and collier
Longtimecoming
Reno – HSK was 5.8 WAR playing SS 2b and 3b at high levels and SS mainly in 22 and would slot into SS for most teams right now.
He is far from old / is in his prime and only makes 8 mil in 24.
That is a lot of value at premium position even if only 1 year. Miami can pick a lottery pick pitcher from SD’s 20-30 (a very strong farm so not like some teams 20-30).
reno24
Luzardo is way more valuable than 1 year of Kim and a C- prospect
Brew’88
1 year of Soto plus Grisham didn’t command anything close to Luzardo in value, so I doubt 1 year of Kim will.
Longtimecoming
You maybe be right but not apples to apples. Soto for 1 year at 33 mil and his 5 + WAR verses HSK at SS and his 5 + WAR for only 8 mil.
Grish was a salary dump so it lessened the return – not increased it. A 20 SD prospect is a + not a -.
Brew’88
good points. LT
Pads Fans
Considering the fact that Machado will not start the season at 3B, why would Preller even consider trading him when he doesn’t have to.
The Padres have so many quality prospects that they can acquire Luzardo without even touching their top 3. That seems more likely. Remember, prospects are suspects. Kim is a proven commodity. One of the best overall players in MLB.
Big whiffa
How bout from reds- marte, Brandon Williamson, and india ?
MARLIN POWER 18
Or maybe Marte and Encarnacion-Strand. First baseman of the future. How’s that for firepower?
Pads Fans
Arroyo, Phillips, and India could get that done.
Alex O.
I could see the Mets going after him
RealJimRome
The Dodgers should acquire him
Chemo850
I seriously doubt he’s the one they trade from their rotation. He’s the most likely to sign a team friendly extension and MIA over the last few years has pivoted towards targeting guys who have ties to the area for a reason. I think Edward Cabrera might be the odd guy out if anyone goes. He’s ceiling is just as high and is less predictable at this point
Joel P
Yes Luzardo is from the area I think he’s the least likely to be traded. Garrett is darn similar if that’s the type of pitcher the Marlins want to trade or teams want to trade for.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Red Sox should be interested
vikingbluejay67
This is why the Marlins will never actually contend. Trash organization.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
They’ve won two World Series. That’s more than a lot of other teams. They have yet to win the division, ironically, but I think they’ll compensate instead for those World Series wins.
I wouldn’t call that trash. Look at the other teams who spend so much that they have aging old players that they can’t move. That could be more of a “trash” state debatedly.
MARLIN POWER 18
@Cora the Explora
Couldn’t have expressed it better.
Go Marlins!
stretch123
If he can flip Luzardo for at the minimum, for 3 good to great prospects that can help the club in 2024/2025 and beyond, I would do it. Especially if they can get controllable bats.
Not having Alcantara next season kills any chance of a deep playoff run in 2024, let alone a playoff berth. Meyer, Perez and Rodgers will all likely be on innings limit next year. Soriano and Puk will be transitioning to starting. Chisholm still has to prove he can stay healthy.
If anything, 2024 feels like it will be a re-tooling, prove what you got year for most players on the roster while the pitching staff sorts itself out for 2025.
Big whiffa
Retooling ? Best try to stick to overachieving 2.0. Get mlb ready controllable bats
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Don’t rule them out now. Anything can happen, even if it doesn’t seem likely.
s.drinkwater
I feel like Luzardo is worth four top end prospects given the control his new team and sky-rocketing price on starting pitching and even more so for a lefty starter. The Fish obviously need a catcher and a shortstop and I suspect a righty starter with Alcantara out for the year. I feel like it is more likely Garrett or Rogers is moved than Luzardo
iron
Toronto seems like a great fit. Adam Macko, Orelvis Martinez and Alejandro Kirk for Luzardo and a small throw-in prospect. I don’t think they would deal Davis Schneider but maybe switch him for one of the guys I listed. Maybe add Manoah to the mix.
baked mcbride
Anyone listen to the band Jesus Lizard? Great band if 90’s weirdo punk is you’re thing.
Bart Harley Jarvis
And there’s always this:
youtu.be/45yabrnryXk?si=en3zq_Y0fxnOQH73
octavian8
India, Williamson, Barrero and Collier for Luzardo? Any takers?
HBan22
Not enough. Edwin Arroyo would need to be included, if not Marte.
Kershaw'sRightArm
Dodgers enter the chat…
Simm
Not looking for deferred players.
Dodgers exit the chat
Kershaw'sRightArm
What the ol'”player to be named later” isn’t applicable anymore? 😉
baked mcbride
Bring this man to Baltimore, Mr. Elias.
stretch123
Will cost ya Jordan Westburg, Sam Basallo, and a couple other prospects. Seems like a win win for both teams
Pads Fans
That would probably get it done.
MacGromit
that’s way too steep an ask, even for Jesus
stretch123
Disagreed. Orioles have Adley and a ton of middle IF prospects. Why not do this for 3 years of a solid No 2 starter if you’re them?
HBan22
These two teams match up extremely well for a Luzardo trade.
Go Go Power Rangers
Rangers need a starter now and they have a lot of depth in the middle infield. Would like to see them do something now that Scherzer is out.
deGrom/Langford Texas Ranger
Come to the WS Champs! Duran and some other prospectsbesides Langford and Carter would make sense.
MacGromit
@MarlinPower
Orioles: Mateo SS, Stowers OF prospect, Mayo 3B/1B prospect.
Marlins: Luzardo LHP.
how’s that sound?
MarlinsFanBase
@MacGromit
How’s that sound?
Pretty stupid for the Marlins and our fan base.
HBan22
Coby Mayo is going to be a stud. That trade is a lot closer to being fair than you think. And the Orioles are a great match in trade for Luzardo. They are overflowing with young position players, some of which play premium positions of which the Marlins are in dire need of filling (SS, C). I’d say of all teams, the Orioles may match up the best with the Marlins on a Luzardo trade.
Mikey P
I’m not knowledgeable enough on the marlins as I only closely pretend to be a GM for my team, sounds like Elly or McLain straight up is easy but as a reds fan, I’d much prefer Marte. Does Marte + Lowder for Luzardo and something mid range sound right?
riffraff
Morel, Shaw, Wisdom be enough from the cubs?
MARLIN POWER 18
No. Those guys are overrated.
HBan22
Shaw would be a decent starting point, but it’d take a good deal more than that offer.
Cody1981
Royals could go maikel Garcia, mj, Massey and like Carlos Hernandez and get like Jesus or Logan Gilbert from Seattle
HBan22
Not nearly enough for either of those pitchers.
MarlinsFanBase
Gog to Seattle. The pipe dream is more like to happen there with their GM.
Yazmyhero
Luzardo to Boston for Ceddane Raphaela, Bobby Dalbec and Brandon Walters.0
MarlinsFanBase
How old are you?
Melchez17
Torkelson from the Tigers? Move Malloy or Jung to 1B
Harris should try and put his name on this roster… instead he’s just signing players from the dumpster.
MarlinsFanBase
Yep, Marlins are in the business of making the Tigers better; not themselves.
gr81t2
Come on Os. Make it happen
Biggie22
Oh now I see why the Reds signed Candelario:)…. Marlins are interested in young SS, huh…
Marte is exactly the kind of mlb ready prospect it would take to headline a package to get him IMO…
MarlinsFanBase
Yep….it’s definitely YOUR opinion.
Biggie22
Yep a top 25 prospect with MLB experience who plays a premium position to start with; I think that would be most Marlins fans opinion if they’re actually nuts enough to trade him:)…
Although, I kinda think if they trade from the rotation; Cabrera might be the likelier candidate…
HBan22
Marte for Luzardo would be a pretty fair deal.
wvsteve
The marlins have the batting champ at 2nd and
A 30 hr guy at 3rd. It would take a very good proven short stop with lots of control. Not many teams have that. He’s not going anywhere
MARLIN POWER 18
@wvsteve
Absolutely. But in point of fact, it would take a lot more than just one very good MLB-ready player coming back. Advantage Marlins. And that’s not being greedy. That’s reality.
wvsteve
I agree. Not many teams match up with this maybe except Baltimore. I hate it when fans from the big teams think they are getting a very good starting pitcher with years of control for absolutely a bunch of prospects. Marlins need to hold on to him
Pads Fans
The Marlins were discussing a 1 for 1 trade for Vinnie Psquantino at the Winter Meetings and the Royals backed out because they felt that was too much for Luzardo according to Rosenthal.
Either Rosenthal is lying, which is a possibility, or you may want to temper your expectations.
Mntwins187
The Twins have it and think we match up well. We have Royce Lewis and Brooks Lee. Guessing the fish would want Lee over Lewis. Lee would be your starting shortstop for the next 10 years.
clayton.shields88
Christopher Morel for Luzardo
HBan22
Seriously?
MarlinsFanBase
@clayton.shields88
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
and…
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
westcasey
Marlins are shaking heads at pipe dream commenters here.
Starting pitching is premium priced. Luzardo is 3 years, #2, #3 starter, LH. (sorry Boston)
Miami has needs at C, SS, OF, 1B, DH and will want pitching back in return.
No team will be able to check all boxes but your trade offer better include several of those boxes and for more than one season. It might take 120% trade value. I speak for Marlins.
So heads up Baltimore, Cincinnati, LA, NY.
SD is a pretender..
MARLIN POWER 18
@westcasey
Amen, brother. You speak the truth. And here’s the thing: If we have to meet those needs through FA signings (like short-term deals for Amed Rosario or Tim Anderson at SS) or internal candidates like Xavier Edwards (UT), Troy Johnston (1B/DH) and Dane Myers (OF) rather than trades, the team will be still be ready to make a serious run in 2024. Guaranteed. So, it’s like, “You want Luzardo? Fine. We can talk. Just don’t waste our time with joke offers.”
HBan22
I gotta say, the amount of truly awful trade proposals in this thread are astounding. 26 year old borderline aces with three years of control do not come cheaply at all. Prying Luzardo away will require a haul.
JB571
Orioles get Luzardo for
Colton Cowser O’s #2 (14 top 100)
Joey Ortiz #6 (50 top 100)
Jud Fabian #13
Cole Irvin LHP w/ 3 years of control
At the very least, it would get the Marlins’ attention
MARLIN POWER 18
@JB571
I’m interested. Luzardo (plus others) for Cowser, Irvin, Westburg, & Basallo.
Mntwins187
I am a Twins fan and we actually match up really well. I would give up Brooks Lee for Luzardo. Brooks Lee is going to be a super star and we are loaded at short. You have to give up something to get something.
Joel P
Twins and Marlins have to both be happy with the Lopez Arraez deal. And the needs match up well. Probably takes a bit more than Lee but it’s definitely a good start.
MarlinsFanBase
Sheesh! It seems every single time an article or rumor like this comes out, we see some sort of competition to see who can make the dumbest trade suggestion.
Mntwins187
You would not trade Luzardo for Royce Lewis or Brooks Lee?
MarlinsFanBase
Nope. Gonna take more than that for a PROVEN MLB SP.
BaseballisLife
What is your dumb trade suggestion? Rosenthal says that Pasquantino was going to be enough. What says you.
MarlinsFanBase
What says me? Did the trade happen? Nope.
Pads Fans
The trade didn’t happen because the Royals backed out. Not the Marlins, the Royals.
Ma4170
Yeah pasquantino shouldnt be considered near enough, so i doubt how realistic that was. Prob would have wanted more back than that.
Pads Fans
Actually, Rosenthal said the Royals backed out.
LambchoP
We need to keep Lewis and Lee. Offer the fish Polonco and a sweetner.
MARLIN POWER 18
@LambchoP
Never happen. If you want Luzardo, it’ll cost you Brooks Lee, Walker Jenkins and Alex Kirilloff. We’ll toss in some cash and a PTBNL.
Mntwins187
Well you need to stop sniffing paint chips if you think you would get Brooks Lee and Walker Jenkins. I realize you have to give up something to get something but we could get pretty much anyone if we offered Jenkins and Lee in the same deal.
Mntwins187
Dream on man. You are not going to get Luzardo for Polanco and a bunch of junk. You have to give up something to get something. Now Mr Marlin Power is on something if he thinks Luzardo is worth Brooks Lee and Walker Jenkins. One of them yeah but no way in hell both of them..
MARLIN POWER 18
@Mntwins187
I realize what a fantastic prospect Jenkins is. Doesn’t hurt to ask. But for me, any viable deal with the Twins has to include either Lee or Lewis, plus Kirillof. A deal with the Royals would cost them Pasquantino, C Freddy Fermin, and INF Nick Loftin. They’d receive Luzardo plus prospects.
Mntwins187
Now i would do a Kiriloff and Lee for Luzardo all day long. That is a good deal for both teams imo.
Seamaholic
Vinnie’s a good hitter, but if Miami even considered for a hot second trading Luzardo for him they should be rethinking their front office.
HBan22
Agreed. I was pretty shocked to read that the Marlins would even consider that. Makes it sound like they may be selling low on him, in which case a whole lot of teams should be calling the Marlins right now.
Joel P
Pasquantino and Singer. That’s a fair deal for Luzardo.
BaseballisLife
If all it would have taken to get Luzardo is Vinnie Pasquantino then a whole bunch of people on here have overestimated Luzardo’s value.
Including the guy that posted just above me.
¡Killer Klowns From Outer Space!
Read my comment below. As Marlins fan since 1993, I just don’t get it. I don’t get how they’ve made themselves the laughingstock of MLB. It’s as if they are trying to lose. They are notorious for getting mauled in trades which makes me wonder how hard it could be to become an MLB GM. Zeus is an Ace.
BaseballisLife
Luzardo is an often injured middle of the rotation starter. He might be a number two in some team’s rotation, but not any team that is looking to go far in the playoffs.
Its likely that with Alcantara’s injury the Marlins are taking a step back and trying to reload with MLB ready prospects to take another run in 2025. Trading Luzardo would do that and probably at multiple positions.
BoomersOwnEverything
Padres new ownership officially putting up the “For Sale” sign
jeremyn
I’d be NUCLEAR pissed if they traded Luzardo…. not only is he a local… he went to the same high school as me and is a hero to a broken community (Stoneman Douglas)….. the Marlins should be targeting Anthony Rizzo if possible and bring him home.. not getting rid of their few local heroes
Big Smoke
Anthony Rizzo lmao
jeremyn
I went to high school with him.. I know first hand he wants to play for the Marlins.. it’s just never happened
J leathal86
Ortiz for luzardo
Orioles need to get in this guy quick
HBan22
Ortiz, Samuel Basallo and Kyle Stowers would definitely get it done.
BreezyB
No it wouldn’t. Close but need a higher ranked prospect to headline
HBan22
Basallo is an elite prospect. Ortiz was ranked as a top 100 prospect as recently as last season. They play catcher and shortstop, the two positions the Marlins have the biggest holes at. Stowers isn’t far removed from being a top 100 prospect himself, and has mashed at AAA the past two seasons. That package is more than enough to net them Luzardo.
¡Killer Klowns From Outer Space!
I don’t get it.
Why would the Marlins trade Zeus? He’s a budding Ace. What indication is he not?
He just turned 26? Is under team control for 3 more years, and it seems as every trade candidate of the Marlins year after year not only surprises me, but the rumors we hear of whom they’re being dangled for and peoples trade scenarios blow my mind.
Luis Castillo, 31, nets top 20 prospect Noelvi Marte, Edwin Arroyo + 2, but the framework for a Luzardo trade would be Vinnie Pasquetino?
Someone in the comment section here who says they’re a Padres fan says Luzardo isn’t an Ace and a 3.58 ERA is no good, yet he wants the Padres to trade for him and should dangle… Jake Cronenworth?
Maybe it’s simply the way the Marlins organization is viewed based off of a history of horrible trades, signings, and rumors, but cmon. Bendix was brought in for a reason, so is he coming to build a contender or destroy the organization.
If my Marlins should trade any starters it should be Rogers. Edward is a budding Ace if he can get that control together, he’s young enough. Braxton is a stud, unfortunately our pitches don’t get their props because a Marlins prospect is viewed differently than a Dodgers prospect. Just go to Rotoworld and you’d think Emmet Sheehan is better than Eury Perez.
Anyhow, hopefully the Marlins don’t trade Zeus
Joel P
Pasquantino and Singer for Luzardo would be solid. Singer has some upside.
MARLIN POWER 18
Throw in Loftin or Fermin and we have a deal.
BaseballisLife
The name fits. Marlins were a contender last season. That is what being in the playoffs means. In case you missed it, the Marlins had the same number of wins as the team that made it to the WS from the NL.
Why was Castillo worth more? He was coming off his 4th straight season of taking the ball every 5th game and had already done so that season when he was traded. Luzardo is in his 5th major league season and last year was the only one in which he didn’t miss large amounts of the season due to injury.
Tommy John in 2016 in the minors then in the majors there has been the rotator cuff in 2019 then the lat strain then the left hand in 2021 then the forearm strain that forced him to the IL for half of 2022. That is why the Royals thought Vinnie Pasquantino was too much to give up to get Luzardo.
¡Killer Klowns From Outer Space!
I love how all the commenters offers are the number 29/30’s prospects of said organization for Luzardo. Give me a break.
Mntwins187
Well I offered Brooks Lee who is the #1 prospect in our organization and is major league ready right now.
baseballlover6363
As a marlins fan I would take that deal there are details that need to be worked out but no more top 8 prospects on top would be needed. I think this is very fair coming from another team and it shows you clearly understand it takes value to get value.
MacGromit
never going to happen. why don’t you also ask for Holliday and Henderson too? I think you’ve severely overvalued Luzardo. he’s a good pitcher but Basillo is a super young stud.
MARLIN POWER 18
@MacGromit
How about Luzardo, P Dax Fulton, OF Peyton Burdick, & 3B Jacob Berry for Colton Cowser, Sam Basallo, & Jordan Westburg? Great deal for both clubs.
Pads Fans
He was 36th in ERA and FIP last season among starters with at least 100 IP. Considering how many guys that are considered to be better had less innings because of injuries, he is closer to 45th than top 20.
BaseballisLife
Luzardo has been injury plagued since he was a top prospect back before the 2019 with the A’s. 2023 has been the only season in his 5 in the majors that he has not spent significant time on the IL.
johnboy1963
How about brewers trading adames and some minor leaguers for him
MARLIN POWER 18
No deal. Next contestant …
kwolf68
Gotta love this conversation. First of all Jackson Merrill is not a top 5 overall prospect in any publication I could find. I’ve seen him as high as low 10s to mid 20s. Good prospect? For sure. But I argue he WOULD be a legit part of any package for Luzardo.
I know how this works, Padres fans want Luzardo, but want to give up just a bunch of decent stuff in A ball. Not gonna happen. Oh I get it Luzardo has had a few uneven years, but lets take a deeper dive into this player.
Luzardo has always been known as having an elite arm, came up with great prospect pedigree. He struggled and then as he hit his mid 20s last year seemed to start to put it together. It is NOT unheard of for players to take a couple years to figure it out. MLB Baseball is hard. If you can’t get the sense that 2023 is looking like a true breakout year for Luzardo then you are not or just don’t want to pay attention.
This is a young fire balling lefty with good control, coming from a reference point of always being one of the more respected young lefties in the game starting to put it together.
You won’t get a mid 20s lefty that started showing last year what most prognosticators said he had in his left arm for just a bunch of stuff. In fact, Miami SHOULD NOT trade him unless they get a legitimately good offer they like. They have no reason to trade him. So Padres fans offering a bunch of guys the 8-30 range of their system won’t work. I argue if Merrill is a piece Miami wants they have every right to ask for that and would NOT be unreasonable if they wouldn’t do the deal without him.
Young starting arms with that kind of upside now tapping into that upside doesn’t grow on trees. I think a package starting off with Merrill and Snelling is a good opening salvo, but even then the Marlins would need another piece or two as Snelling has no time above A ball and Merrill just got to AA.
Brew’88
This is a silly biased argument.
But here are two that have Merrill at #9.
mlb.com/prospects
theathletic.com/4814152/2023/08/30/top-50-mlb-pros…
So you can call him a top 10 prospect and not be wrong.
He’s really good and could become an elite MLB SS which has some value. Most Padre fans I know want to keep him and not trade him to Miami
BreezyB
What’s more valuable a young lefty high upside pitcher who’s proven in the MLB or another 20 year old short stop prospect that’s only hit .800+ ops once in his 3 seasons?
I’m gonna go out on a limb and say Luzardo has a lot more value
HBan22
I agreed with you up until the end where you suggested it would cost the Padres both Merrill and Snelling, if not more, to acquire Luzardo. There is absolutely no way they’d trade both for him. Snelling himself has similar upside to Luzardo, and may be ready by the end of 2024. Merrill for Luzardo, perhaps with another couple other minor pieces involved, is a very fair trade in my opinion. Something like Merrill, Brandon Valenzuela (Padres #10 prospect), and Isaiah Lowe (Padres #22 prospect) should be more than enough to get it done.
21Clemente21
Pirates may end up with this guy
MARLIN POWER 18
@21Clemente21
How do you figure? The stat lines on Pirates hitters are somewhat less than impressive despite the hype (e.g., Cruz, Suwinski), and we’re looking to add real offense (power & average), not three-true-outcome highlight-reel talent. No disrespect. The young Pirates may yet evolve. But so far, no.
Berischa
My Orioles should really consider it, we have the prospects and a rotation of Bradish, Rodriguez as right hand pitchers and Means and Luzardo as lefties plus Kremer, it would work IMO
Ma4170
I have an outlandish three way trade that will never happen, but why not, just for fun. Let the insults begin!
Mets get: luzardo, puk
Cubs get: alonso, fulton
Marlins get: morel, alcantara
baseballlover6363
@Ma4170 your level of baseball intelligence is insulting at best with that proposal
Ma4170
Thats not true at all, not even close actually, especially with some of the joke talent evaluation i see on here. so what exactly do you think reflects my lack of baseball knowledge?
MARLIN POWER 18
@Ma4170
Maybe for Alcantara & Pete Crow-Armstrong. Not Morel. He’s a strikeout machine. We’re looking for high-average contact hitters w./some pop.
Ma4170
@marlin I keep hearing they want to replace the power lost w/ Soler, and Morel is basically a similar profile hitter. Cubs will never part w/ PCA unfortunately.
MARLIN POWER 18
@Ma4170
I get it. He’s your top guy. Then we’d ask for Alcantara, James Triantos, & Owen Caissie. You’d receive Puk & Luzardo, along w. OFs Victor Mesa Jr. & Peyton Burdick.
MARLIN POWER 18
Correction. The METS would receive Luzardo and Puk, and your CUBS would get Alonzo, Fulton, Burdick and Mesa Jr. MARLINS would obtain Caissie, Alcantara, and Triantos.
Ma4170
It’s funny bc I’m actually a met fan. I just know the cubs have pretty much said PCA is untouchable, which I get since he’s a top 20 prospect. Cubs might consider that since they wouldn’t lose a sp prospect.