Veteran free agent Justin Turner was among the most reliable hitters in Boston last year, slashing a solid .275/.345/.455 with 23 home runs and a 17.6% strikeout rate. Taken together, that offensive production was 14% better than league average by measure of wRC+ despite Turner posting his highest strikeout rate since 2014 and lowest walk rate since 2016. Though Turner declined his player option with the Red Sox and decided to test the open market ahead of his age-39 season, the infielder spoke to reporters recently (as relayed by MassLive’s Chris Cotillo) regarding his free agency and his desire to return to the Red Sox.
“I would love to be back and be with the Sox,” Turner said, “…what I’ve heard from all these guys is how amazing this town is when you’re making a playoff run. I want to be a part of that. It has been A-plus across the board in everything we’ve done and that’s with finishing in fifth place in the AL East. I want to know what it’s like to play in a playoff game for the Red Sox, not against them.”
Though Turner made his desire to remain in Boston clear, he also admitted that he’s fielded interest from more teams this season than he did as a free agent last year. Cotillo notes that the Dodgers, Diamondbacks, Marlins, and Angels all made offers to the veteran last year. The Diamondbacks are once again rumored to be interested in Turner’s services this offseason, though it’s unclear what other clubs may have interest in Turner this offseason. That uncertainty surrounds the Red Sox, themselves, as the club’s level of interest in Turner for 2024 and beyond isn’t entirely clear.
MassLive’s Sean McAdam recently suggested that the Red Sox “may be reluctant” to offer Turner a a two-year guarantee this offseason, noting that newly-minted chief baseball officer Craig Breslow has spoken of the DH as a way to rest players. While McAdam notes that Breslow would not rule out having one player serve as the club’s regular DH, a desire to utilize players such as Masataka Yoshida at DH could limit the club’s interest in a reunion with Turner, who played 98 games at DH and combined for less than 400 innings of work in the field split between first, second, and third base in 2023.
Turner isn’t the only newly-minted free agent to recently discuss his future after spending 2023 in Boston. Veteran right-hander Corey Kluber has returned to the open market after a tough season in Boston where he posted a 7.04 ERA (65 ERA+) with a 7.11 FIP in 55 innings of work while striking out just 16.3% of batters faced. On top of the brutal on-field performance, Kluber battled shoulder injuries throughout the year that ultimately left him sidelined for the season by late June. Kluber was noncommittal when asked if he intends to continue his playing career in 2024, with Alex Speier of the Boston Globe relaying that the veteran righty simply responded to the question with “we’ll see.”
Given his deep struggles in Boston this season, it’s somewhat difficult to imagine the sides coming together on a reunion even if Kluber decides to pitch next season. While the Red Sox are expected to make pitching help a priority this offseason, the club already has right-handers Nick Pivetta, Tanner Houck, Kutter Crawford, and Garrett Whitlock as starting caliber options alongside Chris Sale for the middle-to-back of the club’s rotation, and the addition of Kluber at this stage of his career would be unlikely to move the needle for a club more in need of impact than depth in the starting rotation.
Brutal as the 2023 season was for Kluber, the righty was one of the best pitchers in the game not long ago. The 37-year-old’s illustrious career includes two AL Cy Young awards and an ERA title in 2017. While Kluber is certainly not the same pitcher he was back then, he was an effective back-end starter for the Rays and Yankees the past two seasons and could potentially draw interest from a club in need of depth this offseason, should he prove healthy enough to continue his playing career.
I’m rather conflicted about bringing Turner back. Good guy and a good bat in the lineup are of course the positives, the negative in my mind is that Yoshida, a rather awful outfielder, would have to remain out there.
As the free agent market stands right now, I’d like to see them go after an outfielder with a decent glove, but if that market dries up I’d gladly take Turner back.
What they need is a Masher in the outfield. The 35 home run threat type of player. These Speedy guys are what we have enough of.
Hell, I’d take someone who can play some defense too. Though I do concur, they could use some mashers.
And to build off the excess of speed guys, I think either Duran or Rafaela should be considered for trades. The former because he is coming off a good season, the latter because he has stock (for now) as a prospect. I am personally in favor of trading Rafaela, think he lacks the bat to ball skills to be a good hitter.
Would love to see Duvall come back to play a corner spot. That swing fits Fenway like a glove, and the price point wouldn’t detract too much from any pitching investments
He gave the Sox 320 ABs in 90 games in 2023. Spent more time on the DL than playing. Got off to a torrid start, got injured, and didn’t contribute much for the rest of the way. Why in the world would you want him back? Only reason, I see, is for a live body for your training staff to practice on.
roiste – I like Duvall too, but not as a fulltime outfielder. He will get hurt again playing the outfield, he often does. I’m fine with Yoshida/Abreu/Duran and maybe Rafaela patrolling the outfield. Refsnyder had a lousy year this year, he needs to step up more against LHP because he is totally useless against RHP.
@PK- Maybe because injuries derailed his promising start to the season as you essentially admitted in your comment? If you’re ruling out every guy whose had a down half of ball, you’re ruling out practically every player on the market.
WOW I can’t believe what I’m reading.
JT is ABSOLUTELY NOT AN OPTION for 2024 if they want to win. He’s their 3rd DH, he’s over-priced since last year he cost $17.55MM and produced far less than JD who played fewer games but produced so much more for $10MM. JT is absolutely a NO if you want to win.
A slugging outfielder? WHY? We have Abreu, Duran and Rafaela. All great young players making less than $1MM per year allowing the payroll to flow towards ACTUAL NEEDS like 2 SPs, 1 3B, 1 2B and a Lefty Reliever.
Duvall is a TERRIBLE choice. He’s an older version of Dalbec but plays outfield not 1B. If you catch a hot streak you love him but YOU MUST NOT FORGET ALL HIS INCREDIBLE COLD STREAKS. As a fourth outfielder he might be ok but he must accept $5MM and I don’t think that will happen.
YOSHIDA MUST BE TRADED!!!!!!!!!!! He can’t field and Devers MUST NOT PLAY 3B for the team to win and cut their errors nearly in half!!!!
I swear it’s like nobody watched the 2023 Red Sox. They sucked on defense and they desperately need top end starting pitchers. Everything else is insignificant in comparison. IF Devers doesn’t move to DH or get traded the defense will be bottom 10 no matter what you do at the other positions. YES HE’S THAT BAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So discussing Starting Pitchers should be foremost on all Red Sox fans mins along with who to get to replace Devers at 3B?
1 = Chapman or another FA
2 – Rafaela
3 – Story and have Rafaela play SS
4 – Trade for a 3B using Yoshida, Verdugo and whatever it takes to get a young 3b with good defensive skills and an above league average hitter.
5 – Trade STL Devers straight up for Arenado
Fixing the defense MUST be a priority otherwise those great SPs we want won’t sign in Boston if they are bottom of the barrel on defense.
Buddy, stay off the meth.
The Sox are not trading Yoshida and they are not moving Devers off of 3B. They are not signing Matt Chapman because they are not moving Devers off of 3B, and why would St.Louis trade Arenado for Devers straight up?
A more realistic offseason maybe the Sox making one big splash in free agency on Pitching (Snell, Nola), maybe add another arm on a minor league deal. Add a lefty reliever and add some offense. If it were me the Sox roster would be:
C Mitch Garver
1B Triston Casas
2B Enmanuel Valdez
3B Rafael Devers
SS Trevor Story
LF/DH Masataka Yoshida
CF Jarren Duran
RF Wilyer Abreu
DH/OF Teoscar Hernandez
Bench
Connor Wong
Rob Refsnyder
Ceddane Rafaela
Donovan Solano
Rotation
Blake Snell
Chris Sale
Brayan Bello
Nick Pivetta
Brad Keller? Jake Odorizzi?
Bullpen
Kenley Jansen
Jon Schreiber
Garrett Whitlock
Tanner Houck
Josh Winckowski
Chris Martin
Matt Moore
Kutter Crawford (if not in rotation)
Rsox – Good response. I still believe not moving Devers will prevent you from bringing in quality pitchers. Also, Snell is so similar to Price after he won a CY YOUNG that I wouldn’t sign someone who just had a year better than we can expect going forward and costing peak money.
Garver can’t play full time according to most so his great bat is meaningless if he’s yet another DH. Otherwise, I love Garver.
Casas, Story and Valdez is not an upgrade but acceptable. I’d get Merrifield to add speed to the bottom of the order and Valdez hits like a nice back-up Middle Infielder.
Playing Duran and Abreu is solid. I think Abreu won’t repeat what he did but I think Duran will. Abreu is the long term 4th outfielder and could be a pleasant surprise if he can maintain what he did in 2023.
Yoshida is a waste of money. $18MM for a DH with limited power and speed. He is a smart player and if Devers can be moved I love him as a DH going forward batting 2nd behind Duran. If you play Yoshida, you haven’t fixed the bad defense issue. If you play him with Devers you are bottom of the MLB defense. They both suck and suck badly. Saying the team is helpless and can’t move these guys is a defeatist perspective. I believe Breslow has the smarts to truly FIX what Bloom broke.
I love Rafaela and he needs to be in the line-up day 1 whether it’s at RF his long term position, SS so Story can go to 3B or 2B making Valdez the back-up.
Replacing Dalbec with Solano works for me if he costs no more than $2MM.
Refsnyder is fine as a depth guy and depending where Rafaela gets used he may need to be the cheap fourth outfielder.
Snell – I’d rather have Nola or Yamamoto and they will be cheaper and I think they are likely to perform better.
Sale – I love him but he’s a fragile big IF. Counting on him is a Bloom mistake revisited.
Bell0 = Rock solid #3
Pivetta – Acceptable but I prefer Houck and Crawford to him as starters
Keller or Odorizzi – It’s too Bloom-like. There is SO SO MUCH money to spend, why go cheap?
Jansen – 36 year old closer in his last year with us.
Schreiber is odd man out because the team should have 2 short relievers that are right handed and two that are left handed.
Martin and WInckowski are the two righty short term relievers
The lefties on your list are Matt Moore and who?
I said keep Bernadino and add Hader so we have two. One that closes too.
Your roster needs another lefty reliever.
So overall the pitching to me is not an upgrade and has a big risk with Sale. I prefer to treat him as the SP6 and see how he does and you could do that with your roster suggestions.
In the end, this roster wins 81 games give or take 5 wins because the defense is atrocious just like last year. AND you have $50MM of unspent money. I’d go bigger at SP1 and SP2 and I would not sign the Cy Young award winner. It never seems to work out well. If Montgomery could be stolen from Texas we could get him and Nola and look really good at the top of the rotation, especially if Sale is healthy and pitching like Sale. That would make Bello the #4 and he can beat other #4 pitchers on a regular basis.
I say don’t leave money on the table. That’s a Bloom philosophy not a winning philosophy.
I like Merrifield but feel like he’ll end up on the south side of Chicago. With holes at both 2B and RF as well as familiarity with Pedro Grifol and Chris Getz i like the White Sox chances at signing him better.
The Sox spent a lot of money both signing and paying the posting fee for Yoshida to punt on him after only one season. The Sox Infield is going to get tighter in the next couple of seasons with Nick Yorke, Marcelo Meyer, Blaze Jordan and Chase Meidroth knocking on the door. Players will have to be moved, either off position or off the roster to accommodate everyone. I would prefer Nola over Snell but realize the market for Nola will have more suitors due to the price difference. The Sox have always hit Montgomery so I’m not sure how well he would do playing for them, maybe a case of “if you can’t beat ’em, join ’em” but I’m not sure.
All of this could be moot however if the Sox are serious in pursuing Ohtani which i actually hope they aren’t
Rsox – I like Ohtani but I think the fight for him is between the Dodgers and Rangers. If I were him, I’d go to Texas because their roster is far better than the Dodgers.
I live in Texas and saw Montgomery pitch a lot down the stretch. I think Chris Young went out and got Boche which was a brilliant move and he brought his man Mike Maddux with him and it paid off because Montgomery looked so much better than he did in the past. Nate seemed to be helped by the new coaching staff too.
That’s why it’s so critical for Breslow to go get a quality manager with a quality head pitching coach to upgrade pitching in Boston. Cora is a dead weight around Breslow’s neck because he brings his coaches to the table not good ones. Breslow needs to clean house and let his selected guys set up the infrastructure not use the old structure from Bloom.
Ohtani is a problem because of Devers. We can’t let Devers do anything but DH and Ohtani needs to be the DH going forward if Boston could get him. I think it’s a moot discussion because he wants to win and many dominoes need to fall correctly for Boston to recover from Bloom.
Domino 1 is Devers being DH
Domino 2 is Yoshida bringing back something needed
Domino 3 is getting 2 high quality SPs
Domino 4 is finding an adequate solution at 3B whether its Rafaela, Story, a free agent or a trade. I still want Arenado for Devers because I know Arenado and his personality is needed in the clubhouse. He’s a Varitek kind of guy. That would allow Yoshida to be the DH which only works if he bats 2nd in the line-up because his main strength is OBP and if he can slap hits after Duran gets on and steals 2nd we small ball runs along with the HRs this team will hit.
I like Breslow picked up some reserve speed. I hope he’s more in line with what they did in Texas where they bop and play small ball. They steal bases with fast outfielders and middle infielders and they bash from the corner infielders and right fielder. The Red Sox have great young talent but I don’t think it’s the guys Bloom took, I think it’s the guys on the cusp right now. Anthony, Rafaela, Casas, Houck, Bello, Duran, Crawford and Teel. I’m not sold on Mayer or Yorke but I hope they rebound and prove they deserved to be drafted so early. Bloom was wrong about so many things, these could be two more to the list.
So FIX THE DEFENSE and SPEND $50MM on two SPs and Breslow will turn this team around. LEAVE THE DEFENSE AS IS, he will fail in 2024 because Defense and PItching wins championships and you can’t lure pitchers if you don’t have any defense behind them. It’s like trying to sign a great running back when your offensive line sucks. The RB goes to the team with the best line usually or the team that must over pay the most since they don’t have a great line. Lets not over pay for SPs, lets fix the defense.
If you knew what you are talking about you would know that Duvall is always injured. So why do you sign someone for less than half a season trying up a spot on your 40 man roster.?
Because not every player on your roster needs to be a star. Duvall was effective at the plate and would provide an excellent right handed complement to our very left-handed and unproven outfield. He’s a great defensive corner outfielder, and if the new FO actually played him there instead of center he could provide a lot of value to the team in 400 – 450 PAs.
Your snarky (false) claim that he didn’t do anything after the start of the season ignores his torrid August. The dude was one of our most productive players in sum last year, and he could be even better if Breslow gives him a role he can actually handle. I’m not saying he’s amazing, but he’s a good value for an offseason where the vast majority of the team’s resources should go to pitching – especially when the rest of the RH hitters on the market offer basically no defensive value
FP- I like Breslow’s idea of using the DH to rest people. I think if Duvall never gets hurt he has a monster year. So ya platoon the DH spot between Yoshida, Duvall, Devers, and Story throughout the year. Actually, I would like to see them move Devers to first and Story to third in ST and give Rafaela a shot at SS. I wouldn’t sign anyone for SS I’m still hoping Meyer is ready in 2025. Concentrate the money this off-season into upgrading our pitching, that is what let us down last year. We need to get to at least the 6th inning from our starters. I hope they get Yamamoto from Japan.
I like Rafaela at SS but Story’s plus range and questionable arm seem like a much better fit at second than third
And what are you doing with Casas in this scenario?
Rsox – Not sure if your comment was directed to me but I would play Casas and consider him a future all-star.
roiste – Why is Story’s arm questionable? It wasn’t before his surgery and it looked fine in 2023. You are dealing with obsolete information. His arm is fine for 3B, SS and 2B.
kingbum – So you don’t think the bottom two defense needs to improve?
You have two guys that can field and two guys that can’t rotating in and out of the DH spot. If I’m a pitcher on the team I want to pitch on the day Yoshida has off and Devers DHs. I WOULD NOT WANT TO PITCH on days Yoshida is in Left Field and Devers at 3B.
Your suggestion is 2023 when we were a .500 team at best. I want the team to improve so I suggest things that will improve them. It’s ok if you prefer mediocrity but don’t expect others to think that way!!
I’m shopping Casas for starting rotation help, Let everybody else overrate a 1B/DH type and hopefully get something useful back.
Casas gives us a better return of starting pitching than Devers. Devers is a defensive liability and his bat dropped off at bit, it’s not a good time to trade him. You may never get more value back for Casas than ŕight now.
That “obsolete information” shows that Story had 25th percentile arm strength just this year. Statcast doesn’t lie, so it sounds accurate to me. If you’re playing him at 3B, you’re undoubtedly going to see guys beat out infield hits that they shouldn’t.
Trade Masataka Yoshida? You’re out of your mind. He’s had one year in the league. Adjustments are and will be made on his conditioning. The guy can rake. His defense needs work (who doesn’t) but he is far from a liability in left.
Devers’ defense has improved greatly and he will be fine at third. He isn’t as you put it “That bad” at third. Why would you trade a Silver Slugger in the first place?
Glad you’re not in the Baseball Ops department at Fenway, however, I hear Chaim Bloom might be going to work in St. Louis – you should submit your resume. It seems that you two think alike so it might be a fit for you both.
On a side note – I will agree with you on improving the defense, it absolutely needs to be done but your solutions are abhorrent at best.
Late to the party but the reasons are obvious. He broke his wrist and had difficulty coming back. At the end of the year he looked like the guy that signed. He’s right handed with a pull stroke. Add that is defense is passable at any OF position and you understand why.
I think that’s just a byproduct of the surgery that will get better over time. It was clear even in hitting some strength and power was sapped from Story. It’s Devers he’d replace at 3rd, who isn’t exactly Arenado. I’d be concerned if he had those same stats by the end of next year.
PK….He can mash 20 homers in 100 games and be cheap, ya just got to have a prospect as well to match up that you want to have a prolonged look at or have him as your 4th outfielder….That’s not a bad deal.
Championship teams need a guy like him. I hope he comes back.
It’s my opinion that there’s no way Turner comes back. Zero chance. There’s simply nowhere for him to play this coming season. I’m glad to have him last year and wish him well.
Gary – I am very happy Breslow is taking my advice in leaving the DH spot open to rest players. Far too many games were lost because Cora would often rest players by not allowing them to bat either. Let Yoshida, Duran, Devers, Casas focus just on DH’ing once or twice a week.
Geez I will never forget the game in Toronto that Cora lost 1-0 when JD sat out with an injury and Xander was given the day off and NOT allowed to DH. They lost that game on a Arroyo error at shortstop. It was April 28th and even though Travis Shaw had not reached base all season, Cora started him at DH instead of Xander. Bloom was so furious at Cora that he cut Shaw the next day, it was the last game of his non-illustrious MLB playing career.
In other words, Cora is the problem
PK – I’m hoping Breslow will reign Cora in, get more involved in the roster management and pitching staff usage.
Cora is awful at bullpen management.
I don’t believe Fever has been laying the entire issues of what has gone wrong with boston last year, nor the horrid 2022 season either. If anyone has read his posts over the years it’s how often times Cora will make some what is obviously boneheaded move, like a 10yo can see it right off.. yet he makes it anyway and often times it has to do with playing time and lineup situations.
Why? Does he run a Francona style buddy system? Don’t think so myself, he just is prone to making the absolute WORST possible choices fairly often.. Like former sox manager Don Zimmer used to do.. nobody can explain it. Does he need some kind of “keeper” to over rule when bone headedness like the above takes over.. Like maybe he promised Shaw (throwing out there) a wk previously he’d play that day and held his end, regardless of how awful a move it was?
Maybe a bench coach who isn’t subservant to cora would help as well.
John – OUTSTANDING. You have specifically identified the real problem with trying to win close games…. A BAD MANAGER. NO, A TERRIBLE MANAGER. On many occasions I have used Don Zimmer as you did. I watched him mismanage the Red Sox and the Cubs!!! He was the dumbest manager I had ever seen until Cora. I’ve often mentioned sitting Mookie in April 2018 during a week when they had an off day AND a rain-out and when the reporter asked why he sat Mookie he said my schedule said he was supposed to get a day off today. Then he justified his actions by saying when he was bench coach for Hinch, that’s what he did. At that point it was clear they hired an unqualified manager and sold it as a diversity move. There were many better choices that were just as diversified but ownership wanted him, not DD so he got hired. The manager needs to be the GMs man not the guy that ownership hires to keep an eye on the GM and report back to them.
I’m worried Breslow will experience the same thing unless he fires Cora.
John – You are correct, I was merely agreeing with Breslow’s view that “resting” a position player can and should be done more often by having him DH instead of completely benching him.
As for Cora, we all know because of his feud with Bloom that some of his moves were just him being vindictive. Like when he brought in Bearclaw to protect a late inning lead and left him in to give up 10 runs.
No way Xander should have been benched in favor of Shaw DH’ing in an important game against a divisional rival, those games count as two in the standings as we all know.
TF – I can think of a few others after Zimmer that give Cora a run for his money as dumbest manager … McNamara, Williams, Little and Valentine! Haha!
Fever – I’ll take Valentine before Cora in a heartbeat!!!
Fever..come on man “my advice” really..lol.
Pool – Just bringing some humor. LOL
But I really have been saying for a while to leave the DH spot open and rotate players in and out of it. Not like there’s an Ortiz that can fill the DH role fulltime.
Fever – I love you but NO WAY you leave the DH spot open unless you dump both Devers and Yoshida. That’s not going to happen so ONE must be traded and the other should have his gloves burned to prevent any managerial brain cramps.
Devers, worst 3B in the history of the game will be a major deterrent to bringing in new expensive top of the rotation SPs. As an ex-pitcher, I would NEVER want to pitch for a team that has allowed Devers to embarrass himself and hurt the pitching staff this many years. There is something wrong in any front office that allows someone to hurt the team for 7 years. Bloom is gone. Breslow needs to prove his worth. Devers to DH or trade would show all of Red Sox Nation that the man knows what he is doing. Leaving Cora in place and Devers at third will be the opposite message to Red Sox Nation. Time will tell if the owners hired a man or a mouse.
Sox would have to eat a huge chunk of change and/or send some decent prospects to package along with Devers. Not saying I would have a problem with that but no team is utilizing him at third or shelling out $30mm/per season for a DH. Trading him is not going to be easy.
Dickiesox – YOU SAID IT ALl ABOUT DEVERS!!!! Thank you.
Crap contract that will be an albatross for a future GM and I agree dumping him can only happen if you get another expensive guy. That’s why I keep suggesting Arenado who costs more for less years. It jumps the defense from 29th to top 10 by the one simple change. The hitting does not take a hit and pitchers might actually want to pitch in Boston knowing they have the greatest defensive 3B in history vs the worst.
@gary
I’m hoping that you’re right and he re-signs with the Dodgers instead.
THEY LIVE!!! – Dodgers don’t need him. They have JD who completely outplayed him and did it for nearly half the price. If LAD signs him it will be in a utility role so he can retire a Dodger. Otherwise his days in dodgertown are over.
I see the Sox and Turner figuring something out. Can’t see the Marlins signing him after Bell opted in. He fits in Arizona too. As for Kluber he’s done.
Kluber it’s time to ride off into the sunset my man.
Not a Brayan Bello fan? Fairly certain he’s the best of the lot. Sadly, that may not be saying much………
wino – Agreed, it was a glaring omission by Nick to leave Bello out of the starting rotation list. He does have the most potential of the bunch too.
“I would love to be back and be with the Sox,” Turner said
*declines player option*
That was always baked into the contract. He signed for a low salary last season, with a big buyout on a second year tacked on to lower the AAV of the deal.
The buyout made up for the low salary, and, the low differential on the option was considered baking in a buy low deal if the guy was hurt and had an off year expecting a comeback.
GA – Exactly he made $17.55MM for his paltry 114 OPS+. That was a terrible choice by Bloom. The man is now a year older and his late season fade is likely to start earlier in 2024.
He’s a $10MM a year player who got $17.55MM from bonehead Bloom while Freidman signed the guy who wanted to stay in Boston for $10MM and he put up a 134 OPS+. That’s twice Friedman COMPLETELY OUTSMARTED the pathetic Bloom.
Come to San Diego JT!!
What does the 2018 version of Kluber have to do with the 2024 season. Nothing. Totally irrelevant.
Box – Agreed!
I could see Nick pointing to 2022 which was a good season, but 2018 is way too long ago.
I mean, I’d give Kluber an invitation to spring training. But I wouldn’t guarantee even a minor league contract.
bcjd – Nah I wouldn’t invite him at all. What if he pitches great in ST, then the Sox put him on the active roster and …… well, we know what will likely happen then.
I would sign Gray or Snell and Rodriquez, Hader. Trade for Soto and Torres! Then call it a day
Thec – Hard no to Gray! Snell would be only if Yamamoto goes elsewhere.
With what they are already paying Martin and Jansen, I don’t see them giving out another huge contract to Hader. I think Chapman would be the better contract.
Fever – BIG NO to Snell. It’s very reminiscent of the Price situation in 2016. A guy has a peak season and you give him a big contract thinking he can repeat it. Snell doesn’t hit me as a guy who can repeat it. If I had a choice between Snell and Eovaldi I would take Nate.and pay him half what Snell will want.
HARD NO TO CHAPMAN. As a Cub fan I lived through the original Chapman, his name was Mitch Williams. Enough stress for a lifetime. As a Texas Ranger fan, same thing. Ulcers being created with each appearance.
I’ll take a younger Hader.(30 yr old vs 36 yr old) and I would sign him to 4 years. So when Kenley’s time is up after the 2024 season (he’s the same age as Chapman) you can sign him to a 3 yr extension and have one of the most dominant left/right late inning combo in baseball for four years!!
TF – Peak season? He had 21 Wins, 1.89 ERA and 0.974 WHIP in winning the Cy Young award back in 2018! And that was while pitching against divisional rival 100-win Yankees and 108-win Red Sox!
Fever I I have to agree with KD on this one.
I want no part of this guy on the crazy numbers that are being thrown around. It’s true that his best season was his 2018 season he was amazing then but he only walked 3 per 9 that year. He was good this year but he walked nearly 5 per 9 threw a ton of pitches didn’t go real deep in games and had a very high, most would say unsustainable strand rate. There is no questioning his stuff it’s elite but if you are going to make the type of investment he’s going to require you really have to look at the full body of work and especially the last three years. He’s only topped 150 innings twice in his career in 2018 his otherworldly season and last year. This makes him an injury risk and Boston doesn’t need another guy that is that type. Imo he just walks to many guys puts himself in tough positions and here is where the park helps both Tampa and especially San Diego are pitcher friendly parks making it easier for him to wiggle out of trouble. Fenway is much more hitter friendly.
I guess what I’m saying I like Snell his stuff but he will be 31 when that new contract kicks in and I don’t see him aging well if you can get him at a reasonable price then sure roll the dice but I think he’s going to get north of 200 million and that’s a lot of risk for a guy that relies on a power arsenal and potentially won’t age well with injury history.
Pass on this guy.
I think it’s Heyman who’s reporting Snell’s market is 7/245 that’s crazy no thanks move on.
Bruin – Two things to know about his stats:
In 23 starts after May of this year, he had a 1.23 ERA and 35% K rate. It doesn’t get any better than that. Walk rate doesn’t matter if hitters can’t make good contact when he’s in the strike zone, and clearly they can’t.
In his last three seasons he has a 3.15 ERA and 31.5% K rate, so this year definitely wasn’t a fluke.
As for health, he’s had minor groin issues in 2021 and the first couple months of 2022 and then that’s it, perfectly healthy after May 2022.
Now lets compare him with his Top 3 non-Japanese competitors (not gonna include Gray as I think none of us want him):
All four guys (Snell, Nola, Monty, ERod) will be in their Age 31 season next year.
Snell is looking at $200M while Nola and Monty are looking at $150M.
The difference in talent warrants Snell receiving $50M more than Nola and Monty. ERod would be much cheaper, but he ain’t #1 material IMO.
Bruin – I think Snell tops out at $200M, too many other SP options out there.
Red Sox lineup and bullpen are okay, always a little tweaking to do. If they can get one good starter and a bounce back from another one they’re in the hunt
Bring back Turner? Absolutely!
Bring back Kluber? Absolutely not!!!
Rsox – You just sentenced the team to bottom two defensively!!!
We need defense and unless you play JT at 3B, the defense will remain bottom of the barrel.
Devers, for better or for worse, is still the primary 3B. There is no way Henry is going to pay him all that money to be a full-time DH at 27
That’s like saying you’d rather pay a player to help a team lose. They are stuck with that ridiculous contract either way. If winning matters most, Why hurt the team by playing him at third? Taking him off the field absolutely puts the Sox in a better position to win games.
Dick – If the Red Sox didn’t want Devers playing 3B past this year, they never would have given him that massive contract. They would have signed him to a much smaller contract, or traded him.
I agree Fever. I just don’t see him being moved off of 3rd this year or really for the next few years before finally being moved to DH much to the chagrin of KD.
He wouldn’t have signed a smaller contract and the FO didn’t want another franchise centerpiece of the team to potentially test FA. They signed him for what it would take to keep him there and to keep fans happy, especially considering they let Xander walk.
Move on from Kluber already! He never should have been signed to begin with, and I said that at the time. If he still wants to pitch, let him do it somewhere else.
Has Kluber been released from prison for his 2023 salary theft?
JT doesn’t return. Sox don’t need another DH
Duvall doesn’t return, Sox don’t need another outfielder.
Yoshi moves to DH, Doogie gets traded for prospects,
Youth movement in the outfield.
Ceddanne plays 4th outfielder and 2b/ss.
infield is set, outfield is set, catches are in place.
PITCHING!!! That needs to be 100% of the focus and where 100% of the money needs to go.
Make any needed adjustments at the trade deadline.
If they do that, they make the playoffs.
DBH – I like a lot of what you wrote but a couple of questions?
Not high on Rafaela? Biggest outfield arm but could move Devers off 3B or move Story to 3B and play SS to fix the defense.
Your solution didn’t fix the defense which is the single biggest issue with this team.
What excellent SP would pitch for a team that has allowed the worst 3B in history to continue to play 3B? I think if Devers stays at 3rd, you can’t fix the pitching by adding good #1 and #2 SPs. Thus, this team stays in last place and is a failure for a 5th straight season.
Breslow needs to make changes to improve what Bloom tore down. Think about the holes!!! NO DEFENSE at 3B, LF and 1B is shaky not to mention 2B is undefined so it could be bad too. CF with Duran is solid and Verdugo is traded so who plays right field if not Rafaela? Abreu? That works for now.
We need a lefty reliever so I keep suggesting Hader so Kenley and Hader are a closing tandem. If one goes down, you are still covered and if Kenley shows signs of getting old Hader becomes the #1 guy in 2025.
If Devers plays 3B they ABSOLUTELY DO NOT MAKE THE PLAYOFFS because you won’t get the pitching you are seeking and Devers hasn’t proven he can hit without Bogey and JD. Throw in 24 errors that are counted and 30 more misplays that won’t count as errors and you have the 2023 version of the team in 2024. NO PLAYOFFS!
@Troll. As we discussed in the past, I am actually big on Rafaela Ceddanne. I prefer him in CF or SS. If I had my way at this point, with the OF so packed, I would play him.at short were he is great and move Story to 2nd. STORY PLAYS A GREAT 2B. That would be a rock star middle infield, and with Duran in CF, take a third if the field out of play for hitters.
Abreu’s arm would play very well in either corner of, but probably better in RF.
Let’s be honest. We are stuck with Devers. The FO went big for PR. They will not admit the mistake and still chant that he is the center piece of the team. So this year, let’s see if Yoshi moves past his freshman year in LF and improves enough to increase his trade value at the deadline.if he can, trade him, Devers to DH. I would play Dalbac at 3rd. He isn’t a gold glove 3b, but he plays it well enough not to be a black hole there. And he has a good arm. Hamilton can be called up then to play 2b moving Raf to CF, Duran to LF, Abreu to RF.
We won’t see the next wave of young talent until 2025. Mayer, Anthony, and Teel next year, not this year.
I like the concept of a youth movement at this point. Casas, Dalbec, Hamilton, Teel, Duran, Ceddanne, Abreu, Anthony… Devers at DH. 38 million line up that is actually quite good.
Pitchers will come to Fenway for the same reason every pitcher comes to Fenway…MONEY!!!
I would sign Yamamoto. Add him to Bello, Houck, Whitlock, and another pitcher NOT named Sale or Kluber, and the team is set for a decade
It’s amazing how many people mistakenly think Rafaela is a great defensive shortstop. He’s a serviceable defensive shortstop but Story is easily better defensively. Rafaela makes a lot of careless errors at short he’s got good range and a strong arm but if he doesn’t cut down on his significant amount of errors he’s not viable there long term. The Red Sox don’t need him at that position either not short term or long term. Centerfield is where he shines he has a chance to be special defensively a true difference maker. His best chance of playing on the infield would be 2nd base it’s a true need right now in Boston but I still think he will make quite a few errors at that position.
If Rafaela and Abreu have good springs you plug Abreu in right, Rafaela in center, and Duran in left. Rafaela can be a backup option for an infield position. This is assuming that Rafaela hits in the big leagues they may want him to continue to refine his approach at the plate in AAA. This would unfortunately mean that Masa would play left, Duran would play center, and Abreu is in right. The defense is much weaker this way.
I know that KD wants them to move Devers off of third but that’s not going to happen and we just have to face that he’s going to man third at least next year and probably the next few years before being moved off the position finally.
@Bruin, people compare Ceddanne at SS to him in CF.. Ceddanne is elite in CF. That doesn’t make him bad at ss. He is a very good SS, maybe only a half step below story. But is only passable at 2b.
They won’t play Story at 2b simply because the FO is more interested in PR than actual results. I personally think Story is better at 2b than short. The dude is magic at 2b. So having Ceddanne at ss is barely a step down and Story is a huge step up at 2b.. Watching Story and Ceddanne up the middle would be a awesome.
You are correct about Devers staying at 3rd simply for the same reason they will keep Story at ss. It is about the FO bullcrap PR about Devers being the man to build around, leader for the next decade.
Devers could be a very, very good DH for the next decade. He would give us 30-40 hr/100+ rbis. But as long as he weighed down mentally being tied down at third, he is only going to get worse.
He doesn’t look happy anymore. I don’t think anyone would be happy failing, and he knows he isn’t good at 3b. I believe that even he doesn’t want to be the 3b.
But FO spin and b.s. storylines trump all logic.
DB I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree on Rafaela.
I don’t really listen to what other people tell me about such and such a player when I have watched them.
Cedanne Rafaela has made 16 errors in roughly 600 innings at shortstop in the minors. We ran the last shortstop that made that many errors in close to that many innings at shortstop out of town. Hernandez made 14 errors in 550 innings at short. I’m only bringing this up because I do think most people don’t watch a lot of minor league baseball. I think Rafaela could become a decent shortstop but in order for that to happen he would have to play the whole season in AAA at shortstop and transition into that position. He’s going to have a hard enough time hitting in the big leagues let alone letting him play the second most demanding position on the diamond defensively. In center he’s so instinctual he will still unleash the occasional errant throw and drop a ball here and there but he’s so gifted around the walls and laying out and keeping control of his body. He’s a centerfielder.
Trevor Story returned from surgery and while his hitting timing looked off and he looked awful at the plate he was outstanding defensively at short. In roughly 300 innings Story had two errors but it doesn’t stop there in roughly a quarter of the season compared to other fielding bible gives him credit for 8 defensive runs saved it doesn’t matter what advanced defensive metrics you subscribe to he was elite. If he had a full season based on what he did he would of run away with the gold glove. Trevor Story is the best option at short for at least this year and maybe the next couple.
Again, I agree with you for the most part, though we do disagree on his value at short. In the end, we both want him in center.
Best solution is that Verdugo gets traded for a 2b. Even better, both Yoshi and Doogie for a 2b and any prospect with 2 arms and 2 legs. Then we have the young guns in the OF and Devers at DH.
Hamilton is good at 2b, but a light hitting lefty even in the minors, so bring him up for a bench spot, and play Rafaela at 2b until we can unload boh Yoshi and Verdugo.
Anyway, my point was just focus on pitching right now. Make needed adjustments at the trade deadline.
DB I completely agree on pitching that is the focus let’s worry about the peripheral pieces once that pitching is taken care of. If they can somehow sign Yamamoto and trade for Burnes then we can worry about the other pieces.
Justin Turner feels like a cleaner fit in Seattle than Boston or even Arizona.
Justin Turner should finish his career with the Dodgers but Friedman? extended Muncy so that probably doesn’t happen now. What a shame! The Dodger fans deserve better!!!
THEY LIVE!!! – They had better, his name is JD Martinez!!! They need to re-sign him not JT.
I’d love to see more Klubot. I once looked at him like Roy Halladay 2,0
I think he would get back to his Tampa.Yankee form out of the limelight
Lets see Corey Kluber and his Kansas City Royals
I hear you on Kluber but Syndergaard?
for Synedgaard I’d love to see him go to the bullpen, establish a feel for it then ideally become a closer. He could do that anywhere
Turner wants to return to the Red Sox because he’s heard how “amazing this town is when you’re making a playoff run.” He’s going to be 39 in 2024. It’s not going to align with the remainder of his career.
Kluber like Syndergaard are done teams need to move on from these dead arms and give young guys a shot
I like Turner but the problem is he takes up a roster space. Both Devers or Masataka could DH with similar numbers and that really leaves no place to keep Turner unless he’s on the bench. He’s solid but not like he used to be and he’s going to command more money than what we originally paid him.
If Kluber returns I will not buy tickets this year. I got stuck w a Kluber game and for the expensive ticket prices I can’t risk it happening again.
Go get Ohtani, and knock it off with the idea of using the DH to rest players. With all 4 titles the Red Sox have won since 2004, we’ve always had a bona fide DH. Ortiz for the first 3, and JD Martinez after that. That’s what works. Don’t get cute Breslow.
Hah. 45 million for 12 years is the current projection!!!
You wanta 42 year old DH for 45 million???
A decade from now $45 million a year won’t be a big deal. And that’s what it costs to get elite, franchise changing players. You understand that the last few years of their contract won’t be ideal. How has the opposite approach worked out? Last place finish after last place finish.
My goodness, Deeds is an awful writer.
“That uncertainty surrounds the Red Sox, themselves, as the club’s level of interest in Turner for 2024 and beyond isn’t entirely clear.”
What the hell is this? A comma before themselves is 110% wrong. Get an editor. Then there’s this travesty of grammar:
“ Brutal as the 2023 season was for Kluber…”
AS brutal as the 2023 was for Kluber. Come on, kid. That word is not optional. Use proper English like a big boy. For example:
As brutal as Nick Deeds’ writing continues to be, MLBTR could recoup the damage he is doing to their reputation by hiring an editor.
I could see Turner going back to LA depending if they bring back JD Martinez.