The Red Sox announced a pair of option decisions Friday evening. Infielder Justin Turner has declined his $13.4MM player option in favor of a $6.7MM buyout. Meanwhile, the team declined its $11MM provision on right-hander Corey Kluber.
Turner signed with Boston last offseason. He inked a two-year, $21.7MM guarantee that always looked likely to send him back to the market after one season. Turner locked in an $8.3MM base salary, an extra $1MM in incentives, and the hefty buyout — which only required he’d top $6.7MM on his next contract to come out on top.
There’s no doubt he’ll beat that number after another strong season. The right-handed hitter posted a .276/.345/.455 line while connecting on 23 home runs over 626 plate appearances. The presence of Rafael Devers and Triston Casas at the infield corners consigned Turner primarily to designated hitter work. It raises questions about whether he could be an everyday third base option for another team as he enters his age-39 season.
Despite his age, there’s little doubt that Turner still projects as one of the better hitters in the class. He has topped 20 homers in two of the past three seasons, running a .277/.352/.455 slash since the start of 2021. Turner still has plus contact skills and good plate discipline.
The Kluber signing worked out a lot less favorably. Boston inked the two-time Cy Young winner to a $10MM guarantee. Kluber had turned in 164 innings with a 4.34 ERA for the Rays a season ago. His stint in Boston didn’t go well, as he was tagged for a 7.04 ERA through 55 frames. The right-hander struggled both during an early-season stint from the rotation and following a bullpen transfer in May.
Making matters worse, Kluber landed on the injured list on June 21 with inflammation in his throwing shoulder. He suffered a setback a month later and never returned to the big league club, although he did pitch twice for Triple-A Worcester in September. There was never any chance the Sox were going to retain him for $11MM. Assuming he wants to continue playing, the 38-year-old could conduct some offseason showcases in hopes of finding a major league contract elsewhere.
I’m not sure what to make of this. Why, why and another why?!!!!!
Because he wants to play for a contender.
Ever watch the Sox go from 0 to winners in the 2012 2013 seasons? Yeah, your argument makes no sense. A big market team is a potential contender in one offseason.
Bad bet…come on man…how many years does this guy have waiting for Boston to mount a challenge…..
ALCS in 2021 and the 2024 team is better set up than that team was. Except for starting pitching.
ellisburks – Did you just write something positive about Bloom? Were you not here during the disaster that was Bloom? 2021 is still a fluke and the team’s cumulative talent is significantly down from when Bloom arrived. The Red Sox have Devers left from the 2018 championship team but they have a no glove 3B for $30MM a year after he put up a 126 OPS+ which happens to be his 3rd worst in 5 full seasons of play.
Bloom made a huge mess that won’t be easily cleaned up.
His lone remaining offensive star has played in parts of seven seasons. In six of the seasons he’s led all of baseball in errors and now officially holds the record as the worst 3B of all time. During those 7 years his offense has been incredibly inconsistent.
2017 – good year
2018 – bad year
2019 – excellent year
2020 – bad year
2021 – excellent year
2022 – excellent year
2023 – down year compared to 2021 and 2022
This only matters because 2023 as a down year cost Boston $17.5MM and each year prior it cost Boston less.
Going into 2024 and for the next 10 years this inept 3B will cost Boston $30MM a year and there is no reason to expect his defense to be better so he will cost the Red Sox pitching staff dearly as he has the last 7 years if he remains at 3B.
That’s the Bloom legacy. A complete dismantling of a World Championship roster and a massive albatross contract that will hurt the payroll for a decade. Mentioning 2021 as a positive is like mentioning a cut on your leg as a positive when both your legs are broken.
Was 2021 really a positive? Or simply a less negative year than all the others under Bloom? The talent dropped despite the remnants of the 2018 team keeping the ball club competitive enough to make the playoffs. It speaks much more to DD’s legacy players than ANY accomplishment of Bloom.
Not why. He wants more $ and money. Everyone says no one wants to play for the Sox, when it’s not true.
Boston is a tough place to place, some fans are hard on new players if they even start out slow. Have a .210 BA in May, while making lots of money, the fans will turn on you like a hungry pet alligator.
Dave – No different than most other places.
Do you not remember Judge getting booed at Yankee Stadium a year ago, shortly after breaking the AL homerun record?
That’s as cold as it gets, man.
Yankees, good example. Id say those fans close to Bostons. Thats one example. But not “most other places”.
luckyh = My point included two parts:
1 – Last year’s deal was solely for last year and the payments went into 2024 so Bloom could keep the payroll down in 2023 and mortgage the future when he knew he wasn’t going to be there to deal with the wasted money in 2024. If JT really liked playing in Boston he could sign a new contract that would add to the $6.7MM he’s already going to receive.
2 – Boston’s clubhouse and organization is toxic. You can try to deny it if you want but you have the biggest cheater of all-time as the head of the clubhouse and an ownership group that turned it’s back on it’s homegrown generational player and basically gave him away along with the other star black player. That’s an extremely toxic environment and money helps off set the bad working conditions but since the team is not competitive AND the environment is toxic it will take more money to lure a good player to Boston.
As far as the fans go, you are wrong about how “bad” places like NY and Boston are compared to other locations. EVERY location has a percentage of fans that are abusive. Because there are more fans in the bigger parks the volume of abusiveness is higher. Also, the level of security keeping those abusers in check varies. People are people everywhere you go and to suggest one city is worse than another because you don’t like the city or you came from a more rural location in the US is simply biased. The distribution of good and bad people in any city is going to be similar. It doesn’t vary as you are suggesting. The outliers may be more vocal in one city than another but it’s not fair to judge the entire city based on the outliers.
Dave – No offense but that’s a lame response. Sounds like you just hate Boston, period.
Because if you watched other teams home crowds over the years, you’d know that every fanbase has a percentage of lameass fans that will boo their own players. So either you truly don’t know, or you’re lying. Something tells me I could provide evidence of 20 other teams fans and you’d still refuse to admit you’re wrong, so I won’t bother.
So you don’t think Turner can reach a new contract for more than 6.7M?
his contract would pay him $13.7 million 6.7 was the buyout
It was 13.4. So if Turner gets a contract offer greater than 6.7M he’s basically done better than accepting a 13.4M contract.
bhambrave – Whatever Turner agrees to will be added to the $6.7MM that will show up in RETAINED PAYROLL on the Red Sox books.
If he makes $13.3MM somewhere else, his total pay for 2024 will be $20MM thanks to Bloom.
That’s my point. The OP asked why. I assumed he was asking why did Turner decline the option. The answer is that Turner can get a lot more by declining than by accepting.
bhambrave – The contract was a hybrid. It was designed as a one-year deal for $17.55MM to be paid over 2 years to keep payroll down in 2023 and create wasted money in 2024 since Bloom probably saw the handwriting on the wall.
Because he was guaranteed a 6.7 million buyout on a 13.5 million option. The extra money he turned down he can easily beat on his next contract. Wait you’re talking about Turner right???
because he’ll get more money plus the $6.7 from his buyout on the market
Think of it this way; he’s basically getting paid $7 million to test the free agent market, and probably go get paid about 13.5 per year from some other team. Rather than just taking 13.5 to stay. It seems like a no brainer financially.
And if he wants to come back to Boston he can do that too.
Yup, I don’t think they would balk at resigning him despite the option decline, with the positive impact he had on that team. Can’t blame the guy for betting on himself, and winning.
Sodom – Yes Turner is a great clubhouse guy with an infectious personality (pun intended) and he was very clutch, but he also sucked after August 28th putting up just a .556 OPS. At his age he can lose it really, really fast.
Dude will be 39 and the Sox can’t give him many PA’s at DH with Devers, Casas and Yoshida sucking in the field. I won’t even entertain the possibility of Ohtani coming to Boston, but if he did obviously he’d be the fulltime DH.
It’s really a no-brainer, let JT walk as he’s not a good fit for next season.
Sign Jorge Soler to be DH
Fever – Completely agree. With two DHs playing the field there was no need for a third and never was but that’s Bloom for you. He added Schwarber to DH when Boston had JD and Devers. The deadline needs were for pitching but that’s Bloom for you.
With Breslow, I am curious to see who will be his DH. I’m hoping it will be either Devers or worst case it will be Yoshida. The team defense needs improvement so at least one needs to be the DH.
We have too much money being paid to players with sub 120 OPS+.
Yoshida at $18MM needs to be offered in trade if he doesn’t assist in bringing Ohtani and/or Yamamoto to Boston. $18MM players need to produce at least a 125 OPS+ or more to earn their salary. Story at $23.3MM needs to be over 130 in 2024 to earn his salary. Devers needs to be over 150 to earn his salary.
The odds of all three earning their pay is very low. That’s why these three players are the best candidates for trades so Boston can return players who will out perform their cost. With so many young players who cost under $1MM vying for starting positions, Breslow has great payroll flexibility if he can fix Bloom’s three big mistakes – Devers, Yoshida and Story. Sale has one year left so moving him is not really an option but if he can do it he should. The four players total $94.6MM of payroll and all four under performed in 2023. For the team to be more than a .500 team they need players out performing their pay in 2024 and going forward.
Let’s hope Breslow can accomplish at least a few of these goals in 2024.
Resign JT to a 1 year deal and move Max to 2nd until we sign a 3B
Having a nearly 40 year old JT at 3B and Muncy at 2B full time would make for a pretty rough infield defense.
True
Thats on paper. In actuality it could still be good.
Yeah my angle is he can’t be worse than Muncy at defense at 3rd and he brought energy to the clubhouse and stadium. He’s a morale booster.
Just trade for Isaac Paredes, Sheehan/stone as headliners
No brainer
I think Justin Turner will get less on the market. Good for the Sox, as it gives us more flexibility.
We just have to hope Breslow is going to make good moves.
He is not getting less than 7m. Zero chance of that, Sox would have been way better off if he opted in.
He’s a DH and the last thing the Sox need are DHs. He just freed up more money to sign pitching. The Sox need starting pitching, not DHs.
Eh. Before the heel injury he was solid in splitting time with Casas
even if he only gets 7 million on the market his total take would still be 13.7 which would have equalled his pay this year. between that and the buyout. it’s was a complete no brainer for JT
I misunderstood. Thought it was 13 million or was that over 2 seasons?
Turner was guarenteed at least $6.7 million either way. His option was for $13.4 million with a $6.7 million buyout. He opted out, meaning he got his $6.7 million buyout.
Brestow is just figurehead, no real power. Cora is running things with Henry’s blessings.
I’d really love to have JT finish his career as a Dodger but I think that ship sailed last year.
Technically they only have to beat the guarantee they’re declining by $1 or 1 cent and it was at least not a dumb move.
I think he can more than exceed 1 year/$6.7M and could get up to years/$25M or something, which seems quite do-able at this stage in his career and in this market, he will have beat the guarantee by $1 or maybe even by $17.3M and thus this was the smart move.
Also what a bizarre contract amount- $21.7M for 2 years.
A buyout half as big as the option year salary lol. Both sides knew this wasnt being picked up so they spread dollars across two years. JT wont lose on the deal and he gets to pick a better team.
No surprises on both. Turner will probably get a decent one year performance based contract somewhere and Kluber will probably get an incentive only deal from someone.
Wow, how’d I miss that buyout number? That’s a no-brainer after Turner had a very JT-like year.
Hard to imagine he won’t have a lot of suitors to choose from at around 7-10 million, and already 6.7 in the pocket no matter who he picks.
JT is aging very well. He could even get a two year offer this offseason. A 2/$18M or even 2/$20M offer can’t be dismissed. If he does sign a 1 year deal, it will be for $10M+ based on his 2023 performance. I wouldn’t mind seeing Boston bring him or Duvall back this off-season; just not both of them.
Take the good year with Turner as a win, and move on. Sox don’t need another DH.
DBH – If only it had been a good year for the $17.55MM he cost us!!!
His 114 OPS+ for $17.55MM is a very, very bad deal. No good year just a slightly above average year for nearly $18MM!!
Troll, while he was an over pay, it wasn’t a huge over pay or an over pay for a bad year. The guy hit and played defense enough for me not to be upset with the performance. I also credit his leadership. I am not a guy who chants ‘leadership’ alot. I think JT is the first to provide that type of leadership since Tek.
Both Duran and Casas may have flush down the bowl Dalbek style without Turner mentoring.
I will call it a win. But not a ‘let’s do it again-‘ win
I will call it a win. But not a ‘let’s do it again-‘ win
========================
That’s about right. He provided adequate value, a great fit, and a good clubhouse presence. But it is time to move on.
Joe – Well said!
DBH – Hafta strongly disagree about Turner having a “good” year.
From 2014-2021 he had a .877 OPS and it never went below .832
This year his OPS was just .800 and he had a career-high 110 strikeouts. He also had a .556 OPS after August 28th, not a good finish for a player who will be 39 next year.
Yes he was very clutch, as his 96 RBI would attest, but overall I’d call it a mediocre season. The Dodgers let him go because his numbers declined every year beginning in 2018, and this year’s numbers weren’t much different than last year’s.
@Fever, come on man. You’re comparing 40 year old JT to 30 year old JT? Unless they are juiced, no 40 year old is playing as well as their 30 year old self..
And you are mentioning his end of year stats without mentioning his blown out heel in the same time period.
Did I say JT was great, or an all-star? No. But the dude hit well and his fielding wasn’t horrible.
Better, he was solid enough not to be another signing who spent the year on the DL like a lot of last year’s Bloom signing.
Again. A win, hand shake, move on 🙂
DBH – Sounds like what you’re saying is JT had a good season for someone his age, which I agree with.
Injuries are a part of the assessment, they’ve certainly hampered JD’s numbers as well this year and in past years. When you get to be mid-upper 30’s the injuries happen more often.
We both agree overall JT didn’t perform poorly … now where’s the beer and pizza? I’m starving! Who was supposed to bring it, GASox?
Guess he’s not loving the clam chowder in Beantown as much as the Red Sox Nation thinks everyone does….he’s playing the money game……..get ready for more bad news when Ohtani say “hell no” to Boston too regardless of the rumors spread by local news……..
Don’t need Ohtani. Need pitching.
Joe – Very valid point that pitching is the priority but EVERYONE needs Ohtani. He’s the best player in baseball history. No team is so good they don’t need him but since he can’t pitch for a year, Boston still must focus on two SPs BUT they could do a one year deal with one of them and get Ohtani to DH making Devers completely expendable before his defense kills the pitchers again and his body catches up with him and brings him back to being average, not worth $30MM a year.
I personally would love to see a pair of Japanese players signed. Ohtani and Yamamoto would be a great start to reversing the Bloom curse.
All those wasted years playing for the Halo’s. He’s looking for a winner, not a rebuild. Money is important, but he’s going to get it wherever he plays. As his injuries dictate, you’re not guaranteed tomorrow.
There are two huge issues with Ohtani.
1-He’s not old, but he is not a kid either. If we are bidding against the NYY, NYM, Philly, LAD, SDP, etc., there is a decent chance he is getting a 12-year contract. His hitting skills will be greatly eroded well before then.
2-This was his 2nd TJS. There are more failures after TJS #2 than there are successes.
@ Troll, love you to death dude, but…. WHAT?????
Otani will make 40-50 mils a year. NO WAY he is worth that. You and I scream Devers isn’t worth 30mil because he’s a DH. Why in the would would you want to pay 40-50mil for a DH???
More over, who ever signs him gets stuck with this guy for 10-12 years. He will be THIRTY in July. You want to pay a 42 year old DH 50 million??? You just blasted me for saying 39 year old JT had a decent year as a 17mil DH
Bro. Yes, we really need pitching. But please, for the love of baseball, take the foot off the desperate pedal. Take a breath, sip a beer. Bloom is gone, we’re okay now lol.
DBH – Love it when you challenge stuff I say!! Here is my thinking.
Shohei Ohtani the pitcher is worth comparable money to who?
1. Yamamoto? Nola?
23 starts is light but normal would be 26
ERA 3.14 is a Tier 2 performance
WHIP 1.06 is a Tier 1 performance
IP 132 is light it needs to be 156 (26 starts averaging 6 IP)
K/9 IP 11.4 is Tier 1
Pitching once a week he can’t be consider anything more than Tier 2
Tier 2 gets him $25MM a year.
Ohtani the hitter is worth comparable money to who?
597 PAs reflects his injury and missing some games
497 ABs means he walked 100 times which is excellent
His line in 2023 was .304/.412/.654/1.066 with an OPS+ of 184!!
Those are superstar hitting numbers. Guys who hit like that make $35MM a year and are worth it when they put up numbers like Ohtani did.
So his pitching puts him in the $25MM per year range and his hitting puts him in a $35MM range. If he could only do one or the other, then $35MM would be my evaluation of him. BUT he does both in the same year so you MUST ADD THEM TOGETHER. That number is $60MM per year!!!
If you contracted two comparable players for your team it would cost $60MM. My suggestion of 40MM to 50MM is a low ball based on 2023’s performance. So lets add one more factor – AGE.
Ohtani will be 29 in 2024. He’s a freak of nature who keeps himself in great shape like Betts and Tom Brady. He just had TJ surgery so his pitching should last at least 5 years but I’m guessing it will actually be more. His hitting should last until his late 30s so if the contract starts at 29 here is what I’d expect:
29 – Great hitting no pitching (Year is 2024)
30 – Great hitting great pitching (2025)
31 – Great hitting great pitching
32 – Great hitting great pitching
33 – Great hitting great pitching
34 – Great hitting great pitching
35 – Great hitting above league average pitching (2030)
36 – Great hitting above league average pitching
37 – Great hitting second TJ surgery (2032)
38 – Great hitting no more pitching (2033)
39 – Above league average hitting no pitching (2034)
40 – Above league average hitting no pitching
That’s a 12 year deal for $600MM or $50MM per season.
You get 5 years (2025-2029) of $60MM worth of production
You get 3 years (2024, 2032 and 2033) with $35MM worth of production
You get 2 years (2230 and 2231) with $53MM worth of production
You get 2 years (2234 and 2235) with $20MM of production
Add it all up and you pay $600MM for $551MM of productivity.
That means the annual cost is $50MM and the average return is roughly $46MM. For a twelve year contract, that’s an outstanding pay-out!!
Ohtani is a good investment but Devers and Yoshida would have to go.
So you are swapping out $29.153MM for Devers and $18MM for Yoshida (two DHs) for 1 DH and an elite SP for $50MM per year.
Lets see – $50MM for Ohtani or $47.153MM for Devers/Yoshida
I’ll take the DH/SP over two DHs for $2.847MM less!!!!!
Might I add, the back end of the Devers deal will be FAR FAR worse than the Ohtani deal. Two of the greatest hitters of this generation were Miggy and Pujols and they fell off after their 32 and 33 year old seasons and both started at the same age as Devers. Pujols stayed in great shape but his skills eroded and Miggy put on weight which eroded his skills. Devers is a lesser talent and should experience a smilar drop-off. The question is will it happen sooner since he a far lesser hitter than the other two? Devers is will start his big contract at 27 so 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32. Those are the likely break even years if he has any, after that the next 4 will be a huge over pay.
Dumping Devers and Yoshida to get Ohtani at $50MM a year is a no brainer!!
I see what you are getting at, bro. And I too love the friendly debates on here.
Your math is solid, and a year ago I would have been more agreeable with the concept.
Looks like he will land around 45 mils a year…. until he is FORTY-TWO!!!
He turns 30 in June or July. Without the 2nd TJ, I could see him being ace until around 36. He will not pitch his age 30 year, and his age 31 is a crab shoot. No matter who it is, the first year back from TJS is rough. Gotta build the strength back up, and find his stuff again.
Let’s say this goes as well as you hope… he doesn’t pitch lime an ace until his age 32 year.
Sooo… 45 mils for 12 years when the best you can hope for is 4 or 5 (being generous here) of the second coming if Babe Ruth. The other 7 or 8 years is a HUGE over pay!
take the 45 mils, get an ace AND a number 3 or an ace and a couple BP arms.
Don’t be surprised if Ohtani ends up in Boston – I wouldn’t bet against it, not with Yoshida already in the fold. Also, I’m thinking the Sox also end up with a certain Japanese pitcher who’s available right now as well. Not saying definitely to either… but you’d be foolish to think it can’t happen. Chaim Bloom’s tenure is over (thankfully l) and Craig Breslow is going to do whatever it takes to get the Red Sox back into contention now, not in a couple of years – but immediately.
Fridge – Back when Ohtani was a free agent the first time, the only two non-West-Coast teams he considered were the Rangers and Cubs.
He’s NOT gonna change his mind and sign with the Sox just because of Yoshida or New Balance. The only thing that may change his mind about Boston is if Henry is willing to far outbid all other teams.
Fever – Texas sure has a lot to offer him!! They don’t need his pitching in 2024 since deGrom will be returning and the pitching depth is great in Texas. If he could DH and bat among Semien, Seager and Garcia in the top 4 of their order, that would be daunting to opposing pitchers. His chances of a ring would be better in Texas than LAD, NYY or most places that he preferred when he first came to the MLB.
Texas has $114.5MM in committed money to four stars and next to nothing to the rest of the roster thanks to having so many players under control. Adding $50MM putting it at $164.5MM is not unreasonable. Think about this
C – Heim Arb 2 – Under $1MM estimated to jumpt to $3.4MM
1B – Lowe Arb 1 – $4.5 estimated to jump to $8.8
2B – Semien – included in the $114.5MM mentioned above
SS – Seager – included in the $114.5MM mentioned above
3B – Jung – Under $1MM for the next 2 years
LF – Carter – Under $1MM for the next 2 years at least
CF – Taveras – Under $1MM estimated to jump to $2.3MM
RF – Garcia – Under $1MM estimtated to jump to $5.1MM
DH – Ohtani – $50MM or Garver is a FA in 2024
It makes perfect sense for Ohtani to go to Texas based on their huge number of young players commanding very low salaries.
In 2025 with both deGrom and Ohtani at the top of the pitching staff and Nate as their #3, this team looks to dominate for years. Breslow needs to use this model to turn the Red Sox around quickly. Guys like Devers, Yoshida and Story have no place on the roster if they can’t justify their pay through their performances.
At Troll… Now this I agree with, although I am not sold that Ohtani returns to form as a pitcher after his 2nd TJS.
DBH – Ohtani is a freak of nature so I have more faith than I would in most after two TJ surgeries. deGrom is coming back from his second TJ as well but is much older so is far riskier but like Ohtani is a freak. If Texas gets Ohtani to go with deGrom and the rest of that outstanding team, they will make the LAD teams over the last decade look like Little Leaguers!!
Can you imagine a starting staff with deGrom and Ohtani as your 1/2 punch? WOW. That would be incredible and very hard to beat in a short series.
@ Ya man. Reminds me of ’04. Teams have to have a aces at the top!
I am not convinced Ohtani returns to prime, so I am not hot on the 12/528 that he os projected for, but if he returned to form, he could be a good add for 4 or 5 years!
DBH – My man Nate The Great had two TJS, although at much younger ages of 17 and 26.
Point taken! But I am still a hard no for 12years/528mils for a 30 year old lol
DBH – I’m in total agreement, I would much much rather have Yamamoto at half that amount.
And again, if the Sox get Ohtani that means Yoshida/Devers/Casas wouldn’t be able to DH. They need to keep that DH position open.
Fever – Big money to Ohtani is well spent (see my other recent response detailing the years and payback) but I think your view of the DH spot is off.
We need ONE DH and that needs to be the best hitter among those that qualify. Today, that is Devers so Yoshida needs to go. Why you included Casas is beyond me since he’s far, far better at 1B defense than Devers is at 3B defense or Yoshida is at LF defense.
It’s simple – Devers is the DH until Boston acquires a better DH and that can only be Ohtani. Devers contract should be unloaded as soon as possible but I doubt there will be any takers so Bloom screwed the pooch for a decade.
Keeping the DH position OPEN is something I completely disagree with. That spot is Devers now and hopefully forever until he is DFA’d in his mid 30s.
Philly would look good on him
Philly would look good on him. Better than Hoskins and half the price.
Massively player friendly contract with that huge opt out, but JT produced something better than most would have expected for the Sox last year. I think this is a win/win actually.
AgentF – Not really. 114 OPS+ for $17.55MM. I think this was a win for JT only.
We could have had JD’s 134 OPS+ for $10MM had Bloom done his job. And even if it cost $17.55MM in 2023 for JD, he still would have been better than JT.
Glad to know Bloom is in the rear view mirror!!
TF – Are you also amazed at these people who are under the false impression JT had a great season? It’s almost as if they stopped following the Red Sox after the trade deadline.
JT’s numbers SUCKED after August 28th and his overall 2023 numbers were much worse than every season between 2014-2021.
He was SLIGHTLY better than 2022, whoop-dee-doo.
Not really. 114 OPS+ for $17.55MM.
=========================
$15M
Joe – Why do you keep writing the wrong number?
Go to Spotrac and check the Luxury Tax Column for 2023 and 2024 for JT.
In 2024 he cost $6.7MM because that is his buyout
In 2023 he cost $10.85MM
The buyout is part of his cost and is reflected on the books as Retained Payroll in 2024.
I’ve documented this twice now and both were in response to your inaccurate $15MM comment.
Where do I sign up for the Kluber showcase?
team – Contact the Charleston Dirty Birds.
Pirates should consider him for first base. One year/$10 million with a second year player option should do it.
Seems like a move BC would make
Its fine for sox to move on from him..nice guy but offense was not the problem pitching and defense were and turner provided neither
I’ve never understood why Bloom made this contract with such a massive buy-out. How was this supposed to work in the Sox’ favor?
If he had just a league average first year, he was going to decline the option, since he’s a near lock in free agency to top the $6.7m difference between the buyout and the option. So Boston was essentially guaranteeing him $15m for his first year ($8.3m plus the buyout).
The only way he would exercise that option is if he had been terrible the first year of the contract. Then Boston would have paid $15m for a terrible year, and been committed to a second year. Maybe he would bounce back, but why commit to the gamble?
There’s no way that second year option works out well for Boston. I just don’t get it.
I think it was a one year deal with $6.7M deferred until 2024 to spread out the money for luxury tax purposes.
bcjd – Turner wanted $17.55 and got it. Bloom simply paid it over 2 years so the luxury tax was only $10.85MM in 2023. They would have been far better off keeping JD but I don’t think JD would have had as much fun in 2023 in Boston. He knew Bloom didn’t want any part of the DD regime so he found a better place to play that appreciated him, just like they did Mookie. Also, Just like Texas did for Nate.
Leaving the toxic Bloom Red Sox was a no brainer. Now, can Breslow change the paradyme and make Boston a favorable landing place for free agents? It won’t be easy but we have to hope he can.
All – The Turner contract is a perfect example of why Bloom didn’t deserve to be a GM.
Boston paid Turner a guaranteed $10.85MM in 2023 and a guaranteed $6.7MM to not play in 2024. In essence, the Turner deal was for 1 year and it truly cost $17.55MM to put up a 114 OPS+ for a guy who can’t field because Devers played 3B and Casas 1B. Sound familar? Yep, Bloom paid Yoshida $18MM, nearly the same amount, for a 109 OPS+.
So Bloom paid nearly $36MM (Mookie’s desired money) for two guys that were slightly above league average. Four starters had better seasons
Casas OPS+ of 129 for $0.73MM
Devers OPS+ of 126 for $17.5MM
Duran OPS+ of 119 for $0.65MM
Duvall OPS+ of 114 for .$7MM
Bang for the buck? NOPE only Casas and Duran earned more than they were paid.
Add Story at $23.3MM and his 52 OPS+, Kiki’s $10MM and his 62 OPS+ and Verdugo’s $6.3MM for a league average 100 OPS+ and you can see why Bloom had to go.
SO SO much wasted money on mediocre players!!!
So was Turner at $17.55 with an OPS+ of 114 really a step up from JD like so many said?
NOPE JD cost LAD $10MM and put up a 134 OPS+ and is 3 years younger!!
FYI… JD’s 134 was higher than ANY Red Sox player in 2023!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Bloom had to go. Nothing but mistakes the four years in Boston.
Agreed. Paying Story and Yoshida a combined $41 million per year over the next four seasons instead of paying up for Bogaerts when they had the chance to get him on a reasonable extension is just a massive failure.
Bloom is gone! Get over it. Look to the future. We get two studs as FA SP’s and a power bat in right. We live through a rebuilding year with Cora, boot him upstairs, then ManUp for 2025 with CB’s new manager.
BeeCarbo – Wow you have some unusual thoughts about this team. First I’d rather put Cora on a bus to hell than kick him upstairs to find new ways to cheat at the executive level. The man is a moron and not qualified for his current job so you suggesting to kick him upstairs makes everything you said highly questionable.
You got the two SPs correct. Wake up, we don’t need an outfielder we desperately need a 3B!!! The current guy is the worst in the history of baseball based on leading the league in errors 6 seasons out of 6!!!
Fixing the defense and the pitching needs to be the emphasis for year 1 of Breslow. He can add 10 wins by fixing the defense and another 10 wins by adding the right pitchers. If he hits on the pitchers the team could win 100 games if the defense is fixed by trading Yoshida or Devers and putting the other at DH. There is great upside if he can recognize the HUGE need for defense to help the pitching staff. If you watched the World Series the reason the Rangers won had a lot to do with their defense. Jung blows away Devers at 3B. We can’t have Devers at 3B and expect to win. The local High School player could play defense better than Devers.
Yoshida does less damage in LF since fewer balls are hit to him but he’s not a Kyle Schwarber who you can live with as a bad outfielder thanks to his HRs. Yoshida is a slightly above league average hitter who can’t field.
The problems need to be addressed first. Yoshida and Devers need to retire their gloves or be traded. Then go get two stud SPs.
Turner was probably somewhat of an overpay, but I think that is sometimes necessary for players to take a one year deal. I think Bloom liked one year deals because it keeps flexibility. Turner had an OPS of .800, 23 HRs and 96 RBIs. Turner played 33 more game than JD Martinez. So, it looks like a pretty good deal to me.
suit – Fair point about flexibility, but there’s a reason the Dodgers let him go. He had drastically declined 5 consecutive years before they cut him loose.
all – You cherry picked the numbers. JD had an OPS+ higher than any Red Sox player in 2023. That should be enough to make you realize how wrong you are in assessing it as a good deal. It was a terrible tradeoff especially when you consider JD cost LAD $10MM and JT cost Boston $17.55MM.
The number of games played was a shock since JT won’t ever play that many again so his health was a positive. His 114 OPS+ offsets the large number of games played because being slightly above mediocre for more games is not comparable to being at 134 for 33 less games. FYI… JD played less games in 2023 than he has since he came to the Red Sox so it was a fluke, just like JT playing a lot more games than expected. The 134 to 114 is all that is needed to show that JD is and always will be the better player. Add the over $7MM more for JT and the real deal was gotten in LA with JD!!!
KD: I am not worried about overpaying on a one year deal…because it’s only one year! Bloom likely needed to overpay to get a one year deal. Bloom likely valued the flexibility and paid extra for that. Turner’s OPS of .800, 23 HRs and 96 RBIs is a pretty good year. This is no big deal.
All – I understand what you are saying but think about the two options Bloom had and why he chose the wrong one:
Option 1 – Keep JD who signed for $10MM with LAD and his OPS was .893, he hit 33 HRs and 103 RBIs in fewer games due to an unexpected injury.
Option 2 – Release JD and sign JT for $17.55MM spread over two seasons for just one season of play with the OPS, HRs and RBIs you listed which were all less than JD’s numbers.
If there was no better alternative, which there was in JD, then Bloom’s choice wouldn’t be so bad but because he passed on a better deal, it documents one more mistake that Bloom made.
Also, he over-paid in TWO seasons because now in 2024 Boston is paying the $6.7MM reducing available money under the CAP from $237MM to $230.3 MM. It may not seem like much today but every little bit helps!!
Angels will sign him to fill the void left by Shohei. He’ll primarily DH but will play a significant amount of 3B when Rendon makes his first scheduled trip to the IL on or about 4/1. Turner will then proceed to hit .225 while scattering 11 HR’s. The Angel way.
He’ll go back to the dodgers because they can buy whoever they want and players just seem to play harder for them
Anyone who thinks signing Turner was foolish needs to look in the mirror. The opt-out buyout was Turner’s incentive to pick the Sox over other teams. From Turner’s perspective, it was a very good safeguard. After a great season, he gets paid extra to opt out and find another good contract. If he’s bad, then he can lock in another good payday.
I’d love to get Turner for another season; however, if Ohtani is actually a target, it becomes moot or at best a backup plan. I do really love him as a righty-bat and he balances out the lineup well. But Ohtani can be the future pitcher and dominant hitter the team needs.
Cleveland – So I am looking in the mirror as you suggested and I don’t get your point. Boston had JD who put up a 134 OPS+ and he sighed for $10MM.
Bloom hid the real cost of JT by spanning it over two seasons but one year of JT cost the Red Sox $17.55MM for his 114 OPS+.
Since the choices were JD or JT, the superior choice would have been JD. It wouldn’t have changed the last place finish but it was the superior choice. Now LAD gets to evaluate whether they want JD or JT. as their DH when they lose out in the Ohtani sweepstakes. Considering JD did better and is 3 years younger, I think the 2024 anwer is the same as the 2023 answer, JD over JT.
This was the easiest decision Turner had to make. He will easily get 10+mil on a 1 year deal, making atleast 3 more million than the 13.4 he would of gotten with option. Not too bad for possibly your last year in the league.
themailman – JT’s deal was $17.55 for one year but it was to be paid out over two years. His 2024 contract wherever he chooses to go will not be impacted by the residual money the Red Sox owe him. Breslow was passed dead salary thanks to Bloom.
$15M.
Joe – Cash flow is not important. Luxury Tax money is all that matters.
In 2023 he cost $10.85MM versus the Luxury Tax.
In 2024 his buyout costs $6.7MM versus the Luxury Tax.
I’m pretty sure the two seasons cost Boston $17.55MM as I said.
If they played games with the cash flow, that really has no meaning when it comes to official payroll versus the CAP.
I could see Corey Kluber and his Kanasas City Royals this coming year