The Giants disappointed for a second straight year, finishing below .500 after flirting with Wild Card contention into the season’s final month. They fired their manager and head into the offseason in need of star talent to elevate a roster that has been built on solid depth but lacked impact players beyond its ace.
Guaranteed Contracts
- Logan Webb, RHP: $90MM through 2028
- Mitch Haniger, LF: $32.5MM through 2025 (can opt out of final $15.5MM after ’24)
- Taylor Rogers, LHP: $24MM through 2025
- Michael Conforto, RF: $18MM player option
- Sean Manaea, LHP: $12.5MM player option
- Ross Stripling, RHP: $12.5MM player option
- Anthony DeSclafani, RHP: $12MM through 2024
- Wilmer Flores, 1B: $10MM through 2025 (including player/club option for ’25)
- Luke Jackson, RHP: $8.5MM through 2024 (including buyout of ’25 club option)
Option Decisions
- RF Michael Conforto can opt out of $18MM salary
- LHP Sean Manaea can opt out of $12.5MM salary
- RHP Ross Stripling can opt out of $12.5MM salary
- Team holds $10MM option on RHP Alex Cobb ($2MM buyout)
2024 financial commitments (if all player options exercised): $104MM
Total future commitments: $222MM
Arbitration-Eligible Players
Non-tender candidates: None
Free Agents
- Alex Wood, Joc Pederson, Jakob Junis, Brandon Crawford, Scott Alexander, John Brebbia, Roberto Pérez
The Giants have been a league average team for two consecutive seasons. They’ve been unable to build off their surprising 107-win campaign of 2021. Pressure is building for the organization to figure things out.
They already made one major change. San Francisco fired manager Gabe Kapler during the final weekend of the regular season. It was a surprising alteration of course, as chairman Greg Johnson had said just two weeks ago that both Kapler and president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi would be retained.
Instead, the organization decided a change was necessary. That’s perhaps related to some clubhouse discontent. Ace Logan Webb took a shot at the franchise as the season was winding down, saying the club needed “big changes” to create a “winning mentality” in 2024. Webb didn’t publicly call for a managerial change, to be clear, but Zaidi acknowledged the organization needed “to rethink everything” shortly before Kapler was fired (relayed by Danny Emerman of KNBR).
A common complaint among fans and occasionally heard from players is that the Giants had become too matchup-dependent. They’ve been among the sport’s most aggressive teams in platooning hitters. They took a flexible approach to the pitching staff, generally patching things together with openers and bullpen games behind their top two starters of Webb and Alex Cobb.
All of that was true in 2021, when it worked to great effect. Every major league team deploys those strategies to varying degrees. Yet it’s possible that whomever the Giants tab to lead the team prioritizes more consistent roles for players than existed under Kapler. Zaidi said last week the team hoped to have a new manager in place by the start of the free agent period.
By the time free agency gets underway, San Francisco will have more clarity about its payroll picture. The Giants seem likely to exercise a $10MM option to retain Cobb, who turned in a 3.87 ERA over 28 appearances. The veteran righty is headed for a second opinion on a balky left hip (via Maria Guardado of MLB.com). Perhaps that examination reveals a more serious injury that leads the club to reconsider the option, but if he’s healthy, the $8MM difference between the option price and the buyout is strong value.
San Francisco has no control over the other three option decisions on the table. Ross Stripling, Sean Manaea and Michael Conforto all have player provisions. Stripling’s and Manaea’s are valued at $12.5MM, while Conforto would make $18MM. Stripling has already declared he’ll opt in after a down first season in the Bay Area. The other two players could at least consider opting out in search of multi-year agreements. Manaea, who turned in a quietly strong second half working mostly in multi-inning relief, seems likelier to hit the market than Conforto — particularly if he wants a guaranteed rotation spot.
They’d join a handful of other notable impending free agents. Brandon Crawford has been the starting shortstop for over a decade. Crawford won four Gold Gloves, was an integral part of the 2012 and ’14 World Series teams, and finished fourth in NL MVP balloting during a resurgent 2021 campaign. He had a stellar run in San Francisco and earned a well-deserved ovation from the fanbase on the final day of the season. He hasn’t hit much over the last two years, though, leading the organization to likely move on.
Zaidi said yesterday the club viewed 22-year-old Marco Luciano as the frontrunner for the shortstop job. It’s a risky play, as Luciano has all of 32 games of experience above the Double-A level. He struck out at a near-30% clip through 242 trips to the plate in Double-A this year. Luciano has obvious power potential and a patient plate approach, but he’s likely to strike out a lot in his initial crack at major league pitching.
That’s suboptimal for a team that hopes to compete next season, although it’s also a testament to the weakness of the middle infield market. Free agency doesn’t offer any everyday shortstop options. There aren’t any locks to be made available in trade. Perhaps a non-tender or declined option (like the White Sox with Tim Anderson) or a surprising trade possibility (e.g. Tommy Edman, Willy Adames) changes the calculus. For now, Luciano appears the in-house favorite.
There’s a little more stability around the rest of the infield. Thairo Estrada is a quality second baseman. J.D. Davis received mixed reviews from public metrics for his defensive work at third base. He’s a good hitter who’s under arbitration control for one more season. Perhaps the Giants could float him in trade offers with Wilmer Flores on hand as another righty-hitting corner infielder. Retaining Davis and keeping Flores at first base/designated hitter would also be a fine outcome. Lefty-hitting LaMonte Wade Jr. picked up the bulk of the first base reps as part of a platoon with Flores.
San Francisco could have an opening at designated hitter. Joc Pederson hits the market for the second straight year. The Giants made Pederson a $19.65MM qualifying offer last winter, which he accepted. He’s ineligible for the QO this time around and wouldn’t be in consideration for it anyway after his offensive production dipped. Pederson is a capable left-handed platoon option at DH, but it’s a rather limited profile that inhibits the team’s defensive flexibility.
Zaidi indicated yesterday that upgrading the defense was one of the club’s biggest goals (via Alex Pavlovic of NBC Sports Bay Area). Only the Rockies and Royals, who play in two of the sport’s most spacious home parks, have seen a higher percentage of batted balls fall for hits over the last two seasons. Oracle Park’s dimensions are tough to patrol as well, though few would consider the past couple Giants teams as being among the league’s most athletic.
Letting Pederson walk could aid the defense by freeing a few more DH at-bats for Conforto (if he returns) and/or Mitch Haniger. That clears corner outfield at-bats for Mike Yastrzemski and Austin Slater. Rookies Tyler Fitzgerald and Luis Matos are options to assume more center field reps in that regard, though the Giants could certainly look for more offense there — especially if they’re already counting on Luciano as an unproven shortstop.
There are few more obvious fits than San Francisco for Cody Bellinger. The Giants showed interest in Bellinger after he was non-tendered by the Dodgers last winter. The former MVP signed with the Cubs, had the rebound year he’d been seeking, and now seems set to land a contract in the $200-250MM range in his return trip to the open market. Bellinger is an above-average defensive center fielder who dramatically cut his strikeout rate this season. He doesn’t have the same power he had before 2020 shoulder surgery, but he’s a well-rounded player and one of the few star hitters available in free agency.
It’s a similar position in which San Francisco found itself last winter. They have a fair bit of position player depth but lack an impact player capable of anchoring a lineup. The Giants tried for Aaron Judge, only to see him return to the Yankees. They agreed to terms with Carlos Correa before the physical led them to nix the agreement. By the time the Correa deal collapsed, all the other star players had signed elsewhere.
While it’s little consolation to the fanbase after another middling season, missing out on Correa and Judge leaves the Giants with ample long-term payroll flexibility. Their 2024 commitments are more than $100MM south of the base luxury tax threshold. They have just over $40MM on the books beyond next season. There’s plenty of room for a splash, whether that’s Bellinger … or perhaps the market’s top free agent.
San Francisco was among the seven reported finalists for Shohei Ohtani during his first trip to the free agency six years ago. That process wasn’t about money so much as pitching the organization to the two-way star, as his earning power was capped by the bonus pool system for international amateurs. There’s no such limit this time around. Ohtani will almost certainly set the all-time contract record. Teams will still have to pitch themselves as legitimate contenders, but they’ll also have to put hundreds of millions on the table.
The Giants’ reported proposal around $360MM for Judge and agreement with Correa on what would have been a $350MM deal offer proof of concept they’re willing to spend on top-of-the-market talent. Yet Ohtani could find himself in another stratosphere altogether. Whether San Francisco ownership is willing to keep pace with potential bids from the Dodgers, Mets, Rangers and others is to be determined. It’s a similar question if San Francisco can legitimately market itself as a perennial contender to the expected AL MVP.
There could be a fair bit of pressure on the front office to land one of Ohtani or Bellinger. They’re the clear top two in free agency. San Francisco could ostensibly trade Davis to accommodate a nine-figure deal for Matt Chapman, though he’s less clear of an offensive cornerstone for a lineup that needs one.
The Giants are set behind the plate. While Patrick Bailey struggled offensively towards the end of the season, the former #13 overall pick rated as an excellent defender and showed legitimate power upside in the first half of his rookie campaign. He’s the clear long-term catcher. Rule 5 draftee Blake Sabol played well enough to hold the backup job.
That doesn’t leave much room for one-time second overall pick Joey Bart. The righty-hitting catcher has been mentioned as a trade candidate for a few seasons. He has yet to establish himself as a big league caliber hitter. Bart was drafted by the previous front office regime — Bailey was selected by Zaidi’s front office — and will be out of minor league options next spring. He’ll have to be on the major league roster or made available to other teams. It makes sense to move him this offseason, even though the return would be limited at this point.
Perhaps a team like the Marlins or Yankees would offer a potential back-of-the-rotation arm for Bart. San Francisco will need to add stability to the back of the staff. Webb is a legitimate #1 starter. Cobb, if healthy, is a quality mid-rotation piece.
The rest of the group is unsettled. Manaea could opt out. Stripling spent most of 2023 in the bullpen. Alex Wood is a free agent. Anthony DeSclafani is under contract for one more season but posted a 4.88 ERA in 19 appearances and didn’t pitch from late July onward thanks to a flexor strain.
Kyle Harrison and Keaton Winn reached the big leagues in 2023. The former is one of the sport’s most talented pitching prospects. He’s likely to hold a season-opening rotation spot after a promising debut in which he turned in a 4.15 ERA with solid strikeout and walk marks through his first seven starts. Winn had decent results in a hitter-friendly Triple-A environment and seems likely to start next season in a depth role.
Between DeSclafani’s elbow and the risk of any rookie (even one as talented as Harrison), the Giants need more rotation stability. That’d only become more pressing if Cobb is seriously injured. San Francisco has shied away from long-term free agent investments in starting pitching. Under Zaidi, they’ve targeted reclamation plays like DeSclafani, Kevin Gausman and Manaea. They took on some injury uncertainty with Carlos Rodón but limited that to a two-year, $44MM guarantee. After Gausman and Rodón had excellent seasons that put them in the nine-figure range, San Francisco moved on. While they signed Webb to a five-year contract extension, that’s quite a bit different than signing a top-of-the-market starter in free agency.
San Francisco may have to aim higher this offseason. Blake Snell and Yoshinobu Yamamoto are the best starters available beyond Ohtani, who won’t pitch until 2025. Aaron Nola and Jordan Montgomery should exceed the $110MM that Gausman received from the Blue Jays a couple years back. Sonny Gray might not be far off that mark.
The Giants could ostensibly make a run at Bellinger and one of those starters. San Francisco had an Opening Day player payroll around $187MM this past season, per Cot’s Baseball Contracts. They’ve topped $200MM in the past. They’d have only $112MM in guaranteed commitments for next year if all of Conforto, Stripling and Manaea opt in and they retain Cobb.
A strong arbitration class could tack on another $30MM, but that still leaves around $40MM in spending room. A trade of an arbitration-eligible player like Davis or Yastrzemski and/or an opt-out from Manaea would make two large free agent pickups realistic even if the organization kept payroll around this year’s level. If they chose to stick with their traditional tack of shorter-term rotation adds, the likes of Kenta Maeda, Seth Lugo and Michael Lorenzen could offer some stability. Frankie Montas or Luis Severino would be traditional Giants-style reclamation adds.
They’ll likely need to add bullpen depth as well. Jakob Junis, John Brebbia and Scott Alexander are all headed to free agency. While none of that trio is a household name, they turned in a combined 172 2/3 innings of 4.12 ERA ball this past season. That’s acceptable middle relief volume that’ll need to be replaced.
The Giants have Camilo Doval in the ninth inning. Submariner Tyler Rogers is an effective setup option. Last winter’s signees Taylor Rogers and Luke Jackson were fine in year one. The Giants have high-leverage options but could identify a middle relief target or two on a short-term free agent deal.
There are a lot of ways in which the offseason could go. Zaidi confirmed this week that he’s in the final season of his contract as he enters his sixth year leading baseball operations. There’s clearly increasing urgency to secure a star player and, more importantly, push a fine but unexceptional roster back to playoff contention. The first order of business is finding a new manager. Once the winter rolls around, the goal should be to add a franchise player.
In conjunction with this post, Anthony Franco held a Giants-centric chat on 10-04-23. Click here to view the transcript.
If the Giants were an action movie they’d be The Rock
But if they were an action movie star theyd be Sean Connery.
Giants should make a run at either, or both they have the money, Ohtani and Bellinger. Ohtani will be ready to join the rotation in 2025, so you get his bat in 2024. Bellinger can play either 1B or Center Field, so he brings a power bat and gold glove defense.
Belli also carries a huge amount of risk. Cumulative 1.0 bWAR in the three seasons prior to 2023.
True about Bellinger but Ohtani should definitely be on their radar. He immediately adds the star power they need, and he’s going to be a huge power boost in the DH spot.
Problem with Bellinger, and many others, is below average numbers in Oracle.
All you have to do is convince him that all the other teams that are actually good at baseball and are offering the same amount of money as the Giants don’t know what they are doing.
Bellinger’s numbers at Oracle aren’t that bad, and besides, every player’s numbers at visiting parks are small samples. 171 PAs, 150 ABs, seems like a large number, but that’s only about a quarter of a season. He also had 8 2Bs and 3 3Bs at Oracle which would be pretty good for one fourth of a season.
Ohtani has pretty much declared that he wants to win…..are the Giants in the position of moving ahead of the pack in the NL West……..add in that they’re looking for a new manager……pretty iffy even with him in the lineup…….probably a big no thanks to SF…..
@Rocky, he did anything but declare that. He made a status quo statement responding to a question at WBC. He responded exactly how any player well versed in handling the media should have answered.
@ted theadorelogan, excellent! Take. They also have to show him they have enough combined talent on the roster to equal Mike Trout, which I’m not sure they can do.
Maybe the broken leg and dislocated shoulder slowed him down for the first two of those three years?
Perish that thought.
I am a little more bullish on bellinger – there is a good argument to be made that his down years came after the freak post wiin celebration that happened after the WS – if he has gotten past that he could very well have a lengthy resurgence
It’s what happened. That, and the leg fracture. All last year I was saying, wait for him to play completely healthy for awhile before being so sure he’s all washed up. The weird part is this season didn’t actually change the fan debate about him that much.
. I don’t think Bellinger would go to SF Giants unless they really overpay. The pack would not be a good place for him.
Giants should NOT overpay—or even pay—for Bellinger. Too risky!
Both Ohtani and Bellinger are going going to have attractive offers this winter
Frisco isn’t one of them
Add options to that statement and you have it covered…..
When you look at the S.F Giants you don’t really see much on-field talent and until they rectify that(Thru drafting and trade mkt)it really won’t matter who the on-field manager is.
Lots of mix and matchups were part of the way they won games, knowing when to play guys, agaisnt what pitchers. Kapler did well with the roster construction he was given.
That and a remarkable amount of luck with health.
What’s remarkable about being 15th in most man games lost? That’s not terrible. Not as bad as the Dodgers. but hardly remarkably good luck when 15 other teams had fewer. You could say that about the Phillies though SF had 46 IL stints for 1,571 man games lost. Philly had 20 IL stints with 890 games lost and the Astros.
2023 Giants had absolutely terrible injuries throughout the entire starting lineup.
Kapler did well with the roster construction he was given.
==============================
I think he did a great job. if you took a simple comparison to the Padres, how many position players on the Giants would start for the Padres? I’m not bashing, but that might be -0-. How many pitchers in the rotation? Webb for sure. Cobb maybe, but not definitely (outside of injuries). Sd with the better closer also, even if Doval is good.
In other words, SD is twice as good, but only 3 games better. And I can do that with a lot of teams. Again, not bashing, but the Giants look like they played way over their talent level.
I totally agree with you, thought the manager did a much better job then he gets credit for. The roster was just not good enough.
@joe Brady, at least one, the back up catcher from last years spring training.
Player and pitcher don’t want to play in San Fransico bad park.
Old and unproven narrative.
So much to do….be interesting to see how Zaidi handles the off-season this time around…if he flops he’s gone. Imo he should already be out.
Apparently getting coffee and donuts for Friedman in LA didn’t teach either Chaim Bloom or Farhan Zaidi much. They churn thru the waiver wire constantly and just keep rostering AAAA players.
Bloom never worked for the Dodgers, and Friedman is on record that Bloom actually was the brains behind the Rays.
Apparently Tampa is where Bloom got coffee & donuts for Friedman. My bad.
Of course that’s what he says but Friedman is as the guy that got all the credit and he is the guy that has kept it going. While bloom and zaidi have both floundered. Maybe Friedman is just a humble guy.
SF finished 81-81 and are 19th in FanGraphs farm system rankings.
Most of their prospects are fairly advanced (Matos, Harrison, Bailey, Luciano, Schmitt, Meckler).
The next generation of hitters in AAA or already in the MLB. Sadly, the team is hamstrung by a number of bad veteran contracts signed this past off-season.
I think the Giants next window starts in 2025. With Conforto, Haniger, Stripling, DeSclafani all coming off the books, there will be ample room to spend in 2025.
A “passive” punt on 2024 sounds like the most prudent strategy to give your prospects playing time to see what you have and to let your veterans contracts run out (and hopefully be able to flip some of them at the deadline).
I don’t think the team is in the position to be World Series contenders in 2024, and spending this offseason to make that happen would be foolish.
The Giants were 79-83.
Actually, they were 79-83.
Steve is so nice he corrected ya twice.
I don’t see the free agent talent available in 2025. I think the giants always have the problem of getting the top free agents to sign and play there and since there is so much money – they will almost always miss out. So might as well make 24 the window and keep filling the roster w 2-3 war type players and hopefully get hot at the right time
First off the giants aren’t hampered by any bad contracts. Even the ones you listed shouldn’t matter much. The giants have a little over 114m in the books, 140m with arb for next year. That’s should leave a ton of payroll room if the giants acted like the big market team they are. No reason they are getting out spent by the padres.
the giants have a ton in the system to think about in trades, the argument is that you have black, wisenhunt and roupp all about to knock on the door as starters and if you don’t want to touch them guys like teng who are a little further down have gotten interest in the past as well. You can package them with guys that could be useful like Bart and hjelle and ramos and you should be able to put together a package or 2 for some position player youth with a team that has a surplus like the reds or such that needs to bolster the pitching and catching positions
4th generation Reds fan here…
No thank you on the trade thought…
well guess you don’t care about the team getting better.The giants have a major pipeline of young pitching and the reds have not a whole lot – and logjams coming up in position players – it would be a mutually beneficial situation to work a trade as opposed to someone ‘winning’ one. Personally I don’t want to see any of the arms in the giants system go either.
the farm system rankings are kind of subjective – they are going to go down because of graduates but really everything in the top 3rd is constantly in flux
David White — Just to be accurate: The Giants finished 79-83. Their farm system is rated 18th by Fan Graphs. Even if Conforto doesn’t opt out, the Giants have “ample room to spend” now.
Don’t disagree that they’re not WS contenders with the current roster, but let’s see what Zaidi does this off season now that there’s flame under his ass. Otherwise, he’s toast.
If SF fails to land Ohtani or Bellinger than a reset year would be in order.
They’ve got vets with value. Selling off pieces like Davis, Wilmer, Yaz, Slater, Wade Jr and Cobb would be a start.
But if they land Shohei then it’s game on.
I wouldn’t sell on yaz or wade and would hate to see wilmer go but the others could make some sense if things in the offseason go sideways
They’re outlook: let players like Gausman go while trying to sign.230 batting average Correas
Split that Shohei money… sign Gray or Nola, Bellinger, Leclerc and IKF
1B Wade Jr/Wilmer
2B Thairo
3B Davis
SS Luciano
LF Yaz/Slater
CF Bellinger
RF Confronto/Slater
DH Haniger
C Bailey
IF IKF
IF Wilmer
OF Fitzgerald
OF Slater
C Sabol
SP Webb
SP Gray/Nola
SP Cobb
SP Manaea
SP Desclafani/Stripling
RP Stripling/Desclafani
RP Brebbia
RP Jackson
RP Rodgers
RP Rodgers
RP Leclerc
RP Dovel
If this is the roster, Farhan is gone before the All star break.
Yeah that’s a lot of money and still not a very good team.
they don’t really need much in the way of pitching – they have harrison, webb, cobb, stripling, desclafani, beck, winn for sure as starters and probably desclafani at least will need to go to the pen – manaea could very well opt out and though I like brebbia they may want to leave him out of the loop since he is a FA. the reason they are talking trade is because you also have knocking on the door wisenhunt, blkack and roupp as well as others that are climbing the system. IKF is the opposite of what they need as well as the infield is fairly sewn but especially if conforto opts out it gives you the option to add more OF defense and athleticism.
DwayneMurphyFav —
Texas picks up its Leclerc option.
None of Manaea, DeSclafani or Stripling are better than Kyle Harrison or Keaton Winn
Giants don’t need IKF
Nice work Mr. Franco. A few comments. One, you failed to mention that the there was no DH in the NL and that is the primary reason Ohtani chose the Angels. Many in the media think he’ll sign with the Dodgers. If true, then he would’ve signed with them 7 years ago. So, again, without the DH, a NL team had no chance. Two, you said the 3 relievers are “not household names”. What bearing does that have? Did you watch the 4 games last night? How many pitchers were used last night that the average household recognized? That’s kind of meaningless. And three, your $ numbers are accurate, but keep in mind that the $187mil payroll would have been much higher if Judge and/or Correa would have been signed. So my prediction is that SF goes all in and in fact could exceed the $237mil threshold. If they’re lucky enough to sign Ohtani, and I believe they’ll offer more $ than anyone, they’ll lose a draft pick because Ohtani will be given a QO. I don’t know who else will get QOs but I just predict SF will not let losing picks deter them from spending. Perhaps that would lead to signing Yamamoto. Depending on who gets hired to manage, Conforto and/or Manaeh might opt out which would free up $30mil more. They could possibly have $137mil to spend. Could be an eventful offseason.
Mr Franco, you wrote about the QO on September 20. Here’s what you wrote: Shohei Ohtani, Cody Bellinger, Blake Snell, Matt Chapman, Aaron Nola, Sonny Gray and Josh Hader are among the players who are near locks to receive and reject the QO this winter. Jordan Montgomery and Lucas Giolito were taken out of QO consideration by midseason trades, while Eduardo Rodriguez and Marcus Stroman are ineligible as previous recipients.
So thank you. Giants should target Mongomery and Yamamoto.
When Farhan was asked about rookie or experienced manager, the one quality he spoke about was attracting free agents. I think that indicates a desire to be active.
I don’t think it’s that bad of a situation. Stacks of youngsters will hopefully be better for the run, and they will come back with another Papago off season under their belt. Enough payroll flexibility to add quality if it’s there.
I’d be content with one top of the rotation pitcher. Beck didn’t rate a mention in the article but I think he earned himself an early crack at the rotation. I’m a fan. Got a controlled aggressive swag that I like to watch.
Fopp, of Conforto and Maneah, what do you hope for? What do you expect? Opt outs or ins?
Also, it looks like Melvin is not leaving SD. Baggerly mentioned he thought Burrell might be a good manager but that idea hasn’t floated anywhere. Fopp, who would you like to manage. I don’t want a member of the current staff.
Tough questions, Claude.
I’m far too removed for a firm opinion. Happy if they both stay. Manaea because of the finish, Conforto because I can’t see him being worse, and the market is weak.
Take my removed comment and magnify it by 10 for the Manager. I just don’t know about the individual qualities. As Zaidi has prioritised, I’m good with someone respected in the FA marketplace and relatable to a young roster. Cop out I know, but I just don’t have the knowledge.
Managers don’t attract free agents. Location aka city, money and chance to win are all way above manager unless you are wanting someone in the last remaining years looking for a soft landing spot.
Let’s see if he walks the talk. I see his comment as preparation to shift blame to the manager when those FAs don’t sign. In reality, the blame should fall on the top dogs. They are the ones who create the philosophy and the expectations. When you think LA, NY, Houston – they will spend and trade to win now. Add in Atlanta and now Texas, good players will get top contracts with winning franchises and put themselves in a position to win the WS. Most of the players in MLB view the Giants as a team content to win just enough games to get into the playoffs, if the stars align,
Claude Raymond — I agree with everything you say, but don’t understand what you’re saying here:
“Many in the media think he’ll sign with the Dodgers. If true, then he would’ve signed with them 7 years ago. So, again, without the DH, a NL team had no chance.”
That was then, this is now.
Point was Franco intimated that SF was not attractive to Ohtani. Not having DH deterred him from cHoosing SF. Same reason he didn’t choose Dodgers. I’m trying to argue the narrative that SF is not desirable but Dodgers are desirable. That did not apply 7 years ago is my point. but no dh did apply 7 years ago.
This franchise is stuck in mud
If the Giants sign Ohtani, I predict that he won’t hit 30 home runs until 2026, leaving 2004 Barry Bonds (46) as the last Giant to do so #HotTake
What an absolute sh!tshow Farhan has assembled for years to come
The Giants should take that $500 Mil they’re going to throw at Ohtani (but that he won’t take) and spread it out to Matt Chapman (4.4 bwar – sign him first), Bellinger (4.4 bwar – he’ll see upgrades are happening in SF and might look beyond his Dodger past) and Blake Snell (6 bwar – maybe willing to come onboard now that there’s more offense). Surround them with their crop of 2-ish war guys (Yaz, Wade, Estrada and Flores), up and comers Bailey and Luciano, and platoon Conforto and Haniger in LF/DH. Trade Davis (0.8 bwar). That would be a competitive team we can build on. Thanks, Farhan!
So let’s say Ohtani cost 50m a year. You want to sign snell, bellinger and Chapman for 50m a year. I know you look at the 500m but that’s not the same as those 3 which will cost you more like 80m a year.
Not sure Chapman is worth the money. Terrific glove, but why else? Do Giants need another swing and miss guy?
It doesn’t hurt to go for Ohtani, but I have to imagine Zaidi’s addiction to former Dodgers will lead him to Bellinger. Which isn’t a bad thing.
And then it would be great to land either Sonny Gray or Jordan Montgomery, and then maybe a reclamation project like Jack Flaherty.
I don’t like this idea of Luciano being the guy at SS. He still seems pretty raw. Go get Tim Anderson on the cheap, and benefit from him rebuilding his stock in his walk year.
Everything about Tim Anderson—his glove, his bat and his head—are nothing but trouble. Giants don’t need him.
Idk if there’s any other team with more pressure going into this offseason than the Giants (maybe the Padres and Yankees). The Giants either need to go really hard on free agents or stop being delusional and just do a rebuild/retool centered around Webb, Harrison, Luciano and Bailey.
4-14 on series records from July 31st. Thru end of the season. With one sweep against Colorado.
Farhan Mentioned the Colorado series that they lost in Sept as being a turning point. And they went 9-4 against Colorado for the season.
This is a team that could be borderline delusional. Or just completely full of it. And it starts with Farhan. I haven’t really looked into numbers this year. But seeing this, With the players being brought aboard. And all the continuing questions marks that are getting worse, I don’t see how this guy turns it around with the same old story as before.
Farhan is talented yes. With Pitching and Homers. There are also reports that players in the minors are being taught to not compete. A poor minor league culture.
This will be his last year. And the GM from Houston, he has an opportunity here to show some things as well. The G’s have a long history of solid front office people. Anyone that supports Farhan Blindly moving forward would be Foolish.
I gave him the benefit of the doubt until now. The contention window is here. 2025. They need to win some postseason series’ next season. Anything less would be a total failure. We’ve seen enough of what he can do with chances. The experiments need to bring results.
Headline just now, Farhan said they will not be looking into Starters in Free Agency. They are going to go with what they have. When it was a very glaring weakness thru the season, the health and effectiveness of the starters. The fact that he is declaring well before the world series they are not going to look, with the payroll they have, shows more of the same.
You can’t hide the stripes on a Zebra. Farhan trying to outsmart baseball isn’t going to work. This guy is moneyball thru and thru. Find the cheap value in stats and exploit it. But Billy is far Better than Farhan. Better players in the minors. Much better trades. And had speed in addition to power. And the arms to prove himself great.
Reading this is a joke. I want the guy gone. I knew he was bad at press conferences. His jokey laughs at everything when things aren’t even humorous. Trying to connect. Focusing on saying the right things. And back to doing to exact same stuff and telling us so. When a few days ago he said they would look to make changes in how they and himself, do things.
The guy is a Tool. Larry Baer on the hotseat now for this hiring.
JayRider, if you read the story again, you’ll see he was talking about starter DEPTH. Back end of rotation starters. 1-2 year contracts. He clearly said they’ll still look at top of the rotation starters. Heres the quote from Pavlovics article “Anytime you have a chance to add top of the rotation options, we’ll look at it, but for guys that are more back of the rotation options, we just don’t view that as a need,” Zaidi said.
Jay, I get you don’t like Zaidi. It’s understandable but if you’re looking to b**** over nothing, you’ll find nothing to b**** about. And you did that. Read better.
You’re a fool. Enough Said.
JayRider, man, I gotta tell you, your response told me all I needed to know about you. Note to self:
JayRider. Stay away. Smarter than me.
Hey, Proved my point. Thank You.
The headline is “Giants Don’t Plan To Add Starting Pitching Depth During Offseason” and Zaidi quote is “Anytime you have a chance to add top of the rotation options, we’ll look at it, but for guys that are more back of the rotation options, we just don’t view that as a need,” Pretty clear there JayToolRider. I’d say you’re an idiot.
Maybe instead of signing 3-5 bad players for over 10M a piece they should just sign one or two good ones for 20M+? Just a thought. They have another wannabe genius. GM though who’d rather dumpster dive and overthing everything instead of actually use his resources.
Bellinger should be a definite but I would hesitate on Ohtani because he was never honest about the severity of his elbow injury and how good is he going to be next year after elbow surgery? They have to get another starting pitcher.
The Giants have at least one in-house option for a reliever in Miller. A number of Bay area media sites had Fitzgerald and Miller as September call ups and were half right. Miller’s numbers in the PCL outside of the high BB were incredible.
If the Giants had any balls they would sign Trevor Bauer. Clearly he would become the ace on this team. Then sign Tim Anderson. I’d rather have someone willing to fight than to cowardly give up like half of this team. Forget signing any top 5 FAs, they won’t come to a third world city. Focus instead on trading prospects for top players. Oh yeah, Farhan said no one values our prospects like we do. Probably right and explains why Villar and Schmitt fizzled. And why Harrison is becoming the starting version of Hunter Strickland.
I think both are optimg out. Conforto should get a better offer considering the free agent pool of hitters is awful. Manaea pitched well the last 4 months and should be able to match the deal he got last offseason.
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Based.
We have a few terrible contracts to deal with (big$ zero return on investment), DeSclafani has been the worst signing of the bunch, horrible stats since the ink dried on the contract. Stripling and Hanigar contracts are just as bad, and we are stuck with all three of them for next year. Farhan signs marginal and injured players hoping for a career year comebacks, we need professional hitters, not .200 hitters that had one good year a decade ago. Sad shape for 2024.