Two weeks ago, the Angels announced that Shohei Ohtani was done pitching for the season after imaging revealed a tear in the UCL of his throwing elbow. Ohtani has yet to address that injury with that media, but his agent, CAA’s Nez Balelo, met with reporters this evening.
Balelo called it “inevitable” that Ohtani will need to undergo some type of procedure (relayed by Dylan Hernández of the Los Angeles Times). Whether that’ll be a full Tommy John surgery or something less invasive (e.g. an internal brace repair) is still to be determined.
According to Balelo, the tear is in a different area than the injury that necessitated Ohtani’s October 2018 Tommy John surgery. He called it a “best case scenario” given the situation (via Bill Shaikin of the L.A. Times). Balelo made clear that Ohtani plans to be in the lineup as a designated hitter next season. He stressed that “there’s not a question in (Ohtani’s) mind” he’ll eventually be able to return to pitching as well, though that timetable remains uncertain pending their decision on the specific treatment necessary (relayed by Alden González of ESPN).
Shortly after the UCL tear was discovered, Halos’ general manager Perry Minasian told reporters that Ohtani and CAA declined the team’s offer to undergo imaging after the two-way star reported finger cramping in early August. While that could be interpreted as a shot at Ohtani or his representation, Balelo said they had no issue with the Angels going public with that information (via Sam Blum of the Athletic). He confirmed that Ohtani declined imaging at the time.
Ohtani has continued hitting since the injury, raking at a .300/.500/.500 clip in 43 plate appearances. It seems he’ll continue as the DH, at least until the plan to address his elbow is finalized. The AL MVP favorite is up to an astounding .304/.412/.654 batting line and is tied with Matt Olson for the major league lead with 44 home runs.
Even with uncertainty about his short-term outlook on the mound, Ohtani stands as the clear top player in the upcoming free agent class. If he prioritizes the overall guarantee, the 29-year-old seems likely to eclipse the $360MM record which Aaron Judge established last winter. Teams will obviously closely monitor his arm health to assess the likelihood he’ll be able to recapture his top-of-the-rotation form whenever he’s healthy enough to again begin throwing.
Ohtani hurt himself trying to carry the team.
Has anyone here writing and posting ever played the game?
Have you?
There is a zero percent chance he ever has.
Obviously, some neckbeard that goes by “Samuel” has never played the game.
Unless you are a 1930s ghost of a baseball player, maybe you can use your hapsberg chin as a bat.
AbortTexasCarpetbombFlorida;
Ohtani was doing his job. Period.
No player in MLB is “carrying his team”. Not unless he can bat 4-5 times through the batting order and start pitching games every other day.
Go back to your computer baseball game and rotisserie league.
@AbortTexas: don’t worry yourself about Samuel. He is constantly being an arrogant doofus to everyone here. A real know-it-all that puts down people in his responses. As an added bonus, he’s also thin-skinned and will mute you as he needs a safe space. Typical blowhard.
You must be from New York? What’s the commission like on your penny stocks?
How in hell does ‘flyover state’ equate to an insult?
What’s a base ball?
I’m sure many of us played to some level (high school for myself) and are not total novices. However if anyone posting here did play profiles i doubt they would out themselves to not get hounded by nonstop questions
It’s a comment section on a rumors website. You know the answer.
They’re fat and happy too which makes it harder to hoist a team. Rendon weighs a ton by himself, carrying all that stolen cash around
Are you talking about Anthony 2ton Randon Arte Moreno boy
Shohei Ohtani pulled a bleak muscle the baseball gods haven’t been too nice to the Angels this year
I wonder if they change their name to the Los Angeles devils would that change their luck
Still cost him a TON of money. Before the injury, he was looking at 600MM (30M as a pitcher & 30M as a hitter). Now, teams will be hesitant to pay him as a two-way player, effectively almost cutting his value in half. At least that’s my take Captain.
He’ll still break a new player high and get 40m plus avv minimum. You can take that to the bank, or I mean Ohtani can.
Before the injury he was looking at a deal that would have topped Scherzer and Verlander by a few million in AAV over 10-12 years.
If he decides today that he will ONLY be a hitter, he is still going to handily pass Judge’s deal both in AAV and in years.
I think he’s looking at 10-12/400 ish million. It’s an absolutely insane contract but at this point in time—you can’t value the pitching aspect at the top of the market level. I think he was going to get a number that started with 5 before his injury. He’s a huge Jersey and ticket selling asset who can really hit.
I can’t believe it’ll be anyone other than the Angels or the typical big spenders giving that out though.
Mlbs version of Eric Lindros
Different take, would it really be so awful for him to put all his energies into being the best right fielder in the game?
Would he still be more valuable than Acuña at that point?
I wouldn’t put it past him.
Fair enough!
@Gwynning
When has Acuña provided value in RF?
@York- he hasn’t played any other position this year.
Or last.
@oldyork pretty much the entire season. Ran down multiple hits destined for doubles and has a gun from the outfield…which Braves games are you watching?
@braveshomer
-0.5 dWAR in 6 seasons. He’s not providing value in RF. He’d be an excellent DH but but not much defense to speak of.
That’s near nothing over a 6 season span, >0.1 war a year lol
*dWAR at that- perhaps the most debatable and arbitrarily contrived stat. 30 out of 30 teams would take Acuña in RF, who are we foolin’ York?
What does out above average say…. That’s a pretty good stat for outfielders.
OAA is not a fan of Acuna’s work in RF. He’s at -8.
@tstats
That’s because the first few years, he was decent but then he got injured and he’s become a negative impact on defense since then. -0.5 in 2022 & -0.4 so far in 2023. Again, I’m not saying teams wouldn’t want his offense but do you really want negative WAR on defense? He’s costing the team wins because of his defense so I’d say move him to DH if you want his value.
The polo grounds *hi hat and snare hit*
@Gwynning
You can use TZ if you want that shows he has a career total of -9, which sits between Poor and Awful. He just isn’t that great on defense so I don’t see why teams would want him as a RF. Do they want him as DH or for his offense and will overlook that lost runs based on his lack of defensive skills? Sure. Either way, he’s not good at defense and thus, why I asked when he provided value in RF.
O.Y.
He’s definitely provides excellent performance as a RF even if he’s a below average RF
Come on
He’s providing about 5.2 fWAR per 600 PA as a RF
Yes, he’s been below average defensively in RF.
No,,that does not mean he’d be better as a DH
The positional adjustment for RF is -7.5 runs for a full season.
Acuña has been about -4.5 runs per year as a RF over the last two years (he was positive in the seasons before that).
Adding -4.5 to -7.5 gives us -12 runs defensively for Acuña per season.
A DH provides -17.5 runs defensively (please don’t be confused by the fact that a DH provides negative runs compared to the average player who plays defense).
Thus, Acuña is still providing about 5 more runs per year than he would as a DH.
That’s before factoring that most hitters hit worse when they DH than when the play the field
mglbaseball.wordpress.com/2013/12/09/pinch-hitter-…
@filihok
The role of the DH is to hit and only hit so the #’s you’re comparing aren’t similar but you just proved that he isn’t that much better as a RF in terms of offense and would be a terrible DH and as I pointed out can’t field his position. So, he’s good on offense but overhyped quite a bit.
OY
Just how old are you?
What numbers did I compare that aren’t similar? I compared player value. How is that not similar?
How did I prove he would be a terrible DH? Wut?
Of course he can field his position. He just doesn’t do it as well as the average RFer.
Overhyped? I don’t [care] about hype. He’s one of the 5 most productive players in the game.
Yes. I don’t want half of Babe Ruth or a Baby Ruth.
Missing out on that electric 81 mph fastball!
Yankees bleacher creature: Ruth never pitched and played the OF at the same time. He was a pitcher, then switched to the OF. I think there will still offer Ohtani a record-setting salary. Those will be the ones who are patient and will wait for Ohtani to pitch again. Or, his contract could be structured so that he’s paid as a hitter. If he can come back and pitch like he has, then they could add onto his salary.
He did in 1918 and 1919.
1918: 20 games as a pitcher, 166.1 IP, 59 games in the outfield
1919: 17 games as a pitcher, 133.1 IP, 111 games in the outfield.
Led the league in homers both years. It wasn’t until he was traded to the Yankees in 1920 that he all but stopped pitching, logging only 5 games and 31 innings as a pitcher for the rest of his career.
In those days, a full season of pitching was 325 innings. Ruth was pitching half the season and hitting half the season, not really doing both at once.
If Ruth had the fortune of the DH from the very start of his career, and the rule change MLB instituted for Ohtani, then Ruth’s unprecedented career would be totally off the charts. He had 94 wins as is. He might have hit over 800 HRs with the additional DH ABs early in his career, and perhaps had 300 career wins as he wouldn’t have had to stop being a two-way player.
Having spent all of 8.1 innings in the Outfiel in the past 6 years who knows what Ohtani’s defensive skills look like these days
I’m pretty sure Ohtani is a good enough athlete to play RF.
I’m a lot more sure about that than just about anything.
It won’t be next season, now.
This was all under the predicate the injury was bad enough that he would stop pitching and not bad enough to cause major surgery.
He doesn’t want to stop pitching. He’s going to be a DH as long as he still wants to pitch, and can pitch.
Worked for Babe Ruth….
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know if he has any experience at another position. 1B Of? If he were to give up pitching or not make a successful comeback. Could he be something other than a DH?
I remember him playing OF early on in his Japanese playing career. He has the tools but I think wanted to focus on hitting and pitching
If my memories serves, he has played about 80 professional games in the outfield.
7 games in the OF in the MLB; but he may have more in Japan
He has played about 8 innings in the Of in the 2021. That was only because he was pulled as a pitcher and was due to bat the next inning (before the Ohtani rule).
I don’t remember him making any plays though, maybe a grounder that got through.
Most likely 1st base because he can’t throw, he has played outfield just not sure if someone will put him out there. He doesn’t look bad handling grounders and he’s one of the faster mlb players.
First basemen have to throw too.
Bryce Harper played first, and dh from his tommy John. I agree and water is wet. It’s not as strenuous on the arm is what I meant.
We don’t know the severity of his injury. Of course TJ pr3vents him from playing the outfield.
Rex: I don’t think Harper had a full tj procedure. That’s how he was able to come. ack so soon.
Harper did have TJ, not internal brace surgery.
Harper did have Tommy Johns, the recovery timeline is shorter for position players to start with and he came back as a full-time dh which allowed him to return sooner
Could try out being a closer when if he decides to return to pitching, dude is obviously talented enough to do that if he wanted. Though throwing fewer innings doesn’t necessarily mean less risk of injuries to the arm.
Closer, DH and/or 1B would still be a big draw for any team
He’d half to get up and down. Being an RP will never work.
Closer could work if they pull him in the eight most likely a opener, and that is realistically a year and half from now
Unless baseball is going to change their rules (again) for Ohtani, being a reliever wouldn’t work out because he would have to be able to warm up and a guy cannot be pulled from a game and then be allowed to re-enter.
That why I said opener, he might not even get tommy John supposedly it wasn’t as bad of a tear. That’s why nothing has been announced he’s getting several opinions
How many millions does he stand to lose heading into freedom genxy this off-season…
Tens if not hundreds…
Otani will always make more from endorsements than from a contract. In Japan, he is God. Merchants can’t get enough of him.
Almost as big as Snoopy.
Ohtani made $35 million in endorsements this year. Most of that in Japan. More than the salary he made with the Angels.
He also made the Angels a similar amount in sponsorships. He also was the teams #1 draw. People came to see him play that could not care less about the Angels.
He is worth far more to the team that signs him than his production on the field. Which is why Arte refused to trade him last season and this season.
I wonder if the Angels knew about all of this before the trade deadline
Supposedly he didn’t say anything, besides a broken nail or blister can’t remember, he declined a mri
It is strange, but I guess I have to take it as face value
If a player opts for TJ while a free agent how is that paid for with no employing team?
I’m sure he can afford to pay out of pocket.
An Insurance claim would name the Angels as Employer.
>how is that paid for with no employing team?
nbcsports.com/mlb/news/now-that-hes-released-who-p…
Looks like the angels may have a chance to keep him. Surely no other team gives him what he would’ve gotten if he were healthy. Maybe he wants to win so badly that he takes a pay cut though? Unless the Angels just go crazy with free agent additions. But then again, are there any elite free agents this coming offseason?
I still say he’s going to either San Francisco or Boston.
Julio Ur… Carlos Co… umm… Arson Judge?
Yup, he is taking a pay cut from $45 million per season to $40-43 million per season over the next decade plus IF he announces he is only going to be a hitter and give up pitching.
A quick correction for a number of commenters…
Ohtani isn’t ‘losing’ anything because of an injury he couldn’t help. He didn’t have the money yet.
And he’s still going to get paid handsomely, hopefully by Seattle, perhaps with a base of 30m AAV with incentives for each pitching start and opt-outs to his liking. .
I was thinking the same thing as a possible Ohtani contract, but more like 40m avv, with 500k bonus on each start he made throughout his contract…. BTW, booo no chance on your M’s signing him with there cheap ass owners 😉
As “Only” a hitter, he will get paid as much AAV as Judge or more, because he is a much better international draw, and he will get a minimum of 10 and possibly 12 years. Ohtani is 3 years younger than Judge was.
> Ohtani isn’t ‘losing’ anything because
> of an injury he couldn’t help.
> He didn’t have the money yet.
He loses future earnings potential due to his injury if all of the teams bidding for his services as a hitter and pitcher whave doubts as to how well he would pitch after a second TJS (if that is what he needs). Successful UCL surgery isn’t a 100% certainty, especially a second one. Let’s say that the teams all bid $45MM per year instead of $60MM. So, over 10 years that would be $450MM instead of $600MM or $150MM “lost”. The injury definitely hurts his earning potential but how much is unknown.
Thank you so much for that breakdown, Hemlock. I had never heard of ‘earning potential’ and the concept had never been a thought.
There are no guarantees in baseball. It’s truly amazing how few people seem to actually understand that.
> There are no guarantees in baseball.
Strike three! You’re not out!
There are indeed rules….
And lots of bad jokes.
He would never play for Seattle. Seattle is Ichiro’s legacy. Otani would not mess with that.
His next contract will not be longer than 3 years and will be around 150MM in total if 3. Thus he’ll at least break the single year biggest salary record.
His next contract will be 11 years and be omre than $440 million and that is if he announces at season’s end that he will never pitch again.
If he decides to have surgery he will top the $43 million that Verlander and Scherzer got as an AAV and will sign a very long deal.
I’ll take the over
Of course it is. Whether its PRP injection, TJ, or Internal Brace, something has to be done to stabilize the tear.
DId anyone think it wouldn’t happen?
Something this injury kind of makes me wonder a bit is, because of the fact he’s going to have to undergo physicals and such, regarding how much it may or may not impact his overall offers:
Do you take a one year pillow contract and then go into the offers the following season hoping that the following year physicals show that the injury won’t affect your pitching and take a 10 year deal then? Or do you just take the 10 year deal and accept any possible negative effects of the deal with regards to the prospect of when he’ll be ready to pitch again? I mean, clearly you reject the qualifying offer, because even just as DH, I’m sure many teams would offer him a high one year deal with the idea they can tempt him to resign the following offseason. But at what level of a hit to the 10 year offers do you just take the gamble and bet on yourself on a pillow contract just to go into free agency healthy? Of course that’s even if there’s any hit on the offers at all. Still likely someone offers him 500 million
I think a one-year deal is very unlikely
More likely he signs a massive deal as a hitter with bonuses for innings pitched.
But, no one knows until it happens.
Maybe he’ll just take the QO, not have a pick attached to him next year, and be somewhere he’s familiar while he recovers. Unlikely, but not impossible.
He’d definitely reject the qualifying offer for sure still. If he wanted to re-enter free agency healthy without a qualifying offer, he’d still be able to land a one year deal that was larger than the qualifying offer. I’m pretty sure any contending team wouldn’t mind surrendering a draft pick just to have him for a full season even just in the lineup and the hope he’d like it there enough to give them an advantage in free agency the next year. His jersey sales alone would be through the roof and make it worth it for them. Though he’ll likely still just sign the mega deal.
So a team will give up a draft pick for one year of Ohtani, and spend a ton of money, when it could take him a few months into the season to just hit for them? Assuming it’s Tommy John. I mean, it is Ohtani, but…
Guilderc
Yes. Without a doubt a team will give up a draft pick to sign Ohtani.
What?
No team is going to sign him for 1 year this offseason
@filihok
I agree any team would give up a pick for him. But in a reply from a different poster, he mentioned a one year deal. That’s where my reference came in. Would a huge one year deal for Ohtani only as a hitter, for half a season, even be worth the pick?
guilderc
Fair
Halt the season, get the surgery, expect recovery timeline similar to Bryce, hit exclusively, and once he’s ready to throw again ramp him up.
He’s getting paid this offseason. This gives him a head start for 2024 if he shuts it down now. Probably should have done it a week or so ago.
If it’s not Tommy John, he should have an earlier timeline than Bryce. Though it’d still be better to just shut down now. Mostly to avoid any other injury and get a head start on recovery.
I always suspected he might have to give up pitching eventually like Mr. Ruth.
But he is still one of the best hitters in the game, and will be paid accordingly.
@This one belongs to the Reds
Babe wasn’t even close to being a decent pitcher. Ohtani is 1000% better at pitching than Ruth.
A glance at Ruth’s pitching stats would prove you completely wrong on that. Ruth was a great pitcher.
Babe wasn’t a decent pitcher? His peak as a pitcher was about five seasons, over which he posted a 127 ERA+. This includes seasons when he led the league in starts and another in complete games. His 1916 season, he led the league in ERA in more than 320 innings pitched, and ERA+, a stat supporting he might have been the best pitcher in the league. He was the toughest pitcher to hit that season, despite calling Fenway Park his home. That season he also set the record for shutouts by an AL lefty starter, a record that still stands, although it was tied more than 60 years on by Ron Guidry.
If Ruth had dedicated himself only to pitching, the consensus was he’d have had a shot at the HOF as only a pitcher, health willing. Who knows what eventually would have happened with his arm. He eventually gave that up the two-way role because he also had to play the field. No DH.
Anyway, my point isn’t about Ruth vs Ohtani, it’s your statement he wasn’t even decent. He was very good.
12.4 fWAR as a pitcher.
25.3 RA-9 WAR
I can’t imagine any definition of “decent” that doesn’t surpass
What a frail man. Dude has only pitched one complete game and only has one shutout to his overrated career. He’s not even on a path to put up Chuck Finley numbers.
How’s that dedicated section of this website going for this guy?
He might consider signing a two year deal at a “home team discount” with the Angels, get back to 100% and re-enter the FA market.
Angels only lose! Why would he want to go back? Think the Dodgers don’t have great rehab and Dr.s?
Agreed. Angels have to either begin at least a partial rebuild this winter or continue overpaying free agents and getting garbage results. This will not be a winning team any time soon no matter what they do.
Angels management are a bunch of soy drinking beta male cucks. Why would they let him continue hitting? Only to aggravate his elbow. This would never happen with the Dodgers. They’d set him straight
NBD
I hope this is satire
If not, let me know so I can block you and never have to read anything like this again