Mark Attanasio, principal owner of the Brewers, spoke to reporters (including Todd Rosiak of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel) yesterday regarding a variety of topics. One of those topics was the club’s payroll which according to RosterResource took a haircut headed into the 2023 season dropping to $121MM entering the season compared to last year’s final $137MM figure.
Attanasio claims that the dip in payroll is in the interest of keeping the team competitive in the long term, telling reporters, “Nobody wants to hear this, but we haven’t really had a budget in a long time… if you do a case study on teams that lose too much money for too long, then they end up gutting the team. We’re trying to always compete.” Attanasio cited the Brewers standing at the bottom of the league in terms of media revenues as one reason the club’s payroll dipped this season, though he also noted the club has payroll space available for midseason additions should Milwaukee be in contention.
More from the Central divisions…
- Tigers right-hander Michael Lorenzen is making fast progress as he works to return from a groin injury that left him on the IL to open the season, as noted by Chris McCosky of The Detroit News. Lorenzen threw 45 pitches to teammates off the mound yesterday, touching 95 mph with his fastball. McCosky notes that the Tigers currently plan for Lorenzen to make a rehab start on Saturday before being activated from the IL on Monday, when he’s first eligible. That would figure to leave either lefty Joey Wentz or righty Matt Manning headed to Triple-A to make room for Lorenzen in the rotation. Lorenzen, who signed with the Tigers on a one-year, $8.5MM deal this offseason, sports a career 4.10 ERA (105 ERA+) in 471 innings of work between the Reds and the Angels.
- It appears that the Reds will be without franchise face Joey Votto for longer than the 10-day minimum as he works to get ready for the 2023 season, as manager David Bell told reporters (including Mark Sheldon of MLB.com) that thanks to a rainout on Friday and a day off on Monday for Triple-A Louisville, where Votto is on a rehab assignment, the 39 year-old slugger will need more reps before he is ready to play in the majors. Votto struggled badly in 2022, posting an OPS of just .689 before undergoing shoulder surgery that ended his season. While Votto prepares to join the club, the Reds figure to continue using Jason Vosler at first base. Vosler is off to a hot start for the Reds to open the season, having already slashed two home runs, a double, and a triple in eleven plate appearances thusfar in the young 2023 season.
Brewers payroll drop makes sense. We got ride of hader. Dropped bad contracts like cutch and didn’t bring in anyone dumb like that. Letting these young guys play was the best decision we coulda made tbh. Could still leave maybe a glimmer of hope we resign burnes even though I think he’s gone after that arbitration
Cleveland did a rebuild on the fly a few years ago. They dropped payroll, got rid of some veterans, and slowly began bringing up youngsters from their farm system. They were critized by kids on here that think that MLB is Rotisseries League and you need to spend all your money each year or lose it.
Cleveland made it to the final game of the 2nd round of the playoffs last year. They increased their payroll this year, primarily giving raises to their players. They intend to continue to increase the payroll for the next 3-4 years to keep most of those players that pan out together. That’s what small market teams have to do because of the outrageous disparity of revenue between teams. .
Rotisseries League lol
Hammerin’ Hank;
We know you know little about baseball and can’t discuss it, but making fun of (spell check) typo’s shows how pathetic you are.
None of us should get our hopes to high of a Burnes extension. As in, be happy if it happens, but have zero hopes for it. It was a long shot to begin with, and their arbitration hearing with him likely made it less likely. Out of Adames, Burnes, and Woodruff, the order of most likely to least likely is Adames, Woodruff, Burnes, and the odds aren’t high for any of them, nor is the chances between them.
Don’t think the arbitration grumpiness has anything to do with it really. Burnes is going to land a huge contract and the Brewers wouldn’t remotely be in the market for those numbers. Just hoping he can deliver another stellar season before he departs.
The arbitration doesn’t have a whole lot to do with it, no, but the odds were slim to none as it was. My only point was that the arbitration may have just removed the slim lol. That .001 chance might be toast
The Brewers have more money being spent in the minors like every team, but it’s an added cost with that pay increase. They are also a team that has extension candidates, where one from the current big names would increase the future payroll significantly. Didnt get it done this offseason. Or of course they could make extension offers to the young prospect rookies securing a few added years of control. Can’t really do any of that running right up to your payroll limitations.
I never wanted the Giants to give up on Vosler. He always did a nice job hitting in the numerous callups to the majors and he’s got some versatility on defense. He never really got a fair shot. Glad he’ll get some real playing time with the Reds. I’m sure David Bell is familiar with him from Bell’s time with the Giant. I wish Vosler well.
mab your correct, not giving players a fair shot. You have to give a guy 300-400 AB’s to tell what he’s all about. I can name at least 10 guys that the Giants didn’t give a fair shot over the years. Maybe more !!!
Surprised the Reds got both Vosler & Young from Giants. Both have some talent and both have an option. Reds can use them.
With Lorenzen returning, Manning better hope he pitches well tonight against the Astros or he could be watching Wentz play from the minors
It won’t be a long watch though.Joey will come up….get pummeled…and drop back from Wentz he came.
@DCartrow
I’m assuming you’re just having fun with the name because Joey Wentz has been on the team, and is not getting called up. He was also quite effective in his start. It is Lorenzen that would be getting the call. If Manning pitches well, maybe they will drop a reliever and move Lorenzen into the pen. He’s not the future.
I’m busted, Stymee. You’re right. Dang it!
Not paying Lorenzen $8.5 million to pitch in the pen. Manning pitched well again tonight. Wentz even though he pitched well, goes done so they don’t have 3 LH starters in the rotation
Votto needs to mentor Vosler like Scott Rolen did for Todd Frazier on the 2011 Reds team.
The notion that the Brewers are losing money is nonsense. In 2021, the most recent data available, show Milwaukee took in $270 million. Also in 2021 stadium operational costs averaged $300,000 across the league per game. These are the two largest expenses for any team.
Attanasio could simply open the books to document his claim. He won’t because the figures would show the exact opposite
So you know the player payroll, and you have an estimation of the cost of operating the stadium per game. The $270MM that they took in is also an estimate. $270MM minus $121MM (Payroll) minus $3MM for game day operations, leaves $147MM. There are a few other costs, you know. Transportation, Lodging, insurance, non player payroll, stadium improvements, payments on debt, minor league operations and payroll, payments to pension, scouting, medical costs, advertising and promotions, stadium costs on non game days, building maintenance, field maintenance, taxes… I’m sure there are more that I am forgetting.
My two major expenses are my mortgage and my car payment. Hard to believe that I don’t have more to spend in my paycheck when you only look at the “big” stuff. The little stuff adds up. I’m always looking for ways to save. A baseball team doesn’t have the same options. Only 4 star lodgings and first class travel allowed.
Wisconsin just agreed to kick in $290 million in stadium renovations and improvements for American Family Field. Moreover, costs for road games like transportation and lodging are a fraction of the $300,000 to run a stadium for a home game.
I could go on and on but suffice it to say none of those costs come anywhere close to reversing the fact that MLB teams are wildly profitable.
I 100% side with Styme’s argument. By only looking at 2 numbers, you’re in no way accurately calculating how much they made in profits. Everything adds up. And it adds up a lot faster than you’re giving credit for.
Especially if you’re leaving out costs that add up quick. Granted, baseball and movies have different styles of advertising, but advertising isn’t cheap. If you look at a movies budget minus advertising and its budget was 40 million dollars, in all likelihood they spent nearly that same amount in advertising. Advertising isn’t cheap. The companies that do the ads have no reason to give any kind of discount, because there’s a lot of competition out there for that marketing.
The much needed rise of minor league quality of life also means more money teams are spending on the farm system.
You’re also forgetting that team executives pay isn’t included in the team payroll, or the daily costs. That’s another expenditure that adds up fast.
Your argument relies on 2 numbers cost wise while leaving out way too many. Did they turn a profit in the end? Maybe, but odds are, it wasn’t all that much. And what you’re also neglecting, is that it is a business. They’re supposed to turn a profit of some sort, or else what’s the point in running it. But in no way are they taking in big profits that mean they need to start splurging more. Nobody has to like it, but the way they do it is how they need to do that they can stay competitive. Odds are they also likely wouldn’t have had to make much of a dip if they had made the playoffs. But following a year without that extra revenue, a payroll decrease makes sense.
nice, styme….good post
So you’re suggesting that MLB teams spend $150 million per year in incidental costs? That fans should just be okay with it if teams are spending the equivalent of an entire extra payroll for no on-field benefit? Half the commenters on this site spend their days eating out of an owner’s boot, I swear
I’m suggesting that teams operate like a business, as in that like any business, there is a goal/need to make profit. But I’m personally also saying that there’s way more than just 2 things that they have to spend money on.
But also, that people greatly discount how much money goes into other costs. If you google how much an mlb team spends on marketing, one of the first results gives you the Mets 2019 numbers. In 2019, the Mets spent 27 million on marketing. Most teams are going to be in the same ballpark when it comes to their marketing costs, because again, there’s no reason for advertising agencies to give them a discount when if they don’t pay it, someone else will. So that’d be an easy 20-25 million of that 150 million gone on one cost that many people don’t factor.
Also, that 290 million that another user said they got? That was a proposed deal, as a part of securing a new lease to keep them in milwaukee longer. That deal itself was also shot down. Meaning it didn’t happen. The owner just discussed it the other day. It was a proposed plan of which AmFam field would be renovated and in exchange the Brewers would sign a 13 year lease. The renovation is also being discussed instead of proposing the idea of building a new ballpark. But again, that 290 million the brewers were “given” for stadium renovations didn’t happen. Therefore, any stadium renovation costs from the last year does in fact get removed from that 150 million.
Team travel, while doesn’t take a high number off, still takes off another 2 million or so.
And again, their payroll doesn’t include the salaries of executives and such, so that’s another few million off.
But again, I’m not saying they’re not turning profit. But I am saying, business are supposed to turn one, and it’s still not likely anywhere near 150 million.
I love when small market fans believe their owners lies about not being able to spend more money.
The league gifts each team over 100 million a season in tv deals.
Teams split gates with opposing teams.
Milwaukee was 14th in the league in total attendance.
The Brewers Fan Cost Index also falls smack dab in the middle of the pack as well at $250.
The Brewers also are a profit sharing recipient
Brewers ownership claiming they cannot spend more is a flat out lie! Very few MLB can argue low payroll being a result of low earnings with a straight face. It’s ridiculous and people just regurgitate the lie.
I love when large market fans think they know how to run a small market club with their creative accounting, thinking player salaries are the only costs and they take in the same money the large markets do.
I think Mr. Twain said something about people might think you are a fool, then you open your mouth and remove all doubt. That applies to a lot of the large market apologists here on this site.
I feel the Brewers fans pain in advance because I see what’s coming and the team has to do, because mine had to the past couple of years. The Marlins had to several times, the Twins at one time, KC and others I am probably forgetting.
Big market fans like to think that small market teams are just raking in money from their teams. But while they are pulling in money, that money is easily offset unless you just don’t spend like the pirates. Like, pirates fans should absolutely be upset about their teams spending. As a Brewers fan, I understand that as a business, you’re supposed to make profit, but also know that they’re spending within their means. I don’t care how much money the Yankees are giving them, it doesn’t mean the brewers should be spending on players like a big market club would. They have limited resources and when a contract like Yelich’s goes south, they can’t afford to just go buy another big contract like other teams.
Milwaukee hit hard by Ballys not making their, almost certain April, tv streaming rights payment. 14 teams caught in this bankruptcy. Would really like to see MLB step in. It’s time. Launch MLB tv properly. Offer in market games.
And less of the fat little sabermetric- puking troll, Brian Kenney, please!!
I’ve been pretty happy with MA since he took control of the club. Other than the Yelich albatross contract which, no one saw the immense drop off (if you claim you did, you’re lying) and the brewers are stuck with that boat anchor for a while. However he has mostly stepped away and let sterns build and manage the roster which, for us, has mostly been successful.
Now that Matt Arnold is in control of that, I will be eager to see the path going forward wrt our 3 aces. No way we can sign both Woody and Burnes to long term deals. Possibly 1 but I am not sure if we even do that. There’s a chance to reload our farm with both of those players.
Anyway, just contending for the central/wild card is def good enough for me considering how many losing seasons we have endured. If we could make another WS run, that would be epic but just winning baseball I am happy with.
Anyone complaining about MA honestly needs to think back to what it was like before his group acquired the team. The Brewers had spent over 20 years without seeing a post season, and MA ended that drought within a couple seasons. Then the crew got back in 2011. Now they’re a regular contender in the central. They need both a better understanding of what MA has done since buying the team and a better appreciation for the fact that he bought a perennial losing team and made them a contender. He also did this BEFORE the Bucks came back around as one, meaning he invested in a team and a city when very few other people were doing so.
This 100%.
Bud Selig was a used car salesman, and ran his team thusly.
Crew owner has been, overall, a very good fit for the franchise and the city. Until the Yelich injury and the Grisham blunder happened. They were betting big and in the eyes of his investors they failed. Time for a new owner it seems. One who understands the baseball gods are fickle. When you can you go for it!
I didn’t see the drop-off for Yelich coming, but I can’t say I’m surprised. Since the Suppan, Lohse and Garza deals, any big dollar/long term deals make me cringe.
Also I still kinda believe the plan should be to (at least try) extend Woody, and trade Burnes next winter. July if they’re not playing well. Adames might already think he’s just a tick below the big 4, and if that’s the case they have to move him also.
Agreed. I don’t think Adames is that foundational guy you build around. He can hit homers and has a good glove/arm, but not the guy a team like the Crew can she’ll out $300M for. So they need to be prepared to replace him – probably trade him this offseason so you recoup something. We’re not keeping Burnes. I think Woody is the guy they look to keep around.
These owners need to shut the bleep up. You’re not losing money, you’re making money hand over fist, or else you wouldn’t own the team.
How anyone can defend any professional team owners when they’re crying ‘Poor woes me, my team is losing money’ is a fool for defending these owners. Anyone with some business sense knows that while owners can and may make it look like their team is losing $$ on paper and for tax purposes. Most of these billionaires (with a B!) aren’t in the business of owning a professional team to lose money. They’re simply not used to the time and attention it takes to make the large profit margins they were used to in their original business. If there was one?
The problem with some of these team owners is that they actually have to produce and put a product on the field to make money. Whereas, most of them made their original fortune either by inheritance, vulture capitalism, shuffling paper around, and where great time and effort weren’t required to produce large profit margins.
As someone said, have some of these team owners open up their books to the public.
The Tigers are over and under.rated. I hope Lorenzen does.well. Poor ERod, pitches great, has not.much to show for.it in stats….
Even if.they hire me, not.much to trade here….let’s hope. They could send.me to Japan…just.think…I would stop posting….Support the Superfife! I hope.the BP gets hot again! No reason to rush Lorenzen…the most important thing is.he.pitches.well. I am appalled, once again…the Tigers give a guy a chance.to show case on the MLB stage, no team option.
.just a one year deal, half a seasons trade.value at best….or…does he have options? No. I’m starting my own beer league! So who needs a hot rod Lincoln when we have
…the Tigers!