Phillies Rule 5 pick Noah Song has been shut down due to back tightness, per Alex Coffey of the Philadelphia Inquirer. He’s had an MRI and will be reevaluated next week, but it appears he won’t be ready to start the season.
Song, 25, is an interesting case, given he’s spent the past three years in the navy after being drafted by the Red Sox in the fourth round of the 2019 draft. He’s also not been fully discharged, only placed in active reserve, which means he’ll be able to play baseball. It does mean he’ll still have navy commitments though, with an earlier report stating he’s effectively on part-time duty, which still requires one weekend per month and two full weeks each year. It’s not clear how that would’ve played out over the season.
In any case, Song was looking to get back up to speed quickly after three years out. As a Rule 5 draftee, the Phillies would have to keep him on the active roster for the entire season, or place him on waivers and send him back to the Red Sox if he clears. The injury does change things somewhat, as should Song open the season on the injured list the Phillies can still send him on a rehab stint to the minors for up to 30 days. He still can’t be optioned to the minors, but the Phillies would just need to ensure he spends at minimum 90 days on the active roster this season.
Here’s some other injury notes from around the game:
- Evan Woodbery of MLive relays that Tyler Nevin’s MRI on his oblique showed a Grade 1 strain. The Tigers said yesterday that Nevin’s strain was “mild”, but offered no other details on when he might be available. As Woodbery says, MLB’s Health and Injury Tracking System says hitters typically take 27 days to recover from a Grade 1 strain. That’s not a concrete number, but it would appear to put Nevin in doubt for Opening Day. Nevin, acquired from the Orioles this winter, was competing for a bench spot on the Tigers roster this year. The 25-year-old hit .197/.299/.261 with two home runs across 184 plate appearances for Baltimore last year.
- Sticking with the Tigers, and right-hander Trevor Rosenthal threw a bullpen yesterday and felt great, Woodbery reports. He’ll throw a live bullpen on Tuesday, with the hope being that he’ll be ready to step into a live game after that. Rosenthal, signed to a minor league deal by the Tigers this winter, hasn’t appeared in the big leagues for the past two seasons due to a range of injuries, including thoracic outlet syndrome, hip labrum surgery and a recurring hamstring injury. While it wouldn’t be a surprise to see Rosenthal need a little longer than Opening Day to be ready, the former All Star looks a good chance to get some opportunities in Detroit’s bullpen this year.
- The Mariners won’t have right-hander Casey Sadler up to speed by Opening Day, but he is making progress in his return from rotator cuff and labrum surgery, as Ryan Divish of the Seattle Times reports. Sadler missed the entire 2022 season, but faced hitters for the first time yesterday in a live batting practice session at Seattle’s spring training complex. Sadler, who was designated for assignment this winter but re-signed with the team on a minor league deal, put in easily his best season in 2021, working to a 0.67 ERA over 40 1/3 innings. It’s unclear what’s next for the former 25th round pick, but he’ll continue to work his way back with a view to regaining his spot in Seattle’s bullpen sometime this season.
Ahh, the Dombrowski intrigue continues……Mr Noah Song come on down…
I wonder if the Phillies are gaming the system, like Song maybe felt a slight twinge in his back and the Phillies are saying “oh, lets call this a DL injury and work it so we only have to put him active for 90 days and get to keep him!” Wouldn’t surprise me.
But then I am a Sox fan who is a little put out by the fact that we drafted and kept this guy and were looking FINALLY to get a payout and then the Phils come along and Rule 5ed him even though he clearly is not ready to pitch in the majors and the Rule 5 thing was clearly designed for a different sort of circumstance (i.e. a guy who was ready for the majors but whose team was not going to bring him up being able to play for another team that WOULD give him the chance).
So I am betting on Phillie trickery here.
I actually think he’s genuinely hurt seeing interviews and such.
Thanks. It’s too bad I appear to be wrong here, though, because I would prefer that he was not badly hurt and the Phillies front office was being a bit sleazy to the guy actually being significantly hurt; back stuff is not good.
I’m definitely not putting it passed front offices to be sleazy. They may be exaggerating things for sure, but with the MRI and comments made, there does seem to be a legitimate injury of some kind. I think it was a reasonable thing to bring up.
vph, I 100% believe song tweaked something, but also it’s a way to stash him and see exactly what he has to offer.
IMO there was NO way he was making the opening 26. Dombrowski had a plan. The problem down the line might be that rp’s have to be rotated up and down aaa to accommodate his MLB stay…?
My guess he’s out til @june, then promoted and when rosters expand Sept 1st then 2 rp’s can be brought up…
And yes I enjoy a conspiracy or two…
@jtango
So you are a conspiracy guy? Sometimes, things are as they actually are.
Usually I am not; I was thinking this might have been a “stretching the truth” kind of thing… there is some history of some front offices being creative in this way with the DL in the past.
I think players want to play and they know injuries affect their value. They can file a grievance with the union if a team is doing something sketchy like faking an injury.
“consipiracy guy” wtf? So nobody has ever tried to jerry the system for the betterment of his team? Somebody better start apologizing to Bill Belichick ASAP.
Also A.J. Preller’s double injury database scandal that should have gotten him fired.
The only person to thank for the rule 5 issue is Bloom who made the decision to let him be taken. So whatever Philly trickery you think is going on, just remember, 35 year old brasier was deemed to have more long term value than the young and controllable Noah Song by Chaim.
Dombo at it again, the Red Sox need to see the medical on this
New rule to prevent ‘stashing Rule V guys on the IR’ Song needs to remain on the ML active roster for 90 days. No way he makes it 3 months, especially now that he’s injuried. They arent going to want him on the team in Jul, Aug, Sept.
But, may, June, and July would be nearly 90 game days…
There were two other Annapolis graduates who were great athletes in recent times. They both had to fulfill their military commitments before resuming their sporting careers. One was a football player and the other played basketball. Both are in their respective sport’s Hall of Fame so Song is worth taking a flyer from that perspective alone.
Military commitment should ALWAYS be above any sport.
I dont agree with that at all. Military branches need athletic troops. They use these people who join as promotional tools and are proud of those that go on to professional sports careers.
If you want to keep being able to recruit athletes and using them as tools to recruit more, you need to be able to make exceptions. Im not talking about borderline cases, but true potential professional athletes should be allowed to get exemptions.
Considering we haven’t fought an important war i decades? No.
I commend Song for living up to his COMMITMENTS he willingly made. He also didn’t try to resign his commission or use a signing bonus to repay the cost of his education.
Too many people are unwilling to sacrifice for their country these days, but, I suppose that shouldn’t come as a surprise as so many are trying to tear down the nation, its history, and wipe away historical names, markers, statues, and sanitize content they feel doesn’t match their modern ideals (ironically enough, those same ideals which may well be repudiated in the future by even more than do today.)
Heres what it breaks down to:
Assuming that the Phillies are committed to keeping Song:
-A Rule V player must be on the MLB active roster for a min. of 90 days. The best case scenario is that Song is up for the LAST 90 days of the season. That puts him on the roster on July 4th.
-A pitcher on Injured Reserve can only play in the minors for a max of 30 days.
So, the Phillies can send him to their minor league complex to build u strength and conditioning until he is ready for minor league play, between June 4th and July 3rd.
Personally, I think that schedule is too tight. He will most likely be gifted back to the Red Sox sometime before July 4th.
If the Phillies do not keep Song on the 26 man roster for at least 90 days, I am not sure he automatically goes back to the Red Sox. The Phillies may get to start over again next year with trying to keep Song on the 26 man for 90 days.
mlb.com/glossary/transactions/rule-5-draft
“Rule 5 Draft picks are assigned directly to the drafting club’s 26-man roster and must be placed on outright waivers in order to be removed from the 26-man roster in the subsequent season. Should the player clear waivers, he must be offered back to his previous team for $50,000 and can be outrighted to the Minors only if his original club does not wish to reacquire him. A Rule 5 Draft pick can be placed on the Major League injured list, but he must be active for a minimum of 90 days to avoid being subject to the aforementioned roster restrictions in the next campaign.”
That last sentence sounds like the Phillies can try again next year if he is too injured to stay on the 26 man for 90 days this year.
If this is true, the plan may be to keep Song on the IL most if the year and try to keep on the 26 man for at least 90 days next year when he is in much better shape. Not sure how this actually would impact Song’s career.
“I am not sure he automatically goes back to the Red Sox.
He doesnt go “automatically” back to the Red Sox. But any other outcome is next to impossible.
Phillies cant keep him on their team, waive him, and another team is going to put him on their 25 man roster for the rest of the season? Not going to happen.
“If this is true, the plan may be to keep Song on the IL most if the year and try to keep on the 26 man for at least 90 days next year when he is in much better shape.”
Phillies cant keep him if he doesnt make the 90 day minimum. Are you saying the Red Sox would act like a minor league farm system for them? Aka, Help develop him the rest of the season, then give him back to the Phillies in next years Rule 5 draft? Will NEVER happen.
My point is I’m not sure what this sentence means:
“A Rule 5 Draft pick can be placed on the Major League injured list, but he must be active for a minimum of 90 days to avoid being subject to the aforementioned roster restrictions in the next campaign.”
What roster restrictions? Where will the player be “in the next campaign” if he is not on the Phillies 26 for at least 90 days this year? I think it may mean the Phillies can try again next year to keep him on the 26 man for at least 90 days. Not sure.
“What roster restrictions”
It looks like a special rule: There are two rosters 40-man and 26-man. 26-man is the active major league roster. If he makes it through the season, he doesnt just revert to 40-man thus being able to be sent down. If they want to send him down in 2024, they would have to waive him off the 26-man, onto the 40-man. Meaning any team can claim him if they put him on their own 26-man.
Must be a new rule to prevent teams from grabbing guys they dont really have use on on 26-man, but just like his potential. The team hides him through the 2023 season, then sends him to minor league oblivion in the next season. — This way, any other team gets the right to claim him first (provided, they keep him on their 26-man).
Noah Song would be the perfect example of a guy MLB wrote this clause for. Great potential, but wasnt claimed to even out the talent pool, the Phillies just like his potential.
I hope you’re right, but it seems ambiguous to me.
Rsmith – got a rule number and section citation for why, AFTER satisfying the 2023 (year claimed) rule on mlb service time, the normal minor league options are wiped out and the only way to drop from 26 man to 40 man is waivers unlike any other prospect/young player, and not just an option year usage? I can’t recall or see anything that impacts option use in following seasons, only until the rule 5 required service time is satisfied
All in:
Thats my interpretations, for whatever thats worth. “Subsquent seasons” is a bit of a surprise to me as well. Thx for the enlightenment.
GASox:
Im going off of what ‘all in’ provided:
“Rule 5 Draft picks are assigned directly to the drafting club’s 26-man roster and must be placed on outright waivers in order to be removed from the 26-man roster in the subsequent season. ”
mlb.com/glossary/transactions/rule-5-draft
Wait “subsequent season” could just mean 2023? I couldve taken that a bit too far. Maybe not 2024, just 2023.
Thats what Im seeing now, after rereading it. That makes a lot more sense. What do you think?
Yes, 2023 is the subsequent season I believe.
but right after that it talks about the next campaign which I believe is 2024
Right. The season subsequent to the 2022 rule 5 draft is the 2023 season.
Accordingly, there isn’t some new rule we never heard of, in the 2024 season you can still use options to send song (or any other rule 5 guy) down to the minors.
Agreed. I typed my earlier comment before scrolling further and seeing this. 2023 would be the ‘subsequent season’ in question, BUT, only if the MLB service time has been met.
If they fail to qualify for 26 man service time in 2023, that service time requirement would roll over to 2024, and, attached to the 26 man service time requirement that rolled over, the waiver requirement would likewise follow. But outside of failing to hit the requisite days, all 3 option years become available.
Rule 5 isn’t, and wasn’t meant to be, a requirement that a selected player sticks in the majors forever absent a waiver posting; its meant to get a guy onto a 40 man roster, and, as part of the cost to transfer those rights, provide a shot at a mlb level tryout for a sustained period to keep teams from just buying off eachothers prospects.
So, are you saying that if Song does not stay on the Phillies (or another team that claimed Song on waivers) 26 man roster for 90 days in 2023 that they get to try again in 2024? And what happens if they fail again to hit 90 days in 2024?
Suit – it all depends on how they handle things. If song is on the IL, he’s still a 26 man & 40 man player, just an inactive one. To satisfy rule 5 requirements however, the service time accrued target but be on the active roster.
So here’s how it plays out: because he’s not being removed from the 26 man roster, he doesn’t need to be offered back to his original club, and he doesn’t need to be passed through waivers. BUT, if he doesn’t meet his active days requirement, he sticks with the same team, same requirements, same limitations the following season. If they want him.
If he fails in 2023? And again in 2024? And the Phillies want to try again in 2025? Sure, they can. As far as rule 5 is concerned, he’s getting his ‘shot’ and the program objectives are being met.
The interesting part of all this is the 1 weekend per month Duty Requirement for his service status. That’s a couple days where he becomes unavailable. What I havent looked into the rules on is whether they can place him on the military or restricted list for those couple days and call up a replacement player, and, still be within the rule 5 requirements? I’d imagine so. And I’m sure DD has already talked with MLB about how it needs to be handled. But if he can do that, once a month, that would help rotating arms and keeping pitching fresh throughout the season in a way other clubs can’t.
Thanks. So, as I was saying above, the Phillies best bet is probably to get Song in shape this year and try to keep him 90 days on the 26 man next year.
Almost impossible at this point. He’d have to be overcome his injury, ramp up in the minors for at most 30 days, and be on the MLB active 26-man by July 3rd. Then stay there, regardless of the quality he provides, or any injuries, until the end of the season. All the while the Phillies are contending for playoffs.
Is what I said above.
I would say the Phillies should not be allowed to to put Song on the military list two days a month as that takes him off the 26 nan roster. I would not be surprised if MLB changes the rule. If they change the rule, the Red Sox probably have an argument that he should be returned to them.
Im pretty sure, they get to defer that commitment until after the season. Where they can bang it out in one long tenure. I cant recall any MLB player having to leave 2 days a month. Ill check.
Its in the terms of his reserve status. Mlb has no say in it, it was what the military requires. He didn’t get a deferment, his concession from the Navy was they put him in the reserve instead of normal duty.
2 days a month, then a 2 straight weeks once a year. Makes things… interesting.
Got any links for that? I see nothing other than a few news outlets playing the guessing game.
One newspaper says he’s “delayed” his service time until after his career is over. Another says he’s gone on “reserve”.
No one discusses the ramifications to the season, because I doubt they know what happens. I certainly wouldnt believe an MLBTR poster for factuality, especially one who’s got a clear Pro-Dombrowski agenda in all his posts.
Sure, see, that I like. Again, it’s a question of proof.
1075thegame.com/news/rhp-noah-song-changes-militar…
Or if you prefer espn:
espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/35712844/noah-song-dischar…
There’s plenty more if you care, but, I figure one local and one national oughta do the trick.
The details on his service requirements really came out closer to reporting to camp, and nothing back near the rule 5 draft. You’d have to be following song fairly closely to have caught it.
As much as I hate bloom and disagree with a lot of what he does, my push behind song has nothing to do with hating bloom, or, liking dombrowski. I just like song, appreciate what he’s doing, and always have been pulling for him since he was drafted and elected to serve.
Some sources say he ‘is required’, some say ‘typically required’, but, practically speaking, if the navy would let him get away with not doing the 1 weekend a month they would’ve deferred his service entirely, or, put him in a different category. The military missing its recruitment targets doesn’t help.
It’s still possible the Phillies could work out a trade with the Sox to keep Song. Cash considerations or a player to be named later are usually the types of return involved. I guess it all depends on how much the Phillies really want to keep him
“I guess it all depends on how much the Phillies really want to keep him”
I think the Red Sox have to agree to that.
The 40 man roster crunch that left Song exposed in the rule V draft still exists at this moment for the Red Sox so getting cash or a minor leaguer may make more sense to bloom than potentially losing Song again next winter if left unprotected
This whole Song saga is an embarrassment for baseball. Never should have been eligible for the stupid Rule 5 draft. Total screw up. And NOT by the Red Sox. So stuff it, Bloom haters.
Considering the risk was low to select his contract (the Red Sox 40-man roster is like 25% stiffs), no, it WAS a stupid decision.
“Red Sox 40-man roster is 25% stiffs”
What a troll. More players got claimed off their roster than any other team in the Rule V draft (Ward, Song, Politi). More players since the Rule V draft, have been claimed when waived, than any other team.
Yankee fan be jealous. Red Sox farm system is stacked, and he has no clue.
Almost every Red Sox fan here seems to believe they have a lot of dead weight. Perhaps not 25%, but you get what I mean – they could have addrd him without losing someone of consequence.
Song hadn’t pitched in about 3 1/2 years. Has anyone like that ever been added to a 40 man roster?
Song last pitched to the end of the 2019 season.
In the same amount of time since then, paxton pitched about 21 total innings. Chris sale pitched about 42 or 52 total innings, can’t remember which. At any rate, all the above have done so little it may as well be zero.
You can say both those guys have more MLB experience and would be correct. Song was an advanced college pitcher and finalist for best collegate baseball player in the USA.
However, both Sale/Paxton have been injury riddled, while song was young and nominally in good physical condition overall.
Now, which makes more sense when you weight production, control, age, health, amd ceiling – Song… or Brasier?
I think Brasier and Song are both unknowns. Song is younger, but how sure are we about his future? He hasn’t pitched in 3 1/2 years. Sale and Paxton are unknowns too.
We’re not sure about brasier either, and, he’s old as heck, and, you’re probably not bringing him back as a FA. Heck, I’m surprised he’s there now.
I only toss brasier in the mix because the upside is much higher on song than brasier, and, for a PBO who wasted roster spots on the likes of peraza and cordero among others, rolling with brasier locking down a spot instead of trying song to see what he could do on a team needing all the young pitching it can get in coming years?
But, I was just giving examples off only this year’s roster of guys who hadn’t really don’t squat in the last 3 seasons and got 26 man slots, plus, one elderly underperformer nothing is expected out of who could’ve given up his 40 man spot. If song was on the 40 man I expect he’d open at AA, and if results were there, jump to AAA.
Not sure why people think philly is getting away with anything with Song lol ..at the end of the day hes still only allowed 30 days of rehab and then must be on the active rostor for min 90 days.in s plsyoff race at least with spring training hebhad 6 weeks to practice.so its not like hes stashed in the minors and actually pitching. And if he doesnt pitch the entire year thats now 4 years away from the game, oh yea and at that point what must be a significant back injury..good luck with that.
Phillies arent getting away with anything. If they are at fault of anything its possibly putting too much pressure on a young pitcher to make the big league squad.
Lets face it, claiming a pitcher, 4 years removed from pitching with the 90-day roster rule in place, had a strong probability of failing. With the pitcher having a good chance of getting hurt. Why do that to a kid, just to spite your old team?
That narrative is a bit ridiculous. Dombrowski has no desire to spit his old team. The guy cares about being successful. That’s it. Not every decision is going to work out, but he’s not making moves to hurt the Red Sox. He’s not even thinking about them.
“He’s not even thinking about
them.”https://www.masslive.com/redsox/2022/10/dave-dombrowski-on-red-sox-firing-i-dont-think-i-was-treated-right-report.html
I respectfully disagree.
“He’s not even thinking about them.”
masslive.com/redsox/2022/10/dave-dombrowski-on-red…
I respectfully disagree.
Just because you don’t feel you were treated correctly in a former job, doesn’t mean you’re still thinking about it. He was asked a question and answered. He’s moved on.
That interview was a few days before his team entered the WS.
“I dont think I was treated right”
“It was jarring”
“Youre not pleased”
He shouldve had more important things to do and interviews to do. He clearly wanted to gloat.
Then, a month later, he drafts a player who hasnt pitched for 4 years from his old team.
I couldn’t disagree more.
Fair enough. I think he was answering the questions he was asked.
“Your in the WS versus the Stros, how do you feel about your former employer, who you left 3 years ago?”
“No comment, lets talk about the upcoming Series” is the correct response. That is, unless youre carrying a chip on your shoulder.
During thr WS, people are asked a million questions all week. Why not answer some honestly? I definitely see your point, but this is a Boston media outlet that is obviously interested in the Boston side if things. I don’t see the quotes as a big deal.
Actually, if you are doing press conferences in the postseason, anything you can do to avoid talking about your opponent without appearing dismissive of them is the correct response. You don’t want anything to motivate them or become posting board material. If reporters are willing to blow up the news scene and deflect attention from your players or things they may say about the opponent? NY opinion is you definitely want to do it to take the heat off your guys.
18 teams passed on Song before the Phillies took him in the Rule 5 draft. So, I think it is fair to wonder what Dombrowski’s motivations were.
Conspiracy theories are fun, and I get this POV, but Dombrowski was in Boston in 2019 when Song was drafted. Maybe he just likes this kid. Seems more believable than having a childish vendetta against a former team.
Suit, that’s a little misleading.
Song was taken with the 20th potential selection in the rule 5. 9 passed, one being Boston itself.
So, Song was the 11th player selected. Need to account for the teams with full rosters, or, had pending signings they were holding the limited spaces they had open to complete.
2 of those before him were ward and politi, which make sense. They should both be servicable options in 2023 given how they ended 2022, and, ward in particular profiles similar to Whitlock both in terms of Tommy john slowing him down and, having results the minors.
So, what I’m seeing from the data was song was one of the top 10 pitchers taken in rule 5, and, was taken by the gm who originally drafted him and was familiar with all the scouting work previously done.
Doesn’t sound like a gotcha moment of payback. There were 4 more pitchers taken after him as well.
None of us can really say what Dombrowski was thinking and that is why I said it is fair to wonder about. Dombrowski could both like the guy he drafted and want to stick it to Boston. You have a typo there. 18 teams passed on Song if you don’t count Boston before the Phillies took him.
Suit – how exactly was a team with 40 men on their 40 roster spots, and then prohibited by the rules for the rule 5 draft from making any selection what so ever constitute passing on a guy? Those squads were prohibited from participation.
If you want to count teams as ‘passing’ because they were holding their slots for pending deals, that’s fine. Its a semantic argument on those. But to count teams that were prohibited from making a selection as electing to pass on a guy doesn’t pass muster.
They are listed as “passed”, not “prohibited”. I bet you didn’t check who had full 40 man rosters before you made that comment. I bet you are assuming that…and you call me misleading. If they did have full 40 man rosters, it could be because they didn’t see anyone they wanted in the Rule 5 draft, including Song. This is all speculation we are doing which is going nowhere. So, you continue to think Dombrowski didn’t have any bad intent toward the Red Sox and I will think he might have.
Actually, I DID check who had a full 40 man before my original counts of players, and.before I made any post on the subject… just so I would be speaking from a position of FACT, not conjecture.
Look here, it’s what I checked on:
mlb.com/news/rule-5-draft-results-2022
You’ll notice it says ‘roster full’ not ‘passed’
You’ll also notice that the numbers in my original comment on the subject exactly match. No guessing on my part, but, maybe was on yours.
My source was MLBs official news outlet. What was yours?
And, actually, having looked closer at things, I’d argue 2 fewer teams also passed on Song to get the rights to someone they liked better, because that player was available to then in an end-around, and.not because they chose to pass as nobody they liked was there.
Immediately after the draft, both the giants (39men @draft time) and rays (39mean @draft time) and both of whom ‘passed’ used that single open spot to buy a player taken earlier in the draft for cash considerations.
My take on those two transactions being right after the draft is that either there was some agreement in place for the drafting team to take then flip to a lower ranked team, or, after a guy they wanted was taken they rang up the drafting team to strike a deal, and, thuse forwent taking someone themselves so they had a 40 man slot left to recieve the player.
The most I read into any of that is that teams liked their existing guys more than taking a risk as to when Song may have become eligible to pitch.
Bill Belichick and Lou Holtz would completely disagree with that. Compliment the other team as much as possible was their motto. And always stay on point. Talking about a 3 year old FIRING, right before the WS is stupidity beyond belief. Then the owner jumped in giving his two cents. And boy, he had a lot to say on the situation. Im sure several of the players were asked about the Red Sox. And . . . They lost.
Conspiracy Theory? Childish vendetta?
Is that your way of dismissing other peoples views? Wasnt Cooovid coming from a Lab a “Conspiracy Theory”? Didnt the Kroc, the owner of McDonalds open a restaurant across the street from the original McDonalds? Wouldnt that be a “childish vendetta”.
But, I suppose if you dont understand the inner working of people, this seems illogical.
My source was the website we are on right now that listed them all as passed.
mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/2022-rule-5-draft-resul…
If you fill your 40 man with players you like better than those available in the Rule 5 draft, I would say you are passing on the opportunity of the Rule 5 draft.
Being that Dombrowski had a painful ending to his time in Boston and he took 2 Red Sox players in the Rule 5 draft, I think it is fair to wonder if he paid more attention to the Red Sox players than those of other teams. Cam Cannon was the other player taken in the minor league phase of the Rule 5 draft. All I’ve said is it’s fair to wonder.
They did pass in sense. If they wanted to select a player, they couldve easily have released a player before the draft and made a selection. Lets face it, pretty much every team has released a player off their 40-man since the draft, so there’s no reason they couldnt have done it before the draft. By having 40 men on the roster, they passed when they didnt create a slot.
Seems like far too much talk about wording, and even as you say MLBTR considers those teams passing in the draft.
I don’t think MLBTR is a ‘higher source’ than the official media department of the entity conducting the draft itself. One is an interpretive account, the other is the original source.
And mlbtr isn’t the original source.
As far as the other side of things, the fact that other teams released players off their rosters to make an upgrade at some position, or, made a trade to obtain some asset of some sort, doesn’t in my eyes constitute proof of anything except that they were dealing with what were considered subjectively superior players based on contracts, playing eligibility, skill, and other considerations. As I think I said in some post somewhere in this article elsewhere, other teams considered their existing assets superior to selecting any (or additional) prospects via purchase in the rule 5 draft for any of a variety of reasons.
Now, that all being said, question:
Since taking over as PBO, Chaim bloom has claimed 10 players via the combined MLB and AAA phases of the rule 5 draft. Of those 10, 5 players, of 50% of all those taken, have come from the NY Yankees, a team that has not been sitting at the top of the farm rankings.
Do you think bloom is acting vindictive and putting more importance on an attempt to conduct petty harassment against NY, and, in the process taking inferior players and tying up roster spots just to stick it to a perceived rival, above the best interests of the team and seeking best players available? These players being selected were being passed on by other clubs…
“‘higher source'”
Who said MLBTR is a ‘higher source’. Not me. I said they agree with the point, that ‘roster full’ and ‘passed’ are pretty much the same thing.
“Do you think bloom is acting vindictive and putting more importance on an attempt to conduct petty harassment against NY”
Did he get FIRED by NY? Why would he be vindictive against them.? And yes, I hope he would do the exact same thing to the Yankees, because they are an inter-divisional rival, hurting them helps the Red Sox. Phillies are not even in the same league.
This was a “genius move” by Dombrowski:
They had almost ZERO chance of retaining Song. You cant take a pitcher 4 years removed from the sport, and throw him on a MLB roster and expect success. The only one getting hurt in all this is Noah Song. But, yet you call this a “genius move” by Dumbrowski Hows that quote working out for you?
Pretty well. I still think it’s a great move because I stand by the player.
As I’ve said before, every team still has a mix of its own 26 man, 40 man MiLB players, non-roster invitees, etc in their ST camps.
The activities you do in ST camp are the same whether you are in major league camp, or minor league camp. This isn’t like high diving where there’s a less strenuous version of your sport… a class a pitcher, or a aaa pitcher, or mlb pitcher practice shagging balls or throwing programs…. the same way.
It’s not like they said ‘hey Noah, go out there and give us a 90 pitch appearance’ and he got hurt. He was ramping up exactly the same way he would’ve as a AA prospect.
Head to head Dombrowski will eat blooms lunch every time. One guy is a hall of fame quality manager who has had success with every franchise he has run, and, won world series with multiple franchises. The other guy has done nothing but look like a fool so far. And dombrowski isn’t the fool.
I’m happy Bloom targets the rival Yankees in the Rule 5 draft. It looks like Dombrowski may consider the Red Sox his rival now.
You finished it all off with your extreme anti-Bloom take – that he has never done a thing right. It is fair to wonder if this clouds all your takes and I believe it does.
Is Song a submarine pitcher?
No, he throws from a 3/4 arm slot.
I thought he was a submariner since he had been in the Navy
Lol, got me. Nice.
Aviator. He was a pilot
Song being shutdown surprises no one. One of DD’s dumbest moves..
We’re not talking high diving or something where there’s a lesser level of activity.
Minor league players are still with their respective clubs in ST.
Whether you’re on the 26 man, the 40 man, or just a promising prospect with a ST invite, or even a non-roster invitee, the process of drills and throwing a baseball is the same.
This isn’t like he got thrown in a game and asked to throw 90 pitches with no build-up and got hurt. Sheesh.
I think everyone who is a fan of every team should be pulling for this kid trying to come back from fulfilling his commitment to his country and trying to return to the dominance he had in college and his promising brief a-ball career.
“We’re not talking high diving or something where there’s a lesser level of activity.”
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I would feel far more comfortable taking a former high diver, 4 years removed from competition, and ramping him up over what the Phillies are trying to do to Noah Song. Pitchers get hurt FAR FAR more often than divers. Somebody’s never heard of Doug Drabek.
“Minor league players are still with their respective clubs in ST.”
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No they’re not, a player 4 years removed would be most certainly assigned to the minor league facility, from the get go, and probably wouldnt be allowed to pitch for weeks if not months. Not competing at the highest level against Major Leaguers.
Song being selected leaves no time to ramp up.
So, exactly what did the Phillies do that put song at risk, and, what exactly would song be doing differently if he was a aa prospect that makes the Phillies approach so much ‘riskier’?
Don’t say that asking him to attend ST was the risk, because then you’re arguing you don’t think he should’ve ever played baseball again
You lack some fundamental understanding here, and how easily a pitcher can damage his arm.
First you say being in the Major League camp is the same as anywhere. now he’s a “aa prospect”
No, No, he isnt a “aa prospect”. He should start in Rookie Ball. Long tossing, then pitching off flat ground, then off the mound. All before seeing live batters. That process would easily take 2 months, with no complications. No matter what he was doing, to get ready to pitch at MLB level by April, it would require him to take giant steps, he’s not ready for.
Your asking a dumb question: “What exactly . . .”— We dont know. Its like saying “What exactly did the drunk driver do to cause the accident?” We don’t know, but we do know he shouldnt have been driving.
If you’re so adamant they did him wrong, then you should have proof of what exactly they did wrong… no? That’s what makes it not as you put it ‘a dumb question.’ You have no clue what song mightve done while appealing to switch to reserve status do you?
Song wasn’t injured. He could’ve played catch on his own with any friend and it serves the same goal as your long toss on the field. I can go to a cage here and choose whether to practice hitting, or pitching, even with a gun to tell speed. You don’t know what song did or didn’t do, right?
But you second guess a professional training staff with no knowledge what so ever of what plan is in place. Then you complain that his arm is fragile, and point to a back issue as proof the Phillies are doing wrong.
If you cant point to exactly what they did wrong, you should not criticize. Otherwise it should be ‘I don’t really know what the Phillies have done with song, but there could be some tiny chance they might mess him up, I just really don’t know anything that could support saying he was though’…
Drunk driving is a bad example. It’s easy to say what would be wrong – having too many drinks, then driving.
1) Where are you getting this “reserve status” from. You find an outlet calling it reserve, I’ll find an outlet calling it postponed.
2) Again, you shouldn’t let a drunk driver behind the wheel, and you should never be trying to ramp up a pitcher after a 4 year hiatus to pitch at the big league level. How is that not making sense to you? If the drunk driver is in a ditch, I dont need to prove he wasnt cut off in getting there. Song’s arm wasnt ready for this, and Im gonna blame the guy who put him in the situation.
3) Ok, change ‘Drunk Driver’ to ‘Guy rushing wife to hospital during child berth’. Neither one should be on the road. Dont drive, call an ambulance/Dont draft Song let him develop in the minors then make a claim, if you can, in subsequent years.
Unless you have a vendetta, then claim the kid in Rule V draft, who cares about him or if his career could be in jeopardy. At least, you get back at your old boss.
espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/35712844/noah-song-dischar…
Selected reserve. Show me anything that says a deferral was granted. He applied for a deferral. He was granted selected reserve.
And nothing has happened to songs arm. He hasn’t been inactive 4 years, it’s been 3 seasons. Song pitched through the end of 2019 in A ball. Then whatever we dont know in between. It’s just as likely he pitched in a amateur pickup game capacity or in a cage as he did nothing at all whatsoever like you claim.
Sone strained his back. Back tightness. Not forearm tightness. I can pull my back doing yard work.
Paxton has probably exercised his arm less than song did all in all with more layoffs in activity since 2019. For all we know, Song was pitching on the base I’m games with other members of the military. We don’t know.