The Diamondbacks have an interesting stockpile of upper level outfielders from which they’re largely expected to deal. General manager Mike Hazen and his staff have long signaled a willingness to field offers to upgrade other areas of the roster and they’re unsurprisingly drawing attention from a host of teams.
Nick Piecoro of the Arizona Republic reports roughly 10 clubs have been in touch with Hazen and company regarding at least one of the team’s outfielders. Piecoro lists the Yankees, Brewers, Blue Jays, A’s, Marlins, White Sox and Reds as clubs with interest, while both Piecoro and Chandler Rome of the Houston Chronicle report the Astros are in the mix.
Arizona has a number of players that could draw interest, and it stands to reason different teams have varied preferences on the group. Corbin Carroll is arguably the top prospect in baseball, and both Piecoro and Ken Rosenthal of the Athletic have suggested recently he’s off the table in trade discussions. Carroll’s presence gives the Snakes a potential franchise center fielder, though, freeing them up to listen to offers on their other outfielders.
Daulton Varsho is the most established of the group, and he’d be the toughest to pry from the desert. The 26-year-old got off to a slow start offensively in the majors, but he broke through in his third season. Varsho connected on 27 home runs with a .235/.302/.443 line across 592 plate appearances in 2022. That’s slightly better than average production at the plate, and he offers immense value in other areas. Varsho stole 16 bases (albeit with six failed attempts as well), and he has emerged as one of the game’s best defensive outfielders.
Also an intermittent catcher at times in his career, he’s acclimated to outfield work incredibly well. Varsho’s an above-average runner, and Statcast credits him with elite reads off the bat. By its Outs Above Average metric, Varsho made an estimated 18 more plays than expected in his 920 1/3 innings between center and right field this year. Defensive Runs Saved pegged him a combined 19 runs above par, with both metrics grading him highly in both center and the corner outfield. Varsho doesn’t have a great throwing arm — part of the reason he’s increasingly moved off catcher in the first place — but he’s an athletic, rangy defender who can cover anywhere in the outfield and occasionally factor in at catcher if needed.
Varsho qualified for early arbitration as a Super Two player this winter. MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz projects him for an affordable $2.8MM salary, and he comes with four remaining seasons of club control. Between the all-around production and affordable window of control, the trade appeal with Varsho is immense.
That’s not true to the same extent for the Snakes’ other outfielders, but there’s still a fair amount of appeal. Jake McCarthy is a former supplemental first-round draftee, but most prospect evaluators believed he’d be better suited for fourth outfield duty. While that may wind up being the case, the 25-year-old outperformed that projection in 354 plate appearances this past season. McCarthy hit .283/.342/.427 with eight home runs and stole 23 bases on just 26 tries. His average exit velocity and hard contact percentage are a bit below-average, and the offensive profile was propped up by a .349 batting average on balls in play. The Virginia product is an excellent baserunner who’s athletic enough to cover all three outfield spots, though, and he generally has a solid offensive track record in the minors. McCarthy still hasn’t reached a full year of service time and is controllable through 2028.
Alek Thomas offers a similar profile but is a different story, in that he’s been a top prospect who has yet to find much MLB success. The sport’s #32 prospect heading into 2022 according to Baseball America, Thomas debuted in May. He spent most of the year as their primary center fielder but struggled, hitting .231/.275/.344 through 411 plate appearances. He didn’t draw many walks or drive the ball with much authority, and the tough line led to a demotion back to Triple-A at the end of the season. Thomas won’t turn 23 until next April and is a career .313/.389/.499 hitter in the minor leagues, though. He’s regarded as a potential plus defensive center fielder with strong contact skills. Like McCarthy, he has yet to reach even one year of MLB service.
The trio of Varsho, McCarthy and Thomas is certain to draw the most trade interest, but Arizona also has Pavin Smith and Dominic Fletcher as depth options on the 40-man roster. Smith hasn’t done much at the MLB level but is a former top ten pick. Fletcher is a .296/.358/.467 hitter in the minors and was added to the 40-man at the end of the season to keep him out of the Rule 5 draft. A trade involving either player wouldn’t be as significant as a move involving their top trio, but it’s possible the Snakes find some interest in both.
The extended windows of club control for each of McCarthy, Varsho and Thomas could make them of interest to teams at varying levels of the competitive cycle. That’s highlighted in the wide array of clubs that have checked in with Arizona. Milwaukee, Houston, Toronto, the White Sox and the Yankees are all win-now teams known to be looking for ways to plug a gap in center and/or a corner outfield spot. Houston is known to be in search of a left-handed bat, in particular.
Miami is behind that quintet from a competitive perspective. Still, the Fish are hoping to improve their offense to take a step forward in 2023, likely by subtracting from their enviable rotation depth. The Marlins are without an obvious center fielder on their MLB roster at present, with players like Jesús Sánchez, Bryan De La Cruz and JJ Bleday stretched there defensively. Miami and the D-Backs have linked up on a swap of young players before with the Jazz Chisholm/Zac Gallen deal, although that was orchestrated by the previous Marlins front office.
Oakland and Cincinnati are firmly amidst rebuilds, making them somewhat surprising fits at first glance. Yet the opportunity to acquire a pre-arbitration key piece at least opens the door for teams that are more traditionally “sellers” to gauge the market. A’s GM David Forst told reporters this week that acquiring players at or near the majors is “at the top of our to-do list” (via Melissa Lockard of the Athletic). Reds GM Nick Krall similarly indicated at the GM Meetings the team was considering trade possibilities involving prospects or “lower cost, more controllable players in the big leagues” (link via Bobby Nightengale of the Cincinnati Enquirer).
There are a number of ways the discussions could go, but it seems clear Arizona would want MLB-ready talent in return. Hazen flatly rejected the notion of trading any of their outfielders solely for prospects last month, and Piecoro writes they could look for infield or catching help in discussions — with particular emphasis on adding some right-handed punch to the lineup.
I’ve seen a couple of notes about the Braves being tied to McCArthey for LF – maybe a platoon with Ozuna if they can’t move him. His 2.4 WAR with his decent stat line would be an upgrade over Rosario (-1.6 WAR last year), provided he could be moved.
Where did you see that, I’m interested.
I’ve tried to find it (maybe two weeks ago). I read so much Braves news – could be twitter, the Athletic, Bowman, Chop Talk. It would be an AA type of pick up if the price was right.
McCarthy vs.
RHP: .284/.344/.427 6.8 BB%/ 21.8 K%
LHP: .281/.337/.427 5.9 BB%/ 21.2 K%
Combined with his above average-plus defense and plus (potentially plus-plus) speed/baserunning, and McCarthy is pretty close to an everyday player (if not already).
Well I can’t believe the Brewers would fit for them unless they go after Varsho and even then I think they would switch him back to being their starting catcher
Agreed. I just don’t understand why they’d even consider paying the risk premium of trading for essentially unknown prospects when they have at least 5 outfield prospects of their own. Get those young guys some innings first and let’s see what we’ve got!
Thomas needs to be the first one. If its a great return Varsharo will do. McCarthy and Corbin need to be off limits. Mccarthy is getting better and better. We need one more pitcher and a big time hitter. Marlins could package Pablo lopez. Astros can give Urquidy. Bluejays can give Jansen. So many options
I had hoped the Yankees would explore McCarthy to see what type of return was asked. I assumed he would require less in a return than Varsho, Thomas, and Corbin. The article seems to confirm that, but what are your thoughts as a DBacks fan?
The DBacks are actually fairly high on McCarthy for the reasons I noted in my reply to vacommish
My opinion as a fan is that he’s an above average player already; maybe not quite an All Star, but a REALLY good supporting piece nonetheless.
Thanks highheat, I appreciate that. Seems a bit Inconsistent with what’s written above but I certainly see why your explanation makes sense. Kind of the same reasons I was really interested in him. Thinking…”man, if he’s a fourth OFer that could work out well in NY!”
No problem, its kind of the difference of somebody watching the season in real-time and somebody looking back on the results.
McCarthy had a terrible Mar/Apr and below average May before being sent down to work on his mechanics; while I was following his MiLB stay, I noted that his LHP/RHP splits were identical and his SwStr% were down substantially from before I tabbed him as someone to keep an eye on.
Sure enough, when he got called up his splits were almost identical and his SwStr% and CStr% both dropped. So when you’re looking at his numbers, the added context of that atrocious early season helps along with the accompanying knowledge of mechanical tweaks.
BTW, if you’re curious on where I find MiLB SwStr%:
-click Prospects on the FG dropdown menu
-click on the Board
-go to MiLB Leaderboards (Stats Only)
-go the back of the Batted Ball page
Obviously, it’s really helpful to be able to check that before a hitter makes their MLB debut (for Fantasy purposes), hope somebody finds it helpful!
I don’t want to be in a hurry to lose any of them at all.
Let’s see how we fill a few holes first.
Maybe trade one at the deadline but I’m cool not trading unless it’s something we can’t pass on.
I believe the order of availability is
1. Thomas
2. Varsho
3. Mccarthy
4. corbin is off limits
Funny things is Mccarthy made his way up that ladder. Varsho would have never been before him. but it depends on the team needs who trade.
DBacks: thanks. Yeah, I can see why you all are excited about your youth movement on that team. I didn’t realize Thomas had fallen a bit this past season and I figured Varsho would be virtually untouchable with his CF/C versatility. They could get a really nice haul for him! (Well, for all of them, obviously).
Perhaps the Giants could take Madbum and his salary off AZ hands for one of their outfielders. Madbum is a fan favorite.
Nobody looking to offload Bumgarner’s contract; it drops by ~$10MM next season (which is the last year of it).
If that’s all it took, some team would’ve already made that deal (they didn’t).
So Clip, when they announced Judge was coming back to your team, did you say Hey that’s great! But ah, um it’s not McCarthy. I mean, sure, Judge is a terrific player but you think we could trade him for this kid McCarthy? What – no trade clause? Damn. Sure would have been nice. Bro, take it easy, hust teasing you ha.
Coop: Yeah, man. I was like, “Who’s this Judge character? Why isn’t McCarthy signed to an extension in pinstripes yet?”
You know us NYers, man. Unreasonable in a good day!
Hey clip , I think we need someone established. There’s nobody to play as the starting third outfielder for the Yankees, I would not include hicks so I would hope he would be gone by the beginning of next year.
Or sooner.
Oh and I don’t consider us Yankees fans unreasonable, it’s the organization that tells us every year they are world championship caliber, so why would the fans not be expecting that.
Dr: Yeah, I was just kidding brother. Hey, to me, a WS every year is completely reasonable!
Anyway, I agree with you. Optimally we get a proven talent for LF. And honestly, that’s the way to go.
Buster Olney surmised that Yankees are still in deep negotiations with Rodon and working on something {bigger}, according to Michael Kay! Bigger than Rodon? Only one that fits that description is Correa in FA. On the trade side, Murphy (highly doubtful) or perhaps Reynolds?
I don’t know, but I’m pretty excited. Like 2009 all over again.
I recognize that Clipper.As far as big deals in the works, dont get your hopes up. I’ll believe it when I see it.
True Doc, but I always fall into this trap. It’s my 90’s kid self coming back to haunt me.
Anyway, I read another plausible theory on PSA: that perhaps they are trying to hook up with SD on a trade for one of their big names. That actually makes sense given their recent acquisition and payroll.
That makes more sense, lets hope so.
PSA was also discussing Evan Longoria as a potential pick up. I didn’t even though he was still playing. Last thing we need is a another washed up ,over the hill player.
Yeah, amen to that. Are we really going to replace Donaldson with another Donaldson?! Are you kidding? No way!
@Clipper. I hope not, but it has Cashman written all over it.Ugh.he loves these low risk, inexpensive players. If it works out, for a brief period, cashman gets all the accolades, but if it doesn’t, he can say oh well, we didn’t expect much anyway. And he’s exempt from blame.
The problem with that thinking is, it isn’t low risk, in reality, if you’re penciling said player in as your every day player, and if it doesn’t work out, which is likely, you don’t have a back up plan.
And let’s not forget, cashman our GM, could not even sign our franchise player. And I also can also add, that if he had the foresight to sign him a little sooner, he could’ve saved Steinbrenner multiple millions of dollars. He took the intervention of the owner, to get Aaron Judge signed. What does that say about cashman as our GM.
Best strategy is to trade none of them. Give one of them a 1B mitt and trade the 32 year old Walker.
First basemen are worth didly squat. Especially ones that can’t play anywhere else. No matter how many home runs they hit.
Then give one a 1B mitt and sit Walker.
WW, is this Beaver County boy Richie “Call me Dick” Allen?
Sadly Dick passed away in 2020. He ruffled quite a few feathers, but he could hit. Belongs in The Hall, wish it had happened before he passed.
I like Piecoro’s articles but I think he is just fishing here and applying some logical reasoning at the time.
Would you prefer illogical reasoning at a rumors website?
I always like some illogical reasoning, Get plenty of that in the comments section.
If he is fishing he needs to go work for the Marlins.
An outfielder from the D’backs sounds promising–if the price is right.
Sounds like the price is high…. Understandably so.
That’s why the article’s mention of the wsox being interested in any of the dback’s OFers is comical. The Sox don’t have enough talent in the minors and little in the majors to trade.
The Sox have Tatis’s brother to trade. Sorry, cheap shot I know but could not resist with the way the Sox org is run.
Varsho would be a good fit on the Yankees very versatile player
I’m fine keeping all of them. Hazen better not take any low ball offers.
Azsports said their Dbacks sources are telling them: Carroll not available. McCarthy unlikely to be traded, Dbacks value him much higher than interested teams. One of Varsho or Thomas could be moved but asking price is sky high.
Is there a potential deal with Miami that could happen for Varsho?
Shelby Miller still hurts huh
You ever seen an abused dog have puppies and they turn out to be reserved?
It’s kind of like that; that deal was generational trauma lol
Yeah as a Braves fan I was asking what was in the water in AZ to get that deal done.
Considering it was Dave Stewart that made the trade I’m guessing the water fountains in the building were pumping out straight whiskey at the time. It was the worst of times, it was the worst of times.
They have a solid group!
The deal is Urquidy for McCarthy. Talk to ya in a week.
No way Stros do that. Urquidy is very important to them now that Verlander’s gone.
Unless they add another pitcher the Astros would never do it. They didn’t even do it for Contreras.
It’s funny because I don’t think that would come close to prying Jake McCarthy out of thenD’Backs hands. Full season his counting stats work out to a 4-5 war player last year and he has six years of control left.
Arizona’s pitching coach Strom knows Urquidy well from his time in Houston. I would imagine his opinion matters in a potential trade.
I think the Astros would do this simply because they have struck out in FA on left handed hitting OF.
They would sign another low tier FA starting pitcher but it would fill a hole and they would still be 5 deep in starters + whoever they sign.
I have heard they talked to Kluber
CWS has four or five OF prospects that can play, Colas, Haseley, Rutherford and Cespedes
Yeah, but are any of them good enough for AZ to trade one of their OF to the Sox?
Cespedes looks like he may be a good one. Colas should be starting in the Sox OF next season. Before anyone says ‘But he has not done enough in the minors” let me remind them that the Sox just paid a guy with two TJS 12m a year to ‘hopefully’ produce for them this season. If you are doing that you may as well throw caution to the wind and bring up a guy like Colas for the OF.
I’m curious, what would you offer for one of dem
A mostly overrated group indeed
no need to be salty man
I watched Corbin Carroll play several games last year and I didn’t see anything close to a resemblance to the top prospect in the game. He looked like an OK big league outfielder, but I didn’t see anything that made him special. Jake McCarthy looked like a much better player to me.
I see where you’re coming from, but Carrol is 2 years younger, with a lot of upside. McCarthy does have more MLB experience, though, so I can see why a club would prefer McCarthy.
Gotta remember that Carroll only had 657 MiLB PAs due to the Pandemic/injury. You might have seen him against LHPs. He’s had minimal exposure to them due to such limited time.
It’ll be a bit before he settles into his offensive potential; in the meantime, he showed phenomenal defense and the fastest sprint speed in the game.
Nobody has soured on him as a prospect; the fact that he’s even in MLB is a testament to the quality of his tools.
His lack of experience is all the more reason to be skeptical of his lofty prospect status. Too many strikeouts for my taste.
Why should it be? He so throughly handled more experienced players that the best choice was to give him an opportunity to acclimate against MLB pitchers before he was eligible for RotY.
That was the decision made by the people that are actually paid to make it; I think they know their internal evaluation a bit better than either of us, but selecting him to the 40-man before necessary does indicate that there is a level of confidence that he can resolve those issues with some experience.
If he doesn’t get the hang of hitting LHP in a timely enough manner? He still has those tools, and can use them in the long side of a platoon. Would that be ideal? No, there are safety nets, though.
To each their own. Good luck to you.
Good luck to you as well.
Carroll is incredible. I’m not sure about #1 in game but that dude is gonna be a star. The others, I’d say McCarthy is interesting but a lot of teams have a dude like that. Varsho’s a stud but is already in arbitration, so perhaps he and McCarthy are about equal in value. Thomas is way behind. Good defensive CFers who hit a wall between AAA and the majors are unfortunately pretty common. Not worth a lot.
In his cup of coffee he played in 32 games and had a wRc+ of 130 meaning he was 30% above league average offensively, Mike Trout in his rookie cup of coffee year played in 40 games and had a wRc+ of 87 or 13% below league average, im not saying he’s better than Trout, but maybe a bit early for your final judgement.
Varsho and McCarthy pass the eye test for me. Both left handed bats with speed (There is going to be an uptick in steals this year). I think the perfect fit would be for one of them ending up in Houston. That Astro lineup with another quality lefty would be very bad for opposing pitchers.
I know the Astros feel the same way
None of these OF for Arizona are anywhere close to being superstars or even all-stars yet. What’s most attractive about them is their age and number of years of control left. I’m not sure what Arizona wants back in return for them but none of these players alone would be enough to pry Sean Murphy away from Oakland for example.
Some team might be willing to offer a young, starting pitcher who has 1-2 years of MLB experience but hasn’t turned into a front of rotation option yet, but I don’t think Arizona is going to get as big of a haul as they expect for any of these players.
You know that teams scout young players, right? Carroll is a top ten in baseball talent, among the most valuable pre-MLB assets in the whole game. Dbacks would slam the phone down if the A’s offered Murphy, who only has three years of control left. I’d guess Varsho or McCarthy would have to come with a good prospect as well.
Dorothy Dorothy Dorothy,
Check out the credentials for the 4 Dbacks CF below.
Murphy isn’t even close to being enough in a race for 1 of them.
To tag onto Scott, Varsho vastly outpaced Betts by every defensive metric for RF except for DRS (a cumulative stat where Varsho had 14 DRS and Betts had 15 DRS), but Betts had more than twice the number of defensive innings in RF that Varsho had. He didn’t come anywhere close to Betts’s batting line, but an above average batting line (that stands to improve from the shift ban) with an elite glove is a really good player.
As far as McCarthy goes, what team wouldn’t want a player that can play every OF position competently, hit both RHP and LHP at an above clip, and was one of the 15 fastest players in the league?
I’d give Arizona the world for Carroll. It’s probably going to require it by the sounds of it.
But if both turn out how they are projected its a fair trade and works out for both Clubs.
Moreno for Carroll.
What else would it realistically take?.
And i don’t want to hear that prospects don’t get traded for each other, they do and can and have before its just not often at all. It’s been a while so the MLB world is due for one
Corbin Carroll is the consensus pick for #1 Prospect in 2023.
Jake McCarthy finished 4th in 2022 NL Rookie of the Year voting.
Alek Thomas was a 2022 Gold Glove finalist.
Daulton Varsho was a 2022 Gold Glove finalist…at Two positions. OF and Utility.
Extremely high asking price for all 4. Justified.
Scott consensus #1 absolutely not true. Top five probably true.
I would personally rather have Henderson over Carroll but you get the idea if you want to say arguably #1 prospect I can go with that but consensus means no argument sure fire #1 and that’s just not true.
Bruin
Carroll is also the odds on pick for 2023 Rookie of the Year
That’s different from what you were originally saying; he’s pointing out the you said Carroll was the Concensus #1 prospect, when Gunnar Henderson is as highly, if not more so, than Carroll by every outlet.
Saying he’s the odds on pick for NL RotY would’ve left less room for argument, because Henderson is in the AL.
being #1 prospect is not a sure thing. Just look at Yoan Moncada’s career so far as an example.
These OFs from the D-Backs have been tied to the Marlins rumors with Pablo Lopez. It’s very likely that Lopez will be traded, but where and for which bat/position player is the question.
We’ve heard D-Backs for one of these guys. There was the talks with the Yankees that involved Gleyber Torrez and prospects; Recently there has been the mention of Twins; There was once mentions of the Blue Jays.
We’ll see.
I would be happy if the A’s traded Murphy for any of Carrol, Varsho, Thomas, Smith, or Fletcher.
That’s way too cheap for Murphy, and I’m a DBacks fan. I wouldn’t hesitate even if the A’s offered Murphy for Smith, Fletcher, and choice of Kelly/Herrera, but that’s entirely unrealistic.
Carroll straight up for Murphy, at all realistic? A’s have some semi interesting relievers to add in. Sadly after that they have no decent trade chips. If only laureano suspension, injury history wasn’t an issue
Murphy for Smith, Fletcher, and Kelly or Herrera is way too light. Carrol, Varsho, or Thomas need to be included.
I’m fully aware of that, and I stated that as well, although, I used the words “entirely unrealistic”; not at all in jest. However, it was a play off how light your initial suggestion was.
Carroll or Varsho is more than enough to pull Murphy and then some (but wouldn’t happen) and an improvement for Thomas to even average offense along with his defense would put Thomas above Murphy in value. I already see McCarthy as higher value, but I’ve also been watching him successful making adjustments (as you’ve been doing for Murphy).
I personally don’t see an OF getting dealt during the offseason, but I’ve also been wrong before. There’s just been a fundamental disconnect on the valuation of the players from each side.
MarlinsFanBase
Marlins and Dbacks have a good recent trade track record benefitting both teams. I think they match up well again.
It could be for Pablo Lopez-Jake McCarthy straight up.
Or a blockbuster that would fill multiple needs for both teams. For Marlins, a CF Alek Thomas, a 1b with power Christian Walker, and a 3b Emmanuel Rivera
For the Dbacks SP Pablo Lopez, right handed OF bat Jorge Soler and Closer Tanner Scott.
If you showed an interest in taking one of our contracts from last offseason, I believe the Marlins would push Avi Garcia instead of Soler. No one would have a problem with Tanner Scott being included.
@MFB If Tanner Scott doesn’t have options left, his next move could be DFA
MarlinsFanBase
Yes, that was the idea, to take on an unwanted contract. If the Marlins offered Garcia instead of Soler, since Garci has less power potential, which is what the Dbacks want, right handed with big power, I think the Dbacks would pull Walker and offer their other 1b Pavin Smith, the former 1st Round pick.
I know Tanner Scott is not ideal as a Closer, but Dbacks are having trouble obtaining a proven Closer. They might bite for a left handed like Scott to team with right hander Mark Melancon and hope Melancon has a bounce back 2023.
If the D-Backs want a closer so bad, how about a McCarty for Hendrix trade, strait up?
I’d do the deal with Pavin Smith as the change. I’m not sure what Kim Ng would do. though.
Dbacks love walker and definitely wouldn’t want soler
Zack
I agree that the Dbacks love Walker, but Hazen has never declared him untouchable. Instead, Hazen suggested at the end of the Winter Meetings this week that the Dbacks were considering some previously in-discussed players in trade discussions. I would hasten to add that selling high on a player is often a good idea. And if the Dbacks get 2 good right handed power bats for the OF, there isn’t as much pressure on having an all right handed hitting infield.
Dbacks could also trade with the White Sox who want to reduce salary and have some bad contracts. They need a LF and more starting pitching.
So, CF Jake McCarthy and SP Madison Bumgarner for 3b Moncada and Closer Liam Hendriks would take millions off their payroll over the next two years.
As a 10 year Dbacks fan….
All we need is bullpen help. I love all of our outfielders and don’t want to trade them but I know we have to give up something to get something good. I would want a dominant closer for varsho, McCarthy, or Thomas.
We also need another big bat… probably a 3rd baseman.
This is the trade that makes sense for me…
Blue Jays get Jake Mccarthy, Tommy Henry, and Dominic Fletcher.
Dbacks get Jordan Romano and a lower level prospect.
I think the dbacks would be overpaying a little bit but I think it would be stupid for Jays not to except. Let me know what you guys think and post some of you mock trades to my comment!
Zack
Zack
I like your idea. I wanted to target Romano also, and I think the Dbacks should actually trade 2 left handed hitting CF, not just 1. Dbacks fans don’t like to admit this, but having 6-7 left handed hitting CF is not only a luxury but is also a problem. At the end of the year last season, opponents threw every left handed starter and reliever on their roster at the Dbacks with great success. Our right handed hitting lineup was pathetic, and it forced the Dbacks to bat some of the young left handed CF against quality left handed pitching.
I personally think that’s way too much for Romano; if that’s the going rate for 3 years of control, I’d rather push hard for Vazquez and one more mid-tier bullpen FA and ride it out until a bit closer to the deadline.
Sure, there will be a premium on bullpen pitchers at that point, but the OFs have the opportunity to build value as well (in addition to teams needs becoming more clearly defined).
Murphy and AJ Puk may be a semi interesting offer
Romano is a hometown boy. He’s living his dream, and getting traded to ARZ would probably suck the life out of him.
We can give you Bass, who has history closing. We could give you Garcia,
But problem is, we need those guys just as badly as ARZ does
Expendable Jays who have value are currently
Bo
Moreno
Lourdes Gurriel Jr
And only Moreno makes sense for you realistically.
The only deals I see ARZ and TO making are C for OF deals or Uber prospect for Uber Prospect
Considering you have 3 talented OFs, wouldn’t you like to grab the highest rated C who’s clock hasn’t started and seal that position for the next 6 or 7 years
Carroll for Moreno. Helps both clubs immensely
Burying the lede: there’s a Bobby Nightingale too?
If the Pirates decide to cut ties with Reynolds I’d like to see an even up Varsho trade as a possibility. Both are under control for almost the same number of years (Reynolds 3, Varsho 4) and are about the same age. Could work.
Reds make a ton of sense. Trade from surplus of SS prices for AZ surplus of OF
They should have signed tallion. Traded drey j Thomas and varsho for Reynolds and Bernard. Also extend gallen 10 years 205 mill
Prospect for prospect trade could make some sense for the Red & Dbacks…. Swap Thomas for Barerro…
Both are former top 100 prospects; both play premium positions (shortstop & center field); both did well in the minors but kind of sucked in the majors…. Reds need outfielders; Dbacks need infielders…
Prospect for prospect makes no sense for the DBacks at this point; between Walker, Marte, Ahmed, Rojas, Rivera, Perdomo, and Alexander they have options to cover the IF spots. What they’re lacking is impactful options.
I’m curious what the AZ fans think of Thomas. Good, but not great credentials. Struggled a bit in the pros, but might’ve been slightly rushed, and is only 22. I think he’d be a good target for my RS.
Some have soured slightly on him, but there is no urgency to deal him because he still has options and there is a clear mechanical issue to point at and work on (awkward hand load that resulted in inconsistent timing).
He was still a Gold Glove finalist in CF showing off some crazy athleticism, but his arm was not strong (he generally got it into the cutoff pretty quickly; you’d expect some good fundamentals from MLB bloodlines).
DBacks are looking primarily for back end bullpen help, but cost controlled C/SS/3B (likely in that order) and potentially mid-back rotation SP were desires.
I don’t know what I’m really attracted to on the Sox roster aside from Houck. Highly doubt he’d be enough for Thomas straight up, though.
Devers and Sale to the Dbacks
Varsho, Rojas, Walston, and Fletcher to the Red Sox?
What do you think?
So three years of control for 20+ years of control? How about Sale for MadBum straight up?
I’d take 4 days off from work and personally drive Mr. Devers down to AZ. But since I would be interested in seeing what the market is on Devers, I’d be curious what the AZ fans think he is worth.
No offense, but Devers has more value to the Sox. One year of him doesn’t do much when the younger guys have to settle in (more than likely a year out) and we all know our owner wouldn’t extend him.
Tldr; No, just no.
You’ve gotta be trolling; the DBacks can’t afford that hit to payroll, are looking for more than one year of control on impact pieces, and primarily need bullpen help.
Not to mention, that that’s two contributors off of the MLB roster and near term depth gone for the “privilege” to pay for Sale’s albatross and Devers’s inflated arb salary with none of the value that they provided.
HE!! NO
Two fun facts for those that don’t follow the D-backs closely. McCarthy grew up taking live BP from his older brother who threw lefty. As a result, as noted previously, his splits are outstanding. Also, there has been alot of talk about the D-backs OF depth, but they also have four good looking SP due to arrive in ’23 – Jameson, Nelson, Walston and Pfaadt. Things are looking up in the desert.
Jays and AZ are probably talking a lot with some possible scenarios lined up. AZ is stuffed with young talent in the OF similar to the Jays at catcher. Not sure how much talent AZ has in the pipeline to where they would want a Jays catcher. For Carroll, a top ten prospect talent, it would take another top 10 talent like Moreno to make it possible. Even then both teams would probably value their guys more and not do that. So, then we look at McCarthy or Varsho and that is where Kirk would come into play. I think a deal could be had there for Kirk and a 10-20 prospect to AZ for either of them. Or some type of package there. Thoughts?
I’d take Romano and Kirk for McCarthy, Walston, and Fletcher
Who is Moreno?
Gabriel Moreno.
Probably the best touted C prospect coming up since Rutchman.
Pittsburgh has a pretty good one too tho.
I wouldn’t want to do Kirk for Varsho tho. I think Kirk’s shown he’s worth a ransom as well.
TennVol,
Hazen has made it clear that he is Nottrading any of the 4 Dback CF for Prospects. So that’s a hard No.
He d be gg ss in Colorado right now. And Colorado is hardest of In baseball. In a perfect world start the season next year in cf in az get 200 to 300 abs and get sent down like McCarthy to figure it out them come back ready to go. Lewis is intriguing in that respect this year too
Alex Thomas reply
Sean Murphy for Dalton Varsho and Jordan Lawler
The Big Ho Ho Ho, very funny
I wish I could give that a thumbs down lol
Hahahah
Varsho is better than Murphy and we’re trading Lawlar who is going to be the #1 prospect in the league next year? Dude you’re nuts. I don’t even want Sean Murphy, the guy is way over hyped.
So much raw ability in Perdomo. Marte has to go back to what made him so good in his breakout campaign, Rojas not a fan single Handley messed up baumgarner this year, walker last. But great utility guy to have around. Perdomo at third maybe I spring training. Still like Ahmed at ss for now.
I think Perdomo could stand to go back to MiLB for a bit; to slow the game down some and make some adjustments, it did wonders for McCarthy last season. If he can get to even a bit of solid contact or power semi-consistently, he could actually take advantage of his batting eye. He was just getting bullied last season.
I don’t expect Ketel to get back to his break out level due to all the IL time in recent history and he’s always been streaky anyways. But if he can hit at an above average level and still field 2B semi-competently without the shift, that’s still all the makings of an above average player. I’m just kind of losing faith, but I’ll be pleasantly surprised if he’s ever a plus provider again.
Rojas is a nice offensive piece, but his glove has been bad at 3B and and not quite as bad at 2B. Rivera has been a competent enough defensive 3B that he’s a viable defensive replacement and hits LHP well. Even if the DBacks make no moves at 3B they’re likely to be around middle of the pack in production there.
An IF addition that actually improves the complexion of the team would be nice, but making that move isn’t a necessity.
Highheat
Agree.
As Dback fans, we need to remember what last year was all about. It was a year of aggressively promoting a large group of highly rated young prospects, and if necessary taking our lumps as they make mistakes and gain experience.
Early in the season, it was position players. Late in the season it was starting pitchers. Overal, we were pleasantly surprised that the team made a 22 win improvement over 2021. However, in the last 2 months of the season, when we played the really good teams in our Division and elsewhere, these young players looked very competitive at times but ultimately faltered. It showed how far we still had to climb, but there was some hope.
This off-season Hazen is trying to improve the competitiveness of this team against the top teams in our Division., while at the same time identifying the core pieces to hang onto and build around.
The most glaring need to strengthen this core is the bullpen, especially Closer.. the second glaring need is right handed bats against left handed pitching. Hazen isn’t going to waste his high quality CF trade assets, on anything other than back end of the bullpen and/or power right handed bats. He isn’t going to trade these 4 CF just for the sake of making a trade.
As far as I’m concerned, this is a development year as well; however, the bullpen was literally demoralizing last season, so that’s the only thing that truly needed to be addressed this offseason. And I doubt that any of the OF pieces are dealt for a CP unless the deal also includes another piece that addresses an MLB need.
Like I note a bit higher up, Carroll just physically hasn’t had enough PAs against LHP to have any expectation of performing adequately against MLB LHPs; it’d be unreasonable. I have the confidence that he has the ability to become an everyday Leadoff hitter, but it’s going to to take some time to adjust.
On the value note, everybody pitching deals like they’re trying to acquire a 4th OF or league average player aren’t understanding that they’re viewed as above average regulars in CF (with the exception of Thomas who they’re more inclined to give MiLB reps to anyways) and Varsho has the least amount of control with 4 years.
I said at the beginning of the offseason that I’d be content with 2 bullpen additions and a position player upgrade. With Castro and Lewis acquired, that leaves one more (although, I’d like to see Vazquez signed as well now that I know he’s available, and one more arm never hurt no one).
In regards to RHB against LHP, I still stand beside my suggestion that Blaze Alexander should’ve been getting reps in the OF as well. He’s not the future SS, doesn’t quite have the bat to be a full time 3B, and his arm is wasted at 2B; however, if the outlook is a likely platoon batter, why not try to grab a LHP PA at every opportunity?
Even without playing OF, he can get in the lineup by playing Lewis LF, Marte DH, Alexander 2B and keep all the favorable matchups with Rivera, Ahmed, Walker, and (I guess) Kelly. Although, I don’t know why, but something tells me a SS with a plus-plus arm and no OF experience can play a COF spot comparable to an injury plagued Lewis. Just a hunch.
I’m not asking for a blockbuster deal, just to keep building some support around the guys coming up. And yes, that means a semi-competent bullpen.
Hazen has made it clear that there are enough at bats to go around if the Dbacks keep all 4 CF.
He doesn’t want prospects.
He doesn’t want another team’s bad contracts (unless he can dump MadBum’s contract in exchange).
He values these 4 much more highly than others do.
He wants right handed hitting OF and/or 3b, and/or a Closer for one of these 4 CF.
He is looking for a backup C, but obviously wouldn’t trade a Top rated young CF for a backup anything.
He is looking for middle relievers with high velocity who can get strikeouts, but obviously wouldn’t trade a top rated young CF for a middle reliever.
If anybody has any trade suggestions that fit ALL of these criteria, please post. Otherwise you’re just not listening and you just don’t get it.
Scott, teams don’t make trades to address all areas at once.
Toronto traded Teoscar, they got one of the peices they needed in the Pen , we didn’t also get a CF and a 3rd starter and cash savings in the deal. That would be impossible
Taking a look at your proposal. I’d be happy for the Jays to eat madbums contract to pry Carroll away from you, while also providing you your Catcher of the future in Kirk
You could have Moreno str8 up for Carroll instead.
But we can’t give you high leverage RP, we can’t give you an impact bat unless you’d like to include Bo Bichette in that trade, but now you’d need to come up with alot more value added for Bo.
There’s a reason trades aren’t happening on a daily basis. And reasons why teams continue to have holes. It’s easier said than done
He meant “don’t fit any of these criteria”, we all know it’s unreasonable to expect that large of return. That being said, the DBacks aren’t urgently looking for someone to pick up MadBum’s contract because the dollar value drops by over $10MM for ’24.
Next, Carroll is untouchable because he’s not even at peak value (everybody knows there will be inherent platoon struggles for some time) yet he’s still valued as highly as he is. He has the potential to be the premier Leadoff hitter in the game, but is still projected to be an above average player next season (even with the warts). Hard lass on any proposal.
Carroll for Moreno straight up isn’t even fair trade; they have comparable hit tools, but Carroll actually has the speed to take advantage of the times he’s on base.
Impact reliever is the priority, and I doubt any of the CFs are traded for a reliever without addressing another roster hole.
Lopez, Scott Garcia for Varsho and McCarthy. Can throw in Stalling. Then go get Vazquez.
Frank. No, and who is Scott Garcia?
Lopez, Scott, Avi Garcia and Stalling for Varsho nd McCarthy why not? I would go after Vazquez or Zunino very good defensive catchers better hitters than Stalling
Frank,
Here’s why No.
First, you are asking way too much. One of those two Dbacks are actually too much for those 4 players.
Here’s why. Avi Garcia is a big, sunk contract. By including him in the deal, you take away all or most of Pablo Lopez’s value. The other two have very little trade value.
For that package of 4 players I would offer CF Dominic Fletcher or OF/1b Pavin Smith.
Question to the Diamondback fans..what is your club weak in,and what are they lacking? MIF? C? SP?RP? The Jays desperately need a outfielder(LH is preferred)who can play CF. If the D-backs are thin at catcher, we can definitely help eachother. It would be nice for both of these teams to help eachother out with a trade instead of trying to sign an over the hill ballplayer(s) who cost a crazy amount
Saskatchewan,
As I wrote elsewhere, the Dbacks have 2 huge glaring needs: a Closer and a power right handed bat for either the corner OF or 3b..
Dbacks would be interested in Romano. That’s about it for getting one of the 4 stud CF.
If you want to offer a backup catcher, we’d trade our 5th or 6th CF, Dominic Fletcher or Pavin Smith.
Carroll for Moreno makes too much sense for both teams.
They don’t have a highly rated C coming up. We need a young star OF and he happens to be LHH AND a CFer.
Moreno is as polished a prospect as you’re going to find, bat control, OBP, Speedy his pop time to 2nd is Elite and a cannon. Even has versatility to play 2nd or 3rd and some LF.
I personally was hoping we’d trade Kirk but everyone seems to think his pudgy frame is a negative.
Jaysfan
Hazen has said on multiple occasions that he is Not trading any of the top 4 CF for prospects.
Hazen has also said on multiple occasions that Carroll is untouchable.
So the trade you propose might make sense to you, but you get TWO HUGE NOs from the Dbacks.
And the Jays have said Moreno is also untouchable.
That’s what makes that trade perfect. No point in having 4 CFs on your team, 3 of them will become unhappy eventually.
GMs talk to appease fans, behind closed doors everyone’s available.
Bro you’re not getting carrol. The dbacks would give up McCarthy and maybe a lower prospect for Romano but that’s it.
You don’t trade a starting capable CF with 5 years of control straight up for 3 years of a CP, let alone with another piece. Especially after Nimmo is off the market.
JaysFan, my dude, this is like talking to a brick wall. You can get your hopes as high as you want, but Carroll isn’t getting dealt; who do you think has a better gauge on Hazen’s valuation of players, AZ fans that’ve been following these guys since they were drafted or you?
Highheat
First, chill. You wouldn’t talk like that to me in a bar, or any other poster here in fact in a bar face to face. So don’t do that here
Secondly, everything you just said is also true on the opposite side, who do you think has a better valuation of talent in the Jays system? What makes the statement less true coming from The Jays and Atkins side. Catcher is just as premium of a position and arguably HARDER to find premium talent.
Im just not trying to be a cocky prickly Cactus spouting my knowledge like I’m Jimmer,
What I’ve done. The things I’ve seen, the research I’ve done. I have a valid opinion and it doesn’t have to agree with yours.
3rd, this board is designed to do EXACTLY what we’re doing. Bringing fan bases together who have no say or control over what their teams do, with some having pie in the sky ideas and others actually understanding how the front offices function etc.
It all gets mixed into a big pot and we all have to take from it what we want and participate where we’d like
Remember that the next time you want to needlessly puff out your chest over an innocent conversation
Firstly, I absolutely would talk to you that way in a bar if you were being as dense as you were with the Moreno suggestions after being given multiple reasons as to why it wouldn’t happen. There’s nothing wrong with acknowledging somebody being obnoxious as obnoxious, nor is there anything wrong with acknowledging a waste of time as a waste of time (trying to sort out a package for Corbin is a waste of time).
Secondly, you’re the one proposing a deal for a CF by dealing a C, not me. I know that each of the C options is incredibly valuable, that’s why I’ve said multiple times that I’m content to sign a defensive C and roll into the season with what we have unless there’s a favorable deal to be had. The DBacks aren’t going to struggle to get enough PAs for the top 4 CFs, the Jay’s might struggle to find enough PAs for all three Cs, though.
Thirdly, I agree about the purpose of this board, and actually value opinions/suggestions from other fanbases, but those opinions should have a basis in reality. I even value the dialogue you present, but it’s pretty frustrating when multiple people explain multiple reasons why your suggestion wouldn’t happen, yet you continue to make the same proposal. You’re the one disregarding outside input there.
I brought up the fans that have been following, because other fanbases just disregard the DBacks until we have good players then expect a favorable deal from their teams. Even if it was technically a fair trade proposal by market value (it wasn’t), we’ve been trying to explain that they’re each valued within the organization higher than outside teams are offering. And there is no NEED to deal any of them, they all still have options.
It’s like having a new toy on the playground that you really like and another kid rolls up with his new toy that’s pretty nice and wants to swap with you. Yeah, he technically has a cool new toy too, but you have your toy because you prefer it.
If you have a problem with me, cool, but I don’t have a problem with you. The “Carroll for Moreno” line of dialogue was getting tedious, though.
LOL.
First. NO you wouldn’t. We’ll leave it at that.
2nd the ONLY retort anyone is giving is HAZEN SAID SO. Yet I’m told I’m dense and ignoring valid arguments against my post????
Apparently YOURE the DENSE one to A. Make up facts, and B. Assume your GM is to be taken at face value. Gms play politics and media games to keep their jobs and have the value of each of their players at max value (I can’t believe I have to explain this)
If your argument is CF is more of a premium position I would argue against that, it seems to be the ONLY other point of contention you’re bringing forward, and I would argue if you had 2 players who could both be elite on offense and defense it would probably be better to take the C as opposed to the CF just because the chances of getting a C with positive value on both ends is nearly impossible. Name more than 5 and exclude the 3 on the Jays roster
Thirdly. No you don’t. You’re in full disagreement with me on my opinion and somehow want to twist things as if I’m just a Dense noob who’s new to the board and needs lessons in reading compression etc. Will a Moreno vs Carroll trade happen, probably not. You’ve got me there, if I were a gambling man I wouldn’t bet on it but is it logical and possible, a huge YES on both accounts. You have yet to actually bring a factual argument except Hazen said so and in your opinion CF vs C is blah and u can sign a D only placeholder until magic happens
Sorry this ended in a pissing contest. I’m Canadian after all, im not trying to be a prick. I really just believe in my opinion on this particular topic as well as others relating to proposals I’ve made to other fans.
You’re not the first one to have to read a novel from one of my responses.
Best of luck to the Dbacks in 2023, Jake Storiale favorite team
According to Statcast, none of these guys hits the ball well. I remember Daulton’s dad, Gary, well from the Pirates in the early 1990s.
None of them (aside from Varsho) could hit with consistent authority; however, if you’re going to bet on a hitter outperforming their xStats, the safest bet is a LHB with a sprayed GB/LD profile and elite sprint speed. That pretty accurately desribes Carroll, McCarthy, and Thomas.
It’s generally more than likely that a hitter’s wOBA falls to their xwOBA, but young/inexperienced players can see the inverse happen.
I’m a Dodgers fan and saw Caroll play at the end of the year. That kid is ridiculous. He’s going to be a star. I think the Snakes are going to be sneaky good this year.
Why would the Snakes unload any of their outfielders? Right now when their still developing? Not one of these guys are at max in terms of value. You have the DH spot and even 1st when Walker needs time off. Stand pat right now. DON’T TRADE ANY OF THEM NOW!
Article in a Reds website said:
The Reds should not trade for one of the D-backs outfielders.
When one thinks about the Cincinnati Reds and their farm system, you can’t help but observe the glut of shortstops in the team’s pipeline. The same can be said of the Arizona Diamondbacks’ outfield depth on their 40-man roster.
After acquiring Kyle Lewis from the Seattle Mariners, the D-backs now have six outfielders on the roster; all of which are 26 years old or younger and controllable beyond the 2023 season. That seems like a nice fit for the rebuilding Reds, right?
If at least one of those aforementioned outfielders was a right-handed hitter, you might be onto something. But Alek Thomas, Daulton Varsho, Jake McCarthy, Corbin Carroll, and Pavin Smith are all left-handed hitters.
The Cincinnati Reds have enough left-handed hitting outfielders. TJ Friedl, Jake Fraley, and Michael Siani all figure to see the field in 2023. If the Reds are going to entertain trading for a young outfield prospects, Cincinnati GM Nick Krall had better find one who can hit from the right side.
A trade may be the correct way to fix the void that currently exists in the Cincinnati outfield, but Arizona is not the right trade partner for the Reds this offseason.