The Mets have a rotation to rebuild and are interested in lefty Carlos Rodón. Jon Heyman of The New York Post reported yesterday that the club had been in contact with the free agent, while Andy Martino of SNY reports today that the two sides will be meeting this week. Joel Sherman of The New York Post reports that the two sides will have a Zoom meeting today.
Rodón, 30 next month, is coming off an excellent two-year run and is one of the top free agent pitchers this offseason, alongside Jacob deGrom and Justin Verlander. After missing most of 2019 and 2020 due to injuries, Rodón bounced back in 2021 by posting an ERA of 2.37, along with a 34.6% strikeout rate, 6.7% walk rate and 37.7% ground ball rate. He did spend some time on the injured list and only logged 132 2/3 innings on the year, which was concerning enough for the White Sox to decide against issuing him a qualifying offer.
He signed on with the Giants for 2022 and pushed the injury question marks even farther behind him, getting up to 178 innings with a 2.88 ERA, 33.4% strikeout rate, 7.3% walk rate and 34.1% ground ball rate. His two-year deal with the Giants allowed him to opt out after the first year if he tallied 110 innings, which he did with ease. He made the easy decision to opt out and then decline the qualifying offer that the Giants extended. Even with that QO attached, MLBTR predicted Rodón for a contract of $140MM over five years, an average annual value of $28MM.
The interest from the Mets is quite understandable, given the uncertainty in their rotation. deGrom, Taijuan Walker and Chris Bassitt all reached free agency recently, leaving the club with Max Scherzer and Carlos Carrasco as their two remaining incumbents. They have some internal candidates to fill the backend of their rotation, such as Tylor Megill and David Peterson, but they are naturally looking to improve that overall picture before Opening Day rolls around. They appear to be casting a wide net in their efforts, as they have already been connected to Verlander, Andrew Heaney, Kodai Senga and Jameson Taillon, in addition to trying to keep deGrom in Queens.
The Mets’ payroll for 2023 is current around $235MM, per the calculations of Roster Resource, with a competitive balance tax number of $247MM. It’s unclear exactly how high the club plans to push their payroll but a ballpark figure of $300MM has been floated, per Heyman. That gives the club plenty of room for now, but some of their pursuits are potentially looking for deals around $30MM or even $40MM. Given that the club is also looking into outfielders, such as bringing back Brandon Nimmo, and even their high-spending ways will start to reach their limits eventually.
The Mets certainly won’t be alone in their pursuit of Rodón either, as he’s already been connected to the Rangers, Dodgers, Twins and Yankees, with the Giants interested in bringing him back to San Francisco as well.
Steve Cohen jumping in front of a bullet for the rest of MLB, what a lad!
The Mets are just increasing the offers for Rodon. Expect deGrom to end up back with the Mets.
Steve Cohen: “Why not both?”
What a disaster.
Unless Mets payroll is going to $350 million and they plan on adding the remaining three starters they’ll need in addition to Scherzer, deGrom, and fiasc… I mean Carrasco.
If the Mets don’t resign deGrom or sign Verlander, then Rodon would be perfect for them.
I actually have them getting 2 of the 3 options, but they need offense too.
I think they could conceivably focus only on the pitching staff. I agree that they need offense, but if they shifted Marte to CF, they could have this as a lineup:
1B – Alonso
2B – Escobar
SS – Lindor
3B – Baty
C – Nido/Alvarez/McCann
LF – Cahna
CF – Marte
RF – McNeil
DH – Vogelbach/Alvarez
With Vientos around to fill in at 3B or 1B and Guillorme for 2B/SS. They’d need to strengthen the bench a bit, but that’s solid offense.
Of course, they’d be rolling the dice on Baty, and the OF defense would average at best, but it would free up the Nimmo money for the pitching staff. That is, if there is a need to ‘free up’ any money with Cohen.
Yea I think Baty is a risk, and I don’t love the idea of assuming Marte remains healthy all season, but you are correct. They can roll with this offense. I don’t expect them to perform to the same level they did last year, but there’s no reason to think they won’t compete.
There no real change their in the lineup, they need more power, I would sign Bogaerts,
(2b), Conforto to play RF put Mcneil in LF, let Canha be a 4th OF, sign Voit to DH , Vogelbach,Escobar, Canha, Nido, Guillorme should be bench guys, either trade or release McCann, Alvarez should be the starting . Sign Voit to DH, Rodon, Senga and Eovaldi. Boras is pricing Nimmo too high.
By not resigning deGrom $45), Bassitt ($20-$25), Walker ($10-$15), Nimmo ($20)= $95-$105
Rodon $30,, Bogaerts $25, Senga $15, Eovaldi $10-$15, Conforto $10, Voit $5 = $95-$100
If the Mets go after high-end pitching, I don’t see them in play for the big SSs. That would put them way over the $300 mark, which is nuts dven fot Cohen. It’s also not a position of need.
Why would the Mets acquire a high-end SS when they already have one? Granted, Lindor hasn’t performed to expectations according to many, but there’s no denying he is defensively adept. He’s still throwing up 125 OPS+ After his Mets adjustment. Now, some may compare to other players; for example but Gleyber Torres is 114.
Torres’ relatively commensurate performance on offense notwithstanding, I agree with you, Von, there’s no need to spend big on a FA SS when you have a perennial >5 WAR one on the team for the rest of his career.
Bogaerts won’t sign for 25 and he doesn’t want the play 2B
Lindor is coming off an incredible season.
Not sold on Baty’s defense at 3B
Yes, I agree. His defense is excellent and he leads all SS in WAR, while being 5th in WRC+. I’d take him any day, all day on my team.
I think baty will be very good – better than Alvarez IMO. His defense isn’t great but some time at DH can help offset that. Even if they re-sign Nimmo they need a 25-30 hr bat, so I think a flier on conforto is worth it. But most of all, I really like rodon for them bc they need a premiere LH starter. We’ll see how this all shakes out and how high Cohen will go, but I could see rodon Bassitt Nimmo conforto feasibly happen
@jvent
I think Xander really doesn’t want to play anything other than SS unfortunately – but I love him as a fit. I think he’s closer to $30m though and senga closer to 20m
Your suggestions would put the Mets 110 million dollars above the luxury tax.
@jvent; Thanks for the analysis. That said; the Mets did well without a power lineup in 22. Are dingers overrated? Stay with what got you there. Including, if ya gotta overpay for Nimmo, so be it.
Same with the rotation. I agree with letting DeGrom walk and signing Rodon because of the likelyhood of getting more innings pitched from Rodon. But resign Bassitt and Walker.
Cahna, Marte,McNeil is not scaring anyone, we need home run power, a legit 30+ home run bat
More power would be great. However, Mark Cahna produced 28% better than league average offense per wRC+ in ‘22 and can occasionally play CF and 1B in a pinch. That is not a 4th outfielder. Conforto is a complete unknown at this point and would be a better fit for a team that is not competing and does not need immediate results. Voggie is a platoon DH, that already counts as a bench player IMO.
Not enough to win it all
Like McNeil but cahna isn’t enough.
This is where some analytics can misrepresent value. Canha really wasn’t that valuable, and was actually bad the last month. His overall numbers of 24 doubles and 13HR in 460+ ab are not above average in any world. Some extra walks compared to most didn’t make up for that. He’s ideally a 4th OF on a good team in the sense of 400 ab or so, and if you can get better, you should.
I seriously hope the Yankees don’t sit idly by while these great pieces go off the board. They could really use a Rodon-type.
Cashman always acquired injured pitchers for reclamation projects…why not get one who’s actually elite-capable?
A power lefty that gives up very few HRs is desirable on any team, but would be a perfect fit for Yankee Stadium. Imagine a 1-2 of Cole/Rodon that gives you 450-500 strikeouts?
They’ll resign Taillon and call it an offseason bc “he checks all the boxes”.
I don’t see the Yankees making any moves until Judge is signed or off the board. I think the Yankees would be better going after a Turner then a pitcher. Their pitching was really good last year. Imagine Turner hitting in front of Judge. Changes the whole lineup.
Yeah, I tend to agree with you there. Early reports have Cashman as interesting in bolstering pitching. If he’s going to do it, might as well do it right.
But, if re-signing Tallion also netted us Turner, yeah, I’d be all for it.
Justin Turner, as in replace or trade Donaldson? If Judge gets re-signed, you won’t get Trea Turner. You might get Elvis Andrus as a placeholder until Volpe or one of the Oswald twins prove they are legit MLB day after day talent. Then Gleyber becomes your trading chip.
ELV: I’m under no illusions that the Yanks are getting T. Turner with or without Judge. I can see them going after a top SS if Judge signs in SF, but I do agree, none are coming to NY, imho, if they re-sign Judge.
This makes it especially true if Cashman does acquire a decent SP. They’re already looking at tier two of the LTT.
Gleaner will be free if Donaldson is also taken.
@clip
Agree, I think almost every team could use rodon, and the yanks are no exception
I don’t understand where Yankee and Met fans think their endless supply of cash is going to come from to make these suggested moves.
The Mets are already 10 million over the luxury tax, the Yankees are 10 under but the Yankees are going to re-sign Judge and sign Rodón, being 50 million over the threshold? The Mets will re-sign deGrom, add a couple more arms and be 100 million over?
Well, the supply of cash comes from the $7B in revenue they receive, which is more than sufficient to pay the paltry LT over the first, and even second, tier. Remember, that tax is only on the amount over the threshold, not the total. And, playoff profits pay for that plus, plus, plus.
They’re going to re-sign Judge and have to make another two-to-three moves. NYY need a LF, they need a SP, and a 3B other than Donaldson.
They were at $249M last season, so they will be past that, and they know this. Hal said that beyond Judge there were still several “significant” acquisitions that could be made. Plus, Yankees have a ton of money coming off the books over the next three seasons.
So, to tie this up & put a bow on it: do I think Rodon goes to the Yankees? No. Do I think think Yankees acquire any top-tier FA beyond Judge? No.
As far as the Mets, I could see them push the third tier and hit $300M. But I don’t believe that will be a perennial budget function. Cohen wants to win and knows he’s close.
Penalties increase every year they are over so I would agree that the Yankees could re-sign Judge but not much else unless they find a way out from under Donaldsons contract. Moving Donaldson and/or Torres and Ifk could free up enough space for an impact free agent signing… if they just re-sign Judge and roll with the same team as they did last year it’s not going to go well. I like Bader but his addition will just offset Judge falling back to earth.
And a payroll including Judge of $300 million.
Color me skeptical they’ll go there.
Yes, let’s all hope that the New York teams, LAD & SD can keep buying their teams year after year., while the rest of BB can watch it at a vast distance…
Interesting that he was considered too much of a risk for a QO, but could get $140M over five? Somewhere there’s an incompatibility.
That was after 21 not this yr
Yes, misread the piece, thanks for picking it up.
That’s the wsox way. they used Rodon’s arm fatigue as an excuse for letting a quality pitcher go so they won’t have to pay him what he clearly deserved. Arm fatigue just needs time to rest. It doesn’t require surgery or rehab. I hope Rodon does sign with the Twins. Then he could shove it down the Sox FO throat.
I’m not sure arm fatigue can last for eight years lol.
I thought he didn’t get a QO from the ChiSox because it was agreed upon when he signed a below market deal the year before.
Is it a poorly kept secret that the white Sox intentionally limited his innings to drive down his value? Or was the arm fatigue legitimate?
It would be so Mets-like for Rodon to have a banner season elsewhere, and then come to the Mets and get hurt repeatedly.
Getting hurt repeatedly is kind of Rodon’s calling card.
It would be great to see him on the Braves. However, the estimated contract cost seems limited to him or Dansby. I’d pass and extend Fried to build around him instead.
I want to read, “The Angels to Meet with Carlos Rodon”
Are you sure? There are a few other teams that Rodon will meet with. Should we really want to just read certain teams meeting with him?
If we want him on our team.
Yes. I am sure. I am an Angel’s fan and I want to read that my team is in on one of the best starting pitching options on the market. You can’t SIGN a player without meeting with the player or his agents, either in person or virtually.
It would also signal that Arte was willing to at least entertain signing starting pitchers that would require a deal longer than 3 years.
Later I want to read that the Angels SIGNED Rodon. Rodon as the #2 behind Ohtani makes the 1-2 punch pretty strong. It would also move a pretty good starter into the pen as depth/swingman.
Considering the total lack of depth the Angels have had for years and years that would be an awesome thing to have.
So yes, I am sure.
OK, that is good. I just wanted to make sure that you want to read that article since MLB TR seems to only write articles about the Mets speculative targets….blah blah blah over and over and over again.
Rodon doesn’t come without risk, but he’s going to get a ton because of the current market.
Debuted in 2015, reached 30 starts for the first time in 2022.
There is risk and then there is Carlos Rodon on a 5 or 6 year deal with an AAV of $30 or so million.
Zack Wheeler type reward.
Will take a big gambler to do so. Mets make sense!
Definitely a good fit for the Mets or another perennial big spender. Not so much for a small to mid-market team, just too much risk there IMO.
Over the past 2 seasons Rodon has the 3rd best WAR in both bWAR and fWAR.
The more innings you pitch, the higher the WAR possible. You will see starting pitchers just about every season with a higher ERA, FIP, and xFIP but 40-50 more IP get a higher WAR than some really good starters that only threw 130-140 innings.
I would rather have the guy that is really good (mid 2s ERA and FIP) for 130-140 IP per season, than a guy with a ERA and FIP around 4.00 but 180-200 IP.
And I’d rather not gamble roughly $30 million a year for 5 or 6 years on a guy who has missed 25% or more of his starts in 5 of the last 6 years mostly due to chronic issues with his throwing arm. With as fragile as it has been during his 20s, I would not want my team to be the one on the hook at that price to find out how it will fare in his 30s.
If the Mets will really run out 300MM dollar payrolls every year—good for them.
Now if they can get a FO head like Stearns you could really have something cooking with that many resources.
It’s not sustainable, but they have a good core now. So spending now makes sense.
Eventually you’ll have a 300MM bad team, sure.
But if this is Cohen’s toy and he treats it like that v. a money maker—that’ll be an interesting thing to see. I wouldn’t give Billy Eppler that blank check but would be cool to see a top exec there with a wide open budget.
Eventually Cohen is going to want to turn a profit. I don’t see him as this unending wallet, but in the short term, I think he’ll spend like a drunken sailor.
The Mets turned a profit of $153 million in 2021. Cohen has changed the whole organization up and down to make money. He is in line to build a casino in the Mets parking lot. Assuming he is losing money is wrong. He didn’t gain a net worth of 17 billion by accident.
Lease payments & employees cost more in the city of New York too.
He’s not running great margins churning out a 300 million dollar payroll + luxury taxes with all the other expenses he has going.
He has 17 billion dollars so he doesn’t need to squeeze a tidy profit out of his baseball team . Mega Yachts aren’t the best way to deploy capital either but people enjoy what they enjoy.
If that’s baseball for him then who knows.
Never said he was losing money,but if he pays the lux tax penalty every year, he certainly will be.
He could drop $100m a year on the Mets for a decade and all told it wouldn’t cost him 6% of his net.
Takes a lot of the cachet out of winning, though.
You know what would be a Mets thing or another “Mets LOL” moment? Now that they have Cohen, MLB and MLBPA come to an agreement to have a Hard Cap&Floor system. That would be hilarious!
To be fair he is trying to build the farm, to the point where some have them as a top 10 ranked system. I think they truly see Alvarez baty Ramirez parada Tidwell Williams as big core MLB pieces. I think they’re not as high on vientos or Mauricio, and Allan they love but health makes him essentially a non factor for now.
I don’t see where Mauricio fits in the current major league construction. He is the one trade chip that they are willing to let go. I disagree about Vientos. There was interest in him at the last trade deadline and the Mets were unwilling to move him. He has the same minor league numbers as Alonso did and I would like to see them give him a shot.
@MFB
That’s not nice, take it back. You know what would be equally funny? If the Marlins sign Nimmo to a 6 year $150 million contract. You would have your favorite player locked up.
It’s amazing how much Nimmo’s numbers resemble Heyward’s before his big deal. I like Nimmo a bunch,but I think his particular skillset doesn’t age well.
Mets6986 – I hope you’re right, because I like Vientos. They could use a big power bat, and we know he’ll never be a high average guy, but with opposite field power like that, he’ll hit plenty of HR if he plays.
No matter how you slice it, Eppler got the Mets a 101 win season. He did what he was paid to do.
I think that in the next CBA the MLBPA might go for a $300 million hard cap that increases along with increases in MLB revenue and a $140 million hard floor that increases along with increases in MLB revenue as well as a contractual obligation for teams to spend 50% of revenue on what used to be called CBT payroll.
That would require MLB to open their books so the MLBPA could see exactly how much each team was making, not just the two that are owned by publicly traded companies.
Startling to see ESPN ranking the Mets farm system 5th as of mid-season.
Meanwhile Baseball America projects Megill and Peterson as their #1 and 2 starting pitchers in 2026 and Ronny Mauricio as their starting RFer despite never having played a game in the OF and a chronic .300 OBP through AA.
I could see Mauricio’s upside being like Albies. Poor OBP but can pile up counting stats. Not hugely efficient, but can create runs in different ways. That’s peak upside – he could also be far shy of that (along the lines of a AAAA player). So much variability with him.
@Ma4170 Albie’s a very interesting comp. In Albie’s favor is the .365 minor league OBP a skill he was partly able to carry to the majors, in 2017 and 2019 such that his career OBP. is a tolerable if low .322
A .350+ OBP from a 2Bman those two seasons was a nice prize in this era. –and that he’s a 2Bman is also in his favor. A 106 OPS+ from an above average fielding 2Bman… that’s a nice player.
I tend to see Ronny as a DH, if anything. His error rate is off the charts, hasn’t gotten better year to year, and with Baty and Vientos ahead of him at 3B by age and ability, he’ll be starting in the OF from scratch, if he can even play it at all, given the 0 games there in the minors and in foreign ball
Not a good rate basestealer, either. It’s the same deficiencies year after year with him: in the field, by OBP, and the unproductive SB/CS rate, all of which combine to worry me. I really, really hope you’re right, but the plonking sameness of Mauricio’s year to year numbers in those regards remind me a lot of Fernando Martinez.
It could very well be, which is probably why he fell out of the top 100. Maybe Amed Rosario is his more realistic upside.
JackStrawb;
ESPN favors NE teams. Always has. Always will.
They are to sports what CNN is to news.
I’m surprised people watch or read it it anymore. They keep it going in the men’s locker room of the club I work out at on 4 TV sets. It’s been years since I saw someone look at the screens.
ESPN has no cred. All I know is that Stephen A. Smith seems to sleep there. The man keeps embarrassing himself yet they keep him on day and night.,
Well, both Baseball America and Bleacher Report has the Mets’ farm ranked 8th. I think Fangraphs has them 10th. They’re a top 10 system now by most accounts – MLB’s rankings are always a little off in my view, they have them 14th. They have the four top 100 guys, and then a few others I could easily see on the top 100 soon (Tidwell, Williams, Allan if healthy). But we’ll see as so many prospects never pan out.
Shouldn’t teams be worried about the heavy work load he put on his arm last year? Especially with the injury history?
I know he’s a very good pitcher, but…..
Every player in the game has risks. Nobody would get signed if you always look for the negative.
I didn’t say don’t sign him. But are you telling me that 28 a mil a year for 5 years doesn’t make you pause a really think hard on this one?
All of the top arms have a cautionary tag on them. I would personally stick with Degrom and Bassitt. Degrom has a lot of risk but no one has his upside.Rodon also would cost the Mets a 2nd and fifth pick.
I agree
Lot of risk with Rodon, Verlander and especially deGrom. I don’t see how teams other than Yankees, Mets, Dodgers, Giants or Astros could assume that risk.
Out of Judge, Rodon, Verlander and deGrom, I expect Yankees, Mets, Giants and Dodgers to get one each. Unless Verlander returns to Houston.
I think it was reported that Verlander is off the table at Houston. Seems they’ve moved on
No harm talking with the guy
The Mets payroll already sits at $235 million and they still to fill two rotation spots, CF (or at least one OF spot if Marte or Canha move to CF), and a couple of Bullpen spots. Keeping deGrom and signing Rodon alone probably pushes them to over $290 million in payroll. Lets see if they set a new record this year
“Lets see if they set a new record this year”
I think they will. Cohen doesn’t seem like he has an issue spending money, and he knows he’d make a lot of it back (and then some) if they somehow won the World Series.
Is that $235 with or without Nimmo,deGrom,Bassitt,Walker,May,Lugo,Joely and Ottavino ?
@jvent Heh! I thought it was $226 million, without—at least, according to Roster Resource.
I think that might even be without Cano. Sheesh.
I think the 247 number in the article includes cano
Without
I’d imagine the Mets are going to be in constant communications with Jake, Verlander, Senga & Rodon in case their Olán A fails, they move quickly to signing their secondary choice(s).
They may be better off letting Degrom walk and getting a larger variety of pieces. They need Bassitt back IMO. I’d take a couple number twos over one huge name pitcher. When Degrom has had to win them a big game he often does mediocre. With Degrom and Scherzer proving you can’t rely too heavily on a pitcher or 2 come postseason, I think its best to consider other options. They were also both injured last year and I’m not too keen on Degrom making 30 to 40 mil to spend half the season on DL. I love the guy but you can’t be married to a pitcher just because you developed them and your fans like him.
@Rishi “I’d take a couple number twos over one huge name pitcher”
—Same, and if the Mets had listened last offseason they probably would have had the durability to surpass 101 wins, and have had starting pitching not dead on its feet in late September and during the postseason.
Love
Love to get Rodon back In San Francisco.
MLBTR predicts $140M over 5 years, $28M per year. I guess the annual salary math is there. Salary: he’s lefthanded (add $5M), he’s thrown 300 innings the past two years (add $5M) his ERA+ was 178 and 140 the past two years (add $10M), he’s under 30 (add $5M), only 3 FA starters more highly sought after (add the other $3M)…..there you have it, $28M per season, it checks out. 5 years? Is that right? Old guys Scherzer, Verlander, deGrom worthy of 3 year deals, younger guys get 5 years. Yep, that checks out too. There you have it, Carlos Rodon 5 years $140 million plus whatever the premium is on the insurance on his contract for his time on the IL.
A lot of teams would rather have an older guy on a shorter deal and he’s almost never pitched a full season so the injury history is a huge factor. He gets the big deal because of how good he is but there are things weighing down his earning potential a lot.
Most ins doesn’t pay out until you’ve had, what… 60 days on the IL? I think that’s the standard deductible. Used to be, anyway.
Projecting year by year, Rodon…
2023, 140 ip, 3.00 ERA,
2024, 125 ip, 3.20 ERA
2025, 110 ip, 3.40 ERA
2026, 90 ip, 3.70 ERA
2027, 65 ip, 4.10 ERA
I wouldn’t go near him at 5/140m. On the Mets I’d much rather have Verlander at 2/80m, if he’s available for that, rather than saddle myself with 2-3 years of little production for 28m per.
Curious is this your projection? I dont see a pitcher losing 85 innings in just five years especially one that threw 178 innings. You think he misses 7 starts and only makes around 24 starts compared to 31 this year (assuming a constant average of about 5.74 IP/S)? He is 29 going on 30 as opposed to 32 going on 33. Id bet on a 3 ERA but with a qualified IP count.
@-Purist- Yes, but my system is highly reliable (albeit hardly perfect), and in line with many others of good repute.
178 ip is an extreme outlier for Rodon, and outliers in terms of ip for pitchers often portends collapse rather than a newly discovered way of staying on the mound. Add in that he hasn’t come close to it since 2016 and it’s as much cause for caution as it is optimism.
Rodon, career, has averaged 115 innings across 7.37 seasons (pro rating for 2020), so projecting him for 140 innings isn’t pessimistic.
One thing that makes pitcher projections difficult to read is that pitchers tend to break, while hitters tend to bend. If you have a good pitcher and a good hitter both consistently putting up 5 WAR seasons, as of age 30 the hitter is significantly more likely to put up at least 2 WAR–declining but still of use, rather than simply absent from the field the way pitchers more often are. Having to average catastrophic failure in this format leads to projections that can feel counterintuitive and perhaps too neat.
Most pitchers fall off badly between 30 and 34, btw. It’s just the nature of the beast. DeGrom, Kershaw, the list is too long to make.
Btw, if you go to Baseball-reference’s “most similar by ages” for Rodon’s age 22-29 seasons, every single one of his most similar pitchers ran into trouble by age 30, if they even made it that far.
The Mets need durability—desperately. And at least three starting pitchers. As bad as he was at the end against the Braves and the Padres, I’d bring back Bassitt, but give him more time off so he’s not finished by season’s end. I’d sign Senga, and of Rodon, deGrom, and Verlander, Verlander looks like the best bet to be productive for at least two years, and healthy in October, assuming reasonable rest.
Fair enough, thank you for the explanation. I understand where you are coming from logically and follow it but I personally am going to err on the side of optimism for Rodon. All is fair though.
In my opinion this team is gonna go all out this offseason. I truly believe losing the NL East in that late series sweep to ATL left a very rotten taste in their mouth and destroyed their confidence heading into that wildcard series. It’s not like it’s just one season. They have been losing this division to ATL, Philly, and Washington for 2 decades. But last year was tough. When the narrative goes from winning 101 games to losing the division and not making it to the division series, the team and fans need a little something more. Especially with Degrom and Bassitt possibly leaving.
Kind of similar to the 03 Sox. That final lose what heart breaking. But in 04, they went out and go Schilling to help support Pedro. A solid #2 moves everyone back a spot and makes them better. Then the mid season trade of Nomar for missing pieces.
The Mets are there, they just need another piece or 2 to get over the top
The difference with the Sox comparison is that the Braves and Phillies are there too. NLE is tough. Mets could easily finish 1st or 3rd. And really, I know the Phillies were successful in that final WC spot, but I think that’s a real tough road in the playoffs.
No doubt. The NLEast is the new ALEast.
Like I said, a piece or 2 could be the difference. If not it won’t be long before we see a sell off, I think. Just MHO. Could be wrong lol
@VonPurpleHayes Agree the East is tough, but I’d bet serious coin that without a payroll over $300m, probably well over, the Mets will be nowhere near 1st place.
Say they got Rodon, and brought back Bassitt, Walker, and Nimmo. That’s an additional AAV of $80m to replace their major losses and it puts them for CBT purposes over the 4th LTax threshold, at around $306 million. They’re still missing an entire bullpen except for Diaz and the often-injured Drew Smith and his projectable 35 innings with a FIP around 4.50.
Is Cohen really going into the neighborhood of $350 million just to have a shot at the Braves in 2023, and when those commitments probably drive the payroll of the oldest team in baseball up another notch, to $375m in 2024?
The difference with finishing first and being the wild card is only winning two extra games in the postseason. I agree all three teams will be battling and it will be an enjoyable season for all three teams if it plays out that way.
It’s more than that. It’s about not being able to set up your rotation for those short series, and playing all those road games. It’s really tough, and I doubt we see the final WC have that kind of success again.
But if you beat the teams with their rotation set up in game one or two then the wild card team has the pitching advantage. Split games 1 and two and now you have your ace going up against their third pitcher.
Right, but that’s a big if. Time will tell, but I really think the new format will actually lead to less WC success.
Make that 3 decades. I really just feel like they need to start winning the division for morale. They have lost the division to ATL alone about 20 times the last 30 years. They are every bit as good as Atlanta if they brought back the same team IMO but Atlanta just seems more confident and Philly is gonna be pretty confident coming off a WS berth
I watched that whole ATL series. When you have a 3 game lead and two aces pitching the other team and their fans should be afraid of you. They only had to win one game. ATL didn’t look even slightly intimidated even with Degrom and Scherzer on the mound. Since ATL had won in 2021 I felt like Mets were weighing how well they played in a big series around October in a playoff atmosphere and they did poorly. IMO that hurt them in the wild card series. Their dugout looked like they lost the WS and it wasn’t even a playoff game. They all stood there in the dugout like ATL had just won the WS. How do you think that makes ATL feel about the Mets moving forward?
You do realize the Mets and Braves went 9-10 and the Mets beat them in crucial series as well. They both were very good teams and fans really don’t have a role on how intimidating anyone is. I would expect every major league player to be not be intimidated by any player and think they will succeed every chance they get.
Fans have no role in intimidation then why does the home team win playoff games well over 60% of the time? And I wasn’t even saying that. I wasn’t saying anything about how the season series went. I said the Mets were every bit as good as Atlanta. I simply said they were clearly more confident then the Mets. They were! Why wouldn’t they be? They were coming off a world series title.
The braves were intimidated by Phillies fans in NLDS. Go back and listen to interviews. It’s the first thing every one of them said practically. They were a loud drunk mass doing tomahawk chops, yelling at every Atlanta player.
He should be getting kg type deal Jay’s should inquire
Good job by the Mets to ensure all their pitching was leaving the same offseason. It was the perfect end to the perfect Eppler season, which always involves a faltering pitching staff.
How has Cohen not gotten Click on board?
We don’t know if Click is any better than Chaim Bloom.
You could’ve given Jeff Bridich the Astros and told him to just not F* it up.
Nevermind he probably would’ve. But just about anybody who didn’t come in and blow up all their successful systems and built core would’ve been A-OK there.
It would be nice to bag both Rodon and de Grom, really good news the Mets are talking to Rodon. LGM!!
NO!!!
Hey, they are changing up the titles from “Mets Interested/Considering [fill in the blank player name]” to a new addition of “Mets To Meet With [fill in the blank player name”. After all, no other team will be meeting with Rodon and no other team will be meeting with any free agent. It’s only the Mets that will be doing this, so only they will need these articles written about them. And of course, everyone needs to have these updates all winter long instead of actual news of transactions. The Mets know that they and their fans need to be in the spotlight. They know that they need to make the pages of the news in NY over the Yankees.
If I were involved with the Mets, I’d like to announce that I might be considering to purse a possible meeting with a person that will give me some benefit that I’m seeking. It may not happen or work out, but I’d like for everyone to know it.
@MarlinsFanBase have you taken notice of the amount of commenters on stories about the Royals or Reds or about 20 plus other franchises vs the number of commenters on a Mets, Yankees, Dodgers or a handful of others stories? This is a business, advertisers pay money when traffic grows. MLBTR more than likely encourages and at the very least is extremely pleased when writers submit stories on a selected few teams. Mets might not have as many fans as the Yankees, Dodgers, Red Sox, but they supplement their fans with a massive amount of haters. Mets articles draw a huge amount of comments, they are moneymakers for MLBTR
WampumWalloper;
ESPN tilts stories towards the large market Northeast MLB teams. It’s to an excess.
From what I’ve seen MLBTR covers stories as they break – including the Royals and Reds.
As for the number of comments – it doesn’t mean all that much as people like me tend to make multiple comments on stories we find interesting.
@WampumWalloper
MLBTR is a moneymaker period. It has nothing to do with what teams they write about. When you see these articles leaning one way or other, it’s usually a personal choice. There usually is a connection to the teams being written about all the time to the writers, investors, etc.
And let me point out something. What you say basically makes every organization’s marketing team irrelevant and a waste of money because the marketing team is supposed to make every article or region covered important to the consumers/customers.
So, should companies like E!SPN, MLBTR, FOX Sports cover all teams equally and have their marketing teams make everything they put out sellable? Or, should those media outlets just lean toward certain teams, and save money by eliminating their marketing team because they clearly are a waste of money since they wouldn’t need them any more?
I’d rather have Rodon over Verlander at this point, factoring in age and recent injury history. Rodon will be way overpaid. Really deserves 4 years 70 million but will probably get double that amount. These contracts are getting pathetic
Less $$ less risk than degrom
Rondon and tailleon equals degrom with less risk
More or less
@Mrski Even better, I believe. Figure 25 starts from each of Rodon and Taillon, and about 20 starts from deGrom
That’s 50 starts v 20 starts. Where is the deGrom rotation getting it’s last 30 starts from? Assuming both rotations have maxed out their payrolls, then the deGrom rotation is giving those last 30 starts to pitchers who don’t belong in an MLB starting rotation.
Keeping bad pitchers off the mound is often as important as putting good pitchers on the mound.