With the offseason fast approaching, MLB front offices have begun exploratory talks about potential trades. However, Andy Martino of SNY reports that teams calling the Angels about two-way superstar Shohei Ohtani are finding that the Halos have “no appetite” for discussing such scenarios at present.
It’s no surprise that plenty of teams would be interested in Ohtani, after he showed that his 2021 MVP season was no fluke. A year ago, he hit 46 home runs and threw 130 1/3 innings of 3.18 ERA ball en route to securing a unanimous MVP selection. This year, he took his pitching game to new heights, getting to 166 innings while lowering his ERA to 2.33. His offense took a bit of a dip, as he dropped to 34 homers in a similar number of plate appearances, but he cut his strikeout rate by more than 5% and had a better batting average.
That level of two-way production is perhaps unprecedented in all of baseball history, but certainly within the past century or so. Even Babe Ruth, who excelled at both hitting and pitching, didn’t really see those parts of his career overlap in the same way since he was a initially a pitcher who gradually took the mound less and hit more. Given Ohtani’s incredible and unique skillset, not to mention marketing opportunities, every team in baseball would surely love to have him on their roster.
In that case, it also stands to reason that the Angels would be loath to part with him. The fact that it’s even been a consideration is due to a few factors. First off, the team overall has been struggling of late, despite the contributions of both Ohtani and Mike Trout. They haven’t had a winning season since 2015 and haven’t made the postseason since 2014. Ohtani is also just a year away from free agency now and there haven’t any reports to suggest that there’s any momentum towards an extension. Furthermore, owner Arte Moreno is exploring a sale of the team, casting a great deal of fog over the future of the franchise.
These factors put Ohtani in a situation somewhat analogous to that of Juan Soto, another superstar who once seemed untouchable in trades until he wasn’t. The circumstances weren’t exactly the same, since Soto still had 2.5 years of control at the time he was traded from the Nationals to the Padres. However, the team was unable to gain any traction in extension talks with Soto due to the uncertain nature of that franchise, which is also for sale. These comparisons have led to much speculation about Ohtani following a similar path, and the club even listened to offers at the most recent trade deadline. But even then, a trade seemed unlikely and all deliberations were reportedly kiboshed by Moreno.
With the hot stove about to warm up again in short order, the Ohtani rumors will surely follow, though it seems the club is not on the verge of anything. Martino’s report indicates that the Angels are rebuffing efforts to talk trade scenarios. Instead, it is believed they will try to explore an extension and, if unsuccessful, open up trade talks at next year’s deadline. We also can’t really rule out the scenario where the Angels are competitive next year and decide to keep him past the deadline. After all, they were neck-and-neck with the Astros through mid-May this year before a 14-game losing streak dealt them a gut punch that they never really recovered from. With a few improvements and some better luck next year, getting within striking distance of the expanded playoffs isn’t totally out of the question.
As for this offseason, it’s always possible that their approach could change as it progresses, for a number of reasons. If a sale of the club is finalized, perhaps the new owners will tip the scales one way or another. Maybe they will be interested in giving out a huge extension in order to keep a marquee player around, or perhaps they’d be prefer to try a rebuild and keep spending low for a while, as happened when the Bruce Sherman/Derek Jeter group purchased the Marlins.
That is a great unknown which could potentially extend to the club’s other offseason efforts. As we saw with Soto, a murky franchise future can make a player reluctant to bind themselves into a situation they could later regret. Will that make it harder to get free agents to sign in Anaheim? If that is indeed the case, it will make it challenging for general manager Perry Minasian to improve a 73-win team in order to compete with the dominant Astros, ascendant Mariners and aggressive Rangers in the AL West.
Perhaps there are future scenarios where Ohtani becomes available. As we saw with Soto, a player is “untouchable” until everything aligns just right to make the unthinkable become reality. For now, it seems the Angels will kick any trade considerations down the road. But their hold on Ohtani lasts for just one more year, meaning something will have to give between now and then.
They should… my perfect Ohtani trade would be to the Jays for Manoah, one of their prospect catchers, and Gurriel. Plus a top 15 prospect
And why would the jays be giving up all that for a year of control of Ohtani? Answer they wouldn’t.
Manoah and his 4 years of control are worth nearly 3 times Ohtani and his one year of control by the way.
Jays have 5 years of control since Manoah is not a FA until 2028 season. The difference is Ohtani is equal to Manoah plus Guerrero in one roster spot.
I don’t care if it’s 4,5 years of control he’s still worth 3 times more than Ohtani. That comes from sites that do values not my opinion which is worthless like everyone’s else opinion.
Not worth even close to what Ohtani is.
Whatever team trades for him gets first dibs at extending him. That’s why
It’s have to be more than dibs for teams to give up a ton of value for him.
I accidentally reported you instead of commenting on this. Stupid fat fingers!
Dibs? Meaningless. He’s one year out from free agency. That ship has sailed.
No one is trading for Ohtani to “get first dibs at extending him.” No one.
Ohtani can go wherever he wants after next year. Just cause a team trades for him isn’t going to sway him to stay. He probably will end up with Dodgers, Padres or Giants if he reaches FA. I don’t see him playing in NY as he could have signed with them when he came over from Japan.
As good as Ohtani is that trade doesn’t make them better next year and definitely much worse after 2023.
Would need to be Moreno, Tiederman, Biggio, but chances are teams would be able to beat that.
Cardinals can load them up with young talent. Plus they could afford to pay him.
My question is—- Would Othani even consider playing in the Midwest???
That is a laughably very lowball offer.
Any Ohtani deal and your team is looking at a Soto type return.
Ohtani, argubably, is worth more than Soto since both pitches and hits at All Star levels.
Soto was traded with 2 playoff runs, Ohtani just one. Before you call something laughable maybe learn something
Doesn’t matter… you’re basically getting two players. And of course even that manoah package would obviously improve the Jays next year.
People always talk about the lesser player and prospects and the years of control like it’s one of the 10 commandments, and overlooking that many teams will trade that for a World Series now. Plus I always see people on here lowballing offers bc of limited years of control. Nobody really. Came close to predicting the haul Wash got for Soto, and they still may end up worse without him.
And like someone else said, it does help somewhat in terms of an opportunity to extend ohtani if you have him already.
Years of control is a significant factor. The return a team gets grows exponentially with each yr of service of the player they are trading. It is much harder to stomach leveraging the future for one postseason run. As fast as the opportunity to resign him that could b a negligible factor depending on how just how firm his stance is on testing free agency. I’m sure all baseball GMs have enough sources they know much more than we know as to whether a player is open to signing an extension at all.
@lambchop It’s really 3 potential playoff runs, isn’t it?
Why is it goob?
A) if a player wants to reach free agency that doesn’t help you re sign him, it’s not part of the value assigned.
B) trading Manoah and adding Ohtani would mean the jays would need to add 3 starting pitchers to their rotation since Ohtani needs a 6 man rotation.
Jays had 3.5 starters this year, have no real prospects to call up and are losing Stripling. I don’t know much but I can tell you that the jays would not do this deal, I can also tell you if they were willing the Angels would be all over it, it’s far from a laughable offer. No chance they get a player better than Manoah back for 1 year or ohtani
Ah apologies, I thought it was 1.5 years for soto, it’s 2.5 years. Thanks goob and donny
Saying it doesn’t matter doesn’t change that it does matter.
Actually, it’s 3 playoff runs for Soto. Ohtani is clearly better than Soto, but not nearly 2.5-3 x as good.
Soto may not be there for the third run since he will not do a team extension before he hits free agency since his Rep is Boras.
don’t be surprised if the Padres trade Soto in ’24 to recoup
some of their investment if he won’t extend with the Padres.
Like this deal? mlbtraderumors.com/2018/07/dodgers-to-acquire-mann…
Soto may not be there for the third run
===========================
Still the same thing. They either get three playoff runs, or two playoff runs PLUS recovering some prospects.
Trading for a player to “gain the opportunity to extend him” is just stupid, for lack of a better word.
It is just one year and one postseason shot. Soto was two plus years and three potential postseasons.
Ohtani for one year isn’t close to Soto. He’s not going to get traded anyway so your hotakes and comically bad trade evaluation is useless.
Manoah has pitched like a legitimate ace his first two seasons, Toronto isn’t giving that up for a year of Ohtani. Ohtani will surely test the free agent market regardless where he gets traded to (if he’s traded). I fully expect to see him in Dodger blue in ’24 if they stay out of the Aaron Judge/Tre Turner bidding. You can bet the Giants, Mariners, and Padres will all be in on him as well
I suspect If the Yankees lose Judge, they’ll move to Ohtani, or Soto the year after. Similar, those teams not named the Yankees who also wanted Judge and lose out will become leaders for Obtani’s services.
Ohtani for Manoah is a no-go given the exchange rate. MLB clubs pay their ballplayers in US dollars — and the Blue Jays are located in Canada, where 1 Canadian dollar is currently worth 73 US cents.
Blue jays pay USD and also hedge for currency fluctuations
ChuckyNJ thinks he’s smart enough to know something, but isn’t.
They will. He’s not going to be an Angel next year. Selling high on him is their only chance of getting trout in the playoffs. The organization is in a shambles.
Jays say ‘NO’. Easily.
Yankees for Peraza, Pereira, Gil, and a pitching lottery ticket. Yankees immediately extend Ohtani for 10/375.
No way anyone signs Ohtani past age 37
No matter who signs Ohtani, they are going to be locking him up until 38 or longer. He is so valuable that even if he only plays until he is 35 it would be worth it for the team that signs him. Starting pitchers often pitch well into their late 30s. See Verlander and Sherzer. Ohtani is not just a great starting pitcher. DH’s often play into their late 30s. Ohtani is not just a great DH. I am hoping that the Angels get a new owner in place and sign him long term. I want to be able to go to the Big A and see him for the next decade.
Even if his production falls off he is valuable to a team. He brings in a ton of fans in an international market. He has unique value both on the field and from a financial aspect.
METS
empty the farm. please!
Have you ever BEEN to Toronto? All Asians end up there eventually.
I would expect the Angels to hold on to Ohtani until there is a new ownership goup in place. The Angels have more flexibility with Upton and Pujols off the books. Ohtani is also part of that flexibility. He can be traded for a king’s haul or be extended and be built around.
Whoever buys is the Angels is going to spend $2 to $2.5 billion. If they choose to keep Ohtani, they are going to need to increase the payroll significantly to compete. If you ave going to spend that much on the team, hopefully you don’t skimp of the payroll. The Angels have notoriously committed $120M for 3 or 4 players and tries to fill out the rest of the roster wit the remaining $60M budget.
If Ohtani is traded, it will likely be to the Dodgers. They have the most prospects and have expressed a willingness to trade the prospects for superstars in the past. The Dodgers would have no problem extending him for $45M+ per year. He would still be closer to Japan and play for a winning team, which Ohtani desires.
They would never trade Manoah.
If the Halos have even the slightest bit of dignity and pride left, they will never let that man leave Anaheim. Same goes for Judge and the Yanks.
I’m gonna disagree about Judge. Keep him if the price is right but don’t overpay. He had an amazing season that he’s not likely to ever replicate and has been historically bad in the playoffs. That 35+ million per year could be better spent elsewhere.
I agree on the Halos keeping Ohtani unless they know he wants out. If he’s no coming back trade him now instead of the deadline to maximize the return.
Love Judge, But, I agree with your analysis.
Yankees have more than a few holes to fill: SS or 3B, 1B, OF, bullpen.
Giving Judge 350M may not be the wisest move especially since they also have Stanton’s big contracrt.
Unless traded, IKF and Donaldson are penciled in next season. Peraza and Volpe are also SS possibilities. Pen is largely in tact with Michael King returning from injury. 1B and OF are needs. They also did sign Cole to his mega-deal after the Stanton trade.
@Joe, yes. Look at Stanton. Yea, he’s injury prone, but his skill have decreased since his 59-HR season. Frankly, I’d rather the Yankees do a 6/300 than go into his later 30s. They won’t do that either since that will have significant impact on their self-imposed cap.
Has nothing to do with dignity or pride. It is all about dollars and cents. Ohtani is the most marketable player in baseball, bar none. His merchandise sales are by far the largest, his sponsorships are head and shoulders higher than any other payer, and on the days he starts more people come to games.
Moreno chose to keep him at the trade deadline because Trout was hurt and having Ohtani in the lineup guaranteed attendance and higher TV viewership. He didn’t care about the return in trade.
Judge is going into his age 31 season and is asking for 10 years and $350 million. He is guaranteed to decline from what was a career year. Give him a QO and move on. Spend that money on a couple younger players .
His offer is already on the table. He won’t get much more then he already turned down from the Yankees. He had a great year. But is now a year older and the decline is inevitable. He should have signed it unless he wants out of NY
Joe,the Angels won’t trade Ohtani now, and could get just the same, if not more of package at the deadline if they desire.
Why not try for a run at it next year w/Ohtani 1st half, if they spend some money this off-season, can’t hurt. Thanks
How would you feel If they traded Ohtani and signed Judge?
I would be on the Judge bandwagon pretty fast.
we have more holes to fill.
if the angels keep and extend(i don’t know whether he wants to) ohtani they have to spend ,at least, $250 mil salary for next 5 years to have a winning team. even then they must have a really smart f/o to spend $120mil wisely. i think trading him is the best way forward for a better future for the team.
Right now the Angels have $150 million on the books for 2023 include Ohtani and they only had 4 FA. They have plenty of room to spend. Getting up to and beyond the $233 million CBT threshold for 2023 is well within the teams ability based on revenue. No reason not to sign Ohtani long term as long as the new owner is committed to winning. I don’t think that Ohtani will sign long term if Arte is still the owner. Arte has shown he is more interested in banking profits than winning.
leftfield – “Getting up to and beyond the $233 million CBT threshold for 2023 is well within the teams ability based on revenue.”
What the team can spend is irrelevant. Moreno has a personal salary cap that is no where near the official luxury cap. The team owes $104m to three players in 2023 leaving about $85m to build out the rest of the team based on Moreno’s spending history. With the holes that exist, lack of depth, and BP issues, that is a recipe for another losing season.
The only hope is a sale of the team before the season begins to an owner who understands baseball and what it takes to win.
While I understand the thought process behind not wanting to sign with an unknown, the “unknown” factor may be preferable than actually Arte Moreno.
Arte paid some of his players, yes, but he didn’t care to surround them with talent and was more concerned about building around Anaheim stadium than building an actual winning team.
amen.
Angels lol
arch angel may strike you with his sword.
How can you quantify trade value on this guy? Something similar to a Soto trade?
Less because it’s only one year of control. They probably won’t trade him unless he demands it at this point. They probably still profit off of him quite a bit from jersey sales, tickets etc
Jersey MLB licensed products and therefore the revenues are split evenly.
There are non MLB licensed products that the Dodgers can sell and make extra money, but Jerseys are not part of that equation.
Yes! Ohtani has similar or greater value than Ohtani since he is a ”
two way player and plays @ All Star level on both sides of the ball
Any team giving is a ton for Ohtani will want him to sign and extension.
We all want things
More like the trea turner scherzer trade since ohtani is basically two top 10 players on each side.
consder the massive increase in revenue.
Talk about a NO NEWS story!
Why would the Angels trade heir biggest marketing revenue in the midst of a potential sale?
Of course they would like to extend him! But why would he sign anything, without knowing what plans the new owner(s) might have for the club?
I just hope the sales moves rapidly.
Why would the Angels trade heir biggest marketing revenue … But why would he sign anything,
===============================
You’re asking and answering your own question. The reason for trading Ohtani is because he might not want to sign.
Wish Giants would go all-in on Ohanti instead of Judge.
i agree. judge’s production will fall in sf.
Why not both? I was just thinking about it in my head. Judge can play LF, Ohtani DH and when he pitches he can either DH or just pitch. If we get back Rodon, the rotation has a chance to be extremely good with Ohtani.
SP1 – Webb
SP2- Rodon
SP3- Ohtani
SP4- Cobb
SP5- Wood/Descafani
Our lineup if we can trade for Ohtani & sign Judge:
CF – Mike Yastrzemski/Austin Slater
RF- Wade Jr./Luis Gonzalez
LF – Aaron Judge
DH – Shohei Ohtani
1B – David Villar/Wilmer Flores
SS – Brandon Crawford
2B – Thairo Estrada
3B – Jason Vosler
C – Joey Bart
I think the lineup could be much more improved if. we can get a SS and move Crawford to 3B and/or Thairo towards a Utility role. Bart was improving, Villar can also become a better hitter.
I get it our farm system isn’t as stacked and will probably be gutted with Ohtani trade.
You wait out a season and Ohtani costs you nothing but cash. Got to be the smarter play if prospect capital is down and cash availability is up.
Your lineup needs more JD Davis !
Cash and whatever you have to give up for him having a QO.
Which would be nowhere near the prospects required to trade for him now.
And that. Thanks
Do the Giants have the prospects to acquire Ohtani?
Angels would be smart to get a Soto or better return by trading Ohtani.
If they can get something like 6 top young prospects and young major leaguers, then it is a no brainer deal for them to do!
I love Ohtani, but the Angels do not have the roster to compete in the AL West right now.
The Angels need bunches of great young players: pitchers, infielders, outfielders etc.
If the Angels don’t trade Ohtani, then they give him a qualifying offer, which he rejects.?! And then walks and they get maybe 1 or 2 draft picks for him?!
It doesn’t make any logical sense.!
Maybe, they want to wait for the New Ownership to be in place?!
The Soto deal is a great precedent, since the Nats are also for sale and they, wisely, went for it.
Teams like the Dodgers, Yankees, Mets, Rangers, Dbacks, Giants may have the young players and prospects to make this kind of deal.
I think they can get two top 100, another system top 10, and a young decent current mlb player… can’t see getting more than that
You’re not getting a “Soto or better return” for a one year rental.
Hope the Angels hold on to Ohtani. He’s going to be an Mariner once he’s a FA anyways.
He has already turned down the Mariners once. The question is will he turn down the Dodgers
Well he picked the Angels so he really turned down the other 10+ teams that were trying sign him. But reports were it was between the Angels and M’s, and he chose Anaheim due in a large part they had a superstar in Trout on the roster. Seattle has a star quality player(I will not try to compare him to Trout) a deep rotation, a good farm system, and their books are pretty clean.
Padres were in the final cut of teams for Ohtani
The Angels will hold onto Ohtani until the trade deadline, at that point a new owner will be here and that will allow the new owner to convince him to stay.
If the Angels are not competitive next year, they can attempt to sign Ohtani to a huge contract with a 1 year player option. If the new owner can sell Ohtani, that may work. If they are competitive, no convincing may be necessary.
The Angels are not going to trade Ohtani before the new owner talks to him. Period.
ohtani’s salary will be $50 million or more. that makes appx. $125-130 mil on 2 players. can they build a winning team with the rest? i have doubts.
‘3 players’
aragon – $50 mil per??? The only way he gets that is if he signs a 3 year deal I would assume he wants more than 3 years, If he wants longer the AAV is sure to go down as well.
is he good enough to get $25 mil per season as a pitcher? is he also good enough to ge $25 mil as a hitter?
Unless the owner is willing to go all in, everyone should have their doubts. That’s something the new owner will talk to Ohtani about, and I have little doubt, the new owner will get that opportunity.
Ohtani wants to play for a team going for a Championship.
With the exception of Trout, the Angels have 2-3 years to go before they even approach that level of play as a team.
Arte would never trade him to the Dodgers, but…. Ohtani & Adell for May, Gonsolin, Lux, Vargas.
He’d never trade him to the Dodgers, but that is who Ohtani might sign with I. 2024.
Why would the Angels add Odell to a deal like that?!
It makes no sense.
SportsFan, probably just as an amusing kicker. That is not a bad haul for those 2 either way. I’ll take that deal all day as the Halo’s.
why not? he’s a football player. no use to them
Why not trade him to the Dodgers if that’s where the best trade offer comes from?
So Ohtani is coming to Seattle! It is happening!
or NOT
Not. He’s already turned them down once. If he leaves the Angels, I’ll yptkae the Dodgers over the field and I’d lay odds.
Well, technically, Ohtani turned everyone but the Angels down once. By your logic, he’s signing an extension.
Not true. There was no DH in the NL so he rejected the league. He basically had two choices, the Ms and rip the Angels. I correctly predicted this five years ago. I incorrectly thought he’d choose the Ms.
Since he wanted to play on the West Coast, the Ms are pretty much the only team he turned down.
And we had a sea change in Seattle.
Ohtani now knows more about the MLB.
so yeah, we got a chance…
And Halo11Fan has the safe bet…Dodger Blue…
And you compare to the Dodgers how? I’m not really sure how a 90 win season would be very enticing.
but the mariner still have the worst humanbeing as the gm.
I see.
Yeah, the extension of the designated hitter to the National League certainly changes the landscape.
Besides the Dodgers, who else do you see as a fit? I suppose a lot of this hinges on how well 2023 goes for the various clubs, roster construction during the next off-season, what teams are doing in free agency during this off-season, etcetera.
I’d like to see him go to the Mariners. Is there such a thing as too pitching-rich? He’d certainly fit on the Giants. Judge may change that, either way. The Giants seem rickety to me. Giants partisans I’ve tangled with seem to me to overestimate the health of their team. My impression—perhaps wrongly—is the Padres project to have an overextended payroll pretty soon. Athletics… obviously no. Diamondbacks, doubtful. Angels, even if they managed to field a competitive team this year, again, it’d be a miracle run, rickety, and probably not built for sustained success. He’s most likely not going back. Then again, Angels pitching seems to be in the best shape they’ve been in ages, and some unheralded minor leaguer or invitee could catch fire and change the landscape.
It’s going to be a west coast team, right? Most of us think that. If that’s the case, it’s gotta come down to the Dodgers or the Mariners. Giants or Padres being a way outside chance. At this juncture, there’s probably no way to make a solid prediction other than that the Mariners and Dodgers will be in the thick of it.
As far as who could trade for him, man, I wouldn’t. The cost would be too high, I’d wager, for one year. I think he stays in Anaheim until the next hot stove gets lit.
And there is still bad blood between the two teams. To a man, the Angels believe the Ms threw at Mike Trout’s head.
His salary will be paid for twice over merely in jersey sales if he goes to the Dodgers.
I don’t think he has an issue with jersey sales. Every kid in the Midwest has an Ohtani shirt or jersey. But he won’t leave the west coast by choice because that’s where he and the team can maximize most on his Asian heritage.
I don’t think his heritage has one iota to do with where he is playing now nor where he will play in the future.
He wanted to play on the West Coast. Why is not really important.
He could play for the Dodgers and wouldn’t even have to change his living arrangements. I’m not saying he’s going to leave the Angels, but there is no reason to sign with the Angels, but the Dodgers can give him everything he wants. Why would he song anywhere else.
In 2025, I’ll be surprised if he’s not playing for a Los Angels team
If I were him, Dodgers would be the ONLY other option!
We’ll clearly you don’t understand the abundance of the Asian population on the west coast and how it increases his marketability to both himself and the the team. His and the teams earning are substantially higher by staying on the west coast them by moving to any other part of the country. He wouldn’t get near the endorsement deals in Miami as he would in San Franscisco. He wouldn’t increase the gate sales as much either.
Guest678, F U =)
That is how much respect I have for YOUR opinion and intellect! Happy early turkey day ya little mutt!
I get it. Facts, demographics and economic influencers aren’t everyone’s thing. Some love to live in the grandeur and fantasy of baseball yesterday year and the belief in the 10 year $400mm contracts.
Yeah, thats it. Born and raised in SoCal son…Ohtani will bring MUCHO $$$$ ANYWHERE HE GOES!!!!
Guest678, stop being so focused on RACE you supreme freaking wierdo/idiot!!!!!!!
It was reported that Ohtani didn’t want to play on a team with other Japanese stars.
bleacherreport.com/articles/2747062-shohei-ohtani-…
You seem like a very level headed person. Not easily excitable at all. Probably drive a Subaru. Maybe even feel it necessary to have your pronouns in your email signature. And all that is ok. The world needs those who are chronically extra to make the rest of us seem normal at minimum.
Guest678, just shaddaapp already! I run a small business and educate certain people on life and baseball. Thank me and move on. Once again, happy early turkey day….
I don’t support small business.
I know. I’m holding your psych eval as we speak. I know everything about you practically
Guest678, I think you don’t have no clue about Ohtani. That is not the way he thinks. I think he truly appreciates that the Angels have gave him a lot of power in how he is used. I think he doesn’t really want to think about contract stuff. I think the Angels made a mistake when Ohtani said he was open to extension talks after his MVP. I think he just wants to focus on injury prevention, stamina and most of all baseball stuff. Keep in mind that when he sighed, he could have waited a year and became more of a full-on free agent. I think he is frustrated with the losing but there are a lot that he likes about the Angels. Part of this is that he enjoys the area likes Stassy as a catcher, likes Trout and enjoys his teammates. He won’t have to think about it.
Not sure where he ends up,I think that has a lot to do with who the new owner is and how soon it happens, and of curse how they play in 23. I think many people underestimate the Angels chances in 23 and also the Angels chances of keeping Ohtani.
I think the Dodgers have a huge edge. They are consistently great, he knows the area, and they have the money.
Why would he go anywhere else?
Actual, the people who care about race are also the people who typically care about pronouns. I don’t care about either.
That said, culture is important to people. He may want to stay on the west coast because it’s closer to home or because there are more pockets that share the same culture. It’s irrelevant why.
abundance of japanese food markets in oc may be a factor.
There are dozens of reasons he wants to play on the West Coast. I think it’s silly to speculate without more information.
Justin Hollander? Are you sure you have your ‘feelings’ focused on the right person?
Angels should trade Trout for loads and loads of pitching, sign Judge and extend Othani.
Trout has a full no-trade.
Trout is a great player with a huge contract with many years and a back issue as he enters his 30s. You might be surprised by the lack of the return.
Add payroll while not improving areas of need. Seem like a winning plan.
The Halos package Ohtani and Trout to the M’s for Abraham Toro. Toro plays multiple positions and hits a solid .196. This trade would relieve the Angels of two large contracts and also relieve them of pesky fans coming to the games and ordering beer and dogs. Trout might be able to beat out Jared “anybody got a valium?” Kelenic for left field. Ohtani could slide right into the rotation and when not pitching, possibly beat out Carlos “oye como va” Santana for DH. It’s win-win.
BPax – Am I sensing a little bit of sarcasm?
screw that. we’ll beat that by offering super slugger James McCann
Leave it to the tag team of Arturo and Minasian to do the dumbest thing possible, which be to lose Ohtani and get nothing back. They won’t be able to re-sign him ,or trade him for a decent return. As an Angels fan since 1961, there is nothing I can do but shake my head.
The dumbest thing possible is to trade him before a new owner buys the team.
The dumbest thing possible is to trade him before they have to.
No the dumbest thing would be to wait until it’s too late
If he starts the year slow or has a minor injury around the deadline that could really impact the return. The smart thing would be to take the guardians approach with Jram from last year.
Let a few teams know he’s available while negotiating with him, if he signs an extension all good, if he doesn’t you move him for the best package.
Wait until it’s too late? You mean don’t trade him. So the dumbest thing th3 Angels can do is not trade Ohtani?
That’s an interesting take.
Wait until it’s too late to trade him, ie the risk is not trading him now and his value lowers or plummets, there’s too much risk .
‘The dumbest thing to do would be to wait until it’s too late’
His value is not going to plummet at the trade deadline. His value will remain virtually unchanged.
If he gets injured and isn’t able to be traded, his value will plummet and the angels will get back only a pick for him leaving.
That’s a risk the Angels shouldn’t take, they should try to re sign him or trade him. Starting the season with him is a no win situation.
Sorry. Yes, if he gets hurt his value will plumet.
If he’s healthy, his value will remain unchanged. You are getting Ohtani to get into the playoffs and advance. That’s not going to change.
No his value will not unchange, every day he plays for the Angels he is not playing for another team.
His value over 162 games + playoffs is higher than 60 games plus playoffs
PLUS more teams will be in play looking to acquire him Vs at the trade deadline. Which will drive up his price
And I think you are wrong. Teams that are trying to earn a payoff slot and teams that want to advance in the playoffs are going to be clearer in July than April.
The Angels think they can make the playoffs, the Rangers probably don’t feel they are there yet.
If the Angels fall and Texas rises, he’s going to have a lot more value to the Rangers in July than he does in April.
This year the same was true with Baltimore and the Phillies. If Ohtani was a free agent after 2022 and traded, he would have had more value to Baltimore and the Phillies in July than April.
I’m fine with the angels keeping him, he picked them so he wants to be there, but then work out an extension before the seasons starts.
Teams now may believe they can compete (ie like Detroit and Texas last year) so more teams are looking to compete before the season than at the deadline.
Secondly teams now can go to their owners for money, which is harder to do at the deadline.
More teams yes, but with time comes clarity and with clarity comes intensity.
I feel one way, you feel another. Neither position is absurd and both positions are valid.
There are times, not many it seems, where people can agree to disagree.
As a Mariners fan I gave up fearing the Angles a few years ago. They find a way to be under 500 consistently.
MortDingle – and that is why you are in the stands and not in the field.
He’s right though. There is no reason to fear the Angels until they start winning, just like there was no reason to fear the Ms. Today the Angels fear the Ms.
Both you are dead wrong!
Professional athletes collectively and singularly do not fear another team.
Then to top it off the Angels had a winning record versus the M’s this year.
Would you prefer respect? The Angels now look at the Ms as a threat.
I’m not into semantics. I think everyone knows what the word fear means when it comes to sports. The Angels an not too worried about Texas and Oakland right now. The Ms are the team the have to beat.
You should respect every team and fear none.
Ok semantics. I don’t play that game. He wrote “as a fan”. As a fan the Rangers and A’s don’t scare me. The Ms do.
If we beat out the Ms, I like the Angels post season chances, if the Angels don’t, then I don’t. I fear the Ms.
Why would anyone invalidate how a fan feels and who a fan fears.? He doesn’t fear the Angels and based on history, he has no reason to fear the Angels in the same way I fear the Ms.
There is a reason the game is played on the field and not on paper or on a computer!
Other than some ardent Phillies fans, how many thought they’d be doing this well?
Other than some ardent Braves fans. how many thought they’d win it all last year?
Ohtani still being an Angel had nothing to do with Minasian who had a trade lined up at the trade deadline. Moreno nixed it.
This is all on Moreno.
The Angels will at least get a draft pick for Ohtani if he is not traded at all and they can’t get an extension done. If a new ownership group comes in and decides to trade him, they will at least get a couple of good prospects, so that would not be a total loss either.
Ohtani is basically Vladdy and Manoah in one player. Put up almost same stats +|-
Contract status aside you may want to use that as a starting point in hypothetical trade scenarios.
There is no hypothetical. The Angels are NOT trading Ohtani this off season!
Hey 1972, we agree on something. There is no way Ohtani is traded this off-season.
Halo11Fan – I guess you owe me a beer now. LOL
Unless the sale of the team goes through. There is no way that Moreno moves him. He already blocked a trade at the deadline this season.
Vlad and Manoah have combined years of control left.
Vlad is not going anywhere what with his father’s high status as a former star of the Expos and the affection the fan base holds for the son and family.
Ohtani is the perfect trade chip. Moving Trout is overkill, moving Ohtani is good baseball sense.
Trout will only go if he wants out and he’s given no indication for that
He’s signed for 30M in ’23, that’s not a cheap rental, it’s likely Ohtani would only be moved at the deadline to a contender for what would be a few prospects.
I’m sure the Angels could pry away a few good prospects if they end up trading him but the hope is that the team gets off to a good start and makes a run at the playoffs, in which case Ohtani will be in an Angels uniform at the end of ’23.
If they win it all, he might stick around, if they make the playoffs, he might stick around, but I imagine he will be looking at the offers in FA. Judge’s deal will be a good benchmark for what Ohtani will be offered.
Well, not right now, but of the Orioles offer Boog Powell’s home cooking, that might get the ball rolling
The scenario where Ohtani could be traded is when a new owner takes over. I don’t think there is any possibility of a trade or even a serious discussion before then
As Moreno has said multiple times, players like Pujols, Trout, and Ohtani put behinds in seats and eyeballs on TV screens which seems to be more important to him than winning.
Doesn’t make any sense to trade him right now. Angels have a pretty good core and a lot of players that might have rebound years. They should target starting pitching and go for a lot of one year deals, see if things are working out and reevaluate at the trade deadline.
Angels are just a bad organization. If they have any brains, which they don’t, they’d trade both Trout and Ohtani and whoever else they could move and rebuild that farm once and for all.
If you had any brains you’d realize that Trout has a no trade contract.
No need to be mean to the guy. It’s an honest mistake. Although very unlikely Trout could ask for a trade sometime in the future and negate his NTC. Nolan Arenado had a no-trade clause too!
If you write “if they have any brains”, you deserve it.
It’s like writing, “Your an Idiot!” Laughably stupid ignorant insulting comment deserve to answered harshly.
Arte had a chance to get an incredible return for Ohtani at the trade deadline when Minasian had a deal agreed to. Arte said no. Not because it wasn’t a good deal, but because with Trout injured the fans would have less reason to come to the ballpark or watch games on TV. ALL he cares about is making money, not winning. I cannot wait until he sells the team and rides his sorry behind back to Arizona.
I agree that Moreno won’t trade Ohtani this winter. Not for baseball reasons, but for marketing reasons. New owner or not, there is not enough time to convince Ohtani that the Angels will win soon. So I believe he will not be an Angel long term unfortunately. If my speculation is correct, I think the right strategy is to trade him this winter instead of at the deadline next season because there is more value in a year of Ohtani than two months of Ohtani. But Moreno has shown he doesn’t think in terms of building a winning team. The only hope is for a sale to happen before next season, which is unlikely considering how long the Nats have been in limbo with a sale. But a new owner would still have a mountain to climb of convincing Ohtani they are serious about winning now.
If Ohtani goes elsewhere, I predict the Giants.
Dodgers or Padres when it is his choice.
He is not leaving So Cal..
Assuming the team sells in time, I think the Dodgers are the most likely. Ohtani wants to play for a winner and he has expressed a strong desire to play on the west coast in the past. The Dodgers also have deep pockets and are willing to take risks with big contracts. I don’t think Moreno would cooperate with trading with the Dodgers (he sees them as his marketing competition) but I think a new owner should.
They honestly should attempt to clean house and rebuild. Between him and trout, they could build a dynasty of prospects. Instead of having 2 generational superstars, you could actually build an entire team.
Like the Braves.
Would Ohtani go to Atlanta?
Ohtani is a game changer. How many teams get to the World Series? How rare is it? Many teams dont even get close in a decade. How small is that window? Point is, if your team is close, and you believe you’re right there, this youngmqn makes you instantly better on both sides of the ball. He is the real deal and is a force in the game. If you want to win now, you trade whatever it takes to get him.