November 23: Jon Morosi of MLB Network says that the meeting went well and that the Giants are expected to make an offer to Judge soon.
November 21: The Giants are planning to sit down with the market’s top free agent this week, as Jon Morosi of MLB.com tweets they’re expected to meet with Aaron Judge. Mark Feinsand of MLB.com reports the parties have a sit-down scheduled for tomorrow (on Twitter).
It’s notable but entirely unsurprising to see the Giants in the market for Judge. They’ve long been speculated as perhaps the top threat to the Yankees for the reigning AL MVP’s services. That’s both a reflection of the slugger’s ties to Northern California and, more importantly, to the abundance of financial breathing room at the Giants’ disposal. As MLBTR’s Darragh McDonald explored this afternoon, the Giants are as well-positioned as any team to make a major splash on the open market.
San Francisco’s 2023 payroll commitments are presently estimated around $133MM, per Roster Resource. They’ve opened seasons with player spending upwards of $200MM in previous seasons, and while those heights were reached before the pandemic, they’re still well shy of last year’s $155MM Opening Day figure. The long-term books are almost bare, with just over $20MM in guaranteed commitments for 2024. By 2025, the club has only a $3.5MM player option for Wilmer Flores on the ledger. In that context, it’s easy to understand president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi declaring at the GM Meetings earlier this month that “from a financial standpoint, there would be nobody that would be out of our capability.”
That includes Judge, who’s expected to land the largest deal of the offseason. He set the AL home run record with 62 home runs and hit .311/.425/.686 through 157 games. It’d have been nearly impossible to draw up a better platform season, and while Judge certainly can’t be expected to replicate that kind of production, he’s now a career .284/.394/.583 hitter in over 3000 MLB plate appearances. Few players are more imposing offensive forces. Judge also typically rates as an above-average defensive right fielder and played reasonably well over 632 2/3 innings of center field work for the Yankees this past season. He’d probably be a better fit for the corner in spacious Oracle Park, but his play in right field would upgrade an outfield defense that was among the league’s worst this year.
MLBTR predicts Judge to land an eight-year deal worth $332MM; the $41.5MM average annual value would rank second all-time, while it’d be the largest overall guarantee for a free agent in history. While the Yankees and Giants are generally perceived as the favorites in the bidding, he’s also been linked to the Dodgers. Feinsand first reported last month that L.A. was considering the possibility of jumping into the Judge market while contemplating kicking Mookie Betts into second base. Jon Heyman of the New York Post reiterated the Dodgers’ interest last week.
Of course, there are myriad possibilities for the Giants (and other big-spending teams) beyond Judge. San Francisco has also been connected to the top free agent shortstops available — Trea Turner, Carlos Correa, Dansby Swanson and Xander Bogaerts — as well as center fielder Brandon Nimmo. San Francisco also has needs in the bullpen and could look to make a splash at the top of the rotation. There are a number of avenues for Zaidi and his front office to explore, starting at the very top of free agency.
Samuel
All Giants. All day.
LOL
foppert
Time to give it a rest maybe.
CaptainJudge99
I hear the Giants have “Stupid Money”
Gothamcityriddler
All idiots. All day. Ahahaha!
kam3hameha
Yankee fans saying Astros fans are full of bandwagoners? That’s the funniest thing I’ve ever read. Yankee fans are the KINGS of bandwagon. “This team has won 27 World Series, let me jump on that train even though I wasn’t even born the last time they last won”. I’m exaggerating, but not by much. That’s why you see Yankee fans all over the country, many of whom have probably never even been to New York much less lived there. Do the Astros have SOME bandwagoners? Sure. Should Yankees fans be pointing that out themselves without looking in the mirror? Absolutely not. At least Mets fans have some respect for themselves by choosing to root for the team in their city that doesn’t get to claim “27 CHIPS”.
TheDogDays
Another Astro fan calling other fanbases bandwagoners with zero evidence, just silly insults.
Simply check out Astro attendance figures before they started winning….and this debate ends lol.
DakotaJoe
there is almost a zero chance Judge signs with the Giants. why would a HR hitter like Judge want to go to that ballpark and play for a team that needs so many pieces? if he’s looking for only money and wants to become somewhat irrelevant real soon then it’s a good idea.
TheWomanWithTheGlassEye
Didn’t you just answer your own question? Totally contradicted yourself.
whyhayzee
Yes, because the Giants hardly have any legacy of great players or championships.
DakotaJoe
do you understand sarcasm?
DakotaJoe
the Giants have a great legacy, but Judge is playing now. do you really think he is going to sign to play for a team that needs so many pieces? believe me, I’m just a baseball fan and not a Dodger fan trolling here. the Giants are in a tough division and will be looking up at LA and SD for the a few years. I just don’t see Judge signing for them.
judgementday99
it all depends if he’s AROD and the Rangers….and just in it for the money, or he actually wants to win soon, if he wants to win soon, its down to NY or LA. SF just wants a draw to get fans in the door…
Salvi
Texas Rangers when ARod signed: Alex Rodriguez, Ivan Rodriguez, Raphael Palmeiro, Frank Catalanotto. Thats a LOT better lineup, than what Yankees will be fielding in 2023.
But, sure only NY and LA can win championships. Oh wait, between them, those two teams have 1 champion since 2010. Yankee fans and their egos. Lol.
TheWomanWithTheGlassEye
Money talks and the Giants aren’t looking to flip the roster into a contender in one offseason. Plus, Judge’s contract, no matter where he signs, will be a lengthy deal. That will give whatever team he signs with time to fill out a contending roster around him.
Balk
The Giants, especially with new playoff format were only 8 wins behind the Padres, 6 games behind the Phillies, with the right pieces, especially Judge and or a top end shortstop, another top rotation arm, they can make those 8 games up. People saying he wants to play for a “contender”, well the Giants would be there come next season.
Balk
Giants were 6 games behind the Phillies and 8 behind the Padres bro. They have to replace Rodon, or resign, get a middle infielder, and with Judge I think they can make those up. In the next two years they can have a solid team with the right pieces. It’s not like they have a ton on of money on the books. They can easily buy what they need now with the few commitments on the books
Dynasty
3 championships if you remove 2017 Cheatstros and 2018 Cheat Sox
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
You do realize that SF is a season away from winning the division (2021). Using the winning argumemt is stupid. Any team can win any given year and the Giants have shown to be relevant more than some other teams.
KozmosTerezniak
I feel like the division talent will mean less now that schedules will not be as unbalanced anymore with all teams playing each other starting next year.
Rsox
The AL East is the toughest division in Baseball and they sent 3 teams to the playoffs this past season (as did the NL East for that matter). “Looking up at LA and SD” doesn’t mean the Giants can’t make the playoffs and Judge would be a huge part of getting them back into the postseason
Rsox
Except what have the Yankees won with Judge? In 6 full seasons they have 4 early exits from the playoffs sandwiched between 2 ALCS losses. The Yankees and Dodgers have accounted for exactly 1 championship since Judge came in to the league. If it really came down to wanting to win soon he would be signing with the Astros
slider32
The playoffs are outlier, pitching is the key.
Hexbreaker
@ReedSox
“Oh wait, between them, those two teams have 1 champion since 2010.”
And that one was a 60-game season. So really, zero champions.
Hexbreaker
@Rsox
One 60-game season championship. So really, none.
Balk
Haha
Rsox
Thats sort of the point. Pigeonholing the entire MLB to two teams that haven’t won anything really recently is a truly false narrative
User 401527550
The Giants with Judge are better then the Yankees without Judge. The odds of Judge staying in NY are dwindling by the day.
TheDogDays
But either way, the Yankees will be better than the Mets… again.
User 401527550
What world were you living in? 101 beats 99 any way you look at it. Without Judge the Yankees were a .500 team last year. Nice job trying to troll but it’s 2022 and not 1922. Living on championships from eras ago is just funny.
tstats
The Mets won more than the Yankees last year just a reminder
TheDogDays
Not sure how giving my opinion is “trolling”
The world I live in includes actually winning a division and who got further in the postseason, not on the Yankees losing a few meaningless games to Texas on the last few days.
As if the Yankees wouldn’t have won more games if they played the Nats and Marlins 40 times…
TheDogDays
Just so you know. The Dodgers won more games than the Astros… but they didn’t have a better year…
User 401527550
They would have finished third in the NL east. The last time the Yankees won a season series vs the Mets was 2017.
User 401527550
Great neither team has anything to do with the Mets and Yankees. The Astros won the World Series and the Yankees did not. Both of them were better then the Mets and Yankees.
TheDogDays
Um if they were in the NL East, they would be playing the same schedule as the Mets. I’ll play that division anyday .
Mets vs AL: 9-11
User 401527550
The Braves would have beat up on them. The Phillies would have at least split. The NL west would have tore the Yankees up. The Marlins would have been tough on Yankees with their pitching.The only teams to have a winning record against the Mets was the Padres2-4 and Braves 9-10. Didn’t hear Yankee fans talk about easy wins when the Orioles won 50 games a year over the previous 5.
TheDogDays
I’ll repeat, Mets 9-11 vs AL
Of course the Orioles were lousy last few years, what’s there to talk about. It was obvious.
Maybe the Yankees would have struggled against the Braves, but they sure as hell wouldn’t be swept with the division on the line lol.
User 401527550
Is that why the Yankees won 90+ games a season or is that an excuse for everyone else winning but the Yankees? Did the Astros sweep the Yankees in the playoffs? Kind of an odd to bring up getting swept in a crucial series.
TheDogDays
Getting swept by the Astros isn’t good. But they ya know won the World Series and were the best team.
Getting swept by the Braves and humiliated by the Padres is a little different.
The Mets get stomped by the Astros too so an odd thing to bring up…
DaddyDan
Didnt Mets choke down the stretch again…
Hotstovemelts
Hahaha you’re a trip. I usually have respect for most Mets fans and their baseball intelligence. You allow your sad hate for the Yankees to blind you into moronic rants that make you sound absolutely foolish! And you will almost certainly double down to remove all doubt!
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
I don’t know. Still think Judge ends up as a Yankee
User 401527550
You stated that the Yankees wouldn’t get get swept in acrucial series and they most certainly did. How did the Padres embarrass the Mets by winning 2 games in a three game series. Your the reason why people hate the Yankees. Their fans say stupid things.
User 401527550
No. They won 101 games and tied with another 101 win team. Do you all even know why choking means. The Yankees having a twenty game lead at the break and being the worst team in baseball for two months would have been choking.
User 401527550
You all are talking crap and I’m the one delusional. You all are a trip. I didn’t say anything about how good or bad the Yankees were. You all started saying how great the Yankees were and how bad the Mets are but turn it around like you all are the victims.
TheDogDays
No, I said the Yankees wouldnt get swept by the Braves when one win would win the division. I didn’t say they would never get swept ever!
Apparently, you think Yankee fans say stupid things….because you’re not smart enough to understand what they say.
Most Met fans were completely disgusted by the Padre series, particularly that last game, but if you were happy with it…. Then good for you lol.
User 401527550
LOL you said I’m an idiot by generalizing Yankee fans but do the same about Met fans thoughts. Are you happy with how the Yankees finished getting embarrassed by the Astros? Most Yankee fans are just as mad as Met fans. Sorry you got your feelings hurt because the Mets won more games then the Yankees and your scared the Mets owner will own NY baseball for the foreseeable future.
TheDogDays
Lol how did I generalize Met fans? Saying MOST Met fans were obviously unhappy (which seems obvious) isn’t the same as questioning their intelligence. Geez
Sounds good, you guys can keep winning more meaningless games and wild cards , while the Yankees , like usual win divisions and go further in the playoffs. Deal! Lol
I mean you are happy with the Padre loss amazingly so I understand your low standards!
User 401527550
Most Mets fans are happy going from 77 wins to being World Series contenders. Most Mets fans are extremely happy with the direction of the franchise. Baseball playoffs are a crap shoot. The best team rarely wins the World Series any more. All you can ask is for a chance. The Yankees haven’t gone deep in the playoffs. When is your last World Series appearance?
TheDogDays
Oh well congrats, the Yankees never have to rebound from being that bad so..
Haven’t gone deep in playoffs? They were just in the ALCS genius lol. Umm for you guys happy with getting smoked in the early round, that means the Yankees were one of only four teams left.
I do love you grasping at the meaningless win total though, that’s pathetic.
User 401527550
They were only barely over .500 from 2013 to 2017. What are you talking about?
TheDogDays
Barely over .500…. By 26 games lol
It’s funny you had to go back a few years though. In your research, when’s the last time they won 77??!!
TheDogDays
52 games, my bad. “Barely over .500”
User 2079935927
Typical bitter Mets fans response. Yankees have more championships they know what they’re doing.
notnamed
i lok at trools this way. if you’re not on your own website, you’re trolling. so basically, we’re all trolls.
notnamed
no auto correct
thecoffinnail
One hitter does not mean the difference between a .500 team and a division winner. Sorry but no. A true ace leading a rotation is capable of that. He makes 32 starts a season. Especially a corner OF. Do you think the Yankees would put a mop in RF if they didn’t have Judge? More than likely it would be Stanton. If you have a problem with him as your everyday RF you should have a problem with Judge. Stanton is Judge with a couple more years on him.
goastros123
TheDogsDays is a Yankees fan? That explains everything.
User 401527550
Keep living off of championships from 100 years ago. Don’t give Me the 90’s when half their team was using steroids.
goastros123
Mets, TheDogDays is in complete denial about the Yankees cheating in 2015 and part of 2016.
goastros123
Just ignore him, Mets6986?.
TheDogDays
Not in denial at all, don’t make up things I never said. Show me where I said that.
I’ll recap my earlier discussion with Goastros:
Me: Astros have a lot of bandwagon fans
Him: no, I had a friend who watched Mike Scott.
Me: showing him actual Astro mediocre attendance figures before they started winning.
Him: you’re delusional! Lol
Me: those are facts, how am I delusional ?
Him thinking (um I have no idea, I’ll end the discussion)
To summarize: you’re an idiot
TheDogDays
I respect Mets69 opinion, it’s a sports board where people might disagree. We’re from New York area, so we don’t cowardly block people that have different opinions. Lame— if you want to just talk to people that only agree with you, then you’re in the wrong place.
Is that a Houston thing?
goastros123
A more accurate recapy:
TheDogDays: Astros fans didn’t exist until a few years ago.
Me: That’s not true.
TheDogDays: Did you know the Astros were in the NL? LMAO. I don’t think you did.
Me; I know more about the history of the Astros than you. Did you know they were in the NL West before the NL Central? I personally know some one who been watching them since the 80’s. I started following in 2005.
TheDogDays: THAT’S NOT PERSUASIVE ENOUGH! DO BETTER THAN CITE SOME ONE YOU KNOW! Attendance record says they had low attendance.
Me: But there are lots of people in Houston who like my buddy: aka they’ve started following the Astros when they were still in the NL. I know this because I’ve lived in Houston for all of my life.
TheDogDays: ATTENDANCE RECORD.
Me: Those attendance records don’t tell you the follow story and you wouldn’t have known that unless you lived here. My life experience proves you wrong. Bye.
In summary: you made an inaccurate claim. When I pointed it out, first you decided to assume out of sheer arrogance that I knew nothing about the history of the Astros. When I proved I did, you quickly dropped that BS. Then you brought up attendance records to justify your ridiculous claim, which wasn’t “there were bandwagoners”. No, you claimed Astros fans were non-existant a few years ago. Your inaccurate recap moved the goalposts. Why should ANY ONE on this site take you seriously?
TheDogDays
Ok well people with a brain would clearly immediately realize that I didn’t mean they had NO fans lol. I showed you specific attendance marks that showed their attendance figures were poor, which you haven’t been able to refute with facts.
I’m sorry, but please show me what your “proof” was. You’ve given nothing factual, except your opinions and sensitivities which is why people like you lose these discussions constantly .
“Now that’s how you debate!” —Will Ferrell
TheDogDays
Houston is the 4th largest city in the USA.
Where the Astros ranked in AL (just AL!) attendance from 2010 to 2015
10th, 13th, 16th, 13th, 12th, 11th
I rest my case.
WarrenSpahn
I don’t know how the Yankees could let Judge get away. The NY media would be so brutal on Steinbrenner the younger…
Hotstovemelts
He is gonna call Samuel so they can get together and have a mute monster party while making up new ways to lie to throw shade at other teams because well…. they’re Astros fans
dobsonel
They were a below .500 team with Judge over the last 101 games of the season.
kam3hameha
I would have responded to you up there instead (I did read your reply to me) but I’ll do it here. They also finished 15th in attendance in 2017 (year they won the World Series). Historically they’ve been middle of the pack and at times creeping into the top ten. It’s not as drastic as you’re making it seem. Would it be nice to be number one in attendance every year? Heck yeah. But everyone knows that teams who are successful typically see an uptick in attendance. If you don’t know that you don’t know sports, which clearly is the case with you. There’s also other factors at play. Let’s look at the TV numbers then let’s talk. The Yankees have had a few down years in attendance themselves. Guess that makes them bandwagoners too huh? I’d like to see the Yankees have multiple 100 loss seasons in a row and not see even a slight change in your attendance figures. The last few years we’ve been top ten in attendance instead of being just outside of the top ten. Wow, what a drastic change!
TheDogDays
Ridiculous comparison but this is over.
Of course , there are bandwagon fans and attendance upticks during successful times. No need to state this- it’s obvious.
But to be THAT BAD during the down years is complete proof of my original point. Hell, their attendance was even lousy in 2015 when they were in the playoffs.
We can agree to disagree, you can ridiculously think the Astros have some super strong, loyal fan base but the rest of us aren’t fools and we can read the numbers.
kam3hameha
I’ve never seen them worse than 16th in attendance. Again, middle of the pack. How is it “THAT BAD”. I’m not saying the Astros have the support of the Yankees. They also don’t have the payroll, the market, etc… Yet they keep beating up on you guys. I’m starting to think that’s why you’re so gung-ho on this “Astros have no fans, all bandwagoners” crap. It’s all you can say to help yourself sleep at night that the Yankees just have no answers for the Astros machine. You’re looking at strictly attendance numbers, which again, have the Astros ahead of over half the league or much better consistently. You’ve made no points, you just think you have.
goastros123
“We can agree to disagree, you can ridiculously think the Astros have some super strong, loyal fan base but the rest of us aren’t fools and we can read the numbers.” – 1. we don’t think the Astros have a loyal fanbase, we know they do via interacting with other Astros fans. 2. You’re the only person I’ve ever seen on this site, on twitter, on facebook, etc actually express the view point there are zero loyal Astros fans and be delusional enough to try to prove it. Lol. Yes, the Astros have some bandwagoners, but you’re being ridiculous and most people would tell you that. There is no “us” or “we”. It’s just YOU. YOU can go by the numbers all you want, but the experience that comes from interacting with other Astros fans and discussing baseball with them will always prove that you have no idea what you’re talking about.
goastros123
Astrosfanff7, when did you first start following the Astros?
TheDogDays
How you can call obvious mediocre-to-poor attendance numbers in a big city not a point is on itself, ridiculous.
That is the point !
16th attendance in a top 5 market is a point! That’s terrible!
You’re clearly hypocritical —- the Astros don’t have the market to compete with the Yankees , yet what about the other teams from smaller markets that did outdraw them??
It’s cool, I’m happy you guys finally have your place in the sun for a few years… before falling back to mediocrity (or worse) and the fans of Houston will be on to something else.
goastros123
Many Astros fans will still remain, cheering the team on.
kam3hameha
16th was the worst. If that was their best attendance rate, then sure I’d agree with you. But that’s when they’re rock bottom. 16th, whether you want to agree or realize it or not, is still middle of the pack AT THEIR WORST. Right now they’re in the top ten for attendance. You’re also only looking at attendance and haven’t brought up TV revenue at all or the TV market in Houston. Don’t worry, it’ll be a long while before they’re mediocre again. They’ve built themselves similar to what the Cardinals have done so many years, and though the Cards aren’t winning a chip every year they somehow defy logic and continue to stay competitive. So will the ‘Stros, and while not every fan is loyal (just like every other fanbase in the world), those of us that are will be there regardless to enjoy every moment of dominating your overpaid and heartless Yankee players.
kam3hameha
@goastros123 The first game I ever went to was at the Astrodome, if that tells you anything. I started following them in the 90s as a kid but I didn’t follow them quite as religiously as I have as an adult, of course. Back then I went to some games here and there and watched a few on TV. In 2004 I became more obsessive about sports as a teenager and have watched the Astros religiously ever since. I moved out of Houston last year, but I still support my hometown team.
goastros123
I preivously told TheDogDays that Houston has a lot of people who started following the Astros when they were still in the NL, but he/she/it refused to believe it. He previous claimed they were no Astros fans prior to a few years ago.
TheDogDays
I give up, you either can’t read or are just dumb. It’s that simple.
I never said EVERY SINGLE Astro fan is a bandwagoner nor am I saying they had ZERO fans before they got good ,which is strangely the point you’re trying to make.
The original point was that there are a lot of bandwagon Astro fans, which has been CLEARLY proven by the attendance numbers .
Of course, some fans have been there for a long time, that’s irrelevant. It’s simply not a strong, loyal fan base. The end.
TheDogDays
AstrofanFF7
You might be right or you might not be. The Astros seem to have a strong foundation in place. But as many know, there are no guarantees. Windows can close quickly especially now you have a division where other teams are improving.
I’m happy as a Yankee fan. True, you beat us a few times but in reality , we’re in the mix every year and that’s pretty good for a fan.
And…at least I know that if we ever did suck again, we’ll still have fans.
kam3hameha
For once I don’t have anything else to debate with you lol. You’re right, no one ever knows. Future looks bright. You’re also right the Yankees will always be in the mix, albeit they will severely underperform some years. As long as you’re happy, that’s all that matters. The last thing I’ll say on it is that even though the fanbase may not be as “strong and loyal” as the Yankees, it’s still stronger and more loyal than a lot of teams and when I’m watching them suck I’ll know the stadium still won’t look as empty as many. So I’m happy as an Astros fan too. It could be a lot worse. Have fun next season.
goastros123
“I never said EVERY SINGLE Astro fan is a bandwagoner nor am I saying they had ZERO fans before they got good ,which is strangely the point you’re trying to make.” – you’re lying. You originally said there were no Astros fans a few years ago.
“I give up, you either can’t read or are just dumb. It’s that simple.” – see above.
“It’s simply not a strong, loyal fan base. The end.” – you’re entitled to your opinion.
goastros123
‘Astro fans didn’t exist a few years ago , so we accept you don’t understand rules.” – TheDogDays. I’m happy you two were able to have a peaceful discussion. However, stop lying. You can talk about bandwagoners all you want, but initially you said Astros fans didn’t exist a few years ago and that’s what I’ve been addressing this time entire time.
goastros123
You know what? Whatever, TheDogDays. Whatever you say. Have a good night.
goastros123
By the way “I give up, you either can’t read or are just dumb. It’s that simple.” – it’s neither. I have Autism.
goastros123
I misunderstood everything. I apologize for that and my behavior.
TheDogDays
AstrosfanFf7;
Well said and you’re right. The Yankees have underperformed at times and do have guys that are overpayed. I really think part of this is unfortunately, playing in such a pressure-filled environment, as the Mets also seem to have some of these issues over the years.
But I like that management does make the effort to win, even if sometimes unsuccessfully.
TheDogDays
I’m sorry too, I was at times ridiculous and immature.
You have the best team, deserved to win this year and it’s up to the rest of us to catch you.
Have a good night.
ric7744
Because they have tons of money and will be back in WS contention as soon as next year
Dock_Elvis
The Giants don’t typically spend much time being irrelevant. They’ll be back.
ctbronx7
Three decades ago, everyone expected Barry Bonds to sign with the Yankees — until they were outbid by the Giants.
Sunday Lasagna
@DakotaJoe according to baseballsavant, had Judge played all 162 games in Yankee stadium his HR total would have been 66 and if all games were in SF he would have hit 61. In Detroit, Cleveland, Minnesota, KC or Pittsburgh he would have hit less than 60, and on the high side, the only stadium he has 70 or more if he had played every game there is Cincinnati where he would have had 73. His HR totals don’t project much differently in SF vs NY. In regards to winning, the Giants are only one year removed from a 107 win season. Money will be the winner. Yankees, Giants, Dodgers etc whoever has the bigger wheelbarrow of cold hard cash!!
ric7744
The Giants have tons of money and had the best record in Baseball the year before last. They will be back in title contention next year or very soon.
ric7744
If Judge is serious about winning he actually will sign with the Giants and the ballpark is good for right handed hitters.
Balk
Wouldn’t it be awesome to see a dude hit that glove out in left center?
thecoffinnail
There are numerous reasons for him to go to the Giants. I hope he does. He is already 30 with an injury history. Do they really need another Stanton on their payroll in the next couple of years? Judge knows the Yankee fans love him now but when he turns into ARod and his enormous contract prevents them from signing that years top free agents he will hear the boos. Especially playing RF. Let him move on and give the Giants 2 good years and they will let him decline in with grace. The Yankees have Stanton as the middle of the order threat and Rizzo to protect him. They need place setters badly. Bader was a good start. Keeping Benintendi would be smart and adding someone like Trea Turner would be a good finish. Then maybe that lineup can do something besides hit home runs. Keep Donaldson for a year to help Rizzo mentor the kids. His excellent glove will help take some pressure off of whomever wins the SS spot if they don’t sign Turner. Plus even in decline he is still dangerous. DJL isn’t what he was a couple of years ago but still a quality super utility. Hopefully they are smart and sign Manaea (look up his stats pitching in NY) to be the TOR lefty they need to pair with Cole. They have all that Chapman and Britton salary to pass around for a bullpen ace if they want one. They are stuck with Hicks but he will be a fine 4th OF albeit an expensive one. They are a TOR lefty and a table setter like DJL was when he first joined the Yankees away from the World Series. Judge’s bat will be missed but a few years from now Yankee fandom will be thankful to see the Giants paying his massive contract. Signing 30 year old free agents to record deals has never worked out for them and Judge’s deal is going to look bad for someone. We all know this. They let Cano walk and it was a good thing too. Bader/Benni/Turner/Stanton/Rizzo/Donaldson/Trevino/Rookie looks great. Now pencil in a solid but not spectacular RF addition like Wil Myers. That is a solid lineup with DJL giving the IF days off and Hicks doing the same with the OF. Judge’s salary alone would give them a Myers type addition plus a pitcher like Manaea. Imagine that rotation Cole/Manaea/Sevy/NastyNestor as the front 4 with several options for the 5th spot. Montas should be traded or packaged with Torres for a top prospect. He will be the next pitcher that shines when he leaves NY. That package would be perfect for the Braves who still have lots of talent on the farm. Pitching wins championships and hitting wins the season. I am tired of them winning the season. $40m to a player everybody knows is not gonna age well doesn’t make sense to me. Yet another one of my novels. Sorry
drasco036
I recently went to San Francisco for work… forget the ballpark, why would anyone want to play there? The city is disgusting!
The city reminds me of the walking dead but instead of zombies it’s junkies stumbling around the streets.
Also had the unfortunate opportunity to drive through Oakland and now I completely understand Raider fans from that area… it’s also zero surprise as to why no one goes to A’s games. If you are the commissioner, how do you not take it upon yourself to condemn that ballpark and move the team?
2020Sucks 2
Astros sign Judge, NYC riots, everyone else laughs
Balk
That would be funny
frugalfarhan
Pay this man his money
Milwaukee-2208
Why?
Give a 30 year old a blank check who is never healthy and whose body won’t age well? For what? To be handcuffed financially with a terrible contract in 2 years and constantly have him on the IL. Allocate the money to signing multiple players.
Also, did you see his wonderful postseason stats this year? Let alone his career postseason stats? Not pretty.
Didlz
Why would he not age well? You obviously have no idea but why even suggest that? To say it would be a terrible contract in 2 years is absolutely wild. It’s absolutely possible he is signed at an 8 year deal and is good the entire time. And to suggest that he is incapable of performing in the post season is just stupid.
bigjonliljon
While I don’t agree that the contract will suck in 2 years, I do understand that the contract will suck eventually. Maybe 4-5 years out. Big man. His knees are carrying and supporting a lot of weight. As does his back. He’s had a history of injuries already. That won’t get better as he ages.
frugalfarhan
You don’t get a trophy at the end of the year for running a financially sound organization. If you want good players and can’t draft them or trade for them and have a boat load of money you should pay the price of admission. Also there is that revenue stream that would flow like the Bonds years if we had a hometown superstar to build around. Spend $40 million a year and sell an extra million seats per year along with all the 99 jerseys they would sell. This is a no brainer
alwaysgo4two
At best, Judge will have 2 or 3 years approaching 2022s production if he stays healthy. At worst, he’ll be fortunate to stay healthy and be a Miggy Cabrera type burden the last few years of the lengthy contract.
Mad Hatter
Injury history – a broken rib from diving for a ball and a broken hand after getting hit with a pitch doesn’t make him injury prone.
Fever Pitch Guy
Didlz – It always amazes me when people just assume every player will deteriorate when they hit 33. There are PLENTY of exceptions. Two of the best pitchers in the game right now are 37 and 39, sheesh.
It was only a few months ago when I was mocked for saying Judge would get at least $270M guaranteed. All I heard was “he’s always injured”, “no team would ever give him that much”, etc etc.
Well, he’s had over 1,300 PA’s since last year. So much for being “injury prone”.
jjd002
They get no extra money from jersey sales. All merchandise sales are split equally amongst all 30 teams.
painterman360
Actually…it does
TheDogDays
So if a guy happens to have an injury-free year, in a walk year nonetheless, then he can’t be called injury prone.
You guys need to take a logic class.
Endar Malkovich
If you don’t account for his rookie call up and the covid year judge averages 135 games per year. There is no evidence to suggest he will suddenly increase that amount closer to a full season.
There is no way the human body can play the outfield position into age 38 and on without decreasing the playing time per year. Factor in that the kid is 6’7 282lbs and it’s pretty evident.
Even DHing at that age will still not get a full season or close to it.
Stanton in just the time he’s been a Yankee minus the covid year has averaged 107 games per year with most of his time at DH. He’s 6’6 245lbs and 2 years older than judge. He’s smaller and older and still can’t stay healthy as a DH.
What makes you think Judge will defy all of this?
flamingbagofpoop
That one pitcher…missed 1.5 years recently
NWYanksfan
Thank you Hatter! That’s what I’ve been saying! Also, everyone seems to forget that he was drafted out of college. Didn’t even start playing full season ball until he was 22. Not very many miles on Judge.
WiffleBall
@diddleshimself There is a ton of past history that suggests players of Judge’s body type are injury-prone and do not age well. That’s not to say Judge can’t, but he already has a lot of injury in his history, so it’s not a good sign.
No guarantees one way or the other, but OP is assuming correctly based on a ton of evidence. Good find it yourself, it’s out there.
SonnySteele
You’re his agent, right? 😉
Backup Catcher to the Backup Catcher
Williams actually missed almost five full seasons due to military duty as he fought in WW II and the Korean War. Just give him an average performance for those years, most occurring in his prime, and it’s mind boggling what his finals totals would be.
Best pure hitter in my lifetime.
SonnySteele
They didn’t call him Teddy Ballgame for nothing.
thejuice01
You missed a few things, including a shoulder surgery, repeated calf strains and the the performance zapping oblique strains.
Salvi
A breakdown of Judge’s injury history:
2017, 155 out of 162: 92%
2018, 112 out of 162: 69%
2019, 102 out of 162: 62%
2020, 28 out of 60: 46%
2021, 148 out of 162: 91%
2022, 157 out of 162: 97%
—————————
Total, 702 out of 870: 80%
Sure, its only a “hand injury” and a “broken rib”. Downplay it however you want, but only being available 4 out of 5 games is not good.
Judge is entering next season at 31 years old. Baseball players traditionally don’t play more games in their 30’s than their 20’s. But sure, give him 8 years, 300+ million, good luck with that.
User 401527550
2 or 3 years approaching 2022 production is a 400 million contract. If the rest of the season are only 35-40 hr seasons then it’s a steal.
Salvi
“if the rest of the season are 35-40 hr”
10 people hit 35+ HRs this year. Only 3 are over 30yo, with the oldest being 35. So, youre saying he’s going to stay in the top ten HRs, including injury seasons, (cause I see a lot of injuries coming) until he’s 39.
Sure, he is.
Gasu1
Judge is extremely athletic. Judge will play 3 more years in RF, then 2 years between RF and 1B, 2 years as a full time 1B and a year at 1B/dH. That’s an 8 year contract. What’s the problem?
utah cornelius
@ReedSox: You’re right. Yazstremski sucked in his 30’s, too.
utah cornelius
@ReedSox: So you admit there was something fishy about David Ortiz’s 38 HR’s when he was 40. Refreshing to hear that from a RS fan.
Gwynning's Anal Lover
@painterman360 Does not
slider32
If you look at all the big free agent contracts not many are good,deals, and most don’t even make the playoffs every year.
whyhayzee
Who is Yazstremski? Played until he was 43. The only years his OPS were below average were ages 21 and 41. Over 100 RBI at ages 36 and 37. Averaged 144 games a year for 23 years. Cal Ripken averaged 143 games a year for 21 years. And it’s Yastrzemski.
Braves Butt-Head
Hey I don’t mind the Giants making a Albert Pujols to the Angels kind of mistake.
ric7744
The Giants have so much money that they better spend. They better be signing a lot more than just Judge if he signs
zimerust
how is it a blank check?
ric7744
Because they are toward the top in revenue but about 110 million less in what they should be spending next year in payroll. So they should be signing Judge one of tge shortstops and 3 o 4 medium tied free agents, that is if they still want fans
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Milwaukee- I don’t entirely disagree with you here, but also are you the type that basically thinks nearly every player who reaches free agency isn’t worth the money because of their age?
There does seem to be a subset of baseball fans who don’t want to give guaranteed contracts of any significance to any player above 30 and definitely not any player above 33 or 34- but the thing is- players take a few years to mature into their best physical capability and their best technical capability as a player and that is usually from about 22 to 27 or so and then they tend to stay in that zone for about 7-10 years- or about 34 to 37 years old.
Paul Goldschmidt just won MVP after his age 34 campaign.
I just think you’re looking at all the contracts that didn’t work out and none of the contracts that do work out- nobody ever discusses the large free agency contracts that quietly work out and are worth the money.
flamingbagofpoop
The ones that do work out are the exceptions. If your team is very close over the next 2-3 years, FA contracts can make sense. You get the the upfront production to help push you over and fully expect that the backend of the contract is going to be garbage.
Poster formerly known as . . .
Ted Williams only played in one World Series. This was his batting line in 7 games:
.200/.333/.200/.533 with 5 hits, all singles, 2 runs scored, and 1 RBI.
Boy, the Red Sox must’ve wished he wasn’t on the team, right, Milwaukee-2208?
And his career lasted only 19 years.
Since Judge’s rookie season, 2017, he’s #1 in fWAR and 34th in plate appearances. How’d he manage that if he’s “never healthy”?
whyhayzee
Ted Williams injured, hopes to be ready for Series
X-rays show serious bruise on elbow after incident in exhibition game
TheDogDays
Let’s see, Judge missed over a hundred games in 2018-2019 and more than half during the covid season.
Sounds like at least somewhat of an issue.
Salvi
“and his career lasted only 19 years”
Ted Williams missed 3 years to go fight in war. Playing healthy from 1939 to 1960 is a long career. He retired at 41yo with a .316 BA in his final season.
utah cornelius
Only .316 in Ted Williams’ final season. David Ortiz magically almost beat that with .315 in his age 40 season. David Ortiz, on par with Ted Williams. Now who believes that?
Poster formerly known as . . .
In 2018-2020, despite the time missed with injuries, Judge ranked 23rd in fWAR (10.7), right behind Goldschmidt (10.8), and ahead of LeMahieu (10.4) and Altuve (10.1). So, somewhat of an issue, but not a whole lot, DogDays.
ric7744
the Giants make so much money, they will never be handcuffed for money as long as they have the best ballpark in baseball.
slider32
Giants don’t even get into the playoffs with Judge alone, they will have a tough time doing what they did 2 years ago. That season was an outlier!
Poster formerly known as . . .
All of the articles I’ve read about their interest in Judge mention that their intention of adding pieces to field a contending team are part of the pitch to Judge. They’re telling him they mean to be a regular postseason team.
Balk
Milwaukee…first, if he didn’t have to carry the yanks to the postseason maybe he wouldn’t of been burnt…second, if they front load his contract, towards the end, as he is DH it won’t hurt as much and the money keeps getting dispersed around the lineup….third the Giants have one of the richest owners in mlb, they can manage.
.
John Malkovich, Rounders.
sascoach2003
Awesome movie, even more awesome line: Pay dat man his money. Good taste shows
.
He beat me! Straight up!
LordD99
Morosi and Feinsand are Yankee beat reporters, which means this info is coming from Judge’s camp. It’s obvious why. He waited into he had an offer from the Yankees, and now he gets to see if the Giants will beat it. Then he’ll return to the Yankees for their counteroffer.
Judge’s camp pointed to the upcoming Winter Meetings as the place where things will pick up. Expect a deal around those meetings. My guess remains it will be the Yankees as both sides have said they want the partnership to continue.
W.T. 3
Judge wants the highest contract. If the Yankees match, he’ll stay. I don’t think he’s going to give them a hometown discount.
BaseballisLife
Didn’t the article say Judge’s hometown was Linden, about 100 miles from San Francisco?
Maybe the Giants will get a hometown discount?
Backup Catcher to the Backup Catcher
Some team is gonna shell out mega bucks for Judge and within three years will regret it. The Yankees ought to dangle out a 4-year deal at $30 million per. That would be good for both sides.
Two things are for certain: 1. Judge is gonna get an offer from Steinbrenner/Cashman and, 2. Judge isn’t gonna leave the bright lights of NYC and sign with a non-contending team in middle America.
Gonna be the Yankees, Dodgers, Giants or Red Sox.
put it in the books
4 years at $30m a year is a joke.
vtadave
So the Yankees taking their offer from $210 million to $120 million is the way to go to entice him to return? Seems reasonable.
Hotstovemelts
Haha and it appears the lower annual, 4 year offer is what gets the deal across the goal line?? Cause Judge isn’t playing middle America… Haha
A. Judge
Not sure what your smoking, that’s not as good an offer as the one he turned down in the spring. There are 30 teams that would offer that in a NY minute. What a joke….
nando390
Giants will have one all star in Judge and the rest of the team is borderline triple A status
GMoney2850
And still finish ahead of the Padres. As usual
falconsball1993
They….didn’t?
getrealgone2
As usual? What happened this year?
GMoney2850
Blind squirrel/nut, etc
Daddy lets you have one every now and then
BaseballisLife
Haven’t the Padres finished ahead of the Giants and made the playoffs 2 out of the last 3 years?
GMoney2850
2020 doesn’t count. SF has finished ahead of SD in like 45 of the last 53 years
BaseballisLife
That’s strange since those banners from 2020 are still flying.
User 2079935927
They’re going to meet at Fisherman’s Wharf. And the Giants owner will point out to Alcatraz Island. And tells Judge « You sign with us, that can be yours ». A new paint job. Some throw pillows. Knock a few walls down.It will be bigger and better than the Playboy Mansion. Let’s see the Yankees top that!!
He turns back around to see Judge’s reaction is and he’s GONE!!!
.
Get him a clam chowder bread bowl and a shrimp roll he’ll be alright.
fre5hwind
Get the fried turkey Giants may need it, you know what add some cranberry sauce and some mash potato pudding and the Giants will have achieved my respect.
Eaglefeather
Mashed Potato pudding?
This i have not heard of, please tell me more.
fre5hwind
Go look it up, its good.
AndyWarpath
Pretty good AAA team going .500 in the major leagues.
CaptainJudge99
Give me a break guy! It’s just a meeting. Smh
flamingbagofpoop
I’ll assume this is some hyperbole, but this is a very relevant point. The Giants aren’t 1 Judge type of player away.
astros_fan_84
I hope Judge gets amazing amount of money and burns that team with a toxic contract. I prefer an AL team.
Balk
Why? Cause you want every team but your own to suck? You wish bad on Judge? Bet you wouldn’t complain if it were the Astros making a push for him and landed him. SMH
TheDogDays
Astro fans can’t can’t stand a successful player…. That didn’t cheat!
stroh
LOL….you are correct, we can’t stand Jorge Soler and Juan Soto.
TheDogDays
Exactly! Let’s pretend we did nothing wrong, but point fingers at others.
No self-awareness.
Ghost Pepper
Yes nando. But others would surely want to follow if they sign Judge early.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
I have mixed feelings- every single new contract of this kind of size and length always looks fancy and wonderful as it begins, especially in a really well maintained and classy park like the Giants have in the area of the city they are in- but can they compete to the point that Judge’s contract would be worth it for them? Can they compete to the point that playing for the Giants will be worth it for Judge, assuming he is weighing a team’s ability to make it to the post season and the World Series alongside any money he’d make?
It’s been 8 years since the Giants made it to the World Series and the team make up is completely different from that era, with a lot of their best players in the swan songs of their careers and no surefire prospects to bring up to make the difference and a pitching staff that has had some impressive one year leases but no solid anchors.
They’re pretty much the Yankees in a “the Same But Different’ way. I also have this weird suspicion that with Judge gone the Yankees could actually utilize that money and reconfigure the make up of their line up to be more effective in an Astros/Braves style and actually get to the World Series, if not win it- something they may not be able to do with Judge.
I kinda wonder that about Judge- is he a player that, for whatever reason, will put up amazing individual stats but is not good for the make up of a given line up he is in?
avenger65
The Giants are one year away from a 100+ win season and a division title. Part of the reason was that their players all had career years. Obviously that didn’t happen this season. If they start with Judge, then add some other players Zaidi has mentioned, I think they’ll be a force once again. If they sign Judge it will attract other top FAs. Rodon might return because he, like others who want to play for a contender, would see that the giants are serious about being a 2021 team again.
kobo77
And right now is the time as we will see prospects like Harrison, Luciano and even Schmidt start pushing for active roster spots sooner than later! Add that to the smaller pieces we already have and we start becoming good again every year!
YourDreamGM
These mega contracts make me vomit as soon as they are announced unless it’s a rare 26 year old free agent. (Harper Machado)
Lloyd Emerson
Jason Heyward
YourDreamGM
If Heyward had the same track record and numbers and star ppwer of Harper then yes I would have been fine with it.
Balk
I wish it were my money, I’d swim in it! I wouldn’t vomit!
YourDreamGM
I’d swim in it too. Just don’t want to be handing it to someone else. If a team has to do it then the Giants make sense. Ticket sales are down and he would sell tickets. Teams like Dodgers Cards etc wouldn’t get that benefit. Whatever the Giants pay him they will get back 50 to 100 million easy. I am fine with the Giants. Yankees don’t want to lose any ground to the Mets so they are like the Angels and Trout. If the Mets took him it would be a nice blow to the Yanks. So Judge should be the rare non vomit inducing mega contract to a 30 something. He makes sense for 3 teams. Highly unlikely his stats are worth it but marketing wise it isn’t a bad idea.
billy09
So you’ll balk at an 8-year contract to a 31 year old but a 13-year contract is fine for a 26-year old. Interesting…
King Floch
The amount of excess value banked in the first 8 or so years of a 13 year mega contract for a 26 year old superstar caliber player will handily pay for the declining years at the end, whereas an 8 year contract for a 31 year old is already starting perilously close to the decline phase.
YourDreamGM
King gets it. Interesting you find it interesting.
BaseballisLife
The 31 year old will start regressing immediately.
The 26 year old will have 5 seasons before he starts to decline.
getrealgone2
Yeah just get it over with already.
Milwaukee-2208
Tossing tons of money and at this guy will be a mistake. He played out of his mind in a contract year and was healthy pretty much all year. His track record shows he can’t stay healthy and he’s only getting older. I’d stay far away from Judge and go after Trea Turner. He’s more of a complete player
iBleeedBlue
San Francisco has no business entering this sweepstakes.
getrealgone2
Like when the Orioles signed Tejada.
SodoMojo90
Seattle offered Tejada more money too. Thats how bad he didn’t want to come to Seattle. Apparently they also offered more money to Delgado than the Mets. Just some fun Trivia!
King Floch
IIRC, the Orioles also offered Vlad more money than the Angels but he signed there anyway.
That was a wild offseason lol.
Deadguy
Seattle is a hard place to hit in? I was surprised when Robinson Cano signed there and then convinced Nelson Cruz to join?
2014giants
Says who?
iH8PaperStraws
How is it a sweepstakes when there no market? His expectations are too high, and the media which always makes fantasy projections feeds it. He’s 31 not 27. He needs to start considering realistic offers before he can start playing teams against each other to get a little more. Eventually the media will catch up to the new baseball, they’ll still get just as many clicks and comments.
Hotstovemelts
You make no sense… they’re not his expectations!! Its the media and the market supply and demand.
W.T. 3
Why not? They only have 133M on the books for next year and by 2025 will be down to 22M. They have plenty of money to spend on not just Judge but multiple pieces.
stroh
As an Astros fan, I want Judge to re-sign with the Yanks.
getrealgone2
Sow chaos and surrender will bloom
goob
Baggy old pants-&-suspenders taboo?
Yankee Clipper
No need to rub it in….. ugh, his bat couldn’t hit air in the playoffs this postseason, poor fella.
Dynasty
The Astros tears are real
JayRyder
Getting Judge instantly makes the Giants marketable again.
Yanks2
False news. He’s signing with NYY and it’s nothing but click bait to suggest otherwise
Candlestoked
Yankee fans all sound like Trump talking hooey out the backside. No proof just bluster.
Yanks2
Rizzo and Judge won’t sign on different teams
Lloyd Emerson
Rizzo already signed.
Yanks2
Which is why I’m saying Judge to SF is false news
John Bird
So you’re saying he’ll pick friends over family?
W.T. 3
Why? He won’t take the most money because of a 1 1/2 yr realtionship with Rizzo? He’ll make the Yankees match whatever offer he gets. Then, the Yankees wil have a decision to make.
Yankee Clipper
I think he’s trying to get his number up. I’ve heard the Yankees offer was for $337MM.
But, the reality is: if he chooses one place because they pay him slightly more than the Yankees, obviously he didn’t *want to be a Yankee for life. He wanted to be the highest paid. That’s not meant to disparage either, for it’s his choice. It’s just the reality that he’s choosing somewhere else. I wish him the best either way. He gave us some great seasons and I’d love to see him back.
They better not wait too long because all the relevant players are going to come off the board and if he goes too, next year will be brutal.
Yanks2
The fact that Hal Steinbrenner actually had to explain in arbitration why Judge was worth 2M less than what Judge was asking was a huge disrespect to Judge. I wouldn’t be surprised if he wanted to leave for another team. Yankees are not meant for the playoffs anyway
LordD99
@YC, that’s an interestingly specific amount. Were you there :-). It does sound like the correct range of the offer. As I noted above, this now allows Judge to market that number to the Giants, and other teams, before getting the Yankees to counteroffer. The Yankees knew he’d do that, which likely means whatever they offered Judge they did so knowing they’d go higher.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Where did you hear that was the Yankees’ offer? And if that was their offer, that’s very close to the upper limit of what Judge could command over 8 years, so I would be shocked to see him actually turn that down, unless he categorically does not want to be a Yankee anymore or he categorically wants to be a Giant as a local kid making good on his hometown allegiance or something like that- would he take less money to be on the Giants? Would the Giants top the Yankees’ offer, if $337 is accurate?
Yankee Clipper
TTO: You should start seeing that number surface soon in news reports and on the interwebs.
.
Clip, had to share this gem with you. Came across it about a year ago. I hope it gives you as good a chuckle as it did me..
tumblr.com/enterthemindofmadness/102237911354/wher…
slider32
Sounds like the ballbark figure, he will have to get more than Stanton or Cole.
Latino Heat
Come eat some crow when judge signs elsewhere
.
Heat O’l pal, Happy Thanksgiving if I don’t catch you by Thursday amigo! Hope all is smooth!
CubsWin108
prediction: weeks from now Ken Rosenthal will publish a article on the athletic called: The Meeting that won the Giants Aaron Judge. How the Yankees lost the best player in Baseball.
Hotstovemelts
Prediction, under that ‘article’ is another article titled Cubbies, you will be waiting another 100 years for next WS push haha!
giantsfan25
As a giants fan I was hesitant at first to the idea of giving judge a massive contract, but at this point the team hasn’t had a 30 home run guy since bonds. Just give him a blank check.
Central Valley
Bring Kruk and Kuip to the meeting. They’ll close the deal and get Judge to sign the dotted line.
John Bird
So do we think it’s a bigger factor that his parents live in NorCal or that his wife’s parents live in NorCal?
YourDreamGM
About as big a factor as where Springer Cole Strasburg Rendon etc etc etc families lived.
Excluding Kershaw I am right 99.9 percent of the time. They go to whoever will give them the most money. Past team or family only factors in if the money is about the same.
LouWhitakerHOF
I think he is just trying to raise the offer the Yankees have made to him. He gets the 8 years $332m from the Yankees. Plus going from that little ballpark in NY to the big park in SF could really hurt his numbers in the second half of that deal.
YourDreamGM
The only numbers he is worried about aren’t on the back of a baseball card.
bucsfan0004
His baseball card must have a typo…. says he only has two seasons over 27 HRs…. that can’t be right?
bucsfan0004
*three now
Chemo850
Always injured or underperforming. He really isnt worth the contract he’s about to get. Might never hit more than 35 HRs ever again
RyanD44
It’s all posturing to get the Yankees to meet his asking price. It’s not like he made a special trip just for the Giants (even if he did, it would still be a good strategic move to get the Yankees to budge), his family is in California and it’s a holiday week. This will push Yankees fans over the edge and ownership & management will fear letting him get away, which will lead to an 8-year, $37.5m annual salary deal.
prov356
I can see it happening, especially since Judge if from norcal and grew up a Giants fan. I also predict Ohtani will land there.
YourDreamGM
Yes. Players always ignore money and sign with their childhood team.
Balk
The fact that the Giants can outbid any team for anyone right now, I would say the money is going to be there. It’s going to be up to Judge if he wants to take that money and play close to home and for his childhood team. That’s a lot going on for you right there if I had the opportunity it would be a no brainer.
YourDreamGM
If the money is the same I think he will stay in ny. 1 team legacy with the flagship team. Contenders every single year. Endorsement opportunity. Travel. Giants will need to pay more, like 20 million minium.
Simm
I dont think giants can outbid anyone. They have money to spend and the need which makes signing judge very valuable to them. I have no doubt dodgers could easily outbid the giants if they wanted to. They have something like 550m in revenue yearly. People look at money on the books and think that means they can out spend anyone. The Yankees and dodgers are so much richer then any other team. The question for those teams is whether they want to spend that much on a player. Not that they couldn’t of they wanted to and still rake in cash.
prov356
DreamGM – Interesting response considering I never suggested Judge would forgo money to sign with the Giants. As the article pointed out, the Giants have plenty of space on their payroll to sign him to a lucrative multi-year contract.
YourDreamGM
No you didn’t. And I never suggested you didn’t.
mt in baltimore
The Dodgers aren’t too far down the Coast for his next stop..
rememberthecoop
I personally feel that as long as the money is roughly equal, Judge wilm be a Yankee. He’s just getting bids so he can tell Hal how much he’s going to have to fork over.
TellItGoodbye
Diehard Giants fan, but I don’t want Judge. We’ve already had an injury-plagued giraffe in Brandon Belt. Tall sluggers seem to always develop knee issues that never go away. If he were 26-28, sure, but it’s just too risky. And yeah, he stunk up the joint in the post season. I do think Correa or Trea Turner would be solid signings, preference to the former.
gfan
Here come the Judge !
Rodon and Corea to follow.
Fg-3
If he wants to go.. let him go. Yanks will overpay no matter what. Judge is great but look at Cano.. he’s rich and out of baseball. Pujols had a good last year.. because of his reunion with Cards. But his big contract was a noose for Angels. Yanks can afford the mistake. Arod.. Ellsbury.. Judge should know his legacy. Yankee captain if he stays.. or freeze in San Fran. He better learn to pull everything too. No short porch in San Fran. He should meet with other teams. And if the grass is greener…go for it.
utah cornelius
Judge AVERAGED 405′ on his HR’s. Someone did an analysis and overlayed the spray chart of Judge’s HRs on Oracle and determined that Judge would have lost exactly TWO HR’s.
jvent
Bye bye Judge lol, the Yanks will get desperate and give Verlander a stupid contract
stretch123
If they miss out on Judge, they should still spend the money and bring in Nimmo and Swanson
SAM’s
So he’s getting out of the snowstorm in New York and going to have thanksgiving with his family in California? Sounds like he’s just swinging by the park to see what the Giants are offering, since he’ll be in the neighborhood
5TUNT1N
Guys home for the holidays, be dumb not to check that box at the same time! Happy holidays everyone! Be thankful, sadly the world is messed up according to the news.
Edp007
Separations more often than not end in divorce. Usually one partner more than the other wants to test the waters of freedom. With freedom comes opportunity to court others and be courted.
Once even one of the parties starts to enjoy the new found courtship’s , then reconciling rarely occurs.
I think Judge is gone.
Viveleempireevil
Yes…I can see it all now: “oh sorry Mrs Judge…please excuse the piles of hypodermic needles and human waste piled up there. And please watch your step there as those are our homeless dirt bags who have turned our sidewalks into skid rows. Yes, and our state income tax is 12.3% and…well…we sure hope you both can envision yourselves here in San Francisco”. Farce.
scottn59c
You think a Bronx bound subway car looks any better?
Chemo850
I would let him go. Try to get one of the top shortstops and a starter instead. This contract will not age well
frugalfarhan
Sign Judge in the next 2 weeks and sell half a million 99 jerseys/t-shirts by X-mas. My family would probably buy 3 at least which I assume would range from $25 – $175 each for let’s say an average of $75 to be conservative. That’s a cool $15 million or so in immediate return on investment. Season ticket sales would immediately go up instead of down resulting in easily another $25 million. First year of Judges salary is covered before the season even starts. Judge is the real deal not like Stanton or Pujols or Rendon. The DH is going to keep him healthy and productive well into his late 30’s. The Giants look across the pier at the Warriors and how a player like Steph Curry created a global brand for them and Judge has every chance to be that and more for the Giants. This is the biggest no brainer ever. The stars have aligned and all it is going to take is for FZ not to pee down his leg.
Giants78
Judge is a 30 yr old right handed power hitter with below average defensive skills. SF ballpark favors left handed power. Giants shouldn’t sign Judge, will never get the value out of any contract he’d agree to.
TellItGoodbye
Actually Oracle Park is more favorable to BOTH lefties and righties than Yankee Stadium, and was the 10th best ballpark for righties in 2022. Yankee Stadium was 12th. Lefties had a much worse time hitting there than righties last season.
m34josh
Only one left-handed hitter thought Oracle favored LH hitters
Yankee Clipper
“Below average defensive skills” is woefully inaccurate by any objective assessment.
judgementday99
“Below average defensive skills” guess he’s never seen the laser from right pick off a runner going to second LOL
Hotstovemelts
Below average defensive skills??? SMH sure glad to read you’re doing your due diligence! He is a gold glove RF!
goob
Where are they meeting? I want to stand at vigil and do encouraging chants and incantations.
TellItGoodbye
I’d rather have Senga, Correa/Turner, Rodon, Conforto, and then Ohtani. instead of the old injury-proned, one walk year-induced freak season, over-hyped, over-valued Judge.
Rishi
I get they have lots of money to spend but why commit so much to one guy when you could bring in 2or 3 real solid players for same money (and have a better opportunity of at least 1 or 2 working out well)? I guess it would be cool to see another potential HR record type guy there. He’s obviously very marketable.
EastCoastGiant
We already have a bunch of plug and play mediocre talent. We need players who can compete against the Padres and Dodgers in our division. If we just get some normal players we’d have to replace our normal guys we already have.. we don’t really improve.
Mercenary.Freddie.Freeman
All Rise is going to shock everyone and go back home to Cali just like I did. Home is where the heart is.
CaptainJudge99
No I’m not
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Merc, agreed. I gotta get back to AZ and being an incognito Halo and Dodger fan.
dshires4
San Francisco expected to meet with Giant.
giantwarrioras49ersraiders
Get that money! Giant fans are dying for a big time hitter with excitement even if it’s for a few years! They Don’t call it the Golden State for nothing!
brucenewton
He gone.
sandman12
The fans of whatever team Judge signs with will be delighted. As to how much they pay to get him? Whatever.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Yankees will probably still sign him but it is nice to see other teams drive up his price. Whoever signs him may regret it down the line.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
Another thought I had: With many players, a difference of a few hundred thousand a year can make or break their chances at being signed. So for some players a team would love to have them at $7M a season but $8M a season would be too hefty- their value is very clear cut with a very narrow window of acceptable pricing and often times those players can only drive their price up by a few hundred grand, so a guy will wind up making $7.3M a season because the market was for around $7M but less than $7.5M and the winning bid was pushed by $300k just to make the signing happen and both the player and the team understood that was them overpaying by a little bit for the team for that player to get a lot more individually, at their earning power and level of demand for their services.. With other players an extra $1M or $2M a year is nothing during a bidding frenzy- so it starts at $18M annually and might wind up at $25M annually if enough teams make offers and try to be the top offer- so I wonder how far that can push a contract value, especially when the starting point is so astronomical?
In other words- if a team is willing to pay $40M a season for Judge, why not $45M a season? And if a bunch of clubs are willing to match that $45M a season, why not $50M a season? And where would it end? I realize $40M a season wouldn’t turn into $100M a season, but I could see an intense bidding war pushing it up to an absolutely bonkers $50M a season or if it wound up a shorter term deal, $60M a season.
Redwolves3
Today’s meeting with Judge could possibly determine if Giants are really serious and do whatever it takes to sign him. Show Judge they really want him and need him.
Bring in the real decision makers Charles Johnson, Buster Posey, Farman Zaidi, Pete Petila, and former Giants who may make a difference: Rich Aurilia, Barry Bonds, Willie Mays, Will Clark, Hunter Pence.
Mikenmn
Aaron Judge is a smart guy with smart representation. He took a big chance refusing the Yankees offer last off-season and scored in about the biggest possible way. He was fun to watch in New York, and if he goes off to SF or any other team, he’s earned it. This isn’t super complicated–he’s already written himself into the history books and will undoubtedly be extremely rich. I doubt that a couple of million a year would keep him from leaving if he wanted to.
Redwolves3
Today is the most important day of the offseason for Zaidi. It’s his defining moment … all talk, no action or can he seal the deal … produce by signing Judge or be fired.
gravel
Boss, should he leave his letter of resignation on your desk or will you escort him out personally?
EasternLeagueVeteran
San Francisco will clean New York City’s plate, taking Judge, Nimmo and Bassitt/Taillon off the market. Upgrade the outfield and somewhat replace losing Rodon. Then they can pack up their Winter Meeting bags and wait for Spring Training.
foppert
Judge might want to be a Yankee for life but they haven’t made it easy for him. Hard ball in arbitration, publicly embarrassing him by telling fans the details of the extension he rejected. He then responds in the best way possible and puts up a historic season while carrying the team on his back. His reward ? Getting booed when he fails to carry them through the post season.
All I know is that underneath the very professional exterior lives a human. It’s got to hurt.
Gwynning's Anal Lover
Yomiuri Giants sign Judge
goob
Judge Ito?
judgementday99
The Yankees and Judge need each other if they want to continue the money train that is merchandising, If he switches teams..
.(1) this will affect Judge’s market value for endorsements, Continuing to be a home grown superstar in NY, he will make more in endorsements and merchandising than he would make as a free agent in LA or SF. Do you think Jeter would have made as much money if the Reds drafted him?
(2) Steinbrenner will lose millions not being able to push the #99 Judge Merchandise. Hal needs to man up and pay the guy, The money they will make will absorb what is paid out..
I dont think you are going to see stadium being flooded with Volpe or Peraza Jerseys anytime soon if Cashman has his hands in call ups. He is too busy printing up Donaldson and IKF jerseys in his basement.
guynamedchris
I’m pretty sure Aaron Judge will have no shortage of endorsement deals thrown at him no matter where he plays. NY isn’t the only place where money exists. Bad take there, buddy.
judgementday99
There’s a reason Jeter is still the the second best selling Jersey in Baseball…. and he isnt selling 100+K SUVs with Mrs. Jeter if he would have went elsewhere. I agree he’ll still make a boat load of money. But leaving NY will cost him some bucks…not as much as it will cost Hal.
goob
A tidal wave of Orange and Black Judge jerseys would wash over the West – visible from space even!
Inside Out
Unless Giants willing to go 10 years at $42 million a year, no chance they bget him away from the Yankees.
chuck123
Shame on Yankees for not getting it done and then leaking the number. They get what they deserve for being cheap. Hope is does leave or make Yankees overpay
judgementday99
Cashman / Hal pulled the same thing on Mo, Bernie and Jeter…this time they are going to get called out and have to pay $$$$$ if they want to keep Judge.
ohyeadam
If he signs there I want new nicknames like Brandon “The Bailiff” Crawford.
30 Parks
Wined & dined and offered north of $300 million – sounds like my day. I enjoy watching Judge, seems like a stand-up guy, hope this works out for the best in all regards.
TJT88
Agree 110%. As a devoted life long Mets fan, I’m a huge fan of Judge. Just seems Ike a straight up humble class act.
TJT88
Oh baby! Here we go!
rememberthecoop
Waste of time. Judge is not going anywhere. He will sign with thr Yankees once his finishes his due diligence. He’s going to sit down with the major spenders and figure out his market worth. Then, he will bring it back to Hal and say this is what you need to spend. And Hal will pay it. Simple as that. Only way another team has a chance is if they offer him a deal that Hal is unwilling yo match and I just can’t see that happening. It would literally take a crazy offer, something like 10 years, 50MM per. And the Giants won’t do that. (and no, not a Yankees fan)
The Saber-toothed Superfife
The Tigers should make an effort to meet his salary demands ( or close) , sign him by offering a signing bonus, lowering the yearly salary, waiving any no trade clause, trade him for prospects.
The receiving team, gets a lower annual cost. The Tigers pay ~16Mil for a top prospect!
Hire the Superfife!
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Remind him, this could be his last chance to play on a team with the legendary Miguel Cabrera!
Poster formerly known as . . .
I think you’re wrong. I think Hal will refuse to match the highest bid and Judge will sign with the Giants.
Hal already got burned by letting Cashman overpay for Cole, who will never be the pitcher he was in Houston without Spider Tack, which Cashman should’ve known before he signed him. Now Hal is paying for the highest pitcher contract in MLB history for a guy who ranked 23rd in fWAR this year.
dpsmith22
Let the ploy to get more money from NY, begin!
SupremeZeus
9yr. $360M. I hope Judge makes the Yankees pay it.
Macho King OG
1 Billion @ 20 Years!
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Solid offer hitman. He might except.
A'sfaninUK
MLB will absolutely make 1 billion off Aaron Judge and his likeness if they have not already.
goob
Throw in fresh donuts and it’s done.
64' Yanks
The Yankees will resign him as they need him for their star attraction to offset the negativity towards Hal and Trashman. I’m a Yankee fan, but I wish Judge the best of playing on a real World Series contender….forget about Linden being close to the bay area.. I can see him in LA playing for the Dodgers.
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Yankees have too much pride not to keep him.
Poster formerly known as . . .
I doubt that, TJ.
.
We shall see Fink. I don’t really know haha. Personally I think they should have already locked him up. But I can’t even suspend my disbelief long enough to see him in another uniform. Yanks are gonna come out of LF and give him a final offer he can’t refuse! By the way Fink, I can’t stand the Yanks. But I still have as much respect for them and their fans as anyone else. I am a huge fan of the old timers. Yanks have more lore and legend than any other team since the Doubleday era…
Poster formerly known as . . .
What you predict is possible, but I think he’s a San Francisco Giant next year, jacking baseballs into McCovey Cove (though mostly over the left field wall).
.
Now that would definitely be a sight to behold
EasternLeagueVeteran
I honestly believe that the Dodgers would have to move some payroll to fit what it will take to bring Judge to LA. Or Forego signing one of the top 4 shortstops, maybe even forego signing both of the Turner boys. They certainly can do it, but i think for the Dodgers they are closer to a world Series with other pieces than adding Judge and missing opportunities in other pieces.
snowyphile1
Front offices can pay for themselves if they make the right moves.
gfan
8 / 340 should get it done.
Then he can buy the whole town of Linden.
petefrompp
If the Dodgers offer was really 4/214 – then its more like 8/400
mattwild1
that’s not how that works. the higher AAV from the dodgers offer is made so they don’t have to commit as many years. more years = less AAV
Poster formerly known as . . .
Gee, here’s a shocker: “MLB clears Yankees, Mets of collusion over Aaron Judge’s free agency, per report.”
Manfred, the owners’ servant, didn’t find two owners guilty of collusion. Who could’ve guessed?
In other news, Don Corleone cleared his sons of racketeering charges.
Macho King OG
Judge rejected a 214M offer from Dodgers. What are they thinking?
fansided.com/2022/11/22/aaron-judge-rumors-dodgers…
Poster formerly known as . . .
Geez.
Could there possibly be a less-impressive source than “Ramon D. Carmona
@carmonaTV: Dominicano productor de noticias para cadenas internacionales por 27 años amante de los Deportes y enseñar a la gente los peligros de la vida”?
This is like the hat trick of unreliability: Ramon D. Carmona, cited on Twitter by Héctor Gómez, as reported by Scott Rogust on Fansided.
petefrompp
Well it doesn’t state terms of the deal – if that was truly the dollar amount of the offer – my guess that was a 4 yr/ 214m offer.
Makes perfect sense – what not take a shot, and now Judge’s camp has a $50/m year offer – do I hear 6/350 or perhaps 7/400
wrecks the market for Giants and NY
Mikenmn
The man is going to get paid. NY, LA, SF, maybe another town, but he’s going to get paid. 2022 had to be one of the best, if not the best, contract year ever.
Mario93
Texas Rangers.. never know with those guys.
Datashark
Anyone who hit 62 on a contract year – is going to usurp the market for gold
Poster formerly known as . . .
Judge is already a giant. Might as well be a Giant too, right?
foppert
Right.
Yankee Clipper
Speaking of Giants, I watched the “Mays: Sey Hey Kid” documentary last night. It was really good. I had enormous respect for Mays to begin with, but I respect him even more now.
A true superstar, the epitome of professionalism, and I still say, perhaps the best baseball player to ever play the game. It would’ve been spectacular to see Mantle’s uninjured career totals alongside Mays’, during the same epoch. And to think fans watching the ‘51 WS saw Joe D, Mantle, & Mays play against one another. Heck, I was a kid when Mantle & Joe D. died. Imagine, the Dodgers wanted him and refused him because he couldn’t hit a curveball! Imagine Robinson, Snider & Mays on the same ballclub?!
I also forgot one detail about Mays’ life: he was drafted into the Army. I do wonder if he would’ve beat Ruth’s all-time HR record with the additional two full seasons… it’s certainly very plausible, even likely.
Datashark
It reeks of helping Judge get his costs higher for competing offers, as I just don’t see a HR hitter like judge moving to SF (cause SF needs more than just him) or getting big payday there. I see LAD swooping in. I could see NYY, LAA, TEX, or HOU coming in. I see PHILLY or COL has the best place to pad his stats.
pc01
I want Houston to meet with Judge, just to see if that post gets 2,000 comments.
joemoes
I am a Yankees Fan and I think judge is gone. Warm weather, family, decent team. Your family, your wife’s family. Yankees will have to beat the offer significantly. Hal argued over money i arbitration and didn’t give him the extension he wanted in the off-season.
Rizzo may of signed for different reasons: he did not want to uproot is family again. Maybe he likes New York. Rizzo is also from Florida but who wants to play for the Florida teams. So he’s just a 2.5 hour flight home.
I am okay if Judge leaves for the giants I’ll be upset if it’s any other team.
And I hope the Yankees retool we can get a quality hitter and pitcher for judge money. Bellinger in a one year. Gallo with no shift, turner get creative;
Poster formerly known as . . .
I was with you until you mentioned Bellinger and Gallo. I could even stomach the one-year gamble on Bellinger — but Gallo? The shift isn’t going to help him much, if at all. He’s got one of the highest fly ball rates in baseball, and the shift affects infielders. Plus, he couldn’t handle the pressure of New York.
Hexbreaker
@joemoes
Warm weather? I’m guessing you’ve never spent a summer in San Francisco.
Yankee Clipper
“The coldest winter I ever had was July in San Francisco”
TrillionaireTeamOperator
I am guessing SF primarily addressed any potential competitiveness concerns from Judge with a sales pitch about what else they can and will spend to reload the rotation and the batting order with players to effectively compliment Judge no matter what they may spend on Judge himself, plus some kind of commitment to Judge’s charitable interests and so on.
So for Judge to go to the Giants the contract offer will be fair value but the sales pitch will be about every other aspect of the relationship.
The Giants might be pitching a Miami Heat/Miami Marlins approach, when they tried to put together super teams just using free agency. It rarely works or sometimes only works for a year- sign Judge, re-sign Rodon long term, etc etc. but SF is pretty good at putting together balanced line ups and they have a history of having one mega paid mega power hitting outfielder…
xtraflamy
Reading that the Giants got Steph Curry to help recruit Judge. Probably to talk to him about how the SF Bay market can cater to a superstar, what opportunities are available making money, and to speak to raising a family.
goob
@TTO Just to add to that: For the moment, they only have about $20M in commitments in 2024 – so there should be plenty of space to re-enter the FA market again next off-season – to add to whatever they do this year.
pbfog
Amazing update.
rememberthecoop
Of course they’re going to say the meeting went well. How could it go badly? Judge shows up and spits in their faces? But I still believe he’s just gathering bids so he can go back to Hal and tell him how much he’s going to have to pay. I can’t see him leaving. He’s the King of New York!
TrillionaireTeamOperator
The King of New York? That’d be Bill Pullman or Christopher Walken
LordD99
Yes, Giants, please make your offer to Judge. The Yankees have already made their updates offer last week. Once he has the Giants offer, he can then go back to the Yankees for their counteroffer, then he signs and we can all move on.
Dock_Elvis
San Francisco is an incredibly financially sound and well managed organization. They’re kind of the flip side of the Los Angeles Angels.
They don’t scream winner in 2023 at this point. But I believe signing Judge they’d then work on pieces. The Giants have Yankee money thus off-season. This might not be easy for New York if they’re intent on Judge. It’s easy to envision the Giants going 3 deep in major free agent signings.
afl forever
Wonder if the Red Sox have interest?
stroh
One thing is that until Judge signs, none of the other major players will. His contract will set the bar. I think $300-350M for 7 years is not out of the question.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
I could see that. If he’s seeking 8 years for the maximum overall amount of money, a team could offer a higher AAV to get judge what he wants financially and give themselves an earlier out date on the deal.
iH8PaperStraws
It’s already been reported that’s he’s seeking 8 for $320mm. So that the offer to sign him right away. He’s not signed so any offers aren’t anyway close to that. If the dodger rumor is correct, it would be close to the right offer. That would put him at $30.5mm AAV, $100m ahead of Mookie Betts whose average seasonal WAR is identical to Judges. The giants slightly overpay and give him 7/$230mm.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
I think he was seeking 8 years/$320M before he broke the home run record and won MVP. At this point he is definitely seeking more than $320M over 8 years.
The Yankees offered him around $20-$40M more than that and he didn’t sign.
I think he’s looking to break Scherzer’s AAV record and get 8 years, or more. So that’d be at least $43.4M x 8 = $347.2M but what’s $7.2M at this level? So he is probably asking for 8 years/$360M or as much as 10 years/$500M.
bradthebluefish
Of course he goes to the SF Giants as the first non-Yankees team to interview with.
goastros123
He’s from San Franisco.
Yankee Clipper
Actually, it is reported he spoke with the LAD first (after the Yankees, naturally, due to the exclusive negotiating window), who also gave him a short-term, high AAV offer, which Judge declined. I haven’t been able to verify that yet, other than the unreliable Twitter posts from Hector Gomez.
I have it much more reliably that NYY offered him an 8-or 9-year, $337M contract, however. How that’s broken up exactly (signing bonus, buyout, etc) is unknown.
goastros123
I read in passing that the Dodgers made an offer and was rejected, but it was from a site I didn’t recognize so I didn’t think it was true. I didn’t know he really met with them.
Yankee Clipper
I am not entirely sure about LAD because of the source, honestly, Goastros. It sounds plausible though.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
What was the reported Dodgers offer and where are you getting this info, Yankee Clipper? I am guessing like 3 years/$160M or 4 years/$180M?
goastros123
I got this from a quick Google search: dodgersnation.com/dodgers-rumors-aaron-judge-repor…
Yankee Clipper
The LAD one was from Twitter – Hector Gomez, who covers the LAD. But it may have even been one additional source removed (so a another Twitter report referencing Gomez as a source of that info). He’s not the most reliable, if I recall correctly though. And I didn’t see any numbers at that time, just that it was short-term, high-AAV.
The Yankees source I can’t publicize, man. It’s not a reporter and it not supposed to be released. I can say that I think you will see that number, in some variation, come out sooner or later. Unless the information I received was wrong – lolol.
Poster formerly known as . . .
He gone.
‘Shortly before 8 p.m. on Tuesday, a few hours after Aaron Judge’s two-day meeting with the Giants ended, Joc Pederson opened his Instagram and posted an image of the slugger in a Giants jersey, along with the message, “We’re ready when u are 99.” The story soon was shared by Brandon Crawford and Logan Webb, but in trying to convince the American League MVP to leave the New York Yankees for his hometown team, the Giants are not relying only on their stars.
‘As part of their pitch, the Giants put Judge in touch with Steph Curry’s camp, hopeful that the two superstars could connect as Judge weighs his decision, sources told NBC Sports Bay Area. If all goes according to plan, they’ll soon play in the same San Francisco neighborhood.
‘Judge arrived in the city Monday and met with Giants officials for two days, with conversations kicking off Monday night at Oracle Park, where Judge and his agent had dinner with CEO Larry Baer, president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi, manager Gabe Kapler and other members of the organization. The Giants continued to meet with Judge for most of the day Tuesday.’
goastros123
Let’s wait and see, Fink. He hasn’t signed yet.
Dock_Elvis
I would expect the multi-day wooing, especially with SF. I’m not sure what it really means.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
The Dodgers offer was reportedly for $214M, which I am guessing means it was a 4 year offer. That’s the only length that would make sense for that total when you divide by years and see the various AAV scenarios: 3 years it would’ve been an insane $71.333M AAV, which just seems extremely unlikely to impossible and 5 years would be $42.8M which actually seems very plausible, but also very matchable by any other club seriously pursuing Judge and any of those other clubs would then offer him 3-5 more years at that same AAV and a 6 year term on $214M would “only” be $35.66M a season which again, seems pretty low for a player of Aaron Judge’s calibre and free agency demand.
It’s pretty surprising, but I guess they were banking on the ego of the highest AAV ever on a 4 year deal or one of the highest AAV’s ever on a 5 year deal enticing him?
Plus why would they offer Judge that contract when they gave Betts 12 years? I get they’re different players- different body types, different histories of injury or lack of injury, etc. and Betts accepted a ton of deferment on his deal, something Judge almost certainly will not accept- but even so.
Any scenario for that $214M Dodgers offer seems really illogical.
Poster formerly known as . . .
The source of that story about an alleged LA offer comes from some guy in the Dominican Republic named Ramón Carmona who’s touting himself as a movie producer on Twitter. I’m guessing he posted it as a bid for followers, and it probably worked — at least for a day.
iH8PaperStraws
The Betts contract kicked in when he was 28. That gives almost 7 years of MVP level play and his body type and type of play should age better. If $224mm was a real number it would have been for 6 years max, but probably 7. There is no market for Judge at $40mm per year. There is only the 3 teams and they aren’t going to go above a certain number and other top contracts have already set the precedence for where that ceiling will be.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
You’re the only person who honestly thinks this and you seem disturbingly passionate that Judge is not worth $40M a season, even though less valuable players get $32-35M a season and they got those deals a few years ago….
goastros123
Some players do play well past 31. Kirby Puckett certainly did. Let’s wait and see.
iH8PaperStraws
I am far from the only realistic person who pays attention to what actually happens compared to the fantasy pushed out there. And who are these lesser players after you factor in position? The contract may have ended up looking badly but at the time those players were also coming off great years with elite production for their entire careers before that. Even Anthony Rendon at the time was thought of so highly.
JackStrawb
Kirby Puckett had 1 great year after 31, two fairly good years, and one bad one. Then it was over.
Imagine wrecking your mid-market team by signing Puckett to an 8/280m deal after his age 31 season. 16 WAR and out, and carrying 35m with no return for half those years. Brutal.
goastros123
You might want to look again because he didn’t have a bad season after he turned 31.
JackStrawb
You’ll probably want to brush up on cumulative stats including defensive stats, showing Kirby was the worst OFer in baseball in 1993. Fangraphs has him at barely above replacement level, at 0.3 (zero point three) fWAR, including -32 runs on defense. That’s shockingly bad, but consistent with his age and general decline.
It’s also a touch disingenuous to pretend that seasons a player was too hurt to play aren’t bad seasons. The context of the conversation was long term deals. Had Kirby signed an 8 to 10 year deal after his age 31 season, it would have been catastrophic for the signing team given his non-existent production the last 4 to 6 years.
goastros123
“You’ll probably want to brush up on cumulative stats including defensive stats, showing Kirby was the worst OFer in baseball in 1993. Fangraphs has him at barely above replacement level, at 0.3 (zero point three) fWAR, including -32 runs on defense. That’s shockingly bad, but consistent with his age and general decline.” – and yet offensively, he was just fine. He easily could’ve been a DH up until the eye injury, There’s obviously to more baseball than just defense. Yes, I’m aware he’s a 6 time gold glove and he was able to produce despite ecline on the defensive side. He was still Kirby Puckett.
“It’s also a touch disingenuous to pretend that seasons a player was too hurt to play aren’t bad seasons. The context of the conversation was long term deals. Had Kirby signed an 8 to 10 year deal after his age 31 season, it would have been catastrophic for the signing team given his non-existent production the last 4 to 6 years.” –
1. that depends on what you consider a bad season. What is a bad season to YOU? To me, a bad season is a full season where a player is unable to play to live up the standard set by themself. Example Yuli Gurriel won a batting title last season at the age of 37 and hit only just .242 this season. After 1995, Puckett didn’t play a full MLB season again due to injuries.
2. Yes, that would’ve been a horrible decision in HINDSIGHT (keyword right there). Hindsight is also 2020. I can name other players who did very well after they turned 31, just like Kirby did. Want some examples?
goastros123
Literally use any player from the following list as an example of how not all players get less valuable the older they get: calltothepen.com/2021/04/25/mlb-history-best-caree… Not every player is as good as these guys, but it’s very possible Judge is still productive after the age of 31 and thus, who ever signs him gets their money’s worth. We have to wait and see.
iH8PaperStraws
And Betts was already under contract when he signed with Dodgers. Unless they they are on a small market club, The top end player will eventually realize the offer they get from the club they are already in are usually very close to not better then what they will get on the open market. Soto is another example, he won’t ever get close to what he already turned down from the Nationals.
iH8PaperStraws
And! The Dodgers had to make sure they didn’t trade away high prospect capital(at the time) for just a year and a couple of months of Betts. So they too probably paid more then they had to.
TrillionaireTeamOperator
But if they paid him what they paid him in order to secure the trade and keep him around after giving up those prospects, then they paid him what they had to pay him- not more….
Again- do you think baseball teams should not pay players and force them all to retire at 29 years and 364 days old or 30 years and 364 days old or something?
So so so many players play to their peak value until about 33 and then are still valuable until they’re almost 40, just not as valuable- but even then they might not command their previous top dollar free agent salary but they still get paid very well.
I’m trying to understand, guest678— do you just automatically assume nobody 30 or older is worth free agent money? And if a 26 year old is worth an 8 or 12 year deal, then a 30 year old is still worth a 4-6 year deal, minimum- and again they have benchmarks of total dollars in mind when they hit free agency, so the extra years are often there to keep the AAV down and get the players all the money they were seeking- money they’re worth when you consider how profitable baseball is as a business and that these elite players are the product.
iH8PaperStraws
I never said anything about not signing players over 30, but rather their contract expectations need to adjusted for their age. Players do have a Total dollar figure in mind, but they have to be realistic of their age. As I’ve said before, the history clearly shows no $300mm+ contract has ever been issued with less than a 10 year agreement and Judge certainly won’t get one at age 31. Freddie Freeman is a very perfect example of the trend to sign players who plate over 30 to deals that end in their age 37/38 season depending upon their birthday. Most players aren’t going to play well beyond their age 37 season and if they happen to be an outlier they can go year to year and make additional high salaries. But clubs are more willing to bet on the norm as oppose to the a player actually being an exception. The contracts that do take a player past their the contracts that cross the $300mm total value come at an AAV no where near the $40mm+ you and the Boras propaganda machine keep vomiting. And they are structured in a way with time on their side and several more years of elite production than those signed by their higher aged counter parts. Albert Pujols is one of the top 5 best players in MLB history and look terrible that contract ended. They paid him $30mm to go away.
JackStrawb
@TrillionaireTeamOperator “So so so many players play to their peak value until about 33 and then are still valuable until they’re almost 40,”
—-That betrays a failure to do even the most basic research so complete it’s actually offensive. A typical team in 2021 had on average one regular position player over 33 who was worth a lineup spot.
“So many”?
—-Pure derangement.
Braves: none
Dodgers: one
Astros: two
Yankees: none
Cardinals: one
Seattle: none
A couple of these teams had one guy eating up a lineup slot and putting up one win or less playing nearly full=time. That’s a bad player. The number of players 33 and over worth a slot is almost trivial.
outinleftfield
The Yankees offered him 7 years and $215 million before. I think this offseason they offered him a deal that ends after that same age 36 season. 6 years. This time its for $240 million. Less years, more dollars. And its still not going to be enough because someone is desperate enough to go 8.
baseballguru
The Redsox #1 need is OUTFIELD a RH Power Bat, RF good Defense, SBs, you must sign Aaron Judge John Henry! No free agent has matched up better to a Redsox need than Aaron Judge in it’s history! If ever there was a time to refuse to lose a player #99 is The differencemaker! Lock up Devers, Let Story take SS play Arroyo at 2b Utility full time, snag 1 Ace short term high aav. Fix the bullpen & get some rings! Ya gotta get Judge!
baseballguru
REDSOX! JUDGE! DUH…IT’S THE BABE AQUISITION ONLY THIS TIME BOSTON GETS THEIR MAN! A GENERATIONAL TALENT…DON’T BLOW THIS JOHN HENRY TIME TO TELL C. BLOOME WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN ON THIS 1 CHANCE IN A LIFETIME PLAYER!
The Saber-toothed Superfife
Wait until.he realizes this is his last chance to play on a team with Miguel Cabrera…..Scott Boras and his.money be daxxed……
BringToughnessBack
Remember the boos at home Judge. Go back home and avoid those fans or better yet, Fenway is calling. Or join a team that has been to thenSeries in the past 13 years.
JackStrawb
The boos were effed up. I can see it for a guy jaking it down the line (as Mantle did in one World Series) or pulling something similarly boneheaded and lazy, but hitting 62 HR then blanking in the postseason isn’t a failure of nerve or will, it’s just bad luck against strong pitching.
I’m not a fan of Judge, but that was foolishness from Yankee fans.
JackStrawb
The Giants’ farm is ranked 9th, iirc, so good but hardly on the verge of fueling a renaissance in SF. Why would Judge go to an old team without a strong cast of young players on hand to complement a $220m payroll (assuming), or $180m after his signing? Of their decent young position players they’ve got Bart and Estrada and…?
$ talks to players, most of the time, but Judge should know by now that if he’s a marginal HOFer, the ‘he played with one team his entire career’ narrative is still beloved by the writers doing the electing.
GarryHarris
Aaron Judge visiting the Giants is “theater”. The collusion case was classless. Let Judge walk, NYY.
JackStrawb
There’s an unstated cost to the huge overpays made in order to get a bite out of the end of a great player’s prime. A team signing Judge to an 8/306m deal is probably punting any real chance at competing for the last two years of that deal, and if he tears an ACL and never really heals, and can still take the field which obviates insurance reimbursement, it may be far worse than just two years.
The Mets could easily finish 3rd in their division despite a $300m payroll in 2023 thanks to the foolishness and shortsightedness of trading for and signing Lindor, and signing Scherzer (especially while failing to extend Nimmo during 2021, when he would have been reasonably priced, and doing sensible basic things like paying a little extra to get an option year on Ottavino and Walker, and otherwise ensuring that they weren’t starting from scratch wrt pitching after 2022).
Top end salaries are so high now that there’s often little surplus value even in the first years of those deals—while the last years can cripple teams.