The Reds efforts to slice payroll while remaining at least on the periphery of the Wild Card race fell flat. An 11-game losing streak in April set the stage for what would prove to be a dismal season, with Cincinnati tying the Pirates for the third-worst record in the majors. With questions about the extent of ownership’s desired paring of the payroll, the Reds find themselves without a great path back to contention next year.
Guaranteed Contracts
- Joey Votto, 1B: $32MM through 2023 (including $7MM buyout of 2024 club option)
- Mike Moustakas, 3B: $22MM through 2023 (including $4MM buyout of 2024 club option)
Option Decisions
- Mike Minor, LHP: $13MM mutual option (Royals responsible for $1MM buyout)
- Justin Wilson, LHP: $1.22MM club option (no buyout)
Total 2023 commitments: $43MM
Total future commitments: $54MM
Arbitration-Eligible Players (service time in parenthesis, projections via Matt Swartz)
- Kyle Farmer (4.129) — $5.9MM
- Luis Cessa (5.131) — $2.6MM
- Nick Senzel (3.150) — $2.2MM
- Aristides Aquino (3.003) — $1.6MM
- Buck Farmer (5.140) — $1.4MM
- Lucas Sims (4.014) — $1.3MM
- Jeff Hoffman (4.105) — $1.2MM
- Justin Dunn (3.016) — $1.1MM
- Derek Law (3.081) — $900K
- Aramis Garcia (3.036) — $800K
- Tejay Antone (3.000) — $800K
Non-tender candidates: Cessa, Aquino, Buck Farmer, Law, Garcia
Free Agents
The Reds aren’t far removed from their last rebuild. Cincinnati lost 90+ games each season from 2015-18, finishing at the bottom of the NL Central every year. They stockpiled high draft picks along the way, and they began to push forward midway through the 2019 campaign. Despite being out of contention at that year’s deadline, they acquired Trevor Bauer via trade. They followed up by signing Mike Moustakas and Nick Castellanos to four-year free agent guarantees, setting 2020 as their clear target date for a return to competitiveness.
To a very small extent, the Reds showed some progress that year. They finished 31-29 during the shortened season, qualifying for the expanded playoffs but being swept out of the Wild Card round. Whatever aggressiveness they’d shown the year prior waned in the aftermath of the pandemic season, as the Reds didn’t make any strong efforts to build out the roster over the 2020-21 offseason. They hovered around .500 for most of last year, flirting with Wild Card contention into September but ultimately coming up short. To the dismay of the fanbase, they then set about tearing down the roster as a means of cutting costs.
Over the winter, the Reds shipped out Tucker Barnhart, Wade Miley, Sonny Gray and Jesse Winker and Eugenio Suárez in a package deal to get out from under the remainder of Suárez’s contract. They watched Castellanos opt out and sign with the Phillies. Cincinnati made a series of late additions, bringing in Tommy Pham, Donovan Solano, Colin Moran and Hunter Strickland on one-year deals and acquiring Mike Minor from the Royals to backfill the rotation. Their host of subtractions left them with no margin for error if they wished to remain competitive, with very little in the way of depth capable of weathering injuries or underperformance from anticipated contributors. The Reds dealt with plenty of both, and the result was a 62-100 season that again leaves the team near the bottom of the majors.
Getting back to competitiveness in 2023 would require an unexpected renewed willingness from ownership to push spending forward, one which doesn’t seem to be on the horizon. Meeting with reporters last week (link via Bobby Nightengale of the Cincinnati Enquirer), general manager Nick Krall indicated the team plans to “come into (2023) in a similar place that we are right now.” While Krall called the team’s results “not acceptable” and indicated the club would add to the roster in some capacity, he also suggested the roster would be composed of a number of young players. Most players early in their career, of course, are playing on pre-arbitration or relatively low arbitration salaries, and Nightengale reported the Reds were likely to further slice payroll this offseason.
Cincinnati entered 2022 with a player payroll in the $114MM range, per Cot’s Baseball Contracts. Midseason trades of Luis Castillo and Tyler Mahle only trimmed that further, and Cincinnati is sure to decline its end of a $13MM mutual option on Minor’s services. They only have $43MM in guaranteed money on the books for next season, with the final seasons of the Joey Votto and Moustakas contracts their only commitments. They’ll owe an additional combined $11MM at the end of the year to buy that duo out, leaving the books completely empty going into 2024.
That figure doesn’t include projected salaries for arbitration-eligible players, and the Reds do have 11 players who’ll qualify for that process. Around half that group figures to be non-tendered, though, with utilityman Kyle Farmer headlining the class with a salary in the $6MM range. Even if Cincinnati retains each of Farmer, Nick Senzel, Luis Cessa, Jeff Hoffman, Lucas Sims, Tejay Antone and Justin Dunn, that group shouldn’t combine for much more than $15MM. Precisely where ownership will draw the spending line is unclear, but there should at least be room for a handful of low-cost one-year deals late in the offseason again.
While Krall and his front office will have budgetary constraints in the players they’re targeting, they are free to add at virtually any position on the roster. In his meeting with reporters last week, the front office head suggested nobody has a guaranteed position. “Everyone is going to have to come in and win a roster spot,” Krall said (via Nightengale). “That’s just the way it is. I don’t know if we have a ‘this is going to absolutely be this person’s position on Opening Day.’ I think we have to come in, evaluate where everybody is, and players have to earn those roster spots.”
There’s probably some amount of hyperbole in those comments. It’s hard to envision a scenario where second-year pitchers Nick Lodolo and Hunter Greene aren’t in the Opening Day rotation if healthy. Tyler Stephenson will be the #1 catcher, and 2021 NL Rookie of the Year Jonathan India figures to get an opportunity to bounce back from a down ’22 campaign at second base. The Reds do have a few young players who are virtual locks for certain roles to start next season.
To Krall’s point, there aren’t many positions locked down though. Much of the infield is an open question. Votto is a franchise icon and a potential future Hall of Famer, but he hit only .205/.319/.370 over 376 plate appearances before undergoing rotator cuff surgery in August. It’s hard to imagine the Reds taking him out of the primary lineup in what figures to be a non-competitive season regardless, but they could look to curtail his playing time a bit at age 39. Votto is entering the final guaranteed season of the ten-year extension he signed in 2012, and it could well be his final season in a Reds uniform.
India figures to join him on the right side of the infield on most days. The other side of the second base bag is a major question mark. Cincinnati gave some late-season playing time to the combination of José Barrero and Spencer Steer, the latter of whom was acquired from the Twins in the Mahle trade. Both players are 24 years old and came with some top-100 prospect support during their time in the minor leagues. Neither has played well in limited big league time to date. Steer has been below-average, and Barrero had an awful season, both in the majors and at Triple-A.
Steer saw the majority of his time at third base, mixing in some work at first base and at the keystone. Barrero played exclusively at shortstop. Steer has hit well throughout his minor league career and is likely to open the season as the favorite for playing time at the hot corner, but the Reds could start him back in Triple-A Louisville if they feel he’d benefit from further development time. It’s hard to count on Barrero as the Opening Day shortstop after he’s hit .170/.215/.223 through his first 93 big league games. Top prospect Elly De La Cruz has jumped Barrero as the player most likely to be their long-term shortstop. He’ll have to be added to the 40-man roster this winter. De La Cruz isn’t going to start the season in the majors after striking out in more than 30% of his Double-A plate appearances, but he could factor in later in the year. Noelvi Marte is also going to be added to the 40-man this offseason, although he’s yet to reach Double-A and probably won’t play in the majors until 2024 at the earliest.
In the interim, while the Reds would surely love for Barrero to show some of the power-athleticism combination that made him such a well-regarded prospect, they could look to a veteran stopgap at shortstop. Perhaps that’s Kyle Farmer, who has been a capable utility option for two seasons running. The 32-year-old is better suited for a bench role than an everyday job on a contender, but he can hold down shortstop (or third base, if the Reds wanted to give Steer more time in Louisville as well) for a team in transition. There’s a chance the Reds shop Farmer this winter, but he’s projected for a $5.9MM arbitration salary and would have modest trade value after a .255/.315/.386 showing.
Moustakas is also at least a tangential factor in the infield. The veteran left-handed hitter was a productive power bat at his peak, but he’s battled a number of lower half injuries and hit .211/.289/.356 over 491 plate appearances since the start of 2021. One could argue for the Reds to just eat the remainder of Moustakas’ contract and turn his roster spot over to someone else, since they’re certainly not going to be able to shed any notable amount of the $22MM he’s still owed in any event. Yet if he’s still on the roster come Opening Day, Moustakas could find himself in the corner infield/designated hitter mix.
Things aren’t any clearer on the outfield grass. Among players still under club control, Senzel, Aristides Aquino, TJ Friedl and Jake Fraley logged the most outfield action in 2022. Aquino and Senzel again disappointed. Aquino is virtually certain to be non-tendered this offseason. Cincinnati could at least consider the same with Senzel, who now owns a .240/.303/.360 line in over 1000 big league plate appearances. Those rough offensive performances mean he’s projected for a modest $2.2MM arbitration salary, however, and the front office will probably give the former #2 overall pick one more shot. Friedl and Fraley will be back after decent seasons; neither is an obvious everyday player, but each could see fairly regular playing time depending on what other moves the Reds do or do not make.
With both Friedl and Fraley hitting from the left side, a right-handed outfielder could be on the wish list. Chad Pinder, Wil Myers (who’ll be bought out by the Padres), Kevin Pillar and old friend Adam Duvall are among the affordable free agents who’d fit that bill. Pillar and Duvall are both capable of logging some time in center field, although neither is a great defender there at this stage of their careers.
Cincinnati is also likely to bring in a veteran catcher to back up Stephenson. Garcia signed a minor league deal and broke camp last spring, but he didn’t hit well when healthy and lost most of the second half to injury. He’s a non-tender candidate, with the Reds likely to bring in a new experienced backstop to assume a part-time role. Robinson Chirinos, Kevin Plawecki and former Reds Barnhart and Curt Casali are all headed to free agency.
With a number of unproven players likely to assume regular roles, the team will be counting on some to take steps forward. Cincinnati has already parted ways with hitting coach Alan Zinter and will turn to a new voice to guide their young bats. Manager David Bell will return for a fifth season, but a good chunk of his coaching staff will be overhauled.
That’s not the case for pitching coach Derek Johnson and assistant pitching coach Eric Jagers, both of whom are returning. They’ll be working with a number of young players themselves. Lodolo and Greene are former top ten draftees who made their major league debuts early this year. Both missed some time with injuries but showed promise when healthy. Lodolo pitched to a 3.66 ERA with an excellent 29.7% strikeout rate through 19 starts. Greene had a 4.44 ERA as he battled some home run issues, but he punched out 30.9% of batters faced over 24 outings.
They’ll be back at the top of the rotation, and another 2022 rookie could join them in the opening five. Graham Ashcraft made 19 starts this season, pitching fairly well early before tailing off in the final month. He finished with a 4.89 ERA, posting a below-average 15.3% strikeout rate but inducing ground-balls at a stellar 54.5% clip. Ashcraft isn’t a lock for the Opening Day rotation as Lodolo and Greene are, but he looks to have the inside track at a job.
That’s in part a reflection of the uncertainty at the back of the starting staff. Among in-house options, Cessa, Vladimir Gutiérrez, Dunn and Connor Overton led the team in rotation innings. Cessa is a swingman who could be non-tendered. Gutiérrez will miss most or all off next year recovering from Tommy John surgery. Dunn lost most of this season to shoulder issues and hasn’t had much MLB success through three seasons. Overton has bounced between a number of teams as a minor league journeyman. Brandon Williamson, acquired from Seattle in the Winker/Suárez trade, walked more than 14% of opponents at Triple-A. Anyone from that group could compete for innings, but penciling two of them into the season-opening rotation behind Lodolo, Greene and Ashcraft wouldn’t work.
The Reds will probably dip into the lower tiers of the free agent rotation market as a result. Chad Kuhl, Michael Pineda and Trevor Williams are among a host of back-end starters who’d only cost a few million dollars. The Reds’ hitter-friendly home ballpark could work against their efforts to pursue bounceback candidates, but they can promise a fair bit of opportunity.
There’s a chance for a similar low-cost flier in the bullpen. Cincinnati has had one of the league’s worst relief corps over the past couple seasons. Alexis Díaz was one of the team’s few bright spots in 2022, emerging as a late-game weapon. He’s not likely to repeat this year’s 1.84 ERA with how many fly balls he’s surrendered, but he’s a lock for high-leverage work. 2021 breakout hurler Antone missed all of this season rehabbing from Tommy John surgery, but he should be ready for Opening Day. Sims, Hoffman and Ian Gibaut are among the returning right-handed options, but the Reds could look for a left-hander.
Cincinnati holds a $1.22MM club option over Justin Wilson, but he’s likely to be let go after undergoing Tommy John surgery this June. Reiver Sanmartin is the only southpaw who finished the year in the MLB bullpen. He had a 2.96 ERA and a 54.3% grounder rate, but he had below-average strikeout and walk numbers. Even if the front office doesn’t go into MLB free agency, adding a left-handed bullpen arm via waivers or on a minor league deal is likely to be on the docket.
While Krall and his staff figure to make some small moves, the additions are likely to be around the margins. The 2023 campaign is going to be another trying season, with the Reds seemingly looking to 2024 and beyond as their more realistic window for contention. Cincinnati has stockpiled a decent amount of minor league talent, partially as a result of the deals that have torn down the MLB roster. Shortly after the trade deadline, Kiley McDaniel of ESPN ranked the Reds’ farm system #9 in the majors. As that upper level talent continues to matriculate to the big leagues and hopefully joins Stephenson, India, Lodolo and Greene, Cincinnati can begin to see their next contending core.
That’ll coincide with the removal of the Votto and the Moustakas contracts from the books. The long-term financial flexibility could allow them to explore extension talks with any of their intriguing young players who are already at the big league level this winter. Even if nothing comes together on that front, it should afford the front office some freedom after 2023 to attack some of the roster’s weaknesses with more urgency. There are glimmers of long-term hope for Cincinnati, but the fanbase looks to be in for another frustrating offseason and rough year before that hope can materialize into legitimate success.
Big whiffa
Prospect and system rankings are large market bias. Last year Sea was a top 5 system, reds acquired the whole top of their system, plus Cruz, other acquisitions, and all their draft picks yet system is ranked 9th. And that’s bc when u write about reds – it doesn’t generate clicks
Dustyslambchops23
System rankings are a combination of top end talent and depth. Reds got the top end pieces but still lack depth in their system to make it a top 5
drasco036
Seriously? You just said that? Did you forget or choose to ignore that the ranking included Kirby, Rodriguez, Brash and Religh? That’s four of their top ten guys that were moved off the prospect to the team… you didn’t get the whole top of their farm system… you got a couple players from their previously ranked number 1 system… a lot of those guys moved to the majors… has nothing to do with market.
User 401527550
The Rays are perennial top farm systems in baseball? I don’t think your statement is factually based.
gbs42
Big whiffa with the worst take I’ve read here in a while.
sportsarerigged
Dude, us reds fans can only argue about our system ranking. What else do we have?
Big whiffa
#14 ranked prospect De La Cruz hit 304/359/586 w 47 steals
#5 Volpe hit 249/352/460 w 50 steals
#8 Cartaya 254/389/503
De La Cruz is younger than both and even plays at a higher level than cartaya. Do u know why he’s ranked lower ? Bc he’s a red and Volpe and Cartaya play for dodgers and yanks.
Did you hear that ? That’s the sound of the mic hitting the floor
gbs42
Cartaya is a catcher, so the offensive bar is lower.
Volpe is closer to the majors, so he’s more of a known quantity.
De La Cruz has a high strikeout rate and defensive issues that could push him to 3B, where the offensive expectations are higher than SS.
Please pick that mic so I can drop it. BOOM!
nottinghamforest13
Things have gone downhill for the franchise ever since they lost Thom Brennaman.
OKBaseballFan
I pride myself as a man of faith…
tstats
…As there’s a drive to deep left field by Castellanos and it will be a home run…
earmbrister
No big loss.
Fire Krall
Shoulda just said Reds are horrible, no chance in hell. Sell the team Bob!
Big whiffa
I like will Myers in cincy ! He would be a solid investment as he could be next years Brandon Drury with a higher ceiling.
redsfanman
Don’t tell anyone, but I see Wil Myers as a good candidate for a 1 year deal, as a righthanded OF/1b/DH who could play everyday and benefit from playing in GABP. All the reasons why Reds fans will hate that are simultaneously reasons to make him consider coming here. I doubt he’s getting any big multi-year contract offers this winter.
He’d fill a void for the Reds and be tradable to a contender if he does well. I’m skeptical a true contender would give him a guaranteed everyday job, while GABP is an appealing place to hit.
Every other free agent OF they could pursue also has their own red flags.
Fire Krall
Judge, Degrom and Correa! In the Nati!
Rsox
Odd that they would all have the same connecting flight
Fire Krall
In town to see the Bengals play? or maybe buying the team?
schellis 2
It isn’t happening of course, but it wouldn’t be the first time that the Reds had a hall of fame OF and SS demand to play in Cincinnati.
Tigers3232
Did you just refer to Correa as a HOF SS LMAO
redsfanman
In terms of the wide range of options open to Krall, it’s worth noting that Steer isn’t ‘just’ a 3b, but played 1b, 2b, 3b, and even some SS in 2022. India perhaps gets moved off 2b. Steer and India both look like everyday players in 2023, even if their defensive positions are uncertain today. Fraley and Friedl might not be ‘everyday’ players, but they’re on the strong side of platoons, with quantifiable success against RHPs, while being nominally able to play all 3 OF positions – they figure to play a lot, even if their defensive position is decided by less versatile teammates, like the external addition of a lumbering LF.
INF Matt McLain will be getting closer as the season progresses, as another guy the organization will likely factor in sooner rather than later. Another guy with a versatile skill set to play multiple positions (played SS/2b as professional, plus 3b and CF in college in 2019), rather than limited to the bottom of the defensive spectrum. His role is presumably decided by limitations of his teammates, more than his own skill set.
Votto (1b), Stephenson (C), and Barrero (SS, as his value comes from defense at that position) seem like the only guys with set defensive positions, which offers plenty of versatility to work with.
Several top hitting prospects (Elly De La Cruz [EDLC], Matt McLain, Noelvi Marte, Christian Encarnacion-Strand [CES] seem likely to start 2023 at or above AA.
Graham Ashcraft is clearly a lock for the 2023 rotation, despite a bad final three starts after coming off the IL (16 ERs to raise his ERA from 3.97 to 4.89). He’s ~25, throws 100mphs, with a terrific ground ball rate. I definitely look forward to seeing his progress in his second year.
There’s a lot of payroll space between ~$58m (if all players are offered arbitration, which they won’t be) and the $100m+ where the team has long set its payroll.
FromTheCheapSeats
If I had to lay money today, I’d say Matt McLain leads the team in innings at SS next year.
Farmer might start out of camp, but it’s time to promote McClain and give him a shot.
FromTheCheapSeats
Moving India to the outfield is a bad idea. He’s never going to have enough pop to be much more than replacement level.
Stick at second base and keep him there.
There are a dozen things regarding this roster that should be higher priority than 2B. Other than (starting) catcher and two SP slots, it’s about the only thing that’s anywhere near settled.
Slider_withcheese
Reds fans deserve better than what ownership is putting on the field. Just ten years ago they were winning 90+ games.
Rsox
Votto and Moustakas will probably share 1B/DH duties
The team needs to bring in a Catcher that can handle semi-regular playing time in case Stephenson is injured again.
Kyle Farmer was decent at SS and certainly out-hit Barrero by a wide margin.
India and Steer should get 2B/3B, who plays where is what spring training games are for
The rotation and bullpen have lots of young arms though i expect Krall to sign several minor league deals like he did last winter to fill in the OF/bench/bullpen/veteran backend starter
redsfanman
Regarding Moustakas, I expect a decision will be made on him in the final days of spring training, as happened with Shogo Akiyama last winter. But, it seems like his targeted role would be as a lefty platoon bat, which is similar to Votto’s role at this point. I’m not sure how well they’d ‘share’ playing time, without multiple guys hurt.
You’re right that Farmer has out-hit Barrero by a wide margin, but other young shortstops (Matt McLain, Elly De La Cruz) are fast approaching. Personally, I think Barrero deserves one last opportunity to open 2023, further removed from his hand injury, to make his case. IF (and sure, that’s a big ‘IF’ at this point) Barrero can hit a bit, with his great defense, that’d be an important development, while Farmer is merely a warm body and placeholder until one of the young guys grabs the job.
It’ll be interesting to see what India does. Poor defensive metrics combined with the new shift rule, a surplus of 3b/SS candidates on top prospect lists, and the lack of corner outfielders. I expect to see India play everyday in 2023, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him at 3b or in the outfield. He’s a bat-first player with a good arm. He’s part of the offense’s future, but I don’t think his future is at 2b. I also think he’s a better fielder than a DH, and unlikely to be Votto’s successor at 1b.
redsorbust
I hope it’s Votto and Stephenson share DH and they DFA Moustakas.
redsfanman
What do I see the offseason priorities as?
-A right-handed hitting outfielder! If that’s a LF, fine. Fraley and Friedl are lefty platoon players who would benefit from a righthanded complement. if it’s a guy who can play RF or even CF, even better.
-An inning eating veteran starter. Three rotation spots are spoken for, with myriad candidates for another. Hopefully being aware of their needs this winter allows them to better target an appealing candidate (ground ball rather than fly ball), while last winter they acquired Mike Minor for that role as the guy handed to them (by the Royals) after other starters had been traded. Pitching coach Derek Johnson has had plenty of success with his starters, both in Milwaukee and Cincinnati. Let him help choose/recruit a guy he wants. ‘Get the pitching’ was fairly successful in the past.
Hopefully LHP Brandon Williamson can make progress over his first offseason in Cincinnati. Maybe whatever mechanical problems resulted in his control drop-off can be fixed by a modern offseason throwing program. Hopefully he’ll join Greene, Lodolo, and Ashcraft as a 2023 rotation cornerstone. He’s got the talent. Shout out to Connor Phillips coming up behind him.
-HEALTH – One contributing factor as to why the 2022 Reds were so bad was injuries. The bullpen stands out in that regard, that most guys they counted on out of the bullpen got hurt. Hopefully some of the guys who impressed in 2020 and 2021 but dropped off a cliff or missed 2022 entirely (Antone, Sims, Warren, Santillan) have decent 2023 seasons.
Lets Go DBacks
Pretty impressive that the writer was able to put together such a lengthy article on this team and provide that much information. But with all due respect, when the actors in it are bad, no matter how good the script is, the outcome is still a lousy movie. Kudos to the writer though, he did what he could.
Lanidrac
Well, there are certain comedies with mediocre or worse acting (sometimes even purposely hammy) that are still fun to watch.
redsorbust
Agree writer did a good job. IF the Reds can maintain a reasonable health record, unlike this year and second year players and RP Antone and Sims come back and can play up to their potential and Reds sign a player or two that are more than just place holders then it could be an interesting year. All big IF’s I know but have to have hope for something good somewhere.
Deleted Userr
They couldn’t possibly have thought they would contend for a Wild Card spot this year!
Edp007
Jeepers they may get off to a worst start next year than this past season. What an abominable cast.
Even the Nats have more hope.
quonset point
The way this franchise is run is an embarrassment to its fans and to baseball.
Mikenmn
I can understand the sentimental attraction to Votto, but Moose has played 188 games since he was signed, and he has a .216/.300/.383 triple slash line with an OPS+ of 80, and negative cumulative WAR. I would assume they won’t cut him loose because they don’t want to pay both him and his replacement, but maybe they can off-load him packaged with a prospect. He shouldn’t be getting substantive playing time
drasco036
They threw Suarez into the Winkler trade because they didn’t want to pay him… worked out well for Seattle
Lanidrac
Though, as sad as it is, that level of performance may still make him one of their 13 best position player options at the beginning of next season.
redsorbust
Trade him (Moustakas), or DFA him but don’t let him take up a very valuable roster spot.
Armaments216
Inspired words from the Cincy GM. 2023 Reds: Accept the unacceptable.
Sunday Lasagna
Strategy: Load the farm, keep the farm loaded. Develop the players, keep developing players. Sign the ones that emerge to team friendly deals that take them through arbitration and a year or two of free agency. Continuously win.
The Braves do this better than anyone and they deserve the recognition for it.
…..but when the Reds or Pirates or Nats etc decide to use the strategy, the knee jerk reaction is “sell the team”
Give these guys a chance, there are stars that will emerge. India and Lodolo are two that can be the cornerstones of better days ahead.
ShawnM 2
I agree. I have a Facebook group for the Reds minor League teams. Care if I share this?
Sunday Lasagna
Sounds good @ shawn
Lanidrac
There are two major issues with what the Reds did last time, though.
1) Not enough good players managed to develop during their last rebuild to become a truly successful team.
2) They starting rebuilding again too early instead of taking advantage of legitimate chances to compete in a weak division in some overly frugal cost-cutting moves that made their ownership look lazy and cheap, even after accounting for all the lost revenue from the pandemic.
As for the Pirates, they’ve been stuck in a continuous rebuilding mode for the last 30 years that never manages to end, save for a small three year window of contention from 2013-2015.
Yankee Clipper
Perhaps the worst part about this is the fact that the Reds owner is looking at $43MM as way too high a payroll. He’s currently pondering how to cut more money…
Jim Tavegia
You have a great fan base and a very nice ball park, but it seems that management is not committed to putting a good team on the field, that means a .500 team. Pitching will lead any team, so if you have decent pitchers at 3A that are as good or better than what you have, bring them up and let them learn on the big club. Play Votto, but everyone else left that is on a one year deal, cut them lose and let the kids play. Build on defense and pitching and go from there.
Once you let Gray and Castillo go there is no where to go but young.
Lanidrac
Rushing prospects to the big leagues before they’re truly ready causes its own problems, though. They still need to sign some stop gap free agents on 1 year deals to protect against that and then hopefully flip them for decent prospects at the trade deadline.
Jim Tavegia
That is not what the owner of the Reds is going to do. signing FA for 1 year to do what, maybe get to .500? If a kids is too fragile to move from 3A to MLB he probably won’t make it anyway.
Lanidrac
Maybe not, but that’s what he should do, and it’s not to get them to .500 anyway. There are plenty of examples over the years of prospects who have had their development ruined or at least significantly delayed by being rushed to the Majors.
It also allows them to get some extra prospects by trading the ones having decent years at the deadline, and it’s not like they don’t have the payroll space to do so.
GarryHarris
This is the last year of Joey Votto and Mike Moustakes. Will Votto announce his retirement and final season? Payroll will be greatly reduced for 2024.
ShawnM 2
There are 2 ways a team can be consistent contenders. The first is to spend a lot of money, I don’t see the Reds ownership ever doing that. The second is to do like the Rays and trade players as they start to get expensive for prospects and when those prospects start to get expensive trade then, keeping a constant supply of good inexpensive players in the pipeline. The Rays payroll never gets over 75 million but they constantly have one of the best teams in baseball. I think this is what the Reds are trying to do
here is what the 2024 roster will look like if no one is added. There is a lot of good young talent Payroll would only be about 47 million so there would also be a lot of money to spend on free agents to fill holes. I know that all these prospects won’t work out, but some will. I know the roster below is not a winning team. I’m not trying to say it is. I’m just showing what players could be here. These players and a lot of money will make it a good roster. I know it’s a lot easier for me than most people to say “rebuild” even tho it would be a short one, because I love watching minor league baseball
Only thing I would do different than the Rays is pick a couple players to extend to be the face of your franchise. I’m not talking 10 year deals. I’m talking pick a player like India or Stephenson and buy out a couple years early. Give the player some security for their family, they will still be a free agent in time to secure a big contract. and gives the Reds a good player for a couple extra years. Reds should be able to sustain a payroll of 125 million or maybe a little more.
2024 roster and payroll
This is what the roster could look like in 2024.
C- Tyler Stephenson. -1st year arbitration , est. 3 million
C- Mark Kolozsvary or Matheu Nelson or Daniel Vellojin 740K
1B- Christian Encarnacion Strand 740K
2B Jonathan India- 1st year Arbitration, est. 3.5 million
SS- Jose Barrero est. 2.25M 1st year Arb.
3B- Spencer Steer 740K
OF- Elly De La Cruz 740K
OF- Noelvi Marte- 740K
OF- Jake Fraley- 1st year arbitration. Est 1 million
BN- Alejo Lopez – 1st year arbitration, est 1.25 million
BN- TJ Friedl – 1st year arbitration. Est. 1.25 million
BN- Matt Mclain 740,000
BN- Nick Senzel- 3rd year arbitration, est. 3.5 million
SP- Hunter Greene- 740,000
SP- Nick Lodolo- 740,000
SP- Graham Ashcraft- 740,000
SP- Andrew Abbott – 740,000
SP- Brandon Williamson 740,000
RP- Vlad Gutierrez 1st year Arb, est 1 million
RP- Ryan Hendrix- 1st arbitration. Set. 1 million
RP- Reiver SanMartin- 740,000
RP- TeJay Antone- 2nd year arbitration, est. 2.5 million
RP- Lucas Simms- 3rd year arbitration, est. 4 million
RP- Tony Santillan 1st year arbitration, est. 2 million
RP- Art Warren- 740,000
RP- Alexis Diaz- 740,000
There are a lot of other players that could be considered.
Justin Dunn- 2nd year arbitration, est 3 million
Graham Overton
Aristides Aquino. 1st year arbitration
Pre arbitration players-
Ivan Johnson, Francisco Urbaez, Brian Rey, Rece Hinds, Jose Torres, Christian Roa, Tyler Callihan, Allen Cerda,
Lorenzo Cedrola,
Michael Siani, Austin Hendrick, Daniel Duarte,
Jay Allen, Lyon Richardson, Dauri Moreta, Nick Quintana, Ronnie Dawson,
Brice Bonnin, Joe Boyle There are more pitchers I could have mentioned.
AgentF
Antone was legit before he got injured. Hope he comes back strong. Not because I actually like the Reds, I don’t, just liked the way the guy pitched.
OhioDodger
Need to go fishing for front office and baseball development people from the Tampa Bay Rays.
jorge78
Always nice to see a chance for the word “matriculate” be used
(in the penultimate paragraph) and it is well deployed.
Good times!
raulp
If only can get back half of the pitchers in the injured list, and excluding Minor and Strickland, Reds will be significant better next season.
Miamitws
Just saw the Marlins are looking for Centerfield help. Senzel should be available for cheap.
Any chance Naquin can be resigned?
What happened to the Chat for the Reds?