The Phillies, like most teams around the league, have plenty of work to do once the lockout is resolved and a new collective bargaining agreement is in place. With that in mind, it’s worth noting that NBC Sports Philadelphia’s Corey Seidman writes the Phils “pursued [Kyle] Schwarber hard” prior to the lockout but weren’t able to finalize an agreement.
The 28-year-old Schwarber (29 in March) shook off a slow couple months to begin the 2021 season, ripping through MLB pitching at a Herculean clip throughout the summer and into the postseason. The longtime Cubs slugger inked a one-year deal with the Nats last winter, found himself traded to the Red Sox despite being on the injured list due to a hamstring injury, and finished the regular season with a combined .266/.374/.554 batting line and 32 home runs in just 471 plate appearances. Schwarber added three more homers in the playoffs, though he closed out October with an 0-for-15 skid following an epic grand slam in Game 3 of the ALCS.
When finished, the new collective bargaining agreement is expected to include a universal designated hitter, which would make it easier for the Phillies (or another team) to slide the defensively challenged Schwarber into the lineup. He could still see some reps in left field or even at first base, of course, but Schwarber would be viewed largely as a much-needed bat to pair with reigning MVP Bryce Harper in Philadelphia.
Schwarber ought to have plenty of other suitors, as he’s been linked to the Red Sox, Nationals, Marlins and others since the offseason began. Barry Jackson of the Miami Herald reported not long ago that Schwarber is seeking a deal of at least three years and $20MM annually, though with enough competition the asking price could obviously further increase.
While supplementing the lineup with some help for Harper is a major goal, it wasn’t the top priority for Philadelphia this winter. President of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski made clear that solidifying the ninth inning was one of his top needs this winter, and the Phils look to have checked that box already.
Corey Knebel and the Phillies got their one-year, $10MM contract in just hours before the expiration of the 2016-21 CBA, and he’s expected to serve as the team’s closer in 2022, writes Matt Gelb of The Athletic. Dombrowski noted that he did not promise that role to Knebel (link viaNBC Philly’s Jim Salisbury), but he strongly suggested as much, telling reporters that Knebel opted for a one-year deal in order “to show people that he’s a dominant closer again” now that he’s healthier.
Knebel, who had Tommy John surgery in 2019, saw his fastball velocity jump two miles per hour from the 94.6 mph he averaged in his abbreviated return to the mound in 2020. While his 29.7% strikeout rate didn’t match the ridiculous 40.2% mark he posted in Milwaukee from 2017-18, it was nevertheless a strong mark and a reminder that Knebel can be as dominant as any reliever in the game when at his best.
Gelb suggests that a subsequent acquisition of Craig Kimbrel is unlikely to be in the cards, as the Phils aren’t likely to want to commit $26.5MM to a pair of relievers. Still, Knebel certainly won’t be the only addition to the ’pen. Said Dombrowski: “We’ve got a guy that we think will close games for us, and that’s a big start. Then we can kind of build the rest of the bullpen.”
The addition of Knebel and the Phillies’ one-year, $1.4MM deal with utilityman Johan Camargo pushed the team’s payroll to a bit more than $181MM — with a near-identical tally in terms of luxury obligations, per Roster Resource’s Jason Martinez. That’s well shy of last year’s $197MM end-of-season payroll and the even-larger $206.5MM in luxury obligations the team carried. Assuming the $210MM luxury-tax threshold is ultimately increased in a new CBA, the Phils could have quite a bit more luxury breathing room than the $29MM they already possess at the moment.
Tannel809
Kimbrel will be going back to Boston for Jackie Bradley Jr.
Chipper Jones' illegitimate kid
Doubt the White Sox are interested in anything of the sort. If you have to spend $16mil either way, I’d rather have Kimbrel.
Cubneck
I think it would be hilarious if Kimbrel somehow ended up back with the Cubs. Probably with a 3rd team involved. About a .0001% chance. But epic if it did. Lol
ChiSox_Fan
Schwarber will end up on White Sox!
Sox running out of options for left handed hitting RF!
Otherwise, Sox have to settle for Conforto.
DadsInDaniaBeach
Conforto isn’t trash…
thecoffinnail
Schwarber can’t play RF. He has a noodle arm and runs routes like he is blindfolded. No team would be foolish enough to put him in right. Cashman has always had a man crush on Schwarber. The Yankees are still my pick to land him. He will probably get 3/$65 something like that or 3/$60 with achievable goals for a 4th vesting/option year. They will commit to 1 fairly expensive bat this year. I could see them pushing for Rizzo and signing Schwarber if they miss on him. They have too many good SS prospects to sign Correa. Simmons would be my guess to be their opening day SS on a cheap 1 year deal with Peraza pushing him out mid season sometime. Wouldn’t surprise me to see Cashman trade a one of his SS prospects for a decent rental starter. A solid #4 that would give the pitching prospects more time in AAA. Yankees prospects rarely live up to the hype and Cashman needs to continue flipping them when they reach peak value.
ChiSoxCity
Please, explain to me why the White Sox would trade for Bradley? Like, what hole would he fill that they’re going to trade away Kimbrel for.
Tannel809
ChiSoxCity:
1. The White Sox were talking to the Brewers before the Red Sox offered Renfroe and sealed the deal.
2. The White Sox already have Graveman and others
3. Need a RF
4. Moncada and Grandal are the only Left Handed Hitters on the lineup.
5. They’ll save 4M
So in conclusion they already tried to get him, have a surplus of relief pitching, will fill the needs of an outfielder and a left handed bat while saving 4M
Chipper Jones' illegitimate kid
They wont save $4M, brother. JBJ has a $9.5mil salary this year and a $12.5mil mutual option next year which comes with a $8.5mil buyout so the Sox are on the hook for $18mil regardless if he plays for them in 2023 or not.
Just sign Conforto instead.
rocky7
Ah, you realize that saying JBJ is a “left-handed bat” is just admitting he tries and mostly fails to hit the ball from the lefthand side….he’s almost an automatic out unless he’s on one of his infrequent hot streaks which don’t last.
JoeBrady
rocky74 hours ago
Ah, you realize that saying JBJ is a “left-handed bat” is just admitting he tries and mostly fails to hit the ball from the lefthand side…
=======================================
His career L/R are almost identical. Nice try.
bravesfan0618
Wouldn’t mind seeing him back in Atlanta.
PhanaticDuck26
too lazy to take ten seconds to look this up, but I believe Kimbrel needs to go to an AL East team to ensure that he has pitched for six teams across all six divisions.
Chipper Jones' illegitimate kid
West. Did you forget him winning a ring in Boston?
You are right about being lazy though.
PhanaticDuck26
I meant AL west, yes
tstats
I think he doesn’t have AL West
Please, Hammer. Don't hurt 'em.
If you’re talking AL West I think the Angels might be his best chance. They need pitching and I could see Moreno looking at Kimbrel as a possible setup man for Iglesias. Moreno also loves paying players big dollars for the name on the back of the jersey. If 40 something Pujols is worth $30 million in his eyes I could see 30 something Kimbrel being worth $16 million to him.
I just read about the whole Kimbrel/White Sox trade and extension thing. That doesn’t make any sense to me. How did they believe Kimbrel was worth what they gave up and what made them pick up his expensive option after he was so bad? Even after he was terrible with them?
It looks like they are throwing good money after bad. It’s hard to see a scenario where Kimbrel would get $16 million a year on the market. If they want to trade him why not just let him go? Is this drunk Uncle Tony making the decisions?
ChiSox_Fan
Muted loser “Hammer”. Bye bye Loser.
Chipper Jones' illegitimate kid
New name, same dumb takes.
charlien
You wish no way
JimmyForum
Kris Bryant would look really good in that lineup.
Al Hirschen
For the Mets.
VonPurpleHayes
The Bryant to the Mets rumors fascinate me because they make little sense. He doesn’t fill a need there. Phillies, on the other hand, are in a situation where they are pretty desperate for and OF bat. Bryant’s versatility also gives them the potential to play him at 3rd. Either way, some team is going to massively overpay for Bryant.
sfes
@VonPurpleHayes – Yeah the Escobar signing and Cano return (ugh) pretty much make it even more remote. They all ready have plenty of infielders as it is, and their outfield is full. But, would he mainly be an OF on the Phillies? Isn’t Bohm locked in at 3B, Segura at 2B, and Hoskins at 1B? Whole lot of talent to just give up on (Bohm)
sfes
What really concerns me is the Phillies potentially signing Carlos Correa.
Chipper Jones' illegitimate kid
And then making him play CF
VonPurpleHayes
Bohm has been a bad fielder his whole minor league carerr as well. I think he’s more of a 1B/DH type, but the Phils have that already in Hoskins. I don’t see the Phillies getting Bryant, but if they do I envision him as a corner OF, switching to 3B on occasion when Bohm is off or DH.
VonPurpleHayes
The Phillies will not go over the luxury tax. Correa won’t be in a Phillies uniform.
Captain Dunsel
Bohm, Moniak, and Painter head up the package going to Pittsburgh or Baltimore. Bryant fits after that.
Rsox
The Phillies would do better to play Bohm in LF and trade Didi to the Reds for Moustakas. Moose gives the Phillies another lefty power bat to hit between Harper/Realmuto/Hoskins and it would solve the “what to do with Didi?” Problem. Stotts could play SS and Camargo can be a utility player. Maybe the Reds kick in Mahle to get the Phillies to cover all of Moose’s remaining contract.
Phils still need to address CF. The Kingery/Haseley/Moniak three headed monster currently on the roster is not the answer to anything
lemonlyman
“Kick in” Mahle lol
thecoffinnail
I think Bryant expects a contract similar to what his buddy Harper got. I can see him being the odd man out and still looking for a deal deep into spring training. He will probably have to take a 1 year pillow contract, play with a huge chip on his shoulder next year, while knocking the cover off the ball. Then he will get his mega deal. My guess is he will sign somewhere unexpected that has a hitter friendly park. Arizona or Texas would be my guess but there are several teams that make sense. I just don’t see the big dollar teams chasing him this year. Taking the Yankees, Boston and Dodgers out of the mix hurts his chances for a max contract. If he does hit the market next year I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Yankees as the team that overpays him for 8 years. Cashman knows he needs to at least get to the series in the next year or 2. If he doesn’t the fans will demand his head and Hal fearing lower attendance will give it to them.
Dumpster Divin Theo
Are you saying Bohms a bum?
Johhos
I’ve seen the Phillies attempts to convert infielders to OF. Burrell marginally worked. But Odubel, Asche and Hoskins didn’t. They even attempted to have Ryan Howard play LF but that experiment thankfully failed before getting out of the lab.
They are only going to pay one CF/LF , so the other spot has to come out of that group UNLESS you move Didi or Segura money .
dsett75
I think he’d look pretty good in a corner OF spot along side Grossman and possibly Greene, for Detroit. If Greene isn’t ready, then the current RF platoon of Baddoo and Reyes would switch and play CF. But Grossman, Greene & Bryant with Baddoo and Reyes either on the bench or used as trade chips, wouldn’t be bad at all. Grossman would probably have to play on your favorite team in order to properly appreciate him. His solid D, with his .350 obp & 20 jacks with 20 steals was nice though, imho.
Darye davis
Kyle Swarber has ten total WAR in 7 years as a starter. Barely above replacement value!
3 years at $20M/year, for me, is way above value!
Metsin777
3 years at 20 million is definetly an overpay. With that being said, I don’t think WAR should be considered for DH type guys. They produce negative WAR just by dhing. Guys like Schwarber and Castellanos should be looked at by offensive WAR only
Samuel
@ Metsin7;
I suggest that WAR has little value in a FO determining what to offer in a contract for a Schwarzer or a Castellanos. It is however something to talk about in a chatroom comment section or on a cable TV sports channel.
This idea about a universal DH opening up full time position for free agents is stretching it. To begin with, just about every NL team already has at least one guy that should be DH’ing (Mets have 3 or 4). Furthermore, most AL teams have been using the position for years to semi-rest a position player for a day or two, or to bring back recovering injured position players before playing them in the field as well.
For a player that (as Sparky Anderson once said) “plays bat”, how does a fan compute the lost production a team has when they cannot utilize the DH position for some of their other players when needed? I’d suggest that most FO’s today have in-house proprietary systems that can put a number on that.
The article notes that with the Phillies Schwarber could spend some time in LF or at 1B. Realistically that’s what will happen. Then again, the ball will find him.
rocky7
The only reason he is a DH is that his defense is so fart below average that he’s actually a liability in the field most of the time…..aka, he’s considered a DH.
ChiSox_Fan
Rocky?
“Fart”?
Captain Dunsel
He’s saying that Schwarber’s defense stinks.
ChiSox_Fan
White Sox Guaranteed Rate Field is favorable for left handed batters.
So Schwarber should want to bat there.
thecoffinnail
Well said. WAR for somebody like Schwarber is foolish. He is a liability on defense which creates minus WAR. OPS+ is a far better stat for a power hitter like Schwarber. His career OPS+ is around 120 I believe. $20m is a bit much for him but his potential to approach 150 and still being under 30 makes $20m a year a potential bargain. Depends on how teams look at his injury history.
Dumpster Divin Theo
WAR. Huh. What is it good for?
Chipper Jones' illegitimate kid
Misleading stat though. He only played half a season in 2015 and a half last year, then missed all of 2016 with the ACL tear. So if we take the 4 seasons in which he has played 100+ games (2017, 2018, 2019, 2021). He has 10.5 fWAR in 4 years. making him a 2 and a half fWAR player while providing negative defense. Thats not bad.
jtango
I think that he is as good a bat as was available in this entire free agent class, that the only comparable offensive pieces are guys that would require like 7-year commitments, and that a lot of teams can stash him at like DH (especially if the NL goes that way).
So yes, I definitely DO think that he is worth it. I think of him as roughly JD Martinez, a year or two back. That is a VALUABLE item
ChiSox_Fan
Darye: “Schwarber”
BillGiles
Good, no Kimbrel
VonPurpleHayes
Knebel would do just fine as the Phillies closer, except for the fact that they have no one who can field the ball.
Dumpster Divin Theo
Knebel is evil.
bucketbrew35
I am so annoyed that they are making Knebel the closer. This could backfire so horribly.
VonPurpleHayes
What other choice do they have?
bucketbrew35
Kimbrel and Jansen currently and not much beyond that. They waited too long imo. But either of them is still more of a sure thing than Knebel and his 39 innings in the last two years at the moment.
Black Ace57
If the Phillies once again choose to be cheap with their bullpen then they will continue to be a .500 team for the foreseeable future. They should learn from their own division with the Braves on how important a lot of good relievers are.
VonPurpleHayes
The Phillies were never necessarily cheap with their bullpen. You can’t just magically buy a closer, and throwing 20MM+ at aging relievers never works. I also think people underestimate how much the lackluster defense costs the pen. I think the Knebel move was a great one.
Black Ace57
I don’t think Kimbrel is the answer, but they should be spreading $20-30 million over several guys. It’s not 2008 where you get Brad Lidge along with JC Ramero on a cheap deal and win a Workd Series. They need 3-5 high leverage relievers if they want to do anything. JJ Cooper of Baseball America even made the argument a month or 2 back that a high leverage reliever is more valuable to a good playoff team than a good 4th starter.
VonPurpleHayes
I think Alvarado and Knebel fit the bill here. Losing Neris hurt, but he was given closer money, and he’s no closer. Seranthony Domínguez had great stuff years ago before his injury. Hopefully he can be impactful again. And Connor Brogdon showed some fantastic potential earlier in the 2021 season. The Phillies bullpen has some valuable pieces. Like I hinted at before, fixing the defense will go a long way into fixing the pen. I’m not saying they shouldn’t add more if given the opportunity, but I don’t necessarily think its as dire a need some imply. They need another bat, and their first need should be defense.
iverbure
Spending a bunch of money on the bullpen is a great way to spend a bunch of money and still not win. If the front office can’t find cheap pen arms then the wrong front office is in place.
Rsox
Aside from 1997 with the Marlins (a team that got really good seasons from Robb Nen, Jay Powell, and Dennis Cook) DD has been mostly terrible at constructing bullpens over his career. Bullpen’s are such a volatile it makes no sense to sink big money into sometimes. DD spent $6 million on Archie Bradley while Texas signed Ian Kennedy to a minor league contract with a little over $2 million salary and Kennedy had the much better season
VonPurpleHayes
And yet Kennedy came to Philly and stunk it up. To your point, bullpens are volatile and success doesn’t translate team to team.
DakotaJoe
The huge mistake the Phillies FO made last year was giving Bradley $6M but when they could have signed Melancon for $2M with $1M buyout.
DonOsbourne
That’s why Schwarber seems like such a bad fit.
stymeedone
Or it could succeed so wonderfully! Why does everything have to fail? There are no sure things.
terry g
Both the owners and the MLBPA want the universal DH which is why I don’t think it will happen under the new CBA. No one is going to bargain away anything they both want. My opinion.
Jdt8312
I hope you’re right, for the games sake.
Jdt8312
I keep hearing about a universal DH. Terrible idea. This used to be a thinking man’s game. But at every turn, they make strategy obsolete. The game is costing more, and becoming more difficult to watch.
Inside Out
Yes it is so exciting to see a pitcher do crap at the plate. Letting a pitcher hit is like letting your QB play safety. The pitcher’s skill is throwing a ball fast over the plate. Letting pitchers hit is the worst thing about baseball. Time to let the 1950s fade away.
VonPurpleHayes
@ffbbb That’s not why people dislike the DH. It’s less about the pitcher hitting and more about management strategy and late-game moves. Doesn’t matter. DH is coming.
BobGibsonFan
I was a traditionalist and hated the DH. Now, pitchers rarely pitch 200 innings… never 300 any more. They have 7 guys in the bullpen and a steady stream of AAA guys shuffling in and out. Openers? Get real. Dont risk them pulling a hammy walking back after watching three strikes. If the pitchers actually worked at hitting, that would be different. But it’s obvious they are just concentrating on throwing the ball.
Deleted_User
LOL
TomToms
How about Kingery for Kimbrel? Philly gets a legit closer, Sox get a 2B and save 2mil?
VonPurpleHayes
Kingery is not even a major league baseball player anymore. The Sox would laugh at the trade offer.
stymeedone
They might be happy to dump the salary and have money for something they need.
DakotaJoe
That’s never going to happen. Kimbrel is due $16M and becomes a FA in 2023 with no buyout. Kingery is due $14.5M over the next two season with a $1M buyout. That means if the Sox make that trade they are only saving $1M. Kimbrel is still a major asset. Kingery may never be a big league ballplayer. Another interesting point the Phillies have team options $13M, $14M and $15M from 2024-2026. At the time of the contract it seemed like a good deal for player and team. Sometimes those deals work out and sometimes they will bite you.
whosehighpitch
I thought Hoskins was the bat to pair with Bryce.
VonPurpleHayes
When healthy Hoskins has been mashing just fine. You can’t win with 2 bats though.
whosehighpitch
That’s why they went out and bid against themselves for JT. Hoskins gotta go
VonPurpleHayes
What? Hoskins, one of the only consistent hitters on the team needs to go? Makes no sense. Your crusade against Hoskins needs to go.
ChiSox_Fan
Let Kimbrel close once in a while and he will be fine with Sox.
Alternate with Hendriks. Keep them both fresh and healthy!
Emoney123
According to Las Mayores editor Francys Romero, the Phillies have signed outfielder Dariam Gutiérrez. The Havana, Cuba native is reportedly a legitimate outfield talent.
thatballsouttahere.com/2021/12/06/mlb-lockout-phil…
htbnm57
Great but at best he’s years away and they need someone now
Joe S
Phillies need another big bat but 3/60 seems high. Regardless of if they spend money on schwaber they need to take a chance on Rodon. 3 for 60 for him.
Angry Disgruntled Sox Fan
Can Schwarber pitch? If not, Phillies should think again.
Sunday Lasagna
Awful against lefties, career .684 OPS. He’s also not an OF or a 1B, he plays those about as well as he caught in the minor leagues. 20 mil a year for a DH against RH pitching? Learn something from the Braves and go sign Joc Pederson & Eddie Rosario.
Fred K. Burke
The Cubs would be willing to send Heyward to the Southsiders for a wad of used bubble gum and even kick in 10 million.
VonPurpleHayes
Cubs are stuck with that mess.
djmac
Just release Heyward and some team will pick him up for a couple of mil for defensive reasons and they’ll end up shaving a bit of payroll. They can have Rivas or Davis play RF which will cost next to nothing by comparison.