The Pirates announced a slew of roster moves today, outrighting seven players off the 40-man roster, per the team. Pitchers Chase De Jong, Enyel De Los Santos, Kyle Keller, Connor Overton, Chasen Shreve, and Shea Spitzbarth have all been outrighted to Triple-A. Infielder Wilmer Difo was also outrighted to Triple-A.
Shreve has elected free agency, per Jason Mackey of PGSportsNow (via Twitter).The 31-year-old southpaw posted a 3.20 ERA/4.73 FIP across 57 appearances out of the bullpen. Shreve has suited up for the Braves, Yankees, Cardinals, Mets, and Pirates over an eight-year career.
The Pirates also added a number of players to the 40-man roster, returning most from the 60-day injured list. Steven Brault, Blake Cederlind, Dillon Peters, Jose Soriano, Duane Underwood Jr., and Bryse Wilson are all now on the 40-man roster.
Round 1 of the roster purge. Still need to free up space on the 40 man for the prospects
Pirates outright every player making more than league minimum and fewer than 4 years of control off roster in an effort to tweak the 40-man roster.
When asked to comment on the whirlwind of roster moves, owner Bob Nutting simply remarked, “By Grapthar’s hammer, what a savings!”
They out righted players that weren’t good… Quit making it about miney
Pirates should be bold and trade for Cano, Bauer and Ozuna
Why not? Their parole officers will increase attendance.
That said, Shreve will get an MLB job. The rest are the stuff AAAA players are made of.
You win comment of the day!
+1, @tillman.
Though I disagree with the inclusion of Robbie. I can completely understand what he did & why. Can’t say the same about Ozuna/Bauer.
The Pirates are going about their rebuild the right way. Considering what’s happening with the Cubs and Reds, it shouldn’t take long for them to reach the middle of the pack in the division. Third place in 2023 is a real possibility. From there it will depend on the development of the kids. Bucs fans shouldn’t get too frustrated by the losses in 2022. Look at the big picture and focus on the positives, even if there are relatively few on the field at PNC Park.
Nice place to watch a ballgame, though.
Absolutely, and extremely affordable. Pirates fans should take advantage of that. The team will be good eventually.
I love what Cherington is doing with the Pirates. Totally professional. Attacking the restructuring in a manner similar to what Chiam did in Boston – both of them knew what had to be done, got their staffs working together, and didn’t jack around.
It wouldn’t surprise me to see the Pirates finish 3rd in the NLC in 2022. I enjoyed watching some of their games in 2021. They have some very good young players already.
They might not be that bad. I don’t know about third, but I know the division isn’t very strong. They played pretty good after Labor Day, and that should be the team pretty much on opening day. You will get some help around June from some guys starting to show up at the major league level. I should say lineup on opening day, the pitchers will be much different as September saw a lot of fill ins.
The unknown in all of this is ownership, of course. You’re right about Cherrington but as we’ve seen before, it doesn’t take much to strip efforts with strange moves
It’s like being a fan of any team. All we can do is hope. For now, it potentially gives Pirates fans something to look forward to. It appears they hired the right person.
Steven Brault seems very intriguing if he can lower his walk rate
Guaranteed portion of Felipe Vazquez’s contract is up after this year. Still no news on them declining his options. I wouldn’t mention him but I heard somewhere that if they decline his options they still have to pay the buyouts whereas if they accept them but keep him on the restricted list they don’t have to pay him his salary.
What are you talking about? He’s in jail for up to 4yrs and then he’s getting deported. There is no affiliation between him and the PBC. Idk why i scroll down and read these idiotic comments.
Holy rude.
His contract was never voided or terminated. He just couldn’t collect on it because he was on the restricted list. 2021 was the last guaranteed year followed by two club options with $1500k in buyouts. You’d think the Pirates would have declined those clubs options the day after the WS ended but I never heard anything.
I would be amazed if there wasn’t some sort of language within the contract that details forfeiture under various circumstances, especially something as egregious as this. I cannot imagine contractual obligation, whether it’s been documented to the public or not.
@tiredolddude There is no language within the contract that details forfeiture. All the Pirates can do is keep him on the restricted list for as long as he is in prison. They might not have to pay him but he’s still technically a member of the Pirates organization.
Every major league contract has a clause in it…. Called ‘good citizenship’ clause or something. Go look it up. Contracts are voided if they violate it. Convicted of felonies like Vazquez… you’re all done. Game over.
@bucsfan0004 Name one contract that has been voided under that clause. And don’t say there haven’t been opportunities because there have.
@bucsfan0004 Waiting for an answer…
@bucsfan0004 Idk about convicted but plenty of players have been suspended for DV in the middle of large long-term contracts. Jose Reyes, Hector Olivera and Odubel Herrera to name a few. None of their contracts were voided.
If a team actually exercised a clause to void a player’s contract in such a situation, it’s almost guaranteed that MLBPA would fight back. Per the CBA (which MLBPA agreed to), the team can just place the player on the restricted list and not pay their salary.
@layventsky Yeah which is why the Dodgers won’t be able to void Bauer’s contract. It’s pretty certain he’ll be suspended for a while but once the suspension expires the league will consider the matter closed just liked with Reyes et al.
And yes. The Pirates don’t have to void Vazquez’s contract because they can keep him on the restricted list for as long as his legal issues prevent him from physically taking the field.
I dunno, Jim. Bauer’s situation is horrible but Vasquez is something altogether grotesque. While I understand what you are writing and believe the items you’ve put forward here, I have to believe that if for PR purposes alone, one won’t ever get the full scoop on what is happening behind the scenes. As far as the MLBPA is concerned, can you imagine the public relations nightmare that would ensue if they were to protest and it was made public? I have to believe that all parties simply wish this guy and his crimes to go away, as quietly as possible.
@tiredolddude He’s a union member. If the Pirates tried to void his contract they would be required to protest.
A little surprised Wilmer difo is gone, although they will gradually get rid of most of these guys over the next year or two. The rest were just fillers for a pitching staff that was beat up. Shreve will be on someone’s team next year, although he’s pretty average.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Difo sticks around one way or another.
Of the seven Wilmers in MLB history, he is one of two who have not played for the Mets (the other is the late Wilmer “Billy” Shantz). Make an offer, Steve Cohen. Sooner or later, someone will say “yes.”
Wilmer vinegar bend mizelle
Difo deserved to stay on the 40 man roster. He’s a better ball player than either Evans or Tucker. He’s 29 – same as Evans. He’s a much better hitter than either of those two. He had a very solid season for the Bucs in 2021. Tucker was about as bad as it gets batting against LHP. I feel like he’s still in the show because of his hair. He’s best suited as a backup middle infielder who NEVER gets to bat against LHP.
It’s not Evans or Tucker that’s the problem. Evans will most definitely get DFA’d. There are too many legit prospects that need to be added to the 40 man.
I guess that is one problem with building a contender this way – you’re going to have far more strong prospects than you can realistically protect. There are at least a dozen that we’ve been hearing about for a while now that aren’t on the 40-man yet. The Bucs have about 5 or 6 more guys on the 40-man that they could remove without hurting the club, which means we will lose some guys.
This is a good problem though. In Difo’s case in particular, he isn’t good enough to be a DH and his best skill, pinch hitting as a switch hitter, will be rendered less significant if pitchers don’t bat anymore. It kind of makes sense for him to be an insurance policy at Indianapolis in case someone goes on the 60 man. I would have to think that the Pirates have him up higher than guys like Jared Oliva or Phillip Evans. There was a good article that Mackey wrote around the end of August on guys that will need to be added to the 40 man or could be potentially lost for good. I think he lists 12 names. I would have to think at least 6 will be added. If you look at the current 40 man roster, there are quite a few guys who could easily be replaced. Maybe you can question why they would add a guy like Eric Hanhold when there’s a roster crunch anyways. There are at least 5 or 6 no brainers that shouldn’t be on there.
Completely agree. I just hope the Bucs are lucky enough to protect the right guys. At least half of these prospects won’t pan out. BN & BC have got to guess right on most of them since they aren’t going to spend anything at all on free agents.
Is Shelby Miller still on the 40 man?
According to BaseballReference.com he is now a free agent.
The Pirates have seven more players that they can release.They include three pitchers,two catchers,and two outfielders.They seem to be biding time on them to put the young players who could be Rule 5 drafted on the roster and are figuring out who they will be.Shreve actually pitched decently,but did not have the statistics evidently to be kept.Evans will be gone.Difo was a good pinch hitter,but could not catch a pop up.A team as bad as the Pirates have been for 2 1/2 years has plenty of people to get rid of.
I was under the impression that 2022 was supposed to have been the year that they would have turned the corner.Is it now 2023?2024?Only time will tell if and when it occurs,and,if so,how good they can become.
Meanwhile,the alarmingly low attendance will continue.
Why the negativity? Ben Cherington didn’t come on board until November 2019 and is just getting started. Things are moving in a better direction.
Not negativity, CH, just a clear memory of what has been happening here. We wish to believe ownership won’t tie Cherrington’s hands at some point, but it’s not negative to contemplate the Nutting tenure
Buc and Budget-I do have to question about the importance of the Rule 5 draft,though.How many players actually are kept?Maybe 10%?Now I guess that the player has to go through waivers first before being offered back,,but most either do not go north after spring training or quickly show that they do not belong.How many even decent teams can afford to keep a roster spot open even part of the year for a non contributor?And it seems to me as I think that I read the Mackey article that many of these young players I have not even heard of and many are not even close to AAA.What chance do they have of getting drafted?I am all for removing the 6 or 7 and putting the best of the applicable AA players on the ML roster.It just does not seem to me that this is anywhere near the debacle that occurred in the early 2000’s (?) When the top six picks had five Pirates in them!
Nutting is fairly simple in my opinion.As a businessman he values money over wins.But he is willing to spend judiciously if he has a good team that can compete.One can argue that he should have tried for one more year in 2016 but I think that they realized that their three year window was probably over,and they followed their long term plan of trading players coming up to free agency for bona fide near ready or ML players.
For the team that takes a Rule 5 kid, they’re stuck with the kid for a year which, as you said, rarely pans out. The worst part of Rule 5, as I see it, is the possibility of losing a kid that you’re not done developing, but that you were counting on paying dividends down the road. The Bucs have a bunch of guys that they need to protect. I just saw that the Bucs took Soriano off the 40-man and replaced him with Diego Castillo. Now I understand why they took Difo off the 40-man. Castillo is nearly ready and could be in the show in 2022. His salary will be half of Difo’s.
Budget-I think that your response may be for the other newer article,It seems good to promote Castillo to the ML roster,but I am not sold on him based on a few at bats in AAA and one good season in AA.Hopefully Difo stays as insurance for the inevitable injuries that will occur as he was a decent player on a bad team.Give Castillo at least half a year in AAA and see if he can continue his upward climb into next year.
Mendoza – I am a fan of Difo as mentioned much earlier in this thread. I too hope he has a role on the 2022 roster. Just saying that economics has once again reared it’s ugly head as Castillo could fill the same role as Difo at half the cost. Difo’s stats vs RHP were similar to Moran’s.
Difo vs RHP. (.284/.353/.426)
Moran vs RHP. (.288/.352/.432)
Difo was far better than Newman or Tucker at the plate and he’s a good fielder, although not as good as Newman.
I think that Difo is a decent player too and was surprised that they designated him for assignment.If I recall correctly they did this during the year and he passed through waivers.My guess is that they are hoping for that now too.He can’t be making a lot of money,and in my opinion Castillo needs more time to prove himself in AAA.Maybe they will wait for Spring Training results to make a decision on who to keep on the 26 man roster.
Newman was a very good fielder this year and Tucker is of course the best.In my opinion they should have kept him at shortstop and given him the job a month earlier as they know what to expect from Newman now.He started hitting the last three weeks and now they are not sure what they have.They need to determine that sooner rather than later because these other younger middle infielders will relatively soon need time in the ML’s.
With regard to Newman – In 2019, he had 531 PA and hit .308 with a .333 babip. In 2021, he hit .226 with a .236 babip. He was the fourth unluckiest hitter in MLB. He will almost certainly bounce back some from that. With his gold glove caliber play at SS and a near certain rebound to more acceptable levels at the plate, he is still useful. I’d be surprised if he isn’t the regular SS again this year. Most Bucs fans would love to see Tucker improve his hitting and become the regular SS going forward, but I feel like Newman gets one more shot. The Bucs have about a dozen kids in the Minors working their way up to MLB middle infielders. It will be exciting to see which ones pan out.
I think that Newman is a reasonably good player but both the 2019 hitting year(as it was with many players) was an extreme outlier,as was his 2021 fielding year.I believe that he is in between with both.They moved Tucker around so much in this current advanced method of wanting everyone to play everywhere that he never got to settle in to where he plays best and is most comfortable- at shortstop.The Phillies did the same thing with Kingery and second base,but threw in how to hit.a different launch angle to boot.It seems to me that the better teams play to the player’s strengths much more often.Some of this is just common sense which does not seem to be as common as it once was.I think that they need to find out about Tucker in the first 50 games next year and if Chavez does not work out as well move Newman to one of those two positions.
It may be a moot point with the young players coming up but they are just prospects until they prove themselves more than they have.
2025.
I have been a Pirates fan since 1961 and have never seen it this bad.Hope springs eternal.For small market teams to compete it takes close to a miracle because they have only a small window to retain superstars that are necessary for pennant winners let alone WS winners.BC seems to know what to do,but NH was well regarded when he came over from Cleveland.The minor leagues seem well stocked now but I do not know enough nor have seen enough to be confident that the system will produce the two or three superstars necessary and have the pitching depth that even the wealthiest teams need to compete at the highest level.I do not mean to sound negative but I am a realist.I will stay that way until I see several minor league superstars emerge.
@ Mendoza Line 215;
Wrong.
Since 2015 the small market KC Royals, Cleveland Indians, and Tampa Bay Rays got to the WS (and they and others made the playoffs and LCS’).
How many “superstars” did they have?
In today’s MLB it takes all the players on a roster for a team to compete. Defense, pitching and most of all Catchers are the most important elements. Playing strong fundamental baseball is necessary as well.
As a fan the most joy I get is watching quality teams being built. Right now my 2 favorite rebuilds are the Tigers in the AL (Orioles not far behind) and the Pirates in the NL. Naturally the Tigers have been at it longer. I believe the Pirates will be contenders in less time then the Tigers have taken. It’s no coincidence that with the #1 pick in last years draft Cherington took a Catcher.
I’ve been to PNC Park. It’s sensational! Forget the owner and the “cheap” crap. He gave Huntington plenty of time, but the man ran in circles. Fans didn’t show up, the owner had to cut payroll. This is a new administration. Look at the Blue Jays roster and understand that Cherington was instrumental in the drafting and development of most of those young players.
Samuel-You are dreaming.Since 1991 how many small market teams have won the WS?
The answer,Samuel,is one.
Some of those other teams came close,but how many superstars did they have?You can answer your own question.
You admit that your most enjoyment regards teams being built.
I enjoy teams winning important playoff games.
You seem to think that BC is some sort of guru.He may be,but what happened in Boston?
NH was good at making trades(except for the infamous one),but mediocre at drafting and developing.BC has a reputation for the latter,but as a small market team he will need to sign good complimentary free agent players and make astute trades.
How well did he do in Boston?
I hope for the Pirate fans sake that he has learned from his mistakes on the latter and meets your expectations on drafting and developing players.This year’s draft was lauded by most experts and impressed me..But small market teams need to hit on all cylinders to win a WS.
Everyone says how beautiful the twenty year old park is.Nutting will spend on medium level free agents if it can produce a winner based on home grown players.
But baseball winners in this day need to have extreme depth,especially in pitching,to win the prize.They need players to show up in the clutch games.and stars to lead.The recipe has not altogether changed over the years,except for the extreme amount of injuries now.
The proof will be in the pudding.And will the fans wait until 2025 to see if they can accomplish their WS goal?That is the question.
Very well stated throughout this thread. That small window was clearly evident during the Pirates WC runs of a few years ago. To that point, the idea was to develop talent, watch them mature at the MLB level and then either trade them or let them leave through free agency as their contract realities didn’t fit the mission statement. This cycle was put on its head when both veterans and rising prospects were shipped away in the last months of the previous front office. And here we are again. No idea how one can call this “negativity” as we see this in any smaller market team. I have to laugh at the PNC Park comments. Yeah, it’s beautiful but that novelty wears off quickly when it’s the same drumbeat year after year.
Thank you tired.And you had my name before me as I am one and the same.I doubt that Samuel is.It is the lament of small market teams.I wish that it was not so,but it is especially apparent now when even the larger market teams are smart enough to have twice as many good players as they need because of the injuries that they know will occur.
I think non Pirate fans are just being nice about the stadium kudos because lately the team has been so bad,but I would rather have a good team.If they had had those fine teams just a few years before when there was only one wild card they would have had a chance.If the only better team during that NL three year long period would have been in another division they would have had a chance.The vicissitudes of a one game playoff against the best pitcher in baseball will forestall your hopes.