Giants’ president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi recently appeared on The TK Show, the podcast of The Athletic’s Tim Kawakami, and discussed a wide variety of topics pertaining to the past and the future of the club.
Broadly speaking, there’s a wide variety of paths for the Giants to take this winter. They have a lot of contracts coming off the books when free agency begins, which means they will have money to spend but also holes to fill. They could use that money to assemble a team that’s very similar to the 107-win 2021 squad, go with a completely different look, or somewhere in between. Regardless of how it plays out, Zaidi believes their success this season should help make them an attractive destination for potential signees. “We’re just going to keep trying to get better and better and better and at some point you reach the tipping point where you look up and you’re at the top of the standings, and that situation can perpetuate itself by reputation, a lot of free agents want to play for you, and you can draft off of that success if you just kind of keep grinding and trying to make the team better.”
It certainly stands to reason that free agents would be intrigued, especially given that the Giants have seemingly found a way to maximize the talents of veterans they’ve brought on in recent years, such as Darin Ruf, Anthony DeSclafani, Jake McGee and Alex Wood, who are all over 30 years old and did some of the best work of their careers in 2021. And there’s also Giants’ mainstays like Brandon Belt, Brandon Crawford and Buster Posey, who are all 33 or older and had excellent seasons.
Zaidi elaborated on that point by giving some insight into how players approach free agency and how it’s evolved in recent years. He says that money and geography used to be the primary factors, but now, “I think guys are more aware of going somewhere they feel like there’s an infrastructure and a support system that can help them thrive from a performance standpoint. You get a lot more questions from free agents on what facilities do you have, can I speak to your pitching coach or hitting coach? And that’s a way bigger part of the recruiting process. We’ve been really focused on that pitch over the last couple of years.”
Zaidi had already discussed the rotation situation last week, which is surely going to be a big part of the Giants’ offseason as Wood, DeSclafani, Kevin Gausman and Johnny Cueto are all heading into free agency. Kawakami asked him about taking a similar approach to what they’ve done previously, giving short-term deals to talented pitchers with question marks on their records. “You look at the list of free agents and there are some names on that list who have had a lot of success in the past and maybe dealt with injuries this year or underperformed for whatever reason,” Zaidi said. “I think when you’ve got to fill out four spots in your rotation, you’re certainly going to look at that segment of the market.” The team has a $22MM club option on Cueto, but the fact that Zaidi admits they will be looking to fill four rotation spots seems to leave no doubt that they will opt for the $5MM buyout instead.
But those short-term deals aren’t the only thing on the table. “I would be surprised if we didn’t wind up doing at least one multi-year deal for a starting pitcher,” Zaidi added. “Certainly all of our guys who are free agents are going to be looking for multi-year deals based on the seasons they had. We have interest in bringing all of those guys back.”
In terms of payroll, the club should have lots of flexibility for 2022 and beyond. According to Cot’s Baseball Contracts, the club’s opening day payroll was just under $150MM this year, the lowest since 2014, when prorating the 2020 number. According to Jason Martinez of Roster Resource, they only have about $65MM allocated for 2022, when factoring in arbitration estimates. Assuming the club picks up its options on Buster Posey, Wilmer Flores and Jose Alvarez, that number would jump up to the $90MM range. Even if payroll stays steady for 2022, that seemingly gives Zaidi and his team $60MM to throw around this offseason. For 2023, there’s only $33MM on the books so far, with Crawford and Tommy La Stella the only guaranteed contracts. With that level of wiggle room, the club could surely find any number of ways to build a rotation around breakout star Logan Webb, for both the short and long term.
On the position player side of things, Zaidi seems to be less worried about their situation in that department. Kawakami quotes Zaidi from a press conference last week as saying, “We’re deep on the position-player side. We have a number of guys who are platoon guys, every-day guys, we have a lot of at-bats that are accounted for. And we’ve got guys like Thairo Estrada (and) Steven Duggar that we’d like to see get better opportunities. You’ve got a layer of prospects that are even closer to being big-league ready, guys like (Heliot) Ramos and Joey Bart. So we at least have some options on the position-player side. Where all those guys on the position-player side, not just Kris but Brandon Belt, Donovan Solano, these guys fit our team, we’d like to have them back, but we have some options on that side.”
Solano has had a nice run with the Giants but is about to turn 34, whereas Estrada is about to turn 26 and had a similarly-productive season, making it fairly reasonable to see that bringing Solano back isn’t the highest priority. Belt had a tremendous season at the plate but also comes with injury concerns. The club largely turned to a productive Wilmer Flores/Darin Ruf platoon when Belt was out, which they could do again in 2022. (Ruf can be retained via arbitration, Flores by a $3.5MM club option.) Bryant is a tremendous hitter but will be command a huge financial commitment this winter and is an imperfect fit on the Giants’ roster. Third baseman Evan Longoria is still under contract for one more year, at just under $20MM, meaning Bryant would likely be pushed into more outfield time, where his defensive numbers aren’t as good. The club also has a bevy of outfield options already in the fold, such as Duggar, LaMonte Wade Jr., Mike Yastrzemski, Alex Dickerson and Austin Slater. Prospect Heliot Ramos, whom Zaidi mentioned, finished his season at Triple-A and will need to be added to the 40-man roster next month in order to protect him from the Rule 5 draft, meaning he should be in the mix for an opportunity soon. Zaidi’s apparent lack of urgency around the position players seems to hold up to scrutiny. The option of a universal DH for 2022 would open things up somewhat, but that’s not guaranteed to happen.
All in all, it should be a fascinating offseason for the club. The rival Dodgers are in a similar situation, with lots of players reaching free agency, such as Max Scherzer, Clayton Kershaw, Corey Seager, Chris Taylor and Kenley Jansen. Both clubs will surely be frequently connected to free agents in rumors this offseason, meaning 2021’s fierce competition for the NL West division crown figures to continue right through the winter.
Sign a fly ball pitcher who can take advantage of a big outfield. Robbie Ray.
Resign Bryant, but don’t overpay in terms of years.
Both of those seem unlikely. They’ll be signing many people instead of a couple of big fish
Robbie Ray is fools gold, he can get strikeouts but he can get lit up. I would hope they recognize this and if they do sign him its nothing more than a short term deal.
But most of the time Robbie Ray is productive. Worth a shot for any team.
You can pencil in DeSclafani into Seattle’s rotation right now as well as Kris Bryant into our lineup. Gausman I can see re-signing with his pitching coach on the team.
I noticed you said pencil and not pen… not very confident, are you?
Dodgers-gone
Red Sox-gone
Yankees-gone
Happy days are again, the sky above is clear again, let’s sing a song of cheer again, happy days are here again.
Looking back at the 10/03 poll here about which of the ten postseason teams will win the World Series, and the top three were Giants-Dodgers-Rays in that order.
They also happened to be the top three in regular season wins, in that exact same order.
Amazing use of analytics there ;O)
You are right Hogan. Always good to get three of probably the best five teams in baseball history out of the playoffs.
You might end up being disappointed with Bryant. A solid player that can play all over the diamond. However his output and versatility appear to be more like Ben Zobrist in his prime rather than Bryce Harper. Certainly Boras will want a Harper/Rendon kind of contract for Bryant’s services. Would be a steep overpay for a budget minded club. Can’t see it happening.
I’d take a Zobrist on my team, he played great until his final year, at 38.
Zobrist I think could have played longer but that divorce situation took a toll on him and his mind on the game.
Bryant doesn’t really play all over the field though. His value is as a third baseman. He can also play COF, where his bat loses some value. He can fake it in CF. He can play 1B, but so can most anybody. He’s a third baseman. His supposed utility creds are exaggerated and, in any case, if he’s not regularly playing at 3B that subtracts as much value as his versatility adds. He’s a very good hitting third baseman. Attempts to make him other than that are misguided. And he’s definitely no Ben Zobrist.
“….He can play 1B, but so can most anybody.”
*cough* Eric Hosmer *cough*
Heh, well there are guys who just can’t play anywhere
Hosmer’s probably the best defensive 1B in baseball. He just can’t hit like a 1B who makes what he makes.
Hosmer once was excellent defensively, but those days are behind him
What went wrong with Hosmer’s defense? He is still too young too fall apart as a defensive first baseman.
Anybody can play first base?!? To defend like Brandon Belt does isn’t easy. I consider him in the top of first basemen. Shame he has never got a Gold Glove. Freeman, Goldy, all top defense guys. They don’t get there because it’s an easy position to play.
Most players can play first base. That’s reality. Playing it well is a different story, but it’s a position that doesn’t have as much to do as other positions so it’s easy to hide someone there. Bottom line, any good fielder can be turned into a first baseman as long as they are not too short. Bad fielders are bad fielders, but that’s a different matter. There’s a reason so many vets and otherwise DH types play the position. If you can play 3rd well, you can play first.
Actually 1B is an underrated defensive position and it does have a lot to do with other positions. A good first baseman makes all the other infielders better by being able to pick it. A good player at 1B is not about fielding balls, but receiving throws.
A case in point, when the Mets upgraded their offense by signing Mo Vaughan, who was not good, the Mets went from being one of the best defensive teams, to one of the worse, in one season.
So many teams learn about “NOT HAVING A REAL 1St BASEMAN”.
Did you watch Schwarber?
RJNarvick:
Bryant may not be in the same category as Harper, But Bryant is probably not getting a Harper-like contract either. But Bryant is closer to Harper than he is to Zobrist.
Right now for their careers Harper has a 142 OPS+ and a 142 wRC+, Bryant has a 132 OPS+ and a 134 wRC+, and Zobrist had a 113 OPS+ and a 116 wRC+.
Nobody should judge Bryant on his stint with the Giants. It’s a small sample, plus most players struggle a bit trying to adjust to, and fit in with a new team.
Not sure I see the basis for calling Bryant an “imperfect” fit with this club. He actually fits the Giants’ model and needs extremely well with his positional flexibility. Having said that, I suspect someone will be willing to overpay for him and it won’t be Zaidi.
He’d be a great fit at 5/110 but not 8/200.
Exactly. I think he’s worth 5/$110 but he’s definitely going to be shooting for $200+ million with Boras as his agent. He’s not even close to that. Zaidi isn’t dumb. Philly might be though.
Twenty teams would take KB at 5 years, 110 million. No one will give KB 200 million. So I am guessing that he might end up with 6 years and 150 million.
He’s worth way more than 5/$110M. That’s an AAV of only $22M.
Bryant is tied with Springer and Yelich for 14th highest OPS+ among all active players. Springer’s AAV is about $25M, and he’s signed through his age 36 season. Yelich’s AAV is about $26M, and he’s also signed through his age 36 season, but has a $20M mutual option in his age 37 season.
I think Bryant is more valuable than either one of them, since both are single position guys. A 5 year deal would be only through his age 34 season. Any team wanting to sign Bryant will have to offer something like 6/$165M, or even 7/$175M.
I know that RBI isn’t a stat that people care about anymore, but this team left too many runners stranded in scoring position this year, and especially in the NLDS. I think they need to invest in a big time run producer.
logan – It’s true that RBI isn’t very relevant because it’s largely impacted by the number of RBI opportunities.
Look at RISP instead, it’s a far more valuable tool when analyzing a player’s ability to drive in runs.
RISP shows clutch performance, Wade Jr. showed alot of it, similar to Muncy and Seager on what they did for LA.
This is a team that had literally everything go right for almost everyone on the roster, to something like the 95th percentile of expectations, leading to an overall team performance that was probably over the 99th percentile. They don’t need to “fix” their performance with RISP (which was elite like almost everything else, btw). They need to somehow figure out how to have that much luck with an aging roster again. And they have four starting pitching slots to fill.
TED THEODORE LOGAN – Am in total agreement. This team needs an everyday bat that can set the stage and still has pop. Enter Marcus Semien. Pay him whatever it takes. Re-sign Gausman (he’s a #2 in my book) and, if the Giants can find one, sign an ace to go with Webb. Then trade for two MLB-ready starters (from the Marlins and/or Cleveland). We have the prospects to do this without gutting the system.
Pete view; not sure the Marlins or Cleveland are given up mlb ready starters without a huge package as starters worth their weight in gold. Plus starters take a while to adjust to the mlb level. If the giants re sign belt; Bryant and posey than they need to spend money now for starters with some experience or it’s a waste
First off, there aren’t many great starters available. Scherzer (age), Ray (inconsistent) and Gausman (a #2, I think rather than an ace, and also has a funky track record before landing in SF).
The Marlins would love to have Joey Bart. They are deep in pitching and pitching prospects. Same goes for Cleveland, who would be mighty happy to have Heliot Ramos.
I’m not sure the Giants re-sign Belt although they might give him a one-year QO. He might reject that thinking he’ll do better on the open market; good for him, if he does. Bryant may not be worth the kind of money some teams will offer. No bidding war for Farhan, unless maybe for Semien—a perfect fit for the Giants.
So, I think Farhan and Harris are too smart to throw wild money around for too many players. I think Gausman and Semien (or another everyday bat) get the big contracts; they definitely re-sign Buster (if he wants to play), and the rest are smart deals of prospects.
The Marlins are resigning their current catcher and picked up another catcher with a high offensive side from Atlanta. If giants trade say Bart than you have a older in terms of catcher years in Possy catching and nothing in the line for future.
Patrick Bailey is next behind Bart.
Agree that Marlins would do well to trade any pitcher other than Alcantara for Bart, but I predict Giants keep Bart. Posey will become full time DH and backup catcher.
They’ve pretty much given up on Alfaro. Fortes and Jackson have low pedigrees. Bart would give the Marlins a star catcher for years.
Bailey struggled badly at High-A. Too soon to count him out, but he’s got a long road to the majors.
There is no such thing as a player who’s specialty is driving in runs because players don’t control who is on bae or when they get their hits. Focus on OBP and extra base hits (and contact).
I wish I could control who is on bae.
Kapler and his coaching staff worked miracles with the roster they were given. They will need to do the same again next year since there is zero chance Farhan goes after any high priced free agents. He will look for bargains which is his only true skill and most of that $60 million in cap room will be pocketed by ownership. Get ready for the excuses like this player wasn’t a fit or that player was offered more by another team or my favorite one, taxes in California are too high to attract a big time free agent.
He will continue to shop at the dollar store with short term deals given to players nobody else wants. Last year we were one game away from making the playoffs yet Farhan didn’t want to acquire an actual closer which led to 13 blown saves in only 62 games. This year he had the best team in the league record wise but failed to understand that regular season success means little in the postseason and his only significant improvement was Bryant when they could have again used help in the bullpen (Richard Rodriguez was available for next to nothing) or another starter to help reduce the multiple bullpen games they had to throw over the last few weeks of the season.
I was surprised that it only took Farhan 3 seasons to get this team where it is now but this is the best it will get under his leadership. Good regular season records with a low payroll is all he is capable of bringing to the table. In 2-3 years his lack of ability to evaluate talent in the draft will be obvious as none of the players he has selected turn out to be major leaguers. They will continue to sell out only half the stadium as Giants fans did this year in response to the thrift store lineup and rotation that was put on the field.
Dude you’re throwing some serious shade here. The Dodgers never had a big free agent signee or extension until they extended Betts and that was an overpay.
The Giants went from having one of the worst teams and worst farm systems in baseball in 2018 to being one game out of the postseason in 2020 to 107 wins in 2021 with one of the best farm systems and all you’re showing is hate for Farhan. What kind of Giants fan are you?
I don’t know how anyone can find major fault with what Farhan has done with the Giants. Sure there’s some luck in having so many older vets stay relatively healthy and perform as well as this group did, but he had the savvy to not just sign the right athletes, but the right cohesive group of guys. He put a team together in every sense of the word. He’ll spend this offseason, but only on the guy(s) that fit that culture.
I’m a Giants fan not an A’s fan which is why this approach is so irritating. When the Giants ownership decided to bring Farhan on board they did it knowing he wouldn’t be spending any money which is exactly what the A’s do every year. If I wanted to root for the best team with the lowest payroll I would be an A’s fan but I am perfectly willing to pay twice as much to see actual major leaguers on the field. The Dodgers acquired Betts AFTER Farhan left and sure enough they won a WS because of it. If Farhan pulls off the Scherzer/Turner deal instead of the Dodgers we are in the World Series this year. Difference is that Friedman has the balls to make a deal like that or the Mookie deal where Farhan is always too busy looking for the next shinny piece of trash.
Stop giving Farhan credit for the farm system he didn’t draft any of the real talent and the guys he has drafted look awful. He paid 10 million for Will Wilson and drafted guys like Hunter Bishop and Patrick Bailey. Those guys have been huge disappointments along with the losers he drafted with the qualifying picks he got for MadBum and Will Smith because he wasn’t capable of trading them before the deadline that year.
@Giant4, you’re extremely critical of Z when in my opinion, he’s done a fantastic job with what he had to work with over the past three years. He brought a true bottom-feeding team to a 107 win team in a very short period of time and did so with very prudent moves, helping the vets rediscover themselves and a new, dynamic manager and large coaching staff. He now has the green light to spend some $ and I am anxious to see how he uses it. A top starting pitcher, resigning Gausman, a true left fielder who mashes….all possibilities. Any criticism about the postseason to me should be directed at our players’ cold bats. Kapler did just fine. Our guys need to improve their ABs so that if the long ball goes quiet, we can still score and win games. Mark my word: the Giants will be better in 2022 than in ‘21.
Giant4life; not sure with that trade for Scherzer and Turner that giants would be in World Series. The team with the best record in baseball august forward after the trading deadline was the Braves. Not sure if you remember but the Braves vs Giants each team won 3 games and each team lost 3 games.
Like mlb network analysis saying not sure any team could have dealt with the Braves three left handed pitchers.
You can make trades etc but you still have to win the games
@benjamin, plus the cost to our farm wasn’t worth it for a rental in Scherzer and a year-plus in Turner. The Dodgers gave up their top pitching prospect for that trade. If we want to be relevant for the next 5 years, we need our top prospects.
Gotta say you sound more like a Giants fan for a week.
The Giants system is viewed as good not only because of the top 4 system guys that preceded Zaidi, but because they have added significant depth below that. Their top 25 prospects in MLB, Fangraphs, and BA predominantly include low minors level guys that have been added since Zaidi arrived. Included there are all the guys you mention above – lets not forget there was no minors season in 2020 for these guys. Yeah some have had bumps in the road – its called development.
It appears that people that have access to far more than the recent minors statistics you’re likely relying on are far more positive here.
I don’t know where your anti-Zaidi rant is coming from but you remind me of the Yanks fans that think they’d be better GMs than Cashman. Or maybe you’d just like Brian Sabean back?
In your defense though, they haven’t seemed nearly as successful in getting good international prospects under Zaidi as before.
Luciano, Matos, Pomares, Toribio, Genoves, Doval, K. Castro, and Greg Santos all preceded Zaidi to the org.
Of course only the 2019 IFA signs (Arteaga and M. Mercedes as the top ranked for SF) have had much chance to show up since the ’20 signings were delayed until January ’21., but the Giants didn’t seem to stand out there. And Zaidi picked up a couple of others (Teng, P. Berroa) in a trade for Sam Dyson in 2o19, who’s not in MN anymore. So time will tell.
“Stop giving Farhan credit for the farm system he didn’t draft any of the real talent and the guys he has drafted look awful.”
He inherited a system that had Bart, Luciano, Matos, Ramos, and others and it was one of the worst systems in baseball before he arrived. After just 3 drafts, he already has one of the best farm systems in baseball. His player development strategy has been excellent. And I’m sure it’ll play out just fine for guys like Bishop, Bailey, and others that you say “look awful.” Like any franchise, not every talented player will play out.
“MadBum and Will Smith because he wasn’t capable of trading them before the deadline that year.”
He was perfectly capable of trading them. But not for something that was as good as what they could realistically get in the draft. They weren’t getting a haul for either of those guys.
An obsessed with “star signings” fan. No other outcome is acceptable.
KJ – I’ve got no dog in this fight, but Mookie was far from the first big extension or free agent signing.
Kershaw $93M/3yrs
Kershaw $215M/7yrs
Jansen $80M/5yrs
Dodgers were 1st or 2nd in payroll from 2013-2017 and 3rd or 4th from 2018-2019. Wouldn’t be possible without some very large contracts, and they took on some very big contracts via trades also.
I know but those were uber necessary in house extensions. Except for the Kershaw deals they never went over 80mil for anyone until Betts and Bauer. Betts is undoubtedly still one of the best but 11 more years of that huge contract does mean they let guys like Kike Hernandez and Joc Pederson go at comparative peanuts and with those guys the Dodgers are likely in the WS this year.
I am a Cubs and Dodgers fan, but I have to stand up for the Giants’ front office. (except for the guy who fought his wife for the cell phone). The Giants do a good job with the pieces that they have, which usually means those were better pieces than others thought. And total spending amounts are decided by owners, not GMs or so-called presidents of baseball operations. As a GM you are always happy to spend more it makes you look good more often than not (but not always).
Wonder if the Giants shock everyone and go after Scherzer. No Q0.
Theyve got money to spend to sign Scherzer and resign Bryant.
Bring in Scherzer, resign Gausman, have Webb, could trade from their OF surplus to bring in a SP or two, then sign a platoon OF guy to a 1 or 2 year deal. Maybe go get John Means from the Orioles or a Marlins pitcher.
I’d like to see Atlanta make a run for MadMax too. I could see him sitting atop the Atlanta rotation.
Be weary of Scherzer, at age 37 with the amount of innings he has logged – I do not think he will be able to endure 180 innings next season and the falloff from there will further erode his performance.
Scherzer will look to maximize years to at least to age 40 but the numbers he will ask will not amount to the return on investment after age 37.
I think there is more to Scherzer ‘dead arm’ he stated, I bet dodgers wont even resign him either. I bet if Kershaw did not have the history with LAD he would not be resigned either, but because of history they will likely resign him.
Agree with this. Dodgers are very smart about self-evaluation. If they don’t go hard on Max, watch the eff out. I’d stay away in that case. And if they DO go hard on him, they’ll get him. Teams looking to sign a major SP might want to look elsewhere.
Scherzer would scare me with his age and past history of injuries. If you signed him I think you would have to skip some starts during the season with him to get him available in post season.
The pitcher Gray the dodgers gave up to get Scherzer is going be a better long term pitcher from the trade point forward than Scherzer. Not saying Scherzer past talking about the future August 2021 forward Gray will be better
Agree with Data, Seam and Benjamin regarding Max… hard pass if I’m Angels GM.
What would be a better deal? Scherzer at 3/95 or Verlander at 2/50?
I would not give Scherzer 3 years at 95 million. I would not give Verlander two years at 50 million.
The management did an outstanding job of getting the most out of their players, kudos to Farhan and Kapler, they really turned this team around. I am not a giants fan, just a fan of the game.
I’m not buying that any ball player is going to say ‘well the Giants got this out of this player who was a fringe player so maybe they can do the same for me’. I don’t believe for a second that fringe players realize they’re fringe players is what I’m saying. I truly believe that today’s players are fueled by money and money alone. If winning and getting better really mattered Mike Trout would have made an effort for the team that pays him $37 million a year instead of milking a calf strain for 3/4 of the season.
There really isn’t enough love for Farhan and his gang. Is 2021 sustainable? Probably not; lots of career years there. Will Farhan react? Absolutely YES. He has the revenue to pretty much do what he wants. And while the criticism that he doesn’t draft well is warranted, take a close look at the Rays drafting; not exactly scintillating. And they’re considered to be the best talent evaluators in the game.
GMs have to read and react; the Braves are going to the WS because AA didn’t suck his thumb after the OF injuries, he reacted, He looked at what he had, all throughout the organization, and acted accordingly. That’s what the good ones do.
And Farhan’s a good one.
No, the Giants aren’t ideally built. But they won more games than anyone else. So much for “ideally built”.
Pretty amusing that people consider all of Farhans findings to be based off of luck
Not the largest coaching staff in baseball
Not the analytics department
Not the internal strategy to spread FA cash among a multitude of signings
Not the player development in the minor leagues
Luck.
This is why people will still be surprised when Zaidi works his magic again this offseason and finds more gems. I wonder how many years it will take until the recognization is there, if ever
Baseball 1600;
I disagree with your argument here you act like Giants are the only team with these departments and only ones who find hidden gems. All teams have departments and people sometimes you just got to get lucky.
Sleepers happen look at the Braves how could every team sleep on Eddie Rosario and Jorge Soler yet Atlanta found gold in them. There is a lot of luck involved in a signing.
Eddie Rosario and Jorge Soler both have had previous success as big leaguers, but were able to be acquired for cheap due to current performance (or in Rosario’s case, because of injury). I wouldn’t compare that whatsoever to guys like Yastrzemski or Wade Jr, who were essentially career minor leaguers (Wade played a bit in the bigs in 2020, but didn’t do much). Farhan’s sleepers have been on seemingly no one else’s radar, so it’s not even a valid comparison to Atlanta.
Benjamin101677:
And I have to disagree with you. It almost seems like you’re saying all, or almost all, teams are equal in terms of supporting departments. There’s a huge discrepancy between the amount of money teams spend on something like an analytics department. Every team has an analytics department but there’s a huge difference in now vested teams are in that approach.
It makes no sense, that some teams that are loath to spend money on player contracts, would invest the kind of money the Giants have on support and facilities. I could be wrong but I don’t know of another team that has 3 hitting coaches like the Giants.
It’s in no way luck. He knows exactly what he is doing. He knows what players will work in what spots. He sees things 90% of other GMS don’t. Guy’s a genius.
I believe in Zaidi.
Bobtilman; in my opinion problem with baseball is only Giants fan will remember 2021 in a few years a World Series championship lasts forever.
Example who remembers 1993 and the Braves and Giants both in same division back then with no wild card fought it out to last day of season Atlanta won 104 and Giants won 103 and went home. Braves lost first round to Phillies. Everyone remembers Joe Carter and the blue jays winning World Series not who had over a 100 wins.
A lot of people remember that 1993 season. Of course every Giants fan alive at the time remembers. But more than just Giants fans remember it. The announcers were talking about it during a game broadcast just the other day. And I recently saw an article about 100 win teams that didn’t make the PS. Now the casual fan is oblivious I’m sure, but not real baseball fans.
I will never forget 1993. In my opinion that was the best Giants team I’ve ever seen. I could, from memory, name every position player and starting pitcher.
I was going to debate ya, but honestly pound for pound it was probably one of the best since even NY days.
They did everything even Benzinger had a great year….JR Phillips was at his height.
Two 20 game winners, Stolen bases, power…they had it all. except for late Aug/Sept losses to ATL meant more than they knew.
Come on now… these guys were good before. McGee was only bad when he was in Colorado, which should be no surprise. Wood has had some excellent years… Descalfani had a couple great years.
You guys should try and predict who will be good before they are good and see how close you come. You guys love your spinny rate stats and exit velocity. Find someone that isn’t doesn’t have an ops over 130 and who has a great exit velocity and launch angle and say, “hey, watch this guy. He could potentially have a great year.” Instead, we get. “That Mike Trout guy… he pretty good.”
Look at the free agent list… find a guy that you think might stand head and shoulders above what everyone else will do and let us know now. Choose a hitter and a pitcher. Put your reputation on the line. If you are wrong… oh well, you tried. If you are right. Every major league team will come to you to find out who you think will be next.
LOL
Any chance the Giants look at Correa? Or is he strictly a SS? Can he play 3B, or maybe move Crawford to 2B due to his age? I’m just brainstorming.
I know ownership wants a star to market for the future, and will allow Farhan Zaidi to spend however he wishes. Either way, they had a phenomenal season and were really fun to watch. I imagine lots of players will want to join them for the 2022 season.
Correa is going to cost an arm and a leg, but if the Giants sign him they’ll be getting a solid young SS that can elevate his team. He does have some durability concerns and also brings a bit of a black cloud over his head due to the Asterisks cheating scandal. I honestly think they’ll look to re-sign KB and hopefully develop their next SS to come in and take over after Crawford is ready to hang ‘em up. I’ll have to look it up, how did Bart finish up in AAA? If they add a DH in the NL next season going after Correa would make more sense since they could use it to rest Posey/Crawford/Belt. If Bart is ready to take over more AB’s behind the dish and the NL gets a DH the Giants age concerns become less of a problem.
The Giants had a heck of a season. They will have to make some crafty moves in order to come back strong next season. The were able to catch lightning in a bottle this season but their core is aging so they’re going to depend on the development of their farmhands to be a perennial contender in the NL West. I don’t see Farhan making any long term splashes as far as free agent signings go but I do think they’ll try to re-sign KB once his market dries up a bit. Webb looks like a legit ace at the top of the rotation but they need to figure out how to fill 2-5 creatively. Doval looks like a formidable closer so I think their bullpen will be tough next season as well. It will be an interesting offseason, my Dodgers have a lot of maneuvering to do as well, although I believe in our young core of homegrown players a bit more than what the Giants have on the farm. Farhan is trying to build something sustainable and that takes time. Go Braves!
I agree that Webb and Doval sure look like exciting young pieces for the future. It will also be extremely difficult to replicate their 107 win season. You’re right, they definitely caught lightning in a bottle.
Dodgers resign Chris Taylor? I can see Taylor getting a ton of interest this off-season.
Central Valley;
I think the dodgers let Taylor walk as he is going cost a lot and there is not a clear cut path to playing time for him. He is going go somewhere and start 150 plus games with the dodgers on paper with Muncy back; Bellinger looking good and Lux there isn’t as clear a playing time spot
Dodgers will retain CT unless they get Freeman or Castellanos. Kershaw will go to Dodgers or Rangers on two year deal.
1 Betts RF
2 Trea SS
3 Muncy 3B
4 Smith C
5 Justin DH
6 Pollock LF
7 CT CF
8 Belli 1B
9 Lux 2B
I disagree with them resigning Taylor. Much more likely they spend the big money on pitching. Even if they did keep Taylor. Muncy would stay at 1B, Turner at 3B, Belly in CF and Taylor plays a Utility spot.
Betts RF
Seager 3B
T.Turner SS
Muncy 1B
Smith C
Bellinger CF
J. Turner DH
Pollock LF
Lux 2B or CT3
I HOPE!
If they can dump rest of Bauer contract maybe they can keep both Taylor and Seager and Kershaw plus sign a no. 5 starter.
Seager is not going to play 3B for Dodgers.
he will consider 3B on another team am sure for longterm deal but not the Dodgers
Christ Taylor was in a contract year I see big regression for him next season if he gets multiple year deal.
Lets look at Giants –
They are losing 4 SPs
Its almost certain that they need to bring back gausman.
DeSclafani is not worth a resign unless its cheap to fill innings.
I would think they would bring back Wood on short term.
Cueto, only if its cheap and short term, because he needs to prove himself anyway as he looks like a low rent player than what he used to be. Overall I think Giants move away from him entirely.
They need a solid #1 or #2 type pitcher to anchor with Webb (outside the resignings of gaus and wood)
I hope they raise the price on kershaw for fun and Scherzer (I think scherzer while displaying solid production I think his window of greatness closes soon with his age)
they will lose quality HR potential in their lineup through FA
They need to make that up in a big way
Bryant would make sense on a resign as he has power gap ability although his $$$$ value might not reflect his worth and that is where they need to determine it.
Belt has aged although last two seasons were good but its been a long time coming and he his age shows more decline than improvement.
The Giants need to build around power bat that can drive in runs, they need to look at FA that can deliver it in the clutch.
Knowing Longoria is one year away from FA – Its time to think getting a 3b now for longterm knowing they have to shift away from usual position first year. (it also depends who is available next season) also DH may give them that opportunity
Tough job this off-season. No matter what he does, the team next year will likely be 10 wins less. Could easily be 20 less. This was a special year where things went right. I think the key is being honest about how good guys will be moving forward and not thinking 2021 performance is where they’ll be in 2022.
I would really push to resign Gausman as priority 1.
I hope they can resign all 3 of the Starters. Cueto,eh, bye bye. Possibly trade for a more established hitting Outfielder. Yaz disappeared. And resign what you have. Belt, Solano, one year. Etc. If there is a Way to add a more disciplined hitter, I’d go for it Totally. Could make the Lineup even Better.
Please, Farhan, DO NOT sign Belt.
Yea man, don’t sign the guy who’s been one of the best hitters in the league the past 2 years, with gold glove caliber defense, and also happens to get along famously with the rest of the club house. Give me a break.
Yea, what the heck? Belt is terrific.
I think Belt will be the classic case of a guy having one of his best years in the final year of his contract, only to revert to the norm once he signs a new one. And he’ll be asking for a big pay raise and too many years.
Giants fans have been hearing for a decade, “this is the year Brandon Belt breaks out and becomes a superstar.” Hasn’t happened.
He is what he is: a very good defender and a .240/18/50 hitter.
He’ll be 34 next year. He spends way too much time on the IL… that will only increase as he ages. And FWIW, the Giants had a better winning percentage when he wasn’t in the lineup.
Cut him loose.
Ah, that explains it. Wanting to let Belt walk is a head-scratcher. But I see you like outdated stats like BA, and counting stats.
He’s admittedly not a superstar, but why are people expecting him to be? He has a 126 wRC+ for his career. That means he’s been 26% better than league average for his entire career. Who are you going to get who’s better?
He’s been vastly underrated by a lot Giants fans that don’t bother to look deeper into his stats. Here’s a stat for you. Oracle has been the park where it’s been the hardest for lefties to hit HRs. Belt homered every 28.4 ABs through 2019. Since they put the bullpens in CF and closed off the arcade, after the 2019 season, he’s homered every 12.5 ABs.
So now that the park is not so punitive to LHHs with power, and he’s more valuable than ever, you want to let him walk.
Farhan Zaidi is worth every penny. I hope his staff remains largely intact.
Giants ownership hit a home run with the folks they have running things. The future is bright.
I’d love to see Correa in San Francisco. I know they have Crawford at SS and a stud prospect in Luciano. Maybe rotate Crawford at DH?
Getting Correa makes no sense because…
Why on earth would you DH a gold glove SS?
They signed Crawford for two years as a stop-gap until Luciano is ready.
Look at the Giants current contract structure with their players in hand and the key prospects in their system and where they are and the strategy becomes pretty obvious.
The contracts with the established older guys are all done after ’23. So Posey and Belt back on 1 or 2 year deals, possibly for less money than they made in ’21 and maybe plus options for old times sake. That pretty much fills out their position player group for next year, though they could make a big strike for one of the top guys if they felt (assuming a SS) that they got positional flexibility for the future there. Semien might make good sense there. Plus he’s already the oldest of the top middle IF FA available so he fits right in and could take a shorter deal. Their top prospect Luciano, though still a couple of years away, is also a SS.
Their system is pretty good and heavy in OFs and Pitchers, but few are really close to helping in the next 2 years. Only 6 of their top 25 prospects on MLB have reached AA, 9 so from Fangraphs, with 6 between them that are on the 40 man now – 5 that may be pen pieces depending on how you view the suspension completed Greg Santos.
I could see them non-tendering Dickerson in favor of an out of options Duggar. The later is just simply more useful and likely over $2 million cheaper. Their prospect base is full of OFs, one of the best of which Ramos is at AAA already. Another reason their focus in FA if at all should be the IF. And Bart is likely ready to step in at back up C to Posey, Meaning they could also non-tender Casali and save another $1 million +.
The bullpen is in pretty good shape through ’23, and they have some young depth behind them as discussed above. I’d expect they’d like to carry Beede as a long guy if he can’t cut it as a starter since he too is out of options.
The rotation is obviously the key issue. But the money is certainly there to make a splash, even if they add somebody like Semien (or Seager to piss off the Dodgers). I’d expect at least 1 older guy on a lower cost and/or short deal will be in the mix – its in their org DNA no? And clearly they like their reboot types – could Andrew Heaney fit as a long shot depth piece? He might not give up quite so many HRs in SF. But they need 2 or 3 solid guys to mix in – Wood may be the top return candidate at the lower end. And I’m sure they’d like Gausman back but the market will dictate that and they can’t QO him. Lots of options, but again with like 10 starters in their top 20 or so prospects I don’t think they’ll want to go longer term (remember their ’23 cliff) with more than 1 or 2.
Your assuming that Belt; Crawford and Posey and others would all have career years again?
A lot of people on here talking about stats and stuff well if you look back more of the experts with the stats took the giants to finish 3rd or 4th. I don’t think the key to 2022 would be to re sign the majority of your players and hope for career years again.
The giants had a great 2021 magical year but I don’t think they could do it again in 2022 with them same cast of players with so many in their mid 30’s that would have to career years to match 2021. Last time the giants had really good team they resigned a bunch of them Huff; Burrel; Scuarto; Freddy Sanchez and it didn’t work out well the next year.
Don’t forget the Dodgers should still be strong; the Padres should be strong so it won’t make a lot of sense to trade away a farm system to try and win in 2022 when there isn’t a young team with emerging stars one piece away there a aging team with some stars past their prime that had a good and some luck season.
With the dodgers getting knocked out by Atlanta I could really see the dodgers spending huge to get some more star pieces. If Atlanta doesn’t resign Freeman the dodgers would be a logical destination.
Isn’t Max Muncy the Dodgers’ first baseman? Isn’t Bellinger a 1st baseman also?
I was skeptical about Kapler at first, but am now confident he’s not going anywhere anytime soon. Seems like he’s doing a great job and the players really like him.
His job is safe. Manager of the year in my eyes.
Central Valley; I hope that you remember 2021 if the giants don’t do nearly as good next season.
There are only two candidates for manager of the year and a case could be made for either Braves Brian Stinker or Giants Gane Kapler.
I don’t know when they vote for manager of the year awards. If it’s after he post season when Stinker probably has moved votes away from Kapler as we only have a short memory
San Francisco can have Stanton for Bart.
They would do it, but NY will have to pay all of Stanton’s contract except the major league minimum.
The article correctly states that Longoria is under contract for almost $20M, but omits the fact that the Rays will pay $5M of that. I wonder if the Giants would be willing to eat that $14.667M and let him walk for an upgrade at 3B. Probably not, since it’s still a good chunk of change, but opening 3B for Bryant would definitely be an upgrade.
“It certainly stands to reason that free agents would be intrigued, especially given that the Giants have seemingly found a way to maximize the talents of veterans they’ve brought on in recent years……”
B I N G O
This is what teams have to do to win in today’s MLB.
Not just when bringing in veterans, but in how they work with all players on their roster.
6 years 48 million is the absolute most I’d offer Bryant. Never seen a player milk more out of limited production than he.
That won’t happen. I’d give him a 4 year deal. $64mil. Something along those lines. I think that’s reasonable and not overpaying.
Dream on. He’s a Scott Boras client.
Why would anyone think you could sign a player that’s tied for the 14th highest OPS+ among all active players for 6/$48M, or even 4/$64M? An AAV of $8M is an insult. But even an AAV of $16M is still $9M -$10M less than the guys he’s tied with on the OPS+ leaders list, and that offer would appropriately go straight into the trash bin.
I could see Max Scherzer in a Giants uniform next season.
Ha ha. That was a good read. Article and comments.
If Farhan is stating that the Giants are a place FA want to come too, I’m thinking it’s safe to assume Gabe has good job security.
As for the man himself, I sat out the MLB last year so as a Giants fan, I have the advantage of seeing only what I see. Impressive guy. Intelligent, speaks well and with sincerity and detail. Defers credit to those around him. Obviously a believer in getting the best out of your body in terms of nutrition and conditioning. Leading by living it. What about the garden hoses he has protruding from his forearms !!
The dude is an articulate, intelligent weapon. Respect.
In terms of the game, played it a bit differently and managed a 40-1 shot to win the division. Had them showing incredible consistency in terms of the win loss record. Just kept winning 4 out of 6. Again and again and again. Took it to the wire with the Dodgers in the playoffs. Stayed true to form to the death.
Respect.
Led a team of coaches that got nearly every single player to perform above their average and/or expectation. I can’t help but think the doomsayers are missing the whole preparation part of the Giants.
Anyhow…….Respect.
Giants won 107 plus 2 equals 109.
Dodgers won 106 plus 1 plus 3 plus 2 equals 112.
112 is greater than 109.
Dodgers will have won the most games in 2021.
But at least the Padres “won” the 2020-2021 off-season finishing only 27-28 games behind their big brothers.
2021 proved you dont need to win 100 to get to the final series.
Shark – It’s always been that way.
If you’ve got a very talented team that experiences key injuries or a Covid outbreak midseason, and said team gets completely healthy for the postseason, they are just as capable of winning it all as a team that stayed healthy all season and won 10 more games in the regular season.
The Giants lost because the bullpen gave up runs. Fact.
The Giants need to trade with the Detroit Tigers.
The Tigers need top prospects.
The Giants could use closer Gregory Soto, Catcher Haas or and Second baseman Schoop. That 40+ hrs and a second closer for SF.
The Tigers could take on LaStellas’ contract.
It wasn’t the pen that lost the playoffs; the Giants barely hit. The Giants are not a good trading partner for the Tigers. The Tigers are searching for an everyday SS and another catcher this off season. Thairo Estrada and Joey Bart would fit that bill but are not available.