The Red Sox signed right-hander Jose De Leon to a minor league deal earlier this week, as the right-hander announced himself on his Twitter feed. De Leon was designated for assignment and then released by the Reds two weeks ago.
SKOR North’s Darren Wolfson tweets that the Pirates and Blue Jays also showed interest in De Leon’s services, and it isn’t surprising that multiple teams looked into taking a flier on the righty considering his past status as one of the game’s top pitching prospects. Unfortunately for De Leon, his development was hampered by a Tommy John surgery that cost him the entire 2018 season, not to mention other injuries.
As a result, De Leon has only 48 Major League innings on his career resume since making his big league debut in September 2016. De Leon has an unimpressive 8.44 ERA over his brief time in the majors, including an 8.35 ERA over 18 1/3 frames with Cincinnati in 2021. Control (14.5% walk rate) has been a significant issue, though De Leon is missing a lot of bats with a 27.7% strikeout rate.
Red Sox chief baseball officer Chaim Bloom is no stranger to De Leon, as Bloom was working in the Rays’ front office when Tampa Bay acquired the right-hander from the Dodgers back in January 2017. There’s no risk for the Sox in seeing if their minor league development staff can sharpen up De Leon’s control and turn him into a real bullpen weapon, considering his obvious strikeout ability.
Dumpster diving again
Dude is terrible
Which one, Bloom or De Leon?
Boy does this make up for the quiet trade deadline.
Greatest signing since David Ortiz. 8.44 ERA, surely you jest
Bang bang
8.00 ERA is out of this world. I really want to know what’s going on in Bloom’s head.
33 strikeouts in 18 innings has the stuff just needs to figure it out
If you give up 3 runs while striking out three, it doesn’t make the score any better to say he “struck out the side.” You can’t really blame the batters for not where the ball is going because neither does the pitcher.
we all would
pwndroia – it’s a black hole where good ideas are sucked into the vortex and disappear forever!! haha
I hate to think this but Bloom is sabotaging this fun team.
Oh ya , fun team. Check out the base running…..
Pasha2k – Sabotaging? Isn’t it just Bloom being Bloom? Doesn’t sabotage suggest a thought process? That’s what makes it unlikely.
Bloom is the reason why they’re so successful this season and he made it clear that they’re looking to build the future rather than now.
Destined: So true, weird how people can’t comprehend such an obvious position. Stockpile low risk, high reward as much as you can, then wait.
This team never had a chance this year, but has thankfully overachieved. Setting up a bright future. But, to take the achievements of this season, and get angry that they won’t trade off the farm to POSSIBLY get a little further is ridiculous.,
That is pretty much how I look at.
I think this might an ‘only in Boston’ thing, kind of like lining up on the Tobin every time we sign a minor league player.
Some fans will spend the entire year and off-season complaining about how we are the worst team in baseball.
Than spend two weeks complaining about how we didn’t dump the entire farm in the pursuit of a World Series, while simultaneously complaining that we are going to finish last.
Some of you guys make it sound like Bloom signed him to a 3-year deal. It’s a minor league deal and he’s 24.
Exactly! I’m fine with the deal, as long as he doesn’t get called up this month and thrown into high leverage situations which tends to happen with Cora.
FP Guy – He was a very legitimate prospect 5 years ago until he graduated to the majors in LAD and they realized he didn’t have what it takes so naturally they shipped him to Bloom!!! hahaha.
Is it any surprise we got Downs, Wong and Verdugo in the Mookie trade rather than some real potential talent like Urias, May, Gonsolin or even Josiah Gray?
How much better would two SPs have been than the three guys we got? Either way the next championship ring is a half decade away but at least the pitching future would have looked better and that’s been the Achilles heal since 2018.
I dunno, Sox needed an OF’er and Verdugo was highly rated.
Coulda been worse, glad we didn’t go through with Graterol.
So what are your thoughts on Pivetta getting pulled yesterday? Dude I’m still fuming.
“ Is it any surprise we got Downs, Wong and Verdugo in the Mookie trade rather than some real potential talent like Urias, May, Gonsolin or even Josiah Gray?”
It’s called trade value of a rental
FP Guy – Furious too but have come to expect it from Cora. Bad decisions by a bad manager. He showed up in 2018 not knowing how to manage a pitching staff and has learned nothing in this time in Boston.
I don’t dislike Verdugo but at the time it was easier to find an inexpensive outfielder who could produce Verdugo-like number than find a young SP with good stuff and an excellent upside. The Dodgers were loaded with them and we got their 4th best OF, their 5th or 6th best middle infielder and their 5th best catcher for one year of a player who almost won the MVP and put them over the top to win a ring.
In July, after COVID hit, Mookie’s value would have sky-rocketed because ATL, SD and LAD would have been bidding on him to put them over the top to win the NL and the World Series. I hold Bloom accountable for the horrific choice of when to move Mookie and the way he moved Price. All rookie mistakes despite him not being a rookie.
Who else was bidding for Mookie besides the Dodgers? If there was only one bidder, the return will probably be lower. If there are more than one bidder, you can get the bidders competing against each other and likely get a higher return.
Thoughts and prayers for a speedy recovery.
29
*typo
Fine with it, just not sure of the impact.
Bullpen weapon? Heck, he’ll be the #2 starter by next year. There isn’t anybody else.
Bob – I like Eovaldi or Houck for #2 and #3 but after that…. it’s go fish!!!
It’s the dudes birthday I wish him nothing more then better success then he’s had In previous stints
Low risk. Mediocre reward. Heck. Why not.
At age 29, he doesn’t have a lot time to “figure it out.”
He’s got at least 4 years
Bang bang
Every team is dumpster diving for pitching. The Giants just signed Tyler Chatwood to a minor league deal.
Bartolo!!!!
I think this is a great signing (for what it is… a minor league flier) the guy obviously has big time strike ability/stuff and was, at one point, considered an ‘elite-elite’ prospect. If the Red Sox minor league development staff can figure out a way to harness his stuff and get back to his pre-TJ surgery days. (which will hopefully be easier in a relief role vs starting as well) he could be a guy that turns out do be a really solid steal for Bloom an Co. Having said all of that though there are 2 BIG caveats 1) he might just continue to suck and be released in a month 2) it might not be until next season… he could be a guy that needs to really break things down to the absolute basics. But if that’s the case, and the Sox have the patience (and he resigns this offseason) I think they could be rewarded (think back to what they did with Andrew Miller) not saying this guy’s as good. But as far as flier minor league FA deals go… I think this is a good one.
Yours is a voice of reason against the repetitive fulminations of the Bury Bloom group. de Leon was once an elite prospect—so was Arroyo, and a lot of people like that move.
I for one don’t really care who the Sox sign to minor league deals to see what they may have…
BUT.
Boston isnt exactly known these days for helping guys turn things around on the pitching side of things. They can develop and fix (to an extent) position players, but pitching development let alone redevelopment has not been a strong suit. I don’t expect much.
Pivetta, and Yaksel Rioa could be trending that way.
Jeff Z – So you are waiting for the same guys that turned around Perez, Richards, E-Rod and the other dozen guys that have gone through the revolving door since Bloom arrived to have success with this guy after a dozen failures?
That’s the definition of optimism.
KD17 – Not sure what you mean by “turned around” since ERod has been here all along. But, why all the hate?
He came into a crappy situation. DD left him with a terrible Salary Cap situation. That he had to reset. And one of the worst Farm Systems in the league. BTW, I’ll bet it would be hard to find another Farm System, that went from Top 5, to Bottom 5 in 3 years, anywhere else in the past 50 years.
Sure DD won 2018 WS, but by no means was that a guarantee, (A quick check of odds from Feb 2018, had Red Sox as 7th best behind LA, NYY, Hou. ChiC, Wash, Clev). So he guts farm system, maxs payroll, and he finds himself with 7th best chance to win a WS. WTF. THATS NOT GOOD MANAGEMENT. If he doesn’t get lucky (yes it took luck to win ’18), this conversation wouldn’t even be happening.
Back to Bloom: Lousy team, Over the Salary Cap, Gutted Farm System, COVID. And he somehow is able to compete a year and half later. And you guys are whining about it? Wow. Youre not a Red Sox fan at all, please take off the sheep’s cloth, and put a Yankee jersey on that Babe Ruth picture,
dennyd = DD left him with Cherington’s mess that ownership stopped wanting to pay for. Their mistake but it was easier to pass it off as DDs. No truth to that rumor.
Bloom didn’t have a gun to his head when he was hired. He took the big money and maybe or maybe not he knew they wanted Mookie out. He still handled non-tender ineptly. He still gave away the franchise player at an inopportune time to maximize value. He still made the huge financial mistake on Price. Those are all facts or water under the bridge if you want to look forward.
DD never gutted the farm system. That’s simply you hating on DD. It’s the opposite of the truth!! DD continued the most successful farm system of the 2010s. His payrolls were below the cap it was the retained pay from before him that put them over so that is more fiction you are spewing about DD.
2018 wasn’t lucky it was 3 hitters having career years, a couple of timely pick-ups by DD and a very solid pitching staff. They might not have had the most talent on paper but every team has players that have up years and down years. When a team has many players having an up year they tend to do well. 2018 was that type of year. I give the players the credit more than anyone else. Just like in 2021.
The Red Sox WERE NOT lousy when Bloom arrived. It had high skill levels and an ace that was hurt. Just like the Mets aren’t lousy because DeGrom is hurt. Injuries happen and when they happen to your ace the team performance is most significantly impacted.
The team wasn’t REALLY competing this year. The lack of talent caused by Bloom had them pegged at 4th. Great seasons by 4 or 5 players allowed the early performance to be much better than expected. Things have started to normalize and they will fall to fourth in the division because they have the fourth most talent thanks to Bloom’s mistakes.
I have been a Red Sox fan since I was very young. I cut school to watch Yaz play in the 67 series. I suffered through the Bucky Dent homer with a room mate in college that was a Yankee fan. I called a friend who was a Met fan in 86 late in game six to rub it in and I watched in disbelief in 2004 when the finally won because it was one year after my father passed away after 80 years of being a fan without seeing a championship.
Yep I have been a Red Sox fan for over 60 years and I am furious with ownership for letting go of DD because he wanted to keep Mookie and re=invest their money in winning rings. I am furious that a two time cheater was allowed to be a part of the organization. He had his second chance in Boston after the Houston cheating and should NEVER have been asked back for a third chance. And I am furious that they hired an unproven GM who is a YES man that isn’t about winning, he’s just a marketing guy telling people things are good when they aren’t. He has no proven track record in TB because they have continued to be excellent without him while Boston flounders with him.
Ownership should sell to people who want the Red Sox fans to see a great product, not a cheap product.
dennyd – My turned around comment related to E-Rod based on the fact that E-Rod has never been good. He’s a mediocre pitcher and the minor league experience should have turned him around into a productive pitcher. Take away his run support and he’s a #5 SP on a good year.
ERA+ for ERod
2015: 112
2016: 95
2017: 109
2018: 116
2019: 128
2020: He got Covid bad, and hasn’t been the same.
His best year:
2019: 34 Starts, 204 Inn, ERA+ 128, FIP 3.86
“he’s a #5 SP on a good year.” — Such a load of crap.,
Love these random statements like they’re facts. “DD left him with Cherington’s mess that ownership”
Please eloborate. On second thought, let me:
-Aug 2015 (right before DD took over) Team Prospect Rankings: Red Sox ranked BEST in all of baseball. (mlb.com)
-Aug 2019 (right before DD fired) Team Prospect Rankings: Red Sox ranked 30th in all of baseball. (mlb.com)
2015: 4mil under the Cap
2018: 42mil over the Cap
2019: 33mil over the Cap
Best Farm System in Baseball, Under the Salary Cap. Both of which Dombroski DESTROYED. Yeah, Cherington left him in such a mess.
WTF are you smoking?
Hard to see any reason for dissing on Chaim. Today the Sox claimed the season series from the Shamrocks, and tomorrow they’ll semi-officially eliminate them. The Yankees are charging and it will be a great 3-way race in the AL East for the rest of the year with the Sox, MFY and Rays. All in. a year of low expectations, no Sale, and after the Betts trade. Chaim is closer to exec of the year than he is to deserving criticism.
Agreed. Some Sox fans clamored that Bloom didn’t do enough at the TD when this was suppose to be a bridge year. Pedal to the metal when the racecar is out of the pitstop. I’m looking forward to this race. The Sox will get Sale back and the MFY will have what remains of Kluber and Severino. Jays will also be in the mix.
Here’s the thing…. the sox contending status isn’t because of the moves chaim has made.
The guys carrying the team and largely responsible for the success you see were pre-bloom.
The 2019 core was something other clubs aspire to get to after years of tanking. The contending window was at it peak. The season went south because Cora mismanaged ST and the pitching staff. Once they had the equivalent of ST experience they played to a winning pct with the best of them, but the early hole was too big. Then the offseasom blew something up that shouldn’t have been. Trade mookie, but price should’ve been kept.
2021 shouldn’t be a bridge year, it should’ve been in Conte tion all along. And when you have a legit shot, you take it too. Not sit back and say, well, there should be others, let’s wait. You go for it when you can.
Bloom retooled the whole bullpen in one offseason which is a big reason they are contending. He also signed Renfroe and Hernandez. I don’t think Bloom sat back at the trade deadline. He said he found the asking prices too high. You would probably blame him for paying high prices if he did.
AITSTYW – Retooled the bullpen? He got several guys that don’t suck as badly but are now starting to break down because he got them at K-Mart. Glad you mentioned Kiki since Bloom passed on Semien so the owners could pocket more profits and not re=invest in their team after destroying it.
Renfroe has had a decent first half, lets see if he can finish this career year. Not paying high prices for key players, now that sounds like a winning strategy!!
You are really missing the point. High prices are irrelevant. Results are relevant. DD got a cheap pitcher for Philly and they’ve taken off. Why because he’s been effective like Pearce and Eovaldi in 2018.
Bloom got an injured hitter that has no position to play where he won’t hurt the team defensively. That’s the difference between a quality GM and a guy who doesn’t belong.
The bullpen has been much better this year. I agree with Rsox below about the Sox farm system. I think it is middle of the pack without much other teams want except the best prospects. Yes, let’s see how Renfroe does the rest of the year before we judge it. I think Renfroe and Hernandez were signed because the Sox were in rebuilding mode and staying below the luxury tax. Contending this year was unexpected. I wish they got more at the trade deadline for sure. However, Bloom said the prices were too high and I am good with that for now. Bloom has been with the Sox for less than 2 years. I am willing to give him more time to remake the farm system. Eventually, I may be unhappy with Bloom like you, but I am not there yet.
GA: Here’s the thing. . . DD was the boss in 2019, and Cora worked for him. Any overworking of players, should have been addressed between the two of them. Managers don’t work in a vacuum, so to blame Cora, and absolve DD, is ridiculous.
Here’s all the facts your avoiding, to come to your conclusion about 2019, “should have been a bridge year”
-Aug 2015 (right before DD took over) Team Prospect Rankings: Red Sox ranked BEST in all of baseball. (mlb.com)
-Aug 2019 (right before DD fired) Team Prospect Rankings: Red Sox ranked 30th in all of baseball. (mlb.com)
Red Sox Salary Cap Situation:
2018: 42mil over the Cap
2019: 33mil over the Cap
2020: 9mil under the Cap
In 2019 and going into 2020, facing a 50% tax on money over Salary Cap, plus drop of first round draft pick, and loss of International Pool Money, also several big name players looking for pay raise, David Ortiz’s bat gone, and no farm system to speak of. RED SOX HAD TO CUT PAYROLL. If you can’t understand this, then it’s a shame. No team can stay above Cap forever, rules were put into place for just this reason.
So in 2019, Red Sox had a terrible farm system, several players looking for a big payday, Salary Cap Tax up the whazoo, plus it penalties. But, nah Red Sox should’ve kept steering for that iceburg. If you were on the Titanic, you would’ve said, “Nah, all good, I’m going back to sleep”.
dennyd – cherry picking like JoeBrady does!!
First, farm system rankings are meaningless. The Red Sox had Moncada and he was over-rated so DD moved him to get an elite pitcher. Any good GM would have done the same.
Next, your payroll numbers are horse crap!!
2018 – Active payroll was $168M, Injured players were $18M.
That means $186M was on DD. Retained and deferred payroll was $43M.
2019 – The Red Sox exceeded the cap by $36.8M that year. It was comprised of retained salary and injured players worth $37M
2018 DOES NOT include Pedroia’s $13.75M which was inherited as dead money So DD was roughly $25M under the cap in 2018 and right at the cap in 2019. The rest happened prior to his arrival and should have been on ownership to pay because it was their mistake..
So you exaggerated DD’s numbers to suit your argument and misled people to believe DD overspent. HE DIDN’T!!!!
One other point. Go do a look-up on the Gross Profit made by the Red Sox since 2004 or when this ownership bought them. Then use standard percentages for their net profits to gross profits of this industry and explain why an organization making that much money can’t spend over the cap. The Yankees have done it for years because they have even greater profits than the Red Sox. The new Dodger ownership is willing to do the same because they too have hundreds of millions of profits each year.
Please note I’m not saying Revenue I am saying PROFITS. Money that is either re-invested or moved to individuals or stockpiled.
Your fabricated scenario is simply NOT TRUE. If you make several hundred million in profits the $10M to $30M luxury tax IS NOT taking it up the whazoo, it’s an insignificant speed bump.
You looked into the water with your telescope and thought the ice cube was an iceberg!!! Financially, the Red Sox have money to burn but instead of competing by re-investing they are pocketing the money. Prices aren’t going down but they still feel no need to share their success with their fans in the form of re-invested dollars to win rings. They did it for 20 years and suddenly stopped but the prices to fans haven’t gone down because they stopped.
The tail you spun was a gross misrepresentation of the facts.
KD: You make sense, but you need to reset the luxury tax at some point to avoid penalties. They could have gone over this year after resetting last year. I am not sure how covid and empty stadiums affect revenue. I can see teams keeping costs down this year because of covid uncertainty. I am willing to give Bloom some time to see if he can get the Red Sox to where the Dodgers are. The guy running the Dodgers came from the Rays like Bloom, so I am willing to give Bloom some time. I think DD may have been fired for the Sale and Eovaldi contracts. Both those guys got hurt after signing huge contracts which tied up about $50 mil per year. Just my speculation on why Henry fired DD.
Every GM inherits bad contracts. Cherington inherited Matsuzaka, Buckholtz, Crawford, Lackey. Cherington won a WS 3 years later, then left the number one Farm System. DD wins WS, but needs to gut farm, and put the Payroll way over to do it.
DD’s list from the Chopping Block:
Still Playing in the Majors —–
Yoan Moncada, Travis Shaw, Marico Dubon, Michael Kopech, Victor Diaz, Jamie Callahan, Deven Marrero, Jalen Beeks, Ty Butterey
Still considered decent prospects —–
Wendell Rijo, Jose Almonte, Anderson Espinoza, Luis Basabe, Esteban Quizor, Elio Prado, Noel Romero (this is just the ones that are decent, several others fizzled out)
How can you say with a straight face, that DD didn’t ruin the farm system.
Zero command – signed, a Reds fan…
The Red Sox system doesn’t have a Simeon Woods-Richardson or a Josiah Gray to land the Berrios’ or Scherzer’s. Unfortunately they really didn’t have a Sam Howard to land Kyle Gibson. Would JA Happ or Jon Lester been available to the Sox with what they had to offer? If Bloom traded for Happ people would still be complaining. I don’t think there is a whole lot Bloom could have done to make everyone happy. And as poor as the pitching has been lately the offense has been worse. Get the bats going and the pitchers won’t be scared about giving up one or two runs and losing
Rsox – Seriouisly? Wow and people think I’m hard on the current players. Houck or Gray, I take Houck. Sam Howard? Bloom should have given Texas Perez, Richards and E-Rod for Gibson and explained why he thinks so highly of them to close the deal. That way we would be assured they wouldn’t be returning!! FYI… Howard sucks.
There has to be a long term strategy and Bloom says he has one but can’t articulate it to anyone. That’s a sure sign of BS. The Red Sox have both Casas and Dalbec to play 1B and could have moved one to get Rizzo not Schwarber. The Red Sox could have moved JD to other teams since this year isn’t happening and got a 3B so Devers could go to DH. So many, many things a good GM could have done to improve the future but instead he got a square peg to put in a round hole.. Brilliant!!
All of those moves make absolutely no sense. Why would Bloom sell the entire farm system for a few rentals that probably won’t resign especially in a seller’s market for the most part. Dalbec still has potential so I don’t logically see him being a part of a deal. Moving JD for the sake of putting Devers at the DH spot isn’t really wise either. It seems that your definition of a “good” GM is someone who plays franchise mode on the show.
destined miner – Look I accept that you tried to respond to my comments but you have no idea what I’m talking about.
Without writing a primer on being a GM lets start with simple concepts. The GM has an inventory of players by position. He has a finite payroll. He must mix and match high salaried players with low salaried players. He must spread the coverage at each defensive position with the best possible candidates given his financial constraints.
What does that mean? If Dalbec and Casas are both 1Bs then he is in a position to reallocate his resources so he has better coverage across all positions. Boston needs pitching. Moving a long-term 1B when you are deep at that position to acquire a SP isn’t selling out the farm system, it’s reallocating your resources.
Devers is the butcher of Boston because of his defense. He should have been moved to DH at age 12 or at least by 20 but people kept crossing their fingers that he would improve. He’s proven that if you take a small enough sample you can show improvement but if you look at his career it is consistently terrible. Thus, moving him to DH IS WISE contrary to your opinion because it helps the pitching staff by lowering stress innings and it lessen the chances for momentum in a ball game to change due to an error.
Reallocating resources is why I wrote what I wrote. We are hurting at 3B right now, we are too deep at DH, we are too deep at 1B without a standout in that position right now, just a future standout. We have an adequate 2B and catcher. We have a struggling center fielder of the future. We have an adequate left fielder and an average right fielder. We are extremely short even with Sale coming back at starting pitching. We have no true closer and the newly acquired relief corp has very little pennant race worthy experience except for Ottavino.
My suggestions were my attempt at reallocating the resources at the trade deadline to help extend the over-performance that had occurred through the first 108 games. All moves need to be directed at the long term since this year is another throw away year. Bloom needs to know if Dalbec or Casas is the 1B of the future or the 1B and 3B of the future. Bogey will need a bump soon. Kiki is adequate. Duran is a future building block of the team. Verdugo is a solid player and Renfroe probably should be a platoon guy next year because 2021 is a career year. Having Schwarber and Renfroe platoon is an expensive alternative to finding one player like Benny to handle left field.
My suggestions should not invoke mellow drama responses. I’m not suggesting radical changes I’m suggesting re-allocating resources to maximize skill across the team. The Red Sox took a HUGE hit when they lost both Mookie and Price. They haven’t replaced the lost skill level and that makes them a fourth place team in the division. There are two ways to replace that talent. 1 – A farm player blossoms like Mookie did and adds great talent. Let’s hope the next one isn’t given away like Mookie!! And 2 – trade for someone who better meets the need using players buried in deep positions like 1B. After the season, free agency can be used to fill the needs but for 2021 Bloom missed his chance to acquire talent to help prolong the good run the Red Sox were on.
You believe stating something makes no sense is somehow an adequate response without saying why it doesn’t make sense. Next time explain why so people can respond to a real opinion not a flamboyant declaration.
I like Houck and am happy they didn’t trade him for a rental but truth be told the Red Sox are not prospect rich. Whether Bloom has a direction apparently only he knows that but decimating an already thin farm wouldn’t be the answer
Wow that trade is laughable. ERod is on a down year and a Free Agent at the end of it. He would lower the trade value. Seriously are you 12 yo?
What we are seeing with the Redsox is the result of Bloom and co. telling the team, at the deadline, sorry, we’ve got no help for you! You’ll just have to go it on your own. It’s a long season, and most of these teams are beat physically and mentally exhausted. They depend on an infusion of talent at the deadline, and the adrenaline that comes with it. I do think that Sale, Houck, and Schwarber will help, but it’s going to be 2 weeks too late. Also, Munoz should have come up from Worcester by now. He brought great energy last year, has previous mlb experience, and is more deserving than Cordero. Yes, 2021 has brought an unexpected opportunity to Redsox nation, but unfortunately management is missing it! I hope you have been enjoying the olympics John Henry!
This could be true. If so, I hope they get over it.. A Boston beat writer was saying he thought this happened. They really went downhill after the trade deadline.
Just wondering who should Bloom have traded for? Can you name someone that got moved, then we can compare the picks given up, to what the Red Sox have in minors. That way we can tell how much gutting would’ve happened, for a slightly better chance this year of making the playoffs.
Use baseballtradevalues.com/trade-simulator/. If your suggested trade isn’t accepted don’t bother telling us.
Just wondering if anyone knows when the last time a pitcher got 2 decisions the same day? Matt Barnes lost the first game,and won the second game in Saturday’s doubleheader with the Blue Jays.
There’s the big deadline move
Lets face it the Red Sox got the wrong De Leon. Having Ponce De Leon riding in a duck boat would have been awesome!!
If I’m a rebuilding team, I would have done everything to sign this kid. He was a Cant miss prospect at one point and injuries derailed him. He just needs to reset and I bet you, he can come back as a solid 5th or strong bullpen guy. Just my thoughts.
Bloom is a bum. This guy is a lightweight who can’t swing deals like Theo or Dombrowski.
Or Duquette. Let’s not forget all the teams he robbed, stealing Pedro TWICE (from LAD and Montreal) and stealing Lowe/Tek from Seattle to name a few.
To Dennyd: These guys that are just playing out the last year of their contract are not that expensive in trade terms. According to baseballtradevalues, Scherzer could be had for Bello and Jiminez. And Dalbec for Rizzo straight up is a reasonably equal value. If you have to throw in a lottery ticket on top of each trade, who cares.
Couldn’t disagree more. Mid-Season trades always come at an exorbitant price.
Seriously Dalbec for Rizzo? You’re saying that Dalbec is more valuable than Alcantera and Vizciano. Because, the Red Sox would’ve had to outbid the Yankees to land him.
===================================================================
Here’s an analysis of the trade, from NBC Sports;
OF Kevin Alcántara, RHP Alexander Vizcaino
Acquired from Yankees for Anthony Rizzo
“I was fascinated by this one,” Goldstein said of the Rizzo trade. “I thought the Cubs killed this one.”
Alcántara, 19, made his professional debut in 2019. In 51 career minor league games, he holds a .273/.330/.387 slash line.
“He’s built like a small forward,” Goldstein said. “He’s 6-6, he’s lanky, he’s wirey, he’s muscular. Another guy — bat speed, power, it’s all there.
Vizcaino, 24, is in his fifth professional season after joining the Yankees system in 2016. After spending 2020 at New York’s alternate site, he missed time earlier this season due to a shoulder injury and has only made seven appearances.
The right-handed reliever wields a high-90s fastball and plus slider.
dennyd1 min ago
Couldn’t disagree more. Mid-Season trades always come at an exorbitant price.
Seriously Dalbec for Rizzo? You’re saying that Dalbec is more valuable than Alcantera and Vizciano. Because you would’ve had to outbid the Yankees to land him.
Here’s an analysis of the trade, from NBC Sports;
OF Kevin Alcántara, RHP Alexander Vizcaino
Acquired from Yankees for Anthony Rizzo
“I was fascinated by this one,” Goldstein said of the Rizzo trade. “I thought the Cubs killed this one.”
=======================================================
I was going to say this in my previous post, but decided to remain upbeat. But it needs to be said.
Some, not all, Red Sox fans know nothing about baseball.
JB – You are being too hard on yourself!! I think you’ve learned a lot in the last six months!!
dennyd – Try not to quote know-nothing sports writers, try to form your opinions based on the numbers. I believe if you thoroughly examined the evidence, your conclusions would surpass those of the media clowns.
I think based on the numbers that Dalbec projects better than Verdugo and we got Verdugo for Mookie who is much better than Rizzo!! We should have thrown in Downs and Wong (over-rated LAD trash) and sold them like Friedman did as outstanding prospects!!.
One last point about the Rizzo trade. How many times have we seen highly touted Yankee prospects turn out to be trash? What makes these two guys any different? The list of trash is overwhelmingly long. Heck, even a star player like Cano under-performed after being dealt!! I’d bank on Dalbec over the Yankee farm guys. But to make them happy throwing in a couple of over-rated future failures like Downs and Wong to impress them works for me!
The Red Sox need a gold glove at 1B as long as Devers keeps playing 3B to keep the errors under 30!! They can’t keep bribing the score keepers to change obvious defensive errors by Devers to hits. It’s killing the pitching staff numbers!! I estimate Devers errors would sore from 24 to 36 per year if the score keeping was legit!!
KD174 days ago
JB – You are being too hard on yourself!! I think you’ve learned a lot in the last six months!!
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Yup, I predicted 85.5 wins for the RS, and they are on pace for 92 wins. Such is life.
Not a good pick up in any way. Most major league pitchers have good stuff, or they wouldn’t be major league pitchers. What separates pitchers is consistent command. This guy has zero command. He won’t learn command anytime soon, or ever. You can assume he will run nearly every count deep, and nearly walk, or walk a guy every outing. As a reliver, he is in the Robles mold of being gasoline you pour on a fire.
William – Outstanding!!! Please comment more often.
Question:
Has any GM ever destroyed a Farm System as fast as Dom Dombroski?
He came to Red Sox in August 2015. Red Sox Mid-Season Prospect Ranking #1 in all of baseball (per MLB.com).
He left the Red Sox in August 2019. Red Sox Mid-Season Prospect Ranking #30 in all of baseball (per MLB.com).
From Best to Worst in 4 years. Has any GM ever come close to that?
That isn’t destroying a farm system, it’s called a farm system graduating. Farm systems are built, but they are not forever replenishing. As soon as the top 4-5 prospects graduate or get traded, the farm system plummets in rankings.
Besides the goal of a GM is not to have the #1 farm system. The goal of a GM is to use the farm system to have the #1 big league team. Which Boston did in one of those 4 years. The ranking of the farm system is meaningless in the grand scheme except to the people ranking them.
Dennyd – A couple of days ago I detailed a very long response to the bs you wrote about DD. Unfortunately my internet went down as I was submitting and I lost it so here is the abridged version.
First – NOBODY should care about prospect rankings because they are meaningless. Any time a professional organization that so many follow concludes that Blake Swihart and Henry Owens (2014) are better than Mookie Betts you have to question the source!! The history of the farm system rankings proves two things:
1 – The ranking are wrong more often than correct
2 – Only one team in over a decade won a ring with a top farm system and that only happened because they stole the homegrown Mookie Betts from Boston.
You expose your lack of knowledge about the game when you make ignorant comments about DD and farm system. The list of DD’s accomplishments are too long to detail but everything you write about him is false. I’ve detailed it many times before so I won’t do it again. He didn’t overspend, he used the farm system as it was intended to be used and he made timely additions that led to rings.
Read this part closely and try to learn something.
Two contributions can be made by a farm system player:
1 – He can graduate and add value to the MLB team
2 – He can be traded to fill a need on the MLB team
Until one of these two things happen to a farm system player, they have no real value to the team. They simply exist as a unrealized potential asset.
A team gets NO points for a top rated farm system. It usually means the GM is either inept or an ego maniac needing gratification from a rating rather than a ring.
How should a farm system be measured? Simple, by contributions to the MLB team and the performance level of it’s graduates.
What is the wrong way to measure the strength of a farm system? By the number of top 100 prospects. None of those prospects are guaranteed to contribute to the team. They a player futures, like gold futures and their future value can plummet as easily as it can soar.
Measure the farm system by the contribution and you get an accurate measure.
The peak in 2015 was due to over-rated farm system guys like Downs today. Moncada was number 1 so the farm system had a high rating. He got moved for an elite pitcher that helped bring a ring to Boston and in the meantime the top prospect has spent his controllable years being very average. Great deal by DD. That’s how farm system assets are supposed to be used and how trades are to be evaluated.
Your understanding of the game has led you to select the wrong measuring stick for the success and strength of a farm system. Also, you have no clue what the proper timing of graduations can mean to balancing payroll.
Toronto will struggle to keep all 3 second generation players because their pay jump will hit at the same time. DD and Cherington had one graduate a year roughly for a decade allowing Betts to get big bucks after Bogey and before Devers qualified for the big bucks. The plan was ideal and so far Bloom hasn’t screwed it up since Dalbec was the 2020 graduate and Houck/Duran the 2021 graduates and that will spread the need for salary bumps in the future.
There was no best to worse because you used the wrong criteria for measuring. Learn the game, learn how to evaluate components of the game and most importantly use facts not horse manure when you state things about guys like DD otherwise you’ll have a carload of folks correcting your inaccuracies.
Only in Boston do people line up at the Tobin, bemoaning the collapse of their world, all because the RS sign a minor league.
Lol, comment of the day.
That’s the best they can find out there…….
218 comments on DeLeon / a startling dull week for sure….