The core of the Cubs’ 2016 World Series club is nearing the end of its tenure in Chicago, and president of baseball operations Jed Hoyer said Thursday that there are no current extension talks with any members of that core (Twitter link via 670 The Score’s Bruce Levine). Anthony Rizzo, Kris Bryant and Javier Baez are all slated to become free agents at season’s end, while catcher Willson Contreras hits the market following the 2022 season.
For much of the offseason, talk around Bryant was focused on whether he’d even make it to Opening Day. The fact that former Rookie of the Year and NL MVP had a dismal 2020 season likely helped keep him in Chicago, as last summer’s struggles paired with a hefty arbitration raise to sap much of his trade value.
A quarter of the way through the 2021 season, the pendulum has swung in the other direction. While the entire league seems to be plagued with anemic offensive performances, Bryant is better than ever. Through his first 167 trips to the plate, he’s raking at a .301/.401/.615 pace with 10 homers, 14 doubles and a pair of stolen bases. He’s even doing so while splitting his time between third base and all three outfield positions, showing off plenty of defensive versatility.
Rizzo is also in the midst of a resurgent campaign, having increased his average, on-base percentage and slugging percentage over last year’s levels. He’s still not back to peak form, but a .250/.361/.443 slash is solid — particularly in the aforementioned era of strikeouts and near-weekly no-hitters. Rizzo is a rarity in 2021, having walked at a higher clip (14.8 percent) than he’s struck out (12.4 percent). The Cubs reportedly offered him an extension in the vicinity of five years and $70MM back in Spring Training, which checks in at about $60MM shy of the $130MM commitment the division-rival Cardinals made to Paul Goldschmidt. That deal began in Goldschmidt’s age-32 season — the same age at which Rizzo will play in 2022.
Baez, meanwhile, is enjoying a more productive season than he did in 2020, albeit with plenty of red flags. He’s raised his slash line across the board but is now striking out at a 37.2 percent clip that represents the highest non-rookie mark of his career. Even though he’s raised his average 60 points over its 2020 level, Baez’s OBP is still resting just shy of .300. He’s batting .263/.299/.526 on the whole, which is certainly sound production, but he’s needed career-highs in BABIP (.351) and homer-to-flyball ratio (32.3 percent) in order to get there. If either of those two marks regresses or his strikeouts continue to tick up, Baez’s 2.7 percent walk rate will become all the more glaring.
Contreras, the only one of the group controlled beyond the current season, is hitting .254/.349/.462, continuing a lengthy run as one of the game’s best-hitting backstops. That he’s controlled into 2022 puts a bit less of a spotlight on him, but there were some trade rumblings surrounding Contreras over the winter.
At 21-21, the Cubs needn’t yet entertain the idea of any sort of broad-reaching fire sale. They’re still just 3.5 games back of the Cardinals in the NL Central and very much in the mix as of mid-May. Should they wilt in the coming months, any of the impending free agents would make for a plausible trade candidate. There would of course be PR implications to consider with dealing from that group, but an unavoidable reality; even if the Cubs hold onto everyone through season’s end, they’ll eventually have to bid adieu to at least one, if not two or all three of Bryant, Rizzo and Baez in free agency. For now, the hope is likely that the group puts together a big showing over the next two months, positioning the Cubs as division favorites and deadline buyers.
The more interesting scenario to consider, though, will be what the Cubs will do if they’re still in precisely this spot come mid-July. A Cubs team hovering at .500, give or take a couple games, would have to weigh two sides of a difficult dilemma. Make one final run with an offensive core that really hasn’t gotten it done in October since that World Series victory, or sell off some of the most iconic players in recent franchise history? The former route could leave the Cubs with little to show in terms of compensation for a core that won’t stay intact. The latter route would be tantamount to waving a white flag while still in striking distance of a postseason bid while turning the page on a historic era of Cubs baseball.
Hoyer, it should be noted, did make clear that the Cubs maintain an “open-door” policy and aren’t ruling out future negotiations. But Rizzo said earlier this year that he’d made his peace with the lack of an extension, while Bryant has never seemed all that likely to sign before free agency. They’ve talked with Baez for the past two to three seasons without a deal ever coming together. Generally speaking, the expectation of a deal for any of the bunch coming together before free agency (save for perhaps Contreras this offseason) should be low.
brandons-3
The Cubs are a reminder that when you have a team that’s good enough, you need to go for it. Too many teams think long term for a future that just never materializes. At least they got one, but I remember when the Cubs and Astros were the next great dynasties of baseball. Unless you’re the Dodgers or Yankees, you have a 3-5 year window with guys and you need to maximize it. Banners fly forever.
Joel Peterson
They pretty much did go for it. And they won 1 championship thats real can’t take that away. But this year they clearly aren’t as good. I respect what they did but they should be selling right now.
BeforeMcCourt
How can you say they “went for it” when they spent nothing in significant free agent dollars for most of the end of their run??
The Cubs stopped trying to moment Ricketts was caught trying to lie to the city of Chicago
Ducky Buckin Fent
I’m pretty sure it was their building project(s) that was the culprit behind cutting off the funds, @McCourt.
Which is certainly on ownership & shows how teams are viewing themselves financially.
The…what?, Wrigglyville project (I think it’s called) ran well over budget. & then ’20 happened. The cost of building went – & remains – sky high. We are letting the material cost of jobs blank right now on our contracts until the day we actually order building supplies for a job, for example.
Crazy.
I’m not excusing the Ricketts.
Not everyone is a capable builder. Good thing too, or I’d need to figure out some other way to get paid, man.
But they got in over their heads, some things out of their control happened, & they used money from their team to pay for other stuff. So I get that too.
&…well, now they are just another dynasty that – ya know – wasn’t.
BeforeMcCourt
Hahaha stop. They didn’t get over their heads. It wasn’t COVID or 2020. They tried to pull a fast one and got caught
They tried to claim they their new renovations would still be tied to 1906 coding laws, as that was when the building was originally built. This would severely limit how many accessible seats they would need to provide. They were caught, plans had to be completely changed, cost nearly doubled, and they haven’t spent any significant money since.. 2017?
If you don’t think it’s on ownership to know coding laws before starting hundreds of millions in renovations… or worse you ACTUALLY believed the Rickets thought 1906 laws would apply to 2016 and beyond construction, I got nothing more to say
BeforeMcCourt
Ran out of edit time. Here’s an article that discusses the lawsuits. To find the 2017 suit I’m talking about, scroll about 1/3 of the way into this article (this article is about a newer, 2019 lawsuit)
Start where the paragraph starts “In December 2017”
Since then, team hasn’t done Jack to improve bc they’re too busy getting sued
google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/business/c…
Ducky Buckin Fent
I still read that as “got in over their heads”.
Ya know?
Thanks for the link.
I find this to be a pretty interesting story for a few reasons.
BeforeMcCourt
I guess it comes down to semantics+ If you take the Ricketts at face value. Maybe they just got in over their heads. But that would mean a veteran front office+ownership didnt review what permits would be needed before starting nearly half a billion in construction.. seems a bit unlikely to me
I look at it as, they ignored ADA regulations and hoped they wouldn’t get caught, and therefore would have more space for high cost seats. Shady business is nothing new in Chicago real estate and that’s where I see this fitting in. It’s a pretty big oops if it’s truly legit. I don’t buy it
Maybe it was innocent. I just have a hard time believing they had no idea they would be restricted by ADA regulations from the last century
Ducky Buckin Fent
I’m inclined to blame the contractor.
I don’t expect my clients to know building code. They – however – expect that I do, uh?
As far as shady?
I’m also inclined to think their contractor was – indeed – trying to pull a fast one. Odds are anyway. Seems pretty hard to claim ignorance on this. & these were such enormous deals, man. Which – truthfully – makes it all the more puzzling & hard to buy into an “oversight”.
I think their biggest mistake was shaking hands with the wrong dude.
brodie-bruce
@ducky i’m getting tired of hearing about having a 3~5 window, the teams everyone is sick about hearing about (nyy, stl, lad) is they build there team for both now and the future. i’m going to use stl because i follow them, as much as a lot of moves mo makes or didn’t make have me screaming for his head but the man has kept stl from doing a “full rebuild”. i hate the fact that people are eating up tanking to be good. i don’t know about rest of you but if my birds came out and said hey were doing a full rebuild i’m going ok see you in 5 years because i’m not spending my hard earned money and time to see crap.
BeforeMcCourt
While I can’t say I have personal experience, with a 500M+ cost on a construction project, I would like to think I would take the time to pay a second person to look over my plans and ensure I’m fully in compliance with any and all building codes.
Imo, it’s too big a project & too potentially egregious for ownership to just be able to pass the buck as an oops
Ducky Buckin Fent
Sadly enough, I don’t either.
D’accord.
Which is part of why it is such an interesting (to me anyway) story. There’s baseball, construction, business, economics…lot’s going on.
I don’t think we’ll ever actually be able to piece together all of it. Would have loved to be a fly on the wall when the contract was signed.
Ducky Buckin Fent
Oh yeah, @bruce.
No way I’m sitting through multiple 100+ loss seasons.
brodie-bruce
@beforemccourt you can have 100 guys look at the plan and still have it rejected, this sounds more like plans we’re approved by inspectors (all building plans in the us must be approved before you break ground) and chc ownership wanted to make unapproved plans. all of my work is commercial construction and inspectors and cities don’t like it when you start changing things without there ok. in the commercial world the prints are gospel and unless approved you don’t deviate from them
purplewidow
Dynasty? With no home grown starting pitching and a pathetic minor league system? Dynasty? lmfao maybe to the Chicago media. You need to sustain both a farm and the mlb roster to be a dynasty.. cubs had a few players to build around in the lineup and the rotation and traded the farm away in hopes of staying competitive.. they did but never rebuilt the farm tons of bad deals. they win one championship and dynasty talk? lolololololol
@budselig6969
Wow, that could’ve been the most annoying comment I’ve read anywhere. Congrats!
mike127
purple—can you please produce a link to any story in the past 6-7 years directly connecting anyone in the cubs organization directly speaking of or talking about a dynasty? i understand how fans and media can get caught up in the moment, even if that moment is fleeting—but i’m sure there is no tangible evidence anywhere that the front office or ownership spoke about a dynasty….
just because this is the internet doesn’t make things true even though they seem to take a life of their own….
—and i’m sure the same thing goes for the astros, dodgers and right now the padres and white sox
JoeBrady
The folks that want to criticize an organization, always say ‘it should’ve been a dynasty’. Because it cannot be disproved.
But the Cubs rotation, in the year they won, was:
Lester Age 32
Arrieta 30
Hendricks 26
Lackey 37
Hammel 33
You only have one that is not already on the downside of their career. So a dynasty is really unlikely.
Capi
Another annoying person without any acumen to mute. Thank you.
CubsWin108
“No homegrown starting pitching” Ummm does Kyle Hendricks ring a bell? What about Jake Arretia? Cubs transformed him into a Cy-Young after one of the worst seasons by an SP ever. The Cubs focused on drafting top-of-the-line hitting talent, then developing that said talent. And then signing/trading for arms to help the run. “Pathetic Minor League System” Okay while the cub’s farm system is nothing good right now you gotta realize that they spent 4 years tanking. Then they went all in trading prospects. And then they won the WS. Who cares if your farm system sucks if you won the WS. Theo’s goal was to win the WS, he did not mind what happened after. Sure he would’ve loved to win 3 or 4 WS’s but the Cubs underperformed at the wrong times. Brandon is not saying that the Cubs are a Dynasty. He’s saying back in 2015/2016 they thought the Cubs would be the next great Dynasty
baseballpun
Hendricks is one of the more underrated pitchers in all of baseball in my opinion. That said, your argument about the Cubs’ homegrown starting pitching is really proving purple’s point.
cars
NEITHER Kyle Hendricks or Jake Arretia are homegrown. They were obtained in trades. Look things up 1st before commenting
Robertowannabe
Exactly. @cubswin108 obviously has no idea what homegrown means. Homegrowns means drafted and developed by the same team.. Both Arrieta ,and Hendricks came in trades. Of the rest of the active roster plus 10 day IL players Bryant, Baez, Higgis, Happ, Bote Contreras, Nance , Steele, THompson, & Maples were wall drafted or International or amateur FA signings.
Rizzo Sogard, Peterson Heyward, Duffy, Marisnick, Chafin, Williams Brothers, Mills, Miller, Megill, Davis, Tepera, ,Kimbrel. Winkler were all acquired by the cubs or were UFA signings Not a lot of home grown talent .
drasco036
By that rational none of the following players are “home grown” and we should mock White Sox player development.
Eloy Jimenez
Dillion Ceases
Yoan Moncada
Nick Madrigal
Louis Roberts
Lucas Giolito
Carlos Rendon
Here is something White Sox fans do not want to hear, it took Epstein and Hoyer three years to build a championship team from NOTHING. Literally the Cubs had Baez in the farm and nothing else.
It’s taken the White Sox 10 years to build a playoff contending team…
Deleted_User
Madrigal, Robert and Rodon were 100% homegrown
brodie-bruce
@cubswin108 yes you revived arretia but other than hendriks the cubs have not developed any pitching.
brodie-bruce
@cubswin108 the cubs spent a lot more than 4 years tanking, the only reason chc&hou could sell tanking is because both organizations were bad teams for years. also theo ran your system thin trying to go for it every year and not valuing homegrown pitching, other than hendriks cubs have no home grown pitching and tbh nothing on the farm pitching wise.
The Baseball Fan
I didn’t ask or care, just by the way. Also it doesn’t matter, the Sox have a better team now anyway that’s all that counts if you really think about it. Think with your head, smart guy
rememberthecoop
The state of the farm has little to do with a dynasty. Of course the Cubs aren’t a dynasty, but not because they have a poor system. In
fact, I would argue that teams in win-now mode often wade in shallow farm pools because they’ve dipped their toes in the water to maintain a level of winning at the major league level.
lamars
Bingo!
Robertowannabe
The state of the farm can help a dynasty form and extend the window of competitiveness or kill a dynasty for teams.. Dynasty type teams can keep a strong farm system while still fielding a very good major league team. A strong farm allows for ready replacements or trade chips to fill in or replace injured or non producing players. Not a Cards fan but do respect how they are able to seem to keep a supply of players ready to fill needs from their minor league system Wish my favorite team would do the same thing
Very Barry
The Cubs did “go for it” ….. the great Theo Epstein failed!! …. Epstein showed no ability to evaluate free agent talent …. Jason Heyward, Tyler Chatwood, Craig Kimbrel … etc …..Epstein showed no ability to evaluate the Cubs own talent ….. Kyle Schwarber, Albert Almora Jr. , Ian Happ, etc. Refused to deal away guys when they had value ahead of keeping them until they became busts …..Epstein also failed to develop any minor league pitching. None! This will be a very, very long and brutal rebuild!!!!
FunkyButtLovin
Like the 09-19 White Sox bad???
JoeBrady
Very Barry15 hours ago
The Cubs did “go for it” ….. the great Theo Epstein failed!!
===========================================================
Some people are still under the impression that the Cubs won the WS. Glad to see that you know better.
Joel Peterson
You can’t be stuck in the middle. Once you trade Darvish it was time to trade the other guys. Waiting on Bryant is gonna work out but you still have to trade him. He’s not coming back everyone knows it. Just start over trade the core for a new younger core and be competitive again in a couple years.
bot
We all know the cubs aren’t going to extend anybody. MLBTR – how bout more content on player accomplish like no-hitters and ohtani breakout season ?
It’s almost like reading the obituaries every-time I click on site there’s so many injuries. Put a little positive zing in there !
baseballpun
I know this is more than just a rumors site, but I think just reporting what happened in last night’s games isn’t really the purpose of this place.
lamars
I don’t think we need to hear about over bloated no hitters on this site. Especially when there are 6 no hitters in less than 2 months of the season and two of them were thrown by the likes of W. Miley and S. Turnbull.
scurvyrickets
Do you know what MLBTR even means? RUMORS. Go to any of the thousands of sports sites or channels for analysis. Just don’t be surprised when a RUMORS website talks about RUMORS. Lol.
baseballpun
When you have a .500 team, you have to do everything you can to lock down that core.
BeforeMcCourt
Most would say, when you’re a .500 team you do whatever you can to improve. But hey, that works I guess
Cubsforever22
Exactly our bp is straight dominant and the offense is second in runs scored since the horrible start around April 17th. Just won again today, over .500 bout to play the cards with first place in sight already. Truth is this team is a Darvish and a new #5 from being legit WS contenders. Keep winning and we will add a sp or 2. I still think 2 of the 3 of kb, Javy, and Rizzo resign and the odds that kb is the one they really go after have deff improved since the offseason. Go Cubs!!! F the dead birds!!!
brodie-bruce
we might be dead birds but at least we’re not Completely Useless By September and the fact my dead birds have 8 more ws than the lovable losers.
@budselig6969
Let’s hope the new rebuild doesn’t last 108 years.
HubcapDiamondStarHalo
Hoyer: “We have no immediate plans to be competitive after 2021…”
baseballpun
Are they competitive this year?
mlbnyyfan
Rizzo probably the only one they keep. Trade Bryant to the Mets.
august
Wonder what KB would cost
Deleted_User
Nope. Rizzo goes too.
pt57
Cubs likely pissed him off with lowball offer. The only way he comes back is if Cubs offer the most money.
Deleted_User
Which they can do even after trading him
tigerdoc616
Not a surprise. They got their title so the choice comes down to spending big dollars to keep the talent you have, then spend to add more, or retool. Cubs have the resources to spend like the Yankees and Dodgers and just spend to keep the band together. But ultimately if that were an option they would have extended these three a year or two ago. So retool it is. Unless the Cubs are in contention all three will have new homes before the end of the year.
Tom Emansk1
Why would the Cubs extend anybody? That would eat into Trust Fund Tommy’s profit margins and we can’t be having that
Golfsucks
Kind of reminds me of Blue Jays fans that couldn’t let go of the past when it came time to move on from their old core from 15/16.
They can spend their money on maybe one of these guys and remake some areas like pitching.
I like Rizzo, but he is a poor mans Goldy. He is dreaming if he thinks that he will get that term or money. They aren’t in the same league. I doubt that he will even get a qualifying offer.
Baez walk rate is horrid and so is his OBP. If his D gets more erratic he might accept a qualifying offer. His style of game ages horribly.
Bryant has had a nice bounce back, but now his D might move him to first.
In that case I would think if anything they might resign Bryant and move him to first.
Qualify Baez and let Rizzo walk.
Who knows..
mike127
why would they move bryant to first—he’s obviously the most versatile defensive player in the game….maybe five, six years from now he settles there—
when he hits free agency i’m willing to bet there is not a single team out there that targets him as a first baseman…..third base–probably—outfield–definitely…..
Golfsucks
Very versatile player but he is fragile to put it mildly.
Way too fragile to be a thought of longterm in the outfield.
First base he could be pretty great.
Capi
You’re so off in so many levels…
Calling Rizzo a poor man’s Goldy when Rizzo’s OPS this season is about .100 points higher than Goldy’s.
Baez, who won’t the GG at SS last season still ranks as an above average defender at a premium position despite the errors and is on pace to another 30 HR season despite his walk rate and he’s gonna accept a qualifying offer?
And Bryant’s D might move him to 1B? Have you missed Bryant playing CF (another premium position), LF, RF, 3B and 1B this season?
Do yourself a favor and don’t comment on things you know nothing about so you don’t look foolish.
Golfsucks
I like Rizzo, but he definitely is a poor man’s Goldy.
I like Baez’s D, but certainly not this year. I also like Baez’s offence from a few years back, but extensions are for the future and he is not trending well
Bryant is versatile, but fragile & has never won a gold glove anywhere..
Cubsforever22
Lmfao preach brother!, directed at Capi lol
Cubsforever22
Your Take on Kb besides him maybe being who we actually do resign is just crazy amounts of stupid. Dude can play anywhere on the diamond. He was hurt last year, played thru it and didn’t complain even though his numbers suffered horribly because we were winning the central all year, yet he gets bashed for it, ok. Back to being the MVP KB
Metsin777
If im the Mets, id trade JD Davis (who has 4 more years of control), for Kris Bryant (who is only controlled for this year) and take on Craig Kimbrels contract
Capi
Might wanna give more than Davis for KB and Kimbrel… But Davis could go to 1B if they can’t/won’t extend Rizzo.
BeforeMcCourt
You’re so generous
Tom Emansk1
Lol “Kimbrel’s contract.” He has a 1 million buyout for next year. He’s a net positive asset at this point not a net negative. Davis + might get you Bryant alone, but Kimbrel is costing extra.
Deleted_User
No one’s trading actual assets for Kimbrel. He’s pitched well enough that the Cubs should be able to find a taker but what that taker will be “giving up” is agreeing to pay the rest of his contract.
Tom Emansk1
Given what relievers go for at the deadline, I dont buy that at all. They can and will get something for him, even if it’s not a haul.
everlastingdave
I’m hoping for a Bryant sweepstakes to spice up trade season. He’s at his best right now and he’d bring a real return. Sadly I think it’s more likely they keep the group together and make some mid-level additions in July instead. Unless the bottom completely falls out, we’re not getting the White Flag.
jhanley108
The Cubs spent way too much on veteran pitching without developing their own, drafted poorly on position players since Bryant but it was always the hitting coach who got hung out to dry. Good teams, like the Dodgers and Cardinals move guys when the production starts to fade and always have someone to step in and do the job or make good trades. Holding onto fan favorite players despite lack of talent has always been the Cub way. It’s been 5 yrs since 2016 and they regressed every year since. The Ricketts are the MLB version of the Bears McCaskey Family-milk 1 championship as long as possible with no clue how to keep a franchise sustainable.
Cubsforever22
Wtf have the Cards won latley?
Orel Saxhiser
Plenty. The Cardinals won in 2006 and 2011 and went to the World Series in 2004 and 2013. Four pennants in the 21st century is a nice run, and they’re poised to contend in 2021. Most teams would love that kind of recent success.
lamars
So like he said, they haven’t won anything. Sure pennants are nice and definitely getting to the WS is icing on the cake. But I think they would trade in the 4 pennants and 2 trips to the WS for 1 WS win.
DonOsbourne
I respectfully disagree. As a Cardinals fan I will say WS wins are great but I would not trade multiple winning seasons for a single championship. The great thing about baseball is the daily entertainment value it provides over basically a 6 month period. I prefer watching consistent competitive baseball night after night, year after year rather than one great season surrounded by years of mediocrity. For example, the 2006 Cardinals were 83-78. The eventually got healthy, got hot, and won the WS but the regular season was tough to watch. In 2004 they lost to the Red Sox in the series but in my opinion it was probably the best team they have had in my lifetime. It was a great season from start to finish and I’d take it every year over 06.
brodie-bruce
@lamar smith ok i’ll give you that the cards haven’t won in recent years, but what the cards have done is put a playoff team out year in and year out and give us fans hope and good bb to watch. anything can happen in oct look at the 11 cards or the 19 nats. as a cards fan i’m happy with what my team has done on the last 20 years 2 ws and multiple deep runs, yes i wish the chip numbers were higher.
JoshHolt32
What do you think of trading Bryant/Kimbrel for Stiever//Lambert (white sox pitching prospects)?
lamars
Ask yourself why would the WS entertain that? Sure they could use Bryant but why would they want Krimbel when they already have L. Hendricks as their closer? And if the WS need an outfielder down the stretch there will be cheaper options than taking on Krimbel’s payroll.
Cubs Dynasty
Kimbrel just isn’t a bargaining chip any more…
paindonthurt
He’s lights out in his year. Pay attention. Kimbrel is absolutely a tradable asset as of today.
lamars
And so is all pitching across the board.
Tom Emansk1
No shot they trade Bryant to the Sox. I don’t think they wouldn’t trade with the Sox period (obviously the Q trade), but the optics of trading Bryant to the Sox would be next level bad–it would have to be an offer they can’t refuse and that offer ain’t that.
Deleted_User
Trading Bryant to the ChiSox would be the best thing that ever happened! How awesome would it be to steal a top prospect or two from their crosstown rivals for a guy who the ChiSox would lose after the season is over? Maybe Bryant even comes back to the Cubs?
JoshHolt32
Also what about Baez/Chafin for Gil, Medina or Vizcaino (pick 1) with OF Florial or Clint Frazier (Yankees)
PutPeteinthehall
How many middle infielders do you want the Yankees to have that strike out 40 percent of the time and hit 180?
theodore glass
They should trade all 4 along with Kimbrel and Hendricks.
downsr30
No point in extending anyone during the season if you’re confident that other teams won’t outbid you for them in the offseason. Bryant is the only that’ll likely get paid more than the Cubs are willing to offer. Rizzo is not going to get Goldschmidt money, Baez is the worst SS of the crop that’ll hit free agency. Let them test the waters in the off-season, and that allows the Cubs more options to see if there are better fits as well.
Cubsforever22
Yea people forget just because a few core guys are becoming free agents doesn’t mean we’re not going to spend money. Only have Kyle, bote, Wilson arb, and j hey ughh contract on the books. We can spend wide open. Jed just talked the other day about getting back close to the luxury tax line. Don’t kno why ppl think even if we don’t resign some of the core we’re just not going to put together a roster. We are and I would bet our payroll goes up significantly after this year.
PutPeteinthehall
Don’t think there will be a market for Kimbrel until middle of July. No one will want to pay more than two months. He’s a gamble and would only be wanted by a contender with a closer problem.
theodore glass
Closer or not teams need bullpen help.
Albert Belle's corked bat
Sometimes I struggle with MLBTR’s definition of a “solid season”. Can someone out there give me a definition of a solid season using a slash line? … And yes, It was Lofton that climbed through the air duct to rescue me.
Cubs Dynasty
Years ago when Belle was popular, I went out and picked up every rookie card available. I just knew he was destined for the HOF.
JoeBrady
I can trade you 1,000 Bill Doran rookies for your Belle rookies.
paindonthurt
Gregg Jeffries cards galore over here.
JoeBrady
I knew Doran was a gamble and I think I paid a dime each. But I also have, like you, my Jefferies collection, as well as Kal Daniels. I can’t believe that Jefferies and Daniels weren’t big stars. These were two of the best pure hitters in baseball.
Jefferies had a 178 OPS+ in his first season, albeit 109 ABs.
Kal Daniels had a OPS+ of 151 thru age 26, averaging 26 HRs, 26 SBs, and a .300 average, per 162 games. Daniels issue was purely health-related, but he was easily the best hitter in baseball.
Orel Saxhiser
Cubs Dynasty.
In honor of Belle, give them out to trick-or-treaters on Halloween.
Cubs Dynasty
Good idea…!
Cubs Dynasty
Please. I’d rather hold off on spouting great numbers so far. There’s too much Pittsburgh and other weak ones on our early Cubs schedule. I think Rizzo is here to stay. Baez, a hitting enigma, severely undisplined at the plate and on the bases. Very limited awareness of fundamental base running situations. His career has included ignoring base coaches. Actually the whole team on that account. KB is headed out. We just don’t know when… go Cubs (and get better pitching)
Deleted_User
Trade Rizzo
Cubs Dynasty
Rizzo is one of the best hitters in the NL… excellent eye and bat control…very smart at the plate…that being said, Rizzo is also one of the worst base runners in MLB…
Deleted_User
Except you’re forgetting the part where he’s a free agent at season’s end
Cubs Dynasty
I’ll be surprised if he goes….
Deleted_User
If you’re really that certain the Cubs will be able to sign him then they should definitely trade him. Then they can bring him back as a FA next winter like the Yankees did with Aroldis Chapman. Rizzo already isn’t a Cubs lifer anyway, being drafted by the Red Sox and making his debut with the Padres.
Cubsforever22
Everyone in the division has played the pirates and we didn’t really play well against them. Won 10 of last 13 bp is legit nasty and offense is second in runs scored since April 17th. Happ and joc really coming around too. We need 2 sp and we have a legit shot at a title. Go Cubs baby!
troll
jed will probably unload the unvaccinated players he so disappointed with
Mahin Choudhury
Cubs are not sure if they will be buyers or traders prior to the July MLB Trade Deadline. Maybe all or some players from the core would not get an extension done during the 2021 season. It is all all about how these players are doing behind the plate and on the field plus how the Cubs are performing in their respective standings.
JoeBrady
So you feel strongly that might or might do something at the deadline?
Dan Hunter
Cohen HAS to get Bryant now!
Orel Saxhiser
Doing so would mean topping other offers. It won’t be a one-team market.
And shouldn’t Cohen let his baseball people make baseball decisions? That’s what other owners do.
Orel Saxhiser
I Imagine Jayson Stark will get some mileage out of this Reds boxscore entry from this afternoon:
A. Blandino 1B-P-1B
JoeBrady
-0- ERS in 2 innings for the position players.
18 ERS allowed by their pitchers in 7 innings.
My oh my.
Cap & Crunch
If Im the Fo Im gutting the team today-
I know the Div isn’t strong but this team isn’t either
Trade Bryant Rizzo Baez Davies and Kimbrel if possible this year
Contreras’s and Hendriks in the offseason if not this year as well. Id dangle both to Arte WHILE taking on J Upton for a HAUL in the offseason ….use payroll as a nest for bad contracts for the time being not actual on field performance
Take the next 2 years to rebuild, will start 24 with just Bote under contract for 5.5…. just dipping one or two toes in the water isn’t the answer….but fan pressure can be a beeotch , dont cave tho, you need to turn the soil ALL the way over here …fans will see the light 2nd half of the decade
Deleted_User
ThEy ShOuLd ExTeNd ThEm NoT tRaDe ThEm!
Cubsforever22
Yes!!!
Cubsforever22
We have way too much money to do that. We need a couple sp but any core offense that leaves can be replaced. Team has a lot of stud pitchers coming up, steele, Thompson, alzolay, Marquez shortly. Doubt you watch much of the Cubs on a daily basis.
Orel Saxhiser
Joc is useless to them as well. They should be hoping for one of his surges so they can ship him out. I’m surprised to see he’s gotten his BA up to .260.. Some big October moments. Teams would be interested.
mitchladd
If I’m the cubs I would pick up a rental or two for one last run with this group then issue QO’s to everyone that I should and trade everyone else.
66TheNumberOfTheBest
The Cubs are admirably unselfish. One World Series title every 100 years is enough for them. They don’t want to hog it.
They have the market, the money, history, ability to attract free agents with lots of matinees, etc. to be competitive every year, but…
citizen
Of course in their walk year, they play better and arent injured. Sarcastically they’ll try to get Lindor’s contract and bat under the Lindor/Mendoza line.
Get rid of the softball players
Hoyer having to do what little Theo Epstein should have done three years ago.
anthonyd4412
I love Rizzo, but using the Goldshmidt contract isn’t a great example (declining skills). Still would love to keep him. Love Baez too but very sick of his refusal to take a walk, the K’s are insanely high.
KCJ
Although I’m a Brewer fan living in Wisconsin, I sure despise the Ricketts family and REALLY wish they’d sell their “money-draining” investment so they can enjoy the billion dollar or so profit that they would take from it. Woe is me, says Tom Ricketts. That ownership is simply bad for baseball. For the life of me I can’t understand why they insist on continuing to own the team, when there would be people lined up down the hallway willing to take this horrible burden off their hands.
Meanwhile, 70 miles down the road, Mark Attanasio is somehow keeping the Brewers afloat (without repeatedly crying poor) with a small fraction of the market or fan base. Amazing how this all works
Orel Saxhiser
I agree, but they are making money without spending a whole lot so there is no desire to sell. It’s the same thing with the Pirates even though the finances are different. A problem for Cubs fans is winning in 2016 gives Ricketts no incentive to have to do it again. Reversing the curse gives him license to rest on his laurels, which you can bet he’ll do. Good for the other teams in the division’s annual post-season chances, but, yes, terrible for the sport.
As a Dodger fan, I take no joy in what’s going on with the Rockies. I’m stoked that the Padres and Giants are playing well. As a baseball fan, I hate the thought of teams who become afterthoughts in their own city when football starts. It’s a reason why I’m bullish on expanded playoffs.
BeforeMcCourt
I saw the Cubs had the highest ticket prices of any team after their 2016 title win. It’s probably someone else now, but let’s be real, these teams are huge profits for these owners. Tv deals alone for big markets cover most of the payroll and from there’s it’s largely profit from there
Orel Saxhiser
It might be the Dodgers. n 2020 before Covid hit, I was planning a Dodgers weekend in Pittsburgh. The same tiered box seats that go $90 and up at Dodger Stadium are $36 in Pittsburgh. But the Pirates won’t be sold because ownership still makes an easy profit. They are have-nots by choice. Bad for all baseball fans, even those of us whose team is among the haves. Spending $100 for a ticket to watch the Dodgers play a Triple-A team is no fun.
BeforeMcCourt
I bet the Yankees are one but the Dodgers very well could be two. Just a hunch. I could be wrong. But you are right, dodger ticket prices have soared the last four years
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
Speak for your OWN team Cey Hey.
(By the way…RON CEY was extremely overrated. As both a Doggie and Chubbie. Not a HOFer. So am tired of that tiresome debate).
But…let us (if you will) address the “Dodgers versus Pirates gamestand yoy were (literally) willing to “spend money on”…to watch “The Dodgers” (who seem to sign EVERY player these days)…yet STILL can’t escape “3rd Place”…to watch them “play” (or is it “to toy with”?)…a “team” called the Pittsburgh Pirates?
How’s abouts dis, eh? Yep. Bob Nutting sucks as an owner. Pirates have sucked since 1980. And PIRATES FANS (long suffering…like me) don’t need some Calfornia jagoff to tell us so.
How about you DODGERS worry about defeating San FranSucko, first?
Seems like you all…and your “wonderfully owned and managed team…figure out what FIRST PLACE is…and worry not…the DEAD LAST PIRATES will still be there…waiting…in DEAD LAST…for LA to have their way with (as 300 million always trumps 30 million) so no worries.
You can take all 3.
But since “The Pirates suck so bad”. (Rightfully stated you did. They do). But I MUST ask this.
At a payroll of 300 MILLION a year? Shouldn’t you win the world series…EVERY YEAR?
For if I were the owner…gave you THAT money…and you were the GM…and you did not”? Then you are FIRED.
An APE can win baseball games w a 300 million dollar payroll.
And while we are ‘speaking of the Dodgers’? Aside from Clayton Kershaw? Those players aren’t worth the money.
In Pittsburgh? Lol. I wouldn’t pay a washed up hack like David Price 32 MILLION a year (half being paid, of course…by the equally inept Red Sox) to carry a 5.02 ERA.
But you Doggies keep swinging.
Go Dodgers.
(You’re gonna finish…3rd. Miss the playoffs too. Same as my Pirates who will finish DEAD LAST. Yet won’t spend 270 million MORE to miss the playoffs). Dead Last or 3rd. Does it matter?
Yep. Nutting is a hack. He always was/always will be.
But when YOUR team…at 300 million+ is in first? Okie dokey. Then please tell the Pirates how to run things, will ya?
Course…them Padres and San Fransuckos (worst city in America by the way. Even worse than (dare I say? Dare dare! Los Angeles) just standing in Them Doggies way. Now ain’t they?
But hey…at least them Doggies still be ahead of them killer DBacks and Rollicking Rockies.
(Two teams that are as bad…if not WORSE than…The Pirates)
Nutting is a garbage owner. But he is smarter than you think. California. Lol.
Modus Operandi of that state? ‘Lets Just Spend More”.
Varangian
I got thru about 5 lines of your rant then skipped the rest. Caps and name-calling? Lay off the crank until after your 13th birthday, at least.
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
Yeah. Vaginian or whatever.
Words are hard. For some.
Try reading.
Then come back and try ripping.
Next case.
Franco27
Yes, Brewers are tearing it up. How is Ricketts bad for baseball exactly? Renovated Wrigley Field, top 5 payroll 2015-2019, 3 straight NLCS 2015-2017. WS 2016. Yes, in a bit of a downturn right now for several reasons, that most teams go through. While not WS contenders, still competitive and starting to see some younger talent, especially pitching coming into play. I personally hope they move on from some of these players and keep building farm system. I would rather be a WS contender 3-4 years down the road than trying to patch holes with free agents and hoping for a wild card in a bad division, like the Brewers.
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
Good. Cause they suck.
Why “talk extensions” with underperforming garbage that is only 3.5 games ahead of The Pittsburgh Pirates AND with Cubs players who seem to have a definitely (and blatantly) obvious time “defeating the Pirates”?
You can’t defeat…THE PIRATES? Then you sir…suck more than Jenna Jameson on a speed date app.
Cubs are gonna finish…”next to DEAD…LAST”.
Pirates already have a “middle earth-depth anchor holding that true ‘Dead last” place…but the Cubs are garbage.
Cut em all.
And rebuild again
onegame
Clearly not a dynasty, but also one of the most successful stretches the team has ever experienced. Since 2015 the team has been more competitive than the owners seem committed to continue. They had a couple of division wins with Piniella, but this stretch has been the best. Despite the lack of continued wise investments. Of course now Kimbrel will start to find his old touch in time to leave town. It was fun while it lasted.
n2northsiders
I agree, get rid of the core guys. Get what you can for them and start fresh.
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
But on a sidenote…Felipe Vazquez (aka: The Nightmare…of Lolitaville) was convicted on 15 charges today. (Bout time. And the Pirates still are paying him thru end of 2021).
As a lifetime Bucs fan…I never was a Cubs hater. Team is cool. Good rivalry. Nice park (city of Chicago sucks…but hey, the whole country lnows that). But always loved the Cubs too.
And as a Pirates Fan, and as the Cubbies enter into a rebuild…and yinz all hate Kimbrel and Rizzo is kinda “meh” and whatever and whatnot…
I must also state this:
Be thankful that it is not the CUBS (but rather the Pirates) who have had to pay that sicko since the end of 2019.
But…it could have been The Cubs. (And if Pittsburgh had a smart GM back then…it would have been the Cubs or Dodgers.)
Cubs were very interested in “The Nightmare…of Lolitaville”, as yinz all.needed a closer. Yet the Pirates (shocker!) Were already out of it…and still “had a closer”.
Neil Huntingforaclue (Pirates GM then) and Hurdle The Turtle (their ridiculous manager) clung to Felipe like flies to dog crap.
And the Pirates (stupidly…twice…heck, LA even offered 2 Pitchers a SS and a Catcher for Vazquez)…held onto The Nightmare…of Lolitaville.
And isn’t it quite the (as Popeye would say) “co-inky-dink” that Both Hurdle And Neil get axed right around the same time that Felipe got busted?
I have always liked the Cubs. (Never could stand Harry Carey…but Ernie Banks, Billy Williams, Bruce Sutter, Dave Kingman, etc. Always a cool team to see back in the day…in Pittsburgh. And I was happy when yinz all finally won that World Series. Pirates? Meh. They probably won’t ever win one again. But as a fan who also likes your Cubbies…a word of friendship between those two cities.
“You’re about to enter the rebuild. They suck. But happen. Simply be thankful you are NOT “The Pittsburgh Pirates”. Those idiots have “been reinventing rebuilds” about 27 times since 1979…and YES…are still paying Felipe Vazquez (The Nightmare of Lolitaville) to sit in a prison cell, since 2019.
Cubs may have it tough for a while. But remember…always “at least they aren’t The Pirates”
paindonthurt
I award you zero points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
Thanks. God and I can sort it out later.
But the zero point score.
Thanks!
Let me know when you actually type something.
I will be sure to give you at least 1 point.
Knowing you progressed to Cro Magnon state is an accomplishment.
Next case
paindonthurt
You are unlikeable. Hopefully that’s just your internet persona.
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
Oooh. I’m crushed.
A “once sentence-respondent don’t like me”.
Seek ye…your safe space and therapy dog.
Nexxxt case
JoeBrady
I can’t help but laugh at the Pirate fans. They wanted like four top prospects, and the fans were saying ‘if they don’t want to pay the price, we’ll just hold onto him’.
While no one could’ve predicted something like this, if you are going to trade a player, then trade him. At the trade deadline, everyone is looking for RPs. The best offer you receive is likely to be more than a fair offer. And holding a guy, hoping he will be worth more in another year, seldom works.
TheBaldPhoenixRedux
I can’t help but laugh, when being laughed at ad a Bucs Fan, by a Cubs fan.
It makes me smile so” it does really.
(Course…Cubs fans usually find extreme difficulty in “reading words” as they did a total fly-by on a compliment.
Thusly…for Cey Hey (et al) sake…I shall break it down in shorter…easier sentences.
“Ugg. Pirate Team Office Bad ”
“Cub Team Office only Kinda Bad. Uhh”.
There! Whew. I am glad I was able to re-explain. Especially to that Cey Hey person. I am sure the time he saved? Will petmit him to get back to the Jeff Mathis thread. Where he can defend his hero.
Don’t worry Cey Hay. Mathis made enough to pay someone else to towel him off after showering. You can go back and tell the world how great Chris Davis was now, too.
Logjammer D"Baggagecling
They should’ve extended Rizzo 2 years ago. It’s a real shame they low balled him so badly. The Ricketts stopped caring when the ball hit Rizzos glove. They traded their best pitcher. For marbles. Then they didn’t even both spending that 60mil they saved on Yu Darvish. That money could’ve been used to extend Bryant and Baez for at least one year each. And Rizzo to probably a 4 year deal worth 75 mil. It wouldn’t handcuff them in anyway. They’d still have money to get a TOR Starters. Their bullpen has been fantastic lately. They need to use Keegan Thompson as a starter. And when he’s cleared call up Brailyn Marquez.
JoeBrady
That money could’ve been used to extend Bryant and Baez for at least one year
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So your working hypothesis here is that both Bryant & Baez are wiling to accept one-year extensions?