It’s been a few seasons since Shin-Soo Choo had an opportunity for impact at-bats, but the southpaw swinger has maintained his control of the strike zone with solid bat-to-ball skills. His 10.2 walk percentage in 2020 remains solidly above-average, and though a 26.0 strikeout rate isn’t ideal, he did enough damage when he did make contact to produce a 97 wRC+. His exit velocity (90 mph), 10.1 percent barrel rate and below-average .284 BABIP suggest Choo might have gotten that wRC+ number back above average had there been a full season in 2020. Instead, that number fell below 100 for the first time since 2007.
While the 38-year-old seems to have enough left in the tank to contribute offensively, he’s long been considered a subpar defender in the outfield, a perception that’s born out in -25 career defensive runs saved across 1,722 career innings in left, and -26 DRS over 8,109 2/3 career innings in right. But Choo has been working out at first base this offseason to provide teams with another avenue for getting his bat in the lineup, per Robert Murray of FanSided (via Twitter).
That’s enough for the Brewers to give him a look, notes Murray. Presumably, the Brewers also like Choo as a potential contributor at the designated hitter spot, should it eventually find its way into the 2021 rule book. Otherwise, Choo would join a rotating collection of position players at manager Craig Counsell’s disposal. With the recent addition of Kolten Wong at second, Keston Hiura is expected to slide over to first full-time. There are at-bats to be had at third base for Hiura, as well, with Luis Urias being relatively unproven at the hot corner. All in all, it’s not hard to imagine Choo getting regular work in Milwaukee between first base and right field, where Avisail Garcia’s career splits suggest he might be best suited in a short-side platoon.
The Pirates have also expressed some interest in Choo at first base, per the Athletic’s Rob Biertempfel (via Twitter), though not much progress was made towards a deal. The Phillies are another of Choo’s known suitors.
Over the great Dan Vogelbach!?
hell no!
If Braun is not going to retire ( I am not sure what he is going to do), then the Brewers are better off just having him back than signing Choo. As a Brewer fan, I would really like to see Braun back for one more year to fill in for the outfield, DH, and play a little first. They can drop Daniel Vogelbach and not pay him a penny. His contract is not guaranteed.
This is completely my perception of everything, but I feel like if Braun was ever comfortable playing first, he would have been a regular there the past 3 seasons. Seems like they tried it, he just never felt quite right, so they went away from the idea.
That said, I don’t get the interest in Choo anyway. I was under the impression Hiura would be moving there after the Wong signing…
I hear what you are saying and agree 100%. However, I believe that Braun is just as good as Vogelbach when it comes to playing defense at 1st base. The Brewers would not be asking Braun to play 1st all the time. Only when Keston needed a day off or when Keston gives Wong a day off. Braun would mostly be used to play in the outfield to give someone a day off, play outfield in case of an injury, DH when possible, and a pinch hitter late in the game. His time at 1st would most likely be 20 games or less.
The only way Braun is back is if the NL gets the DH. But it’s a shame that the heartless Stearns declined his option. He needs one more year so the fans can acknowledge his career as a Brewer. I believe he and Robin Yount are the only two players with the Brewers to play their whole careers with one team.
If he’s only a dh at this point, he’s not worth the $15 million or the roster spot he’d tie up.
And Braun was already indecisive about playing in 2021 before last season ended. Why pick up an option and pay him all that money if he’s going to be sitting at home?
If there is a dh spot in the NL, wouldn’t crew put Huira there? Guy can’t field, but has shown signs he can rake! Would rather give him a shot then over pay Bruan who seems to always be hurt.
Teddy Higuera and Jim Gantner and two others. There have been plenty.
He cut the cord with Aguilar way too early. He had a 30+/100rbi+ season when he made the All-Star team. He did pretty well with the Marlins last year. So while we look for a 1b he gives up on one. Yes Shaw wanted out. Villar has a decent bat and led the AL in stolen bases. Meanwhile we’re going to have to live with Daniel Robertson.
His option wasn’t for $15 million and he would’ve played one more year for way less.
Braun’s option WAS for $15 million.
Jim Gantner played his entire career for the Brewers.
That’s crazy talk, can we please just get a third baseman?
Antoine Williamson should be ready soon, no?
Deep dive into Milwaukee Brewers history for this joke!!! Former GM Sal Bando infamously drafts a fellow third baseman from his Alma Mater with the 4th pick in the first round of the 1994 draft. Still on the board were future greats like Paul Konerko, Nomar Garciaparra, Troy Glaus, Aaron Boone, A.J. Pierzinski, and Jason Varitek.
Don’t know anything about this guy, but Ben Grieve, Dustin Hermanson and Todd Walker are the closest things to “greats” out of the 13 players drafted before any of the players you just listed, so it’s not like that was the only miss at the top of that draft.
And I’m officially in a baseball reference rabbit hole. You will be glad to know that Mr. Williamson (-0.8 bWAR) fared better than his cousin Kevin Higgins who amassed -1.0 bWAR Lin 202 plate appearances for the 1993 Padres.
I’d check that math again, Nomar was drafted 12th and Hermanson and Greive were off the board. And all 3 of the guys you listed had better MLB careers than Williamson, hell so did C.J Nitkowski.
@stevewpants
In fall fairness to Bando, you never know which players are going to be future stars and which ones are going to wash out at the prospect level.
You can make an educated guess and have a pretty good idea, but some players who rake in the minors just can’t figure out major league pitchers, and some guys who are lights out pitching in the minors just can’t replicate that kind of performance versus big league hitters.
Do you think they don’t want to sign Puig because they are racist?
They don’t want to sign Puig because he’s a dick.
To play where?
Justin Turner on a one year deal just makes too much sense.
If Turner would accept a 1-year deal it wouldn’t be with the Brewers. If he is even willing to accept a 2-year deal it would be with the Dodgers. I think the only way he doesn’t stay in L.A. is if he is unwilling to sign for less than 3 guaranteed years.
rumor is that Turner is asking for 4 years. No way is the crew in on that (as they shouldn’t be) if that’s the case
I wish the Brewers would just sign Jed Gyorko to play third base. Look at his stats throughout the years. They are almost identical to Moose in terms of offense. Moose has a lifetime batting average of .251 vs. .245 for Gyorko. Gyorko has a OPS of .310….. Moose has a OPS of .310, Gyorko has a Slugging Percentage of .424 vs. Moose who has a Slugging Percentage of .442. Gyorko will hit around 25-30 homers a season with enough at bats, and Moose will hit between 25-35. In terms of defense it is not even close. Gyorko wins this one easily as he has a fielding percentage of .986 to Moose who only has a fielding percentage of .960. Then there is the money….. Moose is making $16 million a year, and Gyorkoś last extended contract with San Diego was for 3 years at $9 million or $3 million a year. Both are 32 and have September birthdays, and both have played for the Brewers. So my question is why don´t the Brewers sign Gyorko? $3 million is nothing, and you can get almost the exact same stats as Moose who makes $16 million.
Because Stearns takes pride in churning the roster. We wouldn’t be in this problem had he not traded Aguilar, Villar, give Shaw a chance to come back, Thames who is going back to Korea and of course Jedd Gyorko.
Aguilar couldn’t hit his way out of a wet paper bag for half a season before they finally moved on.
Villar couldn’t stop making boneheaded plays in the field or on the bases. Plus he didn’t like the position he had to play, and let everyone know it.
Shaw wanted out, AFTER they gave him a full season to figure it out.
And Thames was a platoon player, who had lost his job to Aguilar. Then neither of them could hit.
Keeping Gyorko made sense though. I’ll give you that one.
Glad I’m conversing with such an expert. Points made are mainly true but I will contend that he gave up way too early on Aguilar. He made the All-Star team the year before. So while he jettisons him, he keeps Shaw and gave him the whole season to figure it out. Aggy played well for the Marlins last year. Here? We have to depend on Vogelbach who was released by two teams last year.
If you want to
Goingyard – add Grisham, D.Santana, and Segura to your list.
The boy wonder has lost his edge IMO, perhaps the ownership shadow is stronger than discussed.
I agree on Grisham, Segura and Aguilar, but not really Santana. So far, his best career season has been with the Brewers and while he did bounce back in 2019, he was only about league average.
You think this is the real Quaid?
All these people blabbing about Mars are just asking for trouble.
Do the John Candy for the seventeenth time, we all think it’s so clever and funny!
You know, I have a friend who works at the crime lab at the police station. I could give him your toothbrush and he could run a test on it. To see if you actually brushed your teeth or just ran your toothbrush under the faucet.
You’ll get nothing from me but my scorn.
Hiura’s days are numbered. Sad. Like grisham. Gone.
If Hiura and 3 of our top prospects get Jose Ramirez from Cleveland then I am all for it.
Brewers would be stupid to get rid of Hiura.
Agree to disagree, for Ramirez it’s worth it. Hiura’s a junk ball hitter, hasn’t proven he can catch up with fastballs.
or you could try and get him without giving up Hiura
Not enough good prospects in our farm imo. I mean if they’d take Urias as the major league ready replacement for Ramirez I’m all for it but I would think their ask starts with Keston.
@stevewpants
If that’s the case, then he needs to work with a hitting coach to shorten up his swing. Nearly all big league hitters can hit the fastball. That’s why they’re in the majors.
Agree
Grisham is another good example as is Davies who is now with the Cubs. Eric Lauer sucked and Urias isn’t ready to play everyday in my opinion.
I wanted the CWS to sign him for RF prior to Eaton until I looked at his stats!
The idea of Shin-Soo playing first is interesting, something to Choo on.
Well done
Not funny. No one thinks you are cute.
I’m a huge fan of Choo, but his days of being a productive player are all but over. Would be cool to see him suit up for another year, but wouldn’t expect much from a production standpoint.
Um, Choo had a .284 BABIP (Career .336) in 127 PA last year, which led to his low batting average – you look very foolish writing that off as “his days of being a productive player are all but over” – be careful here.
Why are so many people using 2020 stats to judge production though? Don’t ever do this. It’s too small a sample, every team basically only played their division last year so 2020 stats shouldn’t be used like this, we should be including them over 2019+2020 to get the full picture on players current productivity, and Choo’s combined 2019+2020 OPS is .809, which is plenty productive..
He is 38. While I am taking 2020 stats with a grain of salt, we aren’t talking about a Nelson Cruz here. How much longer can Choo be a productive bat?
@mlb1225 Choo is exactly the kind of player who actually could have a late-career career-year at like 39 and play til he’s likem 42.
Another thing not nearly enough people take into account is its 2021 and strength, diet and conditioning knowledge and technology are better than they’ve ever been, and will keep getting better. We might actually start seeing more players like Cruz be monsters til their mid-40s and even play til their late 40’s soon – I would not write that off. Verlander is making noise about playing til he’s 50. Not everyone is Albert Pujols, but as long as their body holds together and they know the right people to help keep the body the same, who knows how long they can be factors in MLB?
We are at a point in sports+technology where scientists know what muscle groups and tendons to focus training on for maximum benefit and we are about to start seeing it via players like Cruz. Can Choo be the same type? He will hopefully get a chance to show it this season. While I don’t like the fit on Milwaukee (Hiura should be the everyday 1B), he definitely would prosper if a team could give him regular DH/LF/1B at bats.
Cruz-type players are the exception, not the norm. The fact we can’t name that many consistently good players who are 38+ years old should tell you that. You can know which muscles to train, excercise, condition, whatever, but time will eventually catch up.
I’m saying they are -about- to be the norm, we are in this era right now, and here’s a list of all the best seasons from age 37 on from 1980 to present, there’s been about 150 of productive seasons from players aged 37+ in that time frame:
fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&…
Only about 150 productive seasons from players older than 37 isn’t too many in hindsight. Since 1980, there have been a total of 5487 seasons where a player has reached about 500 plate appearances. 37+ year olds make up just under 4% of the total.
@mlb1225 –
Aren’t you still in college?
Man…you don’t know the half of it yet lol.
But you’re right, man.
Experience, guile, treachery, & finances can only partially make up for ever-diminishing skills & ability.
I am in college, but we can have all the technology we ever want but there’s no natural way to keep up to father time. Bodies break down. We can excercise, condition, stretch out certain muscles all we can but eventually, they’re not going to be as strong for a 40 year old as they are for a 28 year old. Ovbisously, there are going to be exceptions of players who are outstanding for a long period of time, even into their 40’s, but you can’t rely on every player to defy their age.
Yes, which builds onto my point that NOW we are going to start seeing more of these, those “exceptions” are going to become more common.
Also the fact that therre’s 150 of those seasons is > the “none” that fans love to argue on here “so and so’s 35, he’s done” “choo is cooked because he wasnt lucky enough in a small sample last year but was fine in the last full season of the year before” type comments.
Yessir.
See what you have to look forward to?
Maybe, but again, we can’t rely on that to happen. Yes, we do have more technology and medical knowledge than we did like 15 years ago. Bodies breakdown no matter how much you know about what muscles to condition. Sometimes, it doesn’t matter. Most of us are stronger and faster at 28 than we are at 40.
I can break this up… Marty/mlb1225… both of you are right. He had a lower BABIP, but the reason for that was because he’s not seeing the ball as well. His weak contact% jumped in 2020, he hit less balls to the middle of the field and went oppo more, and the amount of fastballs he saw dropped. All of that plays a factor into the stat BABIP. He also saw a weird little niche of his get diminished in 2020: his first pitch swing%. Might not seem like a lot, but that stat fell 5% in 2020. I can’t tell you the amount of times Choo got the first hit of the game on the first pitch of the game… and that’s just in the first AB. Do I think he can still be serviceable? Yes. Does that mean he’ll be good? Ehh, maybe. But to just provide BABIP doesn’t give a fair argument because other things go into BABIP as well.
I don’t think Choo sucks or anything. Just can you really rely on a 38-year-old to bounce back?
@mlb1225
I might also add that people in general are more injury prone as they age because their body cells just don’t have the regenerative capacity that they did when they were younger. This effect is natural and normal, and is magnified in athletes.
I am in my mid forties and used to run track and field and play baseball in high school and college. If I tried that today at the same level I did back then, I would probably wind up in a wheelchair.
@ marty
For someone who post regularly on this site, you embarrass yourself for not understanding why people use 2020 stats to judge production. Recency! If you do not include them, that’s even more embarrassing.
@stymeedone thats funny, because I find it really embarrassing that people use small sample sizes for any baseball player stats. Strange you think small sample sizes are valid, they literally never are.
2020 stats are fine as long as you include 2019 too. MLB plays 162 games a year, it literally doesn’t matter what a player does in 100 ABs. Hope you learned something today!
Maybe you can take a day to learn how to use the term “literally” properly.
Marty we should talk about your posts about Asian racism if we want to feel embarrassed! What about how you claimed no one would sign in Toronto, and then like 6 players signed there over the next week?
You are in NO position to call anyone else “embarrassing”!
Now go eat a double portion meal, you’ll feel better! It’s beautiful to be fat!
@ Chief Two Hands
Unnecessary. When the vast majority of the population uses a word “incorrectly,” lexicographers change the meaning of the word to reflect actual usage. This has already happened with literally.
In a literal manner or sense; exactly.
“the driver took it literally when asked to go straight across the traffic circle”
Informal:
used for emphasis or to express strong feeling while not being literally true.
“I was literally blown away by the response I got”
Still incorrect. My guess is that you say “I could care less” when you mean you could not care less. Quite frankly I do not care if so many people use terms and phrases incorrectly that it becomes socially acceptable, it shows ignorance to me.
It shows ignorance BY you, Chiefy. “I refuse to accept what society accepts because it’s wrong to ME.” What a jerk.
@pdxbrewcrew
I don’t pander to the lowest common denominator…of course you don’t like me. I completely expect and embrace it. Also, your take on my post was inaccurate, not that I am surprised.
My post was quite accurate. Another example of you refusing to accept something simply because YOU don’t want to.
i wouldnt say he can’t be productive at all. he could still be a good DH.
Another example of Stearns’ bottom feeding to build a roster. Besides Yeli and maybe Cain, what is the face of the franchise? BTW we need a c too, unless Navarez hits this year. Pina won’t be ready until mid-summer and is not an everyday c.
If a player is the “Face” of the franchise isn’t that singular and only requires 1? Pitching, the team could advertise to the fanbase Brandon Woodruff, Corbin Burnes, and Devin Williams. Josh Hader is a “face” of the franchise under your line of thinking.
Nottingham is who team will play away from Pina. Catchers are few and far between. You may have a handfull in a season that are tier 1 and 2. Otherwise its tier 3 on a good year and tier 4-5 when its bad. 2020 was a tier 5 for Narvaez.
Just trade Hiura to Oakland already, it’s obvious he’s no longer a fit on Milwaukee.
$150m earnings for a guy whose made 1 all star team. Good for him.
to be fair, he had a pretty good career for a guy with only one all star nod. two top 15 MVP finishes without a nod.
Top 15? That a stat or a streeeeeeetch ?
And the All Star game appearance was because every team needs to be represented, he was their token participation.
Give Huira a break. He was our #1 prospect and really raked. He has played a combined 143 games in two years. Give him more of a chance. After 143 games how well did Cain or Yeli hit? There are few players who come up and immediately start hitting like they did in the minors. Arcia finally looked like he finally found his hitting stroke, after 5 mlb seasons.
Among the players 247 with at least 3000 plate appearances since 2008, he’s 37th in wRC+, 45th in OPS and 34th in wOBA., while being 12th in OBP and 46th in home run total. He’s arguably a top 40-50 batter.
It’s not that hard… Tell him Wash…
It’s incredibly hard
Who’s Fabio?
Huira will NOT be getting time at 3rd. His main defensive issue is his arm. If he can’t handle 2nd, 3rd is out of the question. Choo only makes sense if there’s an NL DH.
What is all this get rid of Keston Huira business. Just because they got Kolten Wong, we write off Huira for Shin Soo Choo. Get out of here.
Strongly agree. Those who want to get rid of Huira are obviously not baseball experts. Everyone should be an instant All-Star or out with you. Let’s take Josh Hader, he had a down year last year, if he weren’t under two more years of control, Stearns would’ve been non-tendered. I have know issue of ever trading Hader, I think,Devin Williams is the real thing.
Hader didn’t really have a “down year.” He had two bad appearances out of his 21.
2 of 3 HR given up, 5 of 10 BB, and 6 of 8 runs came in those two appearances.
If Braun is not going to retire ( I am not sure what he is going to do), then the Brewers are better off just having him back than signing Choo. As a Brewer fan, I would really like to see Braun back for one more year to fill in for the outfield, DH, and play a little first. They can drop Daniel Vogelbach and not pay him a penny. His contract is not guaranteed.
Beggars can’t be Choosers.
why do the brewers always want people to play out of position?
Desperation?
Would be a very Counsell esk brewersie move
I hope it gets done, it would only take a top 30 prospect
Choo is a FA.
Brewers must hate Hiura
Interesting. With the Braves signing Osuna and now the Brewers interested in Choo while already having Hiura and Vogelbachh, I’m wondering if there is an indication that the DH will be implemented in the NL. Doesn’t make much sense sticking up on those guys if there isn’t.
i mean worst case they cut Vogelbach. not that big a loss.
Another player they are trying to shoe horn into a position he doesn’t play
This is a meh move. It doesn’t do much of anything to help the team beyond this season and even that effectiveness is debatable. Position flexibility as part of a bench building strategy is only useful for a few reasons.
– you can deploy platoons that make for better offensive matchups vs pitchers
– you want to protect a lead and get better defense late in games
– you want to give primary option starters rest
– you have to fill in for injuries
The best run teams build for the first reason to get better results a lot of the time by having a platoon provide better results than a single steady starter. They us those players to defacto accomplish the goal of testing regulars. Fill ins for injuries and defense use the same players without explicitly rostering just a late inning defensive specialist or pinch runner.
“Meh” is a sound, not a word. Use your words.
Check the dictionary yourself, troll. It’s a word.
informal
exclamation
exclamation: meh
expressing a lack of interest or enthusiasm.
“Meh. I’m not impressed so far”
adjective
adjective: meh
uninspiring; unexceptional.
“a lot of his movies are … meh”
unenthusiastic; apathetic.
“everyone else I talked to was kind of meh”
You’ve made this mistake and been corrected before. So you’re back. Only a matter of time before you’re banned again. Just go away.
You attack others for using non-words and not only do so incorrectly but then use lolz in your name. SMH.
Brewers to Choo (Ralph to Lisa): I choo-choo-choose you!
Bonds is listed as the top 3 seasons after the age 38 is pretty much all you need to know. The others are mostly hall of farmers which Choo is not. Father Time always wins in the end.
You actually believe that Bonds was rated that high? He looked like the Incredible Hulk. The bat began to look like a toothpick. People at 35 don’t just wake up and bulk up. It’s a medical fact. Next to Pete Rose, Barry Bonds is the biggest disgrace to baseball. He never admitted he cheated and paid off his “adviser” not to testify.
There have been books documenting this. So leave this reprobate out of any discussion.
Did anyone notice the anomaly of Shoo walking 112 times in 2013?
Hiura sure struck out a lot last season. I wonder if he will be one of many players hurt by not being able to look at in game video…..
The idea makes zero sense. What even is a guess the kind of money to offer Choo? For the Brewers 3-4mil max or less would have to be all the value seen in the idea. Choo made 21mil last season.(old contract I know)
The Pirates have had some interest in Choo though talks have cooled as Choo is expected to command more than a sawbuck per game
wouldn’t mind seeing him Pittsburgh. Had him on my fantasy teem way back when and he kept me in it.. always liked him after that lol.
though if he is getting any other offers i doubt he’d come. With Moran and a couple others he might not get much time at first… oh yeah and its the Pirates lol.
But really a first and OF option even if he really isn’t an OF any more. possible guy to trade in the summer if he hits anywhere near his career numbers.