The latest rumblings centering on the trade and free-agent markets in Major League Baseball…
- The Blue Jays have touched base with the Cubs about the cost of acquiring former NL MVP Kris Bryant, tweets MLB Insider Jon Morosi. At this point, it was practically qualify as oversight if the Blue Jays hadn’t checked in on Bryant, as they’ve made inquiries into just about every big name on the market so far this winter. The two sides haven’t discussed a potential deal for a few weeks, however, suggesting that Bryant constitutes something closer to a back-up plan for the Jays. The Cubs don’t appear particularly close to moving Bryant, so Toronto likely has time to explore their other options before circling back, should Bryant ultimately become a more appealing target.
- The Marlins are among the teams that have discussed outfielder Andrew Benintendi with the Red Sox, according to Jim Bowden of The Athletic. To this point, though, the two clubs have not been able to agree on compensation. Benintendi would fit the Marlins’ desire to add a corner outfield, having played the majority of his career in left since he debuted in 2016, though he would be a reclamation project for Miami. Once a superstar prospect and effective big leaguer, Benintendi posted average production in 2019 and then endured a nightmarish, injury-shortened campaign last season.
- Free-agent first baseman C.J. Cron underwent season-ending left knee surgery last August, but he’s doing well now. Cron has been cleared for full activity and should be ready for spring training, Jason Beck of MLB.com tweets. Cron, who just turned 31 last week, looks like one of the best first baseman on an open market that’s low on impact players at that position. He has delivered above-average offensive production throughout his career, evidenced by his lifetime .257/.312/.464 line with 118 home runs in 2,586 plate appearances.
I would be really sad if Benni left. They would need a good prospect for him, even though he’s had problems since he started getting injured.
Just replace him with the Brockstar.
Just start a breeding program using the Brockstar line. If only scientists could isolate the “meh” gene.
@Wark. You just mean dude. =D
Haha sorry salary. Brock Holt being Boston’s chosen son is op’s calling card. I thought gbs was giving me the set for the spike.
Sorry, even I don’t like the idea even as a joke. His past value certainly was not to play the outfield platooning full time with Renfroe, I would have liked the joke has it been to platoon at second and then back up the other slots.
Everyone missed the gbs42 joke. I did not. Well played.
@WereAllJustGuestsHere – Thanks. Glad someone got it.
We’ve been on these comments threads way too much if we know pasha2k this well.
gbs42 we always remember the absurd. Well, except for the folks questioning you on this thread here…
God no, Brock’s bat fell off the map, hes terrible now. We have better guys in house.
I disagree. Outfielders are easy to replace, especially if they haven’t fared as well as Benintendi. He really became a hassle to watch at the plate the last two years.
I truly wonder what the asking price is for Bryant? 2 of an org. top 5 prospects? 2 cost controlled TOR arms? 1 and 1? He has all the talent in the world, but coming off a sub-par year, and controlled for just 1 year at $20mm, do you take what you can get? Wait until the trade deadline? Offer a QO? I’m curious and I’d like to hear some opinions
With 1 year and 20 mill hes worth a top 10 prospect if you ask me.
I don’t think there is any way that the Blue Jays trade two top 5 prospects for one year of Bryant. The only one of their top prospects I could see them possibly including in a Bryant deal would be Groshans. With Martin in the fold, Groshans could be expendable. I think the Jays offer would be Groshans, a controllable arm & a lesser prospect
There’s so much more value in 6 years of Groshans compared to 1 year of Bryant that’s it’s not even in the same galaxy. Martin is destined for the outfield or second, he’s never shown to be capable with throws from short or third in his career. It’s disappointing to me how Groshans is so overlooked by fans and management when discussing the blue jays future. We’re looking at a well above average defender at third with well above average power and hitting skills. He would be the best infielder defensively on this team tomorrow if he was starting at third. Everyone should let that sink in before we’re so quick to flip him for a rental
It is easy to overlook Groshans when he has hardly been on the field. He missed most of the 2019 season & there were no minors last season. Out of sight, out of mind.
I hope the Cubs’ return, if they trade him to the Blue Jays is good, but there’s no way they get Groshans back in return. The Cubs won’t be getting any top-5, maybe not even top-10 prospects back for Bryant, but I could see a return of C.J. Van Eck and Riley Adams, but probably not much more.
But that return – Adam’s and Van Eck – and dumping $19 million would be a good outcome for a return. That is, it would not simply be a salary dump.
The Cubs didn’t even get a top-10 org. prospect from the Padres for three years of Darvish, who was coming off a great year, so it seems highly unlikely they would even get a sniff of a top-100 prospect for one year of Bryant coming off a terrible year.
Lol, first off, all four of the prospects the Cubs got in return for Darvish are legit prospects with top 100 potential. They are crazy young but have extremely high ceilings. Hoyer made out extremely well in the Darvish trade.
Second, too much is being made from Bryants bad 60 games, where he was dealing with injury the majority of the time and didn’t have a full spring training to get ready. The guy is a career 24 plus WAR and posted a 132 OPS+ just a season ago. It’s not like he forgot how to hit, some with Yelich. It’s hilarious when people talk about Bryant “regressing” a 132 OPS+ and a OPS of over .900 is regressing!
Looking at Toronto’s prospect lists, and their youthful prospects, I think they have the upside of the kids Chicago got from San Diego in the Darvish trade so I strongly doubt the Cubs would consider any of them as a center piece in a trade. Odds are they would seek Groshans or Woods Richardson and another piece, possible De Castro.
People keep bringing up Darvish’s years of control as a talking point… The Cubs wanted out of Darvish’s contract not because of next season where he will turn 35, but his 36 and 37 year old seasons. Having Darvish for 3 years may not have been the strong selling point that people may think.
Bryant makes 19 mill and had 1 hr going into last series of year
But cubs should get what Red Sox got for Betts or Indians lindor
Lol Bryant lucky he wasn’t released
I’m not sure where you are coming up with your Betts and Lindor comps from.
Boston landed a controllable stud in Alex Verdugo who already had success at the ML level, Jeter Downs, MLB’s 40th ranked prospect, and Conner Wong who is a good prospect in his own right. Plus the Dodgers took on Price.
The Indians received two ML ready young players, one being a former number 5 over all prospect, Gimenez was the 92nd rank prospect and has had MLB success, and two pitchers, who like the Cubs received in the Darvish trade, have extremely high ceilings Wolf has two plus pitches and plus control with a developing third pitch, Greene is a Brennen Davis type player who could easily go from being a hardly know to a top 100 prospect.
You are also only looking at last year and coming to a conclusion that Bryant somehow completely lost the ability to hit. Only fans and “personalities” take the 2020 season seriously.
A LOT less than you think. Too much money, rough 2020, looks like declining skills. The Indians didn’t get much for Lindor/Carassco…it’s tough year for anybody making 15M+.
Yankees fans be like we will give you Andujar/Frazier for your Kris Bryant…….
I can’t even tell if this is a joke
I think other teams rightly imagine the Cubs can’t get a decent player for him AND save money. Maybe he’d be worth an orgs top 10 prospect if the Cubs paid half his salary; though that would be embarrassing. I guess I’m trying to say I imagine teams are playing really hard ball with them and offering a couple of top 30 org prospects if the Cubs pay 1/4 of his salary— which is likely a non starter. I was honestly surprised the Cubs didn’t just non tender him, considering how cheap and crappy their ownership is.
I agree with your assessment though that Bryant has at least some potential to go off for 280/340/520 and 30 HR.
There’s no way it’s going to take 2 Top 5 prospects in an organization for Bryant. Didn’t take that much for Snell, Lindor, or Darvish. I honestly think the Cubs are going to hold onto him until the deadline then decide what to do from there. Contreras is the most likely to go IMO even though it would make 0 sense, but hey it’s the Cubs
With Bryant, for me at least as a Cubs fan, it depends what their plans are with Contreras, Hendricks, and the rest of the payroll saved by trading Bryant. If they’re dealing Contreras, for whom they should be able to get a lot back right now, I’d keep Bryant, otherwise that offense would look anemic. If they’re trading Hendricks too, he would bring a lot back in a trade, but keeping Baez and Rizzo (who I assume they want to extend both of them), and Bryant still gives them a chance to win the NL Central. What I mean is, keep Bryant if they’re trading Hendricks and Contreras because (1) they need to still have a respectable team and (2) an offense with Bryant, Baez, Rizzo, Happ, and Heyward can still win the Central.
But if they use Bryant’s 19 million on other improvements, say sign Garrett Richards and Jurickson Profar, then maybe trade Bryant? BUT they should be able to sign those guys anyways, as they are $75 million under the luxury tax threshold. So finally, trade the two guys that have lots of value (Hendricks and Contreras), retool for 2022, and keep Bryant, who doesn’t have much value now.
I think there’s real doubt as to whether they’ll spend any of the money they saved on Darvish. It’s possible they just keep dumping salary for whatever they can get. I’d hate to see that. I’d like to see them wait til the deadline and give him a chance to regain some value.
If they trade Hendricks and Contreras it is no longer a retool it’s a 3-4 year rebuild.
Cubs fans won’t be happy if he is traded. They hated the darvish package. well bryant only brings back 1 or 2 of those type prospects and no Davies. So a Josh Bell return. That’s best case. 20 million is a lot with a full season and not full fans at games. For a team that’s 100 to 200 million of revenue not coming in. Pirates cleveland rays etc will be fine. So will ny la. It’s the teams that have over a 80 million payroll but don’t have a mega local tv contract that are going to be hurting.
Realistically I think he’s worth 3/5 of the Mookie Betts trade. He has that potential and could definitely sign an extension. He won’t get that much because last year/COVID but that’s what he’s worth right now in my opinion.
I think it falls around what Cleveland got for Lindor.
Bubba… you mean Lindor/Carracci? Not sure how you parse the value for Lindor from that trade.
I would say parsing that would be: Lindor for Gimenez and Wolf
Carrasco for Rosario and Greene
Paddy- I would say that Lindor has been a much better overall player than Bryant since they both came up. What I’m trying to say is that Bryant will not get much but for sure less than what the Lindor and Carrasco trade netted. It is a buyers market at this time. Look at the Darvish, Snell as other examples.
The Cubs are so desperate to dump salary, that it will only cost the Jays a case of LaBatts and a gift card to Tim Hortons
Any team on the receiving end is going to use his contract status against the Cubs. I think the Cubs would be lucky to get 1 mlb piece and mid level prospect or two mid level. You really could make a case as to who:
A. Can afford him
B. Who has the need for 3b
C. Who plans on contending in 2021 and beyond
D. Who has the budget to try extending him
E. Who has the talent to trade for him
F. Who typically makes a move like this.
…it probably comes down to a lot fewer teams than you think.
Yankees, Astros, Dodgers, Blue Jays. A big maybe on the Phillies, but only if Realmuto signs elsewhere.
I think Bryant might have more value at the deadline than now.
First off the other trades this offseason have shown teams are unwilling to part with top prospects to take on salary in this questionable economic environment. Aside from the even in a normal year teams would be very reluctant to part with even 1 top prospect for a player in his walk year especially coming off a down season. The Cubs will be lucky to get a return of 2 prospects ranked #11-15 from an organizations farm system for Bryant.
KB has little trade value by himself at this point. Once the season starts, an acquiring team won’t be able to tag him with a QO, further decreasing his value. In order for his trade value to increase, he’ll have to get back to All-Star caliber play, but if the Cubs are competing for a playoff spot, will they want to trade him?
Right now, I think he’s worth two or three lottery picks, lower quality prospects than the Cubs got for Darvish. If they eat part of his salary and include another player, the return increases, of course.
If the Cubs are done cutting salary, they should keep KB, try to compete in a weak NL Central, and QO him if it appears reasonable to do so.
Absolutely no chance Bryant gets one top 5, much less 2, for an expensive 1 yr contract on a player with decreasing numbers and injury issues. Any GM that does that would be fired asap.
I doubt Bryant’s return will be great. Maybe 1 prospect in the 7-10 range (Kloffenstein?) along with Reece McGuire and Derek Fisher?
You know what’s becoming apparent? Nobody wants to win the NL central. I’m a Cardinals fan and as things stood coming into this off-season I would’ve pegged the Cubs as the favorite but it’s actually possible the Cardinals could do next to nothing and take it. Our division is becoming the NFC East of football this year. I understand the Cubs don’t want to be forced to suffer a long rebuild by holding on to long but they won the division last year. Why sell now when the division is so weak? Maybe they think even if they got into the playoffs they wouldn’t go far but sometimes all you need is to get there and get hot at the right time. Seems they are open to trade anyone of value while every other team in the division has gotten weaker(weren’t that strong to begin with)or has stood pat. I think the Cardinals may take the division but wouldn’t use the word win more like given to them
Nice to see the Marlins trying to upgrade!
Marlins might be one of the few teams to make money this year. Florida might have more relaxed attendance rules. Besides visiting teams fans. Are locals cruising and flying as much? Seeing a good upcoming baseball team might be something of interest.
At a $6.6M salary and probably due $10M in ’22, he’ll be an interesting get.
Good, Finally something else the Blue Jays’ alleged fans can cry about on the internet.
Bryant’s their “backup plan” to signing Greg Nettles.
Who is Greg Nettles? Graig Nettles was one helluva fielding 3B back in his day.
It might have been funny if you actually knew what you were talking about
Calm down bud
Bosox will get the best deal from Miami. They’ve traded a couple of aces away in the last few years. Where does Jeter find these guys?
Cron wouldn’t look to bad in a Rangers uniform.
He’d look a lot better in a Brewer uniform
If the Jays could trade for Bryant and Hendricks, that would check off a few boxes on needs. Would a package of Gurriel, Thornton, Espinal and Kloffenstein make it attractive?
No, that’s a terrible return.
No way should they give up Gurriel for 1 over priced year of Bryant. Gurriel has alot of upside and has many team friendly years left.
Benintendi to Mets for Nimmo, Matz, Gsellman.
Mets say no to that.
As a Mets fan, I don’t see the RSox making that deal.
Nimmo is better.
I don’t think that was a serious offer. Well I hope anyway…..
Hearing the Blue Jays are interested in DaVonta Smith.
What’s the chance that DeVonta Smith is around at #11 in the draft?
None he goes to Miami at 3 or Bengals at 5.
Benintendi to ATL might not be bad if they could possibly get Boston to take some of Ender’s contract and then resign Duvall or someone to platoon for him
Why would the red Sox trade benintendi for Enciarte? Unless the Braves were also sending back a really legitimate prospect (or 2) I don’t see why Boston would be interested in that deal. I’m actually not entirely opposed to Boston acquiring him and hoping he could rebound… but Benintendi is much cheaper and other than 2020 has hit better than Ender too… so not sure what the interest would be without significant other assets in return.
Atlanta would definitely have to add prospects (probably some young arms) in a deal. I didn’t mean for it to sound like a 1 for 1
I heard the bluejays were in touch with manny ramirez after being released from his team earlier today
Jay’s are in on everyone. It’s the Giants actually signing everybody. But nobody is in on manny.
Jays only need to offer a single a pitcher for bryant
I’m not sure I really understand why the Red Sox are looking to trade Bebintendi right now… the timing just seems really odd. His value has never been lower so it’s not like they’re going to get a massive return for him. And its not like he’s blocking someone else from playing time next season. So unless another team is willing to overpay for him or they’re planning on signing someone like Springer and thus are trying to make room in the outfield for him I just don’t get the reasoning. You would think that they’d rather give him a chance to rebound from his dismal season last year to, at the very least, rebuild some of his trade value. I mean granted he certainly hasn’t lived up to the expectations set for him when he was a rookie but he has also shown solid ability in the past so unless Bloom and company feel as though there’s some reason he won’t ever return to the level he was at as recently as 2018 I just don’t get why you’d sell so low on someone who is still only 26. It’s not as if he’s too old to start to take a step(s) towards fulfilling some of the potential he was thought to have. He may never be the superstar scouts predicted years ago… but he’s also young enough and has flashed above average offensive ability enough times to say that he could still develop into an above average outfielder if he can rebound past last yeats injury ruined season.
The theory of value being low and holding onto a player always strikes me as stupid. If you think he isn’t the player you thought he would turn into then trade him. Why keep him to see him falter another year then no value whatsoever. Yes it’s a risk but hopefully coaches and scouts know what they have.
Jeff, based on recent history, nothing the Red Sox have done makes sense. They adopted a trade low policy a year ago when Bloom showed up. They got next to nothing for Mookie compared to a July trade. Paid double to get rid of Price. Their financial guys should be fired. Benny’s low value says exactly what you are saying, NOT THE TIME TO TRADE HIM. Same for JD. Heck same for Devers. In fact, based on last year, there is nobody that should be traded since everyone under performed except maybe Verdugo.
I say trade guys whose value is higher than their abilities like Verdugo, Downs and Wong. LAD hyped their value to heights that far exceed their abilities so trade them before they prove how bad they really are. Verdugo isn’t bad he’s just riding a crest of success that means his price might be higher than his value. If Bloom needs to stay under the luxury tax and can’t since $16M is going to pay for Price to play in LA, then, trade the guys you got for Mookie and upgrade the pitching sooner rather than later like he should have done in 2020..
The Betts trade was as good as it could have been. If he was traded earlier, we would have gotten more.
I think you’ve unknowingly pointed to exactly WHY bloom hasn’t made a meaningful upgrade to the rotation:
Boston pays 16m/yr to have price play in LA, saving 16m/yr.
Have you looked at what SP costs lately? Effectively, bloom has to accomplish 2 things valuewise with a SP signing, or, he looks even more inept.
1) for less than 16m he needs to equal or exceed the production/talent level of price. Obviously you don’t want to pay MOR for equal level production, or else why trade?
2) the cost savings off the 16m must be of enough magnitude to exceed what including price in the Betts trade cost the Red Sox in terms of diminished prospect return.
Here’s why: as it stands, bloom traded away a top 3 MLB talent, and took a lesser talent return to dump price’s contract, BUT, hasn’t yet replaced price. So, to use that abstract concept of ‘prospect points’ imagine Boston gave up 50 prospect points in the deal to save 16m a year without price. If your replacement/equal production costs 15m/yr, bloom forfeited 50 prospect points for 1m/yr net cost savings.
That’s a bad net trade difference. Better off keep price, pay 1m extra, and get 50 pts better prospects.
That may explain why bloom nibbles at 1m-4m contracts seeking that #3 bargain rebound pitcher. It’s easy to give up 50 prospect pts to save 13-15m a year. It’s hard to justify why you do it for 1m.
Trading Betts put the red Sox below CBT. Price just gave extra room, room bloom only used for his revolving door of washouts and nothing else of value.
That’s total nonsense and gibberish. Prospect points! Start living in the real world.
Why is everyone still talking about Bloom like he was the one who traded Betts/Price. That was an ownership decision. That was not Bloom coming in and making that decision let’s be real. Do you honestly think that a new GM wants to come in and trade the best player the Red Sox had developed since at least the mid 70’s maybe even the early 60’s? What really happened is the Red Sox ownership had decided, whether right or wrong does not matter, they were going to be unable to keep Betts. Bloom was sent out with his marching orders and he was told get under the lux tax. If you want to argue the return they got for one year of Betts and 3 years of David Price wasn’t enough then then we’ll everyone is entitled to their opinion. I think Bloom did fine the got rid of Price who clearly didn’t want to be in Boston and they added Verdugo, Downs, and Wong. Personally I think the return was decent for a disgruntled pitcher and one year of Betts.
I am not to concerned what Boston does this offseason. The free agent class is relatively weak. I don’t see Boston going over the lux tax but the reality is there are still a lot of free agents out there and not a lot of buyers. Toronto seems to be a buyer but they seem to be having a problem getting players wanting to go there right now probably because they have no idea where they are going to play. Still plenty of time to Bolster this Red Sox team. The biggest difference between this years and last years is hopefully getting your two best pitchers back to health. Sounds like Erod should be the real question is how is Sale going to look when he comes back. Those two along with the continued development of Houck and Pivetta and if Eovaldi can finally stay healthy are going to more determinative of the Red Sox this year then any free agent signing.
I think it will be unfair to judge Bloom or ownership for that matter until the 2022 season. If Boston doesn’t participate in the much better free agent market of next offseason then I will start to get restless. My guess is this upcoming season is just a see what we have and if things break right the Red Sox could be a playoff contender but next offseason is when we see the team build there next future World Series contender.
Was he the point man on the Betts deal? Yes. Ownership asked and Bloom delivered. He made that deal.
The real question is why people are complaining about the deal and what did they expect?
I agree he hasn’t been great overall but I do think moving Betts was the right call.
Jays aren’t acquiring Bryant. Stupid idea.
Well, at this point, they need to acquire someone… it will be beyond embarrassing if the season starts and they have no significant addition to their club.
Lots of names still out there, but no certainty is formulating.. and close time approaches.
No point in Bryant if your team can’t pitch. What, win 85 games and watch him leave after the season? Then the Jays are back to square one minus whomever they dealt in the Bryant deal. There is a better way.
Well, at this point, they need to acquire someone… it will be beyond embarrassing if the season starts and they have no significant addition to their club.
Lots of names still out there, but no certainty is formulating.. and closing time approaches.
Devonta Smith future Blue Jay!! Ok
Benintendi to the Cubs. Need a LF or CF who hits for contact.
Good luck. Guy can’t hit for anything. So many groundsball outs, not much better.
Andrew Benintendi to Cubs
Kris Bryant to Braves
Bryse Wilson to Red Sox
Fair?
Cubs have no interest in him.
I think the cubs would rather have Bryse Wilson and cut out the middle man.
Great suggestion Marty. Love the players involved but Braves come out way ahead in the deal.
How about the Cubs get Devers, the Braves get Bryant and the Red Sox get Ian Anderson? With Potts and Dalbec 3B has many options in Boston, Bryant fixes a Braves problem and Devers takes over 3B until they realize he can’t field or the DH comes to the NL.
KD you can bet the Braves will NOT be trading Ian Anderson for Kris Bryant. That’s laughable.
Will never happen. Sox want to unload Benintendi, not Devers.
Not a single General manager in league would give up Anderson for Bryant. I’ve seen some crazy offers on here over time but this takes the cake. Sorry.
I’m hoping the Tigers give Cron a second chance.
With all due respect to Cron, I do not. The Tigers should fill their regular IF with younger players with possible upside like Candelario (1B/3B), W. Castro (SS until he fails) and Paredes (2B if he gets in shape). Then there are Cabrera, who wants to play 1B sometimes, and second tier players like Goodrum, H. Castro and Alcantara.
If the Tigers sign a player with potential upside as a potential trade piece (like Schwarber), then I would be okay with reduced ABs for younger players. But Cron projects to be a sub-par 1B, which is not worth any adverse effect on possible future regulars.
Gruß,
BSHH
Benintendi for Nick Neidhart and Monte Harrison.
Blue Jays touch base with everyone-then get left stranded on the basepath
Benintendi to the Marlins is interesting, wonder if they could get a starting pitcher for him?
Cron looking for his 5th team in 5 years. Going back to Detroit could be possible. Maybe Cleveland or Milwaukee
If the price is right, Cron fits Milwaukee though they have Vogelbach and without the DH in the NL, he’d take AB’s away from Cron. Vogelbach was very good for Brewers tha last 5 weeks.
The only person the Blue Jays aren’t interested in is YO MAMA!
The Blue Jays are going to be in on everybody until theres nobody left to be in on…. then say they tried and made their offers but the ask was too high. Blah blah blah Rogers blah blah go away Atkins blah i hate you. The end.
Lolll
Lol that was great
That was always the song and dance when Shapiro was in CLE. Every winter ended with him shrugging and saying, “I tried, but I’m not going to mortgage our future for a moment.”
If we trade Benny I really hope we get pitching.
Everyone said the same with about mookie.
Bloom happened.
Bryant is the backup plan to Arrenado. The jays are swinging for the fences and could use his glove at the hot corner.
Only if Arenado legally agrees to opt out after this season.
“Once a superstar prospect and effective big leaguer, Benintendi posted average production in 2019…”
In 2019, Benintendi only played in 138 games and in two of those he had no plate appearances and in three others, he only had 1 PA. There were some injuries that slowed him down.
What will they do if they trade him and JBJ decides to take free agency? Get him out of the lead-off spot and back to his normal swing and see what he does.
Take free agency? He is a free agent. He’s not on the Red Sox roster. They need to resign him if he is to return and frankly unless he accepts $1M a year to be a late inning replacement I don’t think anyone should want him. He couldn’t hit in his 20s, why would his 30s be any better. Since game saving catches happen late in games he is nothing more than a late inning guy who might get 1 at bat if he’s lucky. $1M is probably on the high side for his contribution.
Game saving or winning catches happen any time.
You take away a hit in a bases loaded situation in the 5th for the final out you still saved runs. If you later win 4-3, that 5th inning play WAS the game saving/winning catch, or at least one of multiple ones.
It can be argued that ‘point in time’ events during a game are irrelevant because the strategy of the game changes based on the earlier innings. What ends up being an important play early in a game alters the remainder of the game but should NEVER be considered a game saver since all the opportunities squandered after that point in time also were game savers based on which side of the outcome a player is on.
Also, if JBJ makes a catch that can only be caught by a few other CFs then it provides incremental value to that game BUT if he makes a catch that stops a rally but the catch could have been made by 50% of the other CFs in baseball then his value is overstated since the game saving catch wasn’t unique to him.
JBJ is a great defender and a miserable hitter. 8 years of proof make me confident in my statement.
The goal is to win. So, as much as anyone is a fan of a player he must be evaluated by his contribution to winning. JBJ makes a PO on average roughly 2.5 times a game. His fielding percentage in CF is .991 and league average during his 8 years is .988 or .003 less than JBJ’s.
If someone chose a fielder with league average abilities and who hit .260 which is .021 higher than JBJ during his 8 years, would their team be better off? The team would have 11 hits per season more with some of them being extra base hits. In the meantime, the defense at league average means ONE additional error!! Why wouldn’t EVERY team prefer a guy who hits .260 or better with a .988 fielding percentage over a guy who hits .239 with a .991 fielding percentage in CF?
JBJ is thrilling to watch but he’s over paid and can be easily upgraded for far less money. I don’t not love JBJ because I’m saying this, I’m just looking at it from a player evaluation perspective. He’s been fun to watch on defense and embarrassing to watch on offense. He’s just the opposite of Devers. I hate to see JBJ go but it’s best for the team. It may not happen since JBJ and Devers have always received preferential treatment. Devers at 3B costs the Red Sox games compared to playing him elsewhere and JBJ playing full time in CF costs the Red Sox games. That just goes to show how special 2018 was because they had a joke for a manager, a CF who couldn’t hit and a 3B that couldn’t field and they still won a ring. Now that’s impressive!!
Fielding % is a tip of the iceberg for a CF.
Is he getting to 2 or 2.5 balls per game range?
Is he among the top CF for assists?
For 2020, guys like Ian Happ and Avisail Garcia playing CF with no errors, but getting to less than 2 balls per game.
Trent Grisham 2 errors with 2.5 per game is much better.
Even half season of Buxton around 3 outs per game saves the Twins over 50 baserunners. This stuff adds up.
Bradley range and arm aren’t getting any better but he still rates among the top for assists, not many errors, and as long as he can remain durable, still probably 25-50 outs above average range over a full season. 1 or 2 year contract still probably lands in his positive WAR years.
Without horses in the starting rotation it’s not necessary to trade for Bryant, although it would be nice to see him in a Jays uniform. If the Jays were set up as the favorites in the AL and needed a 3B this move would make sense. It would be a waste for both parties if the Jays acquired Bryant and did not upgrade pitching.
Guest, Why would a trade for Bryant preclude the Jays from adding TOR arms? Jays could easily trade for Bryant and his 19 MIl salary and add Bauer or Odorizzi, Walker or do a trade for pitching with the Reds. Making one move does nothing in the way of blocking more moves.
You didn’t read, again.
Without horses (pitchers) there is not necessary to trade for him. I did not say don’t do it nor did I say they won’t get pitching. Jesus…
A Bryant acquisition better damn well result in a SP or two with one of them named Bauer and another not named Odorizzi.
Obtaining Bryant without 2 starters and a CFer is plain stupid. The jays need all 4 assets, If they pickup Bryant they better be sure that they can at least acquire an elite starter and and a very good starter before the season starters or picking up Bryant is a waste of time, money, and prospect capital.
Exactly. Not sure why that idea is controversial.
Look here; I just don’t get the philosophy of Chaim. The Red Sox don’t have to sell the farm to get good stars or become Tampa Bay North for God’s sakes. Don’t spend money on bad contracts, but selling Benny when his star isn’t shining so bright just doesn’t make any sense to me. I’m getting really sick of the way the team’s direction is heading. All they need to do is this; go out and snag lemahieu from under the Yankees noses, snag Cory because his number are going to bounce back as he’s a workhorse with a great curveball and get a damn CLOSER that can close a freakin game out. A few more little pieces here and there will help move this team to be a contender without going over the bank. But alas….Tampa Bay North…..sigh.
Trade Groshan’s and Martin for Bryant !!
Cubs would do that deal yesterday. It ain;t happening. Even Atkins isn;t that stupid.
I like Cron. For some reason Scioscia didn’t and never gave him regular playing time. His numbers would be better in my opinion if he was allowed to be the Angels starter at first base. Pujols stood in his way and Scioscia chose him over Cron.
Keep Bryant, compete. Sign a pitcher and a contact hitter and the cubs are actually ok. Davies, Hendricks, Mills, Alzolay, FA and then go for it. If they compete Cubs are fine. Then pick who you want in the offseason from your guys and the FA class. No reason not to try to compete in 2021.
Giants should DEFINITELY be in on Benintendi.
Blue Jays should trade for Bryant and sign Springer, Hand and Tanaka!! Ok
Bless you, bless you.
The Giants should trade for Benintendi, they need another left handed bat
I would pass on Bauer and sign Max Scherzer to whatever he wants