Add the Pirates to the clubs planning to attend for Corey Kluber’s January 13th workout, writes Rob Biertempfel of the Athletic (via Twitter). The Nationals and Diamondbacks were previously mentioned as two among many planning to view Kluber in Florida. The Pirates don’t seem like the likeliest team to sign Kluber, though he could conceivably provide some veteran stability with the upside of becoming a mid-season trade chip. It’ll be interesting to see how Kluber shows after two mostly lost seasons. Before he ran into health troubles, the 34-year-old reeled off an exceptional five-season run.
Here are a few other items of open-market chatter …
- Though there’s no evidence of recent progress, there’s still cause to remain bullish on the odds of a reunion between the Twins and slugger Nelson Cruz. The match, after all, has worked out well for both sides to date. In an appearance on the Locked On Twins podcast, Darren Wolfson of KSTP 5 indicated that mutual interest remains strong. But the club and the 40-year-old DH could also be eyeing alternatives. Wolfson suggests the Padres would have interest in Cruz if it turns out that the DH will remain in the National League. Remaining uncertainty in that regard has iced the market for lumbering sluggers. Depending upon how things shake out, per Wolfson, the Twins may have interest in a slate of options that includes Michael Brantley, Kyle Schwarber, and even Marcell Ozuna.
- Several of those players would also be of interest to the Nationals, per Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic. It seems that Ozuna is likely to require too much space on the balance sheet. But Brantley and Schwarber, along with Joc Pederson, are each seen as possibilities to take up a post in the D.C. corner outfield. The Nats have an opening after allowing Adam Eaton to depart.
- Free agent righty Jake Odorizzi appears to be in position to land a three-year deal, an executive tells Rosenthal. The expectation from that industry source is that the veteran starter could secure a guarantee in the realm of $36MM to $42MM — just where MLBTR predicted he’d land. There’s still no clarity as to Odorizzi’s slate of suitors, but it stands to reason he’ll have fairly widespread appeal given that Kevin Gausman and Marcus Stroman each accepted qualifying offers, removing two primary targets from the market.
I’d be absolutely in for the Pirates signing Kluber, so of course they won’t. He might cost them more that 1m, so that’s a no go.
pirates exectutive nutting wallet will do his due dilegence
Just window shopping .
Pederson will be re-signed by the Dodgers or go to one of the bay area teams (Giants most likely)
With Grossman off the market i could see the Dodgers bringing Joc back.
Washington wouldn’t really be a fit for Joc if the Nationals plan on giving Andrew Stevenson any significant playing time. They need a right handed hitter to share RF with him. Adam Duvall would certainly fit for Washington as a RH platoon option
Going to SF sounds like one way for Joc to deplete his best tool, his power
SF was a live park last year for even righty’s. They moved in triples alley and covered up the archways in right. Balls flew out of right, I think one even reached the cove off a right handed bat. If they keep it the same, it’ll be a great place for fa hitters to come play.
That’s a fair point. I would add that he is not Brandon Belt. When Joc hits them, that park won’t hold it, especially to RF. Joc is a bay area guy, grew up rooting for SF. I could totally see him signing there.
Angels should grab Odorizzi.
Angels should grab “insert starter here” at this point
that is jays specialty!
I mean the bucs might be a good option if they work a limited no trade into the deal and kluber get to pick one of 4 teams of his choosing at the dead line. The bucs may not max his trade value but other wise wouldn’t get him, and kluber gets to simply pick the 4 teams he tinks have the highest vhance to win. Kluber says lad, nyy, SD and twins id go to. For instance
At Kluber’s age (will be 35 in April) i can’t see why he would sign with the Pirates with the hopes of being traded to a contender mid-season when he could just sign with a contender. Kluber is in a rare position where his “showcase” isn’t about hoping to land a minor league deal somewhere, he knows he will get an MLB deal and will basically get to choose where
The Nationals could be the best fit for Nelson Cruz if there’s a DH in the NL. To me at this point the PA is better off saying to mlb in public we reject the NL DH in 2021. This either calls mlb bluff and they announce it tomorrow or then teams know the rules for 21 and there’s one less excuse not to spend money.
Now let’s assume tomorrow they announce the DH in the NL. Why are the nationals the best fit for Cruz. They out of all the contending teams are in need of a cheaper big time RH bat and they would only have to give him a one year deal.
I think that if Cruz was willing to accept a one year deal, he would have signed already.
He will likely end up back with the Twins but would be even more scary with the Whitesox or Padres.
Much as I’d like to see the White Sox get him, I doubt it. With Vaughn likely coming up in 2021 and Abreu coming off an MVP season, and with Collins and Grandal capable of filling in until Vaughn arrives and Eloy getting starts there on his off-days, I doubt they’ll lock themselves into 2 years of Cruz. Just too many internal options. If he were ok with a 1-yr deal, I’d say go for it.
Jake Odorizzi is probably the starter I want Texas to sign the most right now just because he’s the most secure of all the SP options on the market right now (besides Bauer, obviously). Paxton has his injuries, I love Sugano but he is coming from a weaker NPB league, I don’t trust Walker enough yet to want to sign him, and Tanaka has his injuries too though they are to a lesser extent then someone like Paxton. But Odorizzi for 3 years, 38 million would be a good signing if we could make it happen.
Odorizzi would be good for TExas, as a better version of Gibson. I think the other two pitching moves that make since would be Guzman and one of Palumbo, Allard or Benjamin to Col for J. GRay or in a move that sounds out of LF initially but if you think about makes a degree of sense, though I doubt either would do it and that is a 1 yr contract for Wainwright and 2 yrs for Molina. You get a solid veteran pitcher that throws strikes to tutor the youngsters and one of the three or four best catchers ever to train Trevino and Huff. If viewed in that lens I don’t think it is too far out of the box to make sense.
Odorizzi is in position to land a 3 year deal after basically not pitching in 2020?
Certainly puts him out of Boston’s price range
Would be nice to see Kluber in a Pirates uniform even if they offered him a decent contract (I doubt that they would), but even if they did I’m sure one of the bigger market teams will offer him more than what the Pirates are willing to offer.
You have just brought up something that gave me an idea…
Teams like the Pirates – and especially the Pirates – have a crap ton of money to spend because of their lack of financial restrictions. So why don’t they just throw a ludicrous amount of money at a guy like Bauer for one or two years (say, 2 for 85), and then trade him at the deadline of the first season he’s signed while eating the rest of his contract?
They’d get a king’s ransom in return because whoever is getting him, is getting a free ace. Plus the fact that the Pirates’ farm isn’t too good right now, and they have sooo much money to spend. I just don’t see how this could be a bad idea. I guess the only thing would have to be hoping that Bauer is an ace in the first half of 21′.
That would actually be a pretty smart idea for the Pirates. Even a team like the Rays would be able to trade for him in that scenario. However, I’m not sure that Bauer would want to accept that deal, as most players don’t enjoy being traded midseason. Also, he wouldn’t be able to choose his final destination here.
Bauer loves winning and quirky things. Sign him to a huge deal like that with a no-trade clause to; essentially, non-competitive teams, and then be transparent with him through the whole thing and keep him up to date with what’s going on. I think if it was done well, it could happen. Because like you said, players don’t like being traded mid-season, but I think if you were transparent enough, and the money was enough, I think Bauer would be down for it.
I agree that Bauer is the type of player who could potentially agree to something like this, however I think you are underestimating the physical toll of getting traded in the middle of a season. Many players like long term contracts not just because of the large amount of money involved, but also because they allow the player to live in one location for the duration of the contract.
Also, the Pirates would have to pray that he doesn’t go down with Tommy John Surgery or something that could easily make this a horrible deal.
No, I totally understand where you’re coming from. Though imo, I think the pros outweigh the cons for both parties. Bauer has been moved around lately, so even though a mid season move is stressful, I think that he could stand it so long as the Pirates are transparent. He needs to be told the truth in order for this to succeed in my eyes. Let him know which teams are offering deals, and essentially let him choose where he wants to go because all the trade offers will be great (or at least let him narrow down the choices). Then I think the money will also have some say too. For a player projected to get between 30-35 mil to instead be offered 40-45 mil AAV, that’s big.
As for TJ, that is part of the reason Bauer is a good example because he has had no injuries his entire career. It’s amazing, but he’s been so, incredibly durable it’s pathetic. I would be worried with any other pitcher, but I am confident that Bauer will be healthy for a long time.
I think the reason the Pirates wouldn’t do this is because their total salary will only be about 60m and if they were willing to add 45m to it they’d be better off fielding a 105m team than just having one 45m player. My issue with the pirates is they should be taking flyers on any rebuild candidate they can, like Puig. Should be cheap and could be flipped later but they’re not interested in spending more than minimums on dumpster guys.
That’s not the point though. You field one 45 million dollar a year player (who is a proven commodity), and you flip him after a half of the first season for an all-star prospect haul. Then after the 2nd season, his contract comes off the books when they’ll start investing in free agents again. Yes, you could spread 45 mil around the whole team, but the point isn’t to try and build up the team as a contender. The point is to try and get the largest and most star-studded prospect haul back as possible. Signing bounce-back guys won’t always do that. My idea would step out of the box of usual rebuilding, and finally let those rebuilding teams have control of the highly ranked prospects that they otherwise would’ve had to draft in order to get. It’s yet another way to advance the rebuilds of small market teams.
So your suggesting that 3 or 4 prospects, with no guarantee of future success and 3 months of Bauer is worth 85 million? And that is if another team sees fit to give up their own prospects. I like creativity but never will take place in realty.
Yep.
I think the idea of “buying” prospects (which is what you’d essentially do by signing Bauer) is better put when you take on a really bad contract in exchange for a good load of prospects. Say you take 40 million off the Mets hands in the form of bad contracts and they give you a haul of prospects, it would free them up to get Bauer, Mets would essentially be “trading” for Bauer.
What you say is true too, but what about teams like the A’s or Rays? They work with a budget of $30, so there really isn’t any player you could take off their hands in return for prospects. So, you offer them a super-star – which they could never get with their budget – for free, and I bet they’d be putting together huge trade proposals.
@Rangers29 Bauer has posted solid numbers for 1.37 seasons of his 8 year career. Yet you find him to be worth a king’s ransom?
My take is mostly based on FIP, smart FOs are likely passing on Bauer to avoid overvaluing the 2020 season which was 37% of a season.
So for a standard regular season in which the trading deadline is (somehow) closer to June 20th, maybe a FO would spend capriciously on Bauer, IF he continues his great 0.37 of a season and does well in 2021.
Maybe less shrewd GMs who fall for recency bias will sign him to a huge AAV contract. I doubt Cherington fits that description, though JD likely does. Maybe Chris Young will save JD from himself.
The one stat Bauer continues to improve on is walks per 9 innings. His control has improved. He has been healthy in his career for the most part. Organizations know that, rightly or wrongly, Bauer is a student of the game of baseball and will step outside the box to find ways to improve his craft. All of these things matter on-top of his strong 2020 (shortened) season.
What drives his price up is competition and a bidding war. Whether he’s worth the huge price or not will be up to the final two teams bidding for his services.
I like the creativity but part of the rebuild(tank)playbook is to not only collect prospects it’s also to save money in your war chest. Rebuilding teams will strip payroll down to the bare minimum and when their window opens they have more money to spend to go for it. By paying Bauer that absurd amount of money they’d be spending “war chest” money on a team that has zero chance. They need to save that money for a later date and that’s what they’ll do
I’m betting TB and Oakland would pass. 1-2 years of Bauer is not worth disrupting a long term system that constantly produces.
@Rangers29…Your idea would make sense if Nutting was not the owner. Bauer signing with the Bucs for that high of an AAV is slightly more likely than winning the PowerBall. Moreover, unless attendance is way up at some point mid-2021 (unlikely), the chances that Bauer will perform like he did in 2020 AND also a team paying a king’s ransom for him is not probable.
Maybe you’re looking at a grand slam on 0-2 count with two outs to win the game by a hitter whose been an a huge slump?
This seems like a great idea in theory to me. Sure there are risks, but it would seem to be the best use of money that a low payroll team could ask for. Good for the player as well in terms of the high AAV if they are willing to bet on themselves with low years. Flaming out or getting hurt are just risks associated with this deal. There are risks associated with every deal. But the reward seems to me to be a lot higher than using that $45M to sign 4 or 5 other FAs.
Another problem with this idea is that you’d have to convince the players to sign, just to be traded. For them, it may be more hassle than needed… Particularly for a guy who could probably get a 7-year, $150M+ contract if he wanted.
Then there’s the risk on their part. If they get hurt, or become ineffective, they may never get the opportunity to make the $150+. Interestingly, Bauer is the one person I could see doing this, since for years he was saying he wanted a series of 1-year contracts at free agency (he’s definitely an odd one).
But theoretically, signing Bauer, Springer, Cruz, Hendriks, Realmuto, and LeMahieu to a 1-time combined $200M+ would certainly buy a lot of decent prospects.
Bauer for one or two years (say, 2 for 85), and then trade him at the deadline of the first season he’s signed while eating the rest of his contract?
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It;s been tried before, in a different format. Teams would buy a FA, and then trade off a similar player for prospects. Bauer would be a more expensive version of the NYY signing DJLM, playing him at 1st, and then trading Voit.
And again, similar to a more expensive version of signing RPs, only to trade them at the deadline.
I see 2 issues with this.
1-As someone else mentioned, PT would take on an enormous performance risk.. With Bauer, this is huge. First, he has never performed at his 2020 level before. Secondly, his peripherals were borderline ridiculous. He had a 90.9 LOB%, 2nd highest of 40 eligible SPs (per FG). His BABIP of .215 was again 2nd lowest of the 40 eligible. Everyone should also look at his 2020 splits. He might have the easiest schedule in BB. Bauer could easily revert back to his 3.90. That’s worth something, but certainly not a top-tier prospect.
2-MLB would likely say no. it is mostly okay to throw in ‘some’ money, especially if a player is underwater. If you trade an $85M contract 1/4th of the way thru, you are talking about PT cutting a check to someone for $64M.
Past that, I wholeheartedly recommend a similar process. Sign 3-4 top RPs, including a closer. They will help PT win a lot more games, and you can still recoup prospects, though more like #100-150 types.
It’d be an easy way to pay for prospects, IF Kluber stays healthy and is dealing. Trade him at the deadline for a few prospects — or keep him, if they’re a surprisingly-contending team, like MIA in 2020. Obviously a long shot, but PIT can benefit from consistent innings against presumably weaker competition (NL Central). Opposing evaluators will disregard the lack of wins in PIT. “Oh people will come, Ray.”
Crazy they still can’t figure out if there’s an NL DH or not. I know about the negotiations, but come on that’s ridiculous.
I’d take Odorizzi at 3/36. Make it happen bloom
That seems very expensive. I think he’s a decent target, but his career OPS+ is only 106, he mostly missed last year, and three years would from 31-33. I think his number will be less than Rosenthal thinks, and maybe a decent amount less.
If $36M/3 is Odorizzi’s number, I’d think about throwing in a little extra and seeing what Sugano’s number is.
$12 million per year isn’t terrible for a #3 starter, especially when Drew Smyly could $11 million from the Braves and he’s a bigger question mark
You would think Kluber is throwing well or he wouldn’t be having an open workout for clubs to observe. He’s a pretty intelligent guy.
Figure out the NL DL situation already. Yay or nay. It’s already 2021. Why does baseball always insist on doing things the hard way?
Considering how important that decision is for NL teams building their rosters, it should absolutely be decided by now. Should have been decided within a week of the W.S.
Kluber would only go to a rebuilding team like the Pirates if they were the only offer on the table. He’ll select a team most favorable to his needs that will best position him for a bigger deal at the end of 2021. I don’t see that being the Pirates at this stage of their rebuild.
Best destination for Kluber: Tampa Bay.. Kevin Cash uses his starters on a regular rotation and keeps them to a minimum number of pitches per outing.. Cash and Kluber are quite familiar with each other, so, the chemistry already exists.. & finally, Tampa will visit Boston at least three times in the 2021 season.. that’s usually more than enough in-law visits for just about everyone..
As a life-long Yinzer and Pirate fan whose been living in the Cleveland area for 11 years, I would be thrilled to death with the Pirates signing Kluber. He’s been my favorite pitcher since he came on to the scene. Assuming he’s healthy, and assuming a reasonable commitment, I’d be all for it. Guy always seemed underrated to me, even as he was winning the Cy Young. Watching him pitch is like attending a baseball art museum… The way he mixes the Sinker and Cutter so perfectly… his very unique curveball/slider… and his excellent use of the 4-seam and changeup when needed… not to mention his humility and professionalism.
However, it would also be strange for him to sign with Pittsburgh, even if they outbid other teams. He’s almost a guarantee to be traded within a year. They’d have to offer a 1-year contract that would be enough to convince him to try and build his value back up. Not sure that’s going to happen, or a good idea for Pittsburgh.
Twins kluber three years at 55 million plus incentives
lol, no chance at all he gets that after barely pitching the last two years.
Mets- Odorizzi 3/$40 and if the Mets miss out on Springer I would try to sign Joc Pederson for CF, If the Mets can only get Odorizzi than build a strong bullpen by signing Hand and Hendriks than maybe put Lugo in the 5th starter spot behind Peterson. DeGrom, Stroman,Odorizzi,Peterson and Lugo it great but with a strong bullpen if they sign those 2 relievers should be ok till Syndergaard comes back.
Here’s why the Pirates might sign Kluber. Pittsburgh is the only team that can guarantee him a spot in their regular rotation. If he’s not 100 percent no contender will guarantee anything. But the Buccos are about to trade Musgrove & the rest of their starters are shaky at best. However shaky Kluber may be in the spring, this is the one team that can give him as many starts as he needs to get it together. And they can then trade him to the team of his choice for a nice return, or make him a free agent after this bounce-back year.
Preller being “interested” in every FA, or piece of trade bait on the market is a running joke every offseason. Nelson Cruz is just the latest.