Though they’ve been linked in the past, at least speculatively, the Angels are evidently foregoing pursuit of top free agent starter Trevor Bauer. Maria Torres of the Los Angeles Times reports that the Los Angeles organization just doesn’t see itself as a match.
The report doesn’t formally stamp out the possibility of a deal with Bauer, but it comes just shy of doing so. Torres pegs the odds of the sides lining up at “practically zero.”
This development makes for a bit of a surprise given the Halos’ need for a top starter and Bauer’s ties to Southern California. One might’ve expected some effort to land the high-grade hurler, at least to a certain point in the bidding.
Interestingly, it doesn’t appear to be a situation where the market has simply moved past the team’s valuation of the player. Money is a factor, to be sure. Torres indicates that the Halos’ budget likely doesn’t have anywhere near the space needed to fit Bauer — at least, barring the authorization of a pocketbook expansion by owner Arte Moreno.
Cash is generally king, but it may not be the dispositive factor here. Torres cites the presence of Mickey Callaway as a major roadblock. Callaway’s relationship with Bauer is, she writes, “believed to be eroded beyond repair” from the grating time the pair spent with the Indians organization.
If indeed Callaway and Bauer are oil and water, the Angels may not be a fit at any (realistic) price. That could leave the Mets in the driver’s seat, though other clubs have been connected to Bauer and there’s still time for some dark horses to emerge.
Smart move. Career 3.9 era with 1 1/2 great seasons to date plus he is a known headcase wanting 36 million per season. Just have to hope that other moves are on the horizon like a deal for gray or Castillo
If he uses the stuff Cole uses like like last year it’s not smart.
Now that words out that Cole and Bauer are cheats I’m betting their will be some managers sending umps to check them for foreign substances. I think Bauer isn’t going to get closer to what he’s trying for.
As much as I would like to agree with you, that simply won’t happen. There is plenty of evidence out there that basically every team uses some form of substance and if you call someone out, they are absolutely going to call you out too. It is an unspoken agreement between teams that nobody is going to call the other one out.
I agree with Doug here. Maybe. It the same substance, but guaranteed that their team is using it as well, so it would be silly.
Word has been out that everyone cheats since 1876…like managers didnt know that…or have players on their own rosters? Its like people just learned how the game is played.
You do realize that this is not news? Almost all pitchers use some kind of slip protection. Trust me when I tell you this, the hitters WANT them too. 95 to the ribs is the DL.
It’s amazing how people give old HOF pitchers like Gaylord, Whitey, and Sutton a pass for doctoring the ball. Then they hold modern pitchers to a higher standard. In the comments section after Don Sutton recently passed away, people were fondly joking about his history of scuffing the ball. I personally don’t care either way, but let’s be consistent in our judgement.
Those guys pitched until their arms fell off. Today’s pitchers barely make it out of the 5th inning.
People have to draw the cheating line somewhere.
Players, and Coaches don’t really have an issue with a pitcher being able to grip a baseball. That’s why the Angels VISITING clubhouse attendant got dinged.
The last thing any batter wants is a ball slipping out of a pitchers hand.
Since it’s done in the open, it’s not cheating. Cheating is gaining an unfair advantage. No one cares about this.
I agree with you Tat. He’s a big, egotistical mouth who has had problems with teammates and coaches. The Angels are smart to not want to do business with him. And those career stats! Not worth it.
I agree with Tat Also why pay Premium money for A player Who has bad chemistry in the clubhouse Bauer is a Flake How many different caps as he wore taking to social media asking fans why should he join their team pimping himself off
Tit for Tat. You guys can go back and forth and forth and back making genial thoughtful comments while the rest of the room ruminates.
Yeah, let’s overlook the 2020 Cy Young award winner. The man is a total gym rat who lives and breathes the fine details of pitching. A true competitor. Why would you want someone like that?
Surely the Angels have better options, lol.
He has a career 3.90 ERA, among other mediocre stats. How many seasons under 4? 3. And one was shortened. That’s a huge investment in a 30 yo when you aren’t sure how it turns out. And who can hurt the team in the clubhouse.
@earmbrister Actually he has 1 season to date in which he faced the entire league. Last season he played the central which was by far and away the worst division in the league. Darvish had a similar fate having a career year against mediocre competition. If I’m shelling out 36 million per season I want a locker room leader and some one consistent, bauer is neither. Sorry you missed the memo, but by all means only highlight the 75 innings as if it’s his entire career. He has yet to replicate this over multiple seasons and is doubtful to do so over the albatross contract he will likely command.
The rest of the seasons he faced friends and neighbors in a community theater production of Guys and Dolls
earmbrister is correct. Bauer is a hard worker and a very good pitcher. Who cares if random fans think he’s a head case? He’s still going to get paid well, as he should.
Yeah but he’s a total gym rat!!!
I’ll bet his ERA is below 2.00 in every gymnasium grom Newark to Dubuque and beyond, baby!@
What you bet that his whip is pretty fine in the steam rooms too, baby!!
The other way to look at bauers 1.5 good seasons is that its when he left callaway, maybe they vview how he should pitch differently
Yeah, the Indians have no idea how to develop pitchers! (Sarcasm)
Bauer has never had more than two consecutive very good seasons; he has multiple incidents of getting his ego, nasty mouth, and primadonna attitude into situations where he has to walk it back. As a Mets fan it is suprising all the hoopla surroinding signing a non-proven pitcher.
He has talent no doubt. But not the track record. His mental stability and personality are turning off a lot of teams. Besides big spenders watching their spending.
Something feels weird about that article. Idk, it goes against everything that’s been indicated this off-season and she doesn’t explicitly say that they are not in on Bauer (except in the headline). She could be right on the money still though….yet based on the baseball media screw-ups this off-season, it could easily be wrong…..also puts the Angels and Bauer in a weird spot where they either deny the report and thus acknowledge that they are actually in active talks, or stay silent and confirm them (unless they sign him relatively soon).
I agree. Even while reading it, it felt like the LAA were planting the story to push Bauer into a decision.
Who cares about his career? 7 years ago impacts tomorrow?
The last 3 years he’s been a top 15 pitcher in ERA, FIP and other advanced-era predictors. Top 15 for the last 3 years! That’s way more important than the entirety of 7
Pretty safe to say the angels could use a top 15 SP
Point is last four season bauer posted these numbers
2017 4.19 era 108 era+
2018 2.12 era 176 era+
2019 4.48 era 106 era+
2020 1.73 era 276 era+ (75 innings against weak competition)
So which bauer are you getting for 36 million+ per season? This is not something angels can afford to miss on, they are just looking to get out from upton and pujols deals adding a bauer albatross is franchise destroying. Especially with trout aging, angels are sadly not a piece away and need to build a contender the right way with depth and drafting sooner rather than later.
The angels haven’t had multiple above average starting pitchers in half a decade? Probably longer?
Why is Bauer guaranteed to be any more of an albatross than every other high priced free agent that has whiffed with LAA, beside you do not like him? Upton, Pujols, Wilson, Nolasco, Hamilton, Simmons injury wise.. the list is endless
With Bauer’s numbers, have you actually dug into them at all? Maybe noticing that Bauer‘s 2019 bad numbers are due to one horrible august and a subpar May, but 4 excellent months in between?
Will Bauer possibly be overpaid? Sure. But will Bauer likely outperform every pitcher on the angels roster in the next 4 years? The answer is pretty easily yeah. The pitchers the angels have at their best are either injury prone or equivalent to Bauer before he put it together in Cin. You can think he’s over the top personality wise. I’m not his biggest fan. But he’d undoubtedly make your team better
Again. Last 3 years, he’s a top 15 starter. I’m using the same stat sheet you are. Why do you refuse to acknowledge how good of a pitcher he has become? Just say you don’t like the guy. Because he damn well improves the angels bro, even if he settles in at a 120 ERA+ Heck a 108 ERA+ probably is at least #3 in every Angel rotation of last half decade. The angels spend 160+M on payroll. They should be paying 2 or 3 pitchers 15M+. If they want to win. They haven’t paid A SINGLE PITCHER more than 15M since 2016. They’re working on a 7 year drought playoff wise. Why wouldn’t you change the plan? Bauer doesn’t have to be a messiah to be a good investment
The long list of names you list that have been expensive mistakes is embarrassing. The one I knew out of the gate that you didn’t include was Vernon Wells. Hamilton was a drug issue, Pujols a HOF certainly doesn’t belong on this list. Nolasco the expectations and compensation were not that high. I see what you do about Bauer and the need for an established ace is great at this time. The personality and talent have to be a fit here as the luxury tax needs to be weighed against the sin of wasting prime Trout years. This is a tough decision and I prefer Castillo in a trade fact all possible as being the wise choice.
I had the same feelings regarding Ozuna instead of Upton when he was available in trade early with the Marlins as you could see the talent was there to excell at a controllable cost. It is all about cost and value.
How is a 4 and a half ERA 2 years ago make him a top 15 starter?
If you’re giving him 36m, it shouldn’t be a long term deal, so you at least won’t have him through his late 30s. But I agree that it’s a gamble with his up and down results.
Carlos15 ( not Beltran I hope )
How can you discount his CY last season?
Rob, you are absolutely correct. There are bo shortcuts when it comes to building and sustaining a winning organization. I hope Arte has finally seen the light.
For 2021, the Angels need to beef up the bullpen and sign a decent starter with the money that would go to Bauer. Most starting pitchers will not be properly stretched out so bullpen takes on even more significance.
I don’t believe that there are shortcuts in building a winning roster.
It has been a long time since 2002 but that was a winning roster.
There are only a few teams that can afford him, period. Those teams could afford to miss.
Walker would be good in Anaheim.
Bauer has been good to elite since 2016 based on ERA- and FIP-, which are park and league adjusted.
100 is average and lower is better. 2016 = 97/93, 2017 = 92/88, 2018 = 50/58, 2019 = 96/95, and 2020 = 38/63. The first number is ERA- and the second is FIP-. So since 2016 at worst Bauer has been slightly above average at times. Every team in MLB would be better with him in their rotation.
Anthony.
The people who use Bauer’s early data are purposely trying to skew the narrative.
Is Bauer who he was the last three season, or is he the Bauer who stunk it up in Cincinnati in 2019?
I don’t know, but what I do know is what he did several years ago is not relevant.
You’re right Anthony, but most people here refuse to acknowledge the advanced metrics. All they know is good ole ERA and winnin’ percentage.
Accept you just proved my point, why would I pay someone top dollar to have the potential to be average? Advanced metrics also don’t support you, the years he has been average fip and whip are in line with those numbers, I could do further back and show you overall in 8 seasons he’s had a 4.5 era with similar advanced metrics for 6 seasons. His best season came against the worst offenses in the league and was only 75 innings, see you darvish 2020. You guys aren’t very smart if your argument is to justify 36-40 million a season for a guy that can’t consistently be an ace.
Tat, There are some points with not thinking Bauer is for real.
That 6.39 ERA in ten starts for Cincinnati is concerning.
In 2016 and 2017 he was solid. Not great.
And from 2018 to 2019 not counting what he did for the Reds, he was great.
You don’t think he’s worth it, no argument. Maybe he is, maybe he isn’t.
Why pay top 2 price for a top 15 pitcher?
This is the best rebuttal on here. Excellent point.
Problem with Castillo is that the Reds want a package of first born sons for him, that’s why the Yankees walked away from the table. The truth is the Angels don’t really seem all that intent on winning. I feel like that’s the culture there anyway. Trout isn’t really a “winner” and doesn’t take the front office to task for settling for mediocrity. Last year they should have been all in on Gerrit Cole but quietly went to their room without dinner when it came time to step up negotiations. You can be one of the best players in the world but unless you use that status to help improve your team then you’re just as bad as they are. Trout’s a yearly MVP candidate but who cares when you’re happy playing without any pressure to win..
Mystery team is on it. LAA for what ever reason doesn’t excel at building the team. They buy some costly players. They have some very bad results. Pujols certainly belongs on the list bc it exactly points out the bad decision making and lack of discipline. They try to buy instead of build. You can build by buying some of the needed players, but they have to fit needs and a definitive strategy. LAA doesn’t have that plan especially regarding a pitching staff. I bet the owner gets too involved in baseball matters
IMO the Yankees should have given them Gleyber Torres as he isn’t a great SS and then should have signed Didi who is. Sad to hear this comment about the settling for mediocrity culture which wasn’t the case clearly in 2002 or the Vladdy, Weaver & Figgins years. Joe Maddon, Trout, Rendon, Ohtani someone needs to step up.
So the Reds would in this instance have only be willing to take on one Alou? Tough bastards
Mystery Team,
The Angels need to bring Howie Kendrick back into the organization.
He can motivate them to be winners as he did for the Nats.
Need to drop the Castillo thing.
Angels don’t have the prospects to trade for a Castillo. If they want to send Adell, I’d package him with Pujols or Upton somewhere. Get Pujols or Upton off the books ASAP.
Neither Pujols nor Upton have any trade value. I would love to dump Upton but I don’t see it happening.
Prov, are you aware how well Upton hit at the end of last year….
After the first 20 games he hit 302/393/605.
I don’t think he’s done. He just didn’t come back from an injury very quickly. I’m not going argue with those that think he’s done. They may be right… but I may be right as well.
But can you trade him? I think that’s the main point in the thread. That part is doubtful. Upton can lengthen that potent lineup in Anaheim.
Halo – the very end of a shortened season doesn’t make up for the totality of his Angels career in my opinion. He may still have something left to give and I hope it starts in the 2021. I also consider him a lazy defender based on what I’ve watched.
Guest – Aside from low value, Upton also has a full no trade clause so he’s not going anywhere.
I agree that Upton has no trade value. I just don’t think he’s done. He may be, He turned 33 in Aug. I think he has a year or two in him.
Defense is another matter… but at least it’s LF.
Michaelchavez22,
Pujols has a no trade and he’s going nowhere. Maybe Adell and Reid Detmers but the Angels do in fact have the prospects to deal.
It will either cost $ or prospect capital but without an ace, the Angels aren’t competing which is really unfair to Mike Trout and Angels fans.
Either absorb some luxury tax for 2021 as Pujols is off the books next year, or deal the prospects. Pick your poison but this is not an easy decision.
Bundy pitched like an ace, unexpected.
Bassitt pitched like an ace, unexpected. They A’s did it via the bullpen.
The Rays did not have a starter to average 6 innings. They did it by bullpen.
You can get by with serviceable starting pitching if you have a strong pen.
I’m not concerned about the Angels staff. But they can’t have that staff with this pen.
The real issue is no pitching, no playoff’s again. new management, same old Angels
I don’t see the Reds moving Castillo unless they are blown away by an offer. Gray, while much likelier, won’t come cheaply either. This ain’t be the Cubs dumping Yu Darvish; the Reds want real major league-ready pieces for Gray.
Enjoy .500 again.
Mmm thinkin they’d need a lot more than just Trevor to make a dent there.
Bauer or the Angels? Bauer’s career 3.90 ERA is mediocrity. Give him 30 mil / year and clog your payroll?
And the White Sox have won a ton of playoff games in the last decade and a half.
Anyway, it’s it’s not the starting pitching that a huge problem, it’s the bullpen.
Lmao true. Surprised the halos let go Robles , thought he was a solid back end piece
Really? Starting pitching is not a problem? Can you PLEASE let me know what pitcher on the roster is the #1 starter? Ohtani the bomb has been the biggest bust for the Angels since Mo Vaughn. Are you saying that Dylan Bundy is a #1 pitcher LOL or Andrew Heaney the human HR machine. Granted the Angels bullpen is garbage but it is on par with the Starting pitching.
I agree with fangraphs. This is before they added Quintana. And I’m sure they’ll add another pitcher. But what do I expect from someone who things the Angels only draw 20,000 a game.
“The Angels rotation is not in particularly bad shape, though it could use some spice at the top and some depth at the bottom.”
Beat the Angels when it counted. Heh.
Beat the Angels when it counted. Heh.
Enjoy 4th place in the al central
Enjoy 4th place in Southern California.
We will see. Pale Hose will be playing in October.
Lol what? No team in the central is even close to the White Sox, they should runaway with that division.
Mets or Dodgers IMO.
Definitely the Mets
They really don’t need him though. He certainly makes them better, but they have a lot of extension candidates and a huge Lindor contract to secure. They have enough money to do it all I suppose. May as well make a good rotation even better I guess.
It’s weird. Fact is if they do sign him you can say goodbye to syndergaard when his contract is up.
Or Stroman instead. His contract is up as well.
Always someone around to make a Stroman argument
No they use the 18+10 mil dollars saved on stroman and familia for syndergaard
Don’t the Angels need more than 1 SP?
Spread the cash around, sign Odorizzi, maybe trade for another?
Think this move makes the most sense, then trade for gray or Castillo and work on pen
Castillo is a baller but what prospects are going to Cincy in that deal
how about Marquez from the rockies
Not really, 1 more gives them 7 SP’s.
Depth! Angels starters have been injured a ton and now no pitcher is going to go more than 160 because of the truncated season. They need reliable depth more than they need anything else.
Actually, the Angels will add a starter and the depth is pretty good.
Barria will be the the seventh and had an ERA around 3.5 two of the three years he’s pitch. Sandoval will will the 8th. And Detmers, who very close will be the 9th. Suarez, who seems to be a AAAA pitcher will be the tenth.
They don’t have a front line starter. Which is a problem. But they don’t have a pen, which is the real problem.
The owner is the biggest problem for the Angels.
No they don’t. They need a bullpen.
It’s like saying the A’s need starting pitching. Maybe they do and maybe they don’t. What separated the A’s from the Angels last year was the bullpen.
Halo, in fairness, the Angels had the 2nd worst rotation ERA in MLB last year.
The Angels routinely require 9+ starters to get thru a 162 game season. Odorizzi, Castillo, etc push Dillon Peters, Jose Suarez, etc out the back end of a 9-10 man rotation depth chart.
Angels & NL. I understand your point, but Heaney, Bundy and Canning pitched well last year. So did Barria who wont even be in the starting rotation.
I’m not at all turned off by Ohtani not hitting the floor running. That’s very common for people coming back from TJ Surgery.
I don’t think the Angels have a top line starter, but they will add someone, and there will be depth.
I’m not worried about the rotation. I’m worried about how many games will get out of hand and lost when the starters are out.
Halo, good points. The Angels could use another backend RP like Rosenthal. Regarding SP, I’m anxious to see the improvement in Chris Rodriquez, Patrick Sandoval and Detmers. They may provide surprisingly good rotation depth in slots 8-10.
Yeah, I think the Angels starting rotation isn’t as bad as it’s portrayed, but it’s certainly not enough to win a playoff game with. (Made a big post about this curfuffel a farther down in the comments)
That’s mainly because of the enormous ERA’s by Ohtani and Teheran.
Ryan, Ohtani only pitched 2/3 of an inning so his ERA isn’t driving the teams number.
They need to pursue someone via trade. Time to overpay for Castillo, Marquez, etc.
Millville Meteor,
I have actually been to Millville quite an interesting place. I toured an old military museum alongside an aviation field and a handblown glass plant and museum.
All in on Castillo if he can be traded for.
When you can’t get best, get 2 good ones, is a good strategy. Takes 12 starters on average to complete a season. Odo and Walker, plus Bundy Heaney quintana canning and a bit of otahni, and you have enough.
Perfect! Now get Odorizzi and another solid RP.
Angels not pursuing top notch pitching?! I’m shocked!!
Just bc the SPs don’t sign doesn’t mean they weren’t pursued. They went hard after Cole last year, for example.
Maybe the Angels can sign another top third baseman like they did last year when the needed pitching.
They went after Cole before Rendon last year.
I think the point was that even though they went after Cole and he chose the Yankees they still needed starting pitching and they signed a 3B instead. The Angels have skimped on pitching since the C.J. Wilson overpay and when DiPoto wanted to re-sign Grienke but Arte wanted Josh Hamilton instead
Que the Angels’ fans saying “Well I didn’t want him in the first place” lol.
The move for the angels was Gerrit Cole not Trevor Bauer. Signing. Bauer now to make up for what could’ve been is a mistake especially if he wants record AAV.
I didn’t want him in the first place.
I didn’t want him in second place
Hard pass on my favorite team. Prima Donnas not wanted and that includes Yasiel Puig!
Ironically, neither do the Angels. Want to be in the first place or second place.
See below.
See above.
Well this is not surprising as the luxury tax was almost certain to derail this pursuit. Now the question remains will they dumpster dive for what remains a thinned out pitching market or hope their current staff can be at least slightly better than .500?
This is gonna drag on for a while, I bet. Similar to harper where it was just Phillies vs. Yankees for months, then Yankees backed down and Dodgers/Giants decided to give offers to run up the price. Mets will probably eventually sign him but I bet Dodgers try to run up the bidding and offer competition.
If I’m not mistaken, the Yankees never even had a conversation with Harper. They did meet with Machado.
I wouldn’t want to deal with him. But Mets sound interested so could be a bargain for them money wise if they don’t bid against themselves.
Have you seen Bauer? You think that guy will sign for a bargain? He wants record AAV.
He can want whatever. I would offer him what I think is the best contract available to him and he can take it or sit out.
Dodgers will take him on a two year high AAV before he opts for a discount with the Mets. If the Mets really want him they’ll have to outbid the Dodgers, which is certainly possible. If Bauer is open to a high AAV two year deal I think he’s a Dodger. Lower risk for the Dodgers on a two year. Heck, give him an opt out after year 1 if he wants to hedge his bets. Kershaw comes off the books after this season and Bauer potentially replaces him for 2022 if Kershaw walks.
Mets are currently $30 million below the CBT. Angels are $26 million. Dodgers $4 million. Any one of them who decides to sign him will be going over the tax. The Jays are the only team still theoretically in the race for Bauer who can actually afford him.
For sure mlb if he takes a two year for like $74M he’s a Dodger 99.9%
You want to pay him (AAV) more than what Cole got. Better look at the career numbers and what each has done. A guy throwing an tantrum can ruin team harmony. My guess is only a few teams have actually inquired. The only thing he has going is for him is his agent. He would be starting the season at home or signing a last minute short deal if Boras was his man. Anywhere from 2/60 low to 3/105 on the high end. No team wants to sign this guy for a decade.
Dodgers aren’t going to pay top dollar for a Pitcher they don’t need. Dream on!
That’s too bad, but I’ve been saying from the beginning that the Angels should try to trade Jo Adell for a cheap, controlled ace like Luis Castillo or Zac Gallen. That way they could get elite production without having to break their budget.
Adell stock is too low right now to get Gallen or Castillio. I wouldn’t make the trade one for one, but I understand the other side.
But it wont be one for one and there is not way the Angels will give up two.
Anyway, without Adell, the Angels don’t have a RF.
Marsh > adell also they likely will start scott schebler in right field
Few people think Marsh > Adell.
Schebler will make the team. And they’ll have to drop someone off their 40 man roster for Claudio.
They didn’t have one in 2020 so what’s the point?
This Calloway-Bauer issue was many years ago. This is fake news. Why have the Angels been linked over and over again. It’s not like this just happened. If Calloway refuses to use analytics he wouldn’t be the pitching coach in today’s game.
Nobody on the angels, nor anybody close to the team linked them. They’ve been linked by national media and Bauer’s social media campaign. Trying to drum up interest in his services. Angels are too close to the cap…erm luxury tax and still need too much to have ever pursued a 30M/year pitcher.
Agreed. It’s just noise. Unless Bauer slept with Calloway’s wife, two adult professionals can put their differences aside for a common cause especially for the money that is at stake. It’s a poor narrative to say that the Angels won’t pony up.
Calloway told Bauer he was pitching wrong, his preparation wasn’t correct and made him change his regimens. Bauer became elite once he got away from Calloway.
If someone doesn’t think a pitching coach is important to a pitcher, they’re an idiot
As someone who has watched Mickey Callaway up close as Mets manager my advice is he is clueless.
I don’t know what to do regarding Bauer as I haven’t really watched him up close but I wouldn’t let Mickey stand in the way of signing Bauer. Sign Bauer ( if you believe in him again I don’t have an opinion on him ) and Fire Callaway. It’s not like he hasn’t been fired before LOL
@halos17
You ask why the Angels would be linked with Bauer? Simple. Angels need pitching. Bauer is a pitcher. No other reason needed. It in no way implies they wish to pay him what he’s asking.
Arte should give Callaway a bonus for saving him from himself.
Amen
The only reason the Angels are passing is because Bauer is overrated & over priced… oh & train wreck waiting to happen, which the Mutts are about to find out. Alderson is no Cashman. You are now free to move about the cabin.
Maybe Bauer should have a 50% off sale?
best Angels news I’ve ever read on this site. get some bullpen arms and let’s get cracking ! next off season with no pooholes we can really spend
MLB will be on strike in 2022 so it doesn’t really matter.
How is this just coming out about him and Callaway? I feel like that would have closed the door on the Angels signing him even before the off season even started.
It’s been known for years.
and they chose now to bring it up again. That’s all I find funny about it. Arte like Dingers. I really doubt he will ever “pay” a pitcher
Who’s to say that they were ever in on Bauer… Just rumors.
You’re right, not one really knows anything on that front. The Angels typically keep things close to the vest.
jdLynn, It’s been brought up frequently… They didn’t get along in Cleveland. It was always in the background.
Oil and vinegar? Sounds like a delicious salad dressing if you shake them up together.
Maybe oil and water would be better here 🙂
Isn’t that ironic? Like rain, on your wedding day
Yeah, he’s gonna be a Met.
I still think a two year high AAV gets it done for the Dodgers. 2 years/$75mm (up to $80mm) with an opt out. Let Bauer work towards pitching on three days rest on a trial run, which could give Kershaw, May and Gonsolin an extra day or two of rest. Dodgers still have some question marks with the aging Kershaw and rusty Price, and three youngsters with smaller sample sizes. If you’re going to upgrade you want to upgrade at the top and work down. Buehler, Bauer and Kershaw as your big 3 is as good as any big 3 out there.
so, arte is going after realmuto, huh!
Was there any consensus Arte was going after JT?
This may be a woosh moment for me but Realmuto resigned with PHI.
He’ll have to settle for a catcher coming over from Japan instead: Fakemuto.
Thank you, Mickey. You are now officially the best pitching coach in Angels history.
Sometimes the best moves are the ones you don’t make.
So true
another season missing the postsrason. great! he may not be a slave player many want them to be but his presence would allow the team to finally contend. besides, is a pitching coach worth more than a front line starting pitcher?
I’m happy, I still remember the Jose Guillen saga almost 20 years ago. Attitude does matter.
I also remember the Jose Guillen saga. He was a great OF and hitter but he had the run in with Mike Scioscia just prior to the postseason and was cut from the team and unfortunately that adversely affected the Angels postseason chances.
Oh Mickey, you’re so fine.
All this praise for Mickey. Ironic. You know. Cause. The Mouse.
The real botch this off season was Claudio. They could have gotten O’Day for about the same money. They needed two BP guys, now they can only add one.
I would have loved Richards. Gone.
Get Rosenthal, Get Ordorizzi/Paxton. Schebler will make the team and be added to the 40 man roster. Which means the Angels will have to drop someone. Which I wouldn’t mind if the spot was for O’Day, but it’s not,.
So far Perry the Platypus is not very impressive. I’m hoping he turns into agent P, but I have grave doubts.
He got two relievers. Claudio and Igleasias.
Claudio hasn’t had an ERA below four since 2017 and RH hit him at a 300+ clip. You can’t bring him in to start an inning. You do realize there are more RH than lefthanders… right?
Right hand batters hit O’Day at a 193 clip and LH at a 228 clip.
Claudio stinks. And with the three batter minimum, he really stinks. He should be the seventh guy in your pen, not the guy you want pitching in the 7th or 8th.
Claudio will be fine. They can use him with 2 outs, and then he could only face 1 lefty most of the time. Let’s make that around 80% of the time….oh! And that would be the 4th thru 7th innings.
In today’s environment, left handed pitchers who can’t get RH batters out are worthless.
We would have been much better off signing O’Day. I can’t believe a single person doesn’t understand that.
Dude what’s your deal with Claudio? Lol did he hurt you? He’s a cheap lefty (which the angels don’t have). Not like we gave him a big deal
the biggest blunder was missing on hand.
They should have talked to hand. “Talk to the Hand” the trees whispered.
Not spending ten million on a pitcher with falling velocity is not a bad thing.
I would have preferred Yates for half the guaranteed money. But a LH Relief pitcher who can’t get RH batters out?
I’m surprised more people don’t see that was a huge mistake.
Dumb angels, his dreams was to play in his SoCal region home area. Also this would’ve maybe forced the A’s hand to go in a rebuild, knowing the angels may have better roster. As an A’s fan I’m ready to blow up the roster due to the cheap owner.
AsFan, did you read the link. He wasn’t going to pitch for Calaway. Did you want them to fire their pitching coach?
Force the As hand into a rebuild…LOL…that’s their MO every season. They rebuild on the fly; that’s why they are so successful.
Surprise surprise Arte is once again leading Angels fans out in the cold. I wish we could vote him out as owner. He placates us every few years by getting a great hitter but then stops sort of doing what’s necessary to build a championship roster for Trout, the greatest player in 50 years
Of course the Angels aren’t pursuing Bauer… it makes too much sense. They’re still trying to figure out how to turn their DH into a SP. Why? ‘Cause that’s what they do & who they are. That’s why they’ll continue to see a majority of blue hats in their home market.
You see a ball game in Anaheim much? There are not very many blue hats.
There aren’t many red hats at the Big A anymore either. What do they average about 20k a game and 70% of that is the away teams fans.
DODGER JR
I remember the Frank McCourt days the lean years for the Dodgers the Angels were the hot ticket In Southern California
Your 20 K lowball figure 30 K Attendance
Meh. Blue hats. Red hats. All I see are Mouse hats. Maybe its wayward travelers who thought they were lining up for the tram only to end up at a sports match.
Dodger Jr is a product of the modern day school system.
In 2019, they played 81 games at home and had an attendance over 3 million.
Curveball1984 Save your breath
Yawning
Clearly has never been to an angel game. Always top 5-7 in attendance the past decade plus and it’s all red hats.
The Donald is always top 5-7 in attendance. ALL TIME. And it’s all red hats.
Mets fans salivating over Bauer deGrom Stroman Carrasco and Syndegaard (albeit mid season but still). Very impressive at least on paper. 4x#1 and a strong #2. Lots of right arms but still an awesome rotation. Let’s see if NYM can get it done.
Very interesting as Arte Johnson would say!
And what would Joey Heatherton and Marty Allen say in response?
Who knows they weren’t on Laugh In
Dom Deluise? Joann Whirly?
Jo Anne Worley was on Laugh In. Thanks for reminding me.
So was Goldie Hawn.
Of course Goldie Hawn and Lily Tomlin, Ruth Buzzie, Henry Gibson et al
Charles Nelson Riley?
Flip Wilson
As long as the Halos get a couple quality arms instead of one Bauer, I’m happy about this news.
Why would the Angels break a trend of ever having any starting pitching. Hey maybe the Dark Knight or Trevor Cahill can resurface.
Yep it is
Resurface Dark knight Trevor Cahill?
for what team genius
Could get Tanaka and odorizzi for less aav probably
cookmeister – we cant pursue Tanaka because of his feet. His feet will be playing in Japan.
Cookmeister – nothing of note will be done from this point. Mark my words. The current staff is what they will bring to spring training.
AJ Preller has entered the chat….. (not likely, but would it really be a surprise at this point with him)
Torn on this one y’all. I like the guy personally. I think the media have been complete jerks to him. From all accounts he’s a great guy in the clubhouse. I think what he’s doing with his brand is amazing and I hope to see more of it. But I’m just not 100% sold on his pitching. In a 9-year career he has two great seasons. His All Star/sixth-place Cy Young award year in 2018 was elite. In his 2020 Cy Young award year this past season, he was DISGUSTING on the mound and deserves every bit of credit for it. But if you look at his other 7 seasons, he’s put up FIPs in the 4’s and high 3’s along with ERA+’s just above the average. His career FIP sits at 3.85, and his career ERA+ sits at 113. Those numbers are almost identical to Marcus Stroman, who also has a career ERA+ at 113 and carries a career FIP at 3.64 over 5 seasons. The career numbers from Bauer (and from Stroman) are by no means bad- they’re pretty solid. But they aren’t what you would pay 30M+ a year for, or even 25M+ for. At the same time, it’s entirely possible that Bauer has figured something out and has turned a corner. It’s fully possible that the Bauer we saw in 2018 and 2020 is the version you’ll be getting from now on with him. Maybe he goes to the Mets and absolutely shoves and gets them to a World Series. Yet based on his career numbers, I’d say there’s just as much of a chance that he stays inconsistent and comes back down to earth . I certainly think it’s safe to say that either way, to his credit, he’s not gonna absolutely suck.
Bottom line, if you’re the Angels, who need more than just Bauer, it might be the best decision to go after second tier guys or hit the trade market for now. What the Angels really need is certainty, an almost impossible commodity to have in a game based so much on chance and future predictions. But based on what I have seen from Trevor Bauer, it might be the best choice to pass on him for now- though I could absolutely be eating my words in a few short years. Truth is, Bauer is one of the most interesting guys in baseball, and I still don’t know what to make of him….and he might just like it that way.
Which will touch down on earth first? Trevor Bauer’s decision? Or ocjthalos’ musings?
I hope Bauer’s decision lol
Preach on brother. You should do motivational chats at the Holiday inn
why waste all this time?
Oops sorry it posted twice for some reason
What some people will do for clicks. I can tell you this is all fake news. Bauer to Anaheim within the next 72 hours. Working out the final details as we speak.
Talking about my post? All this could totally be fake news, I 100% agree, but I thinks it’s a convo worth having.
*think
And I agree there’s better money to be spent for the Angels. Trade for Sonny Gray, sign Marcell Osuna, sign Roberto Osuna and sign Ken Giles. Adell needs time in the minors.
Oh hey Scott Boras. Glad you can join us. Are any of your clients going to sign today? Or will it be tomorrow/Monday. Write back
One, possibly two within 48 hours.
Negative, I was responding to the article in whole.
As expected…
Seems like Mets or bust for Bauer…
Angels need a SP, some more bullpen and a RF. They can get quality at all those spots for less than 1 year of Bauer. However, they appear to be letting everyone pass them by and aren’t interested in competing. Moreno only cares about selling his 3 mil tickets and since Covid won’t allow that I bet he’s not going to spend enough to compete.
Best player in baseball.
Ask the Braves big-time offense in the playoffs how hard he is to hit.
Even I couldn’t hit him and I had a buzzer and a trash can telling me what he was throwing at me.
It would be so hilarious/ironic if you were actually Bregman lmao.
Ironic. Like finding a spoon when you need a fork.
Headline should read Angels Not Expected To Contend.
Fake news bro.
Actually, this is very true news.
Yeah my bad, the Rangers are going to take them out. 😉
Rangers29
Is that you Ted Cruz
Headline should read Angels Too Legit To Quit.
I realize Bauer may be difficult to deal with at times. But a team like the Angels (who Desperately need a high end arm) to not sign Bauer because of a freaking pitching coach?! That’s just stupid. Who cares about
your pitching coach. Fire Callaway if it’s that big of an issue, and hire a new one. Not too mentions it’s not like Callaway has a perfect track record with the way he’s managed others in recent yrs. He was a complete moron in NY and an awful manager.
He was a great pitching coach in Cleveland and Bauer was throwing temper tantrums. I’m old enough to remember how a bad attitude can ruin a team chemistry like Jose Guillen did in 2004.
Yeah, I know Callaway well thought of In Cleveland but much more recently he’s been a massive failure at coaching/managing. Plus he’s a F’ing pitching coach, so who cares. I’m not even an Angel fan but just want Trout in the playoffs. They’ve got zero chance without a couple more high end arms.
The issue is that Bauer would already start off in the dog house with half the team. Even for the players that don’t know Calloway even exists, they won’t like him being fired to make room for an outsider.
I guess, but this team obviously needs good arms. I’m sure if Bauer would them be successful that would be what the players would care most about. I don’t have a dog in the fight, but the Angels have such a ridiculous need for a guy like Bauer, regardless of his “personality” issues. None of the other guys they may sign will be nearly as good as Bauer. Whatever tho, baseball fans everywhere can just continue to watch playoff baseball without their best player being in it again.
My guess is they sign Odorizzi then trade for a starter using Sandoval and Adams +
The Angels will compete this year, and have a good chance at the playoffs. I fully expect them to add a couple pitchers that will help out.
LOOK OUT in 2022! Swap out Pujols money for a front line pitcher, which that FA market is a lot better. Then at some point this season you get Detmer and Rodriguez’s feet wet, and Whammo! That rotation in 22 might just be amazing.
I find it weird how much y’all are down-talking Bauer right now. I don’t want to go down a stat rabbit hole because I’m going to bed, but he’s way better than y’all make him out to be. He won’t get above Cole’s AAV – unless it’s on a short deal – but by golly is he gonna get a payday.
Well u did miss the bus on your previous post on, Bauer and Angels fans wanting him. A vast majority weren’t in on him, not because of his talents. It’s just that the pro’s didn’t out weigh the con’s, with the Angels current situation.
Hey Rangers29 has gone to bed. Let’s dip his hands in a tub of warm water.
DumpsterTheo – if Rangers29 really is a hs kid, then that really is an Epstein comment
LOL well I’m going out on a limb and saying Bauer will most definitely sign with the Mets now. Minasian better go get Odorizzi or make a trade, or else his first offseason has been a disaster
Pinstripe: Are Yankees intentionally trying to barely win the WC and make the ALDS a toss up? They’re very frustrating, and these acquisition decisions are reflecting a true lack of direction, outside of DJL, for the offseason.
I’m starting to think the worse thing they could’ve fine is wait for him because they missed so many other opportunities and are now buying from the Buy Here Pay Here lot.
It’s not a lack of direction; it is a lack of money.
Mr. Todd, the analogy that represents things that don’t mix is “oil and water”. You used “oil and vinegar”. Those things mix to make salad dressing.
Mr. Todd, your choice of words here is ironic. Its like 10000 spoons when you’re looking for a knife.
Who would’ve guessed?
Another year of Trout wasted
It’s okay guys, Matt Harvey is still out there.
I feel sad for that guy. What could have been…
Meet and MFing Greet the Mets.
Great move by the Angels. Bauer is the most overhyped free agent since the Bryce Harper nonsense. Mets are only team looking at him. If I am the Mets I offer this guy 2 years @ $50 with a team option for a third year and dare him to find a better offer.
Are the angel fan surprised about this I’m not it’ll be another year that Mike Trout does not make the playoffs they sign a old catcher and a 500 pitchier maybe it wasn’t Billy after all as I see it this team is no better then last year pitching is god awful sorry to break to us angels fan but we’re going nowhere again maybe 4th places
Money is better spent on depth. We just need to do something now.
If Bauer signs with the Dodgers, his W-L, inning pitched and quality start numbers (the only stats that really mean anything for a starter) will be better just because of the supporting cast behind him.
As a Dodger fan, I hope Friedman passes on Bauer (and I believe he will). Starting pitching is not close to being a need. I’ll take their rotation over any in the game, regardless of who signs Bauer. You don’t make moves just to make moves.
Totally agree Cey Hey fron the Dodgers perspective. He’s stuck with playing the Mets against themselves. That said, if Bauer does decide to go with the one year route again, that opens it up to many of teams.
Taijuan Walker, James Paxton, and Jake Odorizzi. Angels hopefully sign at least one of these starters then go after at least 2 more bullpen arms. 36 million is alot for Bauer when they can practically upgrade multiple positions for that kind of dough.
LaFlame, If they sign a starter and an RP, they cut one man from their 40 man roster. Two bullpen guys, then two men.
O’Day vs Claudio was the big mistake. A LH who can’t get RH out has very little value. If they had signed O’Day and not Claudio, and added another back end reliever, they’d have the 7th, 8th and 9th, handled.
Right now, unless Iglesias pitches like he did in 2019, they only have the 9th inning handled. If Iglesias pitches like he did in 2019, they don’t have a back end of the pen.
lol dude. relax. calling Claudio vs. O’Day a big mistake is hyperbole of the year. Don’t beat yourself up over 2 relievers that make less than $3, neither will make or break the team
You’re logic is simplistic and you don’t get it. You think it’s about money? Claudio is worthless and takes up a BP spot.
The signing of Qunitana takes up a bullpen spot. I bet you don’t see that either. Why don’t you see it? Because you haven’t at it.
Unless you want to lose Peters, he has to make the team. They have Rivera who is rule 5. I’d rather have both than Claudio.
They have taken up all these spots and still don’t have anyone to pitch the 7th or the 8th.
They better hope Buttrey is the 2018 Buttrey and Mayers is not career Mayers.
It was a huge mistake. A LH RP with a three batter minimum who can’t get RH out is the most worthless slot is baseball. And for that worthless slot, we could have gotten O’Day.
Dear Halo11Fan,
You constantly post negative things regarding the Angels’ moves and always seem to have a better solution. Calm down and try to see other peoples’ points – you might actually see validity in what someone is saying then.
Seriously, you wanted to sign Garret Richards over Quintana? The rotation needs a reliable person who is not going to get hurt. I do not care if his ERA is 4.20 over 200+ innings and Garret Richards ERA is 3.30 over 100. I will take the extra 100 innings with the Angel’s offense.
The Angels are not done yet, but their bullpen and starting pitching is already better than 2020. Claudio > Milner and Iglesias is better than whatever you want to call the late inning management last year. Sign an Odorizzi-type player and the Angels will have a solid bullpen. No stars, but solid.
In my opinion, I do not think Bauer is worth Gerrit Cole money, and it would be a mistake for the Angels to allocate that much money to one player. This man is a child not a professional. Who could forget his 69 days of giving of $420.69 donations?
There pen is not projected to be better than the disaster than the projections of the 2020 pen, and we know how that turned out.
How is their rotation projected to be better? Teheran 2020 was projected to be better than 2021 Quintana. Everything else is the same. They’ll add one, but it’s not the starting rotation that has me concerned.
I did want Richards because Quintana is Barria. Richards has big upside, Quintana v Barria is a coin flip, Barria starts in the pen.
Their bullpen is almost done. Claudio has seen to that, my guess is you haven’t noticed why, this paints them into a corner.
Here is the Angels pen.
Peters (out of options)
Barria (out of options)
Rivera (Rule 5 )
Buttrey
Mayers
Claudio
Iglasias
Pena
And who they add.
Reyes at AAA,
That’s nine guys. With a six man staff, that’s 15 pitchers. The Angels NEED an 8th inning guy and because they signed Vargas, they don’t have a 7th inning guy and they are not going to get one.
Halo, I agree the Angels need one more backend RP like Rosenthal.
As it stands today, the 7-9th innings will be covered by some combination of Pena, Buttrey, Mayers and Iglesias. Not perfect, but there is some upside there.
Claudio will replace Milner as the situational lefty. Probably coming in the game in a lot of two out situations.
Thanks for being civil.
With a three man rule there is not a lot of room for a situational LH pitcher who struggles getting RHs out. Milner didn’t work out at all, but unlike Claudio, Milner could not even get LHs out.
I think they Angels will add two pitchers. And because the Angels signed Quintana and have to keep Barria on the active roster, they’ll lose a couple players and still wont have the 6th and 7th innings handled. I have to believe they’ll still get an 8th inning guy and a starter. I’m not really bummed about Bauer, I’m am bummed about O’Day.
Pitchers don’t average 6 innings anymore. Claudio is going to be used so sparingly, I don’t see how he can be useful. If he is used a lot, he will not fare well. And I sure hope Quintana is better than he pitched with the Cubs, but I’m not sure why anyone thinks he will.
Let’s see if this sinks in for u 11. You’d be surprised how a BP can come together by just adding a single closer. It takes all the pressure off everyone, and they can just go out there and pitch.
Sure, there are some high leverage situations in the 7th and 8th, but the level of the 9th is in a mentality world all by itself. The Angels have that now in Iggy, and the RP’s that we’ve have now, look pretty good when there not pitching the 9th like last year.
But still, let’s get 1 more solid RP to make that pen an advantage, not just acceptable.
So you are betting everyone is going to pitch better if we add that one closer?
Maybe, but that’s not way to build a bullpen. Right now the Angels are going to have to figure out a way to get to Iglasias, and that going to cost them a lot of games… like it does every year.
And by the way, if Iglasias pitches like he did in 2019, it gets a lot lot worse.
And what you are also going to see because we signed Claudio and Quintana is the Angels loose players.
Because Peters has no options left, he might be the first victim and I’d rather have him than Claudio.
Eventually you’ll see what I’m talking about.
You are assuming no moves are made. It’s possible people get moved around and this overcrowded pen you’re talking about will be nonexistent.
Yes, I think the value of left handed specialists has gone down with the three batter rule. That doesn’t mean there’s no value. Bases loaded and two outs with a power lefty up to bat…seems like a good time to use that lefty. If the first guy gets a hit, the damage is done. I don’t think it really matters what the next two batters do.
I understand your frustration as an Angels fan – we all have gone through the same thing. I was always taught that teams don’t stay the same- they either get better or worse. I think the angels have gotten better this off-season, and it’s not even over. I think relaxing and just waiting to see what the opening day roster would be good to your psyche. A lot can change from now until then and there’s no point in getting worked up about the snapshot picture of the roster in the middle of the offseason.
We’ll see in spring games, things have a way of working themselves out. There are a few guys they can cut in the pen if they don’t perform, even Mr. Rule 5 guy, nothing lost there. There’s room to add an RP and a SP. It creates competition for the last spot or 2, this is a good so called problem to have.
The Angels need to bring back Petit. Eppler signed him for one year and he had the best year of his career. Then Eppler and Arte let the A’s steal him away. He’s still a good pitcher. He can pitch more than one inning. They also need to sign someone to be the setup man. I don’t think anyone they have now is reliable enough to do it. Buttrey seemed like he’d end up closing or being the setup man but he doesn’t seem like he can handle the pressure.
I don’t think the Angels need an over-priced head case. Let him be someone else’s problem, especially if he can’t get along with Mickey Callaway. I think Callaway is way more valuable to the organization than a single self-absorbed player. Mickey is the real deal as a pitching coach and his history of success in that role is undisputed.
Callaway sure didn’t help the pitching in 2020. How long does it take him to fix the pitchers?
The Angels are not serious about winning. What a waste of Mike Trout’s prime years
If Trout prime’s years are wasted, then Mike Trout has some of the blame.
He stunk in the playoffs and the following year when he Angels just missed the playoffs. Trout batted 210 with a 350 slugging pct in August. The Angels went 10-19.
Halo11Fan: “If Trout prime’s years are wasted, then Mike Trout has some of the blame”
Me:
2012 ROY / MVP runner up /10.5 WAR
2013 MVP runner up/ Silver slugger 8.9 WAR
2014 MVP / Silver slugger /ASG MVP 8.9 WAR
2015 MVP runner up /ASG MVP / Silver slugger 7.7 WAR
2016 MVP / Silver slugger 10.5 WAR
2017 4th in MVP voting / 6.7 WAR
2018 MVP runner up / Silver slugger 10.2 WAR
2019 MVP / Silver slugger 8.2 WAR
2020 5th in MVP voting /Silver slugger 1.9 WAR (short season)
Hallo11Fan: “He stunk in the playoffs ”
Me: All three games?
Also me: SMH
Some Halo fans don’t deserve Mike Trout.
.
You totally missed my point.
I doubt Mike Trout feels like the Angels wasted him… Mike Trout is probably upset with himself he didn’t do more when he had a chance.
If Mike Trout doesn’t go 0-8 in those two extra inning playoff games and the Angels make the World Series…. Is anyone saying they wasted Mike Trout?
If Mike Trout didn’t hurt his wrist on a foolish play and go into the tank for a month, and the Angels advance in the playoffs… is anyone saying Mike Trout was wasted?
Ignorant people are saying the Angels wasted Mike Trout.
all due respect that i can muster, you sound like arte or his younger brother.
Vizionaire… me?
My only point is Trout is a man. I bet he’s not sitting there saying the Angels have failed me. I bet he understands that things were not out of his control.
I hate it when people say the Angels wasted Mike Trout. I bet Trout doesn’t feel that way.
If Trout ever said that, I’d have a little less respect for him, but I’d be more on board with the comment.
Halo11Fan: “Ignorant people are saying the Angels wasted Mike Trout”
Maybe they are right? What makes them ignorant?
And you’ve made so pretty “ignorant” comments if we’re going to judge.
Mike Trout has been the best player of his generation and is on solid track to be the greatest baseball player of all time. Much of his amazing production came at very reasonable prices and the team still managed to shoot itself in the foot over and over again and failed to build a team around him. IMHO, they have wasted Trout’s amazing career so far.
For you to pick two playoff games (out of the only three has has ever played) to imply he is the reason the Angels have been the Clippers of baseball is just foolish.
Trout has been really exposed during crunch times. He may not build for pressure. His eyes don’t see the ball well or some advance scouting on pitch patterns that got him off balance. I still remember the yr Angels traded for Upton and Phillips. Trout couldn’t do anything in that Sept. Look at last month of last season, same thing.
Arte Moreno is only serious about selling three million tickets per year. And he’s been doing that. But I think half of them don’t even get used. He needs to stop worrying about money. If he wants his team to be a winner he needs to get serious about pitching. The Angels need an ace this winter and they still need two good relievers.
Don’t believe that story. Maria Torres is obviously getting her information from the Mets or a New York sports writer. There’s zero evidence of what she says. Some idiot writes crap and you all believe it?
JUST ANOTHER ANGELS VICTORY! LIGHT THAT HALO UP!
look, Perry so far is doing a great job. He’s putting together an competitive team with a chance to win the west this year. All at no cost to the future with all his 1 year deals. World series this year? Not looking good.
2022 and after? That’s what’s happening here with the 1 year deals, and with the money starting to fly off the books. Oh! Just look at those free agents next year. WRITE IT DOWN! that’s when you’ll get your front line pitcher or two, and potential deep playoff run.
Be patient Angels fans, you don’t want to bust the future budget in panic mode, with little chance to win it all this season. We’re close, just hang in there.
Oh, and as far as these Trout trolls, and wasting his prime? No, he’ll be in there soon enough, multiple times. I’d bet my house on it, and sell yo mama’s basement. Hahaha 😉
SwingtheFNBat:
Whether or not Perry is doing a great job doesn’t really matter. Moreno will find a way to undermine another GM by getting hyper-rigid and cheap on the non-PR moves every team needs to make in order to win. Moreno’s only priority is his net worth and he’s been great at growing that.
It’s been 11 seasons without a playoff win. You yourself are saying that 2021 is “not looking good.” But you type an all caps proclamation of victory? You see another year of bargain bin diving and one year contracts as leading to a “deep playoff run” in 2022?
Trout is on track to be the GOAT….and the team HAS wasted his contributions. You calling people “Trout trolls” and implying they live in “mama’s basement” doesn’t really change that. What are you, 11 years old?
@ Way of base Sealbeach
In all due respect, you’ve pretty much missed the bus on all 3 things you have there in your rebuttal. Let me try and get your faith back, that is if you truly are a fan of the Angels to begin with.
1) You can’t speculate on Moreno’s ties to all of the bad deals the angels have made in his tenure. The only one you could is Pujols. With that, its still speculating. But that said, it was a pretty good PR move to get people in their seats. Plus if true, don’t hate it. It got Trout his extension with the huge TV deal that came after.
2) another big miss: Victory is coming! In way of contention this year, plus maybe playoffs, with even better things in 2022. Maybe I should type this whole thing in caps, so people don’t think I’m claiming victory this year. Haha 😉
3) Trout is the man, and as far as the joke I made about the basement. That’s all fun and games to the actual trollers.
SwingtheFNBat:
1) Moreno will spend big $$$ for a guy like Pujols because it tied directly into signing a TV contract that made Pujols’ contract look like a drop in the bucket. The fact that it hamstrung the team didn’t matter. The “PR move” to get people in the seats (really to get the big TV contract) undermines GM abilities to actually build a winning team. This isn’t speculation….we haven’t won a playoff game since 2009.
2) So, you think one year contracts for mid-tier guys is going to lead to “deep playoff” runs starting in 2022? Respectfully, I disagree. Especially given Moreno’s tendency to hamstring GM’s by demanding big splash signings that don’t make sense….and then putting a hard cap on low PR deals that would help build an all around team. The Angels have a die hard baseball-crazy fan base located in the baseball epicenter of the world….and Moreno (who could care less about winning or Trout’s place in baseball history) has taken advantage of that loyalty to exponentially increase his net wealth….with no playoff wins since 2009.
If you want to be a cheerleader operating on an 11 y.o. level, throwing out middle school insults, etc… then whatever. But please don’t imply others are not real Angels fans because they are sick of Moreno’s act.
@ Sealbeach – The idea that the signing of Pujols “tied directly into signing a TV contract” is a complete myth. That TV deal had been in the works for over a year before it’s completion, long before Pujols was even a FA.
The reality is that Arte knew he was going to get the $3b TV deal, and hence was comfortable with signing Albert to the contract.
TV deal, then Albert. Not Albert then TV deal. This blows your entire point #1.
Hossmandu:
Moreno signed the TV contract at the same time he signed Pujols and Wilson and it was widely reported that the signings were intertwined. That was a decade ago and I’ve never seen anyone argue otherwise. It seems pretty clear that Moreno hamstrung the team by signing Pujols to $240M so he could sweeten the TV deal and get 12 times that back from FOX. Moreno’s bank account wins….the team doesn’t.
Do you have anything to back up your claim?
Yeah, they negotiated a $3b deal in one day.
My first piece of backup is that one of my good friends was an attorney that was on the Fox Sports side of the deal. Secondly, Arte opted out of the previous TV deal in 2010 long before Albert was even a FA. There is a ton of back up online.
Albert agreed to sign on Dec 8
“FS West, Angels Ink $3 Billion, 20-Year Deal: Sources” Dec 9 story by Mike Reynolds of NextTv – a TV Industry Blog. No mention of Pujols
“Albert Pujols, C.J. Wilson deals enabled by TV revenue” Dec 8 story by Bill Shaikin LA Times
“Angels $3 billion Television Deal Fuels Pujols Transfer” Dec 13 story by Michael Long of Sports Pro Media site
“Los Angeles Angels New TV Deal Worth $3 Billion Over 20 Years, Per Report” Dec 8 story by Eric Stephen at SBNation. A quote from this one proves my point “The reason they were able to make it rain all over Dallas was thanks to a new television contract that will reportedly more than triple their current broadcast revenue.”
“Angels Can Afford Albert Pujols Thanks To Their Next TV Contract” Dec 9 story by Cork Gaines at BusinessInsider
The fact is the TV deal facilitated the signings of Pujols and Wilson not the other way around. It’s a myth, and sometimes myths have a way of becoming false truths.
So, your “proof” is that you know a guy?
And who said either the TV or Pujols signings were negotiated in one day? No one. And, of course, they would have been negotiated in the same time period…..because, as you say, you don’t negotiate these kinds of things in a day.
From Dec 8th: losangeles.sbnation.com/los-angeles-angels/2011/12…
In other words, you have nothing to back up your claim.
I know the “I know a guy” is thin, which is why I gave you ample independent evidence. Did you even read that article. It basically says exactly what I was saying. I even quoted this article in my post. LOL.
I’ll make this simple for you.
TV deal $ was because of Pujols signing — MYTH
Pujols signing was because of TV deal $ — Truth
fox and angels agreed to $2 billion tv contractand the for signing pujols they agreed to increase it by $1 bil.
Vizionaire:
That’s in line with everything I’ve heard at the time and since then. In 2011, Pujols was one of the most marketable athletes in the world. Not a trivial thing to a TV network.
Beyond you knowing “a guy” and some in-the-moment guessing by a few writers as the story broke…..you have nothing to back up your claim that the TV contract was agreed upon without considering the Pujols/Wilson signings.
The deals were all negotiated simultaneously over a period of weeks and announced on the SAME DAY. (see, I can use caps too!). But, in your mind, Moreno couldn’t have used the eminent Pujols and WIlson signings in his negotiations with FOX?. That’s pretty naïve and silly.
Where is your back up? @Sealbeach Comber and @Vizionnaire? $1 billion extra. LOL you guys are delusional.
Moreno is at least trying to win with the top 5 in payrolls every yr in a relative small mkt team. It is not his fault that Upton and Pujols can’t hit their weight. Hamilton, Harvey, Cahill, Allen, Burnett, Madson, and etc. can’t even performed as an avg major leaguers. We can dwell on the lack of results. Moreno does need to invest in scouting and developing. The Dodgers, Braves, Cardinals, & Rays, and others are in the playoff every season because of their minor league depth. Moreno loves superstars, but that won’t get the job done as we have seen in the past. Build the farm.
“relative small mkt team”
Only relative to New York….
Now that Mickey has flashed his Minnie, Bauer might be back in play for the Halos as Callaway will be getting an extra $300 week for 6 months on the unemployment line.