Indians president of baseball operations Chris Antonetti and general manager Mike Chernoff held their season-ending media event this afternoon, discussing numerous topics with The Cleveland Plain Dealer’s Paul Hoynes, MLB.com’s Mandy Bell, The Athletic’s Zack Meisel, and other reporters.
As has become a trend during these wrap-up events in 2020, there was much discussion about how the economic uncertainty brought on by the COVID-19 pandemic will impact the Tribe’s payroll going forward. While Antonetti said “we don’t have a specific number for a payroll at this point,” no implication was given that the Indians would increase spending in such a “daunting” financial environment.
“The reality of the finances in baseball in 2020 is that the industry lost billions of dollars and as a team we lost tens of millions of dollars. That puts us in a really difficult financial position that will take us years to recover from,” Antonetti said.
Pre-pandemic, the Indians had a projected payroll of just under $100MM for the 2020 season and that number could drop significantly given the amount of money coming off the books. Cesar Hernandez, Oliver Perez, and Sandy Leon are all free agents, and Cleveland holds club options on Carlos Santana and Brad Hand for 2021. If all five of those players departed, the Tribe would save approximately $39.5MM in salary, though obviously the team would be left needing to fill multiple roster holes.
Francisco Lindor represents Cleveland’s biggest obligation, as the shortstop is arbitration-eligible for the third and final time and will earn a raise on his $17.5MM salary for 2020. Given his rising price tag, Lindor’s name has swirled in trade rumors for months, and this offseason could represent the Tribe’s last chance to get a significant trade return on his services.
While Antonetti said “I don’t think I ever take that view” that Lindor is a surefire trade candidate, the executive did say that there hadn’t been any more extension talks with Lindor’s camp since negotiations broke off during Spring Training. “What has happened with the pandemic has added an entirely unexpected layer of complexity as to what the future may look like. So we haven’t even started to wrap our head around what that may look like,” Antonetti said.
Perhaps more tellingly, Antonetti also made multiple comments about the approach the smaller-payroll Indians have taken to put a consistent winning team on the field. “I think we’ve made consistent decisions over the course of the past few seasons to infuse young talent to position us to sustain that competitiveness….And had we not made some of those decisions, we’d be in a much worse position right now heading into 2021,” Antonetti said.
“I think we can afford any individual player. It’s less about that. It’s about how do we build a team that’s capable of contending? And how do we allocate resources in a way that gives us the best chance to win as many games as possible?”
While Lindor’s Cleveland status may be up in the air, one person who is expected to return next season is manager Terry Francona. Due to both gastrointestinal problems and surgery to correct a blood-clotting problem, Francona missed 46 games during the regular and both of the Tribe’s playoff contests, with first base coach Sandy Alomar Jr. stepping in as interim manager. It isn’t yet known if bench coach Brad Mills or hitting coach Ty Van Burkleo will also be back in 2021 — both coaches opted out of the 2020 season.
In other notable news, Antonetti implied that Jose Ramirez would remain as a third baseman, which creates a few ripple effects for the Tribe. For one, it will put the focus on acquiring a second baseman (whether re-signing Hernandez or adding someone else) this winter, rather than widening the search to third basemen and moving Ramirez back to the keystone.
It also means that top prospect Nolan Jones could move off third base and see time as a first baseman or corner outfielder. “We have talked to him a little bit about the possibility of adding some positional versatility,” Chernoff said. “He’s out at our fall programming in Arizona now and will mix in potentially at some other spots.”
Jones played shortstop in high school and shifted to third base in the minor leagues, though there have been long been whispers that first base or the outfield might be his eventual position. A second-round pick in the 2016 draft, Jones has hit .283/.409/448 over 1453 minor league plate appearances, reaching the Double-A level in 2019. The cancelled minor league season robbed Jones of his first taste of Triple-A ball, but he did work out at the Indians’ alternate training site all summer as part of the team’s 60-man player pool.
mt in baltimore
Sadly, the Indians totally whiffed on the opportunity to trade Lindor 2 years ago where they could have received a huge return for his time in a controllable contract…
Very similar to what the Orioles did (didn’t do) w Machado 2 or more years before his contract ended.
In the Orioles case, I’m convinced that Mr. Angelos wouldn’t allow Duquette to make that trade. Seems that the Indians GM is the one who has allowed foolish pride to squander the return for this fine talent…
I feel bad for the long-suffering Indians fans….
Brixton
Or they were trying to win so they kept their elite player
mlbnyyfan
Indians are not trying to win if they trade Bauer and Clevinger in consecutive years.
SpiderManFromMars
Or they were trading from a position of strength to attempt to address issues with the rest of the roster.
Polish Hammer
Exactly!
MikeEmbletonSmellsBad
@SpiderManFromMars That strength really showed against the Yankees last week lmfao
looiebelongsinthehall
Indians are well run and seem to be the hybrid model other teams will follow for the near future given the pandemic. While a Tampa is the true dream, Cleveland’s approach seams more realistic. Ability to compete by paying to man a capable roster, give younger players real opportunities and have the ability to both buy and sell at the trading deadline. Most teams simply can’t be run long term like the Dodgers or Yankees.
looiebelongsinthehall
*seems
AndyMeyer
@Mikeembleton
They ran into a buzz saw. Nobody could’ve predicted that. Shocking. They’ve scored 35 runs so far in 4 playoff games. That’s insane
MikeEmbletonSmellsBad
Both buying and selling at the deadline never works. You can ask the Indians about that one. Swept out of the playoffs in the first round as their strength turned into a weakness.
Mishimacool
Mr. El Tiante…Indians *”seem” to be appears correct in that context. “Indians seems” is awkward. My two centavos.
Prospectnvstr
mlbnyyfan: Bauer had an excellent season this yr but look what has happened to Clevinger. The Indians traded from a strength to address current needs on the current AND future roster. Yes, they lost in the 1st rd of the playoffs to the Yankees but that doesn’t diminish what they’re pitching staff did over the season.
looiebelongsinthehall
I simply meant depending on the situation. If the need to add becomes dire due to a key injury, the Indians can usually afford “most” players available but if they have a down season or “excess”, they’re willing to look long term. I still say the Red Sox should have pulled the trigger on Benny at the 19 deadline when his value was still at its peak (despite a lousy season). I’m not convinced he can man CF full time (maybe I’m spoiled having witnessed JBJ these last years). Benny needs to realize despite a beautiful swing (perhaps the best outside of Harper) that I’ve seen from a lefty since Darryl Strawberry – I’m partial here as my dad months before his death said the same thing about Strawberry, comparing his stroke when he was on his game to the incomparable Ted Williams, he might be best served as a singles and doubles hitter, going with the pitch.
looiebelongsinthehall
Thanks Mishim. My strong subject in school was math not English. Back in the day, I had a 300 point difference in my SATs. Sadly, I think my ability in math now matches my English skills instead of the other way around.
sufferforsnakes
Does the “f” stand for fat?
Mishimacool
But America knows you tried your best. Cheers.
mt in baltimore
Seems that they didn’t have enough of a talent base to pull that one off.
Like the Indians a lot. Their GM totally misplayed his cards here and now they will have to do a soft reset w their team.
jk
misplayed Kluber as well. A trade in 2018 would have been huge for this team.
3Men&ABibee
I don’t they they regret the Kluber trade at all. He pitched a few pitches for the Rangers and he was done and prob won’t ever be what he was. They got an elite reliever (who yes was suspended) but will be back next year in an already better than expected bullpen. I don’t regret them waiting. Kluber meant a lot to the team and they did good with what they received. Even Delino ended up being better than expected. No Regrets
3Men&ABibee
Misplayed? They didn’t have to trade Clev. They are stacked with pitching (and more on way). People who get mad when they trade away people are not close enough to the Indians to know how they operate. They always do this and they will as long as the current front office is here. I don’t think that is bad at all. Yes, they have not won a WS but neither has the dodgers lately (look at the money they spend every year). Indians have a top 3 front office (if not the best). Proof is how many former front fffice people are running other organizations. Look at what Shapiro did for Toronto. Falvey with Twins. You may not like they trade people but it works. It shows too. Since Francona showed up, they been one of best teams in baseball. So, I take what they do minus what fans want. #RollTribe
wild bill tetley
Shapiro’s track record in Toronto is yet to be determined and certainly not (yet) a success. The Twins are a big fish in a small pond. The AL and NL Central are AAAA teams. Tribe rolled is more like it.
MikeEmbletonSmellsBad
“But it works”
No it doesn’t. The only reason they even had those 3 division wins is because the other teams in their division were rebuilding at that point. You never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever trade core players when you are trying to contend.
… ever
Polish Hammer
Delini is hot garbage…
debubba
I believe they took offers, why wouldn’t you? They were looking for an offer that made it worthwhile and based on the fact he is still there, they didn’t get one they liked. Aside from Tampa, Cleveland does a pretty good job evaluating talent and trading. If you go back several years, they always get a good return. This is a cornerstone of a small market team and they have done this well. Farming outfielders, that is another story.
MikeEmbletonSmellsBad
Why would they trade Lindor when they are trying to contend?
jbigz12
Very simple why they would do that. Because they want to contend for more than just next season. With Lindor it’s a 1 shot game. Trading him is going to harm their chances next season. But if they receive enough value back in return for the next 4-5 years the Indians have proven that they’d take it. Could they win the WS next year with Lindor? Maybe. Could they win it without him? Smaller chance but it’s still a maybe. They aren’t going to be anywhere close to the favorites with or without him.
They lost this year. But even if you had Bauer and Clevinger. Bieber would’ve still gotten that start and gotten nuked. He was the best pitcher in baseball this year. Had they just kept Clevinger—I’m not sure he would’ve started over Carrasco anyway this year. But obviously the 2020 Indians would’ve been a tougher out with Bauer, Cleve and Bieber together.
jbigz12
The Indians management has taken the philosophy that they want let’s say a 20% chance at a title for many years rather than a 60% chance for 1 or 2. Given that they aren’t going to be a big spending team. The philosophy hasn’t resulted in a WS yet—- so it’s easy for people to come on here and criticize.
Until they win one—they’re going to keep getting ragged on for it. Is it the right call? I don’t know yet. Lots of teams have went “all in” and won nothing too. Don’t know if they would’ve won one with all the players they dealt away or not.
MikeEmbletonSmellsBad
What we do know is they haven’t won one since 1948 so clearly something isn’t working. And despite how people commenting on this thread will inevitably try and spin it, there is no way to trade Lindor and increase their chances for 2021.
debubba
My thought is that they are fielding a team each year that will get them into the playoffs. Just like the 2016 team, any team can get hot and go far. They can’t pay a player 35 million. In fact, look back to WS championship rosters who have won with a player with 30 million salary. It is often the Howie Kendrick or the Aaron Boone that make the difference. Although trading Lindor may hurt their chances, it hasn’t worked for a lot of teams…
Vince Camp
Keep Hernandez,Perez,and Hand, Let the others walk. Hand can be traded at some point. Also retain Roberto Perez. No way can he be as bad with the stick as he was this year. Get whatever you can for he smiling mercenary who plays short.
sufferforsnakes
Trade Hand in a package with Lindor.
cdav45
First off, nobody will pay Brad Hand $10M because he isn’t worth it. Especially in this diminished covid circumstance. So picking up his option would not be wise or prudent for an organization short on cash. The Indians should have traded him(if possible) this season and went with what they had remaining.
I don’t know if they’ll keep Perez. He is one that they could select his option and then trade him. He’s owed $5.5M next season and Hedges is owed $3.5M. There’s no way on earth that the Indians will pay 2 catchers that can’t hit $9M so someone will likely be gone IMO.
Hernandez is a damn nice ballplayer. Nothing extravagant, but solid in every aspect. He deserves a fair contract and I doubt the Indians will go that high because they have some younger players that are just about ready.
Lindor will be traded and the return should net this team a legitimate corner OFer and a couple of other pieces. If the Yankees are in then I would include Perez in the deal and target Frazier, Andujar, Green, and a minor leaguer. Frazier could take over RF, Andujar and Naylor can cover 1B and LF. Green makes an already potent BP better. The Yankees get the best SS and defensive C in the game.
hockeyjohn
I seriously doubt that Roberto Perez is traded. The Indians love his defense and the way he handles the pitching staff. The Indian catchers next season will likely be Perez backed up by Hedges. Cleveland is defense first at catcher.
bobtillman
They’ve had the advantage of not having a coastal money-printing machine in their division, and that the two big money teams (Chicago and Detroit) are taking their time getting competitive..(.I know, the White Sox are pretty good; took ’em long enough) But it seems the Indians have done a pretty good job of navigating small/mid market revenues and staying competitive; they’re “in it” every year. Overall, they strike me as being one of the more intelligent and reasonable FO’s out there.
jdgoat
I wouldn’t be surprised to see a full scale rebuild this offseason. They can’t afford to be mediocre for years after this core is gone.
Michael Chaney
They’ve traded a few of their veterans in the past few years specifically to avoid a full scale rebuild. That’s literally what Antonetti was hinting at when he said they’d be in much worse shape now otherwise. They’re young enough, have enough payroll flexibility, and have enough talent in the rotation that rebuilding isn’t needed even if they don’t seem good enough to win the division either.
Whether it’ll work or not remains to be seen, but their strategy has been to trade from areas of depth (the rotation) to acquire younger players and rebuild on the fly so that a full tear down isn’t ever necessary.
Besides, most of their “core” is already gone anyway; Santana won’t be coming at (maybe they’ll bring him back but his option is definitely getting declined). He and Lindor (who’s probably getting traded) are pretty much the only other significant members of the 2016 World Series roster left with the exception of Jose Ramirez and Carlos Carrasco who are both signed to affordable extensions.
3Men&ABibee
There will be changes. Santana and Hand’s option wont be picked up at that price (17.5 and 10 mil, respectfully). They don’t need Hand and Santana is too costly *he could resign back cheap) and we can open up 1b to put Naylor over there sometimes and Nolan Jones has a real shot next year. Lindor will also be gone. There would be no need to keep him and they can still get good pieces back. He look resigned to leaving and his “Indians are worth a billion dollars” stuff is getting old. The moment he mentioned 400 and 500 million, he sealed his future here. Indians won’t even come in the same galaxy as that and shouldn’t.. Bracho, Jones make him expendable.
Michael Chaney
The Indians really remind me of the Toronto Raptors when they still had Lowry and DeRozan together. They had more than enough talent to dominate the regular season, but it had gotten too stale and it was only after shaking up their core (i.e. trading DeRozan to get Kawhi) that they were actually able to win meaningful games consistently.
I definitely think that shakeup is coming this offseason, and I’d personally be shocked if Lindor is on the roster at the start of next year. They won’t rebuild, but I think that next season will be a one-year step back to see what they have with their younger guys. Chang will probably replace Lindor, Daniel Johnson will probably start in the outfield, and Bobby Bradley or Jake Bauers will probably replace Santana. They’ll also get Clase back to replace Hand in the back of the bullpen. Who knows if any of those guys will become solid regulars, but they need to give them an opportunity instead of patching holes with flawed veterans because it’s clear that they’re more than a piece away from winning a title.
They’ll be competitive regardless with that rotation, but I see next year as a temporary step back to see what they have in this core before they try to open a new competitive window in 2022.
Mishimacool
Mr. El Tiante…Indians *”seem” to be appears correct in that context. “Indians seems” is awkward. My two centavos.
JustCheckingIn
A good team with a 100M payroll who could be dynastic if their payroll was in the top 5 of the game
Imagine if they had held onto Bauer and Clev for their own run? They seem to be a team that’s satisfied being Good in an bland division and then praying the randomness of the Oct takes over
CKinSTL
Wouldn’t you say nearly all teams would be great if they consistently had a top-5 payroll?
For a team that is in the bottom-third of market size and payroll, it just isn’t realistic to have a top-5 payroll.
cdav45
If I ran the Indians I would be looking to shed the expensive contracts. Paying Lindor or anyone else $30M a yr for 10 years is a disaster waiting to happen. Santana’s option will not be picked up. Hand’s option will not be picked up. If Hernandez resigns it will be for a below market agreement. One of Perez or Hedges will be dealt. Naquin’s roster spot is in jeopardy. There’s going to be some serious turnover and I’m ready for it. I would fill this roster with as much young, inexpensive TALENT as possible. The Lindor trade will help and I wouldn’t be opposed to trading another SP to fill other needs, but ONLY if it fills those needs immediately, and it would not be any of Bieber, Plesac, or Quantrill.
hockeyjohn
I seriously doubt that Roberto Perez is traded. The Indians love his defense and the way he handles the pitching staff. The Indian catchers next season will likely be Perez backed up by Hedges. Cleveland is defense first at catcher.
cdav45
Again, I seriously doubt they pay 2 catchers that can’t hit $9M. It just doesn’t fit the narrative.