Two-way star Shohei Ohtani expressed discomfort in his right arm following today’s start against the Astros, per various reporters (including Rhett Bollinger of MLB.com). He’s been sent in for an MRI, the results of which have not yet come back.
There’s surely hope disaster will be avoided. But it’s tough not to be at least somewhat alarmed. Ohtani worked his way back to the mound this season following October 2018 Tommy John surgery. Yet he certainly hasn’t looked as dominant as he’d been.
Ohtani battled control problems throughout Summer Camp, and his two regular-season starts have been unmitigated disasters. He’s walked eight of sixteen batters faced, allowing seven runs in 1.2 innings along the way. Perhaps more worrisome, Ohtani’s velocity plummeted by the end of today’s outing, Bollinger points out (via Twitter). While he touched his customary 97 MPH at one point, his fastball was into the 89-90 MPH range before he departed, Bollinger notes. Of course, that could simply reflect fatigue at the end of a long, stressful inning or mere minor discomfort.
There’s little overstating the 26-year-old’s general importance in Anaheim. He’s proven an elite hitter since coming over from NPB. Even as he worked his way back to pitching from surgery, he didn’t miss a beat at the plate. He was similarly brilliant on the mound over his first 10 MLB starts (3.31 ERA/3.57 FIP in 51.2 innings), making him a key member of an uncertain Angels’ rotation. Surely, the hope remains his body will enable him to regain that remarkable form.
Damn
Prob COVID
His velocity did look down from what it was in 2018.
He hit 97 today.
The last at bat he barely touched 90 with the fastball
But the last batter he threw 90. Something looked off at the end
He wasn’t even touching 90 at the end of the second inning. His final 3 fastballs were 89.6 MPH, 89.1 MPH, and 89.7 MPH.
I don’t think velocity matters all that much when you can’t throw it over the plate.
Except hitters have a batting Average close to .375 on his fastball. That includes his rookie year. .080 average against the rest of his pitches. His fastball has zero movement.
Great, hopefully that’s not what got him hurt. Just let him hit from now on if he’s going to keep on getting hurt pitching. Not worth it
Sure. The Angels have plenty of pitching. They don’t need Ohtani to be their ACE.
But not good enough to compete for the division without Ohtani being at least a 2
unfortunately I was just thinking he may be hurt based on his recent performance
I was guessing that was coming. Astros radio broadcast was saying his fastball went down to 90 on his last hitter.
signing with the pitching graveyard of LAA doomed his career
Upvote
He still has a great career ahead as a hitter. If I were the Angels I would teach him to play 1B since the Angels don’t have one in the system. He wouldn’t have to throw much and has the athleticism to be an elite defender. This is more valuable than pitching once a week and not in the lineup for three straight days.
Not very many pitcher come back from TJS. When they do in takes a few years. He still can hit so might as well give him a year off and just play 1B.
Actually tons of pitchers come back successfully from TJS, including the reigning two time Cy Young award winner Jacob DeGrom. It’s a very successful operation and most pitchers are back to full strength within 15-18 months at the most. TOS and rotator cuff surgeries are much more risky to a pitcher’s career than TJS.
DeGrom has TJ surgery 10 years. It took 7 years after it for him to be dominant
There is not tons of pitchers that come back from it. There are tons that never pitch again. Many minor leaguers have TJS and never pitch again. Again most is the wrong word. 1 in 3 make it back and only a few pitch as well as they did before.
Cite sources on “not many pitchers return from TJS”. Because you cant.
Pitching philosophy i guess has nothing to do with domination by a pitcher….
….wow, the level of comment quality in this article is way low today….talk abliut false narratives…
That is a simply foolish statement to make. Increasingly, pitchers have TJ surgery in college or even high school. those who play at the pro level would be a direct contradiction to your bold statement.
Yeah, unfortunately I think Ohtani has more value as just a hitter or a pitcher than try to make both work.
Historically, Anaheim is actually a pitching haven. Unfortunately, the pressure to win now has had them bringing up too many pitchers with arm concerns during the last decade. It’s another byproduct of moving away from their farm system earlier in the decade in favor of expensive veterans.
It’s another byproduct of moving away from their farm system earlier in the decade in favor of expensive veterans.
Best/most spot on quote of the day for any MLBTR article today
Time to have him learn to play 1st, and keep him hitting daily. Scrap the pitching. He’s much more valuable hitting every day.
Why have him learn first? He’s already a well trained outfielder. Scrap the pitching and you’ve got yourself an AS Outfielder
The Angels don’t have room in the OF. Jo Adell is a future star and Brandon Marsh is gonna be right there with him. Trout isn’t going anywhere, and Upton is there too. He can DH and get in the field every once in a while.
Yea people saying OF are completely off –
This org needs to get Adell Marsh on the field as contributors for payroll reasons as well.- They need good cheap arb players like no other.
Id have Albert try and teach him first next year on his way out the door- They could just alternate
Jo Adell is not a future star, he is a prospect. He is a very good prospect that COULD become a future star, but for now he is just a prospect. Same with Marsh. There have been tons of prospects like those two that did not become future stars. For the Angels, Brandon Wood and Dallas McPherson come to mind.
Ohtani is there now. They are paying him now. He is a proven big league hitter and could play RF now. I don’t think Ohtani is a guaranteed All Star outfielder like the OP, but he could definitely be a quality starter. Most of his mystique is tied to him being a two-way player. Take that away and he is a good, not great, hitter.
He hit 51% and 23% above the league average as a hitter. He was an excellent outfielder in Japan w/ all the tools to transition to a very good OF here. His “mystique” isn’t because he does both. He hits extremely well.
If anyone should move to 1B it should be Upton and his -15 DRS -8 OAA.
He’s clearly lost a step out there. The Angels were willing to dangle Brandon Marsh for pitching this offseason. He could be a valuable chip to do so at the deadline. Particularly if Ohtani isn’t going to be the pitcher they need.
Seems like more of an OF if he is going to start hitting regularly, no?
Not a good sign when trying to come back from TJ surgery. Hopefully it’s not anything serious.
I remember back at the begining of 2018 many thought he would have to drop hitting. I hope this isn’t the case but he might have to drop pitching. If he’s still having trouble keeping his velo up, maybe they can try and salvage his two-way status by making him a relief pitcher.
i like that idea. as much as his pitching talent alone is better than his hitting, (in my observation) he might be more productive that way.
If his velocity doesn’t play up as a starter why would it be any better out of the pen. I would leave him off the mound this little season and play him in the outfield or 1B. He is still an excellent hitter. I think 1B would be better since there is a lot less throwing, also the Angels don’t have a future option there.
He had the velo in the first inning, but not the second.
what mlb said, plus when guys transition to the bullpen they tend to add a few ticks to their heater. shorter outings mean higher effort pitches
And less innings on their arm. So far with Tommy John and now this, they might want to limit him to only two or three innings.
Bad sign, but maybe its not serious. Hoping for the best for him.
Yikes.
If this MRI goes bad and he needs any serious time off, that opens the door for Trout to opt out. Would be very little play for at that point, outside of a nominal amount of money……for Trout.
Lol. Who you do you write for Steve Colbert?
Never seen “Stephen Colbert” spelled that way.
I’m guessing you’ve seen his show pop up on your channel guide and that’s about it, eh?
Steve!! HA
You don’t give up on someones pitching that fast. Someone who has top of the rotation arsenal. It might be scar tissue from the surgery..This is actually his spring training. He was supposed to pitch for a minor league team during the season on days he wasn’t in the line up. This was before the Covid-19.issue put the whole 2020 season in jeopardy.
Johnny Bets- You might be right. I watch either Kimmel and Fallon. With your “Eh” at the end of your question. I’m going to take a guess you’re you Canadian and you watch Larry Siegel or Sammy Maudlin on SCTV?????eh?
Not a Canadian! But I did manage to ruffle up your California feathers pretty easily. There’s a number of easy jokes there but I’ll take the high road!
He is going to opt out in this economy? Guaranteed 37 milliom until 2030, that’s not going to happen.
I said this before the season (And got killed by Angel fans especially our friend Halo 11) but they should have never sent him to the mound this year especially right out the gates-
It kind of reeks of desperation but I kind of get it- They have the best player in the World and he’s gaining in on service years vs playoff abs every year. I dont think Arte Moreno has a clue what he’s doing long term
It has been nearly 2 full years since he had TJS. I don’t think any doctor would have cautioned against him pitching this year. This is some real captain hindsight business
I guess you missed his spring entirely –
My reasons at the time was he did not have enough time to fully get stretched out and ready- He was thrown straight into the fire and my fear was he was going to get hurt b/c of that
Real talk John… I like Ohtani btw as well, wish they would have waited and let him work himself into form during this season thru pen sessions etc and maybe get a little lite work midseason outta the pen….. But they are playing behind the 8 ball and that makes you take some bad shots that usually ending up costing you more in the end.
Obv yes, but I no Captain I will say
Nobody had enough to time to get ready for the shortened season.
I agree with you Ryan to a point…
Ohtani def didnt have enough time and there was evidence the first time he threw 50 pitches 43 were balls in a side session – From there they should have been on further high alert and not pushed the envelope….but they did partly IMO b/c they are really desperate to get back to the playoffs with Trout. They even viewed this year as an ‘All In ” year. Ido belive as I stated he should have gotten some work this year but not starting him the 5th game of the season full go….A low leverage inn or two outta the pen after a couple weeks of pen sessions is how I would have gone about it
To go even further into this subject of sports/readiness …Id be REALLY concerned if I was an NFL player this season…If it goes down we are going to see injuries like we’ve never seen before and thats quite alarming with such a high bar that football sets
These guys play at a level/speed/force that they need every minute they get in camp to prepare- Its going to be an infirmary out there this year if they get on the field
I think they followed widely accepted practices for players coming back from TJS. Can’t baby guys forever
You have to put him out there and see what happens. If pitching is not in the cards then he can just be an everyday player.
Time for him to change gloves and start playing OF again. He played RF in Japan.
He hasn’t played right field consistently since he was 18 and hasn’t even played an inning there since 2014. However he does have the athletic ability that if he needed to play it, he probably could.
I am sure he could easily transition to another position. It looks like pitching is not in his future.
Too fragile at this point. cut bait and say goodbye
Wut
@ Human Rain Delay-spot on.
Plus,what idiot left him in for 42 pitches in one inning? Is that true?
OH its true David Frost, I watched every PAINFUL moment of it as well yelling at my computer screen to get the guy outta there
Its just insane under these circumstances they pushed this- I get the Angels fans being optimistic pre-season but the org saw all this in spades before it happened and looked the other way
Hindsight is 20/20 but I am so grateful this guy snubbed the Yankees. Best LAA can hope for is that he can be a decent, healthy hitter only going forward.
Why? He’s still a threat with the bat and pretty affordable.
If James Paxton turns things around as expected the Halos should try to sign him in the off-season. Thinking $90 million for 5 years should get that done. The Angels need pitching obviously or they will never become the Yankees.
Both of Paxton’s starts have been disasters this season and he would probably get even worse if he went to the Angels
I doubt Paxton gets half that and Im being completely honest
The idea that Paxton gets more than 4 prepaid bus tickets to and from the MiLB team city is laughable.
@jakethesnizake- yes, so glad Ohtani snubbed the Yankees also. He is so talented. But will he ever be able to stay healthy? Maybe, if he stops pitching and just stays hitting like your saying. The pitching is just not working out unless he just becomes a reliever.
Time to give up the pitching part of it and just let him hit. The dude can rake. Let him.
Ohtani’s arm is toast. Let him play the field and hit everyday before he really gets hurt
Harder to find good sp Than of
Hope they will be fine
This is terrible for the game of baseball. He had/has the opportunity to be the best athlete in the history of the game. I fear he may soon just be a hitter. It’s not a terrible problem to have when you “only” have a middle of the order bat, but it sucks when you could have a middle of the order bat and an ace caliber pitcher.
Wow…”had/has the opportunity to be the best athlete in the history of the game”?????? That’s an insult to all the great players of the past and present who have earned that description not just gotten the label because they are an oddity (2 way player) that the game has not seen in quite some time…….
Between you comment and Franco’s description of Ohtani as an “elite hitter” who has batted .285 and .286 (since when is .285 elite?) throwing out this years stats completely, and his “brilliance on the mound” with a 2 season ERA of 3.31.(10 whole starts)……according to Franco also you would think we’re reading about a cross between Mike Trout batting and Chris Sale/Gerritt Cole throwing the ball……man, a seemingly good and talented player if he can stay on the field but stop with the “greatest hitter/pitcher of the decade stuff and other platitudes which to date are way over the top!
Ya, the guy who is a middle of the order bat and has the potential to be a top of the rotation pitcher wouldn’t be the best athlete? Batting average also isn’t a stat to determine if someone is elite or not, so it’s pretty hard to take this comment seriously.
I don’t know if they need to call off the pitching for good either. Maybe you call it off in this short whatever we have season this year. Or you use him as a reliever and an outfielder in the future. I wouldn’t give up on the idea entirely after 2 horrendous starts in a very strange season.
Ohtani has the best arm on the Angels. Is the Fastest player and has the most Power.
He’s the best athlete I’ve ever seen play baseball. That doesn’t make him the best player. But he’s faster than Grifffey, has a better arm than Griffey and has more power than Griffrey.
I’m just using Griffey as an example. I’m not saying he’s close to the player Ken Griffey was. I’m just saying the guy has that much talent.
Im with the GOAT on this one-
He’s definetely one of the most intriguing players we have in all sports this century
The Angels really harmed the org today as well as all baseball fans
Bo Jackson and Deion Sanders?
Bo Jackson couldn’t throw like Ohtani. Sanders didn’t have the power or the arm.
Funny thing about Jackson, you could throw a fast ball right by him. It’s why Ohtani is a much better hitter.
Bo Jackson had a great arm. I think you need to amend your statement that Jackson couldn’t *pitch* like Ohtani.
Bo Jackson’s arm was good, it’s not Ohtani’s. Bo Jackson was never baseball quick. Never got good jumps in the outfield. Never got good jumps on steals. And had trouble with heat.
But he was very fast, had a good arm, and had tremendous power.
That Home Run he hit in Anaheim. I may have been the closest person in Stadium to where that landed. I would have probably gotten that darn ball had an usher not told me to stay off the tarp during BP.
This was a big PR/hype signing a couple years ago. We knew he was developing arm problems when we signed him. It’s unfortunate because he’s so talented.
With or without Ohtani thinking Halos are not a playoff team anyway. I have the A’s winning the division and the Cheaters winning a wild card this season. Hopefully Texas wins a wild car instead of the best cheaters ever. We’ll see
The Astros are in as much trouble with their pitching as the Angels are. None of the remaining 3 teams have any aspect of their game that would make them a postseason lock. The AL West is up for grabs again. Finally.
Long term wise Oak has a nice stranglehold on this Div with its starting pitching but rolling with sub 70 mill payrolls every year makes it dicey year in year out
I think Sea will spend in 2022 and get back in the hunt soon thereafter
Ana always has a punchers chance
Texas needs help
Houston is going to spiral and open this whole thing up to be the wild wild west
Why is he called a two way star when he has done almost nothing
Because he’s done a lot for the Angels given his playing time.
He had a successful 2 way career in Japan before signing with the Angels.
Because he’s the only player in history with ten starts, ten HRs and ten SBs in the same season.
Oh tani!
Duh
We all saw this when teams tried to lure him, especially after the medical came out
two-way Star? yeah right, this guy isn’t a pitcher, just play DH AND that’s it
Just because he had TJS and is struggling in his return from that doesn’t mean he’s not a pitcher. How many players on your team ever put up good numbers as a hitter and then turned around and took the mound and put up effective numbers as a starter? None!
I would not want to be an Angel’s fan right now. Ohtani is such an enticing player you just want to see it all out together in one season. We were all kidding ourselves if we dreamt of Ohtani getting 30 starts/500 AB’s, but even a more realistic 20 Starts/300 AB’s would be interesting and fun to watch.
Wow…reading Franco’s description of Ohtani as an “elite hitter” who has batted .285 and .286 throwing out this years stats completely, and his “brilliance on the mound” with a 2 season ERA of 3.31……according to Franco also you would think we’re reading about a cross between Mike Trout batting and Chris Sale/Gerritt Cole throwing the ball……man, nice player but stop with the platitudes which to date are way over the top!
Maybe not elite. But his wRC+ the last two years is better than Acuna, Better than Rizzo. Equal with Springer.
But what do I expect when someone uses batting average as a guide.
Haters will continue to hate.
They should just make him an everyday player. This season is too short to continue waiting.
Shut down his pitching. No sense risking him in this farce.
Assuming Ohtani’s arm is ok, we have to remember two things:
1) He has not pitched in a MLB game for nearly two years (Sept 2018); and
2) He has only thrown 75 innings the past 3.5 years – 25 in 2017, 50 in 2018, zero in 2019 and 1 2/3 this year thru July.
Again, current arm problems aside, Ohtani is going to need some time to get back to 100% mentally and physically on a MLB mound.
Good luck, Shohei.
I said when they announced his timetable that they were bringing him back too quickly.
“Two-way star Shohei Ohtani” Really; says who? What’s Ohtani done in the MLB to be a “star?” To the rest of us he looks like another over-hyped Japanese baseball player who is an injury prone average baseball player..
Not much really – only pitched to 3.31 ERA with 11k/9 through his first 10 starts while hitting 40 HR / 123 RBI’s at a .285 average through his first 200 games in the majors. But yeah, he’s another overhyped and overrated Japanese player.
Excuses for why he has been pitching like GARBAGE.
Yea.. injuries are typically the first round(s) of excuses when ur paid like him
Ohtani didn’t get signed to a multi million multi year contract. He gets paid the minimum. Like all pre-arb players in the game. Rules changed before he signed.
The Angels gave him a 2.3M signing bonus. And 20M to his NPB team to obtain his rights.
What are you talking about?
The guy is made of glass, I swear
This guy who is made of glass hit two home runs the day he found out he needed TJ surgery.
The rehab from TJ surgery is so long and can not be rushed or shipped. I would guess batting while in TJZ recovery is not recommended. Angels manager is nor known for taking care of pitchers. Dusty Baker is another who goes thru pitcher like a buzzsaw.
The Angels manager who didn’t take care of Ohtani was Mike Scoscia in 2018.
You are going to have to explain how. He only twice threw over 100 pitches and never pitched on less than six days rest.
Even if Ohtani isn’t anything more than an average 3 starter like a Max Fried or Joe Musgrove, he’ll still be extremely valuable as long as he keeps batting like he has the past two seasons.
Yep fully agree. I’d even say an above average 4 if he can keep his bat going would be great. Would win you a lot more than an average 4th man.
Oh what a surprise. I scouted ohtani to be a right fielder only before he signed. His arm and shoulder will not hold up long term inMLB.
That would seem inevitable. Which means he won’t be serviceable as a right fielder if he continues to pitch, correct? By the way, the days between Ohtani’s pitching starts were continually altered when he was a Major League rookie. Whether that came from Scioscia or someone else, Ohtani wasn’t done any favors. Granted, this seems destined to end poorly regardless. There are reasons we don’t see two-way players in MLB. Sadly, the Angels seem too caught up in the novelty of the idea to see it. The marketing potential is not reality.
Cey Hey, Ohtani almost always pitched on Sundays. I’m not sure if he has pitched on any other day.
Anyway, right now, except for Ohtani, the Angels starters have been very good.
Without Ohtani, they may move to a five man rotation with Patrick Sandoval taking the fifth spot.
And of course, with Ohtani in the lineup, the lineup gets better. This is not the end of the world.
Halo11Fan, here are the dates of his first nine 2018 starts. The tenth was the unsuccessful return on Sunday, September 2. I’ve always thought the “retired” Mike Scioscia took the sword for his mishandling.
April 1 (Sunday)
April 8 (Sunday)
April 17 (Tuesday)
April 24 (Tuesday)
May 6 (Sunday)
May 13 (Sunday)
May 20 (Sunday)
May 30 (Wednesday)
June 6 (Wednesday)
They needed to find out where they were with him in September.
I don’t like Scioscia but you can’t blame him for Ohtani getting hurt.
Were they suppose to wait the entire year and then get TJ in 2019?
Really Jimmetree? Because virtually everyone else wasn’t sure he’d be able to hit.
Not uncommon for pitchers returning from TJS to get aches and pains in their elbow and forearm when they start pitching in games. These starts would normally be occurring during a rehab assignment in the minors. No need to panic…yet.
Expecting the worst and hoping for the best health for him. I was really looking forward to seeing him pitch and pitch well.
Another note, people are citing that he was a tremendous outfielder in Japan. That may have been but how can he possibly play the outfield with a jacked up arm? He can’t. He’s going to be the DH full-time and hopefully he can learn first base. Maybe, maybe down the road he can try again in the outfield.
Ohtani just turned 26. Technically this is his 25 year old season. This is Puk, 25 year old season…. just for perspective.
“Don’t worry, we have an ace in Othani and our staff is great”.
Said every Angels fan here.
Are Angel fans ready to re-join reality?
I don’t think anyone said don’t worry.
However, Bundy 2.84 ERA. Canning 3.38 ERA, Heaney 2.79 ERA. Sandoval 2.25 ERA.
What team are you a fan of? Do they have four starters like that?
I heard a lot of fans who said don’t worry about the A’s. Fiers 5.40, Manea 7.0. Megden 6.75 And of course Puk hasn’t pitched and Luzardo who doesn’t have a start. Luzardo also allowed two runs that were credited as unearned because of a gift by the official scorer.
But don’t wory about the A’s starting staff. They are fine.
Small sample. But please feel free to let us simpletons know why the Angels can’t be beat with their unbeatable pitching.
Of course it’s small sample. But it’s amazing how the A’s staff is worry free but the Angels staff is horrible. Montas PED user, Puk hurt. Luzardo not a single major league start. Manea.. hurt.
But Ohtani, no small sample size… Got it.
No consistency at all.
It’s pitching… Worry about almost everyone. There is no such thing as a worry free pitcher.
are you serious bro? 3-7 record would indicate otherwise. And you’re cherrypicking 2 ok starts by Bundy who’s got a career 4.7 FIP and ERA+ of 95. GTFOH, jabroni!
The Angels starting pitching has been good. Are you serious?
As far as Bundy pitching in Camden Yards, he wasn’t very good. So you know the future? Good to know. What pitchers are going to be good. What pitchers are going to be bad. What stock should I buy.
But what I want to know more than anything is what team do you root for.
Wild Bill you are just talking out of your rear end regarding what you allege “All” Angels fans said. Get real.
Small sample. But please feel free to let us simpletons know why the Angels can’t be beat with their unbeatable pitching.
Small sample size did not cause one A’s fan a moment of pause.
So Wild Bill, what’s your team? Is there pitching staff worry free?