The small market Rays have long been proactive on the trade market. That’s been the club’s preferred method of fielding competitive rosters while maintaining one of the league’s lowest payrolls. That can sometimes require moves unpopular with the fan base, although like any team, the Rays have had their fair share of wins (and a few losses).
Since the Rays promoted Erik Neander to GM in 2016, the front office has been active as ever on the trade market. We’ll look back at the GM’s trade history (excluding the most minor swaps) over that time, with a full breakdown of each at the included links. With two of Neander’s former top lieutenants now running AL rivals (Chaim Bloom in Boston and James Click in Houston), it’ll be fascinating to see how the club proceeds once they’re again able to make transactions.
2016-2017 Offseason
- Acquired OF Mallex Smith, LHP Ryan Yarbrough, and INF Carlos Vargas from Mariners for LHP Drew Smyly
- Acquired RHP José De León from Dodgers for INF Logan Forsythe
- Acquired C Jesús Sucre from Mariners in exchange for cash considerations.
2017 Season
- Acquired SS Adeiny Hechavarría from Marlins for RHP Ethan Clark and OF Braxton Lee
- Acquired RHP Chaz Roe from Braves for cash or player to be named later
- Acquired RHP Sergio Romo from Dodgers for cash or a player to be named later
- Acquired LHP Dan Jennings from White Sox for 1B Casey Gillaspie
- Acquired 1B Lucas Duda from Mets for RHP Drew Smith
- Acquired RHP Steve Cishek from Mariners for RHP Erasmo Ramírez
- Acquired RHP Tobias Myers from Orioles for INF Tim Beckham
2017-2018 Offseason
- Acquired RHP Curtis Taylor from Diamondbacks for RHP Brad Boxberger
- Acquired INF Joey Wendle from Athletics for C Jonah Heim
- Acquired INF Christian Arroyo, OF Denard Span, RHP Stephen Woods, and LHP Matt Krook from Giants for 3B Evan Longoria and cash considerations
- Acquired 1B C.J. Cron from Angels for INF Luis Rengifo
- Acquired INF Jermaine Palacios from Twins for RHP Jake Odorizzi
- Acquired LHPs Anthony Banda and Colin Poche from Diamondbacks for Steven Souza Jr., INF Nick Solak from Yankees (Diamondbacks also traded INF Brandon Drury to Yankees for RHP Taylor Widener)
- Acquired RHP Daniel Hudson, INF Tristan Gray, and cash considerations from Pirates for OF Corey Dickerson
2018 Season
- Acquired RHPs Andrew Moore and Tommy Romero from Mariners for OF Denard Span and RHP Alex Colomé
- Acquired 1B Ji-Man Choi from Brewers for INF Brad Miller and cash consideratiosn
- Acquired LHP Jalen Beeks from Red Sox for RHP Nathan Eovaldi
- Acquired C Michael Pérez and RHP Brian Shaffer from Diamondbacks for RHP Matt Andriese
- Acquired cash or a player to be named later from Phillies for C Wilson Ramos
- Acquired RHP Tyler Glasnow, OF Austin Meadows, and RHP Shane Baz from Pirates for RHP Chris Archer
- Acquired OF Tommy Pham and international bonus pool money from Cardinals for OF Justin Williams, LHP Genesis Cabrera, and RHP Roel Ramirez
- Acquired RHP Matt Seelinger from Pirates for SS Adeiny Hechavarría
2018-2019 Offseason
- Acquired C Mike Zunino, OF Guillermo Heredia, and LHP Michael Plassmeyer from the Mariners for OF Mallex Smith and OF Jake Fraley
- Acquired 3B Yandy Díaz and RHP Cole Sulser from Indians in three-team trade sending 1B/OF Jake Bauers to Indians and $5MM to Mariners (Mariners also traded 1B Carlos Santana and $6MM to Indians; Indians traded DH Edwin Encarnación and Competitive Balance draft pick to Mariners)
- Acquired RHP Emilio Pagán and Competitive Balance Round A draft pick from Athletics, RHP Rollie Lacy from Rangers in three-team trade sending LHPs Brock Burke and Kyle Bird and RHP Yoel Espinal to Rangers (Rangers also traded INF Jurickson Profar to Athletics; Athletics traded SS Eli White and international bonus pool money to Rangers)
- Acquired RHP Oliver Drake from the Blue Jays for cash considerations
2019 Season
- Acquired C Travis d’Arnaud from Dodgers for cash considerations
- Acquired RHP Peter Fairbanks from Rangers for INF Nick Solak
- Acquired INF Eric Sogard from Blue Jays for two players to be named later
- Acquired outfielder Ruben Cardenas and $250K of international bonus pool space from Indians for RHP Hunter Wood and IF Christian Arroyo
- Acquired 1B Jesús Aguilar from Brewers for RHP Jake Faria
- Acquired OF Niko Hulsizer from Dodgers for LHP Adam Kolarek
- Acquired RHPs Nick Anderson and Trevor Richards from Marlins for RHP Ryne Stanek and OF Jesus Sanchez
2019-2020 Offseason
- Acquired OF Hunter Renfroe and SS Xavier Edwards from Padres for OF Tommy Pham and INF/RHP Jake Cronenworth
- Acquired 1B/OF José Martínez and OF Randy Arozarena from Cardinals for LHP Matthew Liberatore, C Edgardo Rodriguez, and a Competitive Balance Round B draft pick
- Acquired OF Manuel Margot and C Logan Driscoll from Padres for RHP Emilio Pagán
- Acquired cash considerations from Reds for RHP José De León
- Acquired 1B Brian O’Grady from Reds for cash considerations
How would you grade Neander’s wheeling and dealing as the Rays’ baseball ops head? (Link to poll for mobile app users)
Interested in how other GMs hold up under this exercise? We’ve covered Diamondbacks GM Mike Hazen, recently fired Astros president Jeff Luhnow, Brewers president of baseball ops David Stearns, Angels GM Billy Eppler, Rockies GM Jeff Bridich, Tigers GM Al Avila, Braves GM Alex Anthopoulos, Blue Jays GM Ross Atkins, Mariners’ GM Jerry Dipoto, Phillies’ GM Matt Klentak, and Dodgers’ GM Andrew Friedman as well.
A+
Since he can claim he got another GM fired I am with you.
John Coppolella gets an A+++ then for getting Dave Stewart, John Hart, and himself fired complete with a lifetime ban.
I’d say B. They got a lot of good players for nothing but they’ve also traded quite a few good players for nothing over the years. It’s going to be interesting how the three big trades this past offseason play out. All three look to have some serious high risk, high reward qualities for all involved.
What trades would you consider bad trades?
I have a few great to unheard of trades he has made during his time
If he doesn’t deserve an A I don’t think any GM does
Dickerson stands out on first notice, as does Ramos, Odo, Colome, Fraley/Smith, Solak, Wood/Arroyo, Pagan, De Leon. not a lot of big losses but most of those trades were lopsided nonetheless. Solak in specific could really hurt in time.
Smith and Fraley combine had a -1.0 WAR last year.
Just Zunino alone is worth that. This isn’t even considering Plassmeyer
so? Zunino isnt exactly good himself, and fraley was just a rookie last year.
The trade is Plassmeyer vs Farley
The rest are moving parts
But I would take a catcher over the others because he has value
Considering DeLeon was dangled months earlier in a potential trade for peak Brian Dozier I would not consider him a loss when you’re giving up Logan Forsythe.
Peter Fairbanks has great stuff. Ridiculous to call the Solak trade a loss after a few months. Fairbanks could have a Nick Anderson-type breakout in ‘20/‘21
Gave up Dickerson, Odorizzi, and Renifgo for nothing really and I think the Zunino trade will likely end off bad because of Fraley.
I agree about Odo.
The Seattle trade. Plassmeyer so far looks decent.
Regarding Fraley. I don’t think he has that much upside. Someone I saw in college.
Smith could find himself out of baseball or as a pitch runner pretty soon .
Dickerson and odo were pure salary dumps. The Rays didn’t exactly try and maximize the value of those players they strictly wanted out of the money owed.
If they actually were salary dumps, that’s just bad asset management. They only saved a hair under 2 million on Dickerson after giving up a lot for him, and Odorizzi was controllable, cheap, and not locked in to any contract. That’s actually worse in hindsight if they weren’t targeting value.
No it’s because Jake Odorizzi just came off a season where he posted a 5.43 FIP and TB’s front office thought it was unloading a depreciating asset. TB runs out about a 60 million dollar payroll and they clearly didn’t think Odorizzi was worth 10% of that. Which at the time didn’t look like a terrible call. The Rays try to sell at peak value and work under constraints like most other teams do not.
You can’t grade Neander like a GM who operates with a 150+ million dollar payroll. I think people are doing that. With the money he has to play with—I think he’s an easy A as a GM
Exactly my point, odo was coming off a couple seasons of disappointing play and pay was only getting more expensive. And I wouldn’t say he’s been a rockstar for the Twins, he’s been decent but would still have no room in the Rays rotation right now so it was a easy move
Are you kidding? Trading Matt Liberatore was idiotic! Trading Tommy Pham was really dumb as well. With those trades alone, I can’t give him an A. There are others as well… giving away Jose deLeon, DFA’ing Cory Dickerson, they got nothing for Alex Colome.
I was thinking B- He won a lot of trades but did some real bone-headed stuff too
This is where you go off the rails. If you want to assess trades and draft picks, you need to give them a few years. I like the Pham trade a lot for TB, but it too early to tell if they won that trade or not.
Yep. What if Tommy Pham struggles big time this year? He is 32 years old now and he has a degenerative eye condition. His defensive grades completely eroded last season as well.
There’s absolutely no way to know how that deal will work out today. Guys get better or worse with different coaching as well. The FO could very easily see a flaw in Renfroe’s swing that they want to change and makes it all the difference. We really don’t know til the games are played.
FWIW, as a RS fan, I really wanted Renfroe as part of a Betts’s trade. Before he got hurt last year, he was absolutely killing the ball, and is a plus-fielder.
I was actually annoyed that TB got to him before we did (though I still like our LA trade). I’d bet real money, and no small amount, that his 4-year WAR with TB is higher than Pham’s 2-year WAR with SD. Not close, imo.
With the coronavirus potentially throwing a wrench in to future arb contract’s maybe he’ll stay in Tampa Bay for longer than I thought. But I’d say Renfroe has a maximum of 2 seasons in TB before he prices himself out of there. HRS pay and even if the rest of his hitting profile doesn’t get there—those arb salaries are going to get too high for TB’s liking. Especially with what they’ll probably have to put out for a guy like Glasnow.
That’s the TB M.O. In 2-3 years, they will trade Renfroe for yet one more good young player.
Yeah. As long as he develops the rest of his offensive game. If he doesn’t—he’ll be a straight salary dump.
I agree. I too gave him a solid B
I agree on the B. All I know is TB is sucking wind in my OOTP 21 season so far. Out 20 games in June. Of course Glasnow went down for the season 2-3 weeks ago. Snell is 4-6 and Yarbrough is 1-6. McKay is 5-4, Morton 5-8, and Richards 1-2. Anderson has 11 saves when the league leader has 18.
You’re doing baseball takes now?
its hard to give full credit (or blame) to Neander given the power structure between him, Bloom, and Click. that being said, there are a lot more hits than misses here.
The meadows, baz, and Glasnow automatically puts him at an A until something equally horrible happens
that Souza trade was highway robbery
i just cant quite give this an A. lot of good moves, but also a few where returns were really light. giving up Wood, Arroyo, Solak, DeLeon, Dickerson, Ramos, and a few others for essentialy table scraps doesnt seem all that appealing.
Because you are making decisions on trades that haven’t yet to be determined
A lot of these trades you already have a concrete decision on still haven’t been proven one way or another
hindsight is 20/20. if you trade a guy for nothing and he gets injured than you’re in the clear, but if it was clear the guy had more value when you traded him you should’ve gotten more value. selling high for current value knowing a guy will lose value soon after if is the mark of a great GM. again, take De Leon. cash in return for anyone is essentially nothing, and while he might be injured for the rest of his career and provide such lacking value, it’s hard to argue he’s worth nothing at the current moment.
You have the 40 man roster
I don’t follow Tampa close enough but I probably could find the reason for the trade
They couldn’t keep most of those guys you listed because they had better guys on the 40 man. Deleon, Arroyo are probably going to be absolutely nothing as major leaguers. Wood was another roster casualty. He hasn’t exactly had enough time in the big leagues to say much. Wilson Ramos was a rental that they dealt for salary purposes. He was coming off a major knee surgery and had only about a half season of ABS.
He’s done well. The Liberatore trade is the only one I see on here with the potential to really bite him. The Solak deal might end up being a loss. But you’re talking about a guy who can’t field at all and the Rays had a logjam of guys that cover the positions Solak attempts to.
Don’t underestimate Martinez.
Watch the NLCS last year. He was the only player for the Cardinals even hitting elite pitching.
Jose Martinez is a player whose numbers declined because they didn’t have a spot for him.
As much as I am a fan of Matt Carpenter I feel like the game passed him by. The Cardinals would have been smart to keep Martinez as their RF.
Jose Martinez could’ve been had for a lot less than Matthew Liberatore. If there’s one trade that could bite them, like the German Marquez trade, that’s the one.
Martinez is a good but not great bat only player. They don’t cost top pitching prospects. Martinez also isn’t 26 or 27–the guy is pushing 32. You have 3 years of control but it’s not exactly prime seasons. If the Rays end up becoming victorious in that deal,I believe, it will be because of Randy Arozarena.
The 3 years remaining is the key for a team like Rays
You can’t judge every trade the same for every team.
If Martinez can produce to a 900 OPS level the next three years for Tampa it doesn’t matter what RA does.
If martinez could do that—it’d be the first in his career. He’s 32 years old and looks like he’s going to be used in a platoon with Tsutsogo. I have a very hard time believing the Rays will win the trade if Jose Martinez is a solid platoonDH and Liberatore gets anywhere close to his ceiling.
Just not going to get me to agree with that. Liberatore’s 6+ seasons have far more value to a club like the Rays, as you point out. Unless Lib is a complete flop—I believe they’ll need some production from Arozarena to win this one.
Which again, isn’t really the main point. If they just wanted Jose Martinez—the Cardinals would’ve traded him for less than Matthew Liberatore. You just can’t tell me that’s the cost of an exiting his prime DH.
You are just completely missing the point
Rays are trying to win now..
So they will make moves that could add to their club.
Martinez can hit. For the money compared to the production he has had it is worth the trade.
They can’t just go sign someone to a big deal they have to look for cheap players who could possibly produce.
Could backfire or could be a win.
Just the Dynamics of a team like Tampa that is trying to win in the current
You’re missing the point. Jose Martinez doesn’t cost Matthew Liberatore. The Rays had to trade Matthew Liberatore in large part due to acquiring Randy Arozarena.
Unless you’re telling me that Jose Martinez is now the world’s most expensive to acquire platoon bat in history.
Guys like that don’t fetch premium prospects like Liberatore. I am fully aware that they could win the trade. But this is the deal that they could potentially lose big. That’s fairly clear.
Your original claim was that it was a bad trade.
I brought Martinez up because it is well known that RA has possible upside.
Like I said in the beginning don’t underestimate Martinez because I have seen him hit elite pitching.
The point is that Tampa is trying to win in the current that is why you bring in Martinez.
Yes the core of the trade is RA for Liberatore
No I didn’t say that. I said that was the one that could bite them. Not that it was a sure fire bad trade. It’s obviously the one that has the potential to hurt the worst. The rest of their trades involve guys w/ little team control or ex-prospects like Solak with ceilings that aren’t anywhere close to what a guy like Liberatore has.
They weren’t afraid to admit publicly they think RA could be a very above average major league producer. And he’s crushed the ball at every single level he’s played and this spring. With the way the Rays produce pitchers, acquiring a controllable long term middle of the order bat and elite defender is a trade you make every single time
You don’t typically trade one of your best relievers and acquire another CF a month later and block Arozarena either though. Those moves together look highly questionable. I understand they’re trying to buy low on Margot and sell high on Pagan—it just doesn’t look real good when you trade all that for RA (who is 25 and has a season and a half of highly successful AAA abs) then block him.
The Rays had to trade Matthew Liberatore in large part due to acquiring Randy Arozarena.
————————————
This is why it is impossible to include a trade like this in evaluating Neander’s trade performance. TB upgraded from a 2nd round supplemental to a 1st rounder, added a promising Cuban, and added a pro player, in exchange for a single A player with a 3.6 BB9 that FG ranks as a 50FV,
Anyone who thinks they have enough insight to judge this trade, is just kidding themselves.
I agree, Joe. That is why I said this deal is the one with the potential to bite them.
But also Arozarena is 25 years old, has ample AAA experience and yet the Rays still traded for another CF. That’s where my overall skepticism of the deal comes. Not that we can grade the deal today but we do have a pretty good idea that Liberatore could’ve been used to add major league talent to the Rays roster today. They’re choosing to keep the guy they acquired down in the minors.
Yeah the only problem is they definitely undersell sometimes for seemingly no reason. Nothing that kills the franchise but still not good. B+
All the players you just names pretty much had very little value at time of trades. Arroyo, wood, deleon all have 0 major league success and most likely never will. Dickerson was a salary/ roster casualty he was expensive and smith outperformed him the next year so that was a good trade off of players. Ramos was always a rental and he just never really got his footing all the way back and at the trade deadline half a season of a injury prone player isn’t gonna take in much. And like mentioned Solak can’t field worth anything and the Rays prize defense probably more than any other team
You have to stop calling Dickerson a salary dump. They brought back Hudson in the trade. They saved less than 2 million dollars in that deal.
That’s a lot to the Rays lol and then saved more after they cut Hudson loose
Ramos was hurt at the time of the trade. Dickerson had one good season, and wouldn’t start with the pieces in the roster last year or this year. Odo and Longo trades were eh, but otherwise a solid A.
The Longoria trade was a huge win. The win was getting rid of a declining asset. What they got in return is nothing but a cherry on top.
Ramos was had an injured hamstring when they traded him. I do wish they would’ve kept him though because they went on a run afterwards towards the end of 2018. Dickerson trade was awful but – again – it was a pure salary dump. Arroyo Solak and DeLeon are all AAAA players and won;t make much of an impact
The Tommy Pham trade looks like a break even in my books he traded a mob ready infielder two other prospects for Pham the flipped Pham and a no name for a top prospect and the heavy hitting renferoe so until that trade plays out in my mind this all is a C+ maybe b-
i wouldnt call Cronenworth a no name just yet. he tore up the IL more than anyone else before he hit the injured list and also has two way potential.
Tommy Pham is overrated and is gonna have a prolonged injury history now. He’s skills declined st the end of last year no doubt and his elbow needs TJ a steep price to pay for an outfielder when you have 10 other ones on the roster and then you add a top 100 prospect to the deal the Pham trade is a no brainer
Renfroe if he stays healthy will give the Rays better defense & more pop. Edwards gives the Rays another high end prospect. Neander makes trades due to the lack of team payroll to improve the roster. The team has a top end farm system & overall the roster is very solid top to bottom with needed depth in AAA.
Renfroe in the AL East and playing half his games in TB where the AC blows out for Tampa hitters has 40 HR potential
You’re kinda killing me now. You’re bending over backwards to justify everything.
TB was 24th in park factors last year. Meaning it was the 7th toughest hitting park in the league. If you looked over the past 2 years—there’s really no difference between the Trop and Petco park.
Your equating park factors that are determined more by current pitching than the park itself.
In most years especially a dome stadium the park doesn’t change.
So a Stadium isnt more offensive one year than another unless of course something in the Stadium changes
Yes the Trop is a much better stadium for a power hitter than Petco.
The AL East is a much better division for power hitters than the NL West
I agree that some of that is quality of pitching related.
But Tampa Bay is routinely in the bottom half of the league as far as park factors go. That’s every single year. That’s not a great place to hit HRS. The division is an improvement, sure. The ballpark in Tampa? Not really. It doesn’t really matter what park Renfroe is playing in though. His biggest issue is cutting down on swinging at thin air. A strikeout doesn’t go out of the ballpark in any stadium.
I am with you
That is why you have to look at his outs from last year.
Stadiums can make or break hitters.
A few balls that normally would be outs turn into HRs. This does wonders for a players confidence. But the other hand I have seen it totally destroy hitters.
Like I have said. The Rays front office knows more about Renfroe than me because I haven’t really looked into it but from what I have seen I think a different stadium and not playing 100+ games on the West Coast could really help him.
Next step is for him to control the strike zone.
Look at what happened to Machado and Hosmer at SD
Definitely an A.
He hasn’t really lost any trades.
Was able to clear Longoria off the books. Had a productive piece in duffy, when he was healthy.
The Archer deal was just plain highway robbery of glasnow Meadows and baz.
Stole Wendle
Stole Yandy Diaz
Sold high on Logan Forscythe who was just plain awful for the dodgers; unfortunately injuries derailed De Leon.
He gave away Hunter Wood but that’s pretty much the only glaring mistake so far.
Only real questionable moves were trading Liberatore for Martinez and Arozarena. And trading Solak who was a top 100 prospect at time of the trade. But gonna have to see how those deals pan out.
You don’t think Cardenas is ever going to play in the majors
Giving away Hunter Wood is a non factor for this team lol. He has no proven MLB success and the Rays still had the #1 bullpen in baseball. Solak can’t field a lick and Martinez and RA will absolutely Rake in Tampa and RA has a chance to be a very special player. I’ll trade an impact position player middle of the order bat for a #2-3 any day
If Solak can’t field….you put him at DH and keep Liberatore and the pick. Not trade a DH then go pick up another DH who’s 31 and only has 3 years left.
The rays were fine in the OF with Pham, Meadows, and Kaimaier. If they wanted Arozarena badly they could have JUST acquired him.
You are talking about three different deals into one.
Renfroe is better than Pham
The trade of Jose Martinez and Arozarena makes sense for right now. TB is trying to put together a team in the current so they can lose a couple of young prospects especially considering they have a deep system.
Solak.
I think you could say that could end up being a bad deal but we will see.
I like the moves made by TB this off-season.
They are a lot more dangerous in the current.
Better? Thats a weird way to spell younger.
Renfroe isn’t better. He’s cheaper, younger, and has more team control. He’s far from better. Rays traded Pham away because he’s scheduled to make 8 mill this year and potentially 10-12 mill next year in his final arb year. Renfroe is making 3.3 mill this year with 3 more arb years to come.
Phams last 3 years offensively and defensively
2017 – .306/.411/.520 good for an OPS+ of 144….6.2 defense according to fangraphs
2018 – .275/.367/.464 good for an OPS+ of 127…-0.7 defense according to fangraphs.
2019 – .273/.369/.450 good for an OPS+ of 119….-7.5 defense according to fangraphs.
Renfroe last 3 years offensively and defensively
2017 – .231/.284/.467 good for an OPS+ of 96…-10.9 defense according to fangraphs.
2018 – .248/.302/.504 good for an OPS+ of 120…..-5.4 defense according to fangraphs
2019 – .218/.289/.499 good for an OPS+ of 102….5.1 defense according to fangraphs.
The 3 years remaining is the key for a team like Rays
You can’t judge every trade the same for every team.
If Martinez can produce to a 900 OPS level the next three years for Tampa it doesn’t matter what RA does.
Renfroe is hitting his prime and played in a large ballpark on the West coast
The Marine air at Petco killed his power but indoors Renfroe could become a nightmare
Renfroe is someone to really watch.
I believe with better results it will depend on his ability to control the strike zone.
I have to really watch Renfroe but he is a player who could have a break out year.
To make a comparsion
Josh Hamilton in Texas and Josh Hamilton in Anaheim
On a talent and production level, nobody should ever claim Renfroe is better than Pham. Ever. Renfroe, at this present time, is a wasted talent.
Your subsequent arguments are simple excuses. Renfroe is lucky a good team is allowing him to start. He’s been so putrid that anything more than being a platoon player facing lefties is a gift. Renfroe has done absolutely nothing in the game of baseball to deserve the kind of praise you are throwing around. At least Pham has had a prime.
The rays have 3 players on the team right now that are more useful than Solak at Dh. The Rays refuse to clog the Dh spot with one guy, they prefer everyone can play decent defense
They literally just traded for Jose Martinez though…
And he can play 1b and his bat will play better for the Rays than Solak
So I see one declining consistently and one that is improving consistently besides when he got injured last year and tried to play through it. You’re proving our point you have A+ defense and a hitter who’s young and on the rise you’re trying to say keeping the older more expensive player on the decline is the smarter thing to do… no
So the foot affected his bat but not his defense? Ok sure. Whatever you say man.
In the real world. Renfroes main defensive strength is his cannon for an arm.
He is a power bat with little to no on base ability.
Also here’s a major problem. Tropicana is 315′ to deep right and 404′ to deep center. Petco is 336 to deep right and 396 to deep center.
21 less feet in right but huge space between right and center.
Furthermore renfroe is also now playing in 4 of the top 10 hitter parks against Yankees Orioles Blue Jaya and Red Sox majority of the season.
I guarantee you’re gonna see an uptic in renfroes offense since he’s playing in doors (still low obp ability) but his defense is going to regress.
Phams defense is gonna improve but his offense will regress playing at Petco.
Padres traded for Pham cause he can draw a walk and doesn’t strike out. He’s posted sub 25% k rate multiple times and over 10% walk rate multiple times. Meanwhile renfroe has never walked 10% or more and has k’d 25% or more 2 out of his 3 seasons with a personal best 31.2% last year.
I think OBP can come with the increase in power as well.
On Renfroe though. Matters what the Rays saw in him.
Pham’s production is probably going to drop while Renfroe’s will increase.
Regarding Petco and Trop
SD has heavy marine air. Maybe not as much as SF but both parks are very tough to be a power hitter
Unless you are a pull hitter in SF.
Trop is indoors plus there are rumors about TB controlling the air
Blows in when pitching and blows out when hitting
By how much is how well can he control the strike zone.
All his time lines look good except the 2017/2018 off season-
This is the off-season he got Longo off the books which was good but he also lost Renigfro Solak Dickerson and Ordoozi for not much in return(Poche?) in 4 different trades, Yikes……
So A- here for the small blip- Also I know the pens deep but still would have rather had Pagan than Margot. Liberatore will have them holding their breath for a while as well but ya gotta play fast when your the Rays w/ a bottom 5 payroll
2 players you named were salary dumps and neither would be with the Rays still if they would’ve kept them regardless and Solak and rengifo were prospects and Incase you have seen a depth chart of Rays infielders in the organization they had no place in Tampa
Had no place, but you don’t give them away for nothing, which is what tampa bay did at this point.
Rangers were the only ones interested in Solak? Doubt it. Solak was a top 100 prospect according to fangraphs. I am sure there were better offers out there than Fairbanks.
Rays got one season of Cj Cron for Rengifo. Got nothing for Cron.
Yes both those players would’ve never made the Rays roster and you think other teams don’t see that? They all scout eachother they knew who the team Kinda needs to get rid of they aren’t gonna offer up everything for a player who is useless to another team
Come on. A prospect doesn’t have less value because their team has too many of them. That’s crap. Solak was blocked, the front office liked Fairbanks. Teams swap blocked prospects for players all the time. There’s not some kind of substantial decrease in value because their blocked.
Don’t use that as an excuse. FO liked Fairbanks, maybe they didn’t think Solak’s game would translate. He’ll have to hit a whole lot to make up for his D. Time will tell. Way too early to say.
but you don’t give them away for nothing
Wanna ruin a franchise? That’s how you ruin a franchise by giving away decent prospects who are blocked.
Should trade Greg Jones then. Blocked by Franco Brujan and Edwards in the system. Josh Lowe can go too since he’s blocked by Meadows and Renfroe.
Seriously? Trade them cause they’re blocked? That’s how you ruin a franchise long term.
No I’m not saying blocked at just major leagues, most of the Rays top prospects are also infielders, so you pick the one who is lowest on the chart and yes teams can see that. Players values absolutely 100% diminish if there is no playing time for them on their current team. Solak gonna beat out Adames? No. Lowe who signed an extension ? No. Brujan? No. Franco? No. Diaz? No. Yoshi? No. Choi? No. Martinez? No. Robertson? No. So where in the world is he gonna play? Teams can absolutely 100% see that
The Archer deal might be the best trade I’ve seen in 5 years.
Also, how much credit does Neander get for any of these? Matt Silverman is their President of Baseball Ops, shouldn’t he be the one we are grading? I thought the buck stopped with him. It’s like we’re grading Jed Hoyer instead of Theo Epstein.
Silverman just went back to the baseball side. He was dealing with more ownership type things and no day to day operations stuff. Neander is the brains of this team no doubt
What is funny…
Go back and Google that trade from a Pittsburgh media POV when it went down.
They were pretty much calling Glasgow and Meadows AAAA players and saying they got an ace
Most BB writers know very little about baseball.
He should make more trades, why so few
Liberatore is no need for TB when they have a lot of pitching depth also the best team at developing pitchers when you can trade one of those to upgrade the offense you do it
Evidently there was no need for that trade to happen since Arozarena was shipped to AAA a couple weeks back and Martinez is a useless defender. All to cater to an overpaid, declining CF and an overrated, do-nothing Hunter Renfroe. For a team looking to win now, Liberatore being dealt does very little to move the needle.
This was probably one of the worst tales I’ve seen
Which part bothers you most, kc38? Do you feel Jose Martinez is a great defensive player or that Hunter Renfroe has had an incredible offensive career to-date? Or that Kiermaier is always healthy and productive? Please, enlighten us on the “tales” I am telling.
Some of you are underestimating Renfroe.
Has showed raw power in the majors
I see a high increase in production. How much is determined by him.
Similar to Josh Donaldson in Oakland and Josh Donaldson in Toronto
The move from Oakland put Donaldson on another level.
Renfroe hasn’t had the same production but he is around the same age
Does his OPS increase by .05 or .20.
We will have to wait on the season
A ton of players show raw power in the majors, ranging from Brian Dozier to Wily Mo Pena. Who cares.
Donaldson in Oakland was miles better than Renfroe is and was, well, ever.
Some of you are overestimating Renfroe.
2016: 68 wins
2017: 80 wins
2018: 90 wins
2019: 96 wins: playoffs
Thanks in-part to Baltimore and Toronto deciding to suck together simultaneously.
I want to say A, but some of these deals of late have not been good.
The Carlos Martinez trade stands out as a crazy poor deal for me. They essentially took Liberatore’s value and distributed it to get Arozena, CMart, and a draft pick swap. But like, vs LHP platoon bats don’t cost top pitching prospects, and neither does Arozeana. Dickerson, Solak, Odorizzi, those were all big losses in those trades.
Still probably an A but not a slam dunk.
Really hard to say they lost the Solak trade already. Solak was very good in his limited sample in Texas but we’re talking about 100ABS. And Fairbanks has only thrown 12 innings in a Rays uniform. If Fairbanks busts out like Emilio Pagán did last year—you may be looking at that differently.
Looks like a clear A to me. They obtained:
Yarbrough
Glasnow
Meadows
Poche
Renfroe
X Edwards
Margot
And gave up:
Odorizzi
Colome
This ignores guys that came and went (Pham & Pagan), though he should get credit for having received 1+ years of good production prior to trading them away. And it ignores a couple of trades involving young guys whose value is yet to be determined. And it ignores the strict salary dumps.
And Archer, Still agree tho!
Whoops….
I’d add Yandy Diaz to the positives list. Possibly Joey Wendle as well. Though he may have just been a flash in the pan.
I didn’t want to get too much into the minutiae. There were a lot of small pieces going back and forth. Richards & Anderson look good, for example, but I didn’t want to include guys like that because I don’t know what guys like Stanek & Sanchez might develop into.
Spends less on his entire roster than the old yanks do just for their tired bullpen. A+