SUNDAY: Support for cutting minor-league teams isn’t limited to the Commissioner’s Office, reports Tim Brown of Yahoo! Sports. Some executives, including Diamondbacks’ GM Mike Hazen and Blue Jays’ president and CEO Mark Shapiro, expressed support to Brown for some measure of reducing the number of players and affiliates in each organization. The goal of these contractions, per the executives with whom Brown spoke, would not be to cut aggregate player development costs but to more efficiently allocate their resources among the organization’s more promising prospects. Each, however, expressed some regret for fans of the affiliates in jeopardy. Brown’s piece is well-worth a full read for those interested in the potential benefits and drawbacks to making such a radical change to the affiliated ball structure.
SATURDAY, 9:02 pm: If the situation wasn’t fraught enough, it now appears that the ongoing dispute has begun to bleed over into the political arena: Sen. Bernie Sanders published a letter this evening threatening Congressional action against MLB’s proposal (link).
SATURDAY, 3:42 pm: Minor League Baseball has released its own statement in response to MLB (link from The Athletic’s Evan Drellich).
SATURDAY, 11:52 am: The relationship is strained and tensions are rising between Major League Baseball and its minor league affiliates. Negotiations between the two sides have failed to find middle ground, and both sides have publicly decried the other, per Bill Shaikin of the Los Angeles Times. Commissioner Rob Manfred is now threatening to walk away completely if the minor league owners aren’t willing to make concessions.
For their part, minor league owners entered negotiations so appalled at MLB’s proposal to cut 42 teams that they have yet to soften their stance. Minor league owners stoked the flames of controversy by going public with their concerns – a tactic that infuriated MLB. But public opinion is very much a part of this debate, as among other things, MiLB blames MLB for misrepresenting their positions to the public.
With thousands of jobs hanging in the balance, Congress has begun to pay attention as well. Senator Bernie Sanders will meet with minor league owners in the near future, and if diplomatic efforts aren’t improved, expect further government interest.
On the other side, torching the entire minor league system hardly seems like moving in the right direction, though MLB maintains its stance that they will “work diligently to preserve organized baseball in a compelling, fan-friendly format in every American city that currently has an affiliate.” Along with the proposed cuts, MLB is tasking minor league owners with improving facilities and bearing more of the burden of minor league player salaries – a can of worms in and of itself.
The ultimatum issued by Manfred basically charged minor league owners to come to the negotiating table or plan on staying home. In a rebuttal to a four-page statement released by MiLB, MLB had no problem escalating the conflict, threatening with a reminder that once the 2020 pact runs out, “…MLB clubs will be free to affiliate with any minor league team or potential team in the United States, including independent league teams and cities which are not permitted to compete for an affiliate under the current agreement.”
Oh boy…..
This idea sucks and shows how greedy MLB owners are. Fact is the system was in place before all current owners bought their teams. No reason to do this but greed. How many fans who live far from MLB cities chose their loyalty while watching minor league action at family friendly prices?
Move to a real city then and enjoy the show
That’s a fair point. I’ll quit my job and move my family so I can more easily watch a game
If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor.
Shelton that is a pretty ignorant statement
You should be ashamed to comment something so idiotic
Finally – a REAL solution. Let’s move everyone into the already overpopulated “real cities” to solve all of our problems. Do you have a newsletter I can subscribe to? I don’t want to miss ANY of your amazing ideas.
“Move to a real city”. I’ve heard a lot of ignorant statements on this site, but they were only ignorant in regards to baseball knowledge…until now. So congratulations on being such a tool that you transcended sports ignorance to become just plain ignorant.
Not necessary. One could move to St. Louis instead.
he said “real city”
I’m sure he’s a New Yorker or Bostonian where the only “real fans” are.
Best thing to do.
Lots of small towns require minor league baseball to get people to the area to spend into the economy. It just makes sense to protect the minor league system if you believe in local businesses.
Shame on MLB for trying to destroy small businesses!
New Yorker. I think he’s assuming that fit is from Boston because of his Red Sox themed name
The majority of research has proven this to be fallacy that owners use to get municipalities to fund stadiums with public dollars.
Let’s face it Shelton, you should’ve kept your browser shut.
Shelton shut up. I’m so tired of people like you in the world. We would all be better off if there were none.
Agreed
Why did MLB owners get involved in basically independent business anyway? It was a scam all along to keep young players strapped in the minors for 3-5 years or more to control the players arbitration time! Now the new negotiations are going to cut a lot of this controversial control owners have over players and the MiLB is going to be the fall guys! Simply put, the owners really don’t have anymore use for high profile minor league teams and they’re going to cut the funnel off! Plain and simple! As long as the minors were saving owners millions of dollars in player’s control and salaries they fed them. The free ride is over across the boards.
“Why did MLB owners get involved in basically independent business anyway?”
–
Actually Baseballfreak;
The majority of “Independents” are subsidized by the MLB franchises. Were they not, almost all would go belly up.
MLB is losing large amounts of money with their minor league affiliates.
I live in a minor league city. We watch MLB.TV rather then go down and watch the youngsters. Anyone with a cable or satellite system gets most of the games played by the ML team in market they’re in, as well as national games from places like ESPN a few times a week. There are games on TV just about every day/night of the season.
Don’t get me wrong, it’s always fun to go see a game live once in a while. But our team doesn’t get many return fans. Mostly they sell discount packages to groups from schools, hospitals, lager businesses, etc. It’s a shame, but the fact is that without money coming in from the big league club, there is no way they could afford to open up their doors.
They’re not losing anything. Young players need organized leagues to develop. Unlike Basketball or football, how many college grads go straight to the majors? The cost has really been overhead that they’re trying to cut out at the expense of their municipal partners. If
Why would Manfred want to cut 42 teams? He does realize that the minor league teams are the building blocks to the major leagues and fans attend the games to see future superstars at affordable costs. Sometimes things just don’t make sense.. What happens to the 1050 players that were on those teams that will now see their dreams taken from them? A thousand players are affected!
The NCAA will step in
The players on those teams are still under contract of the Major League club. They are not out of jobs. They would be reassigned to another club or they would report to the teams spring training facility.
@Bleed_Orange: Do you really believe that? Do you still believe in the tooth fairy too?
$$$$
Ok, look, you want to know how ridiculous the whole idea is?
Mlb complains it needs to cut costs, contraction of teams will allows higher salaries/benefits, right?
Well, do the math – 42 teams of 25 guys. Thats 1050 players. Let’s give them a HUGE raise, of a minimum salary of $50,000 each (1050*50000= $50,100,000).
No spread that out over 32 teams $1,565,625 each team. That’s it. At an huge salary raise that’s still it.
To put in perspective further, oakland”s revenue sharing exemption has been phased out. It’s estimated that that itself is $40,000,000/year going back to the clubs.
You want a radical proposal? Here’s one so please give feedback. We INCREASE the number of minor league clubs so every club has te same number of affiliates. Maybe 6 or 8 each. Every club gets less back in revenue sharing, BUT, mlb pays from a carveout in the revenue pool a basis of 50k per minor league player – anyone signed for more the club pays the difference. So at 8 affiliates each that’s 200 ball players, 50k each, 10m per club. That’s not even 1/3 of each clubs share now, and guarantees revenue sharing money goes into player development.
We can even say an additional $1m per MiLB club in Rev sharing goes to facilities maintenance/inprovement. Now you’re still only eating 18m of each clubs allotment.
Done deal – more clubs mean easier to schedule games close together.
More clubs mean more community access and interest.
Using Rev pool to fund it means better salaries and access to improved facilities/treatment for players.
So your idea is let’s figure out how MLB can afford this when they have no desire to attempt to afford it? This is like telling everybody how to survive on a vegetarian diet when we all know it’s possible but bottom line is I wanna eat a burger.
MLB doesn’t want or need MiLB in its current form. The reason the MiLB is in such a tough spot is they have no leverage at all bc MLB is telling them their services are no longer desired in the same capacity as in the past. Of course MLB can afford to support MiLB. Anthony rendon just got 35 mil/year. If every team spent a few mil more on the minors I think he could still survive at 32/yr. But they don’t want it. How do you fix that? Bottom line is you don’t. You can’t force somebody to pay you for unwanted services. MLB is greedy af and MiLB is gonna pay the price.
MLB would probably prefer kids go play college baseball for a couple of years. It will give teams more data, more reliable daea, for the draft.
The government won’t let this happen. Government doesn’t want to get involved until it happens in their back yard. Then legislators will scream. Another possibility is that MLB has no intention of following up on a big plan. It may be an opening negotiation ploy to leverage for what they do want whatever that may be.
Half the clubs losing their affiliation drew less than 2000 per game last year
. 8 of them drew less than 1000. And you think there should be MORE teams?
Mlb needs a new commissioner. Manfred is a clown.
It can not be stressed enough just how much Manfred sucks. And all the owners trying to cry poor.
Excellent point, Manfred is somehow massively worse than Selig. Billionaire owners are being encouraged to pocket the profits they make while simultaneously “crying poor” instead of redistributing the profits to the players who earned them, and because the owners also control/own the media, they permanently set the narrative to making fans think: “players making X money = bad, but lets not talk about who that money actually goes to. Nope, players “dont deserve” X money, end of convo.”
Haven’t three different players received $245+ million guaranteed contracts in the past week alone? Hard to say they aren’t redistributing profits amongst the players.
Yep, the top slice of players get paid bank by the top slice of teams, and F everybody and everyone else
Relative to how much the owners are making, they aren’t. The primary reason why MLB minimum salaries are growing at rates 2-3x inflation and FA salaries are growing 3-5x inflation is because owner profits are growing at rates 8-10x inflation. For every dollar a typical MLB owner makes, ~55 cents goes to players.
Forbes had an article post-2018 that touched on the subject a bit:
forbes.com/sites/maurybrown/2019/01/11/economic-da…
That’s the problem and reason for strike. Owners make a dollar players should make a dollar. That’s the 50/50 relationship that all unions abide by including nba and nfl. The issue with mlb is it’s 65% owners now and only 35% goes to players. Not 1 mlb player is in top 15 highest paid athlete in the world on a per year basis but other sports including nba have several making over 40$MM/yr. it’s sad what Manfred has done to the game…. we’ve never seen someone so greedy ever. Sad
We can’t compare the contracts across sports to evaluate fairness in how much players are paid. They’re all pro athletes but it’s apples and oranges to match them up.
MLB generated $9.9bn in 2018 and to divide half of that among all players on a 40-man roster would produce an avg salary of $4.1m per player. The NBA generated $7bn in 2017/18 and to divide half of that revenue among all players on a 17-man roster would produce an avg salary of $6.8m per player.
It just not the same and to make the argument that baseball players aren’t in the top-15 paid players is irrelevant.
Well said, I remember my father saying in 1973, that money would ruin the game…he was right!
Yet you must have watched the WS on TV while enjoying some wings and a beer.
Strike Four you must have slept through the winter meetings and FA signing so far for you to think the money is not being redistributed on the MLB level.
On the minor league front what MLB is doing is pathetic
Both things are true.
You think the money being thrown around this offseason is appropriate? I don’t. You see “324” and I see “about half of what he’s actually worth, money-wise, all things considered.”
Okay, StrikeFour. Chris Davis is making $17 million a year right now and using you’re argument Chris Davis should be making at least $34 million a year right now. I doubt you even truly believe the nonsense that you say. If so, I want to see you say that Chris Davis should be getting paid “at least” $34 million every year. I bet you won’t because you know everyone will think you are nuts. However, if you don’t it proves you don’t even believe your own ridiculous logic.
And they bought the baseball manufacturer to juice the ball and LIED about that. Want baseball to survive? ………. DUMP Manfred!
They are actively ruining baseball. This is my opinion and it is also a fact.
Couldn’t agree more…and they bow to soccer moms who are pissed that they can’t get their kids to bed on time because the games last too long. If Jr wasn’t being micromanaged because he has four activities going on at once, you wouldn’t have this issue. LEAVE OUR GAME ALONE!!
Uhh, I think the issue is getting kids to watch baseball in the first place. Never heard this argument about soccer moms and kids going to bed too late. In fact, I find the idea of a child watching an entire game from start to finish to be quite hilarious. Good one!
Pearly this man has no children!
It’s simple that no one takes the time to understand the chess game being played on the field. You have the stat freaks and soccer moms crying because they have to sit down with REAL fans that understand that it’s not as simple as looking up stats or the first time to the mound a manager makes a hasty decision to pull a pitcher that could’ve easily worked out of the situation and pitched 2 more innings. Instant gratification for a bunch of spoiled brats given everything instead of working for it or ciphering equations for themselves.
Yeah, lots of instant gratification coming from those 1-0 soccer games.
Can we please not devolve this discussion to who’s a “real” fan?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman
This is about fiscal parity and choosing to ambiguously attack some strawman group of peers only enables those ripping you off to continue to do so.
Kids aren’t watching baseball.
It should also be mentioned that MLB was granted a legal monopoly by Congress. They are exempt from antitrust laws. This is how MLB can unilaterally decide how and where baseball is played everywhere in the country and one of the reasons why the commissioner can flip the bird at the minor league team owners and get away with it.
And they gained that antitrust position by bribing politicians…
No. MLB’s antitrust exemption is derived from two Supreme Court cases – Federal Baseball in 1922, affirmed by Toolson in 1953.
But it depends upon Congress not amending antitrust laws to eliminate that exemption. That was part of the court’s reasoning in Toolson, that Congress had failed to amend the law in the decades after Federal Baseball.
Among Congress’s enumerated powers is regulating interstate commerce. If Congress takes action against MLB, it’s extremely unlikely MLB would receive any relief via the Court.
Marc has it right. The original exemption stemmed from a Supreme Court decision but it could have been rectified by Congress. It never has, which is why baseball has since 1922 been the only sport to be exempted from antitrust law.
It was pretty much ALL of the court’s reasoning in Toolson.
I seriously wonder if anyone is paying attention, This is about control not “crying poor” paying the players more is a central part of the MLB strategy, but before they pay the players more they want to cut extraneous jobs that are never going to make it to the mlb, It makes perfect sense yet still people run to shove their anti rich worldwiew onto others.
at least 100+ congressmen did. if they lose jobs in their districts they are not going to take it sitting down.
Oh these billionaires want to “pay the players more” as long as they’re not footing the bill and can line their own over-stuffed pockets even further.
These are the same people who actively campaigned to have codified into law legislation that legalizes their criminal underpayment of MiLB players, so charmingly called the “Save America’s Pasttime Act”
These people are straight up sociopaths who only care for money.
You are just fundamentally ignoring large parts of the system, namely the Draft, during which these “Criminally underpaid” players get millions of dollars from mlb Owners, The draft pools in 2019 ranged from 4 to 16 million dollars for the 30 teams. As for the rest they work half a year and the system has become bloated in the sense that they are employing more players than necessary. And the majority of minor league players, talented they may be, are a dime a dozen. The MLB is not a welfare office if they want to cut staff they can try to do so. The reality of the situation is that it is a fine arrangement, The big time draftees get a big payday, and the others get to delay real life by 2 to 3 years. You are buying into a line of logic that doesn’t match reality.
“get to delay real life by 2 to 3 years”
What, by working at 7-11 on the side?
funny but still doesn’t address the bonus pool argument.
“…extraneous jobs that are never going to make it to the mlb…”
Which jobs, exactly? Nobody who plays rookie ball makes it? High draft picks don’t burn out? Low draft picks and nobody signings never make the majors? All future major leaguers are obvious talents from the get go? Nobody ever grinds along in the low minors and takes off in the mid/high minors, right?
It’s a good thing baseball’s talent pipeline is pretty clear cut, because it would start to get complicated if, say, major leaguers were drawn from a pool of players ranging from Dominican teenagers to American college players, and everything in between.
This imbecilic “most of them never make it anyway so who cares” argument needs to stop.
Talk about a strawman, when did I ever say any of that? It really is simple the MLB has decided that rounds 25 to 40 are an inefficient way to find MLB talent and the numbers back that up. In the deal they proposed support for indy leagues as a way of identifying some off these guys as potential MLB players. The MLB would like to get rid of a level and 42 minor league teams to reduce the amount of players so that more money and better facilities could be provided for whats left, as well as more profits for them, a win win so to speak.
You should google more names of logical fallacies.
What a tremendously well thought out counter argument, You will have to give me a second while I attempt to parse through all the incredible points you just made.
Let’s be clear, I didn’t even attempt make a counter argument to your shrieking “straw man” like a freshman poli sci major on Reddit and rehashing pretty much the same set of Manfred talking points (I’m keenly aware of the league’s argumentation, but the effort put into regurgitating it is noted and appreciated) that I was responding to in the first place.
The as-of-yet unaddressed point I was getting at is that this has nothing to do with the size of the talent pool (“extraneous jobs”) and everything to do with who pays what for different stages of player development. Manfred represents MLB owners, exclusively, and his interest in what happens in the minor leagues is limited to when and how MLB owner dollar bills enter the equation. The league’s sudden-onset crocodile tears regarding MiLB player pay, supposed issues with facilities, etc., are nothing more or less than a tactic, uncoupled from the reality of how MLB and MiLB do business.
I agree with Joseph. Let’s not forget that this all started because minor league players were allowed to sue MLB for round the clock minimum wage on away games and nicer facilities. If you wanna get you have to give. MLB isn’t forcing any team to shut down. Nobody has the legal ability to do that. They are just no longer going to subsidize those teams lack of profit. MLB has no business paying teams to stay afloat at a higher rate than before when those teams don’t produce enough talent to even come close to making it worth it. The only halfway realistic argument I have heard came from Bernie Sanders who said that it would decline enthusiasm amongst fans that follow those 42 low level minor league teams and thus hurt MLB viewership. I don’t even believe in that argument. I live in the same county as a Triple-A team and have never been to a minor league game. I still watch every MLB game my team plays in and I still go to several MLB games a year. Removing these teams from the MLB system won’t hurt MLB at all. It will actually help the truly productive MiLB teams and players. Any team that doesn’t provide enough talent worth the subsidies shouldn’t be subsidized. Any unsubsidized team or business that can’t make a profit in it’s own right shouldn’t stay open. Any of the 42 teams that are contracted will fall under both of those categories. That is not a debate. That is fact. It never feels good when facts show that people should lose jobs. The problem is that facts don’t care about your feelings.
No player under MLB contract is going to be fired. They will just be reassigned The Minor League players are making pennies on the dollar and teams will continue to stockpile tallent. If they don’t make a minor league club they will report to the teams Spring Training facility like players who don’t make clubs do now. The clubs being considered for removal are being subsidized by the MLB Also, their facilities are not up to par so MLB clubs do not want to send rehabbing major leaguers and high priced minor leagues to clubs that have outdated equipment and rehab facilities.
This is likely to get very ugly.
Oh boi. Big government here it comes.
MLB does have the Supreme Court on their side. I think the way the court is currently constructed would strike down big government interference in private enterprise like MLB.
This is such a complicated and interesting story. Please keep these detailed stories coming.
The SC would prevent Congress from removing MLB’s antitrust exemption?
That’s partially true. But remember, all sport leagues have a congressional exemption to operate as a monopoly since there is no competitor, like in the case of MLB. That exception is dependent on whatever Congress says is allowed within the confines of the monopoly laws. So if MLB gets too heavy handed and try’s to throw its oversized economic weight around, congress can step in and threaten to remove the monopoly exemption which would for the league to break up. The Supreme court wouldn’t likely take up the case as it falls directly within the scope of congressional power and would be following already approved laws.
THANK YOU FOR THE INFORMED COMMENT!
I think all of that, is what makes this soooo interesting. MLB had to walk on egg shells, while the MILB can kinda mud-sling around.
No. It is absolutely false to claim that all sports leagues have MLBlike antitrust protection.
The NFL very specifically lost an antitrust case in Radovich the 1950s, which ultimately blew up their ability to negotiate a league wide network TV contract and the AFL/NFL merger until two acts of Congress specifically and narrowly allowed the league to do both those things.
The NBA settled in Robertson or they would have been almost certainly prohibited from merging with the ABA. Boxing got clobbered at the Supreme Court in the 1950s because they were violating antitrust law.
You are correct, only baseball enjoys this exemption, and the impact of it seems to be in play here. The minor league teams are independent franchises in name only if MLB can simply wave its hand and make them disappear as it sees fit. It’s difficult to imagine this taking place in any other industry.
Manfred needs to go, he is ruining everything great about this game that millions love and thousands played professionally including this guy. He will kill off everything that’s America’s pastime if we let him
Umm, Manfred is not the problem.
his presence on this earth is.
That’s a little harsh. I imagine there are some people who could say the same of you.
sure, but i don’t try to hurt people who are in worse shape than i am in. and i don’t ever try to take away anyone’s job.
Hahaha good one
So in your opinion, your sins are less egregious than someone else’s. Sounds a little Pharisaical to me.
Umm yes he is.
He’s not the only problem, but he’s one of them. Some of the ideas he’s had about improving pace of play have been ridiculous.
Manfred works for the owners and represents nobody’s interests but the owners. Not the fans, not the game, not the players, just the owners. The words coming out of his mouth are the words the team owners put into his mouth. This is another chance for us to sit back and admire the sweet deal ownership has going for them. Given a legal monopoly by Congress, how much their employees make is public, but how much they make is private. When something like this comes up, the commissioner takes all the heat and ownership gets to hide in the background and pretend like it isn’t coming from them. The fans are none the wiser, unless they choose to be.
WOOOOOWWWW DEEP BREATH.
I don’t think he’s the concern, just yet. I’m reserving the Manfred ruining baseball comments for after the Stros investigation.
If he does little to nothing, than rail the crap outta him.
Other than that. He’s been pretty good in my eyes. I totally agree with his grievance and how he’s handled the MILB negotiations.
Me personally. I don’t understand why there’s Only a few minor league complexes that house multiple franchises. It seems most cost effective to have massive complexes where multiple team could utilized at once. It seems to me, like all of the minor system would run a lot smoother.
But there people jobs and politics involved soo what’s most effective and efficient won’t actually happen. American government.
Dissolve the minor/major league system over a period of 5 years and move to a promotion/relegation system that soccer uses…no more tanking, more fan buy-in, more exciting games all year…easy.
That’s actually not a bad idea. A lot of teams would be forced to spend and actually want to compete
It doesn’t work like that. :Clubs like Manchester City and Man. United. have enormous advantages in world wide revenue that allow them to spend, far more, and ultimately crush on the pitch, the smaller clubs. It would be the same here with New York and L.A.’s billion dollar TV markets. Is the rest of MLB just supposed to sit back and be crushed every year by the Manchester City’s and United’s of MLB? Forget that.
Except that Leicester wins few years back…the teams with high revenue are always going to be great…it’s the chance for teams like a Las Vegas, Nashville or Indianapolis to take a sport from Miami, Detroit or Kansas City…they can always regain their spots by winning the AAA crown.
Also, go Liverpool!!
The Leicester argument again? Lol. They’ve got a great scouting dep’t that allows them to contend. twice a decade….until their Kante’s and Mahrez’s are scooped up by teams that will ultimately knock them back down the table with everyone else. It’s funny how Europe is Socialist, but Monarchist when it comes to soccer.
But I do like Liverpool. Klopp is a great guy and their success sticks it to London and Manchester.
You realize Kante and Mahrez are both sold off and Leicester currently sit in 2nd? They aren’t knocked back down.
And to OP about Man United, they haven’t been good (relating to standings in the table, Champions League qualification and play) in quite some time. Their money hasn’t led to success and their development of players has lagged behind other clubs.
Wow I wish.
Nein! No soccer in baseball.
I’d love to see this but realistically the levels of football popularity in England allow this. No one follows MiLB like supporters follow Championship. The money discrepancy would be way off. But I’d still love to see it.
Yeah cause that works for soccer
Let me know when they are on prime time tv for their championship games or when they actually have a local tv contracts
orwe could just go back to the old system before MLB became a monopoly
That was in 1922.
And they acted very, very monopolistically and monopsonistically before 1922, too.
Uh, yes. It was a Supreme Court decision in 1922 that permitted baseball to be exempted from antitrust law turning away a challenge that it was operated as a monopoly. Congress could have fixed that right away or at any thereafter but never has, leaving baseball as the only sport to have such an exemption.
For me, Rob Manfred is the worse Commissioner MLB has had in a very long time
manfred got rid of mlb message board. he is already a loser in fans’ opinions!
Hard to imagine him being worse than Selig but it’s close for totally different reasons!
Yeah, I thought Manfred couldn’t possibly be worse than the Steroid King, but I guess I was wrong.
If you can’t juice the players juice the balls.
Bingo
Firstly love the comment, but is it possible mlb juiced the ball back than also? Bonds has only had 1 season where he hit more than 50 home runs and when was last time two pitchers had 300+K in the same season?
I’m sure the Anti-Trust exemption card that MLB has enjoyed over the years will soon be played.
more than 100 congressmen opposed to manfred’s plan. when it gets into advanced stage i’m sure most congressmen will threaten mlb with taking away the exemption.
They’ll threaten, but they won’t take it fully away. Too many big money donors in that group,of owners who will make sure that hundreds of millions go to those favorable to them.
I’ve done my best to learn more about this whole situation, but I still don’t know all the facts.
That said, from a purely subjective point of view, I don’t see how eliminating over 40 minor league teams will really accomplish anything as far as MLB is concerned. MLB and MiLB are two separate entities, and I don’t see any way that minor league owners agree to this proposal. I support minor leaguers getting paid more (much more, in fact), and it’s probably true that a lot of these teams need better facilities — which is something they should have to pay for themselves.
But I don’t like this new plan, and it’s another example of how Manfred keeps trying to change too much. The three-batter minimum rule, in particular, really annoys me because it removes some of the strategy and it basically makes LOOGY pitchers useless. Most of these changes are having a very limited impact on times of games anyway, but that’s a separate issue.
“MLB and MiLB are two separate entities” – this is simply not true. One exists due to the other.
actually no, milb was its own organization and coopted by mlb
If they weren’t two separate entities, then there’d be no disagreement.
Spectacularly incorrect. MiLB and MLB are two distinct entities that have an expiring contractual relationship.
“…it removes some of the strategy…” That ship has sailed #DH
As far as the LOOGY goes, the three batter rule doesn’t remove strategy. It changes strategy.
Fair point
gtfo bernie
Another political turd in the pool.
Shhhh… just close your eyes and pretend we’re talking about Deion Sanders and his UZR or BLORG7 rating or something.
Control your sphincter. Or try using your pre-frontal cortex. You know, grow up.
Except that Mo’s at work, flipping burgers.
jk
Not exactly bhamhead. I had a 20 year career as a corp. exec and 15 yr career as a small business owner. That’s how I get to spend my time chatting with hamheads like you.
I guess you didn’t see the jk.
lighten up.
Wilford. I’d rather be talking baseball than listening to your lame political vomit.
Like yours is any better. The lack of self awareness is strong….
“hamheads” gotta look that one up
Mo is constantly whining about something on here, just ignore him.
Mo clearly didn’t read the article (what else is new?). The fact that a “political turd” (your words) has entered the picture, it becomes political. So if a person doesn’t like one side or the another is irrelevant. A politician is now involved. This thread can now become political. If you are triggered, and by the looks of it you are, that is your problem. Quaker Oats did little to get under your skin.
So you’d rather be arguing politics than discussing baseball. Interesting. What the heck are you doing on a baseball site, then?
Lol I love Bernie. He hasn’t trusted anybody wealthy since they moved his Dodgers from Brooklyn. Absolute King
Manfred is stunningly arrogant, and if he has the backing of ownership(s) then screw them.
How can he justify this while at the same time the vast majority of minor league players are being payed McDonald’s level wages?
IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!! IT WILL BE ANNOUNCED VERY SOON!!!!!!!!! YOU READ IT HERE FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is huge…
Rob Manfred is an anagram for Modern Barf.
Don’t you have a reverse mortgage to sell?
Manfred is an embarrassment to baseball. He has his own selfish agenda and doesn’t believe there is another side to anything. He also gives attitude to anyone who dare question him. Terrible representative of the sport.
Well said, amk3510. Not good for baseball! A power monger out of control!
Manfred doesn’t have his own agenda. He works for and at the pleasure of the owners, so everything he says should be seen as a reflection of their views. The office of the commissioner was created to look after “the best interests of baseball,” but we know that has always really meant the best interests of the owners. No different here.
I think the minor league system could use improving (and probably a little thinning out), In fact I think the way players in MiLB and MLB are brought up/ paid is WAY overdue for overhaul. teams being granted all these years of control and being able to play service time games is ridiculous.
That being said I don;t think Manfred is the man for the job.
So we should be skipping MLB and spend our money on MiLB and independent league games instead? Ok if you insist
Frankly minor league teams provide better baseball in every way than MLB does. I support MiLB. That being said, I also think that minor league players deserve better pay. Maybe $35K-$250K. And the major league teams should foot the majority of the bill for their development systems. Hold the anti-trust exemption over their heads. Facilities should be the responsibility of the MiLB owners, donors and their cities.
But I think what you’re proposing is premised on the notion that enough people will be perfectly happy watching minor league baseball to pay the players decent wages. If that’s true then I agree with you.
mlb pays milb players’ wages.
They should pay more.
In other businesses it’s called the cost of R&D, and a company won’t have long term success if it neglects it’s R&D team.
Highly suspicious
Major league teams have always paid the bill for MiLB players. And my understanding is the MLB teams want to pay those players more. But they want to shrink the number of players in MiLB to help make it happen. I think that’s a realistic plan. 1/3 of the MiLB players are guys who are already past consideration for the majors.
mlb went to all the state governments on top of feds not to pay minimum wages
The yankees have ruined baseball for years, they have to go. Manfred is a Selig tool, they’re both terrible. Bart Giamatti was the only good commissioner baseball ever had.
LOL!!! You mad?
L
Making my point once again. All these Red Sox articles lately and Yankees fans have behaved themselves beautifully. Red Sox fans continue to dump on Yankees wherever they please. In Yankees articles. In other articles. Wherever they please. They can’t help themselves. They’re obsessed. They’re deranged. They need therapy.
LOL, LOL, LOL. What an IDIOT!
Maybe Trump should nationalize baseball and force the owners of MLB clubs and Manfred out? Do to them what Reagan did to the air traffic controllers back when.
before he can do that he’ll be in a cell in guantanamo!
After reading this Vizionaire comment I realized why all his other comments were so incredibly stupid.
well, you may consider my posts to be stupid but you are stupid and that’s a fact!
Don’t hold your breath waiting for that to happen.
On second thought, go ahead and do that.
How many MiLB franchises are owned by MLB teams (e.g., Syracuse Mets)? I presume they are safe.
quite a few actually, but those are the lower level teams. more higher level teams are not, and i dont think AAA is being dissolved.
This is an effort to buy the minor league teams out. Every MLB team should own and run it’s minor league affiliates.This is why the Wilpon’s bought the Syracuse team two seasons ago. They knew teams would be bidding against each other and driving the prices up. I’m not saying they’re smart I’m saying they’re cheap
Bob Costas for Commissioner.
Manfred is pro-billionaire anti-player, and so-called “fans” of the game support him every single time you write “player doesnt deserve that much money”.
Salaries need to be driven by profits, not some arbitrary “limit” everyone makes in their minds on a case by case basis.
If you don’t want MLB to make more money, then don’t support the corporations that buy ads, don’t buy mlb tv or mlb network, dont go to games, just illegally stream them! That will get player salaries down, you win! (jk no one wins)
Manfred represents the owners… That’s literally the job of the commissioner of a league.
Odd that a sports site that has so many well informed fans, very few understand this.
This comes down to money as usual.
MLB wants minor leaguers paid more. Think everyone agrees they are under paid. Who is going to pay though??
MLB wants better facilities. Think everyone agrees they need improvement. Who is going to pay though??
Gets cloudy here but I agree with mlb on centralizing teams. Which would drastically reduces travel.
I think improving these areas would make baseball more attractive to young players. Maybe even get some to skip college to go pro right away.
A lot of good intentions but someone has to pay.
It’s a nice idea to centralize the teams, but, look at a map.
There’s areas of the country that just don’t have enough mlb franchises close together to accomplish both stated goals – reduce travel times for players AND let teams have their affiliates close to home.
If you tried it you’d have situations where two or three teams only play eachother, ever.
Reading the mlb pitch sounds like a guy trying to make strawman arguments that, on their own, each sounds rational. But then you read that they want to do ALL of them, and notice they contradict eachother.
MLB better understand that the minor leagues are a huge part of the “romance” of pro baseball as a whole. Where guys come up from, where they’re seasoned etc. I have to believe that there are many minor league parks that could use some crumbs from the billions in MLB revenue. This smacks of greed and misplaced priorities.
MLB would rather screw players and fans over rather than pay people livable wages. This is America…
People can go find a different job and make more money. THIS is America!
There’s a finite pool of good jobs. Everyone could work hard as hell and look for better jobs and most are still going to have jobs that suck. How hard is that to see. Criminy!
Man people that think like this suck…
The article is trying to be evenhanded, but this is a mismatch were billionaire owners heavily subsidized by the taxpayer are bullying not just Minor League teams, but also the small cities they are generally located in or near. It’s disgusting.
It’s a matter of time when the MLB implements a salary cap for all of the teams. These contracts from the last two years with Harper to Manchado to Trout to Cole to Rendon would not mean anything. Small market clubs are not able to sustain competitive teams due to the service time for certain players they bring up in the MLB.
Right now, a lot of rhetoric is being spewed by both sides. Hopefully, cooler heads prevail. But if MLB is intent on being that heavy handed, then yes, Congress should absolutely get involved by yanking MLB’s anti-trust exemption.
To hell with Manfred.
Manfred is hot garbage. Hes lightyears worse than Selig and selig was garbage. Owners are the worst too. Crying that they have no money. What a crock of poop. Baseball is being destroyed from within. You want to really make a statement? Stop supporting MLB. Theyll turn around really quickly and be for the fans. Because currently they are not for us or the players. A bunch of sociopath billionaires. Also they changed the ball and lied about it. Like really?
Selig’s being complicit with the steroid scandal overshadows what was actually a quite successful run as commissioner. No work stoppages, record revenue, and the implementation of the wild cards… That’s a pretty good resume.
Most people vilify Selig over the steroid era but he did do a lot to help the sport too. And in all honesty he saw what the strike did to hurt baseballs popularity first hand and had a tough choice to make. He could have exposed the steroid situation right away and possibly hurt the sport more or let it go under the radar as long as he could and hope that things rebounded enough that it wouldn’t kill the sport when it came to light. He took the second option and got lucky with the race for the home run record in 97 driving up interest again. He ended up with the majority of blame for not exposing it earlier and made a mess to sort out later but he very well might have saved baseball in the process.
if so, vote bonds in!
I should have known the only way MLB owners would give minor league players a raise is to have less players. And what’s with this facilities excuse? Didn’t all MILB teams have to upgrade a few years ago or lose their MLB contract?
That said, why are they planning to cut only a few teams in various leagues? I thought in their original announcement they said they wanted a radical
restructuring with whole leagues disappearing?
Did I miss something? That wouldn’t be the first time LOL!
Colorado Springs lost their Triple A affiliate because they refused to upgrade the park. But their conditions were considered good enough for short season ball.
The plan calls for the elimination of three of the four short season leagues. But some of the cities with teams in those leagues have better facilities or draw better.
For example, Brooklyn is in the New York-Penn League, which is one of the doomed leagues. But the park is better, and they draw much more than Binghamton of the AA Eastern League. So the plan is for that franchise to leave Binghamton for Brooklyn.
XLB to the rescue. Hard slides, barrelling into the catcher, noogies on the mound, bat flips, and bench clearing brawls will be an every game occurence. In Vince We Trust.
Bernie Sanders to rescue. Now we can all rest at ease.
political turd here ^^. Step aside.
Get sarcasm?
You’re about to get Berned minor league baseball.
Another politiical turd ^^. Watch your step.
Make me, tool
…until Bernie realizes that the MILB employees are paid wages below the poverty line. Then he’ll realize there’s no actual good guy in this fight.
With the likelihood of MiLB and Rookie contracts salaries going up a fair amount MiLB concessions will need to happen.
But I do agree with MiLB that cutting that many teams and jobs is hard to swallow.
I guess it really depends on how much they go up. if its only 25-100% then screw the owners.
if its 100%+ then MiLB will have to do something.
You’d think there would be other options than just cutting out teams all together.
Alex Andropoulous (sp) spoke at length about minor leagues about 2 months ago on mlbtv; smart guy, AA. He claimed the industry’s biggest problem right now is the cost of player development. To paraphrase, you spend 20M a year (between scouts, bonuses coaches, facilities and Player Development contracts), and if you get an Avasial Garcia and a Kolby Allard, you’ve had a TREMENDOUS year; better than most.
The minors are part of that problem. Facilities have improved, and teams no longer just hire their drinking buddies (ex-players who couldn’t get a job at WalMart) as coaches, but the system still needs an overhaul. Centralizing all the complex leagues would go a great way to that end. It’ll deny the “on the road” maturity for high schoolers and International prospects, but the training would be better.
Again, it”s insane that a college player can jump into a Bill Belicheck defense right away, while an OFer needs 4 years to learn how to catch a fly ball. Short season A teams are a waste, and likely counter productive.
Ya, some small business owners will be hurt; no one doubts it. But it’s inevitable, IMHO.
Cutting 1,000 players out of the minor leagues will ultimately result in MLB owning the whole ball of wax, which is probably what they want. In some ways it makes a lot of sense. They would be able to have control over coaching, medical care, training facilities, etc. If there was a way for the eliminated cities to be able to start another league, then they wouldn’t be totally out in the cold. If MLB succeeds, then their justification for antitrust exemption would go out the window. Maybe we’ll see a second league get established, eventually.
Anyone who has ever worked in MILB will tell you that the minor league owners aren’t the good guy here either … Their entire model is based on paying their work force wages that are below poverty level. I remember working for $18k/year w/ a director title. I knew what I was signing up for, but I cant say I was thrilled when the owner gave his alma mater $40 million or when the team president took home a bonus that dwarfed my annual salary.
Rich people will be rich people anywhere. And if no one is watching them and at least attempting to keep them honest they will be ten times worse. I know. I spent an entire career working with them. Many are just plain scum.
Agreed. The only point here is that people need to stop treating the MILB owners as the good guy here. there is no good guy in this fight.
Baseball since Selig has touted the value of its franchises and the business aspect of the game….without ever once really touting the fans overall impression of the game. The Commissioner at one time would occasionally act “in the best interest” of baseball….but he’s a total and complete pawn now since they promoted one of their on in Selig to the position. This should be an outside arbiter…who ALSO represents the fans. Someone must care about THE GAME instead and NOT just the next short-sighted quarterly report.
The fans are the outside arbiter… They’re represented by the money they spend.
In some ways….but these TV contracts are backed by nothing but bubble. Good luck trying to these new owners trying to pull a 1,000% profit on their sale. Baseball has been pumping to dump since the ’94 strike. Steroids messed with it a little….but they got their new parks. Unless they can figure out how to sell controllable virtual-reality to short attention span information saturated generations coming up…they’re going no place. Theyve made the ballpark an event…driven eyeballs away. They’re gonna run out of foreign and multi-media market to strike gold in.
I never worked “for” a MiLB owner, by I interfaced with them quite a bit on a business level. And while I’d agree that many are as vicious as you say (especially with multi-team conglomerates got involved), I’ve also known my share of guys barely scrapping by, and making money because the son was the clubhouse boy, the daughter the ticket taker, and mom made the post-game meal. Again, it ALL changed in the 90s, when larger companies found they could make a lot of money operating minor league teams.
Treasure that experience you had, even if it didn’t work out right. I saw more human drama over those times (25 year old men sitting in the hallway, crying because they had just been released; richer kids feeding their less well off teammates; compassion being both absent and in abundance in every locker room) than I think most do. You probably did also.
I for sure saw it. And what I’ve become accustomed to is now seeing a new generation come on who has absolutely no memory of before this profound sports-business-as-entertainment-and-angst. I’m not even an old man! But I’ve come to realize that..wow…you can be 25 years old and THIS is all youd know…the 24 hour cycle…where even a trade site might be more popular with people than the actual game. What it does is give no frame of reference in the grand scheme.
To me it’s just negative publicity when the game itself pushes money as an advertising tool. It’s part of our age though. Really…its just for personal reference with dealing with people. The game hasnt really had a golden age…that’s all nostalgia…
Where I see the game going is more personal. The opportunity for people to create their own personal league. It may not be for years….but we might see the death of baseball as a large community experience and see it go into a virtual reality world. Teams will break geographical boundaries. Fan interest in fantasy baseball/sims/streaming is breaking down the markets. We’ll see…but that’s where people are going. This place even represents that. I’m one of the original people from the early days here…and its astonishing where it’s gone. The dialogue is wholly different even among serious commenting.
justinept
“The fans are the outside arbiter… They’re represented by the money they spend.”
But it’s a monopoly. Where else does fan of baseball go but the one team in their city? That’s the difference. Everything else you can vote with your wallet and buy a different product/service. Not baseball.
That’s why the fan needs a commissioner who represents the fans, not the owners.
they go to another sport. they find a new form of entertainment.
The “best interests of baseball” has always meant the best interests of team owners. The commissioner speaks for ownership. Always has and always will. I used to blame Selig for the bad stuff that happened to baseball during his years as commissioner until I saw the light. Same goes for Manfred. If you want to blame someone don’t blame the commissioner, blame the people who employ him to be their mouthpiece.
Bluesky… you’re correct for sure…and while virtually every commissioner has been asked over the coals….there WAS atleast the third rail..fans…represented. I just think of ALL professional sports…baseball has as much to lose of not marketed properly. It’s the one that lends itself least to modern culture. The pricing is escalating…and its pushing eyeballs in front of broadcasting with about 500 different options. TV is a bad sign because those numbers are being juiced now by retiring boomers. They cant be replaced. Baseball must invest in the live experience for younger fans.
I responded to your points in detail but my “comment is awaiting moderation” for no reason so that means you will probably never see it.
I’ve got two or three innocuous comments awaiting moderation. My guess is that some coward disagreed with me and flagged them. If you disagree with me, just be an adult and say you disagree with me. Don’t try to censor me.
I have a couple as well. I’ve stayed away from the comment section for years now actually. I was one of the originals from the beginning…there was sane discussion and learning then. Still great free value…but yeah…
Mine is still pending, 11 hours later. Nobody reviews these as far as I can tell. Ironic, considering the posts that have been allowed in this discussion.
We both go back a ways here, can’t even say how many years. I drop out for periods when the posting is more antagonistic than interesting or informative or even civil.
I’ve had a few that get “flagged” and usually can think outside the box and figure out why, even though as used there’s wasn’t anything wrong.
For example, if instead of using xyz you use all xs, you may be auto flagged.
Likewise, use the phrase half-(rooster)ed.
Things like that seem to be earmarked by a filter so, while you didn’t say something improper, a filter thinks you did
Sometimes it’s possible to guess the word that caused the robot system to flag a comment but the filter is effectively arbitrary, so it isn’t always clear, especially if the post was a long one. The problem I have with this system isn’t so much the arbitrariness of the flagging it’s that nobody seems to be tasked with reviewing posts “pending moderation” or removing words from the filter that clearly should be allowed. Some of the disallowed words are player’s names!
Let’s see now. MLB is upset that the public was told 42 teams are going to go away. 42. So MLB is technically cutting thousands of jobs between the teams and people who work in the cities with the teams. Ouch. But wait. MLB says for those teams that are left we only ask this. All you have to do is pay more salaries and of course we need fancy ballparks. In return we let you say you have a minor league team. That’s pretty generous of MLB. You don’t like it. Well then we are literally going to take our ball and go home. I have two words for MLB. STICK IT!! I hope you hear that everyday and in this case I hope you do get political pressure. Poor babies.
Not a congressional issue at all. What a joke.
Actually it is a congressional issue. Baseball is the only professional sport to be exempted from federal antitrust laws. Congress could have repealed that exemption at any time over the last 100 years but has never done so. It probably won’t happen now either but not because it shouldn’t happen.
Read the Toolson decision. Pretty sure it exactly says its a Comgressional issue.
The strength of baseball is the depth of its support. A key element of that depth is the minor league system. MLB will be badly hurting itself if the contract teams. Why mess up a good thing. Just pay the minor league players a little more and be done with it
The teams being eliminated would be the short season leagues. AAA, AA, and both levels of A ball wouldn’t be affected. This is because MLB is looking into going to a 20 round draft, instead of the current 50.
Its actually a good plan.
Respectfully and strongly disagree. It’s about money pure and simple
ItI love MiLB, but there are just too many of y’all. Too many great high school and college players think they have a chance, but that chance is small. Major League Baseball clubs pay all player development expenses. It isn’t unreasonable for them to conclude they are carrying too many players and teams that don’t have a realistic place in MLB. Few teams will disappear totally, but they’ll become “unaffiliated” independent league teams.
Read Milb’s 4 page rebuttal. There are actually some significant costs that MLB doesn’t pay according to MiLB, and, in MLB’s response those claims weren’t refuted. so it’s a stretch to claim MLB foots the whole bill
That form of contraction might be factual based on league structure…but doesnt save individual cities from losing a team in a higher league. A current Triple A team could conceivably shift to A ball…and some have voted on tax supported parks FOR higher level teams. This is a RIDICULOUS MLB maneuver…you will see cities file a stack of lawsuits.
Baseball teams could also shift their teams closer. For example….Cedar Rapids could lose their A affiliate of the Twins to St Paul very easily. Take Wichita. Brand new 10k seater….thatll play well when the owner shifts that AAA team to Jacksonville…and they fight to get AA there. It’s real bad PR. And major legal trouble.
Every season there are changes to what cities have franchises in which leagues. Just this past season, Colorado Springs, AAA team moved to San Antonio, while the Helena rookie league team moved to Colorado Springs. And did Helena file multiple lawsuits? Nope, they just said “we’ll miss our team.” Because that’s all they could say. There’s no legal basis for any lawsuit.
Sorry that doesn’t fit your pre-conceived notion that this will ruin baseball.
Hrmm… could mlb be sued for tortious interference with contract regarding long term lease arrangements put in place as an inducement for capital improvements or new stadium construction?
Brewcrew…I was with you until your last little sarcastic spiel. Yep..aware of franchise movement. But are you AWARE that the city of Wichita has a contract with the owner of the new AAA franchise to supply a AAA team in the new tax funded park for 30 years? Most franchise movement comes at the end of stadium leases…not at the beginning of new ones. So you bet your bottom dollar the City of Wichita will file suit over breach of contract.
You want to talk in general…that’s fine…franchise movement. But you mess with 40 teams and start restructuring that ends up involving a LOT of lawyers and a LOT of negotiations.
Maybe that doesn’t fit with YOUR preconceived notions. No need to be a richard.
AtlSoxfan– Can they be sued…oh sure. And will be. They’ll face attorney fees by the tonnage. This wouldnt be a simple process no matter what. They cant just wake up and say…well next year this is what’s happening. We’re talking contract breaches….its domino. This usually takes place at the END of a working contract with a team or with a stadium lease. Theyd have to be VERY careful.
Itd be like McDonalds restucturing their franchise system.
MLB isnt going to go there…they just want concessions.
Is that contract between Wichita and the owner or MLB? Does that owner have a contract with MLB guaranteeing a AAA franchise? If not, that sounds like an owner guaranteeing something he has no control over. That ain’t MLB’s problem.
You Richards are acting like every minor league team is going away. Its just the short season leagues. Or do you think the Appalachian League should continue when over half the teams didn’t draw 1000 a game last year?
All this talk about abandoning cities that support their teams except when it comes to buying tickets.
@pdxbrewcrew- you’re missing a couple things here:
1) these Milb teams facing retraction aren’t in dire financial straits and needing special subsides due to poor attendance.
2) many of these low-level teams that draw 1000, 2000, 3000 a game are not in densely populated areas. I’d argue that per capita for local population many of them have higher attendance rates than almost any mlb team in existence.
Using your logic, a town with a population of 100 that can sell 50 tickets a game deserves a minor league team because such a high percentage of the population supports the team. Hey, 50% support from the residents of a town is nothing to sneeze at.
The biggest problem in MLB today is an aging fanbase.
Most people first learn to love baseball at a minor league park.
The obvious solution: get rid of 1/3 of the minor league teams!
In 50 years, baseball as we know it today will no longer exist.
Rob Manfred will be in the Hall of Fame for making the owners lots of money (ala the despicable Bud Selig), but America will no longer care.
The HR derby that passes for baseball today breaks my heart, but what Manfred is trying to do is disgusting.
I thought that the commissioner was supposed to act in the best interests of baseball???
I’d venture to say most people fall in love with baseball on TV. Perhaps they SHOULD at a ballpark. It really depends on where someone lives I suppose. I grew up with WGN being pumped in. The game had no better salesman then than Harry Caray. Id also say baseball cards played in for my Gen X peers.
Baseball has to be personal and in their hands…no matter what generation probably.
None have for 25 years why would they start now
Lawyers…….ugh.
Let me say that Rob Manfred is worse than Bud Selig. I don’t know if you can say anything worse about anyone.
Great the government is getting involved, which means it’s only going to get worse……Bernie Sanders probably wants free baseball for all!!
The right can’t meme
oh, boy, another political turd. How original.
No worse than you saying the same thing over and over again…..
Just flagging the crap so people can step around them.
You sure do talk about turds a lot. Something you would like to tell us? Oh, it is projection. That’s pretty private stuff. I’ll keep your issue quiet. My condolences to you.
Impeach manfred
It would be more entertaining than the farce going on in DC right now.
Here is the reality. of the situation. MLB baseball needs the minor league systems. MLB wants more control of the number of players while pushing the financial responsibility of salary to the MiLB owners. But in reality, the players are drafted by the MLB owners and are under MLB team control. Many of “us” fans are getting tired of the greed by players AND owners. Out in LA, a majority of Dodger fans cannot even watch their team due to the greedy TV deal with Sports Net LA. Directv, Dish, and other cable outlets do not have access to Sports Net LA. Why? Dodgers sold to the highest bidder and Sports Net LA is trying to charge distribution outlets exhorbitant amounts of money monthly for a six month game. As a result, the inpass has entered the …gulp….6th season. Parking is going up to $30.00 per game, concessions are through the roof, game ticktets are sky high. With $300- $400M contracts becoming more regular, the “average” fan is being priced out. MLB surely doesn’t want so much support for MiLB right? They want less financial investment, but limit the number of development teams. At some point in time, the bow will break.
I never thought it could get worse than Bud Selig. I was wrong.
MLB is doing this to get out in front of Legislation in Congress to entitle minor league players to at least minimum wage, as they are making squat right now. If they are not affiliated with like 6 teams, which is what the average MLB team has, then they don’t have to pay all those minor leaguers. Keep AAA in the fold is okay, as the players salary there is higher than minimum wage
This is gross.
Baseball has evolved into a multi billion dollar industry. While minor league affiliates may not have the on paper gains that the MLB shows, you cannot discount it’s part and value in the MLB gains. Development alone is invaluable. If you look at it from a practice squad mentality, the better your practice squad is, it makes your A team that much stronger. They have to be if they want to keep their jobs.
Additionally, the argument can even be made that teams, for years now, have abused the process of service eligibility. Lack of integrity in terms of not fielding the best possible team to save money for their business in the long term. I’m not here to discuss whether that is right or wrong, but to point out that there are major caliber players, sometimes even stars, being stockpiled in the minor league system to the advantage of MLB owners. The farm system provides you depth, flexibility to think long and short term, and the opportunity to develop young players into home grown MLB talent at a team friendly rate during a player’s prime years of service.
The disparity between wages in players is mind boggling in and of itself to me. I understand some player’s performances represent the ability to earn more, and rightfully so. However, the amount that differentiates between a player receiving hundreds of millions more than their teammates is wild when you really think about it and analyze the structure of it.
For the MLB to bully it’s way to the negotiations it desires is gross. Sometimes, just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you should. And it doesn’t mean it is the best thing for the greater good of baseball. The sport is where it is, in some part, due to the development of the farm system. And in a team sport that the TEAM aspect of it is so imperative, the MLB needs to recognize the MILB is their teammate, not their opponent. And treat them as such.
Manfred need to go. I stand with MiLB.
On a player development side, I can see that a reduction of teams and rounds in the draft may be good. This may affect college ball, where those who may be drafted after the 20th round, make their way to college teams. Whether this will be good or not, I cannot tell.
Unfortunately my local short season A team is on the block. With a recently renovated park and training facilities and a reasonable distance to two nearby teams (1 hour travel north and south) the only reason I can see that they are on the block has more to do with their affiliated MLB team (SF) and it’s other affiliated MiLB teams.
High School players drafted after the 20th round rarely sign especially now that bonuses are capped (since 2012).
I haven’t seen the need for so many rounds since then…..
Quite honestly, college baseball has come leaps and bounds in the past 25 years. The facilities at the higher level programs is well beyond most A Ball level teams. Leaving those programs is very much like taking a step down. Let the colleges at them.
Salem-Keiser is on the chopping block because they have the lowest average attendance in the Nortwest League. Tri-cities is next lowest and is also on the chopping block. The other teams draw 1000 or more a game (Spokane almost triples Salem) and are becoming a full season low A league.
This a perfect example of why which teams are losing their affiliations.
I read where there “120” plan would save MLB $20 million per year. $20 measly million per year! And they’re willing to do this. Pathetic!!
Also interesting is that none of the MLB owned affiliates were on the “cut” list. Hmmmm….
Rob Manfred needs to walk away. Worst commissioner ever. Ruining baseball. Pay the MILB players a decent wage without trying to make up the money somewhere else. They should have been doing it before. In fact, baseball has plenty of money. It doesn’t need to milk every dime out of it. Stop changing baseball for marketing reasons.
MLB teams need minor league teams. They don’t need 7 or 8 of them. Let each team have 5 minor league affiliates. The rest of the players and teams are free agents. Start a winter league in the Caribbean or Australia or South America. Then have a special draft every year where each team has to pay an entry fee in order to draft players from the foreign league. This entry fee goes to the league that the team will draft from… for instance, if the Yankees wanted a player from the Korean league, they would pay a fee to draft from that league. That money is divided up among all the teams in the league. If The Braves and Angels wanted players from the Dominican league, they would pay a fee to draft. Same with college draft. If you wanted a college player, the team pays a fee to the colleges to draft their players. Say, a team like the Marlins are trying to save money, they just don’t draft anyone at all and save the money.
Billionaires aren’t just good at making big money in business, leveraging every advantage they have, they are also good at picking up every nickel on the ground, and if there’s one out there. they aren’t going to let an opportunity pass. Expect more arm-twisting, along with as much political influence as they can marshal.
No reason to have A ball if there is A plus ball. Short season teams, rookie ball etc
All this does is make the minor more competitive and bad players are forced out quicker instead of, we will see how this pans out.
You might feel differently if it was your local team on the block. And maybe if you realized that non of the MLB owned affiliates are on the block. It’s also worth noting that the $20MM to be saved from this is a pathetic sum compared to the overall money involved and the marketing for the sport this involves…
20M won’t cover the lawsuit the city of Wichita will file over this new tax funded AAA stadium if they are shifted or eliminated. The lawyers around America will load MLB with suit after suit
A+ is too hard for less developed new draftees and some IAFA players. There’s a reason for modern farm system to have so many tiers– to ensure that no talent goes to waste.
supid solution to a non-issue. not that minors player saleries arent an issue though, its just that this being a solution to the problem is so outlandish that i cant accept it as having been said with any shred of reason.
We don’t need to start out giving every 9000th overall pick tons of money, All it would take is a decent formula that factors in pro service time, 40-man roster time, and past MLB service time. Then the guys that do stick it out for a little while can get some decent compensation for it.
i just dont think you need less players to pay them more. the teams make enough money to pay all of the minor leaguers more. it shouldnt be a matter of dissolving jobs to pay everyone else who still has a job better. i can guarantee you that any of these players losing spots sure wolnt be happy with it.
MLB’s treatment of minor league players is appalling. Most minor league players get less than minimum wage and they only get paid during the season. A minor league baseball player should make an annual salary (even 24K per year would be a huge pay raise) and receive benefits. MLB threatens to damage the core of the game.with their blatant disregard for MILB players.
Here’s a bad idea; take the money used for signing draft picks go directly to the players in the minor leagues. If a draft pick decides not to sign out of high school, go to University. If a draft pick decides not to sign out of University, they are banned from Major League Baseball for two years.
That way every minor leaguer will be better compensated. $289-mil was spent on picks in the 2017 draft. Assuming a base of $300-mil available, split $10-mil per team and split that between the affiliates to pay players AND coaches on-top of what they are currently receiving.
As for Manfred, there is a lot to unpack. Bottom line, game speed can’t “speed up” if the league is dead-set on boosting offense. More walks, hits, homeruns, foul balls thanks to crowding the plate, longer games.
This is not going to end well
Jesus quit $&@!ing with the game and leave all politics out of baseball.
I was not a huge fan of Selig and I think he capitalized on his delayed fight against steroids, but Manfred has been bad enough that I miss the Selig days. Manfred has seemingly alienated fans, major league players, minor league players, the player’s association, and will likely lead us to the next player’s strike when the new CBA comes around.
He’s also failed to garner more interest in the game, effectively shorten games, and in the event minor league teams are cut or lose affiliation to the MLB, I expect the quality of players to end up being compromised as well. It’s just ridiculous.
This is just my theory on the long-term impact this would have if the minor league system were extinguished. We’ve seen an influx of young talent at the major league level over the last few years, and a trend against paying free agents after the age of 30 (unless they are premium contributors). What could happen is seeing baseball turn into a youth sport, if all players are young, the lack of experience gap shrinks. Overall, this likely would harm the product because really MLB would be the same level as a mix of the most talented players from a pool of AA/AAA ages, and a sprinkling of highly productive, older contributors. Further, with the current arbitration system, young players get paid little compared to their production. Couple this with not spending on players approaching 30 or beyond, and now owners get their wish; low payrolls and comparable payrolls. Many have been wishing for this, but I hope people see that this is at the expense of the players, primarily and harms the overall product of what fans see on tv or at the games, secondarily.
What am I missing? Why is MLB suddenly so angry at MiLB?
These teams can’t cost MLB much more than the 25th and 26th man on the roster and usually are very geographically located to provide a built-in fanbase.
If anything, Minor League teams should be furious that the MLB pays their draftees nothing while they are in the minors and are forced to do wacky promotions just to keep the lights on.
I’ll never forget Cleveland Indians pitcher Carlos Carrasco talking about his stint in the minors: I ate pizza 60 days in a row because I found a place where slices were $1 and I really didn’t have much more money to buy anything until I got to the Majors.
Seriously, MLB? Your pipeline of talent doesn’t even have food to eat? That is ridiculous and MLB should be at least putting together high quality nutrition for these guys who will be stars of tomorrow. And as someone who lives in a city with 3 minor league teams, I know that is 100% true, because most players live with host families because they are making less than $1,000 a month and need to get fed and have a roof over their head just to survive.
A huge embarrassment for MLB and the MLBPA.
Wait, I thought pizza is high quality nutrition? Damn you, Manfred!
I think you’re a Tribe fan, but seriously, would you rather go watch the Indians; or the Crushers, Rubberducks, Captains, and Scrappers anymore? I’m a baseball fan, not a Tribe fan.
Dolan is going to trade both Lindor and Kluber in the next 7 months, not because he has to, but because he wants to keep making more than a 45% IRR on his investment. It’s embarrassing. And before some apologist jumps in to support Dolan, his minority owner just bought the Royals, and as part of the disposition of his Indians stake, Dolan just got > $100M richer.
Tribe Front Office doing amazing work with the completely wretched boss they have.
Crushers? Do you mean Clippers? Also, you forgot the Lynchburg Hillcats.
To answer your question, I’d much rather go watch these teams than the Tribe. I love baseball, especially the minors. It’s more Americana.
In fact, if I have my way (please, God), my retirement will be spent in Goodyear, AZ, home of their player development complex. There I could watch all their young players in early development. Not always the most fundamental baseball, but I bet it would be very enjoyable. Bonus is the up close viewing, sitting on the bleachers, and zero cost to fans.
And yes, I consider the FO to be the best in baseball.
And as the LAST person ever to want to get government involved in any problem, Congress really needs to remove MLB’s anti-trust exemption.
Both these owners and players are getting way too fat, rich and greedy with no competition. MLB is a horrible parody of what it should be. Competition would help fix some things.
I still consider Selig worst of all time, though Vincent really messed up, too.
<>
What exactly is Bernie Sanders going to do? Not enough time in the day to simultaneously ruin baseball AND America. Send Elizabeth Warren in there to change the braves and Indians names. Haven’t her people suffered enough? But to openly mock and shame her by such racist and offensive team names…priorities mlb, priorities.
Political turd in the pool. And its got girth. Funny thing, isn’t GreenBay a successful socialist coop team?
No, it’s actually not. “Funny thing is” the team is “owned” by their fans. But none of the “owners” make money. I have stock in the Packers. Cost me a couple hundred $$$. All it is, is a piece of paper used for fundraising. And I get to go to green Bay for an “owners” meeting if I want to waste my time for that. So…no, it’s not. But nice try.
It’s not owned by a rich dude. It’s owned by the people. That’s my point. That makes it much more socialist than your average free enterprise entity.
The Packers are effectively totally controlled by an appointed board, and even then, only a very small executive committee of very wealthy and powerful folks actually makes decisions. It’s socialism in the same way that the inner circle of the Soviet Politburo was socialism.
No Mo. Wrong again.
Manfred is a slime. He is trying to strong arm the minor leagues to save the owners a total of $20 million they spend in the minors on coaching staff and player salaries. Less than $1 million per year per team. To do that he will put 5000 people out of work.
Hell, why stop at 42? too many minor league teams anyways.
and to respond to all the crying, why do you think these guys buy the teams? Baseball at this level is not a game, its a business. Businesses are around to make money. So why wouldn’t the owners try and make money and streamline their developmental costs? Cut the fat, let all these minor leaguers that are never making the show go play indy ball. Let the teams that lose their affiliations join indy leagues. Let MLB help fund the indy leagues for those rare guys that get it late and earn another chance at organized ball.
All that so the MLB can save $20MM, less than $1MM per franchise, when they are making many tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars each and every year for an outrageous return on investment because We the People have given them anti-trust exemptions so they can avoid free market competition and enjoy monopolies over their markets/fans??? No thank you. Let all those smaller cities and towns keep their teams, pay the players a living wage, and move along.
Well said Mo
All these rules changes is making the game of baseball pathetic! Rob Manfred needs too go!!!
Time to start a BASEketball league
Hope to see Preparation H Field here soon
Who really gets their feelings hurt on a baseball trade discussion site? Grow up.
Sad that a bunch of smaller sized towns are going to lose sports so some corporations can get even richer. It never ceases to amaze me how people, almost always of moderate means, can empathize with the Robber Barron over people much more like themselves. One day I guess you’ll boot-strap yourselves to a fortune.
FFS, fire Manfred already, he’s been managing the major with ill intentions from day one, and Now he wants to ruin the farm system of modern baseball.
Make Pete Rose Commission and Bonds and Clemens can be his Assistants!! Yippee
Manfred = Satan
Time to invoke those magic words against MLB – “Anti Trust Exemption”.
The legal reasoning behind that decision has been pretty much dead in the water for years, but it’s precedent so it’s not easy to overturn. Eventually, though, someone is going to come right at it and it’s going to fall. I hope that’s Manfred’s legacy… the guy that ran the ship aground…
What sucks is the single A umpires make more than the players. But a few players have some bonus signing money.
What sucks is that support people in trade schools and colleges make more money then the students.
Do you realize that you’re demanding that people learning a trade should be paid by the people teaching them the trade….that are losing money doing it?
I’d say the players are more like a grad student serving as a TA. They may not be publishing scholarly papers yet, but, they do produce at a basic level. And all development costs are negated by the fleecing called pre-arb years.
The surplus production value of a single good year of a prearb player compared to a similar FA is enough to pay basic 50k minimum salaries to the teams entire farm system
I know where your coming from. I spent 10 years driving a water tender for a fire agency making on average 72-84 k / year. Quit, bought my own truck and now contract for 4-5 times that amount and do 1/10th the work.
There also a problem if you offer a kid out of college $30K a year to play minor league baseball or pay some kid from Venezuela $30K a year to play minor league ball. Not every country has same opportunity to make that much money.
that’s the same principle that allows other employers to hire foreign help for under minimum wage. they know domestic help will demand minimum wage, so they manipulate immigrants instead.
Aren’t there really too many players just hanging on to provide a game for baseball’s future stars to grow?
Many could play in CC games and lesser 4-year colleges, if they star they will play.
Is it really greed for owners who put on the Show to think the system is too big and actually perpetuating rich teams like NYY.
If there are fewer marginal leagues, there will be more college players.
Ever think about how many minor leagues the NFL and NBA have?
Young HS players: go to college, a local JC, play ball and if your cream, you will rise to the top,
Ty
I wasn’t aware of the insane number of colleges that weren’t running baseball programs, that wanted to run those programs, and had the athletic department funding in place with nothing else to spend it on just waiting for players to put in a team.
College ball does not develop you in the same way a major league ball club does either.
The current system isn’t great, but everyone is opposed to changing it? I don’t get it.
I’m not saying Manfred’s proposed changes are the best ones to make. I just don’t understand the incredible amount of outrage in discussing changes in general.
I for one think the minor league system could definitely use some streamlining and adjustment. How exactly you would go about that is, obviously, a different story.
That is not so simple Simon. What about HS players who ready are the cream of the crop? They shod turn down millions of dollars to go to college to prove what?
Further college baseball has zero to do with development for MLB where each MLB team has their own idea of how to develop a player for their particular organization
Not quite true. Major league clubs often prefer to draft out of college not necessarily because college baseball develops the player but because the player will no longer be a teenager and their level of talent will be that much easier to evaluate.
Bernie Sanders is the biggest demagogue in American politics today.
He wrote a letter “threatening Congressional action”?
Oh boy! The stay-at-homes can tune into their local cable stations all day to watch this.
LOL
Oh nice just what we need. Bernie good for nothing sanders meddling in MLB
He seems pretty good at triggering Neanderthals like you
He seems pretty good at triggering dependent, non-functioning people like you.
I’m so jealous of your amazing job selling asbestos and snake oil, bud
I’ve never sold asbestos and snake oil, bud.
I do however envy the graduate degree you got in Name Calling. Sure beats having to gain knowledge, experience, and develop the ability to think.
Meddling into MLB? Congress granted MLB an antitrust exemption so MLB answers to Congress. Take away the exemption then they will not “meddle”
well this might be the first thing i agree with Bernie on
Say what you will about Bernie, he fights the greedy.
Bull.
Bernie used to bash millionaires, until people figured out he was one…..and he’d never held a job in his life. So now he bashes billionaires.
Let Bernie put his money at risk to create jobs for others. Why doesn’t he buy a minor league team? Get all his Congressional friends to buy some too.
Whatever you do, do not hold the same standards you have bernie for all other politicians, you might start crying even harder!
Absolutely! I just saw Bernie pummeling a mirror to a bloody pulp. Such a fighter of the rich and greedy!
People get shot when Bernie is involved in baseball.
Bernie has no business in baseball! Keep that socialist pig out of sports!
teatraitor!
Capitalism is literally doing everything you are accusing socialism of potentially doing, you know that right? People are dying in the streets in 2019. We don’t have the same society we had 10 years ago, let alone 50. Please wake up. Bernie is our only hope and the ONLY politician we should even think about trusting.
What makes Manfred think he’s some kind of Czar! All powerful and able to dictate his will onto baseball! He’s gone rogue! He’s needs knocked down a notch!
The anti trust exemption from Congress makes him the czar. Time to take the exemption away
Here’s a proposal to help solve the financial issues of the minor leagues…….
All players on major league contracts and all agents that make money in negotiating said contracts, should pay a 5% tax on all earnings to be used to build and maintain MiL:B parks, as well as subsidize MiLB player salaries.
This is no different then, say, gas taxes, which generate funds that to allow consumers and businesses to profit from the use of public roads.
–
I’m sure the all players and their agents would be more then happy to support their brothers and sisters coming up.
that coulf work, but the fundamental issue here is that this is the responsibility of the owners, not the players. higher level players shouldn’t need to pay out of their own pockets to compensate for owners who dont want to pay players minimum wage, or would rather raze parks than improve them.
OK…
If a household, business, or individual has to pay an additional 5% out of their pocket for good and services they get, wouldn’t they then go shopping to find out how to get similar good and services for 5% less?
Based on this off-seasons pay increases, player salaries are skyrocketing. Now you also want the owners to pay more to develop future players as well?
So change it up. Right now mlb teams pay a surcharge to Japanese clubs who post players on tip of the contract value.
Do the same here except instead of the posting fee going to a club, when paying a free agent the fee goes into the MiLB fund.
Their is no money issue. The owners are making record profits. They just want more. Sad they are trying to strong arm minors. Disgusting.
Maybe that’s the real issue here.
It’s ok for mlb to publish a “list of concerns/opinions” but once it’s out there, everything has to be in closed doors where nobody in the public sees or hears what’s going on. If/when milb publishes a similar sheet outlining a position, it’s time for a hissy fit.
Almost sounds like this contradictory list of “issues” by mlb is intended to create a stalemate giving cover for the more recent statement “In the absence of agreement mlb teams will be free to create relationships with any independent team or city otherwise not eligible under the curent system”
What’s that really mean? It’s cheaper for mlb or its owners to buy low value unaffiliated clubs or start one in a new municipality than pay the current fair market value for an existing team as they try to gain actual control of the affiliates.
You kids have no sense of humor.
You should have closed comments on this when the issue started.
Fire Manfred and his puppet joe torre. Sad how much he’s ruined the game. Fire him
Maybe it’s time for hearings to start on 2 fronts: revoking the anti-trust exemption, and, requiring the break-up of mlb into smaller organizations due to the defacto monopoly. Hearings to at least make national league and American league into separate entire organizations.
Then, as these hearing progress, maybe the hardliners tactics we see fade into the background some and encourage “reforms”
Also, just finished reading an article that stated at milb winter meetings it was announced that league-wide attendence INCREASED again year-over-year, at a time when mlb attendence saw a DECREASE.
Is it possible that mlb/owners think that by removing teams from certain markets there will be increased mlb attendence by capturing those eventgoers who no longer have the alternative (more affordable) venue available?
Intrigue…
Seems plausible and I wouldn’t put it past them.
Genuinely trying to understand why so many people are against Manfred’s proposed MiLB changes.
Isn’t the minor league system pretty much a mess as it is? Low attendance, long travel, poor conditions for the players at some facilities?
Also, I don’t understand the uproar over eliminating minor league teams. Are they untouchable for the rest of eternity? You can’t have change without, well, change.
Maybe I just don’t understand the potential ramifications enough. Anyone care to explain?
To be clear, I’m not a fan of Manfred. I just hate him for other reasons at the momemt.
Counter-question:
MiLB recently announced yet another year-over-year attendance INCREASE.
MLB announced yet another year-over-year attendance DECREASE.
Doesn’t that show a relative overcapacity for major league product compared to minor league?
Given the problems with mlb teams and certain markets, especially with attendance, should we discuss retraction of MLB teams such as eliminating the TB rays and Florida marlins? Should they be untouchable for eternity?
Should we discuss retraction for any mlb club requiring revenue sharing since it can’t support itself on its own revenues/merits?
The As literally have human feces back up and flood locker rooms and facilities in their ball park, and have for years, without the team accomplishing any improvement in playing conditions. I cannot recall hearing of ANY milb club with such atrocious conditions. We should retract the As as well right?
Well, not all MiLB teams are experiencing increased attendance, and it’s not like we’d be getting rid of ALL of them, just trimming some of the fat, Granted, 40 seems like too high of a number.
And I’m all for, at the very least, relocating both the Rays and Marlins, as their issues are more location-based than there being too many major league teams.
Pretty impressive of Rob Manfred to unite people on both sides of the aisle in 2019. Of course it’s because we all hate his ideas, but still.
I don’t think I’ve ever met or talked to someone who is a fan of him, and for good reason.
This is becoming a joke
Minor League ball players stay at generous folks homes for free because they can’t even afford to rent a room and have to have another job or two, while playing professional baseball. THAT IS A JOKE! Pay the minor league players AND umpires a living wage.
Curious to know why umpires haven’t factored in this at all publicly. They would be losing their jobs too if MLB decides to dump their building grounds. They suffer the same hardships as these players.
Sometimes… The MiLB team is better and more enjoyable to watch than the MLB team. Iron Pigs & Reading Phillies come to mind.
Bernie Sanders will guarantee minor leaguers make as much as big leaguers and then will wonder why no one goes to the games anymore.
So now getting enough money to not have to live with complete strangers and afford food better than McDonald’s is socialism?
Who is forcing the players to play ?
This isn’t forced labor .
They say the same about those working in Vietnamese sweatshops. That isn’t an argument.
I’m guessing the “small government” conservatives are going to demand the free marketplace bend itself to ensure that small towns continue getting teams that can’t support them.
In the same way the rest of us are forced to fund a $750 billion annual defense package for endless wars and the one that completely missed 9/11, because their constituents are too stupid or lazy to get real jobs so they have to murder foreigners to make their living.
Some of the “stupid” people you have ignorantly labeled died protecting your right to be a dumdf***…
Njbirds fan are you serious? Because they cant get a real job? I joined the military to pay for my college on my own. I could have taken financial aid cause I was poor but decided I wanted to do it myself. While in, 9/11 happened and guess what, i was sent over seas, lost alot of friends over their that were 150 times the man you are. And most were proud to serve, dont ever mistake stupidity for bravery. I was an engineer and 90 percent of my battalion had degrees and were smarter than you could ever hope to be. A real brave smart person sitting behind your keyboard. If you dont like our military and the freedoms it provides please make your way to some other country, I’m sure they would love to have you be a burden on their society
I can understand joining the military for financial reasons or for escaping horrible circumstances. But it still doesn’t change the fact that soldiers are simply tools of the business elites. I love every veteran but I do not love the politicians that use them.
Skullbreathe. A lot of my buddies I did 2 tours with didnt make it back home. I just wanted to say thank you got recognizing that…some people like the OP just dont get it and never will…and that’s fine…that shows how blessed and privileged we a are to live in the greatest country in the world
Semper fi
I can’t believe I actually just read njbirdsfans comment. So now our troops are poor stupid people who were too lazy(makes no sense considering the amounts of training and work they do in the military) to get a real job? It’s sickening that people truly believe that to be the truth.
Just what baseball needs is a socialist who ruins everything he touches… Dear Senator Sanders stick to fondly telling stories of your honeymoon in the Soviet Union to the people of Vermont and stay the hell out of baseball…
Keep reading what russians trolls tell you on twitter, genius. you couldnt be more wrong
Bernie is America’s most popular politician FOR A REASON.
MLB is like a country unto it’s own. They make their own rules, and make an obscene amount of money which should be funneled to some extent into the minor league system. But, why pay into a system that will foster American home grown talent when you can buy a player for peanuts from another country? Go Bernie!
no respect for the Jays now. they probably onpy support this because they already pay their minors players more. they just dont want to pay more overall.
Solution is simple 30 teams
1 rookie ball team (40k a year salaries)
1 single a team (50k a year salaries)
1 double a team (60k a year salaries)
1 triple a team (70k a year salaries)
1 veteran minor league team min 5 years of mlb experience (vet min salaries 250k a year if not on mlb roster).
All together it’d cost teams close to 6 mill a year to roster rookie ball through AAA salaries. Plus another 6.5 if they want a holding place for veterans. All together theyd spend $13 mill a year but increase roster to 30 not 26 increase protections to 50 not 40. Any veteran in aaaa can sign a mlb deal if not on the 50.
I like this idea. Kind of a practice squad type layout.
Who’s paying the salaries mlb teams? If so i am for it .
I dont think a rookie league team could swing that type of payday
Yes mlb pays for the teams. You can haggle over salaries.
But the incentive for mlb to do something like this is limiting earning power of mlb free agents. Maybe max 20 mill a year for however many years. Capping potential earnings in an agreement to sustain minor league teams and a veteran only minor league team for each franchise seems to help more players than hurt.
good luck for mlb ever being able to limit player salaries!
If you offer liveable wages for 2000+ players in the minors in exchange for capping earnings of what 2 or 3 players a year I’m sure there’s a deal to be had.
@Dabofus going to the Padres game – you almost nailed it. But 40k is poverty line in 2020. Start at 60k. Otherwise, well done.
Progressive Bernie Sanders want to keep the status quo. That’s Fing priceless…
what a stupid comment
He wants the giant entity rolling in cash that is afforded special rights by congress to not be able to unilaterally take away jobs, entertainment and civic pride from cities. What a jerk.
You can count the number of minor league teams that make money on John Kruk’s testicles.
Career wise, you’re not doing any 20 something year old a favor by keeping him in the minor leagues.
This is a camp for potentiality big league players, which is subsidized by MLB,. However MLB wants to run these camp is fine by me. . .
Strong Kruk reference.
It’s not the worst idea to have an even number of minor league affiliates per team since MLB has revenue sharing to begin with. Your Angels have 7 affiliates, Most teams have 8, others have 7, some even 9 teams! Why not go with 7 affiliates per team? I’m sure MLB can figure out the teams lagging support and find a resolution for those looking for a new league.
Good idea about the same number of affiliates.
I use to live in Bend Oregon. That park had no business being a minor league affiliate. Because of the way the park was built, Tim Salmon got hit in the face with a fastball that he never saw. It almost ended his career.
Fun Fact, The actor Kurt Russel, played there as an Angel minor leaguer.
I live in a minor league town. I get minor league baseball. But most of these players will never sniff the big leagues and you’re not helping them by having them throw away their twenties on a hobby.
.
Your last part brings up a very good point; the life we choose. The ballplayers all chase a dream and only a small percentage will see that dream come to fruition.
You can’t shut down the Daytona tortugas. They play at Jackie Robinson stadium
Leave socialism out of baseball, Bernie.
If anything, MLB’s massive raise in profits begs for more socialism in it. But in your head, its 1985, and you refuse to look outside and see how totally unchecked and unbalanced capitalism is ravaging America. Checks and balances, that’s what America does, right? Not when billionaires take control!
How does one create a franchise? Better question is, how did expansion come about? Would that be because wealthy people decided to invest in a baseball team? Ding! Correct.
Have current players started an expansion franchise and run the actual team as a business, taking all the risk? Ponder that before you start spewing BS about unbalanced capitalism.
So why 42 teams? That’s more than 1 per team. Who decides which teams lose more than 1 team and maybe 50 spots for their prospects. How is costing 900 prospects their jobs and dreams a good thing? Plus all 42 affiliates employes? From a cardinals fan perspective you will see alot less late developing prospect stories. There will be less time to stick with a prospect through their struggles. Alot less veterans at triple a, when younger prospects need spots. Alot less position to pitcher and vice versa stories. Losing that many prospect spots probably means guys like jason motte, trevor Rosenthal, rowan wick, robert stock, rick ankiel and even david peralta never get their shot to learn to convert. Even carson kelly needed a couple years to convert to catcher from third base. With each team drafting 40 guys each year the turnover will be immense and late bloomer stories non existant
Montfort is in on it too. Rockies management is pushing hard for this to go through according to the Denver Post.
The update added to this story today was a bit odd. Of course it isn’t just the commissioner who favors the reduction in minor league teams. He is an employee of the 30 owners and doesn’t act on his own, he acts on their behalf. The fact that only a handful of baseball execs are willing to go on record as favoring this plan is only news in the sense that the vast majority of them are happy to hide behind Manfred and pretend like this direction isn’t actually coming from them (when we know it is).
MLB leadership has to be out of their minds entirely. They’ve already really angered players, then threw a bone to minor league players only to yank the rug out from under them as the players reached to grab it.
Of course, this sort of situation occurs commonly in large corporations across the United States where companies loosen their purse strings, make a big investment outwardly communicated as a commitment to their employees and community only to turn around and try to lay off a bunch of their work force.
Proposing or making concessions to prospects and then asking MiLB to pay for it? LOL. That takes some big brass ones.
no wonder mlb is losing fans and tv viewers to nfl, nba and even nhl!
The teams losing their affiliations are the ones with the lowest attendance or have sub-standard facilities. Over half the teams drew less than 2000 a game. One of the teams had average attendance of 327 last year.
The only thing happening is eliminating the short season leagues. Of which the vast majority of players won’t ever see the majors.
Every MLB team will still have around 150 players in their systems. This isn’t “destroying baseball.” Only a moron would think that.
That’s interesting, because the Royals are going to be slated to lose three minor league affiliates….two of them won championships in 2019!
The Royals are losing two of their three short season teams, giving them the same number of short season teams as every other franchise. The low A affiliate would become one of the New York-Penn teams that are going to full season Or one of the two new cities.
They’ll still have a AAA team, a AA team, an advanced A team, a low A team, and a short season rookie team at the spring training complex.
Just like every other franchise will.
Time for an Industry Wide Strike and Shutdown.
MLB is one of the richest sports industries.
Yet, they pay many of their minor leaguers starvation wages.
Let the billionaires start losing big revenues…
It will be the only way to straighten this mess out.
Towns and cities across the country have invested in sports facilities with public monies
to support minor league clubs.
MLB has never paid their fair share to players and minor league clubs.
MLB team owners use much of their billions in yearly revenues to fill up their pockets will taking huge tax writeoffs also…
It is long overdue for the MLB Players and Players Association to support
their minor league brothers in getting the pay, benefits, rights anb status that they have earned and deserve.
If it means shutting down the 2020 MLB baseball season with a BASEBALL INDUSTRY WIDE STRIKE, THEN SO BE IT.
Minor league players are not members of the union so they are not going to strike for them. Just stating the fact.
I remember Charlie Wilson saying what’s good for GM is good for the USA. BS!! Now we hear what’s good for the MLB is good for MiLB. More BS!! Manfred and his cronies are going down the black hole when they fought the union. Baseball in these small towns is good for baseball and their communities. Shame on you. MLB.
Sheldon? You offer an apolopy. For being. Just kidding Sheldon. Come on back.