The Reds have “engage[d]” with the Indians in talks regarding shortstop Francisco Lindor, according to MLB.com’s Mark Feinsand (via Twitter). There’s no indication to this point that the discussions are anything but exploratory in nature.
We’ve heard ongoing chatter regarding the Cleveland superstar. Lindor, who recently turned 26, is entering his second-to-last season of arbitration control and projects to earn $16.7MM. Having recently shipped out high-dollar hurlers Trevor Bauer (over the summer, to Cincinnati) and Corey Kluber (more recently, to the Rangers), the Indians are seemingly willing to listen on Lindor. But indication is that the club isn’t especially anxious to deal him.
While it’s still unclear whether there’s any significant likelihood of a swap coming together, it’s interesting to hear of ongoing talks from multiple quarters. The Padres and Dodgers are among the other organizations tied recently to Lindor, though in all cases we’ve yet to hear of anything approaching a concerted effort to pry loose the star shortstop.
No doubt it’d take a massive array of talent to coax the Indians into moving Lindor. Though it’s now quite difficult to imagine he will be retained for the long haul with an extension, he’s also still a reasonably priced young star on a team that is still in an open competitive window. The Indians can plausibly hope to cover the outgoing pitching from within, though they undoubtedly sacrificed quite a lot of near-term upside in the form of Bauer and Kluber. But there’s really no replacing Lindor.
Whether there’s a path to a deal remains to be seen, but the involvement of the Reds could help spur movement on the market. It is especially notable that the Cincinnati organization has recently hammered out complicated, multi-player deals with the Indians — as well as the Padres and the Dodgers, who could consider moving Corey Seager as part of or in a follow-up to a Lindor acquisition. Hypothetical possibilities abound. At minimum, the report makes clear that the Reds are still scanning the market in search of major improvements.
Would it need to start with Castillo? What would the Reds be prepared to pony up?
your drunk right now
You’re**……
my bad lol
How do you like comments on here? Lol
Indians don’t really need Castillo … I’d almost think Nick Senzel would need to be involved
Why in the world would we trade our only center fielder. we dont have one at AAA and the market has none
Good thing the Indians just got Delino DeShields! Send him on over!
Or Billy Hamilton is a free agent again.
Atlanta will send Ender Inciarte as well.
Maybe then you’re not in a position to trade for Lindor?
In all honesty a deal moving Senzel and a few other prospects for Lindor, Deshields isn’t a bad move at all.
Winker has a lot more value offensively as the leadoff guy, and Lindor is a bigger upgrade over Galvis than Deshields is a downgrade over Senzel.
I can’t imagine the Indians would part with Lindor without getting either Senzel or Winker and a criminal quality of prospects on top of it
we have green and India both top 100 guys. those two plus maybe a guy rank 5 to 10 and they can even throw in Freddy Galvis to give Cleveland to shortstop
Throw Votto in center!
Isn’t DeShields dad a coach on the Reds? In a trade between the Indians and Reds, DeShields will be included.
Yeah, his dad managed the Dayton Dragons and the Louisville Bats… both in the Cinci organization. currently the reds 1B coach
Dansby, ended, Wright, Wilson and maybe a mid level prospect or two
Get Lindor, he’s a game changer & figure out CF later. If it takes Winker, Senzel (overrated) & a couple of prospects…do it!!! Get Corey for left Aquino in right, Ervin for CF or some combination
Or maybe the injuns extrapolated and decided to grab Aquino’s 145 HRs next year while the gettin’s good. We can also throw in Votto
Did we not trade Hunter Green? Uh-oh, this is looking like another Berestein deal
I would , senzel and winkler
yes let’s get our Outfield to make one position better
ya indians are really drooling over the cincinnati reds outfield….
Have you seen the Indians outfield? They’re probably drooling to have even some teams AAA outfield
Mercado is good & on the up. Lindor is worth more than the Reds OF. A hypothetical quality over quantity argument.
No he is not. I’ll take Aquino, Senzel and Winker over just Lindor
yes he is. and as a reds fan you can!
you lost all credibility when you said “Indians dont need Castillo”: Hes one of the best young rising stars in this game, and would headline a package for sure. Hes going to be a stud.
Indians don’t need him. They are deep, This is no knock on Castillo but a SP is one thing they don’t need at all. We got Bieber (4th in cy young), clevinger is really good, Carrasco, Civale, Plesac, Allen, and McKenzie coming and better than all of them in the minors in Ethan Hankins, We don’t need a starter.
Trade him for young assets that you do need. The Angels and Padres would probably love to help you out.
also @triber4lifer stop stealing other people’s wordage because you can’t think of it on your own / too busy insulting to prove points. CrewBrew clearly said “you lost all credibility…” and then when you argue with me what do you do? You steal someone else’s phrase they used against you. Why do that? Oh because it’s better than what you were saying. I would hate having any meal next to you as the conversation you regurgitate is equal to the idiocy you spew.
Well this was a nice, casual conversation where people were acting like adults… then you chimed in.
look around bud. chiming has commenced
@Brennan. It’s okay. He is butthurt because he’s has no one in his life and he is tired of being invisibled and no one caring about him, so he comes here to satisfy that. Indians don’t need Castillo and he is not headlining any package cause reds will not trade him. He’s is their ace and they are going for it. No sense at all.
He’s also not going anywhere. What use is making the playoffs if you don’t have the starting pitching?
We don’t need young, controllable, and extremely talented young SP. Said no one. Ever.
Aquino, Michael Lorenzen, Josh Van Meter. Aquino Right Field slugger on 6 years of major league control with Arbitration in 2023. Lorenzen is a solid reliever, along with an ability to play outfield and could possibly DH(Tito would love this guy). Van Meter is a great 2B prospect that I loved watching at AAA Louisville and fits a glaring hole for the Tribe and also has the same control and Arbitration years as Aquino. Then you get to fill in SS in Cleveland and I would go get Jose Iglesias or Asdrubal Cabrera off the free agent list for next to nothing for that. Plus this way Cleveland doesn’t really lose any competitiveness while also getting younger and less expensive. Meanwhile Cincinnati has an infield of Suarez, Lindor, Moustakas, and Votto. And an outfield of Siri, Senzel and Schebler.
You are absolutely dreaming if you think three spare parts get you Francisco Lindor.
You obviously havent seen VanMeter play much. He had 1 hot month and fell on his face, he’s extremely overrated.
A ton of talent.
The Indians really don’t really need to add to their current rotation. Clevinger Carrasco Bieber Plesac Civale is fine. I think they’d start asking for India then inquire on a young current mlb player like Senzel and finish off with a low cost bridge replacement like Galvis
going to be A LOT more than that…. you’re getting 2 years of arguably the best short stop currently in the game. Castillo, Senzel are cute starting points but the Tribe will demand the farm and rightly so. Reds fans think you are sitting atop piles of prospects/ gold & you’re not even close to being atop your own division. Getting Lindor to Cincy would be so monumental for the Reds that y’all can’t even fathom true, realistic scenarios. Also sucks that MLBtraderumors is writing anything and everything about Lindor speculation. Dramatic espn click bait tactics.
If the SS moves anywhere, it’s going to be for A LOT more than y’all are wishfully guessing
That’s why they chose the name Trade RUMORS.
Missing my point- can’t anything p much be a rumor? Anyone can start them. That’s WHY they’re rumors no? “What, to the Reds?!? I GOTTA check that out”. Dude I just heard a rumor that Gronk is gonna start at 3rd Base for Orioles and Jeter is making the first team on the moon and the Browns still have a chance to make the playoffs. I heard those because I just started them. Sooooooooooooooooooooo
Of the “star at the time” trades in the past 10 years, only Chris Sale is really comparable. The White Sox got Moncada (No. 1 overall prospect per MLB.com) and Kopech (No. 67). And that was with Sale under control for 3 more seasons, not two.
The other close comps are Roy Halladay, Cliff Lee, James Shields, & Cole Hamels, all of which netted 2-4 top 100s, most in the top 50. The common denominator: All were pitchers. There hasn’t been a superstar position player dealt in the past 10 years, Arguably the top position player dealt, Eaton, who wasn’t a star, brought back a huge haul (No. 3, No. 38 and a first-rounder), so I don’t know what to expect.
Based on that, any deal would have to start with a top 10 prospect, and the only player the Reds have that fits that bill is Senzel (No. 6 in 2018). He checks the Indians’ box for MLB ready players. Then I’d say Greene or India – both top 50 types – would have to be included and another MLB-ready piece, a good controllable young bullpen arm – which the Indians need – like Lorenzen (2 years) or Garrett (4 years), and probably another lottery ticket low-minors player.
I’m a Reds fan, and I think that’s fair. Depends on the Reds. They overpaid for one year of Puig and one year of Alex Wood for what will be 2 top 100 prospects in Josiah Gray and Jeter Downs. Then they dealt Taylor Trammell (another Top 10) for 1 year of Trevor Bauer. So they could be ripe to give up a mint.
But my guess is that Lindor stays put because no one is going to pay what the Indians want/what Lindor is worth.
Good take on the whole scenario and I agree with you more than anyone else yet! It would be a monumental shift and the Tribe would have to feel that the Reds were “ponying up” and not “fleecing” them.
Bad acid trip is appropriate for that statement
Position generally players don’t bring back as much as pitchers – even young superstars two years away from free agency. None of the teams in on Lindor really need him that badly. If they can’t get him they can make up for his bat at other positions. The Indians will probably do what the Orioles did with Machado. They’ll get back a weak haul because they delayed trading him. But with the Indians that would make sense at least because they are still competitive.
Iron Horse
Your comps all consisted of minor league prospects for major league rental stars. Then you go and throw Senzel (375 ABs in ’19) on top of your Lindor proposal. Doesn’t make sense.
@Iron horse
You are conveniently forgetting that both Eaton and Sale were signed to team favorable terms for those years. Lindor is not. He could see Betts type numbers thru arbitration, and wont have comparable value because of that. Is Lindor worth $25-30MM? Absolutely. Is he worth $25-30MM AND several top prospects? Much tougher question.
Good point stymee. I foolishly didn’t factor that in. Lindor may not gets Betts money but it should be a close trajectory- $16.7M predicted this year and likely $23M or so next year. Definitely changes the calculus.
Reds are not trading Castillo. That will not happen. It will start with India. You will prob hear about Stephenson, Santillan, Siani, Jose Garcia, Siri, and Vladimir Gutierrez all be mentionedb in talks. You might hear winkers name mentioned from major league roster
indians don’t want that for Lindor. the tribe is closer to winning than the reds so why would they give up their best player for a package of hopefuls and decent players? to gain a guy like lindor you can’t have the expectation of just trading the guys you’re ok with losing. it will take a lot more than prospects and an average mlb player. no more “bridge” toss ins. it’s not about quantity over quantity.
Reds added this offseason and are here to compete. The package will be about the prospects and maybe one major leaguer. They can trade Lindor and still compete with our rotation but it is trade Lindor or lose him for nothing and if we wait to trade him next year, the package will be considerably less.
this offseason isn’t over and the reds seem to think they just missed out beating cardinals brewers and cubs. the nl central isn’t the al central. idk if it’s something about ohio but you’re off on this one. reds are still very far behind who they are competing with in their division. lindor would significantly close the gap but cleveland could get better and more of a return from a different team
Reds have a good staff and offense, so no they are not far behind. Moose was a little overpay but he will hit in that park. Gray was good last year, Bauer is in a contract year with Castillo and Descal, and now Miley. I’m not sure where you get far behind but that is a not total legit statement at all.
ridiculous. look at the cardinals and get back to me. look at the brewers and reevaluate. cubs will make moves as well. the reds aren’t competing for the nl central in 2020 by June 1st.
Actually triber4life, you are WRONG.. Cards & Brweres both with quality staffs and actually better pitching than the Reds. You gonna take Castillo over Flaherty? By your worded standards, the Brewers have actually been more active this off-season than the Reds so wouldn’t they have positioned themselves better in the division? They were already better before this hypothetical discussion began. You do realize they made the playoffs more recently and haven’t been subtracting talent. The Cardinals are waiting to pounce on talent that will be washed over in signing periods and will scoop up some players that can contribute with minimal financial risk – before March. The Cubs are feeling THE MOST PRESSURE in the central due to their payroll, big names, recent history etc. Changes are imminent for sure but as of now The Reds are the WhiteSox of the NL Central. If you truly believe the ChiSox are competing for the AL Central in 2020 (soon I can see, but next year?), then you are disillusioned in you’re thinking imo. Drop the Ohio loyalty and look at the real picture in front of you.
That’s just laughable…best pitching staff in the division and young quality position players, plus they have the checkbook out. The Reds could easily walk away with the Central…
Dude. I am not wrong. You are blind and will see this season. What was is not what it is. Yes, I will take Castillo over Flaherty next year. Castillo has pure better top stuff. Brewers are not going up, Their farm is gone.. They added ok pieces but not good. They added no game changes pieces at all. This is not Ohio bias. I don’t even like the reds. Brewers lost Moustakes, thames, steady davies., grandal. They have no rotation at all. They had their window 2 years and refused to add a starter. The cardinals are their toughest competition. I like their pitching but they have done nothing to improve this offseason, cubs are trying to sell. Pirates are not going nowhere. The reds have 5 deep rotation and anyone that says they are the white sox of the division loses any credibility to ever post on here again. You need to lay off the green man,
You read it here first, Folks; a mistaken Tribe fan says “Reds over Cards/Brewers/Cubs in NL Central 2020”. LOL WOW
Wish I had some green but I’m not Chiefin Wahoo over here yet… Castillo is 3 years older than Flaherty. I don’t need to embarrass you on that one. Castillo is amazing but I think the consensus is clear with Flaherty. Gray found renaissance last year but it didn’t work out everywhere he’s been for a reason. Bauer is a headcase and if things aren’t great, he’ll make them worse before better. Wanna bet your division on Wade Miley…lol I hope they do. Moustakus isn’t a young Moose…. Do you not see the flurry of activity the Brewers are making? You stated that making the most moves means you’re doing your team most justice. Is that true Padre fans? Also WRONG AGAIN w/ Cards – they just added Kim who could easily be the next Mikolas signing. Cards have strategy, they sit and wait if it’s not clear who they want or price or market. Has it worked out better for the Cardinals or Reds throughout history? Want to compare Reds and Cards numbers head on? Please be my guest and do that. You talk about the NL Cen division like you know it. The Cubs are not going away. The Brewers are not going away. Stop crowning the Reds before they’ve accomplished anything!
What consensus? It may be clear to you. I don’t care about age when they both young.. I care about stuff and Castillo just has plain better stuff. I like Flaherty a lot. He is really good but I will take Castillo this year. Also, Gray might have just figured it out and you can listen to the media and call Bauer a headcase all you want but he is one of the smartest pitchers in baseball. The narrative that he is a bad guy is totally incorrect. He is different but not a headcase He has made mistakes like we all have like me trying to talk to an idiot. He has ideas in what is best for his body. His driveline is changing baseball and it goes beyond the field. You just repeating what others say instead of having an original thought.. I never said just making moves. Reds have made good moves. Brewers have added like part time pieces and they have no farm anymore and no rotation at all. Also, you’re depending on Kim of the cardinals to be the be mikolas? which one. the good one or the one last year where teams seemed to figure him out a little more? I feel very sorry for you. I do know baseball cause I actually watch it instead of espn highlights and pretend I am somebody that knows. You can’t use history to say what it will be this year. I have clearly stated right now. I didn’t crown any one. You want to say I did. I said they are no worse than second right now with the current moves.
Thought you just had the Reds winning the division? Did you look up the teams in the NL Central or something lol…. Also I don’t have a “Drum life” but that sounds pretty cool. I’m sorry you’re so offended by my comments. I think maybe you should buy some Reds tix this season and I’ll meet you in Cincy for a date vs the Cards and you can show me how much better the Reds are than the Cardinals. PS ty for the attention. I know there isn’t much to do in Cleveland 🙂 by your logic, the Reds are the Nationals of 2020 because of Sonny Gray, Wade Miley, Trevor Bauer and Luis Castillo… I’ll take that bet on YOUR DRUM LIFE!!!! (like those caps??)
You need to slow down, breathe, stop using insults like a small child resorting to frustration, and understand it is ok to disagree, my friend. I don’t think your life is dumb or that you are an idiot. I see youre a Cleveland guy so I know you’ve dealt with struggle and hardship. RESPECT. However, please stop trying to prove any point you are making by using insults. Thanks Triber
I also would appreciate it if you’d read your sentences before pressing “post comment” bc everything you’re describing regarding intelligence and intellect is clearly contradicted in your use of speech & wording.
I have read all your comments and you are the most ignorant baseball fan that has no idea what he is talking about. Talking about Castillo being a talking point in a trade.? He is not a talking point at all. he will not be traded as they are going for it. I said reds were right now now worse than 2nd. I don’t need to look up anything as I know baseball. Maybe you should try watching it. It’s fun. You say the dumbest things i have ever heard. it’s funny to be honest. who said they were the nationals? You want to put words in my mouth cause i put your ill knowledged self in your place. i said the nationals won by starting pitching. Please do me a favor, if you ever see me on here again, don’t reply. I feel more stupid by the moment listening to you. You ignored from now on.
If you think the Brewers have a better pitching staff than the Reds, then you definitely are on a bad acid trip.
LOL you just said you read all of my comments? I’m flattered although that’s a lil bit of an obsessive tendency on your part and kinda creepy. Also how do you know I’m a male? So many assumptions! Can women not enjoy baseball? Your cracks are showing through assumption and ignorance. You’re fired up over our interaction which is great, but constantly contradicting yourself by assuming you know anything about me whatsoever, and using attempts at personal slights to strengthen your view? C’mon dude. I know you know what year it is! Be better. PS the Reds aren’t winning the Central. They aren’t coming in 2nd either. But you may wanna be aware of the ChiCago team in your division instead of caring about the one in the NL Central. Or don’t! HAPPY DRUM LIFE TRIBER
You’re not my friend. You’re a troll. It’s not even funny. It would be ok if it was an intelligent conversation but you just say things to be different and they make no sense at all. I may be a tribe fan but I don’t just say they’re the best because I am. That’s not how I am. I have no dog in the fight for the reds or against the cardinals. Facts are facts. Anyone who says reds, right now, are like the white sox lose any credibility now or ever with me which is why you will not converse with me on here anymore. They’re are a lot of actual baseball fans who I can speak with.who can have a conversation with.smh
Brewers may have a better bullpen/closer situation. Reds are deep with guys who can eat innings and have been successful at points in each of their careers, each with some sort of baggage besides Castillo (Wade’s being age). My point is that it’s hard to say the Reds are the NL Central favorites or even contenders bc of Bauer, Gray, Castillo and Miley. Cards / Brew / Cubs still positioned better imo. PS the acid was good not bad TG
Thanks for cleaning up the insults, I appreciate that. You keep conversing with me though even though you’re saying you’re done? You’re so hung up on the WhiteSox comment (which is true) that you’ve decided to focus on me instead of my writing? You do realize you have no idea who I am in any facet besides my handle “badacidtrip69” and you’ve come to the conclusion you don’t like me? Man, what if I was your mother in your basement sneakily writing about baseball thoughts online. Strangers upset you this much? Lol it’s more and more fun seeing you squirm and try to clean up your wording. The Reds aren’t winning the central. Let me know if you’d like to exchange emails address my friend. IPO in Lakewood? or is that Lorrain. 🙂
The Cardinals were a fraud team in a fraud division. What happened in the NLCS was embarrassing
I’m not saying the Reds will win the the central but to sit there and think they can’t compete with the cardinals or Brewers is pretty silly
“Compete” is a hell of a word. Don’t the Marlins “compete” in the NL East? Of course the Reds will compete. They’ll be competing in late July when they’ve fallen out of contention and are selling. BTW who beat the Nationals in the playoffs? So a sweep in NLCS determines an NL Central title and Division Series win a fraud? Lol ouch. #WhatHaveYouDoneForMeLately
No one ever said anything about being the best about anything. No one was declaring Tribe was best or Reds best or Cardinals best etc so IDK where you got “I don’t just say they’re the best because I am”. Man that reads pretty wonky; I don’t understand what you were feebly attempting to prove. V confusing! WhiteSox are on the rise. Reds are finishing below 80 wins and below second place in NL Central 2020. See, I don’t need to insult you because I have the wherewithal to understand I don’t know you and I’m not assuming anything about who you are… you should look into that sometime. Insulting strangers could be a dangerous game, my friend. Especially in East Cle!!!
Brewers with a quality staff and better pitching than the Reds… troll alert.
Nah I just have an opinion that the Brewers, Cardinals and Cubs are currently overall better teams than the Reds. That’s all Popeye.
In saying this you seem to display the Tribe is either closing their window of winning with Lindor here and are looking to future with prospects developing, or that Lindor isn’t as vital and the team can find ways to win enough games without him to win the division, secure playoff games, prove to their fanbase they are still trying to win-now / aren’t rebuilding and it wasn’t a mistake trading away the star face the small market franchise was incredibly lucky to bring up in the first place. Hard to reason Tribe is doing either of those. Lindor is not Kluber. It isn’t trade Lindor or lose him for nothing… what if they win a WS in the next 2 years BC of keeping Lindor? If he leaves after that is it still for nothing? What is your goal for the team – to win or to covet prospects? Can’t have it all, chappy.
@titanticstruggs We can talk in July when the Reds are out of it and I can hear your excuses then. This isn’t a new front office. These moves aren’t innovative. Just lemme know if you’re serious about Reds winning Central in 2020. Read that aloud bud.
Your crazy. Reds will finish ahead of Pitt, Cubs, Brewers… it will be between Reds and Cardinals
Also agree with triber4life
Not sure why you’re bringing up the Marlins but if you want to continue to blabber on, go right ahead
way to understand what i was saying. bad teams still compete. they go out there and play the game competing. you get it now or..?
*youre as in you-are. rather be crazy than illiterate. no one has mentioned pitt once but thanks for clarifying! also i agree with badacidtrip69
i bring up the marlins because they are bad yet they trot a team out there. how else can i make this clearer to you?
no team that wins a division title as well as a playoff series is fraud. what else ya got andy?
Actually, you said the Brewers and Cardinals both have better pitching than the Reds. Scroll up. It’s still there. And it’s still wrong.
And in that ball park Lindor could easily hit 45 HR’s. Lindor would have the breakout Scooter Gennett season on steroids.
finally somebody who understands. the reds had a lot of good fringe prospects
Go home, you’re drunk
No chance on that.
Reds would give up a lot (as required), but him.
NO on Lindor
YES on Mookie Betts
Go Reds!
Betts is only a one year rental.
Drunk or does not understand value and time.
NOT CASTILLO, EVER.
MAYBE WINKER, AND INDIA,
AND SCOTT S.(NOT SURE HOW
TO SPELL HIS LAST NAME) IF HE’S
STILL WITH REDS AAA.
I THINK THAT SENZEL COULD MAYBE
BE TRADED, WE HAVE ERWIN. BUT
MAYBE SEE IF THE INDIANS WOULD TAKE HIM INSTEAD.
OR KEEP BOTH AND ADD GALVIS?
Getting Lindor , they’d have to part with winker, senzel, and hunter Greene. I’m ok with that.
No. Just no
As good as Lindor is he’s not worth anymore than senzel and maybe galvis as senzel will be very good himself and controlled for 5 more seasons as compared to just the 2 for Lindor. Adding in India and or hunter Greene is way too much as Greene as ace stuff.
We don’t know if Senzel is good. He blows his nose and gets injured. Lindor is a top 5 player in the league and franchise guy. He, even with 2 years, is more valuable than anyone in this year’s free agency or through trade. The only thing that hurts that is reds can’t resign him. As far as Green being an Ace? No. He is not. He has played in 20 games in the minors. He hasn’t done anything. Their is also the surgery he had. That package would be an instant no go. Not even close.
Well, Rendon and Cole were more valuable in this year’s FA pool, unless you’re not counting them because they’re taken.
Well, he is better then Rendon and plays a prime position great. Cole is really good to but he is a pitcher. I would probably take a great everyday player over a starting pitcher due to the amount of games he will effect (all health considered). The contract makes your point understandable because they are locked up now and lindor has 2 years left. You could say that for that reason but things equal in contact, lindor is more valuable and is the better player, no knock to Cole who is awesome. Rendon is good but he is not a franchise player like Lindor and not as good.
@cleve man it sucks to see a cleveland fan so disillusioned. It needs to be more than what you’re ok with getting right now.
You’re delusional if you think Nick Senzel and Freddy Galvis is worth Lindor
Lol. must be a Cleveland Fan. stop drinking form the lake
Everything I said is true. Sorry. you don’t like facts.
Opinions are not facts. Just thought I would try to teach you something today.
You can’t teach me anything but thanks.
I think they could get him with a package of Winker, India, and Greene/Santillan as the base.
This trade is legitimately insane from the Reds’ side. Winker with India is probably an overpay, but then tossing in Greene/Sanillan for good measure just makes this ridiculous.
Indians don’t need Winker. They already have a RH hitting platoon corner OF in Jordan Luplow.
2019 WAR:
Winker – 0.9 WAR in 338 AB’s
Luplow – 1.7 WAR in 225 AB’s
First of all, Winker is a lefty. Secondly, looking at last years WAR is a terrible way to evaluate a young, high-ceiling player. Teams have been trying to pry Winker from the Reds for the last 2+ years, including the Indians–for a reason.
If you pair Winker and Luplow you’d have a hell of a platoon
lmao ok is that “hell of a platoon” better production from a star shortstop who doesn’t ever need to platoon?
“First of all, Winker is a lefty.”
–
@Saint Chrise;
You’re correct.
I saw Winkler play and was not impressed. He lost his starting job so when I watched the Reds later in the year he wasn’t the days I watched.
If other teams are “trying to pry Winker from the Reds for the last 2+ years” I’d suggest the Reds cash in. The Indians have Tyler Naquin – a better hitter with more then double Winkers WAR in 2019.
Naquin is nothing going nowhere.
That would be enough. I have giving up Geene, if he is part of the trade, he is the majority of it.
from the CLE side, not even close.
Cleveland says no and moves on. Cleveland wants controillable MLB talent and the only piece that fits their needs would be Senzel. Personally I am a bit concerned of all of his health issues.
Me too
Drop Senzel and add a 15-30 OK.
Senzel, India & a maybe hunter Greene?
India, yes. Senzel, no. Greene, maybe.
NO! cheapskates
I agree 85. Senzel is the first Reds’ top prospect to make MLB from the recent lean years. He was the best hitter from his draft class. Cincy has converted him to a CFr, and he acquitted himself well there in his rookie season. CFrs who can hit are a rare breed. 5 years for 2 years is an overpay.
If we’re talking prospects, India and anyone not named Lodolo, Tyler Stephenson, or Garcia.
LOL, yes their 3 top draft picks…that’s going to happen
UNPROVEN PROSPECTS VS TOP 5 PLAYER IN GAME RN… OKAY YA DINGUS. I’LL GIVE YA MY BITCOIN FOR YOUR CASH RIGHT NOW. PEOPLE SAY ITS “REALLY GONNA TAKE OFF” AND IS A “SURE THING”…..
I highly doubt 3 of an organization’s best young players, with 17 years of control between them, for 2 years of a great SS who will likely cost between $40-50M is nearly as far off as you seem to think it is.
The talented pieces might be there but unless Cleveland picked up a shortstop in the deal. I don’t see them doing it. They could still win the Central but not without Lindor or at least a quality Shortstop.If they’re out of it by the deadline then a trade makes sense.
wtf? Have you seen the Cards / Brewers / Cubs? you are delirious
Have you seen the Brewers pitching staff and depth? But go ahead, keep commenting
yea i saw it in the postseason last year. because they made the post season. i also saw the underachieving cubs out pitch cincinnati. what am i missing here? haven’t even mentioned cards who perennially make better decisions than reds. reds fans are delusional today. make no more moves bc clearly you have the best depth and organization! lol #getouttahere
reds are the red headed step children of the nl central
Brewers have lost two sticks not easily replaced and their pitching staff is not real good. .
Boston will not be trading Betts because they want too much. Cleveland will not be trading Lindor because they want too much. It’s that simple. The interesting thing is that Cleveland fans were talking this same way about Kluber, like he would bring them the world, and then look what they got for him. As for Lindor, two years is only two years.
Kluber was injured and if Lindor doesn’t turn out, the Reds could flip him also.
If the Reds wanted a plus shortstop, they should have offered Didi Gregorius 30 million for 3 yrs and I think they would have gotten him……Either way, they have to do something with already acquired SS Freddy Galvis and trading a BOAT LOAD of prospects to get Lindor, when they could have had Didi Gregorious for just a bit of cash, makes no sense whatsoever……I think the Reds acquire Frankie Lindor, when Hell freezes over……..
Please, don’t call him “Frankie” he is nicknamed “Paquito” Lindor here in Puerto Rico.
He might not be in Puerto Rico. Maybe he is nicknamed “Frankie” Lindor wherever he is located.
Please, don’t call him “Frankie” he is nicknamed “Paquito” Lindor here in Puerto Rico.
Excellent clarification for a likely all star
The Reds can’t just force someone to sign. Didi wanted to play for Joe Girardi so if the money was close there was nothing they could do.
DiDi is betting on himself he wanted a 1 yr deal. He coulda had multiple year contracts of a few teams to choose from
India, Santillan, Winker and Galvis
As a Reds fan I’d do that and immediately throw the checkbook at Lindor
too light for Lindor. Santillan might end up just ok in the bullpen. Winker is always hurt and Galvis is barely a starter at this point.
I think this is a reasonable starting point. They may need to add in one more prospect or swap Santillan for Greene, but I don’t think this is too terribly far off.
I say if you added Gutierrez or another piece, you be there but Winker value is down and Galvis is what he is. They just don’t have much value. India is really good. Santillan is solid but I’m not sure how people value him. He looks like he could be an avg starter at this point.
In a heartbeat…
Lindor to Dodgers
Seager to Reds
Lux, Pollock and cash from Dodgers, Lodolo, India, and Garrett from Reds to Indians
Thanks for the laugh.
Do enlighten.
he finds it funny.
Trading 2 #1 picks and our best LH reliever for 2 years of Seager i find humorous unless an extension could be reached.
I like your 3 team ideal but think it would more likely be Galvis, garrrett, and India from the reds
Honestly that package seems weaker to me than what I proposed
Put the pipe doooown…
Let’s hear your take then. You’re always a voice of reason
They won’t trade Garrett, he’s their best lefty in the BP, and you never trade a man that isn’t afraid to charge an entire dugout, lol! I think Winker, Galvis, India Aquino and Santillan…
Don’t think the Indians see the return in that package. India and Santillan are fringe 100 prospects…and the rest kind of are who they are at this point.
And yes, losing Garrett would be tough. But he has value and bullpen is the easiest part of a team to replace
Another reason I don’t think they include Garrett is they don’t know what to expect from Iglesias…
but isn’t Lindor the best shortstop on the Indians? By your logic they shouldn’t trade him since he’s best at his position on depth chart….
losing Lindor would be “tough”.
I’m not trading TWO top ten prospects PLUS TWO starters in the OF (particularly Winker) for only two years of anyone not named Trout.
who? free agents that are any good are long gone
Garrett goes nowhere…
I don’t know about the parts of the trade, but a 3-way involving the Reds AND Dodgers actually seems realistic. The Reds have recent trade activity with both teams and Seager does seem like much more of a fit on the Reds than Lindor.
Seager is not worth that much.
He is good, but not that good.
India and Garrett is all I would give for Corey (figure 8 WAR) over 2 years.
better than a lot of BS i’ve seen on here today. Most Reds fans thinking “Winker and everything else we don’t care about losing!” for Lindor.
Too much give from the reds for someone they arent targeting.
if they didnt make that trade for Bauer that’d have still had a chip in Trammell
Silly Season
I imagine the package would be something along the line of of Senzel, Winker or Aquino, India, Galvis, and another Top 10ish prospect not named Greene, Lodolo, Stephenson, or Garcia. Perhaps Rece Hinds. Rest assured Senzel would be part of that deal. Given their desire for a RH batting corner OF last year, I think they would want Aquino over Winker.
id sell high on Aquino if I was them
I would too…
Reds are alreadylooking for another OF. I think they might want to hold onto Senzel for CF and he has injury concerns. That be a risk for the tribe. He can play 2b for the tribe, though but if they wanted a top 2b, they just try to get Lux from the dodgers. I think a package centered around India and Santillan would be more sensible.
LA does not want to give up Lux. But if we managed to somehow get Lindor I think it would only benefit us in signing that final outfield piece. But say it was the five players I listed above (Senzel, Aquino, Galvis, India, + other prospect), would you even care if we had an OF with Winker, Irvin, Jankowski, and whichever corner OF we sign (Dickerson, Castellanos, or Ozuna)? I think we sing one of those three regardless of a trade. For Lindor, I could live with a CF of WInker/Jankowski.
You really want Winker in CF? That’s a no. Janikowski is good in the field but he is a 4th of. I say maybe one of our OF would head over Will they sell high on Aquino? I say no at this point.. As far as the dodgers, they may not (which if i was the dodgers I wouldn’t) but i wouldn’t be shocked if they did if they extended Lindor within the trade.
You’re right in that I wouldn’t want Winker in CF, but for Lindor I could live with it. You said a package centered around India and Santillan would be sensible – I can appreciate that. But we would have to give you more. Senzel despite injury, is the closest thing to a sure bet for a future All-Star you would have in any player mentioned in any scenario. I am just curious how you would fill out the package beyond India and Santillan. (Honest question – no sarcastic tone at all.)
Me? I am an Indians Fan, so know the bias. I tend to package low on these deals but it might be a little more due to Lindor being a stud. I like a couple of players in the reds system others may not. I would say Lindor Plus one of our OFs we don’t need (Deshields, Naquin, Zimmer) for India (we need him. you don’t), Stephenson (we need another C option), Gutierrez (I think he be good in BP right now for us). and Siri ( I still think he has a bat even though he has struggled in AAA) plus Galvis. You could include Winker (swap out Siri) in that if you wanted but I’m not sure it makes sense to trade him and bring another OF back in one from Cleveland. With Winker added, It seems a little heavy price to pay. He is a good OB guy even though he is injury prone. Indians did like him before. I wanted to include Santillan but not sure where we put him if they want to keep him as a starter, so I didn’t include him. You could work it around to include Siani but that would make your number 3,7,8 prospects (India, Stephenson, and Siani) That seems steep.
OK – I see what you’re saying. I was just thinking that in trading Lindor you would want a package of players that could still help them try to win this year. Obviously no one player would replace him, but I was thinking with Senzel, Aquino, and Galvis as a stopgap – you would have players that fill needs and could help you win this year. I think the Reds are trying hard not to part with Stephenson, since we have nothing at C in the system beyond him and so close to ML ready. He is arguably the most indispensable prospect we have for that reason as well as his bright future. I’m curious to see how it shakes out. If we did include him, we would have to live with the C position being an offensive black hole in our lineup for years to come. It is now, we were just hoping to change that with Stephenson.
These trade packages are hard to come up with when you think about it. It’s either too much or too little. I mean you never know like with Kluber trade (I liked it a lot) but it seems the consensus we didn’t do well at all. In all that I have read and heard, having cost control players is the most important thing for Cleveland and if you believe that, wouldn’t they center it around prospects? I still think they can compete without him. I think it’s still us and the twins and i expect regression from them. I mean honestly If I am the reds. I say no to Greene and Lodola and work around other prospects. I prob would not give up India+Santillan ( as a cleveland fan. yes). I agree Stephenson might be a hard sell to trade with their C depth
Cleveland is not looking for a prospect driven deal so they would quickly say no.
The are looking for cost controlled youth. India would be part of the deal unless it’s Lodola or Greene (don’t see the reds trading him). Reds are not going trade a major piece of their major league roster to get lindor. It wouldn’t make sense. I would not be shocked to see senzel but he plays CF and reds need to add OF with what they got
This is a good match the more I think about it. The package could be:
India 3B: He is blocked in Cinci and is a legit top prospect to headline as deal.
Lodolo SP: Another top prospect to join India. The Reds seem to be favoring veterans in their rotation lately anyways.
Galvis SS: MLB level veteran to play SS for CLE
Then probably a mix of one or two low minors high upside guys CLE likes or a MLB level reliever.
No way I make that trade! Indians need bats. Senzel has to be included with India, Galvis, and then another piece or two.
Who in the world is playing CF in that scenario? There are NO CFs in FA. Senzel might not be a good fit in CF, but he’s better than everything in FA or realistic trade.
Also, your deal has Senzel with a ton of control, India who hasn’t even touched his service time, and “another piece or two.” These deals no longer happen, it’s not 2004.
I can’t believe people even suggestions senzel winker or any of our bullpen. this would be about making a better team so the logical thing would be to trade out of prospect of or players you don’t need. and the most logical thing would be to trade India,green and gavis. you might have to throw in one other guy but I think that would get it done and it also would make the Reds better without making them worse. basically you don’t want to trade anything you’re going to use in the next 2 years or it’s pointless. you would also want to dump gavis 5 mil
You give up things of value to attain things of value. Pretty easy to understand. Treat the team you’re potentially trading with as your own team and unless you’re so much smarter than the guy trading the better single player to you, you need to approach the scenario with logic and respect, & You’re right, it isn’t 2004, but Billy Hamilton in CF could make it 2014.
I can’t believe you think Lindor will go for the things the Reds fans “don’t want/need”. That’s not how this works! Indians aren’t working for the Reds. Both teams want to get better from it, THATS WHY THEY WOULD DO IT.. Too many people basing their opinions off of what they want from their team. Look at it inverse and see if you would feel great about these scenarios as a Cleveland fan trying to get the most out of a generational talent you were lucky enough to scout and develop. India (unproven), Green (unproven) and Galvis (your bridge for fans of Lindor?) is laughable. The Tribe will want players that inevitably make them better & that you don’t necessarily want to give up. It’s not a game of “how many Reds players do we not need? Give them all of them for a player better than anyone on our team right now!” Once you can accept that and display respect in your evaluations, you may start seeing what it would take imo for something this monumental to happen. .
yes they’re called prospects. why in the world would any team trade their only center fielder? I mean literally they don’t have a replacement at the next two levels and there is zero quality people on the free-agent Market. so yeah we be getting better at shortstop but much much worse in Center.
most teams are going to be offering prospects and that’s just how trade usually go. you’re not going to get a bunch of MLB players the best thing you’re going to get his MLB ready players. They have 2 top 100 guys and a few frindge top 100. thats value enough. if not Cleveland better get lucky and find someone who wants to do a player for player trade
datrain021
Then you’re going to make the same mistake you did with Kluber and sell low because you asked too much. India, Winker and Lodolo are absolutely a fair deal for Lindor, given he only has 2 years left. You’re definitely not getting both India AND Senzel.
Can’t call it a mistake until we see results. I get you are forecasting but what happens if the prospect from Tex becomes the new Kluber? You do remember that deal right?….Jake Westbrrok wasn’t a former CY Young winner but Kluber wasn’t Kluber yet.
For one, he’s a reliever, not a starter. Maybe…MAYBE, he’s the next Kimbrel. That’s a pretty low ceiling for what you could have had a year ago.
So what’s for “2” if you’re going to say “for 1”? I think it’s a foolish perspective to evaluate something that hasn’t developed. The Indians weren’t trading what they had in Kluber, they traded what they evaluate him to be NOW.
It’s not foolish at all to say “sell high, not low.” Especially given Kluber’s age and injury concerns. When you have 2 years of a guy and you know you’re not going to re-sign him, you cash in your chips and get ready for the future.
unless you have the potential to win your division and make the playoffs with him on your roster. consensus says win a WS and deal with the aftermath AFTER.
Indians are not trading Lindor for Galvis and prospects. The Indians already have a 3B prospect that is rated higher than the falling India. A trade has to meet the needs of both teams.
India can play SS and 2b. He can hit. He’s is falling? That is the first person I ever heard say that. He was considered along the line to be in as advanced hitter like senzel coming out. Also Nolan Jones might end up in the OF.
In 2018, MLB.com had India as the #51 prospect. In 2019 he was the #93 prospect. That fits my definition of dropping. Regardless, as I said, the Indians are not trading Lindor for just prospects.
Prospects will be included. Reds are not trading impact major league pieces to get Lindor (like someone acid tripper tries to suggest Castillo). Period. Also, rankings are just that. They are made to have some sort of view of suspected talent in an order for casual fans. I could argue other players rose or new players come up. I have watched a lot of India and read a lot of reports on him and no one has ever mentioned him dropping in expected potential to any degree (unless u mean by that rank which in all truth (as I mentioned) means nothing) He has a bat and nothing has changed as of that right now.
WOW!
2 Lindor rumors in a row!!
After this article, can one on some team negotiating for David Price and/or Mookie Betts be far behind?
And we haven’t read a Bryant rumor for what – 18 hours now?
How about one on the Marlins or Blue Jays being interested in getting at least 3 of the above guys?
LOL
WOW!
A comment about a website called “MLB Trade Rumors” pumping out the most relevant information regarding MLB trade rumors – how dare they???
This might be the most relevant and stimulating comment of all the articles you are referencing! Thank you for your thoughtful reflection.
WOW!
Another non-value add comment from Thought!
Aww how cute watching Clumsy come to the rescue of Velvet
Actually, credit where credit is due. That snarky, sarcastic comment is something I would have said. A tip of the cap is due.
Woof, pick a side
[ A comment about a website called “MLB Trade Rumors” pumping out the most relevant information regarding MLB trade rumors ]
uh, no.
There have been a dozen Lindor rumors on this site in the last 8-9 days.
So the Reds checked in – maybe – like teams are doing with players all over MLB and all of a sudden this is “relevant”?
No, it’s juicy. Clickbait. So overdone that it’s a caricature of itself.
Yes, it is relevant. There is a general baseball rumor as to the Reds checking in. Maybe you don’t care, but it is still information pertaining to a potential baseball trade – relevant.
You stating that “all teams are doing it” is your personal opinion, not based on any report – this is a prime example of something that is irrelevant.
This site is about baseball news, any update is newsworthy if new information comes out. Sure maybe it’s clickbait too.
Further, imagine that just maybe, this is the only news available, the hot stove isn’t piping hot right now, yet, many fans want any small update… you are not one of those fans, clearly. That’s perfectly fine, but what is not relevant or newsworthy to you does not mean it is objectively so.
I have a better idea, instead of reading an article that clearly upsets you… why don’t you read the title, avoid these “clickbait” and “duplicative” articles, and just check this site once a week? No one is forcing you to read the content to your own dismay, that is all your choice. You come on here to declare what is newsworthy, in your opinion, and then spout a complaint having added no substance to any baseball-related discussion people clearly want to have. This shows that you might need to use some of the time away from MLBTR with a dictionary on the definition of “relevance.”
Seems like the Indians fans only see the value of Lindor without looking at the fact he’s only controlled for 2 years and undervaluing the players on other teams that also have longer control.
He is a top 5 player and the best SS in baseball. That’s 2 years. Yes, his value is less with Cincy cause they can’t afford to extend him. That would not be an issue with the dodgers. Galvis is afterthought throw-in. Winker has little value due to injury. Green is hurt and is a big question mark. India would have to be included.
I think India, Hunter Greene, Amir Garrett and Galvis gets it done. Indians would get the controllable young starting pitching they love to stockpile, they get a high upside player in India and a shortstop to hold the fort down in the short-term. They could go out and sign both Castellanos and re-sign Puig. They’d have a formidable lineup, stronger bullpen and quality staff with strong pieces for the farm system coming up. For the Reds, man.. they’d be ready to rock. That lineup.. especially if they were to lockdown Marcell Ozuna.. I like that deal for both sides, and I’m sure Reds fans will say “Noooo we can’t give up our prospects!” You’re trading for a Top 3 player in baseball. You can give up prospects.
that leaves your Bullpen short and no options on the open market and no prospects left to fix the bullpen. that does not help the Reds it makes them worse
It seems that many fans do not understand that the Indians are not trading Lindor for a prospect driven package. That is not what the Indians are looking for. Why is that point so hard for some people to understand.
that is just crazy. They are in sell mode. They might say they want to won win but their actions tell a different story.
wow these are some truly insane proposals. first why would the Reds who are short on outfielders trade their center fielder and left fielder? Trading winker ir senzel dont make them any better especially since there’s no replacements for Centerfield and AAA or on the free-agent Market. if they’re going to trade they’re going to trade from the depth. hunter green probably won’t be ready until after this run so he’s expendable. same thing goes for Jonathan India. any trade starts with these two players and probably includes Freddy Galvis. these 3 guys and another lower guy gets it done. however I don’t even see the straight at me because of lindor’s arbitration cost over the next few years unless the Reds plan on signing into an extension. its not like he has 3 or 4 years or cheap control. he had 2 years at top dollar
I’d hesitate to trade Senzel or Lodolo, but if the rest of the package is reasonable I’d be ok with dealing one of them. If it takes both, hard pass. My initial proposal would be Aquino/Winker (whichever CLE prefers), India (we already know CLE likes him a lot), Santillan, Galvis, and a prospect in the 10-15 range,let’s say Vlad Gutierrez or Jose Siri. Obviously they’ll need to be willing to take a counter offer and re-negotiate if needed
I’m not trading Senzel OR Lodolo for two years of Lindor.
so trade right and left field amd max out payroll. Lol not a video game man
The difference between Lindor and, say, Betts or Price, is in marketability. Price is a pain in the behind; Betts, a quiet, solitary type. Frankie Lindor lights up a room; heck, he lights up the whole house. I can see Lindor absolutely OWNING Cincinnati.
Do whatever it takes……
And FYI, here in P.R. he is an idol. Also has many sponsors and T.V commercials. I am a Cub fan, but Paquito has more fans than Javi here.
good mindset but those are also reasons why the indians would rather keep him
The Reds should make this happen and not just talk (as usual). I could see two of the Reds starting outfield (Senzel, Winker, Irvine, Aquino).Also, add Galvis and throw in two prospects (India, Gutierrez). If Senzel is moved, then the Indians need to throw in Deshields (a Reds filler until Siri or someone comes around).
gavis is not terrible at shortstop and that would leave us absolutely terrible in center
I’m still liking machado to cleveland, Lindor to NY and Andujar,Stanton, Happ and Kahnle to the Padres.
So Cleveland, on the record for trying to cut payroll, takes on a lesser talent for more money and years; then the Padres receive even more payroll, don’t get Lindor; while the Yankees dump about $300M in commitments and receive the best player involved? I see why you like it, based on an inference that you are a Yankees fan.
Cleveland isn’t tanking and trading Lindor for Machado saves over 100 million dollars while still having a cornerstone infielder who just isn’t quite the best player in the game and eliminating the risk of having nothing 2 years from now.
“The Padres receive even more payroll and don’t get lindor”
???
The Padres aren’t getting Lindor, Stanton is cheaper than Machado and adding Andujar and Stanton means you fill two positions for less money than one while improving the lineup and adding a decent starter on a one year deal.
The Yankees get 2 years of Lindor for 15 years of Stanton and Andujar. That’s the reason they are saving money. The Yankees save about 200 million and lose 13 years. If they want to resign Lindor it would cost 400 mil instead of 200 mil.
Just a thought. Try a math class.
I think you’re the one that needs the math class. How in the world does Machado save Cleveland over $100M when Lindor doesn’t even cost $50M over the next 2 years? And the total combination of Stanton, Happ, Andujar, and Kahnle costs over $10M more per year than Machado.
I could also easily see a three team trade between the Indians, Dodgers and Reds. Indians move Lindor and a prospect to the Dodgers, Dodgers move Seger and a prospect to the Reds and the Dodgers and Reds would send two players each to the Indians. Indians could pick and choose (within reason).
Like the idea. Slight modification – if the Reds are getting Seager and even a decent prospect. Then the Reds really should be sending three players and the Dodgers one. This is strictly from a fairness standpoint. (Though the Dodgers have a better pool of players to choose from to be sure.)
Two years ago, Astros gave up Musgrove, Moran, and Feliz for two years of control of Cole who wasn’t an elite SP back then. They did not surrender any top 5 prospect like Kyle Tucker, Forrest Whitley, or Miles Straw). I don’t see the Reds or any other team trading top prospects for him. In my opinion, Indians would like to have a combination of of a middle class prospect plus some MLB ready decent option.
Wait so, because Cole wasn’t a superstar at the time of trade, then Lindor isn’t either? Problem is, Lindor is and has been a top 3 SS over the last few years. His value greatly exceeds Cole’s at the time of that trade. Hence, yes, top prospects will need to be involved here.
I get such a belly ache from laughing so hard that every trade scenario has Galvis who the Reds scooped up for nothing when he was let go by the Blue Jays. It’s not going to take a King’s Ransom to make a deal, but these starting points aren’t it. Nobody wants Winker. He should have been traded before he even made it to the big leagues.
Right…nobody wants a 26 yr old with a career .379 OBP…
Not saying he is the cornerstone of this trade, but “no one wants him?” Now that is laughable
Nice stat. Addison Russell has a career .312 OBP yet he has a war of 12.1 compared to Winkers 1.3. That’s barely a bench player per standards. Joey Gallo has only a career 8.1 war and a .331 OBP for his career. I’m glad Winker can get on base for himself but what is he doing for the team? In 97 less at bats Gallo produced three more runs and eleven more RBIs than Winker. Why the comparison? Gallo was drafted only ten spots before Winker and they are the same age. So maybe someone would like to fill their roster with Winker but don’t act like he’s going to be useful in a trade scenario.
Literally said, “not acting like he’s the cornerstone,” so….yeah
I’d be estatic if Winker remains a Red. Why in the world would we want to sell him at a low point in his value? For just two years of Lindor I would be trading one top prospect not named Lodolo or Stephenson, plus some lower prospects.
exactly. make it trade from Green India because you don’t really need them during this run. if you can’t get the deal done with that and a lower-level prospects then don’t bother to make it. you would also really want to jump off Freddy Galvis is 5.5 million dollars to
Brewers Indians trade Hader and Arica for lindor.
Brewers get a dial tone
The Reds probably match up best with the Indians in a deal. The Reds have top prospects all at positions of need for Cleveland.
I think a match can be made along the lines of: a) Senzel or India; b) Stephenson; c) Siri; d) some sort of SP prospect that’s 2 or 3 years away. Also toss in Galvis as a one-year bridge to Yu Chang playing shortstop.
Indians and Reds both could probably both live with that in exchange for two full years of Lindor.
they’re not getting senzel or winker. only way this makes sense for the Reds if they can trade some of their top prospects and keep their current Major League team together the only guy that would really be Expendable with the Freddy Galvis and he would be more of a throw-in
And it makes no sense for the Indians to trade Lindor for just prospects. Remember that there are two teams that have needs to meet for a trade to work.
They are rebuilding. May not be admitting it but they are. They dumb 2 great arms. if they want to win they would keep him.
Winker, Galvis, India, Aquino and Santillan…
That package could work too. Not sure if the Indians believe in Winker though. He seems like he’s very close to being a busted-AAAA prospect as this point. He’ll be 27 by mid-season next year.
Swap out Siri and a pitcher that’s still 2 to 3 years away for Winker, and I like that package.
That could work too…yep
Cleveland gets Senzel, India, Galvis, Santillan
Reds get Lindor and DeShields
so who do you propose place right or left field? and how would that make it better to get rid of half our Outfield and take up the remaining space of payroll
Plenty of corner OF bats still on the FA market. The Reds would be adding payroll with this deal (Lindor minus Galvis) but if they’re still willing to spend they can fill the corner OF. They also already added Jankowski from the Padres.
3 form 8 to 20 million. plus 17 or 18 for lindor. can’t do both
Not enough. Indians will want to start with Senzel and then some or no deal at all.
who? can’t afford anyone good if you take one much pay. that leavse you with scrubs in right and left. So you suck at 2 more spots to get better at one. not like gavis is terrible. so it makes 0 sense.
Titanic, that package will not get Lindor. Senzel would have to be in the package.
it would be really dumb to trade your only center fielder.
Tough call for the Tribe. On the one hand, Lindor is a premium player who makes your team measurably better (much better) than without him. On the other hand, however, 2 full years of Lindor is worth a lot. My guess is that they will see where they are at the break unless they get bowled over. But we’ll see.
Next mookie betts right here.. let Boston shoe cle either what to do or what not to do depending how they handle mookie…
If the Indians think they can trade Lindor and not get solid MLB talent in return while continuing to compete they’re sorely mistaken.
the way you get better is trading what you don’t need. what do the Reds not need. realistically they have a 2 year window before guys start to reach arbitration and payroll gets out of control. so you trade guys that won’t be playing in the next two years or blocked. you can also at their own players like Freddy Galvis from the major league roster. hunter green or Jonathan India they are all highly rated prospects. what you don’t trade is any players you have planning on playing on the roster this year or any players you could use to replace them from the minor leagues. there will be injuries. you will have to give up more guys if they’re not as close but you will do your team more immediate impact by giving up these guys further away from The Bigs
The key to making a trade is that BOTH teams’ needs are met. Cleveland is not trading Lindor for prospects.
Why? they sre not going to be good this year. get 3 stud guys and a stop gap ss for 2 years of control. thats how most deals work. its not 1980
Cleveland won 93 games last year with 3/5 of their starting rotation missing 2 months or more. To say they are not going to be good this year shows me that you know very little about the Indians or about baseball.
Lol. so ok. ya 2 arms gone and now a stub ss. against the white sox and twins. Lol keep dreaming. if they want a deal with most teams that want a guy like that teams will not want to trade pieces form their mlb roster. its not 1960
What two arms are gone? I guess that you are counting both of Kluber’s arms. The Twins and White Sox still lack pitching. The Twins have yet to replace 2/5 of their starting rotation.
If a team wants Lindor from Cleveland, they will have to trade players that Cleveland wants or why would Cleveland make the deal. It is very simple. Give Cleveland what they want, or Lindor stays an Indian. That is how all trades work JVincent. Both teams’ needs are met.
thats how the vast majority of trades happen.
Lindor to the Dodgers for Corey Seager, Tony Gonsolin and Jeter Downs
That to me is a fair trade. At this point, from what we have seen from the past, the Dodgers are not going to part with Lux and they have said they are not willing to give up lux
Seager is a no. They want control. Why would they trade to get Seager and he will leave in 2 years with no chance of resigning him? They have that now with a much better SS in lindor. No sense to do that at all.
You need to think outside of the box be flexible. Team control doesn’t mean it must be another SS in Lux. It could be 6 yrs of May, or 5 yrs of verdugo. Seager would a 2 yr bridge to one of the top100 SS prospects in Downs, Freeman and Rocchio for the Indians. How many better 2 yr SS bridge are out there than Seager? Switch May for Gonsolin or verdugo+gonsolin in addition to Seager+Downs as starting points are definitely wins for Indians imo.
How about keeping Lindor as a bridge to Freeman and Rocchio and the others in the Indian System. Lindor is better than Seager. You have to motivate the Indians to make the switch to the lesser player.
I like may. I’m not sure the Dodgers would or should include him as they need pitching. I think Lux is who they want. I don’t personally think we need him or may in the deal. I rather have a package of Ruiz, Josiah Gray, and Downs, Gonsolin (not all. Just them as mentions). I also think Dennis Santana is a guy to look at also. He struggled last year but I still like him. I don’t have anything personally against Seager. I just don’t think he will come in trade to the Indians. He might be included in a 3-way deal going somewhere else.
Triber, none of the Dodger players you list are ready to contribute in 2o20. I am not willing to give up on 2020 while we still have Clevinger and the pitching that we have. Lux is a must in a Lindor trade.
The only way Seager goes in a lindor deal is a three team deal where the Indians get prospects for him
I don’t understand these type of trades. People want Lindor for their 2nd tier prospects. Dodgers will give you Gonsolin, and keep May, they will give you Downs and keep Lux.
For one of the games brightest superstars? You think offering the 2nd tier prospects get it done? No way, it will require top shelf prospects. It will cost you AT least one of Lux or May PLUS. Swap out Downs for Lux or Gonsolin for May and Cleveland would listen.
Not talking about Lindor personally, but us as fans have a different valuation then actual front office people.
How many trades have gone down that left us all scratching our heads saying that’s it?
Even the Kluber trade, before it went down if someone here said that all it would take is what Texas gave up for him, that person would have been laughed at. So nothing surprises me anymore.
This gives me Cueto trade flashbacks. If scouting baseball talent was easy we’d all be doing it. Imagine seeing a 17 year old and saying yeah he will be an A+ closer in about four to five years…and being right! These guys that scout and do it well deserve so much credit.
Any fan willing to turn down a SP much less a top 10-20 prospect because their rotation is set is foolish! Pitchers are inherently injury prone, a hang nail and they’re on the IL for six weeks! Plus crazy amounts of prospects that can fill multiple holes for years to come, all for a short stop that once he’s exposed this year and doesn’t have all the players that once made him look good? I’m certainly glad some of the people that comment on here aren’t GM of their favorite team! They would run out a high school team every year because they wouldn’t have back up players to piece into holes that naturally come open throughout the season! Idiots!
pitchers are injury prone and a steadfast, healthy, young, perennial all star, switch hitting icon who plays everyday (not every 5th day) should demand a kings ransom if anyone is truly evaluating.
all i read is winker winker winker winker !!! y’all are crazy
A guy with a career .845 OPS and a wRC of +125 is insulting to you? Now that’s crazy. Pair him with a guy like India and Lodolo and the Tribe would win that trade for years to come. But if you’re holding out for that “king’s ransom” for a guy with only 2 controllable years left, then you’re going to end up getting next-to-nothing like you did holding onto Kluber too long.
can’t grade a trade based on peripherals vs results. People were upset about Jake Westbrook going for a low level prospect with a high ceiling named Kluber…
Also trying to convince someone that an unproven (albeit high ceiling) 3B prospect & a middling OF in Winker for Lindor is absolute craziness. Save it, brother.
You just contradicted yourself between this comment and your “…low level prospect with a high ceiling named Kluber…” comment
Cleveland will have to look in the mirror after trading away Bauer & Kluber and deciding on retaining or trading away Lindor there are a lot of intangibles for them to review. First off if they trade Lindor now then you are giving up on going for the division but most importantly the Haul they will receive now for Lindor will never be any greater this upcoming year. The longer they hold on to Lindor they less package they will receive especially if they hold on to him the entire 2020 MLB SEASON because a lot can happen what if he gets injured that will dwindle the amount of prospects/major league ready talent you will receive.
So they are in a pickle and in trading away Bauer & Kluber now is the time for them to trade away Lindor and get the best package available. and let the teams interested fight it out for the best package.
I get why they would want some though because he fits that mold but the red simply aren’t going to trade him. they can’t replace him in center field at all not even a little bit. I think any trade starts with hunter green and Jonathan India. the only thing the Reds would be willing to give up off their major league roster would be a a shortstop. sure they might want him as a throw into the deal. of course a lot of this depends on what Cleveland feels they need matches what the Reds have in their farm
Bryant and Alzolay for Seager?
I feel like any trade for Lindor will cost a top 25 prospect, a top 100, and two more organizational top 20’s. But the issue for most teams is the Indians are going to want guys closer to ready than further away with high upside because while they are trading a great shortstop, they still want to win.
I feel like Senzel is the start of any trade with the Reds. If he’s untouchable, it would be difficult to make a clear match. Maybe Castillo, and then India and Lodolo or Greene, and then two more organizational top 20’s. But that isn’t a clear fit for Cincy still.
I don’t see how it gets done without Senzel being the center piece
Siri, Galvis, India, Aquino, lotto ticket and Santillan.
No Senzel required. Aquino is the centerpiece. Indians can send back a Bradley Zimmer or Greg Allen to play RF for CIN.
Ghost, you are absolutely dreaming if you think that package would get Lindor. I hope that you are not driving.
Why would the Padres even be discussing Lindor? Sends a bad message to probably the most exciting young player in MLB.
Reds should trade Winker, Senzel, Aquino, Galvis, Lodolo for Lindor, and an AAA left-handed bullpen prospect.
Kiley McDaniel from FanGraphs said this in regard to what it would probably take to land Lindor
” it’s a choice between unproven young MLB types, closer-to-MLB prospects and far-off prospects and how many guys you want to spread it across. CLE is the type of team that would prefer to diversify, so I’ll guess something like a 25-50th overall type prospect and a couple late/fringe top 100 types, skewed toward the upper levels.”
Kiley is pretty knowledgeable. Taking this into account you are probably talking a 55 FV prospect and two 50 FV prospects. Senzel was a 60 FV prospect before graduating but his value has gone down due to his Injury history. If Senzel is the main piece then we are probably looking at…
Lindor – Bradley Zimmer for Senzel (55FV) – Santillan (50FV) – Jose Garcia (45+FV) – Rece Hinds (40FV)
If you downgrade Senzel to India who is a higher 50FV prospect then it probably looks more like
Lindor for India (50FV) – Green (50FV) – Lodolo (50FV)
The first deal allows the Indians to maintain competitive this year, so Im guessing that would be their preference. They both look fair, but it is so difficult to deal one of the best players in baseball when Cleveland already has such a competitive team and a little bit of money to spend after the Kluber trade.
Good breakdown!
The trade starts with Senzel – probably playing 2B. Fine.
That leaves the Indians with Ramneriz at 3B along with their top prospect – Nolan Jones that should be up this year – also a 3B. Jones a better prospect then India and is 3 years younger. So that knocks out India….and Rinds.
Naquin is a better player then Winker – so the Indians have no use for him.
Greene is coming off of TJ so he’s a risk at this point.
Santillan is not more then the Indians have in Allen and Moss (who the Indians got from the Reds at the deadline).
Nick Lodolo would be attractive as a pitcher as would Jose Israel Garcia as a longshot to ultimately play SS.
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Lindor – Bradley Zimmer for Senzel – Lodolo – Jose Garcia
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All that said, it’s all about how the Indians value those players and how they think they can work to develop them. Their recent history is trading for players that are not on the medias/fans radar.
I think that’s probably close, but there would be one or two additional throw-in pieces going in either direction. Like Galvis being a bridge guy at SS in Cleveland for a year, and maybe Cleveland sending back one of their million OFs, such as Greg Allen or Bradley Zimmer.
I think if you added Aquino to this, both teams say yes.
The team that hasn’t been mentioned for Lindor, and where he’s a perfect fit, is the Rays.
1. Need for a middle of the order bat? Check
2. Payroll space? Check
3. Prospect capital? Check
4. Need for a “face”, somebody who isn’t a boring white guy or a pitcher whose 27 going on 13? Check
Lindor’s a “happening”; if MLB could market its players like the NFL does, Lindor would be Pat Mahomes (complete with insurance commercials). And apologies to Trout and Betts, but we all know Mike would rather be at an Eagles’ game, and Mookie at a bowling alley.
Lindor might even be able to save baseball in TB. Ya, it’s a pretty tall order, but the guy is up to it. And ya, it’s only for 2 years; that’s just enough time for wunder-Wander (Franco).
They’d have to move Adames (a 2B anyway) and Lowe (nowhere really; hide him in LF/DH), but it’s a perfect match.
Well bob;
You may have hit on the best possibility for Lindor. Nor discussed anywhere,
The Indians would love Wander back, but as the best prospect in MLB at age 18, not a chance the Rays move him.
Indians might well consider Adames back as a part of a package for Lindor. Very realistic. The teams are very familiar with one another so they could work out another player or make an even bigger trade out of it.
Rays like to rent players for a few years before their salary skyrockets. Lindor could well get them over the hump. Wander will be up by 2021 if not late in 2020. He can play either 2B or 3B while Lindor is there, then move over to WS..
Congratulations! Best trade suggestion made here!!
Imagine if this irrelevant article were never posted (much like how Cole would have never considered the Yankees had they not fired Rothschild). Bob’s comment would not be here and you wouldn’t have had the ability to anoint his comment with your blessed approval.
Won’t happen, Indians GM already stated that Lindor is not going to be traded this year or next year. So how is this rumor still circulating, oh yeah off season circus of nonsense.
“… fans hoping to see their club secure a talent the caliber of Clevinger or Lindor should make a list of the young, controllable players with whom they’d be most reluctant to part … and then expect that at least one and more likely two of said group would be at center of such a deal (in addition to some lesser prospects).”
I might be missing something here, but why is keeping Iglesias never mentioned as far as short stop goes? According to ESPN he had the highest batting average on the Reds for 2019 with a decent OBP, was known for getting on base when there were 2 outs and from watching him this past season was good in the fielding department. Why is his name never mentioned anywhere as a possibility?
I’ve mentioned it several times…I liked Iggy..
of course you do. he is terrible
Iglesias has the 4th highest fielding percentage all time at shortstop, but then again galvis is 2nd on that list.
Looks like the Reds are trying to go for a WS title by bringing in Lindor a move like this is possible — but there is no way the Reds could sign Bauer and Lindor long term — Marlins bought themselves a WS title in 1997 —
these comments and proposed trades are laughable. You all realize that Freddy Galvis was waived by the Blue Jays last season right? He’s definitely NOT a trade chip of any kind.
Any trade package will have to include Senzel. It would likely be Senzel, Greene or Lodolo, India and another minor piece. And if I were the Reds I would do it. You have to pay a premium to get a top 5/10 overral player in the game, especially one with more than 1 year of control. And Lindor could put the Reds over the top in terms of competing this year.
Senzel is highly rated, but doesn’t look like he is going to have a ton of power and still is a somewhat unknown commodity. Greene is coming of an injury/Lodolo isn’t even a top 50 prospect yet, and India’s star is fading.
I also like the idea of a 3 team trade with the Dodgers and picking up Seager instead. That package from the Reds would cost less, something like Winker/Santillan/Siri
Rumor is that the Indians interested in Jonathan India
I’m guessing Red’s will now focus on getting the deal done. Perhaps sending Jonathan India, Tyler Myale,Jesse Winker,Scott Schebler,and another piece or so for Lindor,and Delino De Shields.
And I’m not guessing…no, I’m stating, there’s no way in the world that gets it done. There are Little League teams that wouldn’t take Scott Schebler in exchange for their SS…
Not saying Schebler in general included. Could be Phillip Ervin, even Amir Garrett and so on. It will take a great deal of players and some really good prospects. But in general. Cincinnati has what it would take to land Lindor.
And a great big No on Garrett…he’s their top lefty…they won’t do that…
Let’s be honest, the Indians won’t pay him. They are always trying to slash payroll. If I’m an interested team I’m not giving up elite talent because I can sign him as a FA next year.
Greetings, So many posts! Could not get thru them all. Did anyone comment if a trade does happen and we get Lindor and Tribe gets what they want is there any possibility that Lindor signs an extension? I mean as great as Lindor is he is just one guy. It took many years of the Reds being really bad to draft this talent. Is trading a large portion of it away for two years only of Lindor worth it for the Reds? This kind of trade to me sounds more like one that needs to be made by the Dodgers. You know a team one player away from getting to the world series. Alas the Reds are not such a team.
Cubs losing players, Milwaukee losing players, Cards may lose a couple of players, Reds had a lot of one run losses that will change in 2020, with what they will gain perhaps 10+ games the others may lose up to 10 games, it will be tight but I c Reds as a determined team on a mission
Pipe dream… Like you hit the crack pipe and started dreaming … Reds dont have anything to get Indians interest in moving Lindor ,,, what a joke
Lol. you guys think you will get a plug in ready mlb stud. Lol. Cleveland got lucky in a weak division. in 6 months they traded 2 aces and now they think they can win with even less. They got no cash. So ya of they want to be logical and rebuild or reshuffle ya they need a few younger guys. reds have some at the top of their system. if not move on but you guy are not gettig winker or senzel. They cant replace them so its a non start.
3 Team Trade:
1. Indians get: Lux, Gonsolin, India, and Aquino or Santillan (Indians choice)
2. Dodgers get: Lindor and Senzel
3. Reds get: Seager and Taylor
I think the Dodgers are more likely to part with Lux if they get a cost controlled AS caliber 2B – Senzel gives them that. Reds get SS and solid cost controlled CF. Indians get high quality cost-controlled talent that helps them now and in the future. If they chose Aquino, plug Lux in at SS, Aquino in RF, and Reyes at DH and you are are staying pretty competitive. One thing that got lost in Aquino’s HR barrage coming into the league is that he is a good defensive RF. Long and fast he can catch it and has a good arm to boot.
Got to be a dodger fan, that is a bad trade for the Reds. If they gave up Senzel India, and Aquino they’d need their head examined. More importantly why would LA need to be involved? Senzel for Lindor is a fair trade, maybe mix in a organizational top 20 prospect, but no more
India, Greene another prospect
.
Greetings all.
Interesting Cleveland asked for best and final offers for Lindor last weekend but have not heard anything on what their time frame might on making a decision. Also I wonder if a three team trade say with the Dodgers/Reds/Cleveland might be included in the mix was submitted? How about Senzel, Galvis and a prospect or two to Cleveland for Lindor and send Lindor to Dodgers for Seager and Verdugo? What say ye?
I’m late to the party here, but wanted to suggest an idea to see Reds fans’ thoughts. First off, I’m a pitching first guy so I wouldn’t trade Castillo for Lindor straight up. Castillo is a stud and I value him as much as I do Clevinger. Having said that, Lindor is one of the most valuable position players in the game. Only Trout is convincingly more valuable. How would you Reds fans feel about getting Lindor for Senzel, Winker, and Mahle? Lindor will easily put up another 7 WAR season which is probably more than all 3 of Senzel, Winker, and Mahle likely will next season. There is the possibility that all 3 could have very good seasons and surpass Lindor’s WAR combined, but there is risk.
I’m not here trying to sell the idea to you guys, but it seems like it could work. Regardless, I wish you guys the best of luck and I hope that I get to witness an all Ohio WS before I leave this earth.