Sept. 9: The Red Sox have issued a press release on the shakeup, announcing that a search for a new baseball operations leader will commence “immediately.”
“Four years ago, we were faced with a critical decision about the direction of the franchise,” principal owner John Henry stated within the release. “We were extraordinarily fortunate to be able to bring Dave in to lead baseball operations. With a World Series Championship and three consecutive American League East titles, he has cemented what was already a Hall of Fame career.”
Sept. 8: In a shocking development, the Red Sox announced that they have parted ways with president of baseball operations Dave Dombrowski. Assistant GMs Eddie Romero, Zack Scott, and Brian O’Halloran, and senior VP of Major League and minor league operations Raquel Ferreira will take over as the heads of the baseball ops department for the remainder of the season (MLB.com’s Ian Browne was among those to report the news of the assistant GMs in the interim roles, while Alex Speier of the Boston Globe reported Ferreira’s involvement.)
It was just last fall that the Red Sox captured a World Series championship with one of the best teams in recent baseball history, winning 108 regular-season games and then rolling through the playoffs with an 11-3 record. It marked the club’s first title since Dombrowski took over the job in August 2015, and his second World Series in over three decades as one of the game’s most respected front office bosses. Dombrowski also put together the Marlins team that won the 1997 Series, and his resume also includes two American League pennants with the Tigers in 2006 and 2012.
With such a track record of both past and recent success, it’s hard to believe that Dombrowski is so suddenly out of a job, though there had been some whispers that ownership took a dim view of Boston’s underachievement in 2019. Tonight’s loss to the Yankees dropped the Sox 17.5 games out of first place in the AL East, and eight games behind the Athletics for the last AL wild card slot, making a postseason return all but impossible.
Multiple issues surrounded the 2019 Red Sox, which were seemingly enough for upper management to decide that a change was needed. For one, the team exceeded the upper level of the luxury tax ($237MM) in 2018, and are again in position to exceed the new upper threshold of $246MM this season. As per Roster Resource, the Red Sox have a projected luxury tax number of over $257.7MM, putting them in line to face another maximum penalty — a 75 percent tax on the overage, as well as a drop of ten spots for their highest pick of the 2020 draft. (MLBTR’s Jeff Todd explored some of the financial ramifications for the Red Sox and the Competitive Balance Tax back in February.)
This cash crunch left the team unable to truly add new pieces to the roster, particularly a bullpen that seemed thin after Craig Kimbrel and Joe Kelly departed in free agency. Still, Boston’s offseason focus largely centered around re-signing key members of their 2018 roster (Nathan Eovaldi and Steve Pearce), while also extending Chris Sale and Xander Bogaerts, both of whom would have been free agents after the 2019 campaign.
Unfortunately for the Sox, a large chunk of their 2019 expenditures went for naught. Eovaldi (signed to a four-year, $68MM deal) and Pearce (one-year, $6.25MM) have both been ineffective or injured for much of the year, with Eovaldi shifted into bullpen work rather than his expected role in the starting rotation. Sale has endured a career-worst season after signing a five-year, $145MM extension that runs through the 2024 season (unless Sale opts out after 2022, which seems unlikely at this point).
Past Dombrowski acquisitions have also started to show their age this year. Eduardo Nunez and Mitch Moreland have combined for -0.4 fWAR at a combined cost of $11.5MM. David Price has put up generally good numbers since signing his seven-year, $217MM contract in the 2015-16 offseason, but his production hasn’t matched the big expectations that came with what is still the biggest deal ever handed to a pitcher in terms of total dollars.
If this analysis of Dombrowski’s misfires seems too centered around the results of the 2019 season, there’s really no other way to explain his firing, since at this time last year the baseball world was praising Dombrowski’s creation of a super-team. (Beyond the 2018 Series, Boston also won AL East titles in both 2016 and 2017.) Known for bold trades of prospects for star talent, it was Dombrowski who brought Sale and Kimbrel to Boston in major deals with the White Sox and Padres, respectively. The extensions for Bogaerts and Christian Vazquez both look like big pluses, and the J.D. Martinez signing was a major win.
It should also be noted that if the luxury tax overage was such a big strike against Dombrowski, that wasn’t entirely his doing. The Red Sox could have made just a minimal CBT payment if it wasn’t for the roughly $46MM in salaries paid out to Pablo Sandoval, Rusney Castillo, and Dustin Pedroia, all on contracts inked during the regime of previous general manager Ben Cherington. Pedroia’s career is in jeopardy due to chronic knee problems, Sandoval hasn’t played for Boston in over two years, and Castillo is stuck in minor league limbo until his deal is up.
In fairness to Cherington, he was also not far removed from a World Series title (less than two seasons) when he himself was replaced by Dombrowski midway through the 2015 season. The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal recently explored the possibility of a Dombrowski firing, and pointed out the extraordinarily high standard that seemingly any Red Sox general manager will have to meet, given that not even recent championships were enough to spare Cherington or Dombrowski. As Rosenthal rhetorically asked, if Sox ownership is “frustrated with Dombrowski’s spending and his use of prospects as trade fodder, well, what exactly did they think they were getting? Dombrowski hasn’t broken from character in Boston, has never disguised his M.O.”
Boston’s farm system has been thinned by both Dombrowski’s trades, but perhaps moreso by the graduation of several of the top young prospects to the big leagues, so it isn’t as if the Red Sox are drastically short on premium young talent. Rafael Devers is still a pre-arbitration player, after all, while Andrew Benintendi is only arb-eligible this winter and Eduardo Rodriguez has two arb years remaining.
Even Mookie Betts has one final year of arbitration eligibility, and while his future in Boston was already a big question, it has become of even greater import in the wake of Dombrowski’s firing. Betts told reporters (including Jason Mastrodonato of the Boston Herald) tonight that the front office change “is proof that it’s still a business.” While reiterating that “I love it here [in Boston],” Betts also said “it’s going to be the same answer” in regards to his plan to test the free agent market following the 2020 season.
It will be fascinating to see what direction Red Sox ownership takes in their search for a new baseball operations head. Since John Henry’s ownership group bought the franchise, they famously promoted young executives from within (Theo Epstein and Cherington) before going in the opposite direction with Dombrowski, a veteran baseball man from outside the organization. As Rosenthal noted in his piece, rebuilding doesn’t appear to be an option in Boston, so a new front office boss will have to creatively replenish the minor league system while still keeping the Sox in contention for another championship.
The next GM will inherit, after all, a team that is still talented — the Red Sox have a 76-67 record, and their offensive core of Betts, Bogaerts, Devers, and Martinez is as good as any in the sport. But with Martinez potentially opting out of his deal and some major work needed for the rotation and bullpen, offseason business could explore trades of players a year removed from free agency (such as Betts or Jackie Bradley Jr.) in order to refurbish the roster. Quite a bit of salary will also be coming off the books, so there’s a possibility the Sox could duck under the $208MM luxury tax threshold altogether and reset their penalty status.
Dombrowski was under contract though the 2020 season, and turned 63 in July. The exec hadn’t had many public ruminations on his future, though he wishes to continue working, one would imagine several front offices would be interested in bringing him on, at least in an advisory capacity. Or, it’s also not hard to imagine a team perhaps deciding to make a front office change now that Dombrowski is available.
Photo courtesy of USA Today Sports Images
Shocking? Hardly.
Any other team, it would be.
Any other team, besides maybe the Yankees, would be building a monument to the sky for Dom.
and these be paying for that Monument with John Henry’s money
Yanks probably going to fire Cashman and hire Dombrowski for GM.
@toddy76
Haha…..not going to happen. Being a GM of a NY team, especially one like the Yankees, is about a lot more than just the 9-5 stuff. It’s about having the right disposition and really thick skin because you’ll be judged in so many countless and sometimes unfair ways.
Nope, try again.
My Phillies should hire Dombrowski. The preppie kid posing as our GM is clueless!
I thought the same thing went this went down. Phillies or maybe the Padres
His players suck, not him. Yeah, it’s shocking.
Unbelievable to me. Does anyone really think he had carte blanche to spend without ownership’s approval? Yes he made mistakes but he also delivered three straight AL East flags and a world championship. As a fan, do I want to play horseshoes and be happy with just getting close? Not me. Last year will always be special.
when you spend the most money in baseball you expect to be closer than horseshoes
Yup!
Sox have always spent but only recently won. Steinbrenner spent more than any other owner in the 80s yet didn’t win again until he got suspended and Michael took over making player decisions. The Dodgers were the biggest spenders under their current ownership until now yet haven’t yet won it all. Big spending is an obvious advantage but guarantees nothing.
A lot of the money paid this season was spent by the previous GM. Out of Dombrowski’s control.
Yes but he more than doubled down. Good article but it’s foolish to link Pedroia with Rusney and Panda. He signed a then team friendly deal and was hurt on the field.
3-4 of those bad contracts were signed and left over from Cherrington
Including the big panda.
I think more than anything the organization is probably realizing/deciding that it’s time to focus a bit more on organizational development and the minors. And while Dombrowski isn’t necessarily to blame for the current teams struggles (not have any of his trades of prospects really come back to haunt them all that much – maybe with the exception of the Thornburg deal) I think they probably also realize that Dombrowski isn’t the right guy to move the team forward in that direction. His skill set is really more geared towards taking a team from “good to great” in a short amount of time (which he did in essence last season) but from a longer term perspective — he’s really not the guy to lead a rebuild/retool effort to really build out the organizational depth their most likely seeking. For example this off-season might be a good time to trade Mookie Betts — Dave would be more apt to be the GM trading for him than trading him away… I think the organization’s vision just isn’t aligned with Dave’s skillset so they probably feel like someone else might be better at this particular junction. Despite Dombrowski being really good at what he did/does… it’s just not really a fit right now given what needs to be done to readjust/realign the organizations depth.
True. Maybe DD takes over another team and trades for Mookie. Given his attitude towards parting with unproven talent, he’d likely pay more than any other GM,
Not True.
Dombrowski built the farm system and MLB team in Montreal that had the best record in baseball when baseball Strike hit.
Then, Dombrowski built and expansion Marlins into World Series Champions in record time.
Then, Dombrowski was ordered to tear down the Marlins and rebuild by his penny pinching owners in Miami.
Trades, drafts etc and he built the core that was the next Marlins Championship and left for Detroit before they won it.
Lolwat
Shocking is a good word. Did not see this coming.
I’m speachless!
I remember when Eddie played! He was a terrific utility player n from what I’ve heard he will do a good job if they keep him long term.
I think it’s Ed Romero’s son.
Yes.
Wow that’s a good thing.
Holy macaroni
I was just zipping through the comments and saw this. Not sure why but it cracked me up. Thanks.
Gotta keep it pg for the admins
Wow…didn’t quiet see that coming? One year removed from a WS win and it seems he was handcuffed financially this past winter. A reset?
Wasn’t exactly “handcuffed” financially in the offseason. He dropped 21 million in major league contracts, plus a few too many trips to the dumpster for minor league deals that did nothing to address the bullpen needs.
@AtlSoxFan
I meant towards addressing their most glaring need which was the bullpen. However, it could also be said he could’ve passed on Eovaldi, which I thought was a bad deal the moment it was signed, and directed that money towards a closer. Britton and Ottavino each signed for about the same yearly annual as Eovaldi. so I guess that would be one glaring mistake. But I serve up winning the chip was the price paid for weakening the farm. It’s tough to do both. Cashman has been killed for not paying up for starters in trades that may have cost us a Torres, Judge or Sanchez at one point.
Guys the pen blew up cause the starting pitching this year has been total crap….Sale, Porcello, Price, and the pit at #5…. just killed the pen this year… Cherrington mistakes on Panda and HanRam where accountable
No weakness in the farm SYSTEM, we’ve had more graduations than most. That’s not on DD as a negative, it’s great how many starters have graduated from the farm system since Bogaerts.
We had $34M of bad contracts not on DD and how many closers and set-up men could we have bought with that money? That money rolls off next year for the most part so DD should have been given a chance to prove his worth by giving him the extra cash and seeing if he could get the resources we need to win again. I think he earned that chance last year with the moves he made to help us win a championship.
Cashman is on an island with his idea that relievers and home run hitters win championships. He and I have the same number of championships this decade. DD like other good GMs believe you build hitters from the farm system and buy experienced pitching. Sale is a smart signing if you have the proper pitching coaches. Same with Price. Porcello had moments of greatness but could never live up to his cost. EROD is turning into an outstanding SP. So our overall starting pitching looks good if two things happen: 1 – Sale, Eovaldi and Price are healthy next year and 2 – we find a pitching coach and new manager who knows pitching. Cora can’t handle a pitching staff and his pitching coaches have taken one of the best pitchers in baseball and turned him into an injury waiting to happen. Stop tinkering with Sale and find someone who can coach him to successfully pitch the way he always has in the past not the way Cora and his coaching staff want him to now. He didn’t have these problems in Chicago.
The formula for next year is simple… Re-sign Betts don’t sell him to the Yankees like we did Babe Ruth 100 years ago. Remove Cora so maybe JD doesn’t opt out due to Cora’s lack of respect for him. Trade for a CF who can hit and field. Move Devers to 1B and put Chavis at 3B then find a 2B with speed to hit in the #9 spot in the order. Buy a #5 SP who pitches effectively in Fenway. Determine if there is a closer available that is worth the additional money over Workman or find 3 excellent set=up men to use in front of Workman. Cut loose all the Cora loved pitchers who belong in a softball league, including Johnson, Velasquez, Poyner etc. Teach Barnes how to throw a curveball that goes the full 60 feet 6 inches. And hang on to the utility guys that add value on the field and the clubhouse, guys like Holt and Hernandez. If Devers moves to 1B, then we save the $12M we paid our tandem of Pearce and Moreland.
Most importantly, hire a manager with experience!!! Please.
Well said.
the most glaring need in 2019 was their starting pitching staff. because they’re starting pictures failed it added a burden to the remainder of the bullpen and that caused problems for the bullpen. yes they should have gotten a closer but they didn’t have the money.
Cherrington built the farm system, Dom has emptied it. every minors guy was drafted by Ben or Theo. Doms drafting has been sub par, always has and always will.
I’m going to have to take your word for it. Anyone ever heard of a paragraph? Whoa!
And Cherington gets credit for a farm system that developed talent.
Trader Dave dumped young talent for old players. He couldn’t help himself.
Just wait another season or two and the Price contract will become an unnecessary PRICE to pay. Another year and the fans will wish that they bought Sale on SALE.
Both of these pitchers best years are on their baseball card.
Guys the pen blew up cause the starting pitching this year has been total crap…
—————————————————-
Absolutely. The BP has not been half bad this year. Especially considering that our total BP cost is probably < $10M.
@KD17
I stopped reading after you said put Chavis at 3B instead of Devers. Devers is a much better fielder.
But who did he trade that he regrets? He kept Devers and Benintendi. He wasn’t getting Sale for nothing, but he won that trade, too. What’s the issue?
This manager led your team to a WS title just a year ago and was being praised for his leadership and how he fit right in and now you want to throw him to the wolves less than a year later ?!? Sounds like you have all the answrrs …, dummy
27 blown saves. Don’t just look at the obvious stats. Both starters and relievers have disappointed.
@KD17
So many things to touch on.
a) Cashman’s philospohy is to acquire pitching if at the right price. He acquire. Whether we disagree or not, he hasn’t ignored attempts to improve it (Gray, Paxton, Happ, etc) but he sets his limit and or right or wrong, sticks to it. His philosophy is if I can’t improve the SP then I’ll focus on improving the bullpen and the offense to shorten the game and try to outscore them.
b) You can’t “sell” Betts to the Yanks like they did Babe Ruth. Either sign him, trade him or he’s a FA. Not sure the Yanks would even bother considering we have Judge, Stanton and recently extended Hicks.
c) Cora is a much better manager than you give him credit for and you can’t blame Sale’s injury on him. Sales arm was bound to have issues eventually. I don’t think he’s been overused at all. What lack of respect has he shown to JD? If JD opts out I promise you it has nothing to do with Cora and all about more money or escaping a sinking ship if he feels the team is going to be rebuild ( which I can’t imagine happening).
d) Bradley and Devers. It’s not that easy to acquire a GG CF who can also hit. I think the Sox would be idiots to get rid of Bradley because of his bat. Devers looks like a GG at 3B. Why waste his talent by making him a 1B? They are far more 1B types than there are guys like Devers who can play 3B well and hit like he does. He’s one of the few bright spots for the Sox this year.
e) The bullpen. If there were one place where DD may have made a mistake is allocating the limited amount of money he had to play with by giving Eovaldi 4/$65 instead of signing a proven closer.
He traded buttery, to angels for Kinsler
Agreed/ Since day one the pen has been overused by necessity . Kimbrel and Kelly both have ERA’s north of 5. They weren’t the answers either. The pen was average until they got worn down because starters couldn’t pitch 5 innings. The only things DD did right were extending Xander and doing little at the deadline. Pearce and Sale signings huge mistakes.
You write too much and it’s frankly BS boring !
Sox need to blow up the whole pitching staff & it’s coaches – let go Old dead wood, beef up minors & keep Cora as Manager. New Pres has to be new blood for new strategy.
While Kinsler didn’t perform, the deal was a winner in my book because filling second base was a glaring need at the time (who knew Holt was going to stay hot for the rest of the year?).
They need to develop pitching and find more value for the amount of many they pay in salary.
I look for them to try to entice one of the top FO people from the Indians or Rays to take over.
If the starters pitched to their averages they would hVe been fine. We can’t discount Benny’s struggles, and to a lesser degree, Mookie. Last year they were good and lucky. This year, they were neither.
The Pearce signing, while it hasn’t worked out, probably isn’t a big deal. It’s 1 year and not a large sum. While the money could have been better allocated, it shouldn’t be stopping them from doing anything. The sale signing looks pretty bad right now with his issues this year and the Eovaldi signing looks worse. They made the right move letting Kelly and Kimbrel walk, but certainly didn’t make enough moves to beef up the bullpen. Their starters have been the main source of their issues this year and has lead to overworking a bullpen which just wasn’t built for that.
Personally, I think they should look to trade Mookie in the offseason as he has made it pretty clear he will test free agency. They should look to the Yankees a couple years ago when they flipped any short term valuable pieces to restock the farm with talent and let some of the dead money fall off the books. They have too much money committed to add any significant pieces.
Yes, starting pitching is the most important factor in consistently winning, so you need to draft and develop as much as you can, NOT mostly buy it. If you keep relying on the inefficient trade and free agent markets to build your rotation, it’s going to catch up with you eventually, as it did with the Cubs starting last year and the Red Sox this year. This is also true to a lesser but still important degree with the bullpen, where free agent signings are even more of a crapshoot.
Love when everyone says the Yankees’ model. It’s been around forever but th
(Continued) but the Yanks added a new wrinkle in after the year again signing Chapman. Just one year before Boston traded Miller, Lester and Lackey for more ready but some younger parts in ERod, Cespedes (who was turned into Porcello) and Joe Kelly who was then a young flame thrower.
Dombrowski’s drafting was excellent for Montreal (Pedro Martinez, Larry Walker, Moises Alou etc)
and Miami(Miguel Cabrera and others)..
And, for the Tigers…with Verlander and others.
Pedro Martinez was traded for Delino DeShields by Dan Duquette. Dombrowski did not draft him.
Larry Walker wasn’t drafted.
Damn. He will find a job somewhere
He will sign big contracts, deplete the farm system, and then leave. He’s done it everywhere he’s been
FALSE!
Ownership mandates The Team Plan.
In Detroit and Boston with impatient, billionaire, “win now” ownership,
Dombrowski did what he was directed to do with those teams.
In Montreal and Miami, Dombrowski built top farm systems and younger rosters with drafts, trades, international signings etc..
What an odd tenure
Can’t wait to hear official reasoning, but I’d say mix the season results, his offseason signings, the sale extension followed by injury uncertainty…. condition of the farm, etc… wow. Didn’t expect this.
He doesn’t value prospects at all. I get wanting to compete, but when he was with Detroit and now Boston he traded away any decent prospects for a prime to aging player. This has allowed his teams to win for a few years but then just tank
The Red Sox knew what the deal was, and unlike with your Tigers it actually worked. No reason for them to be mad now.
@tigersfan1320
But isn’t that the point? To win? This current team simply under-performed.. Aside from Kimbrel and Kelly, they pretty much had the same team. I think if anything, you can accuse DD of allocating too much to a injury prone Eovaldi and not trying to replace Kimbrel when you had guys like Britton and Ottavino (although he seemed destined to go to NY no matter what) who may have taken the same or slightly more to close. But other than that I blame it on bad luck (injuries) and key players being off from their 2018 performance. The Sale extension MIGHT be a problem but I haven’t heard anyone say Sale would miss any of 2020 yet.
Dom trades a LOT of prospects, everybody that watches MLB knows that, but the fact of the matter is that the only prospect of consequence that he has ever traded is Cameron Maybin… Yoan Moncada is decent, but has not even accumulated 1 WAR for 2019 and anyone would take Chris Sale for less than 1 WAR, even though he is having a career worst year..
I’d consider Eugenio Suarez a bigger mistake than Maybin. Tigers got a HOFer for Maybin. Got junk for Suarez.
Moncada’s 2019 WAR is 3.2 according to Baseball Reference
It took Moncada a long time to get to that. He was mediocre at best until this year. Teams like the Red Sox don’t develop guys like that in the bigs like losing teams like the White Sox do.
Long time? Yoan Moncada is currently 24 years old.
He has been in the majors getting at bats while hitting nothing until this year. Only a losing team has the time for that. He is coming around this year. The Sox didn’t have at bats to give him in the majors was my point. Even with Sale’s issues I have no problem with it. The extending of him, that’s another story.
Moncada looked lost until this season. I have doubts on many players this year including Devers (to be fair) due to the loaded ball. Should be interesting when the game returns to the old ball and the ball isn’t hit as hard and doesn’t go as far. Pitchers I believe will also have better control.
Have you collected many books on alien sightings or abductions? Do you keep wondering why you’re putting off that planned trip to New Mexico?
he traded away any decent prospects for a prime to aging player.
——————————————————————-
More importantly, who did he trade away that would be starting for us? Moncada?
Sounds like it was a “Power Play” by the other Team President who knows little or nothing about building a team.
Wow. Didn’t even want for the season to end. That’s surprising. Wonder if this has any affect on Mookie being traded this off-season
Not sure where this goes but Mookie might be the whole key. I still say management signed off on his big contracts but they may have to decide on trading Bettinendi for example BEFORE he gets expensive if they want to resign Mookie or they should have traded him this past 07/31. The return on a one year rental is not good. His return will be better than other non pitchers because of his two way star status but still not what fans would expect. I anticipate a trade like the Dodgers trade years ago. Much harder today but if you want Betts even for one year, you take Eovaldi too who if healthy could be impactful. Separately they look to trade Price and pay down the cost. Sale you are stuck with right now so you try to build around him and hope…
Mookie says he is leaving as a free agent,
JD Martinez could opt out of his contract too.
Porcello is a free agent.
the reason why it happened now is because they want to have a general manager in place for the off-season
They already had a Hall of Fame Pres/GM on board.
Ownership pulled a George Steinbrenner.
Don’t worry,
It opens the Door for the Yankees and Rays to take over the AL East.
Last year was the outlier but they hit big on it.
Won the division 3 years in a row but this year when their starting rotation is far below their expected performance isnt the outlier?
Had to be blind not to see this coming! New manager coming soon because they are going to suck for a while! No farm and a bunch of contracts killing them!
New manager coming?!? I’ll admit the Price/Sale money looks scary moving forward, but Cora is very well liked, and did a very good job last year. I doubt ownership lets that happen.
They have a farm just not pitching.
IIRC, farm sits around 20th ranked. Not good, but, better than 1/3 of the teams in baseball – not counting recently called up young talent.
Farm rating is BS for the most part in that sometimes it just depends on getting an opportunity. The Mets for example had no players ready. Stats were inflated due to the desert yet Smith rebounded nicely and what can be said about McNeil and Alonso? I still question the ball’s impact this year.
wow thats a shock. maybe he should head south to philliy
yeah Philly loves Big Spenders that don’t produce
Ownership mandated big spending and going “All In” for a Championship/
Dombrowski just implemented the plan just as ownership hired him to do..
Now, he is the scapegoat?!
Dombrowski has produced and won everywhere he has worked:
Montreal, Miami, Detroit, Boston,
The guy just won a World Series and gets fired! Neil Huntington was coming off a losing season 2 years ago and received a four year contract extension from the Pirates!
Lol. I don’t think any team in baseball looks at the Pirates and thinks, “now, there’s a model of how we should be running our team”.
I think that the point he was trying to make is that if you think that the Sox make ridiculous decisions, check out the Pirates. They lead the league. Chris Archer??
He helped bring a championship to Boston! Thanks Dave!
Agreed but then again so did Sherington. Says a lot about Brian Cashman. To last so long in the business is amazing. If the Yankees win it all this year (I hope not), he should be considered HOF worthy.
Cashman already has 4 rings and 6 pennants over his long tenure. Isn’t he already HoF worthy?
Not really when he took over an already built team. Gene Michael was the architect then of the core four years. Cash in my book gets credit for 2009, buying a championship (it worked) but he needs another that is his signature. Just my take.
This is true. Gene Michael built those fantastic Yankees teams of the late 90’s. Cashman was hugely overrated for a long time, but has had a great run over the last 4-5 years.
Lmao Dave strikes again. The same thing he did in Detroit. I know they have the 2018 ring but their farm system is terrible and they’re stuck with a $200MM payroll with so many issues. Could be a rough few years for the Sawx
@driftcat28
A GM’s job is to win a chip and he delivered. I don’t think they need a rebuild they still have young pieces to build around and have about $40 mil coming off the books. Too early to rebuild I think. Maybe they can pull off a quick rebuild like the Yanks did 3 years ago.
The Yankees didn’t rebuild lol.
@JD Goat
Excuse me, “retooling”.?
Cashman struck gold, getting two desperate organizations to pay big time chips for Miller and Chapman. More recently, he’s found diamonds in the rough getting scraps from so many organizations. A couple of cubic zirconians along the way but overall he’s the Harry Winston of MLB. The best jeweler in the game.
Yanks 2016 opening day starters
Jacoby Ellsbury, CF
Brett Gardner, LF
Alex Rodriguez, DH
Mark Teixeira, 1B
Brian McCann, C
Carlos Beltran, RF
Chase Headley, 3B
Castro, 2B
Didi Gregorius, SS
Yanks current roster assuming all healthy:
Hicks CF
Gardner/Tauchman LF
Judge RF
Stanton DH
Voit 1B
Glyber/DJ 2B
DiDi SS
Urshela 3B
Sanchez C
How exactly wasn’t that a quick rebuild?
If I’m not mistaken Gleybar was the only one of those players that came out of that so called “rebuild”. Trading two rentals and another reliever when you’re missing the playoffs isn’t rebuilding lol
Four years is a long time. Do the Sox the same way. Pretty close.
@JDGoat
Traded Chapman for Gleyber Torres and Bill McKinney.. Torres makes Starlin Castro dispensable.
Traded McCann for Albert Abreu and Jorge Guzman.
Traded Bill McKinney and Brandon Drury for JA Happ.
Traded Jorge Guzman (currently Marlins 17th rated prospect) , Starlin Castro and Jose Devers (currently Marlins 11th rated prospect) to Miami for Giancarlo Stanton.
Traded Miller to the Indians for Justus Sheffield, Cliff Frazier and JP Feyereisen.
Traded Beltran for Eric Swanson, Nick Green and Dillon Tate.
Traded Sheffield, Swanson and Don Thompson-Williams to Seattle for Paxton
Traded Dillon Tate and another minor leaguer to Baltimore for Zack Britton.
. So it wasn’t as simple as you made it sound. He traded a bunch of vets, a ton of prospects and kept the right guys (Torres, Andujar, Judge, Sanchez and Severino).
Wish they would have passed on Stanton and signed JDM. Would have provided better balance to the lineup and cost a lot less. The Yankees biggest issue in the playoffs in past years is they are feast or famine and when they run into top pitching in the playoffs hey can struggle. This years team, with the injuries p, has been a much more balanced team which can win even when they don’t hit a ton of HRs.
They also traded Shreve and Gallegos to the Cardinals to get Voit.
Still, it was more of a retool than a rebuild.
Yankees didn’t rebuild. That was a retool at best.
They net 400 million so 200 million is nothing for them in Detroit it’s 30 million in the hole.
To be fair, the unsustainable spending in Detroit was ordered by the owner Illitch, who badly wanted a Championship before he died (which he unfortunately didn’t get). Now that Illitch is gone, he doesn’t care that everything has come crashing down for the Tigers.
Ownership mandated big spending and going “All In” for a Championship/
Dombrowski just implemented the plan just as ownership hired him to do..
Now, he is the scapegoat?!
Detroit was stupid to let Dave D go and not go into full rebuild mode
after 2014 or 2015.
They would be done with the rebuild if that had happened.
Only surprised by the timing of the move.
Not that he was let go (recall he was let go from Detroit right after trading away David Price to Toronto)…
He was let go because he told Illitch they needed to rebuild & they were losing 19 million a year so they had no cash. Unlike Boston who nets 400 million, Detroit was losing money to compete. Had they listened to Dave D,Tigers would have stated rebuild in 2015 not 2017.
Firing a guy less than a year after he helped lead you to a title? Unless he’s guilty of some sort of misconduct, this is ridiculous.
I think you’re on to something with the misconduct topic.
Oh shiiiiiiii
Huh? Didn’t they just win a World Series last year?
I wonder… does the team know internally that its going to break the highest tier lux tax penalties again this year, breaking ownerships red line?
Interesting thought.
I assume it’s more the league-high payroll and the being on the extreme outer fringes of the WC race with weeks left in the season.
They have mostly the same team and while they’ve been banged up and a bunch of guys have missed games, pretty much everyone has played much more often than not. So do you look at Cora, or Dombrowski (lack of depth for when guys have been out), or more at the players who have generally been less good (though in some cases seemingly due to injuries)?
Also giving Sale a contract when you could have waited til the end of this season.
I agree, the elbow information would’ve been helpful for the Red Sox to have known before hand, LOL
This ownership does not wanna pay managers or GMs, remember Tito n Theo? When they need to pay they don’t, the fire.
@pasha2k Well…I guess they have no problem paying a GM NOT to work for them. They still owe DD one more year.
When will Ricketts give Theo the pink slip?
Right after they can maddon
That is great news.
The man was a big spender that painted the team into a corner financially and it prevented them from acquiring the necessary talent to make it to the playoffs at the trade deadline.
He also did a mediocre job of evaluating talent.
They need to add a GM like Erik Neander of Tampa that knows the young inexpensive minor league and up and coming draft talent better.
spot on
Cora already manages like Tampa. This style of running out pitchers loses fans very fast unless the team wins. No one is talking but my guess is NESN’s ratings are tanking this year after a resurgence. That might also be part of the reason. I for one watched much less live and relied on the app to watch highlights after. The game today is simply unwatchable.
They won the World Series last year.
I think they will go after Neander and Bloom of the Rays; as well as Antonetti and Chernoff of the Indians; hoping to bring one in to run baseball ops.
I feel badly for him unless he has trouble negotiating contracts then I can understand. The ownership squeezed him this off season as they did other yrs too when the bad contracts were not his fault. They better not fire Alex.!!!!!!!!!
The owners got cheap & gave him no money to resign players. I guess netting 400 million a year should allow you to spend whatever is needed but…..
The owners got cheap & gave him no money to resign players.
——————————————————————–
Read the article. We are by far the highest payroll in baseball.
There’s a thing called a luxury test.
“Thanks for the championship. Now gtfo!”
what championship? Boston is out of it in 2019 with the highest payroll in baseball. if that doesn’t deserve a firing I don’t know what does?
2018… Red Sox won the World Series.
Yeah despite him.
did I miss something? last time I looked it was 2019 and not 2018. any reasonable person would expect the highest payroll in baseball to at least get you in the play offs.
@g8752
I think is where fans miss the point. It’s the GMs job to assemble the team but they can’t control players under performing or being unavailable or ineffective because of injuries. You CAN blame him for the Eovaldi signing the same way you can blame Cashman for brining back CC and trading for Paxton (to an extent). CC was a health risk and so is Paxton. Only difference was that CC was year to year so the risk was somewhat minimal and Paxton has been decent when healthy but still in his arbitration years so he’s a limited risk compared to Eovaldi’s 4 year deal.
But no way should the loss of Kimbrel and Kelly cause a team to fall off this much from going wire to wire last year and winning it all. It;s crazy how Boston has a losing record at home and a great record on the road. Not sure I’ve ever seen that from a Sox team in a while.
How in the world can you say this was shocking?
@DL0806
Because about 10 months ago his team won a world series championship?
If only he had done better than winning a championship. He really should have worked on impressing the good folks at Baseball Prospectus instead. Everyone knows that it is much better for people to think you should win a championship three years in the future than to actually win one now.
He wins a World Series & then gets fired when the owner doesn’t want to go over the tax limit? They print money in Boston & NET 400 million so paying an extra 20 to 40 million is nothing!! He will get hired quickly and guess what, Mookie ain’t resigning there so better trade him this off season.
Mookie is gone in the off season or definitely by the 2020 trade deadline for some great young talent.
We live in a very Twitterfied world.
He’s literally still the defending champion.
John Henry I’m happy you made this move.
You were on the right track when you tried to hire Billy Beane years ago.
You should listen to Bill James. His comments in the off season, while abrupt, were logical and will save you millions in the long run.
And yes you are seeing that older free agent expensive long term talent is not the way to go
There is no reason that Boston can’t be in the playoffs every year with an owner that can afford a higher payroll and a franchise that has a loyal fan base.
When you see Oakland and Tampa ahead of you at a fraction of the payroll that has to irk you.
Please hire a GM like Erik Neander of Tampa that knows the young inexpensive minor league and up and coming draft talent better.
@SG
Isn’t that literally what Cashman is being crucified for? Wanting to balance competitiveness with a maintaining a solid farm?
If you can build a team with a solid 5 years of being capable of winning a world series then I think the GM has done their job. And when you try and sustain that period longer it usually means a higher payroll and some players no longer worth their weight. It’s unusual in DD’s case because the players they lost should not have been the reason for the team being this bad.
I don’t know what cashman’s being crucified for as the Yankees are in first place and have had an amazing season and I was thinking that Tampa would be more of an example of the kind of organization I would like to have if I were an owner.
Fans were losing it at the deadline because he didn’t throw the farm away and get a front line starting pitcher. IMO, cashman has done a great job balancing the farm versus acquiring talent to fill out the team, but a number of fans would disagree.
Man that’s cray cray. I haven’t been this shocked since they fired Bobby V.
Bring back Theo!!
David Ortiz could be a candidate for the GM job.
An affable guy that is a future Hall of Famer who definitely knows the game.
That qualifies him for Goodwill Ambassador or On Air Color Commentator. Not GM.
Thought Dombrowski would have one more season to prove that 2019 was a fluke, but apparently not.
I love that all the RS fans have got to be humbled by the reality that they are in a bad place and it ain’t getting any better soon. They will trade Mookie B or let him walk. They can not afford to extend him. It’s a beautiful thing!
It already has gotten better by firing Dombrowski.
Yes, Mookie will be traded for some good young talent.
The Red Sox need 2 more good starting pitchers and a good closer and they’re right back in the playoffs.
The payroll goes down next year and maybe JDM opts out which saves them even more. With talent like Devers and Bogarts the hitting future of the team is bright.
Just look at what the Yankees did this year with players they brought up.
Tampa and Oakland did better than Boston for a fraction of the payroll.
With a lower payroll and a wealthy owner they can always pick up people at the trade deadline and just keep working on finding and developing young talent.
There is no reason why Boston can’t make a serious run at the playoffs and WS for years to come.
Agree 100%. We have a lot of talent remaining on this team. Of course, it doubtless counts heavily on Sale, Price, and Eovaldi being healthy, but we still have a lot of good players locked in for the next few seasons.
How do you figure the payroll goes down. Granted Panda’s salary is now off the books, but that money is long gone because they gave Sale the big extension which kicks in next season, Bogaerts got a big extension which kicks in next year. They won’t offer Pearce or Moreland a deal but those were low paying salaries on one year deals. Betts is going to get a raise thru abritration as will Bradley and Benetendi. Porcello has announced he won’t be back.
JD will stay because no one will pay that kind of money for a DH because he is a below average fielder. (Unless the NL opts for the DH rule)
As for trading Price or Betts , the only way another team takes either of them is if Boston picks up a huge chunk of their remaining salaries.
@bigwestbaseball
As a Yanks fan I don’t think the Sox are that bad off as ppl seem to think. Sox have a lot of good young players to build around, especially if they can extend Mookie and others. if so, Betts, Benetendi, Bradley Jr, Devers, Bogaerts and Rodriguez are a fine collection of talent. They just have to reinvest the money they have from departing contracts, hope for a healthy Sale and Price and try and improve the pitching overall. I think this team is better than their record leads you to believe.
Not a bad place at all. Have somewhere between $55M and $75M coming off the books depending on JDs decision so they can easily decrease payroll and could totally reset.. They have almost their entire offense back which is a top offense. The only holes they need to fill is 1b, 2b and 5th starter and they have internal options for all three that should do no worse than what they got this year. So, basically this next year comes down to their starting rotation. If they come back healthy by participating in spring training they should be a lock for the playoffs. If JD leaves they can decide where to spend a little money.
I feel bad for the Red Sox players. They are all tied to the respected, now dismissed, Dombrowski. They could feasibly lose confidence because of this new uncertainty.
imagine Alex Cora must be working hard to prevent all the suicides contemplated inside the Boston clubhouse as a result of Dave Dombrowski departure. oh my God what will we do without him?
It’s not a stretch to say the former GM who assigned all these contracts isn’t going to have effect on a player’s self worth. Chances of lingering doubt, media designating Boston’s star players as “Dombrowski guys” when their direction changes is pretty much a sure-fire recipe for disaster.
I agree with some other posters “every decision Dombrowski made would’ve been approved by ownership”. And now to fire him, is really more like firing themselves.
This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think this is a good move for Boston. Yes, they may make the wild card, but with their lack of a system and the amount of money that they have locked up right now, it’s going to be tough for them to compete against the Yankees, Jays and Rays who all have very young cores and seem set up for a while.
The Sox had a chance to really replenish the farm system had they flipped Sale, Porcello and/or Bogaerts in the offseason or simply just not paid them and taken the draft pick compensation.
Dombrowski just trades assets (whether they be prospect or money) for current success, regardless of what it means for the future. Look at Detroit: That rebuild is on him, by the time Avila got there it was already too late.
Wow, your opinion is not unpopular it’s uninformed. The depletion of the farm system was due to graduation not trading away anything of value. Other than Moncada, who left in the Sale trade, not one other player traded away has proven to be a star or even an above average player. Espinoza is a fine example of people incorrectly assessing trades made by DD. We got Pomerantz for a couple of year and gave up a guy who STILL isn’t in the majors.
Replenishing the farm system is a Yankee concept. See when a team can’t win a championship their GM can at least gloat about the highly rated farm system. No rings come from it but lots of notoriety and air time on the MLB channel. And really who wouldn’t rather have a top notch farm system over a World Championship?
your analysis is uninformed. having a top farm system is what you want. with that and John Henry’s money you can acquire pieces at the trade deadline to enhance your chances of succeeding in the playoffs. then you can let those expensive pieces go after the season is over and bring up your young Talent
Winning World Series titles is what you want. Anyone can have a top farm system.
You mean acquire players, not “pieces”.
In today’s game: a team needs a combination to be flexible. Sox had no top talent they were willing to give up and the tax penalties meant they could not just absorb salary.
I suspect he meant pieces, which means the same thing as players, pretty much, although pieces is more nuanced, and therefore more exactly what he meant.
please explain to me how you win a World Series again with the highest payroll in baseball and a poor farm system
You cannot win a WS without a good farm.
Look, graduation in a well run farm system means you might be a top 5 system, then you drop to 15th due to lots of graduation… not a drop off to nearly dead last as had happened in boston.
Farm systems don’t get extra credit based upon blue chips in aaa vs in single a… it’s all about the talent, the ceiling. A borderline #5 sp to mrp in aaa is worth less than a highly project able ace caliber 19yo in single a ball.
So the argument that graduation to the show is why a farm is regarded near the bottom of mlb is an even bigger indictment against a gm who has been around 4 years- it means he’s been around long enough to draft or sign internationally some potential impact talent, but, failed to do so. Once the predecessor’s signings made their way though, whether by promotion or trading away, all that’s left is the relative failed of the new regime.
@atlsoxfan First time I’ve ever heard anyone say the Yanks prioritise the farm vs winning. Cashman has traded away at least 8-12 prospects on their top30 list over the last 4 years and this far the ones he’s kept have done well. Its nearly impossible to compete for a championship and still field a good farm team. Just because Cash has shied away from deals he felt were too costly doesn’t mean he’s adverse to trading prospects.
excellent analysis
As a Cubs fan maybe the Red Sox would like to have Theo Epstein back. I’ll be happy to drive him to the airport. That being said, I won’t be picking up Dave Dombrowski anytime soon for a return trip to Chicago where he began his front office career with the White Sox back in the late 1970’s.
As a White Sox fan I still hope that both Theo and Dave will gain employment elsewhere so that GM Rick Hahn can take further advantage of both in future trades.
It’s a thin line between amazing and overrated. A GM is only as good as the level his players play up to.
so why are they his players if the level they play up to sucks? it’s his fault that they are his players
@g8752
If I sign Mark Trout to a 10 year deal and two years in he’s hitting like Steve Trout then that’s more on him than me. I think we can all agree that none of expected the Sox to be this bad this year. We expected some regression because of some of the bullpen losses and some guys may have had career years. However, if we can agree that we are all shocked by how bad they are then wouldn’t that suggest the problem is on the player and not so much the GM?
The offense had been just fine. The one player who really surprised was Sale.
Aside from Sale, DDs winter moves turned out exactly how you would expect for the career numbers and injury histories out of pearce and eovaldi. Likewise, the unproven bullpen did not underperform for who was there and their track records.
Sorry, but you can’t really blame this too much on the players. Even the rest of the rotation issues, if you look at the last few years, Erod has lacked efficency with a frustrating record of short innings, porcello had one aberration cy young year and otherwise is a #5, even the aging price never performed up to his contract value and thus, if anything, overperformed this year.
Subtract eovaldi/pearce, spend that on 3 7-8 mil relievers like ottavino, and you could’ve carried an underperforming rotation – and many of those 1-2 run losses in high scoring games would be wins.
Same thing everyone said all offseason, but DD knew better.
The dropoff in SP was huge and while each part may have been speculated individually, them all failing wasnt likely. Of course skipping spring seems to be the culprit. Lesson learned. They are easily in the playoffs if they had
White Sox fans think they won the Sale trade? If you are happy with it then you can consider it even but Boston got Sale who pitched as expected and helped hoist a trophy. Sox got Moncada who had a good season this year, his first one so far, and so far nothing else from the rest of the package.
Realistic White Sox fans think it’s too early to determine who ‘won’ the trade. Ideally both teams get what they want/need and it’s a win for both sides. Moncada and Kopech will both hopefully be contributing after Sale has hung up his spikes and/or his arm has fallen off.
what a terrible move. he depleted the system to get a ring. how many teams have done that with success. he deserved the chance to build them back up. the eovaldi contract was dumb, but the team was fairly similar to last years team. sale wasnt the same this year. some team is gonna get lucky with dd. not shocked only because its boston
Who did he trade that has proven to be a mistake. One trade and specifically one person. Travis Shaw who has had a horrible 19. Moncada for Sale every time I’d do that because you just don’t know and still don’t. There have been many one year wonders. The problem has been the team was drafting low and was prevented from signing international talent.
He did fine on his trades. He just blew it this offseason when he gave his entire pitching budget to Eovaldi when he could have had Britton and/or Ottavino and others.
Britton & Ottavino both have a BB/9 > 5.00. They would not have been the answer to our need for a closer.
Both would have been awesome bullpen depth, if not a closer. They had enough $$ to sign 2-3 very good bullpen arms. They gave it all to Eovaldi instead.
Dombrowski to the Padres? With all those prospects and $ available, he’d get them to the World Series.
Or bankrupt the team. LOL
This feels like an inevitable outcome quite honestly. DD did what he does, and finished off a contender. The Soxs signed up for it, and It worked. In doing so DD leveraged both the Sox’s prospect capital and financially. There seems to be little belief that he can get creative enough, without gobs of money or prospect capital, to make this team a contender again. Seems weird that you fire a guy for doing the job he was brought in to do, but I guess if you’re at a crossroads/don’t fully trust him in his evals, especially in lieu of a possible Betts trade, it’s makes sense. Just rip the band-aid off. One the other hand DD will probably find a team with a window opening with a top farm to deal from with an aggressive owner looking to possibly change fate. Tbh with what they’ve done seems like the Padres are that sweet spot to take a swing.
This is better news than the Sox winning the WS last year….I’m drinking to this.
If you like anything better than winning a WS, I will assume that you’ve already been drinking.
Theo Epstein deserves to be fired as well, but Joe Maddon will be his scapegoat.
The Tampa Bay Rays have a good baseball team and much of its success is attributed to their front office.
The teams ownership is a carpetbagging crowd of out-of-staters that would move the team if they were offered more a few more shekels.
They have no long history of keeping their top management since the team’s first season in 1998.
It would not surprise me to see one or more of their front office people leave for Boston or another franchise as everyone wants to learn how to duplicate their blueprint for achieving success on a minimal outlay of money.
Clearly David Mark Dombrowski was a traditional General Manager who spends first and most, along with trading prospects as his modus operandi, and that’s the opposite of what the Tampa Bay Rays management has done.
If your an owner who has won multiple championships with different front office GMs. Than this is par for the course.
The payroll was getting to high for them to justify Not making the playoffs. And egos run high.
Dom was probably asked Why they didn’t make the playoffs. Felt pressure. Had blame put on him. And faught back. Like I said. The owners think they can win with Other GMs in place. So they parted ways.
The Sox need better pitching. Period. But as a Giants Fan. I know that teams can come back after Not winning it all. Then reclaim another run at least every other year…
The Sox will be contenders. They always are. Great ownership. Spending all that money. On players and bringing them in. I expect the Sox to be back in play next season. . .
– And the Yanks offensive numbers this year, Are ridiculous… And not in a good way. The ball is Freakin’ Juiced. !
Dombrowski is going to the hall of fame. He wins. Who cares about the money. Just win baby.
John Henry cares about the money. LOL. how thoughtful of you to suggest he go bankrupt I just keep spending spending spending
Oh please let the BlueJays hire Dombrowski and raise the budget to $200M and say to him try to win now!
100% agreed. Should happen this morning. It won’t. Rogers refuses to hire winners.
If you are a Red Sox fan and not simply a DD hater or a fan of a rival team, this should be very disturbing news. I get that personalities always come into play with people of power but think about how Theo, Ben and now DD have all been dismissed after achieving great things. Would you want to work for people who reward success with firing? It almost appears as if the ownership is worried that the GM’s name will be attached to the success rather than theirs. After all, in Boston, EVERYONE knows Robert Kraft, Bill Belichick and Tom Brady. I guess maybe the Red Sox ownership is worried that the Red Sox will be known as DD, Cora and Mookie.
On the other hand, while incorrectly reported, the financial side of the last two seasons is unlikely to be the issue. From everything I’ve ever read, the GM would present spending to the ownership for their sign-off. If they truly disagreed, they would have said no.
Let’s do a quick recap of DD’s success story in Boston. Lets start with the farm system. History shows that we graduated Bogie, Betts, Benny, Vasquez, Devers, EROD, Chavis in an almost constant stream of promotions from the farm system to the Red Sox. So, is a FARM SYSTEM a SYSTEM or a point in time picture? See, I think the Red Sox farm system is the best in baseball because of our graduates in recent years. We did that without playing for last several years in a row like Houston and the Cubs. Only the Dodgers have a comparable SYSTEM that produces a stream of excellent players like we do. So when someone takes a point in time picture and says your farm system sucks tell them to go read about farm systems and what they are supposed to provide.
In a media crazy world where hitting a home run is more important and gets more air time than a guy putting the ball in play like Williams or Tony Gwynn, it makes sense that the number of top 100 prospects is like a 500 foot home run. Problem is, you don’t play for dominance in the farm system arena, you play for World Championships so NOBODY should care what a point in time picture suggests. As proof, take the top 2 farm systems today and see if they have more rings than you do this decade!!
Dombrowski didn’t strip our farm system, graduation stripped it, which is a really good thing!! We have out performed all other organizations since Theo because the GMs have made good decisions about personnel, both player evaluators and players. Mike Trout is supposed to be the best in baseball and Mookie is supposed to be close to him. Now name me the LAA equivalents of Bogie, Benny, Devers,Chavis, EROD and Vasquez? See, LAA is a one hit wonder but we produce year after year and someone needs to take credit for it. Since the GM is ultimately accountable, he should get that credit. Unfortunately, ownership has gone a different route by firing each GM that delivers a championship and a successful farm system.
So, I for one, am very unhappy that ownership has once again fired a GM who has done an excellent job but maybe too good because he might become bigger than ownership. I thought the accolades given Theo were even greater than what DD received last year and that was the driving force in his departure.. Now a pattern of behavior has been established so who would want to be the GM except someone starting out because they know if they are successful, they will be off to another opportunity.
What burns me is that DD had far less to do with our lack of success than Cora. CORA is the person who should be gone because he chose to take it easy in spring training and kill the pitching staff. He chose to move JD from the third spot in our line-up when we had just completed 4 months of the greatest winning percentage in our history. So while it didn’t impact last year except to reduce our projected 120 wins to 108 it did destroy the team’s record in 2019. Yes, CORA’s brainchild of moving JD to 4 for more RBI opportunities despite the facts showing it reduces them, was implemented in March and April of 2019. We all remember two guys who hit well early in the year, JD and Moreland. Unfortunately, it took 5 weeks of floundering before JD got moved to the 3 hole and then we went 18-4. JD hurt his back and has not been used in the 3 hole again. Our record with him batting 3rd is roughly 67% wins and batting anywhere else it’s roughly 50%. Shouldn’t that be something a manager or an analytics department should be able to figure out? I started a blog WHAT DID CORA SCREW UP TODAY and I have yet to experience a day where there wasn’t at least one entry. Why? Because he wasn’t qualified for the job but he was handed the most talented team in baseball. He cost us at least a dozen wins last year and even more this year. He plays favorites and his favorites aren’t very good. He claims to be a people manager but throws his player under the bus daily with his famous shaking of the head and “we just need to play better’ routine at the post game interviews. Can anyone picture Belichick doing that? No. He would say the coaching staff needs to prepare the players better, like any manager with integrity. But, oh boy, did he spend time with the media last year talking about his pep talks with Mookie and how much they turned him into a MVP. I guess no pep talks this year because he hasn’t looked like 2018 Mookie until recently. That might suggest those talks had absolutely nothing to do with Mookie’s great year. He’s a bench player trying to push himself into the spotlight and in the meantime our line-ups are terrible, our pitchers are being used incorrectly and our stars rest more than any other stars in baseball. Can someone please tell CORA about Lou Gehrig and Cal Ripken. Players don’t need two days off each month. And sitting guys like Mookie and JD the week before two open days is UNACCEPTABLE. We lost some very important games in August because of resting starts when they didn’t need it. Last year was a fluke. CORA sat guys when we played the Orioles and Blue Jays and we’d fall behind then the top of the order would come up in the 8th or 9th inning and we’d come from behind to win against a team we would have routinely beat if we hadn’t over-rested our star players.
CORA’s lack of experience shows daily so I vote for him to be the next off the island!!
I wish DD luck going forward and I have that same terrible feeling I had when we let Theo go. We should always learn from the past and 100 years ago the Red Sox ownership made the single biggest error in baseball history. It took nearly a century to fix it. Let’s hope this mistake isn’t as colossal but it sure seems like tomorrow’s headline will be MOOKIE sold to the Yankees!!
Cast vote for stupid comment….DD took the job knowing what he had to work with. He made a few smart decicions like he did with Detroit however he made a lot bad for a win now team….they won
..now they suck so time for a refresher
Bruh this is a whole lot of nothing…
Spot on
“Let’s do a quick recap of DD’s success story in Boston. Lets start with the farm system. History shows that we graduated Bogie, Betts, Benny, Vasquez, Devers, EROD, Chavis ”
————————————————————————
And DD drafted exactly none of those players. That’s part of Theo’s success story; not DD’s.
Let’s be fair though, DD does get a little credit in choosing which of those players to keep as he traded away vast swaths of the farm
Remember ERod was not drafted by Boston. He came from Baltimore for Andrew Miller when they also traded Lester and Lackey. I don’t know for sure but some of the above might be Sherrington picks. Either way, trader DD gets credit for not trading them.
Everyone was already on the team and producing, except Benni.
Past that, the selection process was on the positive side. Espinoza & Kopech both underwent TJS. Maybe there was something the RS thought was a risk, maybe not. But we have not given up a lot, though certainly some could come back to haunt us.
Epstein didn’t draft a single one of those players
Epstein didn’t draft a single one of those players
———————————————
He drafted Betts, JBJ, and Vazquez. That’s easy enough to research. But the point was that to defend DD by pointing out 7 players that DD had no part of acquiring, is pretty far afield.
“Dave Dombrowski was brought in here[Boston} to do a job: Spend the prospect largesse, and win a title with it. He did. Rebuilding the cabinet and looking to the future, John Henry turns to Romero, part of the baseball ops braintrust here forever. #RedSox” -@JonCouture
·
Prospects are just suspects. You want to win it all or finish first in the MLBPipeline sweepstakes?
Good
Definitely a tad shocking. But with the season they’re having in the market they are in after the expectations they rightfully had….. makes sense lol
If you are a franchise willing to spend you might want to hire Dombrowski. Proven winner.
For those concerned about Boston’s prospects….your odds of a better farm system will happen when you draft inside the Top 10 rather than close to 30th every year. Dombrowski did what he had to do; cashed in a ring. Put the Red Sox in-position to win from 2016-2018. He did his job. Well.
Amen.
noticed how you stopped at 2018 and forgot about 2019 and the future which is why he’s not in the future.
This isn’t surprising. There have been rumors and cracks since this off season between he and management. I was hoping after the World Series the Sox would do what they did after 2013. Use the next season to reshape the team. They have all these young guys approaching contracts while having big bucks on the books. Letting Kimbrel and Kelly go were smart because look what they did this year. Pablo and Porcello are coming off the books. Moreland and Pearce were short money. The only good news is the new mistake contracts are long term.
They have to make the tough move on Betts if they can’t sign him this off season.
The problem with the team right now is they are good shape with position players, even replacing Betts. Their pitching is a disaster.
.
Hopefully this move will make it that much easier for Middleton to can Klentak and MacPhail at the end of this season.
Excellent article. It starts out with shock and then clearly explains the reasons DD is gone. It’s still a business as Mookie said. That’s why he’s gone. DD broke the bank and saddled the team with many injured ineffective players. As John Henry said “in 2019 it’s just a matter of how much money we lose.”
The handwriting is on the wall if your name is “Alex Cora.”
Grady Little is holding on line 3
Great article and I don’t have a commenting account anywhere else, so I figured I could says my 1000 words. I have not written anything here in a very long time, but to read this when I woke up this morning is truly disturbing. I’m not a Red Sox fan, but my immediate reaction is to think, as I’ve often thought, the Red Sox might actually be the most dysfunctional sports organization in American sports.
I’ve long stated the 2013 WS was the most undeserving and fluke of a championship in modern sports history. Nothing about that season or legacy had WS written on it. It was sandwiched by some of the worst baseball I can ever remember seeing, including by far, once again, the most dysfunctional management team and ownership team. It was by all measures, a complete circus. I go over the last 10 years of WS wins and I have an asterisk next to the 2013 WS and label it complete luck. Just teams dropping out of the Red Sox way to win that. I know, sounds nuts, but when you really look at it. It’s more a by product of the atrociousness surrounding the game in those years.
Anyway, to read this, this morning, perhaps one of the most tenured and respected baseball personnel to be “fired” after winning last year (a far more deserved and true championship) and technically acting at the defending WS champs, is somewhat unsettling and I’m not even a fan of the Red Sox. It’s just bizarre. Lots of Red Sox fans will read these very critical comments and be in denial about the dysfunction from their teams ownership, but make no mistake, this team, as it’s never been, is a legacy team.
In some ways, this firing shows the Red Sox are the complete opposite of their arch nemesis the Yankees. No class.
I just don’t know what else to say, but I guess I just wanted to write to state what I have time and time again, the Red Sox ownership really has no idea what they are doing and in someways, reading stuff like this devalues their previous championships – it kind of illustrates a flash in the pan mentality and really that it’s more about profits than establishing a legacy. Just weird.
Then again, in response to my own comment, I thought about my commenting from last off season and I was extremely vocal over the fact the Red Sox made serious mistakes in how they approached their off season and should have traded away some star players – the writing was on the wall that the Red Sox were facing the perfect storm of maturing prospects to free agency, some over achievement (Bradley, etc), lots of bloated contracts and they would have been justified in re-tooling the team. I guess time will tell. And that’s the thing about the Red Sox. It’s hard to make sense of something that I guess really isn’t supposed too. Not the Yankees or Astros, that’s for dang sure…
You all have to read the comments in “Dave Dombrowski discovers having the biggest payroll always comes with a price
By Dan Shaughnessy Globe Staff,Updated September 9, 2019, 1:31 a.m”
I’ll say this, my faith in Red Sox fans has been renewed. Not a lot of comments, but many are extremely critical of ownership and many seem to echo my statements above, that the optics of something like this, deserved or not, is terrible for the Red Sox. It truly is dysfunctional up there in bean town.
That is a lot of typing to say you hate the Red Sox. Nothing fluke about 2013, they had the best record in the AL during regular season and beat 3 of the other top seasons. Flukes are teams like the Cardinals who won like 84 games and pulled out 3 series for a championship. There were no indicators to say blow up the team before this season, only an idiot would say let’s break up essentially the same team after last year. The mistake was Coras spring training approach that led to the huge dropoff in SP performance. The rest of the team is comparable to last year. Had their $80M rotation not underperformed this year they would be easily in the playoffs and going for a repeat.
4 * asterisks in 15 years for a dysfunctional team ain’t bad. LOL
Hate to think how good they could have been if they we’re more functional.
I’m sorry. They’re not dysfunctional because they don’t run a team they way you would. Try again. That has to be about the most opinionated subjective judgment of the team in the whole comment section.
Sorry. Didn’t get a chance to edit this comment. I’d say the ownership has one Hell of a “legacy” too. At least they spend their money and can people to win.
Striking that they did it now, as opposed to the end of the season. Did they expect the players to respond and win the Wild Card because of it?
wowwwwww
How is anyone surprised. This has been mentioned all season. DD only had a year left. Cora goes nowhere and the Sox have a great core. They make a couple moves and are back to probably winning it all or at least competing. Yankee fans don’t get too excited. The Sox aren’t going anywhere. Yankees can’t win until they get some starting pitching. Cashman has don’t. Great job but they still need starting pitchers. Sale, Price and ERod are still good and it’s time for Eovoldi to perform next year. They need to get a closer, sign or trade Mookie and redo JD’s contract. It’s not rocket science and they have some $ coming off the books. Dodgers and Astros will be tough to beat this year and the Sox will be back in short order. Too much talent. Just look at the year that Devers and Bogarts are having. Impressive with years in front of them.
The Red Sox are Yankees North.
Seems harsh since many Red Sox fans didn’t expect to repeat. This year the team lacked payroll flexibility because of bad signings by Cherington. Dombrowski’s worst signing was overpaying Steve Pearce this year. Pearce was only back because he won WS MVP, which in my opinion David Price should have won. As silly as it is, I think fans would feel better about the David Price contract if he had been given WS MVP.
Eovaldi’s deal is much worse than Pearce’s.
Yes and Sale’s contract is even worse considering he may need Tommy John surgery soon. Just look at Sale’s splits in September and October 2018 and one has to wonder why DD didn’t realize his arm had an issue?
Sale also had a great stretch in the middle of this season, indicating that there was no carry-forward from last September.
if you look at sales splits from 2019 he only had spot instances where he produced but his numbers by month were generally much poorer than what he’s put up over his entire career and even last year
I haven’t read every comment above so I’m not sure this was mentioned…what makes you think he isn’t stepping away on his own? His contract is up at the end of 2020, he’s been a major league GM since 1988, he’s 63 years old, he’s made millions of dollars. I have this as a retirement more than a firing.
Also, what else is there to accomplish with the Red Sox; based on the money & prospects spent it seems like he was told to win now at all costs…job complete.
I’m going to go with Jed Hoyer as first choice, then Mike Hazen, as the next GM with Amiel Sawdaye on the list if they can’t get either Hoyer or Hazen.(or the Cubs/Dbacks won’t let them leave).
Hiring from within didn’t work last time; Henry may not go that route again.
Shocker. I have to agree with some if yous hoyer will be the next gm. He’s tired of being Epstein’s puppet he’s even said it. Before that he’d like to have complete autonomy to make trades and. Sign players.
I have the Mets signing dombrosky, he would be an upgrade remove Jeff wilpon from making baseball decisions let a pro handle it
The worst pet of this is that he is one of the last true “gunslingers”. Now pretty much all front offices are going to be all risk adverse. Yay.
Which team will DD become the next GM for? My best guess is 1) LAA, 2) PHI then 3) WSN.
Moreno and Middleton don’t pay taxes on the payroll.
I don’t think he goes anywhere next; but WAS would be a landing spot with another early exit from the playoffs. I can’t disagree with much Rizzo has done but he has fired a lot of managers…Rizzo has to be the next to leave.
I think Henry asked DD about an extension past 2020 & DD said he may not want one so Henry cut the cord. Henry probably wants his Pres of Ops/GM to be settled for multiple years going forward, not one year. You can’t have a short-timer running an organization.
Not shocking; a bit surprising. John Henry must have gotten news last night that more people were watching the Pats open up than watching the Sox…..
The metric in Boston is tough; DD paid the price. But he’ll survive; if he wants to work, he undoubtedly will find a job. He’s 63, and been through some stormy situations; he might just want to quit. He’ll be fine.
So will the Sox. The core is still there, and they’re not about to “tank” and sell nonsense about the future; that doesn’t work in New England. They’ll still be competitive next year.
Well, the metric is no tougher in Boston than anywhere else except maybe for the left coast with the exception there being the Dodgers so let’s not hype “only excellence is accepted” in Beantown….fans everywhere want a winner and they want it now.
Of course Henry wants to win and stay relevant in the Boston media as compared to the other sports franchises there but while he wants to win, he’s also a business man who didn’t; become rich because he thought with his pocketbook instead of his head.
Secondly and most importantly they have lots of money issues starting with the luxury tax which they’re backs are up against again in 2020 unless they dump salary but of course where to start?
Also there’s the potential contract extensions like JDM to stop him from opting out and leaving, the Mookie contract coming up soon, and the massive salary vs performance issues like Eovaldi, Price, Sale, Pedroia etc.
Not simple for the next GM to navigate especially since Henry isn’t exactly saying he’ll ignore the Lux tax and spend whatever you wish to get them back to the playoffs.
The core is there…..maybe not for long just depends on the perspective of the next GM but please don’t try and sell us on the statement of no sell off because the New England fan just doesn’t accept anything but WS success!
as a general manager you must take into consideration the existing budget and Personnel in the farm system plus the actual team currently. John Henry should certainly not be criticized for refusing to pay even more money than the top spending team which Boston currently is. so it comes down to the general manager realizing that he’s fortunate enough to have a wealthy owner who has drawn a line and the sand on payroll and is merely asking why teams like Tampa and Oakland which have payrolls a fraction of Boston’s have better records.
I will take a swing at this. Contract negotiations didn’t go anywhere so he moved on. I’m not sure why this is getting so many comments.
Not many comments about his replacement. I’m sure they could talk Al Avila into leaving The Motor City.
Out of the NewcEngland Area Who the F cares.
Apparently MLB Rumors cares, as do you.
MLB Rumors is going to report it regardless. And you dont speak for me.
Thank you for once again posting on this thread.
It seems like everyone in here either loves the move or hates the move. The truth is that DD is neither great nor bad.
To start with, most of the team was built by Theo in 2011, so DD gets no credit for most of the players,.
If you go to his trades, they were neither bad nor good. We aren’t missing any of the guys from the Kimbrel trade. I think we got damaged goods in the Smith and Thornburg trades, but hardly miss the guys we traded. We certainly miss Moncada, but we aren’t getting a perennial CY candidate without giving up some talent.
Price was overpriced, but not by a lot. Eovaldi was too high and too long. I thought he was more like a $39M/3 type of player. But I had no issue re-signing him. JDM was a good signing.
I think it is too early to comment on the drafts. I like Casas, Dalbec’s been okay, and Groome got hurt.
I was never a DD fan, but also don’t think he is a bad GM. Part of the issue is that he got stuck with some veteran contracts like Porcello, Pedey, Sandoval Part of the issue is that the talent Theo drafted in 2011 are getting closer to market price. That’s the way it goes with a lot of WSC teams. You win as your cheap players graduate to veteran players, but you also get more expensive that way.
Pretty obvious what’s coming next. A massive fire sale starting with Mookie Betts. If JDM doesn’t opt out then they will pawn him off on a contending team even if they have to eat a third of his remaining money.
JBJ is sure to be non-tendered as he is not worth the money he will get in arbitration. Can’t do much about all of the bad contracts but any pending free agents will be let go unless they want to sign somewhere near the minimum.
I can’t blame them when I look at how the Yankees are setup. They are loaded on both the major and minor league levels with few bad contracts. They will dominate this division for the next five years so it is better for the Sox to get a head start on the rebuild.
I would do Betts. I’d be glad to have JDM back at his salary. Eating 1/3rd of a $21M contract, for the #4 hitter in the AL, is pretty much insane. JBJ I would probably keep. He is slightly expensive, but we have no 2020 replacement.
The reality is it’s not obvious at all.
That’s why DD got fired.
He’s supposed to see the not so obvious and make changes ahead of time.
That was funny. Yankees are overachieving this year with a lineup of castoffs far exceeding expectations and their farm is not that highly thought of. I’m not saying the Yankees wont be good for years to come but nothing says they will dominate. They have to start paying arb money to some of their young guys and upgrade their rotation big time. Boston has as good or better young offensive core in Vazquez, Bogaerts, Devers, Benintendi, Bradley, Betts with Chavis ready to join them. For both it is SP which Boston on paper has a huge edge with if they earn their money.
Spoken like a true homer….good core….Bradley can’t hit water normally if he fell out of a boat, Betts is going to test free agency and most of the current articles have him either leaving or costing so much money that Boston, unless they commit to paying the 75% lux tax for the next 5+ years, will either be forced to trade to dump money, or not be able to go after any free agents to improve their team.
The article is about the Red Sox, not the Yankees,…..try being objective!
Original comment brought up the Yankees dominating the division, not that hard to follow but you missed it. If Betts leaves that is a big impact but there is a chance he stays. If he does he will make $10-$15 million more a season, easily doable if JD leaves. Also pitching comes off the books. Never said all were all stars but JBJs gold glove defense has made him a valuable part of several division winners and a WS.
There won’t be any “fire sale”. John Henry is too smart not to realize that he has to stay consistently competitive to survive in a market with the Pats, who continue to defy the laws of physics, and the Bruins and Celts, both of whom are usually “in it”. Three years of not competing devalues the franchise far too much; Henry knows this. Silly things like short-term profits and luxury taxes really don’t matter in Boston; the “brand” is everything.
Just about everyone realizes the “Golden Age” of rapid franchise value increase is over; gambling and streaming only takes you so far. If The Sox did nothing else last night, it kept them on the front page for another week or so. And in the end that’s all that matters.
Depends on your definition of “fire sale” because if you read most of today’s articles coming out of Boston, there’s no way the Red Sox are going to keep both JD and Mookie….and the point may be moot if JD takes his good year and tries to leverage out of Boston…remember, he was going for the money and contract and landed in bean town at the last minute on a deal he felt was undervalued.
There will always be a team that values his offense more than his defense (Angels) and has the money to pay him.
Mookie, is going to test free agency, as he has said it over and over again.
Henry didn’t make his money worrying about what the Celts, Bruins and Pats have done, and the hometown press will always find a way in the AL East to promote the Sox. The lux tax hit of 75% will be a burden to bear unless he can shed salary and with Price, Sale, Bogarts signed long term and with the money he still owes Rusney, Petey, and Panda plus the long term deals, fiscally, the team’s new GM is going to have an anchor on its back trying to stay in the hunt while positioning for the next run.
2 of the 3 you mention hurting the next GM wont. Castillo doesnt count against lux tax unless they put him on the 40 man which they wont. Sandoval is off the books at the end of the year.
IT”S A BUSINESS. Poop happens. Thank you for the Championship DD. Happy Trails to you. Like to see another team pick you up. You did not GM the Red Sox Scared. I liked that about you. See you on the rebound…
As Brent Musburger said to Dan Fouts in “The Waterboy” — “Poop??” 🙂
Dumb move. He does s good job.
He was barely mediocre.
Essentially two business models in MLB these days, the Cashman, AA, Dombrowski model to spend versus the Houston or Tampa Bay model to manage. The former requires owners content with short-term results while the latter owners who want to present a contending team season after season.
Arguably, AA tried the spending option while in Toronto, much as he is in Atlanta today, with the kind of results fans wanted though the Jays fell short both seasons. Toronto owners had to deal with the reality of paying more to players no longer playing, or playing in Toronto than were committed to those on the roster today. Play with the arbitrary values of farm systems and other statistics individuals cited in their cherry-picking frenzy, the fact remains it is a short-term business strategy that more often than not falls short if not outright fails.
In reading the comments, I don’t see many Dombrowski sympathizers offering credible explanations why an organization with the highest payroll in MLB and facing more spending fines has a winning percentage of .531 (as of this morning) and sits 12th in all of MLB. Yes, 12th.
Individuals can nitpick all they like about injuries — every team in MLB has had to deal with injuries to key players — and even the manager’s faux pas but at the end of the day, general managers are hired to manage and that is where the buck stops. Am sure the Boston ownership, like a few in MLB, has a business plan that extends more than one season so you cannot blame them for expecting something better than just a winning season. Boston fans can be excused because for decades they wallowed in the Curse and their obsession with a quirky bandbox of a ballpark.
Count me among those who rue the loss of those days when MLB embraced the take out slide at second, those collisions at home plate, and when MLB was less of a business and more of a game with team loyalty, respect for the clean line drive, and disdain for hulks who bragged about their ability to strike out more often than they hit the ball. MLB has evolved to a business operation and fans will just have to endure the Dombrowski’s and AAs of the world. And the doctored ball and business types’ obsession with home runs. Sheesh.
To those who contend that winning is everything, I cannot begin to imagine why you chose baseball where those who fail 70 percent of the time are among our heroes.
“I don’t see many Dombrowski sympathizers offering credible explanations why an organization with the highest payroll in MLB and facing more spending fines has a winning percentage of .531 (as of this morning) and sits 12th in all of MLB. Yes, 12th.”
—————————————————————–
If we had three years of .531, you’d have a point. But we did finish 1st, 1st, 1st, and a WS. I’m not a DD fan, but you have to look at the complete body of work.
“Individuals can nitpick all they like about injuries — every team in MLB has had to deal with injuries to key players —”
———————————————————————–
It isn’t a nitpick. If this was the same rotation as 2018, we’d have a great record. If you wanted to argue that the roster was very thin, I’d agree.
“If we had three years of .531, you’d have a point. But we did finish 1st, 1st, 1st, and a WS. I’m not a DD fan, but you have to look at the complete body of work.”
This ignores the fact that in the non world series years prior to this year, the team did underachieve in the playoffs when the games really matter. Prior to last year the team won a combine 1 playoff game in series they were heavily favored to win.
To your second point you can’t ignore injuries especially to pitchers like Sale who broke down in two of the past three years and Eovaldi.. I’m surprised that no one has pointed out how Clay Kershaw a much more accomplished pitcher also coming off an injury signed for less years and dollars than Sale while both are roughly the same age (Kershaw 31, Sale 30.) .or that albatross contract he gave to Eovaldi who has a checkered injury history and over his career save for the end of last season has been a mediocre pitcher.
Playoff series are typically toss-up events. If my counting is correct, we’ve won 3 of the 5 playoffs series we’ve been involved with under DD.
I disagree with what you said about playoffs being toss ups. Also saying the team has won 3 out of five is disingenuous and rather meaningless. It’s hard to keep winning playoff series if you loss in the first round in two out of three years.
If your team finished 1st three years in a row, would you prefer loss, loss, and WSC? Or three ALDS wins and no WS?
Since we’re dealing in hypotheticals I would prefer to win three world series titles with a bullpen that would be effective in October. Bottom line it takes next to no skill to trade all your best prospects for late prime/exiting prime players and to overpay free agents.
I have to agree that if we had the same “healthy and functional” rotation as 2018 we’d be OK..
@bocknobby The Astros are not a team like the Rays.They are big market and are spending money. The are in the same group of about 10 teams that include the 3 that you listed (Yanks, Braves, Red Sox) They all can afford to spend money and make mistakes. They have the funds to eat contracts that go bad. The Rays and the other teams not in the top 10 in market size need to count on a lot of luck. The Rays have that luck this season.
I definitely agree with gozurman. The Astros spend money just like other big market teams. There is certainly nothing wrong with that. There is nothing wrong with being lucky either.
DD did exactly what they brought him in to do…
So now the speculation as to DD’s replacement…..
IMHO, Raquel Ferreira is the perfect choice. Henry likes to be a trend setter; he seriously considered Kim Ng when she was all the rage a few years ago. Ferreira is certainly qualified, a woman, a minority, and would have the aid of the Sox’ gazillion “special advisors”, from Tony Larussa to Bill James to Jason Varitek to Pedro Martinez, to help her out. The marketing possibilities are endless. And she’d be a heck of a lot cheaper than DD.
La Russa was DD hire and the game passed him by decades ago so he should be gone with Dombrowski.
Chaim Bloom or Andrew Friedman will be next GM of the Boston Red Sox.
Chaim would be a good choice but I doubt as a GM. Presidents are basically the GM’s now
Why would Freidman even touch that gig?!
He has in made in LA
Boston’s Ownership group is getting a reputation as one that many don’t want to work for…..
The job is unstable.
The Front Office is always in turmoil.
Experienced GMs are not gonna want that job.
They fire a guy who won them 4 Divisions?!
A franchise record 108 games?
A World Series Championship in 2018?!
I bet most experienced GMs pass on that deal
I would of had him trade or sign Betts first, cause that’s gonna be a no win for a new GM. Either your giving out probably the biggest contract ever, and we all know how that can go, or your trading basically your franchise player in his prime.. this will get really interesting.
I hate Boston but you gotta hand it to them, they always want to win and people are held accountable. You could see this team kinda being painted into a corner, by way of huge, useless contracts and emptying the farm, but hey, you gotta hand it too them, they went for it last year and pretty much ran away with everything, and that’s not easy to do in the major leagues.
and you have to really respect Billy Beane the general manager of Oakland for consistently being in it year after year after year with a payroll a fraction of teams like New York or Boston or LA or the Cubs
Betts and JD Martinez are leaving.
Red Sox management probably looking at Twins, Rays and A’s going to the post-season, and that $240mil number looks even bigger.
I doubt it, they just won a World Series last year. Id guess the only soul searching is to tell Cora that this year proved you cant skip spring training and World Series hangovers are real if you let them be. Lesson learned.
Managing is the problem this year? You have to go more into detail on that. I’m an Indians fan so this is an outsider perspective. To me, Red Sox are great because of the farm system. Betts, Devers, Benintendi, Bogaerts, Bradley, etc. But Nate Evoldi doesn’t need $17 mil a year when you’re trying to tie up Betts. Better yet, they can’t hold on to any of their homegrown talent right now. Even the Red Sox have overspent and they need to cut to try to keep some of these guys. Typical Red Sox and Yankees fans.
Cora made the choice not to have a real spring which led to a terrible start and significant struggles for our rotation all year. I agree on Eovaldi, didnt like the signing then for the same reason, it was money to lock up our guys wasted but that didnt impact 2019 much.
So the Red Sox aren’t making the playoffs this year. Cry me a river.
I get it. Ownership realizes it needs to reset, payroll can’t keep going up, and there isn’t a ton of cheap help on the horizon.
That’s not DD’s wheelhouse.
Someone else comes in. I’m assuming they lock up Betts, then the new guy has to figure out how to cut payroll. I’d assume that the thought process would be that they are not going to contend next year but hope to turn it around relatively quickly.
Does Sale have any value (without paying down his contract)? I’d think that outside of those with three or less years service time and Betts, Bogaerts, Devers, and Bentidini pretty much anyone else could be moved. Those 4 form a strong core- surround them with Chavis and Vasquez types and the offense will be fine; just need to rebuild the pitching (which is obviously easier said than done).
Cue the Theo rumors.
Only if Theo agrees to come to his hiring presser in a gorilla suit……..
I’d hire him back in a second. He hasn’t been here in 8 years, yet the core of the team, Betts, Bogaerts, Vazquez & JBJ, were acquired by Theo.
The damage is done and will be long-lasting just like Detroit
Trade away Mookie Betts. I’m tired of hearing these extension talks and we don’t have the money for him. Trade him, get prospects and bullpen pieces, and hope for the best.
He seems like Ellsbury in that he’ll leave for a dollar more. I have no problem with that, but that’s how he seems.
LMAO Boston fans are hilarious, they didn’t like Cherington and he got them a world series title and built up the farm system, then they loved Dombrowski. and never complained about his trades right up until they went from winning the World Series to missing out the next year. Why is it his fault its the same team he put together last year and you all loved him.
So ownership has fired two President of Operation the year following world series wins, they have fired winning managers.
They are so far over the luxury tax lines this year is costing them 75% and losing their 1st round draft pick by 10 positions. And please don’t be like some fool and suggest that they have the money, right now Boston is bleeding money.
Betts will go F/A simply because he wants to be able to say he’s #1 in the MLB
Bradley will likely follow suit
Martinez will not opt out unless the NL goes to the DH
Sale and Price are unknowns right now both are getting older and both have started showing injuries.
Evoldi didn’t develop like they had hoped
Porcello has reverted to his pre Cy Young form
Cashner hasn’t worked out
Pedroia is likely finished or he should retire to prevent being crippled for life
Moreland is F/A this year and they only signed him to a 1 yr deal last year
Pearce has been out most of the season
Wright does anyone remember him. 60 game suspension then rehab the rest of the season.
Since he’s been on the job three division championships and one world title and you let him go. This is just the beginning of a downward spiral in Boston. It was discussed Saturday during the Yankees – Red Sox game how they don’t know the extent of the injuries to sell in price and it looks like Mookie will test the free-agent market after next season so he could be gone. All of this including Martinez has an opt out clause in his contract every year for the next three years mookie in my opinion is as good as gone as well he was offered an eight year contract worth 200 million and he turned it down all signs point he even sees the writing on the wall.
That Roster Resource site has a glaring error, where it overstated the “Sum of Other Payments” section at the bottom by over $15 million. Given that the Sox are just under the top tier limit of $246M, not $11+M over.
Folks who want a small market guy like Bloom to come to Boston forget Dan Duquette….”look what he did in Montreal, imagine what he can do with all the money Boston has!!!!!”….yeah…..
It’s a qualitatively different situation, not just a quantitative one….You can lose a few bucks in Tampa and get it back through Revenue Sharing (though I expect there are drastic changes coming with the new CBA). In Boston, you lose real dollars, and, because they’re so reversely integrated, you lose LOTS of dollars…..it’s an entirely different landscape. You can celebrate that every “fanny in the seat” in Boston is worth three times what it is in in Tampa (because of that integration), but you have to understand that when you lose that fanny, you’re losing three times as much.
The rich are different….they have more money…..
Of course. The extra spending money is offset to some degree by:
1-Very seldom having high draft picks. Houston is good because Correa was a 1/1 pick, Bregman was a 1/2, and Spring a 1/11.
2-No rebuilding process. The large market teams can have a July 31 sell-off, in a bad year, but they cannot do a full tank job. Houston lost 100+ 3 years in a row. The big market teams don’t want to jeopardize their fan base that way. TO is off about 1.6 million tickets in just 2-3 years. SFG are off by 600k. For teams like TB, they could sell off everyone without affecting attendance.
What have you done for me lately…no bad decisions allowed…regardless of all the good ones the past 5 years…lots of “loyalty” by the Sox owners!!! Lol!!!
As a Red Sox fan thanks DD for the championship he was brought in to do a job and he accomplished that.
This move shows me that ownership wants to go below and reset the lux tax. I would not be surprised to see Mookie traded especially if JDM doesn’t opt out. If this is the plan then DD is just not your man to do a soft rebuild and the owners recognize this.
Whomever the next GM is going to be has to be able to rebuild that system while competing out in the field. Boston ownership won’t tolerate a 3-5 year rebuild so good luck to the next GM.
Once again thanks DD for the 2018 World Series champions and good luck in future endeavors.
This is not shocking I mean look at the guys resume he comes in and wins yes but at what cost..every team he has ever been with he depleted the farm trading for older guys and then extends them to the moon which puts the team behind the league over time and before everyone starts saying that the Red Sox have younger guys yeah they do but they were at the major league level already when he showed up..He will win you title but at the cost of 3-5 rebuilding years after
The Tigers had no farm immediately before or after DD.
Absolutely agree. Any GM could of won in Boston with that roster and farm system. Dumbroski constantly ruins a farm system and buries teams in payroll. He absolutely killed Detroit. Then to pay $6.25 million to someone like Pearce showed he had no clue. He reminds me of the the US Government spend now worry about paying later. Maybe he will run for office
Wrong. DD made the perfect moves for Eovaldi and Pearce during the season last year. He hired Cora who pushed all the right buttons, as well. He brought in Sale and Price, who were huge parts of the championship team. There is definitely a bit of a mess to clean up now but much of it isn’t his fault(Panda, Rusney, Pedroia), but it’s all worth it considering the Championship. The Red Sox like to go boom and bust. They will retool and be back strong.
So they let all their FAs walk, hope JD opts out, use the money (and the money they’ll save post-Mookie) and sign Rendon (who was built by God to play in Fenway) and the pitchers all come even a lit bit back……and they’re favorites to win the division…..
There isn’t a team in MLB that wouldn’t want a core of Devers/Boegarts/Benetendi/Vasquez. And with Devers at 1B (where he belongs), that’s on BOTH sides of the ball….Get a little lucky, and they’re right back in it….
Is DD the poster GM for opposing sustained success for near-term ultimate “all-in” success followed by teardowns? I may be somewhat biased as a Dodger fan whose team dabbled(imprudent for half measures in this approach) with that in the past. One hears many fans comment on here about how there team needs to just go for it. The Marlins have won 2 WS since their advent. Who would argue that the Marlins’ fan experience has been better than the Dodgers’ fan experience in that same time frame?
Maybe unfair considering fan base, stadium quality, and loathesome owners(Loria out trumps McCourt-pardon the loathesome pun).
Yet another possibility , which actually makes some sense, is that, given how the handling of all of this was so un-Red Sox like, maybe other stuff is up. The paltry sums Disney paid for Fox’s Regional Sports Networks (quite a bit less than they would have paid 5 years ago) may have Henry looking at NESN, looking at that ballpark that they’re running out of glue to keep together, realizing that record franchise increase in valuation is likely over, and thinking that he’s about squeezed every last penny out of Red Sox Nation, is contemplating getting out.
Henry’s no baseball fan; neither is Warner; it’s all about the Benjamins. Maybe (and it’s admittedly speculation) he wants to tear it down, and get what he can for the carcass. DD obviously would want no part of that, which is likely why he “parted company” with Detroit.
When Henry/Warner bought the whole caboodle for 700M, George Steinbrenner called it a “terrible deal; dilapidated ballpark, dilapidated team, lousy TV deal”. That 700M is now worth about 3.5 Billion, maybe more. That’s a lot of soy beans and TV shows (the partners’ respective “careers”).
Perhaps John Henry will sell it while the getting is good.
It would have made more sense for John Henry to have sold the Red Sox right after 2018’s WS win, assume he wanted to sell the team?
He could have gotten top dollar at the end of 2018 as that’s about as good of a level as you could have gotten a team ready for sale to get top dollar.
He must have called the owner a cracker.
Y’all are a bunch of ingrates. How many World Series in the past fiscal year have the other 29 teams COMBINED won?
And FOUR titles in 15 years since breaking the curse, too. Not much to complain about.
DD was only responsible for one of those. Still ridiculous to see a PBO get axed less than a year after bringing his team a championship unless there was some kind of misconduct (which has been suggested by others).
Not sure there was any misconduct. I haven’t heard that at all. It has more to do with John Henry spending $255m on a terrible team this year than anything else.
Dombrowski is a family man who has never been accused of misconduct.
Either Ownership woke up on the wrong side of the bed….
OR the other Red Sox President may have tried to undermine Dombrowski
Following in the Mets footsteps, Red Sox hire Scott Boras
Boras has a good life and does not need the headaches and ulcers lol!
Do you suppose Cora can feel that flame beginning to warm his butt. They fire Cherington after winning a W/S. They hired Farrell and a year after winning the W/S he gets fired. They hire Dombrowski and he wins them a W/S and a year later he;s removed. If I’m Cora I have to figure unless they come out of gate next year playing like superstars he won’t be there by the All=Stat break.
All this being said and being a long time Blue Jays fan, I’d like to suggest in the spirit of friendliness that the Blue Jays do what they did before when we traded Farrell back to Boston they could trade Shapiro and Atkins to Boston. I think most Jays fans would accept the trade maybe for a few bats and balls.