TODAY: Pomeranz has not been removed from the rotation, Bochy told Schulman (Twitter links) and other reporters today. Anderson is slated to start on Thursday, which would have been Pomeranz’s normal turn, though Pomeranz could still make a start next weekend. In the interim, however, Pomeranz could potentially come out of the bullpen if required.
YESTERDAY: Left-hander Drew Pomeranz, one of the Giants’ most notable offseason acquisitions, is changing roles. The team has moved Pomeranz out of its rotation and into its bullpen, according to Henry Schulman of the San Francisco Chronicle.
Pomeranz is now the third starter the struggling Giants have dropped from their rotation since the season began. They previously relegated righty Dereck Rodriguez and lefty Derek Holland after they got off to poor starts. With Pomeranz joining those two in the bullpen, lefty Madison Bumgarner and righty Jeff Samardzija are the only survivors from San Francisco’s year-opening starting five.
Along with Holland, Pomeranz was one of just three free agents the Giants signed to major league contracts during a low-spending winter for the franchise. New president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi handed Pomeranz a one-year, $1.5MM guarantee, but the minimal investment hasn’t gone well for either party thus far.
A former Rockie, Athletic, Padre and Red Sox, Pomeranz has racked up 10 starts with the Giants, averaging a bit under four innings per appearance (39 total) while posting a hideous 8.08 ERA/6.45 FIP. Pomeranz has struck out nearly 10 hitters per nine, but that hasn’t been enough to cancel out his other problems – mainly an unappealing walk rate (4.85 BB/9) and significant issues keeping the ball in the park. The 30-year-old Pomeranz’s home run-to-fly ball rate is at a career-worst 26.2 percent, more than double his lifetime mark (12.9). Pomeranz has yielded the majority of his HRs outside of pitcher-friendly San Francisco, unsurprisingly, though he hasn’t been effective there either. He’s also getting demolished by right-handed hitters, who have recorded a .436 weighted on-base average off him (for reference, Christian Yelich’s 2019 wOBA is .440).
Including his work against lefties, batters have feasted on Pomeranz for a .420 wOBA. Statcast paints a less bleak picture, crediting Pomeranz with a still-unimpressive .369 xwOBA against. He’s suffering from poor fortune in the BABIP (.369) and strand rate (67.7) departments, and has experienced a jump in velocity compared to last season. But none of that is of any solace to the Giants, who saw Pomeranz allow 22 earned runs on 25 hits (six HRs) and nine walks in 10 1/3 innings in May.
This is the second straight season a team has taken Pomeranz out of its rotation. The Red Sox did it last year during an injury-limited campaign for Pomeranz, who collected 15 relief appearances out of 26. Among hurlers who have thrown at least 100 innings dating back to 2018, Pomeranz ranks last in ERA (6.77), fourth worst in FIP (5.78) and fWAR (minus-1.0), and fifth from the bottom in BB/9 (5.18). It’s a steep drop for someone who was once a top prospect and isn’t far removed from a terrific run as a big league starter. Pomeranz excelled with San Diego in 2016, when it sent him to Boston that summer in a controversial trade for then-premium pitching prospect Anderson Espinoza, and enjoyed another quality year with the BoSox the next season.
The 2016-17 version of Pomeranz now looks long gone, and barring a seismic turnaround over the next few months, he’ll likely have to settle for a minor league deal on his next pact. Free agency could come sooner than expected for Pomeranz if the Giants release him during the season, which doesn’t seem like a far-fetched idea. In the meantime, Pomeranz will try to rebuild his stock in the Giants’ bullpen. San Francisco will eventually have to pick someone else to slot into its rotation behind Bumgarner, Samardzija, Shaun Anderson and Tyler Beede, but it has enough off days on the horizon to wait on making a decision.
Bumgarner is a lefty
Queue average Giants fan who’s about to throw Zaidi under the bus…again…
You kidding? He’s the only reason to watch this season. I have no idea what is going to happen next.
What kind of loser watches the team for the GM? Also, you realize he signed the guy they’re removing from the rotation?
Deep breaths
I’m going to give him until the trade deadline to pass judgment, but so far the Farhan tenure hasn’t been much better than the last few years of Evans. I guess we have more headlines on MLBTR than we used to…
SF’s payroll was/is sky high and they weren’t winning with Evans. Farhan will be fine, not much he can do other than trade MadBum and rebuild.
Why not try to trade Samardzija and try to resign/extend Bumgarner?
And don’t say “bring back value” because I don’t trust Zaidi to get much. He’s shown to be poor at talent evaluation so far. Though I’m sure people will give him credit for Anderson, even though that was an Evans deal. (Gave up a decent middle reliever to get Eduardo Nunez, then flipped him to the Red Sox the next trade deadline).
The Giants salaries aren’t sky high.
If Bumgarner is sent packing, will we ever see him again in a Giants uniform? almost heartbreaking and Zaidi will forever be associated as the guy from L..A. who struck the final blow and sealed the Giants fate.
The same people who promoted Evans to GM hired Zaidi. It was the classic Old School Baseball move. But instead of going two World Series teams and signing their Free Agents or Trading for their players, because they want “winners” on their team. But instead of players, they hired the GM. Unfortunately they hired a guy who was and assistant and not the guy actually making the decisions.
Zaidi’s methods are different from Evans (was was a lot like Sabean). Instead of overvaluing vets, usually based on reputation (which often wasn’t deserved), Fahran overvalues minor leaguers other teams were more than happy to give up and guys his “advanced analytics” say should be performing better.
Both are exactly the same in they don’t see any value in players that are already in the Farm System. Which makes it awkward for him when he runs through a lot of his options and ends up having to use them anyway.
The Giants have no talent in the farm dummy
They do have talent in the Farm system. They are just to young.
Zaidi is a horrible GM! He learned from one of the best in Billy Beane! Yet when he was with Dodgers last couple years he destroyed team! Luckily ownership did not let him give away our top prospects! Have fun with Zaidi destroying your team Giants Fans!
Zaidi did destroy the Dodgers.Projected,they only have a 110 game winning season.
Some ML teams will not win half that many.
Some of the statements on this forum are so ludicrous as to be laughable.
He destroyed the Dodgers to 2 world series trips?
How much more off can you be?
It’s not like he picked these players, give him a chance to get the franchise out of the bind they’re in.
His hands are tied, he can only do so much with the players and contracts he’s been saddled with
This year was a goner before it even started no matter who was at the helm after all the damage Evans did
Is Farhan trading for Evan Longoria? Or trading Reynolds and Crick for McCutchen. No, ok then he is better than Evans
He hasn’t even had one draft yet, snd the roster he inherited was crap.
Dude even then u are premature. The turn over needed on the roster , given its salary restrictions, was always going to take more than a couple of years of tinkering. Only an idiot fan could imagine a miracle.
Get used to the constant ebb and flow. The’ll be better by ‘21-22.
If Farhan trades Bumgarner and strikes out he probably goes back to L.A. or even San Diego!
Bring up conner menez, see what he can do. i watched him pitch a few times in Richmond and he looked very good. 91-96 with nasty slide piece, and descent change up. Lester type.
I agree, remember it was Duffy who got promoted from Richmond to the Giants and he panned out well I believe and also I think Kelby Tomlinson came up from Richmond. I just think the Giants really stick to prospects like Williamson and Beede when they should look elsewhere. Yes, promote this Menez and lets see what he can do, even a long relief role and then can Pomeranz.
pomeranz is a future ray searge project….
Good decision, Pomeranz has not been good.
Understatement.
He hasn’t even been bad. He’s been downright terrible.
I didn’t hear that he was removed from the rotation (even though he should be) I heard he’s just being skipped for his next start to work in the bullpen. At least that’s what Mlb app states.
they need SOMEONE in their rotation
What’s the odds on Panda making a start? Hahaha.
Whoa
I could see them actually getting to that point
Scary
not as low as one may think. would be fun though. odds he starts game 162?
Panda is going to the Pirates to start in THEIR rotation.
Should have read “Giants Remove Pomeranz from Roster”. Because the “Creative Genius” has gotten tired of pulling the plug on all of his mistakes, so the Giants are gonna have to live with this one for a while longer.
It’s been pretty brutal watching him this year. They kept him in the rotation with the sole sake of making him a trade piece, but it didn’t work out. They would be better off releasing him and just focusing on prospects.
He took some risks, but it’s not like they hurt the team long term like Evans liked to do
I would have jumped for joy to see DFA POMERANZ.
Just another bad signing by Farhan, along with Yolarte and Parra and Moonshine Maybin. I wonder if the Giants do any kind of personality screening when they bring in these new guys? But realistically did they really expect these guys to “blossom”? Very predictable that we are in last place sadly.
FINALLY !
How he is even still on the team is beyond me. Every time I see him pitch I get an overwhelming urge to claw my eyes out.
Its like the Giants are set on proving all the other teams wrong that these blokes are worth a plugged nickle.
The Giants. Over the hill Vets with unmovable contracts. Years of rebuilding with the draft. It was fun while it lasted.
his start yesterday was horrible
Yea this was overdue. Zaidi made some low risk gambles over the offseason hoping for trade chips and just was unlucky.
Throughout the league from last offseason, we’re looking at one of the lowest success rates on buy low deals that I can remember. Like Vincent was great but was overused for SF. Outside of SF, Shoemaker, Wilmer Flores, Neil Walker were all playing great, but got hurt killing any deadline sale value, and the vast majority have just been putrid.
If you look at buy low guys on rebuilding/retooling clubs, Texas was the only team that really fared well. Otherwise, the Snakes can flip Jones if theyre out of it, Maldonado might have some value, Granderson could get a lottery ticket, but otherwise, a lot of strikeouts and probably a few others here and there, but a lot of failures.
I give him credit for trying though. At least Gott and Yaz have looked good.
Dietrich has been excellent for Cincy as well.
STRIKE ONE = Signed Derek Holland
STRIKE TWO = Signed Drew Pomeranz
STRIKE THREE = Traded 3 players (in DFA limbo) to Toronto for Kevin Pillar
STRIKE FOUR = Connor Joe DFA and returned to the Dodgers
STRIKE FIVE = Geraldo Perra DFA and becomes a Free Agent
STRIKE SIX = Yangervis Solarte refuses assignment and becomes a Free Agent
STRIKE SEVEN = Eric Kratz traded to Tampa for PTBNL
STRIKE EIGHT = Aaron Altherr Waived
STRIKE NINE = Mac Williamson DFA and elects Free Agency
INNING OVER
SEASON OVER
He’s made a lot more strikes than that.
Of the 41 players who’ve been a Giant this year, he’s brought in 18 of them and of course he gave the biggest contract he wrote in the off season to Holland. So that’s 19 of 41. That’s not counting the 11 or 12 other players who’ve been Sacramento River Cats who weren’t with the franchise last year that are just waiting to be called up. (Well, actually no, because he’s let go of some of them). There have been 21 position players, he’s brought in 12. Of those 12, two are in the MInors (Reed is hurt) and 5 are gone. I can’t imagine Solano stinking…er…sticking around much longer. And why Pillar is here, especially when Duggar who’s a rookie and struggling is give the same value is already here, I have no idea.
Your argument is way off basis and actually what you see as an issue is a step in the right direction.
The giants had at the end of last season one of the bottom three 40 man rosters in all of baseball – from talent to and hopes. Add to that a top part of the farm that was bare.
Therefore – with all the salary issues weighing the team down, Zaidi has remade about 1/2 the of that crappy roster and aaa.
While it’s not ideal, something has to be done and it’s the only way to take chances on finding diamonds in the rough. They keep doing this for a bit longer – with hope the trades of vets bring more minor league talent to infuse the system.
The Oakland effect.
You’re getting salty about the bottom 1/5 if the roster??
STRIKE NINE = Farhan Zaidi declares “free agency” himself and returns to L.A.
None of these moves by Zaidi come with any long term harm. He’s taken a lot of gambles on guys and it hasn’t really worked out yet. Get used to it because it will keep happening. He’s given multiple players the opportunity to seize a roster spot and playing time. It’s not his fault that the players failed to respond. They have a bunch of bad money on the books. All his moves are going to be cheap, prove it to me deals. Flip what you can for younger talent, draft well, continue to dumpster dive and keep moving forward. Players gotta get it done.
That’s just it, he was brought in supposedly because he was such a good talent evaluator. If he’s that good, why so many gambles? Both Bobby Evans and Sabean were well known for making a lot of gambles that often didn’t work. There excuse? There was nothing in the farm system. Zaidi is doing the same. Just slightly fewer veterans and more mid to late 20-something minor league journeymen.
Of course to make room for all of them Mac Williamson was DFAed. He then out-hit all them to become the 7th starting LF and 9th OF overall. That worked as well as many of the rest. Also to make room it was declared that Chris Shaw was “lost at the plate” and was sent all the way back to Double-A. He’s since been promote and had the 8th highest OPS in a pitcher friendly league. Austin Slater is never talking about, even though he’s putting up as good of numbers as those Fahran has brought in and playing every position asked. Last but not least is Jacob Heyward, who’s having a breakout season at Double-A after changing his approach and starting to wear glasses at the plate. He’s 10th in the Eastern League in OPS and is Though none of that matters because there is no room to promote him. After all, it’s not like LF with some pop and a 17.4% BB rate (up from 13% career) would be interesting at all for the Giants front office. Or at least when it’s coming from someone drafted by the Ancien Regime.
Of course there are players much more talented than what he has brought in but, you have to consider the fact that you can only sign guys who are available. Guys who haven’t made the proper adjustments to stick are the ones available. This doesn’t fall on Zaidi shoulders. The players were given an opportunity, maybe not much of one, and they didn’t get it done. Slater dropped fly balls in the OF last year and didn’t hit for power. He’s going to continue cycling through guys until he can draft who he wants. He’s not going to get much for Bumgarner, Sandoval, etc… biggest get may be when he trades Smith. This is going to take time. All these moves are cheap, non binding and guys need to seize the opportunity. There isn’t really room for another OF’er at this point. They would be wise to try and move Pillar as he doesn’t fit the future. Austin needs a longer look and they just need to keep running Duggar out there everyday. They have 0 means besides the draft to obtain quality players. Maybe get a couple decent returns via trade. That’s it. Some high priced free agent isn’t going to fix this. Also wouldn’t hurt if the guys who are making 15-20M per year could actually do something besides suck the life out of the organization and fan base. That whole infield is in the low to mid .200. That is disgraceful
There’s so much bad money on the Giants’ books that he has the flexibility of Mount Rushmore. His “gambles” have all been cheap because he doesn’t have a ton to work with. Also, the fact that it’s in-season means that his options are limited.
Dude you really don’t know much about what is going on and why.
Absolutely agree.. well said my friend
Great post but it goes beyond fanboy Slash’ comprehensive skills
If Farhan was working as a stage manager or production talent guy on Broadway his tactics of evaluating talent might work, but not here, this is complete instability and the players must feel like they “seize the moment” or exit stage left.
Money is not and has never been the issue with this team. The past two years the Giants made lucrative offers to Stanton and Harper. The reason neither signed with the Giants is simple. The core of this team is old and incapable of playing at a competitive level. Players know! Harper knows that Posey is not what he used to be. Stanton knows that with Belt batting behind him he had next to zero protection. This failure is on the Baer/Sabean/Evans regime and not on Ziadi. Crawford, Panik, Belt and Posey were signed to long term contracts that are two and three years too long. The trade for Longoria is a monumental disaster. The guy will be here during all of the rebuild. This means that he will roadblock any young talented third baseman in the minors. The trade for Mc Cutchen another monumental disaster. Half a season rental for two quality players Crick and Reynolds. This is on Baer/Sabean/Evans. There is an old saying in baseball. Sometimes management likes the smell of their own farts. Now we know why this current roster stinks to high heaven.
The reasons I object to Pomeranz and Holland is that if the Giants have any talent in their minor leagues, it is on the mound. Why mortgage the future to keep garbage like Holland and Pomeranz around.
None of these guys may be number one rotation pieces but Beede, Rodriquez, Suarez, Anderson, Menez all are 2.3.4.5 starters. Let the kids pitch and find out what we can build with. Keeping Holland and Pomeranz will lead to a 100 loss season. Pitching the five kids will lead to a hundred loss season. The fans can stomach 100 losses as long as the team is building for the future.
Remember a 100 loss season is not only on the pitchers. Do you all remember Belt crowing that this infield could play with anyone. Well Belt your player evaluation is almost as good as your batting eye, after you argue strike three with every umpire in the MLB.
Dump the core. Austin and Green will produce more than Belt. Solano may not hit but he fields. Right now Avelino is as good as Crawford in the field. Crawford will be fortunate to hit 200 this year. Buy out Longoria. There has to be a third baseman somewhere who can bat 225 and only strike out 30% of the time. Why is Pillar even playing? Slater and Gerber are both hitting in Sacramento. Of course, so was Macass Williamson.
Time to get younger now. Dump this group of poverpaid garbage and bring up kids with a cost closer to 45 million.
One thing everyone forgets. The Dodgers ate a huge number of bad contracts before the jettisoned their garbage. The Giants ownership group is among the wealthiest in baseball. To get rid of Belt and Longoria is nothing more than a matter of money. With this core the attendance is down 6000 per game this year. Get rid of the garbage and fans will associate with new younger faces. This franchise is not Crawford or Posey. This franchise is the San Francisco Giants.
Finally and for God’s sake. Get rid of that fossil at manager. The past four years under Bochy has been an unmitigated disaster.
So you must all the issues if the team then u crap on Bochy, who has no say on the bad contracts the team has doled out. Nor does he do the drafting.
He’s the reason you have three chips. Let the guy walk away in peace.
Sleepy, your comment is supposition at best regarding Bochy’s lack of control regarding bad contracts and lack of drafting input. I do not claim to have the keys to the Giant’s board room or draft room. Obviously, you should enlighten us to the inner workings that you have within the organization. I’m always up for another bullshaat story from a Giant’s wannabe. Please remember to back up your stories with hard facts. Changing the toilet paper in the lavatory does not count unless you bring your phone and record the fossil’s strained groans while he pinches off another Metamucil loaf.
I would guess that Bochy had at least some input into whether or not he thought Crawford, Belt, and Posey (‘s) long term contracts were warranted. Knowing Bochy’s affinity for Jake Peavy and his “Bulldog?” demeanor it is highly possible that Peavy’s so-called “resurrection to his career” was trumpeted by Bochy. Although this is conjecture on my part. I would also venture a guess that the “has been” contract given to Matt Cain had some input from Bochy.
To claim that Bochy had no input into the drafting process is again conjecture on your part. The Giants have consistently selected catchers during past drafts because Bochy was a catcher and they are integral to pitching success. If Bochy had his way the Giants would start eight catchers and one pitcher. Now that Buster has run his course we are hopefully looking at a Joey Bart replacing him in a year. However, Bochy has always been known as a player’s coach and I suspect that Posey will hang on as long as Matt Cain. did.
The truth is as follows, Bochy has a sub-500 record as a manager. I would speculate that his inclusion in the hall of fame has more to do with Sabean’s drafting acumen and Sabean’s timely trades, than Bochy’s baseball strategy. If you want to give him credit for three world titles, you should also give him credit for the demise of two franchises during his career as manager of both the San Diego Padres and the San Francisco Giants. Bochy falls in love with his players and in both cases, the result has been to hold on to those players well past their prime (Peavy, Cain, Posey, Crawford). Has Panik or Belt had a prime? The resulting roadblocks to younger player development crippled the Padres for a decade or more. I suspect that unless Ziadi drafts extremely well and get rid of the entire core, the result will be a decade of 4A pitchers and outfielders who show power but zero plate discipline, and less testicular fortitude when they arrive in the majors..
Ziadi is running the show and Bochy is not. Sabean ran the show and Bochy did not.
I would like to ask you a couple of questions.. When is the last time you saw Brandon Belt bunt down the third base line against the shift. Even if he is a lumbering ox, Belt could easily leg out a double. There is no one on that side of the infield or outfield. When is the last time you saw the Giants play run and hit or hit and run? Has Bochy forgotten how to advance runners.? Or perhaps he has become addled during the past four years? The truth is that Bochy has always subscribed to “the move the line along theory of hitting’ and as a tactician, he knows nothing else. Heck, even our pitchers can’t bunt. What does Bochy teach? A stolen base with this club has become the holy grail.
The final question I have is could a drunk monkey win the world series, if you gave him Lincicum, Cain and Bumgarner in their prime? Heck, Hensley Muelens looked like a genius batting coach when he only had to produce 2,5 runs per game.
Sleepy, you keep believing what you want to believe. Bochy should have retired after 2014. Since then this club has been doo-doo.
The rebuild has finally started.. It is time for “the move the players along” strategy of building another world series contender. And unfortunately, the Giants can’t do that with Bochy, Crawford, Posey, and Bumgarner. Everyone gets old.. I waited fifty years to see the Giants win a world series. With Bochy, I can only say, I don’t have another fifty years.
Agree with some of your points but not others. Signing Holland and Pomeranz were mistakes, one a predictable one and the other not so predictable.
And what about tax considerations? That is another roadblock that keeps players from coming here. Avelino no way is better in the field than Crawford, and Pillar though not hitting now still is an ace in the field. Where pitching was supposed to be our strength, it came apart at the seams. I would like to see them clean house in the bullpen just a bunch of dead wood. I just dont see how they expected any kind of turnaround signing the likes of Parra, Maybin, and Yolarte. Now if they had signed Cutch for two years and maybe traded him at this years deadline and if they had signed Adam Jones I dont think this team would look that bad as it has. I think the trade for Pillar was good, he may pan out as half decent. Then again, the starting pitching has just tanked.
Jerry,
A couple of years ago (2016-2017) I really liked what I saw from Crawford. He was leading the club not only with his glove but with his bat. During the spring of 2018, it was apparent that Crawford had gained weight and it took him until May to hit and his fielding started rough but got back to all-star caliber by June. This season, Crawford again showed up over-weight during spring training. We are now in June and we just saw the first glimpse of Crawford’s bat. You should check the defensive metrics on Crawford. He is yet to regain all-star form. (6 errors this year) My opinion is that Crawford has become complacent during his off-season training and comfortable with losing. He is not the only Giant who suffers from this malady. .The book on Avelino is he is a glove, no power, but average contact hitter. I think right now Avelino shows better at the plate and is equal to Crawford in the field. The game is always what have you done for me lately, not what did you do for me two-three years ago. At this very moment, Crawford is the third-best shortstop in the NL West. (Rockies, Story, Dodgers, Seager) Crawford is no longer an all-star and clearly in decline. Next year Crawford will be the fourth best shortstop in the NL West. (Padres, Tatis) I would be happy with Crawford playing third base for the final year of his contract. If Crawford moved to third base next year the Giants could buy down Longoria’s contract and jettison the complacent cancer they got from Tampa.
The age-old axiom of being strong defensively up the middle still applies. At the very least the Giant’s get salary relief by bringing Avelino up. Hopefully, if the Giants buy down Longoria’s contract they will get rid of this weak fielding, no hitting, no power, no walk, third baseman.
Another alternative would be to release/trade Panik and replace him with Avelino. The problem with this is that even if Panik never hits 270 again, he is still a stellar fielder. (1 error this year)
Giants on a roll! WILL THEY EVER LOSE AGAIN!?!?!
Jerry,
Your comment about Kevin Pillar does not stand up. Pillar started with a bang at the plate after the Giants got him. Since that first week, he has shown virtually nothing with his bat. While Pillar makes some incredible catches in the outfield, the defensive metrics don’t support that he is a good find for the Giants. Management has already moved Pillar from center field to right field because Duggar is the better fielder. Unfortunately, Duggar is the better fielder in both center and right. It should also be noted that Duggar is the better hitter, and ultimately should become a better power hitter than Pillar.
Bochy loves his veterans and Pillar now stands as a roadblock to Gerber and Slater, who are both considerably better at the plate. I would venture that Gerber (also a center-fielder).is better than Pillar in the field. At the very least an outfield of Gerber in center and Duggar in right is far more palatable.defensively and at the plate. Pillar is an expensive option that the Giants don’t need. Hopefully, he will be gone by the trade deadline.
On to Slater. It is a known rumor that “rookie/young players die under Bochy’s management”. Bochy will always play a veteran over a young player. I don’t see Slater playing a great deal for the Giants this year. Nor do I see Gerber getting time under Bochy until the trade deadline barring an injury.
During a spring training conversation, I had with several MLB scouts. One highly regarded scout joked the following comment about Bochy. “If Willie Mays played for Sacramento today and was brought up to the Giants, Bochy would have sent him down after going 0-12. Young players die under Bochy’s management. Unless Bochy has no choice due to injury he will always play the veteran first.” Baseball history shows that Willie Mays started his career 0-12.