Cody Allen will be closing games for the Los Angeles Angels next season, but the long-time fixture of the Cleveland bullpen may still add some value to the Indians’ 2019 bullpen: as a scout. It was Allen who first brought Jon Edwards to the attention of the Cleveland front office after working out at the same facility as the right-hander, per the Athletic’s Zack Meisel. Edwards, 30, made 9 appearances for the Indians last season after making his way back to the game, missing all of 2017 and almost leaving baseball altogether. Now Edwards is one of the arms that manager Tito Francona will turn to as the Indians’ bullpen tries to make up for the loss of both Allen and Andrew Miller in free agency.
The glass half-full approach might look at the 2.9 WAR totaled by the Indians bullpen in 2018 and say there’s not all that much room to make up. Still, the bullpen unit earned 6.9 WAR in 2017 after fueling the Indians’ World Series run in 2016, and they’ve helped spark an evolution of the bullpen league-wide. It’s an uncertain unit this time around, with Edwards, Adam Cimber, Nick Goody, Dan Otero, Neil Ramirez and Tyler Olson the most established arms set to pitch in front of closer Brad Hand. Former starters Danny Salazar and Cody Anderson may get the Collin McHugh treatment if they can get healthy this season and contribute as McHugh did for the Astros last year. Salazar is a particularly interesting wrinkle as his career 10.51 K/9 could move even higher in shorter stints out of the pen. He was a top-3 pitcher in their rotation before getting injured. Mike Clevinger and Shane Bieber may have usurped his spot in the rotation, but Salazar has the opportunity to be an impact arm where Cleveland needs the help most.
Newly-acquired youngsters Jefry Rodriguez and Chih-Wei Hu have added to the organization’s overall depth, and they’ll compete with veteran castoffs like James Hoyt, Justin Grimm, and A.J. Cole to claim the open spots in Cleveland’s pen. It’s a long season, and just as often as a veteran bullpener falls apart, a new stud develops out of nowhere. There’s a case to be made that the Indians collection of arms is more than enough to put together a dominant bullpen, it’s just unclear which 7-10 names are most likely to be a part of it. The Indians may feel that the risk of paying significant money to tired, veteran arms isn’t any more risky than relying on a large group of high-end hopefuls to develop confidence and dependability in the nine months from when pitchers and catchers report in February to the playoffs in October. There’s high-end potential in the names above, and they have another reason to be optimistic as well: top prospect Triston McKenzie has risen steadily through the system, and it’s not outside the realm of possibility that the 21-year-old could be ready for an Adam Wainwright/David Price style call up if he continues to succeed in Triple A.
Francona may cull together a functional group from the arms already in-house, but no matter how you slice it, it’s a far cry from the back-end dependability the AL Central champs have leaned on throughout this current run atop the division. There are other issues at hand for the Indians as well, who are facing a significant amount of roster churn. There’s a leadership void to fill around Francisco Lindor, and it’s unclear at this time who will step up, per Cleveland.com’s Paul Hoynes. Lindor certainly has the talent to be “the guy” in the clubhouse, but it’s tough for the best on-field producer to also shoulder the load of managing the clubhouse as a lone sheriff. Allen has been a big-time leader in the bullpen, and Rajai Davis a vocal veteran leader who will no longer be with the club as well. They may have more of a fight on their hands for the AL Central crown too, as the Twins added a ton of right-handed power as they look to rebound, and the White Sox rebuild is nearing a crescendo.
Even if they capture their fourth straight division title, the Indians will have a tough time surviving the playoff gauntlet in a top-heavy American League if they don’t get some reliability and shutdown firepower from their bullpen. The Yankees have not been shy about investing heavily in their bullpen for a couple of seasons, and the rest of the league is starting to follow suit, but as of right now, the Indians, as well as some other contenders like the Red Sox and Cubs, are holding steady with the arms they’ve got in-house. In the past it’s been unwise to invest in the bullpen, an area of notoriously fickle year-to-year performance, but the tide has turned and the Indians run the risk of seeming painfully out-of-step. The rotation remains stacked, but given that it only took one year, $8.5MM for LA to lock down Allen, it’s fair to wonder if the Indians are playing a little too fast and loose with their bullpen.
How do you feel about the current state of the Indians pen? (Link for app users).
Thinking positively, there’s a lot of guys left as free agents that are going to sign for modest contracts. Eventually, they’re going to have to make some moves. Ether getting more bats, or getting more arms for the bullpen. The latter is a lot cheaper (since both isn’t realistic).
Boxberger, Oliver Perez, Brad Brach, Justin Wilson or Neftali Feliz all seem like perfect “on the cheap” candidates for Cleveland’s pen.
Derek Dietrich also strikes me as a perfect fit for CLE’s outfield. He’s even from Cleveland. Gives them some more HR pop, without breaking the bank.
triston mckenzie to the giants for will smith and austin slater
No
Double no.
they are under last years budget by $18M i cannot see why they can’t add a bullpen piece like Bud Norris and or Greg Holland then add an Adam Jones or Carlos Gonzales for the outfield…
While I don’t agree with it, the were supposedly spending more money than they could afford to spend given their income, and had to cut back payroll a bit.
I can’t see them adding much more without clearing some, part of the reason they were willing to trade Kluber or Bauer. But unless they’re overwhelmed there, they’re better off holding onto them and sticking with what they’ve got.
Keep in mind that the MLB revenue sharing number this year was 1.4 billion. This is roughly 44 million for the Tribe. But who knows is that is already earmarked.
Like I said, they were dead set on lowering their payroll. Where the money came from, how much was there, and what they chose to spend it on isn’t as important. Personally, I’d love to add some players and not enter the season with 2 outfield spots and potentially as many as 5/6 bullpen spots up for grabs this spring. Have to get some clarity in the next month. Somebody is going to sign.
Might be saving up to extend Lindor?
Arbitration awards for guys like Bauer and Lindor will eat up much of those savings.
That’s after the savings. They also had Brantley, Allen, and Miller come off the books to cover the Arb raises.
Bullpens can be cobbled together, the bigger problem is their outfield.
They are finished. Machado will sign with my Sox and they will get a starter or two before the start of the season and be the only team in Chicago that matters for the next 5-6 years.
“Well, you know GOB is not that exact of a target shooter, he just kinda sprays it everywhere.”
You really need to get a grip on reality dude… and consider passing around whatever it is that you’re smoking…
Wow you guys the owner of the White Sox posts here!!!
How is the one player approach working for the Angels? They have been to how many playoff series?
Its hard to watch other teams spend and put together their teams, but the FO for the tribe is being smart and I appreciate their approach. They are waiting for the big three to sign and then they will start looking at whoever is left as the dominoes fall. I think they will go out and get a lower level bullpen arm as a set up, but I think their concentration will be on the outfield. Salazar, Anderson, Plutko, McKenzie, and TOMLIN (yes, they’ll bring him back on a minor league deal) can provide depth for the rotation AND fill out a bullpen. The outfielders will come from either a middle level free agent or a trade for Kluber which I still think it’s going to happen once Dallas K is off the board. You’re going to see teams start opening up and being more aggressive with the Indians and their asking price. I wouldn’t even rule out the Indians trading him mid season.
Is there an option worse than panicked?
Yes. THAT option is represented by a white flag.
The Indians’ bullpen (and outfield, by the way) is nothing short of a tragedy. Worst off-season I’ve ever seen. We need to cut salary, but it’s OK to bring back a low average 1B for a salary we didn’t want to pay in free agency? I don’t care about the math (Eddie E. vs. Santana), it was still a step backwards. Plus, we’re being way over-optimistic regard Bauers. This is going to be Brad Hand pitching an unreasonable amount of innings until his arm explodes. Plus, one injury to Jose Ramirez and/or Lindor, and their offense is finished. Very discouraged about their chances to compete in a sea of teams who have made moves to get better.
Eh, the EE for Santana swap I think is a modest upgrade. Santana is a solid defender at first and a reliable on base machine. His numbers last year were deflated by a horrid start…probably nerves from his new team and league. After that he was vintage Santana…totally underrated. Thrilled to see him back in the Tribe uniform. His acquisition provides so much interesting flexibility for 1B/DH whereas we were stuck with Yonder/Edwin last year and that really didn’t work out very well.
But I agree on the pen. Tribe should’ve gotten in on Ottavino or Robertson. Those were deals they could afford. They’re putting a LOT of faith in Edwards, Goody, and Otero being solid and Salazar and Anderson pitching quality innings.
Salazar is such an enigma to me. He was incredible in 2016 right up to the ASG. Once he became an All Star, the wheels fell off and he’s been perpetually hurt or hurting with weird ailments and reportedly normal MRIs then season ending surgery requiring injuries while the team goes on the record calling him out for being lazy…I think it’s nuts to put much stock into him being a contributor next year. Certainly possible but should be viewed as a bonus, not the key 7th/8th inning reliever spot out of the gate
Dude I never believe in standing pat but the Indians won the Central by 13 games, There’s not been a single team that has done anything this off-season to close that gap. You still have a great rotation that can go deep into games. There’s time to improve this team, even in-season, but I wouldn’t be scared of any of the Central competitors, especially the WhiteSox. They can sign both Harper and Manny and it still wouldn’t win them the Central with their current pitching staff.
Twins have signed Cruz and added some good arms to their bullpen. I would call that closing the gap…
But they lost Ervin Santana, Dozier, Escobar and need tremendous bounce backs from Sano, Buxton, Kepler
They got work to do
The Twins mottos this year will be “homerun or die”. They will be striking out a lot this year, but putting tons of souvenirs into the seats.
Dozier was bad anyway. Sano will bounce back to some extent but won’t need to be relied on as the big bopper with Cruz there. I think Buxton is way overrated I bet Jake Cave will be the everyday CF before the All-star Break. Cave will be a solid major leaguer.
If you believe in WAR and projections, the combo of Bauers and Santana produce a higher number than last year’s tandem for half the cost. That’s smart business.
Tragedy? Now there’s some extreme overacting.
The Indians have glaring holes in both the bullpen and outfield. Detroit and KC should be nonfactors in 2019. CWS and MIN will he competitive and will push CLE in 2019.
They won’t just push CLE. They’ll beat CLE. Lifelong Tribe fan, and it breaks my heart.
That’s a pretty flaming hot take. Cleveland’s rotation + Ramirez/Lindor pretty much secures them still as favorites for the Central. Not saying it won’t be competitive, but it’s their division to lose even in their current state
We still have a month before spring training. The FO has already said they’re not done!
What have the Sox done to close a 29 game gap from last year? Their pitching staff was DEAD LAST in team ERA/FIP/WAR. Their offense was 2nd to last in the AL. Who have they acquired that truly moves the needle?
The Twins signed Cruz, Cron and are counting on Pineda. Does that scare anyone?
The Indians are vulnerable because of the loss of several players and are NOT deep enough to handle an injury to Ramirez and Lindor but their staff is sooooo deep. They had 4 guys that gave them 175 IP each of sub 3.50 ERA.
Umm…I don’t like the Twins chances, but Nelson Cruz is kinda great at hitting.
I for one am glad that they didn’t throw money at Allen or Miller. Old, tired arms can be replaced, especially after how those two performed last season.
Bullpen isn’t the greatest, but they don’t like spending big money there like other teams do. But they’ll find a way to “discover” another serviceable arm.
No one really stepped up in the Indians pen last year…
Oliver Perez was probably their best bullpen pitcher in 2018 and it wasn’t really even close.
He certainly was and he came along at the most desperate time and single handedly held the ‘pen together when it was springing leaks everywhere.
As of right now, the Indians should win the central but they have too many holes to get past a Houston/New York or Boston.
Red Sox also have bullpen problems with no closer. Houston lost 3/5 of the starting rotation. The Yankees’ starters are an injury waiting to happen. All teams have flaws.
It is also mid January. The Indians still can add to their outfield and bullpen.
They are declining fast. I predict a 500 finish for them. Won’t be long until they trade away Lindor and Ramirez. It’s white sox in 19 baby
Not so sure about that, but it will be a competitive race given how horrible the Indians’ offseason has been. Probably the worst front office offseason I’ve seen in a decade from any contending team outside of KC when they went and gave big money to a bunch of over-the-hill guys to relive their WS glory days.
Regardless of any talk coming from Antonetti, it’s clear the #1 objective is to slash payroll by $20 million. Not contend, not get better, but slash payroll. If they somehow catch lightning in a bottle for cheap, great, but that is not the main goal in Cleveland this year.
Sox will be no better than 3rd in the Central even if they get Machado, which they won’t.
What are the lottery numbers for Monday oh great kreskin
I can understand them trading Lindor if they can’t extend him, but not Ramirez.
But with their starters, no way they finish .500 .
They still have the best rotation in baseball, and it’s not particularly close. They could trade Kluber and still have a top-5 rotation.
Unless the White Sox get Machado, Harper, and figure out a way to trade for two front line aces they’ll be lucky to finish 3rd.
The Indians are this year’s Mark Twain….the reports have their death have been greatly exaggerated.
As long as they can run those starters out there (with McKenzie in the wings), they’ll win it. The Twins still need Sano/Buxton to BOTH bounce back, the Sox, even WITH Manny, are “meh”, the other two are miles away.
Yes, they need a BP and some OFers. But you don’t win anything in the winter, and they’re financially poised to make moves during the season and on July 31 (when you actually build a bullpen anyway). All the Twins have done is become a better grade of “meh”, and the White Sox really haven’t done much at all. ALL the impact talent in the AL Central is in Cleveland.
You nailed it. Very well thought out and said.
Hi bob;
Agree totally.
Breaking down things by infield and OF on a depth chart doesn’t work. Bauers will play 1B and some LF. Kipnis will play 2B, LF, and CF. Santana will play 1B and possibly some 3B and C. Rameriz will play both 2B and 3B. Allen and Martin can defend in CF. They’ve got RH and LH hitters in the corners. Guys will rotate through DH.
Tito will be mixing and matching each game – both starting and in-game. Taking advantage of match-ups, manufacturing runs, and exploiting hot hitters.
If McKenzie can handle the 5th starter job, then Carrasco, Clevinger, and Bieber can be moved up in the rotation allowing them to trade Bauer or Kluber. They’d want a young RH run-producing bat, a bullpen arm, and any sort of decent prospect back – both for 2019 and beyond.
_ _ _ _ _
The Twins and White Sox are being talked up for no good reason. At this point their pitching staffs are horrendous, and their defense is not much better. They’ll have some 8-plus run games with their hitters, but it’s a 162 game season. I know that the Tigers and Royals rebuilds will outdo them over the next 3-4 years. Avila has been loading up on pitchers – 5 in the Top 86 prospect list in 2018 (for what it’s worth); while the Royals have also been loading up on arms – including taking all college pitchers in the last draft.
Don’t laugh – but if outside of the Indians the division stinks as I think it will, the Royals have a chance to finish 2nd in 2019. I’ve been re-watching their August-September games the past few months. So many players improved that their finishing 20-14 was no surprise. Citing one, Mondesi looks like Lindor’s younger brother – switch-hitter, plays great SS, hits, hits with power, has learned to work walks, and led the AL in stolen bases after the All-Star break. Add Hamilton in CF where he’s perfect for Kaufman Stadium, and it just comes down to their young SP’s continuing to make progress.
The problem with fantasy league sites like this one, is that they – and most of their readers – look at year-long stats of players. and analyze. When talking rebuilding teams and/or young players, one has to factor in improvement – or lack thereof – during the season. Most players come into the majors ill-equipped to play. Teams have to develop players at the ML level. Unless one watches/listens to the games or follows them daily in local newspapers, they’re surprised by late-May each year as to why so many teams over or under perform their projections/expectations.
Samuel: You nailed it. Twins/White Sox Pitching/Defense are horrible. In-game skills are almost non existent on both teams (tho I think Baldelli will help Minny).
I COMPLETELY agree about the Royals possibilities. Let’s face it, almost NOBODY plays defense anymore, especially in the IF; you can run like crazy, and Billy Martin- yourself to 10-15 extra wins. Sure there are exceptions; Red Sox OF, Rays IF, etc. And there are some sound fundamental teams. And there are some that are reacting in a positive manner to the problem, trying to get better.
But until the pendulum swings back (IF it does), there are lots of free runs out there, and KC is poised to take advantage of it. It won’t get them to the dance (there just isn’t enough talent), but it’ll grow their victory total.
ONE of the reasons the Red Sox won so much last year was simple; they simply played the game better. The Indians have that advantage in the Central (most of Tito’s teams do). You don’t see the Red Sox do dumb things often……same with the Tribe. Now add in a talent level (the counting stats) and you’ve got a good chance to win.
In general free agent arms dont do well for the bullpen unless they’re elite. So I like the plan of throwing a bunch of high velocity guys who used to be starters at it. Salazar, if healthy, would be an elite closer. They have roughly a half dozen guys who can throw 95+ with Neil Ramirez, Cody Anderson, Jefry Rodriguez, Jon Edwards, Chih
-Wei Hu and Henry Martinez. Should be able to find a few that stick. That’s a better plan than throwing money at guys like Bryan Shaw.
Jon Edwards had a 5.24 FIP last year, wtf he’s AAAA
If not the Cleveland Indians, who’s winning the AL Central? Smart money is on Cleveland, questionable OF and bullpen included.
I trust Tito to figure it out
Salazar could be a very big weapon in the bullpen. it may allow him to stay healthy for most of the season.
Cimber and Hand is solid at the back end but they could use Brach and Perez.
I think Salazar will somehow fit into the rotation, even though I would love to see him in the bullpen. He is also projected to come back around mid season…
I’m honestly more concerned about their offensive production than their pitching ability.
Salazar, not Hand, will be the X-Factor coming out of the bullpen if he even makes the roster to begin with…. Something to look out for….
Greg Allen will save the outfield.
I hope you’re right because if he doesn’t come through there is going to be 3-4 automatic outs in the lineup.
Bring in some cheap bullpen guys like Hunter Strickland and Adam Warren. Neither are elite, but both are solid relief pitchers, and would definitely sure up some questions in the pen.
Nothing like taking a team expected to make the playoffs but supporting them with a ‘pen full of misfits and hoping it works…SMH
Hey,everything turned out fine for the residents of the Island of Misfit Toys…….so why not the same for Cleveland?
And it’s been stated numerous times and from Tito, that Salazar is not suited for the bullpen. To think a guy that can’t stay healthy enough to take the bump every 6th game can somehow get up in the ‘pen and warm up 3 out of every 4 nights is just plain foolish.
I’m glad that Allen is gone… he was WAY overpaid. That being said.. the Indians may have the worst bullpen and outfield in the AL. That’s sad given the core of talent in the infield and starting rotation.
if there was a choice between panicked and cautiously optimistic i wouldve picked it. i wouldnt be optimistic at all with that pen, but i wouldnt be fully pessimistic about the situation either.
they let big parts of an already struggling bullpen walk without finding suitable replacements
Kluber to the Dodgers, Padres or Braves gets several top prospects and a mlb ready starter. sign Pollock or adam jones and a reliever with that money saved. could also sign a Drew Pomeranz/brett Anderson/wade miley on the cheap for a lefty in the rotation…even gio if the price was right. those white sox may not be there yet but in a year or two they are going to be a force to he reckoned with. twinkies could be as well
They don’t need an MLB ready starter, they already have arguably the best rotation in baseball and have others waiting their turn in the rotation. They need a corner OF bat, reliever and then a prospect.
mlb ready prospect sitting in columbus when an arm gets hurt, it happens from time to time. and with exeption of Tristen theres not a bat nor arm in columbus thats gonna make an impact. bottom line is they dont want to pay anybody we have to trade for upper minors prospects it’s not rocket science and Kluber/Bauer would bring in 3 or 4 apiece
and no def not trading them both. hopefully Salazar can get healthy come may or june, would be very valuable swingman if he returns to form
At least they have a closer the Red Sox don’t…
No Adam Jones, he is just another BJ Upton .