TODAY: Morosi now tweets that the Giants have left the Brewers with the impression that “a young starting pitcher — Corbin Burnes, Brandon Woodruff, or Freddy Peralta — would need to be part of [an] offer” to make a deal on Bumgarner. Of course, that may only be one portion of a palatable package.
Whether the Milwaukee organization has any inclination to pay such a price is not evident. It’s also far from clear just how active the discussions really are at this time. Per Henry Schulman of the San Francisco Chronicle, on Twitter, “nothing substantive is being discussed at the moment” regarding Bumgarner.
YESTERDAY: The Giants and Brewers have had “substantive communication” this offseason regarding a potential Madison Bumgarner trade, Jon Morosi of MLB.com wrote this morning. While there’s no indication that the sides are particularly likely to reach agreement, it seems there’s serious interest on the part of the Milwaukee organization.
From the surface, at least, it’s tempting to view this as a possible blockbuster. Morosi suggests a deal involving the star lefty — a still-youthful player with unmatched postseason credentials — could be the only immediate means available for the Giants to “obtain high-end young players.” And the Brewers rotation is more notable for its depth than for big names at the top of the staff — a state of affairs that has often led to outside calls for a major strike.
Upon closer examination, though, it’s hard to see immense value in the contract rights to the undeniably accomplished hurler. After all, he has not only been limited by injury over the past two seasons, but has exhibited numerous declines in peripheral numbers. To be sure, he has still managed to secure excellent results, and he’s hard to count out at just 29 years of age, but there’s real concern about Bumgarner’s outlook.
With just one season of control remaining, at a not-insignificant $12MM rate, it’s tough to imagine any team giving up its favorite prospects for the chance to see what’s left in the tank. Neither does it make much sense for new Giants president of baseball operations Farhan Zaidi to part with MadBum for little more than cost savings. All said, it’s not entirely surprising that there has been so little chatter this winter on Bumgarner despite the Giants’ reported willingness to move him. Indeed, last we heard (nearly one month back), it was said to be increasingly unlikely he’d be dealt before the start of the season.
Beyond that, Brewers GM David Stearns proved last year that he won’t be swayed by outside opinions on the state of his club’s pitching staff. While the consensus was that the Milwaukee org needed to bolster the top of its rotation — both last winter and in the mid-season trade period that followed — the club largely elected to go with internal options bolstered by seemingly unexciting outside acquisitions. While the resulting staff was hardly dominant, it was a solid unit (particularly when paired with an excellent bullpen) that allowed the Brewers to exceed expectations.
All that being said, it’s plenty notable that the Brewers seem to have serious, ongoing interest in Bumgarner. While the sides obviously have not lined up to this point, Morosi goes so far as to say that the Milwaukee club is “most likely” to land Bumgarner if he does end up being moved. The Brew Crew brass is said still to be conducting “internal deliberations” on the matter, suggesting that the two teams are still looking for ways to bridge the gap in negotiations — and, perhaps, that both sides have some reason to think they may be able to do so.
Yankeepatriot
He is a starter they desperately need
brewcat
Desperately? No.
Yankeepatriot
Their rotation isn’t really good if you Are honest
steelerbravenation
Damn to think they had 2 OF that the Giants woulda had interest in. Those & a prospect I would think woulda got it done.
kbarr888
One of those and a prospect would have got it done
Samuel
Let’s discuss this latest Morosi rumor…….
How about a pool on the date and time that all involved deny knowing anything about this?
claude raymond
I typed Morosi and autocorrect came up with Moroni. Perfect.
Not a story.
davidcoonce74
Wow; it feels like a third team would have to be involved, as I don’t see the Brewers dealing Hader or Yelich. Bumgarner is a rental guy, and as the article points out, has been hurt and in a bit of decline. But he’s still fairly young and still good. The Giants would be very wise to deal him but I’m not sure the Brewers have the right prospects to get this done. They do have a good farm system, so it’s possible the Giants would take a bulk prospect haul. I think a healthy Bumgarner would be fun to see on another competitive team, pitching for a big FA payday.
brewcrew08
Dealing Hader or Yelich? Not sure why you mentioned those two. They wouldn’t get moved even if Bumgarner had 3-4 years left of control.
davidcoonce74
I was just thinking of their two best players; but yeah, you’re right. No way the Brewers would deal either of them.
mikeyst13
Hader or Yelich?? Wow are you shooting high. Reports are they want Corey Ray. Giants are looking for young almost MLB ready talent.
joepanikatthedisco
Yelich and Cain are their two best players
dray16
Corey Ray is not MLB ready talent
brewcrew08
He said almost MLB ready talent. Ray is a year away I think. Probably a September call-up this coming season.
jjnjyoung
Here is just an idea why not trade MadBum and Belt for Yelich and minor leaguers?
daveineg
Brewers aren’t going to offer a “bulk prospect deal” either. Your’re probably looking at Corey Ray, their number 2 overall prospect, plus a Chase Anderson who can replace Bumgarner in the Giants rotation, and low level arm with upside. Anderson is more than just a throw in too. He’s a year removed from a sub 3 ERA and comes with 3 years of team control including two team friendly option years.
biasisrelitive
How dose that help the brewers
augold5
You’re joking right?
dray16
i’ll rephrase, Corey Ray is not MLB talent
twentyforty
Anderson is the definition of a throw in…everywhere but where the pixie dust is still flying in Milwaukee
claude raymond
Thank you. Anyone who has never hit above .250 in the MINORS is not a future major leaguer
lowtalker1
One guy with high upside not in the mlb roster
Ohhoitsjimbo
… why would the Brewers, a team that was a game away from the world series, trade the MVP who is under control for another 4 years AND arguably the best Lefty reliever in the game who is also under cheap team control for a pitcher they think can put them over the top? That’s like going to the bank and saying “another $10 and I’ll have saved $1,000,000! Id like to trade this $100 for $10.”
Ejemp2006
Good metaphors
atuck_sfg
Everyone talks about his injuries, it’s not like he is an often injured guy, both injuries were freak accidents. Give the guy a full season this year where he doesn’t have to do physical therapy and see what happens
Priggs89
Teams aren’t going to trade top value for “let’s see what happens.” That’s why MadBum hasn’t been traded yet. Teams are trying to buy low, and I can only imagine the Giants are trying to sell him as the postseason ace he once was.
terror661
Is**** his numbers haven’t changed in the postseason…
Jean Matrac
Teams aren’t asking themselves if should they acquire Bumgarner to see what happens. What any team interested in Bum is doing is weighing the cost to acquire, combined with a risk assessment, and an evaluation of what his presence on the team would mean. They will have a very good idea of what will happen. And if it puts a team like the Brewers over the top, they’ll be fine with the cost.
stymeedone
@atuck
That may not be possible, as this is his last year of contract. Teams will have to trade for the unknown.
atuck_sfg
You’re right, I meant let him start the season without any PT or rehab assignments and see how he starts the season out
unpaidobserver
Freak accident to pitching shoulder is as important as nagging injury in pitching shoulder I’m afraid.
RedRooster
Not if he shows that he made a full recovery (which he has)
southbeachbully
His ability to start shouldn’t worry as much as his ability to pitch at a high level. He got rocked in his last 5 starts. Era over 5.
bencole
Uh… Giants might get a top 5 Brewers prospect for Mad Bum. Might not.
unpaidobserver
Get more if he pitches like a top flight ace for ten starts to begin season imo than if traded now.
bencole
Yeah maybe… but then there’s no QO for the acquiring team.
thecoffinnail
Get less if he pitches the way he has the past couple of years for his first 10 starts as well.
brewcrewbernie
They wouldn’t deal Yelich and Hader for any one player. Not even Trout. Ridiculous those two are even mentioned for a one year rental coming off of 2 down years.
jbigz12
Hader would be dealt for Trout tomorrow. He’s great but the Brewers probably win the WS with an OF of Trout Yelich and Cain. That’s an insane thought. I’d have to agree at this point with yelich’s team friendly deal he has more value than Trout.
southbeachbully
I think he meant BOTH. Not even sure if they should trade Hader straight up. Bum has a name….a legacy…but he stuggled his last 5 starts.
Black&Orange&Silver
I saw the brewers as the perfect match for a trade partner all offseason. The Giants need youth in their system and they would have to be happy with a top 50 prospect and a protectable group of young players.
As a Giants fan, I’d love to see Keston Hiura, Corey Ray, and Corbin Burnes. I just think that even might be too much of a return. Bumgarner is great. He will help any rotation in baseball. He will be the guy you want on your team in the post season. The problem is that his stats do not show his value. He is one of those rare players.
This trade could however expand into Bumgarner and either Watson or Smith…then you would see a no brainer on the Brewers part and possibly more added into the mix from MIL.
Marytown1
You got some bad drugs expecting that return
biasisrelitive
You would get one of those 3 at best
daveineg
You’re dreaming if you think Brewers would offer their top 2 prospects, and their number one from last year for one year of Bumgarner.
Think Ray, either Anderson or Davies from their current rotation and a low level prospect. Hiura isn’t going anywhere. If Burnes was involved, he’d be the only guy going to the Giants.
bencole
Agreed. Even Burnes is too much and I’m not a Brewers fan.
rdsfan05
That comment was wrong in numerous reasons one yelich and hader are better than Madison even as a reliever but the shut down clear cut ace is out the window for Madison bum! Yes he may be still a good, but that’s yet to be seen after his injury and hader is one of the most shut down relievers in baseball! Another reason is Bum is a rental and his stock is probably at a career low coming off a season ending injury and on a rental status.
rmhtwo23
MadBum is a country boy at heart but Id love to see him in The Bronx with the Yanks. He is a complete Bulldog and a competitor in big games. I think any contender that acquires him might just rejuvenate him and get good return on a deal.
gotothevideotape
He can do what ohtani does.
Awesome players
CCCTL
Ohtani bats above the Mendoza line, and in one season has more HR than Bumgarner in his entire career.
gotothevideotape
yeah, I thought of that b4 I rushed out to eat
basebaIl1600
Maybe because Ohtani got many more ABs than Bumgarner has ever gotten in a season and got them consistently. Just a thought.
gotothevideotape
Hi1600
I like your thought, great point
mydadleftme
Bum is not a good hitter he strikes out like half the time, he just swings really hard at everything. Not a great Method.
Sadler
He’s only getting about 3 plate appearances every 5 days — what else should he be doing? He’s got 17 home runs in 531 at-bats over his career — that’s pretty good.
mydadleftme
With how many strikeouts and what batting average? His hitting is overrated. No where near as good as ohtani
tweeter02
Who the hell cares about his hitting?!? Lmfao
adshadbolt1
Ray, erceg, and one of the big league arms woodruff, burnes, peralta
brewcrew08
If you ask me that’s way too much for a 1 year rental who’s been hurt the last two years. Ray and erceg alone is too much
pustule bosey
the injuries aren’t really an indication of any future performance. they didn’t have anything to do with his mechanics or stress from the game, one was a freak hit by a comebacker and the other a dirt bike. you can question his declining numbers, but again he was also pitching coming off of injuries so essentialy extended rehab starts. you aren’t going to really know what you have until his numbers start coming in …
lowtalker1
That’s way too much
One year rental that’s been injured ?
One prospect is what I’m saying and maybe and throw in like a spangenberg
jbigz12
Erceg put a .688 OPS at Double A. He’s not much of a consequential prospect. Ray has K/contact issues but obviously enormous upside. Bumgarner could be the missing piece for a WS title though. I’d have to strongly consider that if I were Stearns. Given the presence of Yelich and Cain long term
Black&Orange&Silver
With that outlook the deal wouldn’t happen. And in reality that might be the situation.
If the brewers really think they can win post season baseball with a bullpen game, then more power to them. I don’t think they can.
I honestly believe the Brewers were 1 Bumgarner away from have a shot at the World Series last year. Is a prospect that is not a slam dunk (very few ever are) worth wasting another year?
Also, I’d keep in mind…any team that is successful in trading for Bumgarner now will likely pay LESS in terms of prospects than they will at the deadline. Once a healthy, productive Bumgarner is on the market at the deadline, every single playoff team will try to acquire him. The price will go up. Very few teams see the need right now. There will be 10 teams that will be interested in July all with a WS Ring altering their thoughts.
This scenario is the #1 reason why I think the Giants hold on to him this offseason. They are going to get everything they want now, or they will just wait. They know they have a stud, that barring freak accident is not going to injure himself, will not tire down the stretch, and is too competitive to not prove everyone wrong that he deserves every dollar coming to him in free agency.
Speaking to Brewers fans…this is like Sabathia back in 2008. Nobody wanted to give up LaPorta, but he ended up being the worst player CLE got in that deal.
Marytown1
LaPorta, I was static with that deal. You think he’s worth a couple of top prospects who project to be the type of cornerstone of a rebuild for a 1 year rental though. That’s bananas.
Ohhoitsjimbo
I would maybe throw Erceg in if this was 100% necessary. But I would try not to. Having Shaw at third for the next few years makes him expendable if you have to
bencole
Yeah I’m a Cubs fan, and you won’t get close to that. Maybe you get Ray and a couple lottery tickets if your lucky. I’d be surprised if it was even the equivalent of Ray by himself.
gregstruth89
My god?
kripes-brewers
Of course you’d take a flyer on the guy, but you’re not going to give up any top 5 prospects for one year of MadBum. It’d have to be a few lottery tickets and a major league ready piece. That’s a guy you want on your team. But I really don’t see a compelling reason for the Giants to let him go until the deadline…
bobtillman
Yes, yes and yes. Giants aren’t under any need to trade MadBum, and they’d probably get just as much on July 31 as they will now. I can see Ray MAYBE (he’s a walking K-machine anyway). But names likes Burns (especially), Erceg, Woodruff and Hiurra definitely not.
RedRooster
No, the Giants are not going to get more for MadBum on July 31st when the acquiring team only gets him for 2 months as opposed to a full season and can’t QO him.
Strike Four
I could see that happening if contenders get into a bidding war at the deadline. That’s totally feasible.
kripes-brewers
I dunno. I think a team(s) gets desperate at the deadline. Then the Giants have all the reason in the world to cash in by at the very least getting some high end prospects, and they very likely have an edge at re-signing him to a multi-year contract in the offseason anyway… All they give up is 2 months with him.
bobtillman
And you’d get to see which MadBum you’re getting, the very good one or the very “meh” one…….Some of the shine is definitely off the guy…..If the BrewCrew is going to talk Burns or Hiurra, they can get better than MadBum……
RedRooster
If they trade that for him at the deadline they’ll just look stupid for not doing it in the offseason
jbigz12
In theory that’s how that would work but that’s certainly not necessarily the case in reality. If you think at this point you’re trading for Bumgarner of the last 2 years you’re not giving up much of a haul. If he looks like the guy of old at the deadline you certainly would give more. Could go that way for sure
mkeyankee
If he continues doing what he has done for the last 2 years the SFG will get significantly less at the deadline. His arm has been in decline for over 2 years.
daveineg
You Giant fans need a reality check. I realize the D-Backs retooling gives you some hope, but do you really think the G men are going to jump over the Dodgers and Rockies? I get you love Bumgarner. But get what you can now for him and re-sign him as a FA a year from now.
jbigz12
Are people confused on who Erceg is? This isn’t Hiura. Bob, you said you might trade Ray but not Erceg? The man who put up a .688 Ops in AA in 2018? The guy who put up a 724 ops in high A in 2017? Following this careeer trajectory he’s not going to make it to the majors for anything more than a cup of coffee.
Black&Orange&Silver
“Top 5 prospects” are all relative. The Brewers system is not great. The only top 100 prospect they have is Hiura. Corey Ray ranked MIL #2 prospect. He is an athletic guy with potential, but he is not considered a top prospect in baseball. He is not a top OF Prospect in the minors. He has potential, but the reality is that he hit .239 with 176 strikeouts in 532 ABs in AA as a 24 year old.
I’d love to have him in my organization, but him alone, or with throw ins, will not get any team the missing playoff piece and top of the rotation starter.
To get something you have to give something of equal or greater value. If not, it’s on to the next team…and that might just be the Cardinals, Cubs, Pirates, etc.
Redwolves3
Well said bleedingorange! “To get something you have to give something of equal or greater value. If not, it’s on to the next team …”
If Zaidi can’t WIN a trade (Bumgarner or even Posey) then the Giants are much better off keeping both of them.
Other teams recognize what value Bumgarner or Posey would bring to their team. Those teams only want to WIN the trade at the Giants expense.
So far I have not seen any possible trades that would help the Giants win anymore games. Venditte and Valera certainly won’t make any difference. Both appear to be “thrown in” type players to fill utility roles; definitely not capable of being starters.
baseballdeez
“He has potential, but the reality is that he hit .239 with 176 strikeouts in 532 ABs in AA as a 24 year old”
The reality is he was 23yrs old (turned 24 after the season) and hit 32 doubles, 7 triples, 27HR with 37SB as a CF and leadoff hitter with a 10% walk rate and 124 wrc+ playing in a pitchers park. I think his wrc+ was like 137 heading into the final month of the season where he was unlucky more than he slumped. But by all means just use batting average and Ks!! He was a Top 40 heading into 2017 then had a down A+ but leaped forward in AA in 2018. He’s absolutely a Top 100 talent.who has his warts but there’s a ton to like too.
dshires4
Only here for ridiculous packages proposed by Giants fans. Don’t disappoint me, MLBTR.
stevewpants
You won’t be have you seen some of the nonsense up top? How in the world do they expect multiple top prospects?
dshires4
Some of them hurt my brain. Bum is only under control for 2019, had a down season in 2018, has diminishing velocity… There’s zero reason to give up a decent prospect for him.
ColossusOfClout
Bumgarner has been a prominent figure in 3 WS wins and you won’t even give up a “decent” prospect? Hopefully the Milwaukee front office is smarter than their nitwit fans.
pdxbrewcrew
Craig Counsell was a prominent figure in 2 WS wins.
MadBum’s post-season performance will have very little impact on the package of prospects the Giants receive.
C-Daddy
His playoff performances from more than three years ago have no bearing whatsoever on his current value.
dshires4
He was a prominent figure when he was good. Right now, he isn’t all that good. And his contract expires after 2019. He’s got minimal trade value. I’m not even a Brewers fan, you clown. Hopefully they’re smarter than you, but that bar seems like an awfully low one to clear.
bencole
Yeah but that was a long time ago. He might bring one of the Brewers top 5 prospects. Might not. Mad Bum isn’t bringing anything close to a top pitcher package. Not even close. He just means a lot more to Giants fans than the rest of the world.
Black&Orange&Silver
Sorry, but you are 100% wrong. Any team that even engages in trade talks with the giants about Bumgarner will be specifically for his post season performance. The return will be to ensure he is pitching for them when it counts, not against them.
I’d like to hear 5 active starting pitchers in all of baseball that you would rather start a post season game…better yet, a must win game. Then I wonder, how many currently pitch for the Brewers and how many of them are available via trade. And to make it even more appealing, how many of them are not owed over. $100 million guaranteed?
pdxbrewcrew
Five years ago, you had a case. Today, not so much.
I’ll take Kershaw, Sale, Nola, deGrom, Schezer. There’s five and it didn’t take long to come up with those names.
Redwolves3
It seems the majority of the commentators want to speculate that because MadBum has been injured parts of the past 2 seasons that MadBum may be on the decline. And, teams know MadBum is entering his walk year so they want to steal him from the Giants.
If MadBum isn’t still an ace then why are teams still being reported as interested in trading for him? These same teams want to get MadBum as cheaply as they can by mentioning all of the “so called” negatives. But at the same time these same teams know if they can get MadBum their team is drastically changed for the better; suddenly a real contender.
Jim Bowden said it best last night “if there was ANY pitcher I could choose to pitch Game 7 of the World Series hands down it would be Madison Bumgarner … he knows how to win and isn’t afraid of the moment.”
Zaidi better WIN any potential trade of MadBum!!! You don’t trade a franchise player like MadBum and not WIN the trade. If Zaidi doesn’t he may as well pack his suitcase and head back to the Dodgers.
cuban1
So when hes 40 years old, does that mean he still has immense value due to his postseason stats? That has little to no bearing on his value.
basebaIl1600
But he’s not 40, is he now? He’s 29 coming off 2 seasons which he averaged around 3.30 ERA
Dagoat
Brewers get : madbum, belt, sandoval, balboni jr. And international $
Giants get : cain, hader, shaw, aguilar ,davies, 200 million cash, and ken phelps glove.
ennywjp
Absent a strong offer, MadBum is staying put. He’s very popular with the fan base and he’ll put butts in seats in the early season if nothing else. Doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to deal him for a middling package. Give him a chance to rebuild a little value and trade at the deadline.
fasbal1
So if a trade is foreseen, do u think the value would be higher now or at trade deadline?
ennywjp
Well it depends on if he stays healthy and performs as well as he is capable of. If he does, it would be absolutely higher at the deadline. Even for a few month rental, he’d be one of the premier pieces on the market.
I just think it’s a risk worth taking for SF because he’s such a popular player anyway. He’ll at least keep fan engagement afloat if the season goes poorly, as it almost certainly will.
Black&Orange&Silver
Higher at the deadline. Teams with Post Season hopes will bid each other up. Red Sox, Yankees, astros, Indians, dodgers, cardinals, cubs, brewers, nationals, braves, Phillies, will all want him. The thought of allowing their rivals get him will make them more willing to part with that prospect they aren’t sure if they want to let go.
jbigz12
Let’s not talk in absolute certainties here. If Bumgarner continues to pitch the way he is the last 2 seasons the price will not go up. If he gets back to his Ace form it will but that’s no certainty.
mkeyankee
Almost certainly lower, significantly, his arm has been in decline for over 2 years.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
They dont have the prospects the giants can and should demand ..MadBum cant reject just about any trade. Cant seen this happening.
brewcrew08
Brewers easily have the prospects to rent Bumgarner for one year.
kenleyfornia2
Do you follow farm systems and prospects at all because they absolutely do
RedRooster
Madbum has no kind of no-trade protection and the Brewers absolutely have the prospects to get him.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
He has a 8 team limited no trade clause. Theres no mention of whose on that list but I doubt they have te 3 or 4 top prospects for a rental.
JP Morsi talked about their #2 prospect. Corey Ray. It would start with him and likely need to include Knebel or Jefferies. Just to keep the talks serious enough.
Corey Ray, jared Jefferies, zack brown, and one other just to start.
pinstripes17
Absolutely too much for one year of an injury prone declining MadBum. Also, who is Jared Jeffries?
ennywjp
I’m not sure the market supports that kind of package. I also don’t see any reason to trade him for less than at least one top 100 prospect and some depth/long term pieces, which is why I’d be surprised if he was on another team for opening day.
pdxbrewcrew
The reason to trade him is the Giants are going to be in last place and all they’ll get for him when he signs with someone else will be the QO pick. And that’s if the Giants even offer him a QO.
Vanilla Good
Hey this is a baseball website. Not sure what you were looking for, but you’re clearly lost.
ennywjp
They can still trade him at the deadline. If he performs first half of the season there is a very real chance they get more for him then than they can now, even without the possibility of a QO.
amaymon
He used to play basketball for the wizards and was the star on the Indiana team that lost to Maryland in 2002.
He’s trying to say Jeremy Jeffress who was a stud reliever for the brew crew in 2018
RedRooster
@pinstripes17 how is MadBum injury prone!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? He has only been on the DL twice in his career and they were both from freak accidents!
stymeedone
Ok, MadBum is freak accident prone.
Redwolves3
If MadBum is declining so much then why are teams contacting the Giants about a trade?
It’s simple … because other teams know MadBum’s value and what he can do for them. And those same teams are pushing the “negative narrative” only to try and get MadBum as cheaply as possible.
What have the Brewers done during the offseason to improve? Especially their pitching. Absolutely nothing. Brewers need an ACE. Their pitching rotation is lacking a leader, mentor and an ACE someone other teams fear.
pdxbrewcrew
Why? Because everyone knows the Giants are going to suck this season and finish in last place.
2id
For a year of Bumgarner? They have more than enough prospects even without dealing Hiura or Burnes.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Corey Ray and Burnes and 2 major league players.
2id
Package headlined by Ray with a lower tier prospect such as Cody Ponce and a couple of lottery tickets.
2id
No way they trade Knebel or Jeffress
nymetsking
lol no.
MrSeptember
I see you’ve got the trolling motor all fired up
gregstruth89
Cubs fans. Worry about your own depleted and no talent farm system.
bencole
Bryzzo I think you’re really high again. A top 5 Brewers prospect… hmmm maybe. Maybe Ray because if the risk, throw in a couple lottery tickets like in the Brewers 10-30 range. That’s it man. He isn’t being close to old MadBum value
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
If you pay attention.. jp.morosi said the trade talks would start with corey ray the brewers #2 prospect..also meaning they would have to give up at least 1 more top 10 or 15 prospect. Plus at least 1 ML player. The giants aren’t stupid. And madbum can reject upto 8 teams. Brewers might be one of them. If hes smart he says no. They were one and done. No way in hell brewers repeat what they did. Cardinals and Cubs are still the favorites in the nl central..
bencole
Bryzzo… first, I’m a Cubs fan too. Morosi may be saying that’s what SF wants, and yeah I said Ray is possible at points above, but because he’s high risk. They may also want a SP. I don’t think they’re getting both…. maybe Peralta, who’s not all that good? But I think even that’s too much. The fact that they’re asking that is why there’s been no trade, if indeed they are.
afsooner02
If it’s woodruff…..I’m actually ok with that trade. I honestly feel the brewers would have a fair shot at resigning him if he turned his career around with a good season in Milwaukee. The window is just now opening for playoff runs and he would anchor that staff. Plus some players enjoy the smaller city lifestyle. I know it’s shocking but not every player dreams of playing in NY, LA or Bos. They just pay the most….
kripes-brewers
The crew can’t and shouldn’t try to compete for high end free-agent pitchers who will get huge dollars and lengthy contracts. Those guys and the risks that come with them are simply better suited to larger market teams. Just think Jeff Suppan… and he wasn’t even close to elite.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Its gonna be alot more than woodruff. At least 2 of their top 5 prospects.
pdxbrewcrew
Dude, you need to stop going to the dispensary before commenting. There is ZERO chance the Giants get that from anyone.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Well the trade is gonna start with ray..
bencole
No man, they’d be thrilled if they even got Ray. Possible but kinda doubt it. And Ray only because of the risk.
Vanilla Good
Kris Bryant for MadBum who says no?
ennywjp
The Marlins.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Theo hangs up as soon as he hears kris bry…
afsooner02
That was in response to the ray and erceg trade post…..not sure how it didn’t post it under that. Ray, erceg and woodruff I’d be ok with…
Marytown1
You’re smoking crack!
Bringbacktheblue
Do it Brewers
Strike Four
Wow not one trade idea including Hiura yet, are Giants fans asleep?
JoeyPankake
Hiura and ALL THE BEER.
Iron Horse
And bratwurst. And Bernie Brewer.
gilgunderson
SF already has Anchor Steam and myriad other great microbreweries. We good.
stansfield123
Love the article. Jeff always adds something interesting, instead of just droning on about the obvious. Case and point:
“Brewers GM David Stearns proved last year that he won’t be swayed by outside opinions on the state of his club’s pitching staff. While the consensus was that the Milwaukee org needed to bolster the top of its rotation — both last winter and in the mid-season trade period that followed — the club largely elected to go with internal options bolstered by seemingly unexciting outside acquisitions.”
A small market GM’s psychological predilections are not something your average baseball writer will talk about:).
Marytown1
The only thing that I would’ve added to what he stated is that pundits (and us Brewers fans) see the glaring need for that starter that can rest the bullpen almost every 5 days. Stearns will not overpay though, his name isn’t Doug Melvin.
Yankeepatriot
People mention bumgarners decline but he isn’t even 30 yet ad it could have just been a down year. I’d gladly add him on my team any day
Free Clay Zavada
Yeah he’s 29, but he has a lot more mileage on his arm than most his age. I think that needs to be considered too
Jean Matrac
Bum is like 6-4, 6-5, and country strong. The mileage on someone of his body type is much less than for someone like Tim Lincecum or Marcus Stroman, for example.
Free Clay Zavada
If we were talking football players (such as running backs) I’d likely agree but I don’t think there’s a link between size and arm durability. If there’s proof of a connection I’m happy to read it though
pdxbrewcrew
There’s a belief of a link between size and durability. That’s why you rarely see right-handed pitchers less than six feet tall.
Free Clay Zavada
That I could see potentially, but in this case we’re comparing him to his peers, which probably average six feet and an inch or two. Just not convinced there’s a difference in how many innings a six foot one guy can throw as opposed to a six foot five guy
pdxbrewcrew
The average MLB pitcher is six inches taller than the average American male.
Free Clay Zavada
6 foot 4 then…so MadBum is essentially average. Thus I think the mileage on his arm is very important
mikeyst13
His velocity has been declining since before the injuries though. That’s why his swing and miss rate is down and hard hit rate is up. He’s still an effective pitcher, but those things are red flags.
stymeedone
People mentioned his decline because of a drop in results, and a drop in velocity. No one mentioned his age. Their is no magic age at which, expectantly, every player declines.
KF
All the commas and adverbs in this post obfuscate the writer’s point to me. I’m sure lots of people will disagree and mock me for pointing this out. I don’t really care. I have to sift through a seemingly limitless supply of academic writing in my daily life and never see this much comma overuse.
HubcapDiamondStarHalo
You likely need to shift your attention to MLBGCTR then…
mrnatewalter
Congratulations on having no friends.
KF
sick burn bro
Jeff Todd
You have my apologies, sir (or madam), but the simple fact is that my own academic background is in the law, such that lengthy, over-punctuated, run-on sentences have become an undeniable, essential part of who I am — not just when I’m writing, but in my own thoughts as well, and much to my own disdain, if I’m being honest.
kgreene3
Give them ray and another mid level prospect, no chance I would offer much more than that.
Jean Matrac
Well then you wouldn’t get him. The Giants are letting Bum go for Ray and a mid-level prospect.
Vanilla Good
This is all the Brewers should be willing to give up. It’s ludicrous how people on here are overvaluing MadBum. Yeah, he’s a postseason legend, but he’s not the pitcher he once was. He’s got 1 year on his contract. Ray and Lutz could be the outfield of the future in SF. That’s totally worth the understandably hard trade of the face of your franchise. Ray is at very least a semi-regular in the MLB and his clock hasn’t started yet.
kgreene3
I’d hate to see lutz go but that would be more than enough. At this point I have a hard time seeing them moving Hiura, Erceg, Dubon or Turang unless we are talking about a major star.
jekporkins
I think it’s ludicrous how little you Brewers fans are evaluating Bum. This is an ace pitcher and the Brewers are in the beginning of their peak run. Do you want to go into the season with your current staff? To get someone of ace quality you will have to sacrifice something, and it’s more than one prospect and a toss-in.
And to a previous post, a rental is someone you have for a couple months, and this would be a full year, plus the draft pick if he doesn’t pick up the QO, right? Maybe he falls in love with the city and wants to stay. He gave SF a huge discount because he loves it here.
Speaking of rentals, your rival Cubs traded three big prospects (including Gleyber Torres) for Chapman to close out their World Series run. Now you guys don’t want to trade two solid prospects for a full year of a stud who can take you to the World Series, is a huge competitor, and is competing for a huge contract in the offseason? You guys are nuts.
kgreene3
Ok, lets say Braun for madbum straight up. A star for a star.
Swinging Friars
also add in the fact that the Brewer MLB roster is stacked. Where are all those prospects going to play? Now is the time to turn that young depth into an ace on the MLB team
kgreene3
Hiura is staying put, he is your 2nd base. Take ray, could care less. Turang is untouchable and erceg is still a year away. Plus if aguilar fails this year you move Shaw to first and erceg takes over 3rd. Lutz and gray are still 2-3 years out. Brown is staying put should see sometime in the bigs this year and Dubon is your bench depth, saladino had his time. So in the top 10 you can have Ray, Lutz or gray. This team has plenty of room.
jekporkins
Toss in Robin Yount and you got a deal.
kgreene3
Bobblehead? He has a lot of them.
Jean Matrac
No prospect is guaranteed to be even MLB-average. Bum is a known quantity. Even if he doesn’t bounce back to previous excellence, he still had a 118 ERA+ last season. His contract actually makes him more of a low-risk gamble than someone like Keuchel.
I can understand if the Brewers are risk-averse, and want to hold on to their prospects, But the Giants know what they have, it will cost to acquire him. If the price is too high for the Brewers he stays with the Giants, and either gets moved at deadline or a QO.
Vanilla Good
Hopefully the Giants do know what they have: a commodity that will decrease in value for every game he’s wearing their uniform. Trade him now if you want to even sniff top-5 org prospects.
Jean Matrac
Nope. He could be even more valuable at the deadline. Any team that feels they’re close and missing just one piece, or a team with an injury to the rotation, who, if they do nothing, might not make the playoffs, will pay through the teeth. Especially if Bum is having a good season and even more so if more than one team is in need.
augold5
If he’s having a good season you’ll probably get a return around what they’re currently asking(1 T100 prospect and a couple lower minor league fill ins) something like the Greinke trade from 2012. But if he continues to regress or gets injured again, they’ll get nothing even close to what they’re expecting
Emerson83
he is on the market, I’m sure there’s other teams interested. Someone will outbid that
nymetsking
Look at what Machado netted, and realize evan a full season of MadBum isn’t worth a half season of Machado. Ray and a mid 20s org prospect is a fair deal.
Emerson83
I disagree with that. I think the Brewers would much rather have bumgarner, place higher value on him than machado, if they were both available for a full season
nymetsking
I would much rather have a Mustang than a Rolls Royce. Don’t mean I’ll pay more for the Mustang than what someone else paid for the Rolls. I’ll pay the going rate of the Mustang.
jekporkins
So you’d rather have a #3 starter than a #1 because it’s cheaper.
nymetsking
Short attention span much? I said nothing about a cheaper #3 starter. I said I’m not going to dramatically overpay for that #1 starter on a decline and pay more for him than a recent precedent for an in his prime middle of the order premium SS bat, just because I want this SP more than I want that SS. I pay the going rate for this particular commodity. Maybe I’d give up just a touch more in secondary pieces if it gets a deal done, but I’m not parting with a much better primary than the Diaz the O’s got for a more valuable asset in Machado. 5 years ago, the Brewers absolutely overpay with a Hiura and more. These days, it’s not happening.
jekporkins
Why would you rather have a Mustang than a Rolls Royce again?
throwinched10
Huira would probably have to be in this deal for SF to pull the trigger.
stevewpants
There it is.
jjgreedy
I actually laughed out loud. Thank you
pdxbrewcrew
There is zero chance the Brewers include Hiura.
pinstripes17
Lol!
throwinched10
I would be surprised if SF did the deal. Then again, I am not a MIL or SF fan and not familiar with either of their farm systems/needs
Emerson83
Prospects are overhyped about 90% of the time. Bumgarner is an established stud, and his injuries are freak rather than diminished arm injuries. I think they would have to start with hiura
Vanilla Good
Go look at Huiras stats and say 6 years of a (at the very least) good contact hitter with a little pop isn’t worth 1 year of a starter on a non-competing team. Yes, he’s a legend in SF and in baseball in general. He’ll probably just resign with SF again after this season. Why would you give up the future at 2nd base for 1 year of a starter who’s clearly starting to show some ware?
mlb1225
An established stud with 1 year of control left. No team would be willing to give up multiple prospects, or multiple young talents that could be relied on for multiple years for a guy you’ll have for one year guaranteed.
mkeyankee
Or much less the guy who outhit Vlad Guerra Jr in the Arizona Fall League and will be a top 5 prospect to start the season when the new rankings come out. Not happening.
sportsfan101
Lincecum and Cain 3.0? Sf burns there pitchers out mannnnn
Yankeepatriot
I’m 2015 I felt horrible for his arm despite their title win. He carried that team big time
slider32
Not sure Mad Bum is the pitcher he was a few years ago. The first time the Giants won the series Lincecum was the ace, the second Cain was the ace, and the third Mad Bum. i think he is passed his prime.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Honestly the third time. If it wasnt for.madbum the royals sweep the giants. He had two wins and a 5 inning save. Alex Gordon should have had an inside the park home run. And also you gotta take out sal Perez who was very clearly hurt from being hit in the leg by madbum his previous AB.
They are still the worst teams to ever win a world series..
Yankeepatriot
2006 cardinals are the worst lol
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
When cody Ross and marco Scutaro are your best players. They are the worst. Cardinals were a wild card team that got hot. No way they had a worse team. Prime Albert Pujols is all that needs to be said.
basebaIl1600
What are you blabbing on about? Marco Scutaro and Cody Ross are the players that get hot at the right time, not the “best players” on the giants team. Every team has a random player that gets hot. Think Astros Brad Peacock in 2017. Red Sox Jackie Bradley in 2018. Were they the best players? No. They performed when it counted. The Giants best players were Buster Posey, Freddy Sanchez, Juan Uribe, Aubrey Huff, Pablo Sandoval, Hunter Pence, Brandon Belt, Brandon Crawford, the pitching core of Lincecum/Cain/Bumgarner. You are an ignorant cubs fan I can tell.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Cody Ross marco Scutaro and Aubrey huff .. before they ever got to the giants they were role players. They were their best players the giants got extremely lucky vs the rangers and royals
basebaIl1600
Aubrey Huff was on the HOF ballot. So was Freddy Sanchez. They were respectable players.
basebaIl1600
The Giants absolutely destroyed the 2010 Rangers. If anything, that was the WS that involved the least amount of luck. Pretty sure they won a game 9-0.
Yankeepatriot
The 2006 cardinals prime Albert or not have the worst regular season record ever for a World Series winner lol
HubcapDiamondStarHalo
The only qualification to be on the HOF ballot is “having played in each of ten Major League championship seasons.” Being included on the ballot has nothing to do with their performance (except that they were good enough to play in at least part of ten different seasons).
basebaIl1600
Alright. How about 242 career home runs and a .278 career batting average. Aubrey Huff was an above average player offensively.
jekporkins
The 1988 Dodgers shouldn’t have even been a .500 team, let alone a World Series champion. The A’s should be ashamed of that one.
Dagoat
Seriously they were on the HOF ballot? Why?
And I’ll use the stats against you.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Literally everyone who ever played major league baseball is on the hof ballot. Harold Reynolds was on it too..jay buhner was on it as well. What’s your point. The wait is 5 years after retirement. David Wright and prince fielder will be on it as well. Fielder will be on it in 2021 and Wright in 2023. They might get a few of there own teams writers but otherwise they wont ever be HOFers.
davidcoonce74
That’s not quite true – every player who played at least ten seasons is eligible for the HoF ballot, but there is a committee that winnows out the guys who clearly shouldn’t clog the ballot- basically bench players and middle relievers. For example, Jeff Mathis has played ten+ seasons in the majors but he won’t be on the HoF ballot. Daniel Descalso won’t be on a HoF ballot. Basically major leaguers who were regulars, starting pitchers or closers for at least ten seasons make the final ballot.
There have been a few exceptions – Addie Joss made the Hall despite only playing 9 seasons, and Dizzy Dean made the Hall despite only playing four full seasons and parts of a couple more and one game each in three others. But those are old-time outliers and now they’ve been pretty consistent.
basebaIl1600
You’re one to talk, the Cubs were extremely lucky their entire 2016 PS. If Bochy kept Matt Moore in the game the Giants take game 4 and head to game 5 with Cueto, who shut down the cubs offense in game 1, and the entire momentum on their side. All the weight would be on the Cubs shoulders. Very possible if Bochy played his hand correctly in game 4 the Cubs are eliminated in the NLDS. They got very lucky in the WS as well, what if Carrasco was healthy? What if Salazar was 100%? It’s really funny seeing a cubs fan talk about a lucky team winning the WS.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
They were the best team in the league that year. Skills not luck. They have 43 comeback wins more than twice than the next best team. That’s a team that never quits. That’s skill not luck. It’s also clutch
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Cubs won game 1 at Wrigley 1-0 8th inning home run line drive. By javy Baez Baez also stole home in game 2 the next night..Cubs should have swept the giants. Another player out of the woodwork connie Gillespie. Got a straight fast ball from Chapman and made solid contact.
basebaIl1600
You were talking about the giants postseason and how they were lucky to win, so I talked about the cubs postseason and how they got lucky. No one said the regular season team wasn’t good, but there have been better teams (2001 Mariners) who didn’t win the WS because of their postseason performance. The Giants didn’t win 3 WS because of luck, they played some very good teams. 2012 Tigers, 2010 Phillies, 2014 Nationals, all very good teams they beat.
RedRooster
No, the Giants would have at least won game 4 without Bumgarner. He didn’t pitch in that game. The Giants won that one because Brandon Finnegan completely shxt the bed. And you could tell that that was the moment that derailed the Royals.
gilgunderson
You are probably right. When the Giants were trailing in Game 4 and showing no signs of life offensively, I thought they were done. Then they lit up Finnegan and were back in business.
You don’t win three WS by sheer luck. That is pure insanity. And no mention anywhere of the Giants’ incredible bullpen performances across all three WS? When Bochy turned to the Core Four with the Giants leading, they didn’t blow it a single time.
Corazon5
This situation with Bumgarner does feel very reminiscent of what happened with Matt Cain. I think the Brewers would be sensible to wait and see how he performs in the first couple of months before pulling the trigger on a deal.
mikeyst13
Except if they wait and his velo is back up and he’s pitching well then the price just goes up even more.
Corazon5
True, but the Brewers are in win now mode. The healthy and effective version of Bumgarner would be worth it.
Marytown1
If his velo was up, SF and thus MKE and every other team would know about it and raise the number of bidders. So that tells me that his velo is right where it’s known to be.
mikeyst13
You think he’s in a full on throwing regimen from a mound already? A couple pitches here and there his velo could be back up or down, but until he actually gets out throwing on a regular basis with a gun on him nobody is tabbing his velocity.
Jean Matrac
Bum and Cain aren’t that comparable. Cain was dominant until arm and ankle injuries torpedoed his career. The past 2 seasons Bum wasn’t as good as he had been previously due to injuries. But they were of the more freak nature, and not the chronic type like Cain’s. I still see Verlander as a better comp for Bum. Verlander was the better pitcher, but they have the same body type, and came, or are coming back from injuries.
MDNyyClipper07
Yankees where ya at?
basebaIl1600
I love Bumgarner, but it’s for the best we trade him. Honestly though, if Ray isn’t included in a package from the Brewers I’d be disappointed. Him and 2 minor prospects would get it done.
mikeyst13
Wow, someone with a reasonable offer (though I think they could get another ok prospect to go with Ray). I know He has almost folk hero status in SF, but 1 year rental at $12 mil and declining velo does not equal a huge return. He could rebound like Verlander did, bit for a team to take that shot at 1 year they are going to have to accept a lower deal than most are proposing or pay down his contrac lt some to get a little better package.
Psychguy
Zaidi is familiar with Dodger players, sent Baumgarner there for Verdugo and some pitching.
Jean Matrac
Maybe Bumgarner isn’t the pitcher he was, and maybe he bounces back, a la Justin Verlander. But either way, had Bum been in the Brewer’s rotation last season, they probably beat the Dodgers and get to the WS. They probably don’t beat the Red Sox, But there’s a big difference between getting there, and not. If they do acquire him, and if he bounces back, they are clearly among the favorites to win it all. The Brewers have to decide if that’s worth the cost.
Boogaloo
The Brewers have one of the worst farm stems in baseball.
They have 1 top prospect.
Yet they think they can get it done without including him?
Lol.
Giants would be better taking the draft pick if he leaves.
Let him pitch next season, if hes as good as ever put him on the market and see what the 10 teams that want him can come up with.
I’m sure it will be better than Milwaukees.
Vanilla Good
You’d rather have a draft pick than Corey Ray and another actual prospect?
Strike Four
Doesn’t even have to be prospects: Peralta, Burnes, Houser, Lopez, Davies, Woodruff all fit into the Giants plans. One of that group, Corey Ray and a couple lower level guys for MadBum more than gets it done.
Vanilla Good
Lopez was traded to KC, but if it’s Houser, Ray, and a lower guy or 2 it’s a deal!
KP23
People act like madbum lost his luster.
I’m not convinced gms think corey ray is a highly touted prospect at all
mkeyankee
GMs absolutely think the former top 5 pick and 2018 double-A southern MVP is a highly touted prospect. He had an injury after being drafted but was top 100 and will be again at the start of 2019 when the new rankings come out.
Eric P
This is a total non-story. The Giants have discussed Bum with a lot of teams, some in more depth than others. The asking price is going to be high, though not crazy. If it were the Brew Crew, I would guess Ray and Peralta.
Bum suffered two freak injuries. My guess is the Gs hold on to him to see if his peripherals come back up. If they do, they either trade him mid-season when his value has been clearly restored, or they offer him an extension.
Jean Matrac
I agree with a lot that you say, but can’t agree that’s it’s a non-story. Yeah, several teams have talked about Bumgarner, but the Brewers are probably the best fit. With all there talent, their greatest weakness is not enough pitching. They were so close last season, that Bum could be the final piece that puts them over the top. The Brewers know this and that could be enough for them to pull the trigger and pay the price that it will take. This moreso for them than the Braves, Phillies, Yankees, or any of the other teams that have previously been discussed. I think this is trade that could actually happen.
Redwolves3
If Zaidi does trade MadBum (3 World Series Championship Rings) to Milwaukee he better get a Chris Sale (1 World Series Championship Ring) talent haul then Zaidi needs to pack his bags and go back to the Dodgers.
If MadBum is traded there is no Ace on the staff!!!
Vanilla Good
Who needs an ace when you’re gunning for 3rd place?
pustule bosey
the giants aren’t setup to win this season and madbum is going to walk at the end of the season, the question isn’t whether he trades him, the question is what he can get
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
They still have Samardzija….. oh wait. They have been regretting that since he was signed for 80mil more than hes worth.
jobusrum9
They have no need for an Ace which is exactly the reason why this deal probably gets done.
In theory a guy like Chase Anderson would be more valuable to SF right now then Mad Bum.
Anderson would provide them almost the exact same benefit this season as Mad Bum would. He’s going to eat up 150+ innings and have a sub 4.00 era, and he’d be a veteran presence to the rotation.
Mad Bums value over Anderson is only recognized on a team contending for a WS.
I could totally see the Brewers getting Mad Bum for Anderson, Ray, and Zach Brown.
Giants would get 3 seasons of Anderson, 1 OF prospect with an extremely high ceiling, and 1 pitching prospect with a high floor.
Best case scenario the Giants also end up resigning Mad Bum in 2020. In that scenario they would be ready to start contending again in 2020 and potentially set themselves up with 3/5 of their 2020 rotation in 1 deal, plus a potential 5tool CFer.
The only reason for the Giants not to make that deal would be bc they either have delusions of grandeur this season or nostalgic feelings of Mad Bum and what he’s meant to the team.
From a pure competitive standpoint it’s a win win for both orgs.
And I also think Anderson could be extremely valuable for them. You take him out of the NL central and all those small ballparks and let him pitch most his games in SF, SD, and LA he’s probably back to being a sub 3.00 era guy.
stubby66
like this guys thinking and proposed trade
dematteo1982
I am shocked that Atlanta isn’t more active on this Bumgarner front. They have legit pitching prospects that you know your not going to use all of them. I would easily throw 2 of them along with a position player prospect for MadBum.
I’d give the Giants a list of 6 pitching prospects they would be willing to give up and tell them to pick 2
Then do the same with position players.
So for pitchers..
Soroka..Wright..Gohara…Fried..Wentz and Tarnok
Hitters..Riley…Jackson…Pache..Waters..Peterson and Lungbauer…
Give up 4 of those guys for MadBum..
Sign him to a 4yr/$96mil extension
That makes the Braves scary good imo
And I’m a Mets fan
So Gohara,Riley,Soroka and Pache for
MadBum throw in Melancon and pay 10mil towards that and I think you’d have a deal
Remember..MadBum is a proven playoff performer….The Braces should go all in for this
Strike Four
All good points. Braves and Giants match up fantastically but Riley, Soroka and Wright aren’t going to be on the table here.
basebaIl1600
Id assume a Bumgarner trade on Atlanta’s front would at most include 2 legit prospects. I don’t think ATL would want to give up Soroka, Toussaint, Wright, or Riley. My thought is the Giants give Bumgarner and 1 of Watson/Smith for Christian Pache, Kolby Allard, and a few minor prospects. That would be a solid package and a win-win for both sides imo.
Jean Matrac
Does the Atlanta FO believe that Bum is the difference in going to the WS or not? I’m not sure he is, and that’s the difference between the Braves and Brewers, Bum could be the difference there.
grapher0315
That is one of the worst proposals I have seen. You are tremendously over estimating what one year of MadBum will bring. Realistically the Braves would only have to give one of those names, maybe with another much lower ranked prospect.
dematteo1982
I agree…but at some point a team will have to use the great assets they have built up and go and get that one piece needed for an October run. Is that an overpay..damn right it is…even so…the Braces still have 6 top 100 prospects…a legit ace and proven playoff performer…and chances are 3 out of the 4 prospects don’t pan out…and even if all 4 do…im sure a world series title would easily cancel that out..and if u didn’t notice…i had the Braves signing him to a 4yr contract…eliminating the rental aspect
jbigz12
They can use the chips if they want but they don’t use them for a massive Dave Stewart esque overpay
hockeyjohn
No way would Atlanta do that for one year of any pitcher. I doubt Atlanta would even do that for three years of Kluber.
stymeedone
@ DeMatteo
So you’ve spoken to MadBum and he’s fine signing that extension and foregoing his last real opportunity at free agency?
dematteo1982
I’m just throwing out what i think would be fair market value for a 30yr old left-handed ace…just an opinion..god forbid I have one of those
Vanilla Good
Ray, Lutz, & a lotto ticket arm get it done.
Pb
The narrative that Bumgarner has limited trade value and is an injury risk, has become comical.
We are literally talking about the greatest World Series pitcher in history. And this in not a limited sample size, but 3 different World Series.
You can talk about declining peripherals all you want. The dude has the cajones and guile to pitch on the biggest stage. Any he has never been a pitcher that has depended on raw stuff.
Prospects are just that. If a team wants to take the next step……especially, the Brewers, Braves, Yankees that have mediocre starting pitching, then they sacrifice young talent.
pdxbrewcrew
That’s all well and good, but we are still talking about a one-year rental on a pitcher that has missed at least a third of the last two seasons.
MadBum will bring a lesser package than the Tigers got for Verlander.
atuck_sfg
Two freak injuries, it’s not like the guy pulls a hammy every couple games or needs TJ surgery. Give him a season without any physical therapy and see what happens. Still the best postseason pitcher in baseball. And Verlander had down years as well.
pdxbrewcrew
Still means the Giants are getting a lesser package than the Tigers got for Verlander.
A Brewer prospect equivalent to the Verlander package would be Ray, Erceg and Woodruff. So the sights need to be set at a package LESS than that.
Jean Matrac
“MadBum will bring a lesser package than the Tigers got for Verlander.”
I’m not sure about that at all. Sure Verlander had been the better pitcher, and there was more control. But, Verlander’s contract reduced his value quite a bit. There was 3 years and $84M left. Detroit picked up $16M leaving Houston on the hook for $68M. Verlander was also 5 years older when traded than Bum is now. That was a huge gamble by the Astros that did pay off, but could have been disastrous. Bumgarner, at 1/12 is much less of a gamble.
Plus, you’re undervaluing a full season of Bumgarner. That isn’t what is usually described as a rental since the QO is in play. It’s more applicable to guys traded at the deadline with only 2 months of control, without a QO opportunity.
pdxbrewcrew
It’s a rental because it’s unlikely the Brewers resign him. If he pitches great, he prices himself out of their budget. If he pitches poorly or gets injured, they wouldn’t want to have him back. What’s a rental differs from franchise to franchise.
One year of team control versus three. Lesser gamble or not, it boils down to that. I’m not saying the Giants won’t get anything for him. But if the Brewer/Verlander equivalent package is Ray, Erceg and Woodruff, the Giants would be doing great to get two of those.
Jean Matrac
I would say that if you can offer a QO it’s not a rental. And the fact that his contract is only what it is actually way more attractive to teams than one like Verlander’s. And who cares if he leaves after if he helps them win a title. What I’m saying is the Giants have every reason to expect a plus return for him, and if the brewers don’t like the price, he stays, and the Giants either move him at the deadline or offer the QO.
basebaIl1600
Bumgarner got hit by a line drive and had too much fun on a dirt bike. I’m pretty sure neither of that will happen in 2019. Pretty sure lock that he stays healthy considering he’s built like a truck.
stymeedone
Pretty sure you didn’t bet that the last two injuries wouldn’t happen. I am certain that every year a pitcher plays, the chances of getting injured become greater.
stubby66
You know if San Francisco would have just pulled the trigger on Corey Hart for Baumgartner a couple years ago he wouldn’t have gotten hurt
Cam
Madison Bumgarner is a legend. He has written his place in the HoF already.
Just don’t whine about people who are paying attention to what he’s going to provide from now on. What he’s already done for the Giants, won’t help the Brewers.
basebaIl1600
@Cam Literally the same could have been said about Verlander a few years ago. Bumgarner is very likely to bounce back next year considering it’s a contract year.
Cam
Verlander’s rebound is almost unprecedented – that’s the exception, not the rule.
If you’re banking on a “contract year” to give him a Verlander-like ageing curve, then I have some swampland you can empty your bank on. 99 times out of 100, you’re going broke.
basebaIl1600
I’m banking on that and the fact that Bumgarner is only 29, and outside 1 mph on his fastball has showed no sign of drastic decline. He was rushed from injury in 2018 and for his first few starts didn’t have his velo, but he regained his form later in the year. Fans are just buying into what some stat geeks are saying because of 5-6 starts that he really should have been on the DL.
Cam
The fact that you’re admitting you’re banking on a Verlander-esque ageing curve, should end the discussion right there.
Next, you’ll be telling me lottery tickets are a great retirement scheme.
Thanks anyway.
Jean Matrac
Way to twist the discussion. Nobody is “banking on a Verlander-esque ageing curve”. Ridiculous.
What it’s about is the gamble. Every acquisition is a gamble of a certain degree. Bum at 5 years younger, and with a 1 year/$12M contract is far less a gamble than Verlnder was at 3 years/$68M.
Bum and Verlander have similar body types. No one would compare Verlander to Tim Lincecum, but comparing him to Bum is reasonable. And they had similar careers up until they were injuried.
No one is guaranteeing that Bum will bounce back. But given his track record, body type, the types of injuries he had, and his contract, all make Bum a very reasonable gamble. No one wins without first winning some gambles.
Dagoat
Cmon, guy loves the giants. You never gonna talk sense into him. He called bumgarner A legend.
Only in SF. I hope they keep him.
Balk
Your a fool dagoat! Bumgarner is a legend you idiot, he invented the 4 inning save in the postseason. Check his stats for postseason. Hall of fame alllll day long. You’re just a hater who doesn’t appreciate baseball and it’s players and their achievements! Fool!
Cam
Dagoat – I’m not a Giants fan. But you are a muppet, that’s confirmed.
Cam
@tad2b13 – baseball1600 edited his post. He literally said a Verlander-esque ageing curve is what he’s banking on.
basebaIl1600
Can, you’re an idiot. I never said anything of the sort you moron.
connorreed
You’re ignoring the fact that Houston also oversaw big rebounds of Gerrit Cole and Charlie Morton. Unless Bumgarner is going to Houston and using their analytics and methods, Verlander doesn’t seem like a completely appropriate comparison.
bravesfan
Look, braves need to be in this discussion as well. I see no reason why we shouldn’t be. Heck, he’s from braves country I believe.
DougieJones
Worthless article. Giants not doing anything. Zaidi is a bum.
williemaysfield
Lol He’s no Bum. Bum has 3 rings! Zaidi has zero!
Frisco500
36 innings pitched. 1 earned run. A World Series Legend.
Rich Hill’s Elbow
Ray, Diplan, and Lutz??
bdpecore
This is a realistic and acceptable offer for MadBum. Do plan can easily be swapped out with multiple lottery ticket arms currently in the Brewers farm system.
bdpecore
This is a sensible and realistic offer for one year of a former ace who’s peripherals have been slowly declining as of late. Two solid prospects and a lottery ticket arm.
Indiansjoe
Frazier, bird and elisbury…get it done Cashman. Just don’t touch future guaranteed hall of famer Andujar!!!!! Just wanted to sound like a yankee looser for once
Cam
As long as the Brewers are paying for what Bumgarner will give them, not what he has already given the Giants. There’s a lot of heavy mileage on that arm, and the underlying peripherals don’t paint an amazing picture going forward.
Still a very talented, worthwhile arm…just not the Bumgarner we’ve already seen.
Balk
Bumgarner will still throw 200 plus innings dude. This dude is still better then any starter on the crews team!
Cam
Not sure what you’re trying to argue – I already said, he’s talented and worthwhile. I didn’t say anything about how many innings he’ll throw, or what Brew starters are worse.
Are you imagining things again?
Balk
Lol, what is it that you think I’m imagining? You stated a lot of mileage on his arm, so I stated he will still throw 200 plus innings. And yes you will have to pay for what he did for the Giants, and what he would still do for the Giants. Is that enough for ya smart ass?
Central Valley
Well, even if you only got one postseason of vintage Bum then it’s still worth it.
Too much upside. Rather have 3 years at 35 million a year Kershaw ?
aussiegiants53
Still on the fence with trading him but if it helps the franchise moving forward we have to consider it right? How about MadBum, Watson/Smith (or both) for Corey Ray, Tristen Lutz, Adrian Houser and a lotto pick like Justin Jarvis. Ray and Lutz would be the projectable OF the Giants crave, Houser could step into the bullpen in 19
basebaIl1600
Very fair offer. Brewers fans need to realize that the Giants arent handing Bumgarner away. If they want him, pay for him. If not, good luck next year!
aussiegiants53
I think so too, if they want both Smith and Watson then add another mid level prospect and call it a day. If they don’t then we don’t move him. We need to start taking steps in the right direction
noodles465
Go get him brew crew!!!!!
RedRooster
Completely ridiculous that anyone is calling Bumgarner injury prone lol.
He has been in the Majors for 9 years, has only been on the DL twice and both injuries were sustained in FREAK ACCIDENTS, not from chronic arm problems or something like that. He is no more of an injury risk than any other player.
stymeedone
Look up the defn of “injury prone.” He has gotten injured in two of the last two years. I have not seen anyone specify a particular cause of injury to the proneness.
Jean Matrac
New to baseball? The type of injury has long been the defining criterion for whether or not a guy is injury prone.
Balk
Broken pinky by a comebacker, and a dirt bike accident isn’t injury prone. This dude will pitch better this year then 80 % of starting pitchers out there.
Central Valley
Agree
Jason d r
I don’t know if anyone noticed, but I was looking at some of the past and present giants pitchers and they all seem to fall apart around the late 20’s. Lincecum, Cain now cueto and possibly Bumgarner? Does anyone have any idea why this is?
atuck_sfg
Possibly the training staff, lifting/ workouts can cause injuries or failing to notice ailments before they are serious. Also Lincecum has a degenerative hip disorder, that’s tough to spot as a training staff, and all three guys, Cain, Timmy and MadBum threw a LOT of innings between 2010 and 2014, even before then Cain and Timmy threw quite a bit. Bumgarner didn’t make it to the bigs until 2010
wrigleywannabe
Look, I’m a “if you don’t like it, don’t read it” guy, but come on.
Enough with the clickbait.
The Brewers, like any team, have an interest in MadBum.
There’s your headline.
They have expressed that interest to the Giants, but are nowhere near having any traction for a deal.
There’s the “story”.
Oh, the sun rises in the West, too.
Balk
Completely correct! Unless someone offers something they can’t refuse, (Mlb ready talent) then forget it. Kicking the can isn’t news. Trade deadline is were teams get desperate. Giants will wait
baseballpun
Brewgarner
campos101214
Nice
BeerTown
Corey Ray and Marcos Diplan should get it done. Maybe throw in a late blooming lottery ticket like Gilbert Lara. It’s more than the Brewers will want to pay but should be enough for the Giants.
campos101214
Madbum and Longoria for Ray Woodruff Low tear prospect.
MrSeptember
Why would the Brewers want Longoria? Shaw’s a much better player at this point. Longoria drops the return for Bumgarner
mkeyankee
Drops it to nothing and would require the Giants also send Heliot Ramos to
Milwaukee for a bag of balls. Have you seen Longoria’s contract and production?
Central Valley
Brewers are crazy to not get Bumgarner. Do you want prospects or a chance at a World Series? Bumgarner types don’t come around very often. Prospects that don’t amount to anything are everywhere. Enough with the “he’s a one year rental” “ too many injuries” . He’s 29 and very very cheap! Good luck not winning with that mentality. His injuries are not TJ surgeries, or anywhere close to TJ issues. He’s still a beast and after resting this offseason will be “country strong.”
pdxbrewcrew
Don’t expect the Giants to be able to restock the farm system by trading him. He’ll bring back one good prospect, one lesser prospect and maybe one lottery ticket. That’s all any team will give up for him. That’s all any team will give up for him at the deadline.
zimerust
Teams will give up whatever they feel they need to give up in order to get him. It’s not like the Brewers are the only team in need of Bumgarner.
But I’d say Ray, Brown, and Stokes for MadBum would be fair. Would have to be something like that if the Brewers kept Hiura.
drewm
Braun for Bumgarner? Sure, why not.
Nevrfolow
I’d love to have Corey Ray. What could the Giants get for a Bumgarner and Will Smith package?
Nevrfolow
Take Chris Shaw from us too
MrSeptember
The Brewers bullpen is pretty well stocked. No fit for Smith add on
mkeyankee
Milwaukee is not interested in Will Smith for what the asking price would be.
GarryHarris
I think the Nats go for Madison Bumgarner.
basebaIl1600
Bumgarner for Strasburg and Kieboom. Giants get Kieboom, a legit prospect, and relieve the nats of the awful contract of Strasburg and allow them to spend more freely. The Nationals literally Bobby Bonilla’d the contract. They pay Stras until 2030. I’d think it’s pretty fair if the giants take care of that entire contract, they’d get a lot of money off the Nationals hands for somebody who will most likely end up being a reliever because of his injury issues.
Sir Becks
This is ridiculous. Reading all this comments from Brew fans, how they hold on some prospects.
You have a chance to sign best ps pitcher in mlb history, in a ideal moment with Yelich in his prime and that bullpen who get you that far last year.
This is your window, right now, what frikin’ prospects, get him while he’s still outhere and i’m sure all Cubbies and Cards fans are start to panic.
Did they think to have a chance to sign maybe some free agent pitcher with madbum caliber next year or what, did yoy see what Corbin get, could you imagine what will Bum get if he’s back this full season with no freak injury.
Let’s imagine 2yrs ago did someone give you this scenario like it is right now, would you keep your “prized” kids for one piece you need to win it all.
Unreal
nentwigs
I believe that after 2 successive years of non-throwing injuries, MadBum should be poised to bounce back in 2019.. As an outdoors man from NC, as well as a pitcher who enjoys batting, MadBum might be predisposed to consider resigning were he traded to either Atlanta or Milwaukee.. Trouble is that if either of those two teams don’t trade for him in the off season, the price and other teams at the trade deadline will knock them out of contention to acquire MadBum.. The way that MadBum’s stats have taken a beating over the last few years due to the Giants lack of a closer and ineffectual hitting, combined with the team not being in contention for the next few years, it’s more than likely that MadBum signs with a team other than the Giants for 2020 and beyond.
atuck_sfg
I prefer the Giants keep him to be completely honest, he will keep the stadium filled every 5th game and even if they sign him to a long term deal, which I hope they do, let’s say he has some fall off towards the end of the contract, he has proven he can come out of the pen as a reliever
its_happening
The starting pitcher the Brewers need is Josh Hader. He should be the opening day pitcher and the next Chris Sale is born. By making this move the Brewers will need another bullpen arm.
They won’t do this. They will keep Hader in the bullpen and Milwaukee will walk into 3rd place in 2019.
mkeyankee
Milwaukee lead the NL in wins last year. Not just their division. The team is stacked.
Giantsbaby93
If you don’t giants receive paxton like package, it’s a pass. Paxton was far more injury prone and I believe bum is better. But i get the 2yrs vs 1 yr for bum but bum is far more accomplished and can put a team over the top tryna get thru the hump of the postseason just my opinion. Is Anyway Robby Ray goes to Atlanta too what do y’all think?
deweybelongsinthehall
Should be interesting to see the return if traded. Porcello is another who might be moved. His cost is huge which would limit his return but while not being sexy like MB, his ceiling of 2016 and the playoffs last year is significant. Plus there are no injury issues. The man has been durable.
scotty
MadBum for one season is worth a minor haul. Ray, Erceg and Ponce should get it done. All 3 could contribute this year.
kgreene3
I think I should start keeping track how many times I hear stuff about the brewers pitching staff and how they Need an ace to succeed. Oh wait, they don’t need an ace. Brewers Yankees WS 2019.
Gary333
I’d like to see MadBum get a chance to get to the Post season again since it won’t be happening with my Giants. He could get way better run support on the Brewers than he could on the Giants. I think it would just be better for his career. I’ve watched him, Cain, Linceum, etc lose so many close games simply because the Giants couldn’t score runs. Hate to see him go but I really think he’d be better off.
kgreene3
People have to realize Stearns wants control of his ball players. 1 year in his books isn’t good enough, if madbum had 2 years left you might see a different deal. I’d love to see him in the crew uniform but there is a reason Stearns has been successful at what he does. He knows his limits.
petefrompp
So Giants fan here- so bias is known.
I dont know how to value the prospects for trade- I can only go with this- Bums last two years have had some freak accident hangover- even with the injures he still has pitched well. In post season interview in September of this year – he stated he never had full grip strength during the season because of the injury – he said he would correct it on the offseason. So one of his worst seasons was 3.26 era/2.5 war
I expect a huge year from Madbum in 2019 – and given his physical strength and constitution i think he will be one of the top post season pitchers next year- say top 5. Of course none of this means anything coming from me- but there is a value to his track record and he is still only 29. I get its one year of control – but I think he will cost more in July- if you get him now you get that extra 19 or so starts plus you can QA him.
Its all a gamble- such is life, but I would be willing to bet my own money Madbum is on valuable pitcher next season- so he is not going to be cheap- and if I’m the Giants I should get good return wither now or deadline .
Also for fun her are some postseason pitching stats: record/ ERA/ WHIP
8-3 2.11 .899
9-10 4.32 1.092
3-0 2.92 1.29
Madison Bumgardner
Clayton Kershaw
Ryan Vogelsong
imgman09
Reportedly discussed means ZERO other than if you give me 2- Mad Bums I’ll give you the one I have
claude raymond
During the 2017 postseason, Morosi tweeted this:
“Fact: Clayton Kershaw (8) has made more postseason quality starts than Madison Bumgarner (7) since 2013.”
Considering he conveniently ignored Bumgarner’s prior postseason performances (Morosi loves the Dodgers), it showed a lack of responsible journalism on his part.
Since then he has reported other non-stories and bogus rumors.
Everyone needs to just ignore anything that begins “Jon Paul Morosi reports that …”.
Don’t waste your time
imgman09
I agree ! It smells like a rat and a dead one,sounds our news media
Solid Plushdamentals
Giants fans are absolutely high. There is no way the Brewers are trading multiple top prospects for MadBum. If that was what it took, they would be sending the same prospects to Cleveland for Kluber, or would keep the prospects and just sign Kuechel.
As much as anyone wants to say Ray iant that good of a prospect, hes the current MVP of the Southern League. He’s the type of prospect a deal is built around, not a throw in requiring multiple high end prospects.
James1955
Giants fan. I think that a Bumgarner Ray trade would work. The Giants don’t have any top outfield prospects in the high Minors and the outfield looks bad right now. If the Brewers want to give up a ton (they won’t), they could get a SP with more team control.
BrewCrew1302
No way the Brewers are parting with Peralta Woodruff or Burnes. Did you see the way those three pitched in the postseason. They have ace written all over them with their stuff. Woodruff especially.
augold5
I’m a big Brewers fan, but Ace might be a stretch. Burnes is the only one imo that has ace potential.
BrewCrew1302
If not top of the rotation then back end of the bullpen. Woodruff and peralta flat out blow hitters away
mikeyst13
I would actually say Woodruff has the least chance at ending up at the top of the rotation. Sure his stuff is good in short bursts, but when he can’t just let it fly all out he’s much less effective. .246/.347/.393 line against him as a starter with a bad 1.44 K/BB ratio. From the pen .214/.260/.316 with a 6.8 K/BB. I think Burnes and Peralta end up with rotation spots and Woodruff sticks in the pen.
Balk
And there’s no way you’re getting madbum either lol, brewers are absolutely high thinking they’re getting a top starter for nothing! Keep looking for that ring. Madbum has more then one! Lol
BrewCrew1302
id give up alot for Kluber…not Bum
dray16
Who wouldn’t?!?!? Kluber has 3 years of control, not 1!
BrewCrew1302
yes yes more exclamation marks MAKE YOUR POINT LOUDER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Balk
How many rings does Kluber have? Lol, fools
mikeyst13
The numbers don’t really show him as a top starter anymore though. Giants fans are acting like they’re trying to trade for 2015 Bumgarner not the current version with 1 year of control.
bleacherbum
Do it Stearns
Padres r knocking on the door
Makes more sense to trade him at the mid-season trade deadline for both sides. Virtually every contender would like to add A dependable starter going into the postseason. The Giants should be able to get a larger haul. And if he’s regressed too much, no GM looks the fool for giving up too much at the start of the season.
jayfaraday
No way Stearns does this, as he shouldn’t. Burnes, Peralta, and Woodruff just have too high of a ceiling to just give up for a 1 year rental. Even if it’s madbum. I get he’s a hero in San Francisco, I just don’t think it’s worth the long term future.
g55s
How the Brewers going to beat LA, HOU, BOS, NY without adding? Because they are.
jayfaraday
Just have to depend and place trust into the younger guys. Let them develop into the pitchers that Stearns and the rest of the FO think they’re capable of.
kreevich
No! Don’t do it!
AllRiseForTheJudge
I’m not a fan of either team so I have absolutely no stake in this, but here’s my two cents reading some of this absolutely laughable comments:
Bumgarner is an absolute stud. Anyone who talks about his “injuries” as a reason to NOT trade for him or NOT pay a steep price for one of the best pitchers in the game should be banned from commenting in the future. Madison Bumgarner does not have an injury history, he had one freak accident where he was hit by a line drive and one dirtbike accident. Those are the only reasons he’s had a couple of down years in which he was still the lone bright spot on a terrible Giants team.
If his medicals check out – and there’s no indication they won’t – any team trading for him is going to have to give up a haul if they acquire him today, right now, no question about it. However, if the Giants hold him (and they have no reason not to) into the season and he’s pitching like the best starter in the game, any team that acquires him at the deadline is going to have to give up their #1 prospect and more.
I’m not saying Milwaukee should sell the farm to get Bumgarner, but they shouldn’t balk at giving up major league talent, either. Adding Bumgarner to that rotation, with how close they were to the WS last year, I think puts them over the top and makes them instant favorites as a Yankees fan. And guess what? If the Brewers are out of it come the deadline and Bumgarner is healthy and pitching like an ace again, they can flip him to ANY contender for a monster return.
Think of what Boston, the Yankees, the Dodgers, Astros or more importantly, the Braves, would give up for arguably the best pitcher in baseball, fully healthy and putting up Cy Young numbers. Rental or not, if Bumgarner is pitching like DeGrom did last year, Milwaukee gets two of Soroka, Anderson, Riley, Pache or Gohara for him from Atlanta, or a similar return from any other playoff-bound team.
That’s a big return to consider and there’s no reason to assume Bumgarner isn’t healthy.
simschifan
I agree with you. Milwaukee is one tor starter and especially him away from running away with the division. Give up who you need to get him. Hopefully they don’t but they should
mikeyst13
You’re still assuming that Bumgarner is an “absolute stud” when we haven’t seen those stud results in 2 seasons. Yes the injuries were fluke things, but just because his medicals may check out doesn’t mean a return in velocity or results. Plus add in that he’d be moving to the hitter friendly parks of the NL Central and pitching his home games in Miller instead of AT&T, and the Brewers need to show at least some restraint. I still think they should make the move if they can for a fair price, but they cant over-pay just for the sake of making a move either.
basebaIl1600
@Mikey Bumgarner managed around a 3.15 ERA in 2 seasons which he was rushed back to the big leagues from injury and really should have taken extra rehab stints. That is still very dominant.
mpmks
I think the return on trading him before the season starts would be beneficial to all as the team getting Madison would get the chance to extend a qualifying offer and get a draft pick recovery if rejected. If they acquire him during the season that opportunity is lost
neurogame
There’s only one year left on MadBum’s contract. The Giants should just wait until the Trade Deadline to deal because teams looking to get over the top will be a little more desperate. Bumgarner probably likes playing for SF anyways so they could try and sign him after the season.
Phattey
I pray to god we don’t trade Freddy he’s a goonie
Rich Hill’s Elbow
Woodruff or Burnes, that’s a close one…
If it were my decision, I’d offer Burnes, Ray, and Lutz.
BrewCrew1302
no
Tim Newport
Do these teams…and a bunch of commenters…realize that Doug Melvin is no longer the GM in Milwaukee?
Boogaloo
And what would your offer be?
aussiegiants53
I’d take that! Add in Houser and we will add in Watson
zak1993
What would it take for the Pirates to acquire Bumgarner and Crawford in a package? Don’t imagine either of them would take a top 100 prospect. I’d say anyone not named Hayes or Keller is fair game
aussiegiants53
Crawford has a full no trade and I can’t see him at all waving it, not with a few more years on his contract
Boogaloo
Brewer fans acting like they are getting him cheap because he’s got one year left are crazy.
Any team that knows if they trade for him and he leaves at least recoups a comp pick, which teams value.
Or gives them better chance at signing him longterm.
And there will be no shortage of teams looking to get him.
The Astros need another starter.
Can never rule out boston.
Phillies, Braves or Washington all want to win now and have the pieces to get it done.
Then once the Yankees get involved, the price is going way up.
They have always wanted him desperately and could care less that hes got a year left.
What would the Brewers do if the Yankees offered Andujar and a couple pitching prospects?
The Brewers should stop haggling and give up the extra player now before the big boys get involved.
This could be there best chance to win.
Or try and low ball and lose, again
Tim Newport
If the Yankees made that offer, the Brewers would immediately call Cashman and try to rob him too, knowing full well that he must be losing his marbles.
Boogaloo
And the Brewers have a pitcher like bumgarner to give the yankees?
If they do im sure hed listen.
Marytown1
Why would bidding go way up if the Yankees get involved—they aren’t bidding on a free agent. Bidding for a trade goes up by having more bidders (especially ones with trade chips). Milwaukee can’t afford big contract pitchers, that makes the controllable ones we have that much more important. As a brewer fan, I’ll pass on this rediculous ask. We can upgrade at 2nd and maybe sneak in on a catcher later in the offseason on top of bringing Miley back. Not saying I don’t like Madbum, just saying that’s too much of an ask for the way the Brewers operate and I’m good with that.
mkeyankee
96 wins and one game short of the WS with a genius GM who was #2 in designing the Astros and just engineered one of the quickest rebuild turn-arounds in mlb history. Think, milwaukee will be fine if they choose to walk away.
Bum on the other hand has 2+ years of decreasing velocity. Good chance that continues and he nets far-less at the deadline.
pdxbrewcrew
And Giants fans are acting like Giants are going to get every good prospect.because Bumgarner won a World Series 5 years ago.
One good prospect, one okay prospect, one lottery ticket (maybe). That’s it.
Oh, and low ball or high ball, trade for Bumgarner or not, it still means the Giants finish in last while the Brewers are contending.
ShieldF123
Yankees do not need another Lefty starter and already passed on the Giants ridiculous price tag last season.
Bumgarner is coming off 2 seasons under 130 IP, career worst BB/9 and worst K/9 since his rookie year.
Giants fans need to wake up and realize he isnt the same ace
Danthemilwfan
Take peralta. He’s destined for a bullpen role with that fastball and nothing else
Vizionaire
i would rather keep those young pitchers.
g55s
I”m sure the Astros fans are screaming “I wish we had our prospects back instead of trading for Verlander!”
deweybelongsinthehall
Not the same as JV had regained his form and it was not just one season. Houston’s decision wasn’t the prospects they gave up as much as it was a huge financial commitment they took on.
bobtillman
Pretty interesting quandary, no? SF doesn’t HAVE to trade Bum….they obviously have the money to keep him. OTOH, they’re not going to win anything BECAUSE they have Bum. OTOH, trading him could produce some pieces toward the next Giants’ competitive team.
Other factors: he’ll be pitching his butt off in a contract year…..Brewers are more committed to multi-inning interchangeable pitchers than “starters”, per se….the contract, which barely touches SF’s revenues, dents the Brewers’……
Probably the most interesting thing to follow this month……My guess? They keep him till the deadline…..
ChiSoxCity
Bumgarner’s done, I wouldn’t do this if I were Milwaukee.
Balk
Hahahahahahahahaa!! Coming from a Sox fan!? Bumgarner is better then any pitcher in your rotation and 80% of the league! Stupid comment
ChiSoxCity
Yeah? Then Keep him.
ChiSoxCity
Michael Kopech is the future of our rotation, and is better than Madbum right NOW.
Ry.the.Stunner
He had a 3.26 ERA in 2018. I don’t know what give you the indication that he is “done”.
tweeter02
I’d rather see them go after Kluber than Madbaum. Especially if they would have to give up top talent. Heck the Indians want to get out of Kipnis’ contract, throw him in too. Kill two birds with one stone. Ace and a one year second baseman stopgap for Hiura.
mikeyst13
With Kluber you’re talking 17 mil next year, 17.5 in 2020 and 18 in 2021, plus then adding Kipnis in this situation. Not sure Milwaukee is willing to take on that kind of payroll at this point.
Bruin1012
The other problem with that scenario Kluber is going to cost a lot more then just Hiura.
Rich Hill’s Elbow
Bumgarner is still a really good pitcher, so I don’t get why some think Farhan is just gonna give him away for free. The 1/2 a season argument makes sense, but one full year of MadBum is very valuable and should be treated as such. At the same time, Farhan shouldn’t overvalue him to the extend that Miami values Realmuto because there’s always that chance of (even more) regression. Simply put, if Burnes and Ray are on the table, pull the trigger (anything more is a bonus).
ChiSoxCity
Then keep him.
talking baseball
FOR THE LAST TIME !!,
Crawford and Posey have
NO TRADE clauses in there contracts. Quit trying to trade them.
Balk
Lol! True that! They are lifers!
24TheKid
So did Cano and Segura, and the Mariners were in a better place than the Giants are.
Balk
Bottom line is this article is a bunch of NOTHING! The Brewers aren’t going to get Bumgarner!
aussiegiants53
Alright let’s up the ante then, Burnes, Ray, Lutz, Houser and Brown for MadBum, Watson and Smith…
claude raymond
PUHLEEEZE stop with the reactions to Morosi’s story!
Listen, take his original story and every time the brewers team is referenced replace the team with another team. Then take that other teams top prospects and sub those names in for the brewers’ prospects names and the story will be true.
Several teams have had trade talks regarding Bum and the Giants r overasking for that teams prospects. You all think this only pertains to the brewers??
Here, do this:
The (name a team) are having discussions with the Giants about trading for Madison Bumgarner. The Giants are asking for (name a prospect of said team) or for ( name another prospect) and the asking price may be too high for the (named team).
Everything else morosi wrote every one of us on these posts could have written a story.
He’s done this before. Google “morosi article false alarm”.
Trust Henry Schulman of the sf chronicle for giants stories. Morosi got what he wanted. ATTENTION. The dud is a hack
derail76
As a Dodgers fan, I’m actually hoping Farhan keeps MadBum around. Kershaw vs. Bumgarner is about as good as it gets for me, as a fan. I’d be kind of sad to see him go.
Vanilla Good
Wouldn’t you rather see that matchup in the NLCS?
SFGiants74
Based on MiLB Pipeline Scouting assessments, and players productions, MadBum will not end up in Milwaukee. The Giants DFAd a player similar to Brewers second best minor leaguer. I don’t think the Giants are looking minor leaguer.
pdxbrewcrew
There’s a bit of a difference between a 30 year-old nine years removed from being drafted and a 24 year-old 3 years from his draft.
JayBiz33
Between 2013-2015 everyone said justin verlander was done. Would u like him on your team today? I look at bumgarner in the same light that I look at V. Two guys that are tallying HOF arguments (2014 Ws). Do not take folks lightly.
pdxbrewcrew
Yes, most every team would want Bumgarner for the coming season. But few, if any, will give multiple top prospects for a one-year rental. And that’s something Giants fans commenting here don’t seem to get.
ChiSoxCity
The Giants simply want to dump Madbum’s salary and get some prospects in return. Then they can try to sign a big free agent. Nothing wrong with that, except Madbum isn’t the same Madbum he was five years ago. If he were, the Giants would be trying to extend him. Additionally, the Giants want top prospects for him—ain’t happening, it just doesn’t make sense from a financial prospective for any team who might want him.
atuck_sfg
Dump what salary? He’s making $12mil this season, trading him isn’t a salary dump. As you said, trading him is to get prospects, but it is in no way to dump his salary. There’s probably at LEAST 30 other pitchers out there that are worse than him and make more than him. Any team would muster up 12 mil for a pitcher like him. Here’s the problem the giants have, the farm system is weak, they need to improve it, Bum’s stock is a little low right now but most people that comment here don’t watch all of his starts or follow the Giants that closely and get to see he still has the stuff to be elite. His issue last season was he wasn’t locating well. Velocity drop doesn’t help obviously, but he was leaving too many pitches over the middle of the plate, which is something he can work on. Additionally everyone throws out “injury prone”, give me a break, two freak accident injuries, not like he needs TJ surgery or pulls a hammy every couple months. GM’s will use the “injury and loss of velocity” leverage, as they should, but there’s a reason every single team in baseball would want him. They know what he can do and know the animal that comes out in the playoffs. Give him a season where he doesn’t have to start the season off with physical therapy and a rehab assignment and see if he still has it, which I guarantee he does. The giants aren’t in a spot to contend, so why would you resign/extend someone to, for example, a 7-8 year deal so that when you are ready to contend in 3-5 years, that ace you extended is in the latter half of his career? That makes no sense for the giants. I would love for the giants to keep him and extend him, he is an SF Giants legend, but in reality it makes very little sense. So, instead of losing him to free agency, the giants are looking to get SOMETHING for losing him rather than nothing. The problem is nowadays teams covet prospects so highly, and for good reason, but it’s a lot harder for teams to trade for a rental than it used to be. But, to say it doesn’t make sense financially is not true, it’s whether a team trading for him is looking to win in the short term or long term because there is no guarantee in resigning someone. It has nothing to do with financial’s and has everything to do with short term or long term success. It’s also up to the GM on how to write up the proposed extension, whether to tack on the mass of the salary early and have it taper off in later years or the other way around, which a lot of the contracts that get more expensive later on are the ones that are hurting teams nowadays. The Giants know what they want/need, unfortunately all the other teams have the leverage at the moment, I just hope MadBum shows them he’s still an elite pitcher when the season starts. It’s gonna be a painful rebuild, but it worked out very well last time the team went through it. All I can say to finish this off is… Go Giants!
pdxbrewcrew
Go Paragraphs!