The Padres, owners of one 90-win season in the last two decades, remain mired in the latest iteration of what has amounted, over the club’s 50-year history, to something approximating a near-interminable rebuild. This time, though, the club hasn’t taken half-measures, having carefully assembled a lot of prospects to rival any in the game’s history: indeed, by FanGraphs’ latest count, San Diego has a staggering 46 players who project to be major league contributors of some sort, including eight of the game’s top 75 prospects.
The major league team, though, has yet to reap the benefits. Highly touted outfielders Hunter Renfroe and Manuel Margot have graduated and quickly sputtered in their first exposures, and the club’s recent mound graduates, with the possible exception of the “churve”-hurling Joey Lucchesi, seem more of the back-end variety. The richly-paid duo of Wil Myers and Eric Hosmer has also failed to impress, with the latter riding his grounder-heavy ways to a near-replacement-level season for the fourth time in seven years, and the former posting a combined 2.3 fWAR since signing a huge extension prior to the 2017 season.
Holes abound elsewhere on the diamond: Myers, at midseason, tried his hand at third, to mostly disastrous results, and the club received meager-at-best production up the middle (though blue-chip prospects Fernando Tatis Jr. and Luis Urias are knocking loudly at the door). Franmil Reyes did open eyes in limited ’18 action, but he hardly seems suited for a corner-outfield spot, and his minor league numbers, in six seasons before last season’s AAA breakout, leave little by which to be encouraged (ditto Franchy Cordero). Catcher remains an issue, though Austin Hedges did show signs in the season’s second half.
On the mound, the club can hang its hat only on its always-stellar bullpen, with Kirby Yates, Craig Stammen, Jose Castillo, and Matt Strahm (who seems ticketed for a rotation audition in the Spring) all posting brilliant seasons in 2018. The rotation, apart from Robbie Erlin and his microscopic walk rate, was generally awful last season. Lucchesi led the charge with just 1.1 fWAR, while the rest of his rotation mates combined for a sickly 3.0 fWAR altogether. In short, it’s a team that could use an upgrade at very nearly every position on the diamond.
Still, the bleakness of the near-future outlook apparently hasn’t dissuaded the Front Office from scouring the trade market for major, short-term upgrades – in the last two months alone, the club has reportedly targeted Corey Kluber (link), Noah Syndergaard (link), J.T. Realmuto (link), and Marcus Stroman (link), among surely others. Two of the four have exactly three years of control remaining (with Realmuto and Stroman having just two), but the Padres would be seem to be paying an unnecessary premium on the stars to contribute in 2019 and 2020, years in which the club has seemingly little chance to compete.
Does this strategy make sense? Could the big-league ready prospects couple with the bonafide stars to form a legitimate contender in the next two seasons? Or would the club be best-served to wait, see how their current crop progresses in the upcoming season, and re-evaluate in a year from now? Pick your answer in the poll below.
First line is great
Lol
This seems like an unnecessary hit piece.
The truth hurts
The dude trips over himself trying to come up with a clever way to bash the Team. 4 commas and as many big words as he can find…. all to say that this club hasn’t won much and is currently rebuilding. Good job Ty, thank you for showing us you found a thesaurus at mom’s house over the holidays. Now please find the book that shows you how to use all those big words in a cohesive sentence
Except for his over-dependence on WAR as a stat, was he wrong? Not really.
And yes, the truth hurts.
The twins have 5 above 90!
It’s false
Two 90 win seasons
It’s not 2019 yet
Yes, they will be agressive. No, they aren’t going to win the division until 2020 at least. They should stockpile on pitching though.
they wont be good until after 2025 if then . They don’t draft well , don’t develop players. they have lots of below average minor league players.. Try to act like they are in all free agents and trades , but they aren’t it just show they don’t sign any body that not cheap.
They have two of the leagues top prospects in Tatis and Gore to build around and then they only need a few of there other twelve or so borderline top 100 prospects to pan out. If 2020 isn’t their year, 2021 definitely will be.
If all you needed was Two top players the nats would have won 5 WS by now
How have Buxton and Sano worked out for the Twins? Moncada for the ChiSox? And on and on …
We can’t keep defending our team just because we have prospects. Until they show they can produce in the Big Leagues, they are meaningless to our success.
It’s a little early to be writing off Buxton, Sano and Moncada but your point is well taken.
You are believing the hype.
And that is ok. Hope is important when there can be only 1 champ.
All fans must have it.
I read that tatis may be moved from ss so he better be a day one hitter. I’m not sure where i read that so when you ask keep that mind. Personally id bet they trade tatis cuz it seems he is the most hyped.
Absolutely no chance Tatis is traded. He is the center of this rebuild.
Padres have a hole at 3rd base too so if he does have to move there it isn’t nearly the end of the world. It just means they have to find a SS rather than having to find a 3rd baseman.
Silly. Of course their is a chance Tatis gets traded. Unlikely yes but Tatis is not untouchable
.001% – so you’re saying there’s a chance!
Have seen several comments on this board with the draft results showing that the Padres are above average at drafting. They had 2 guys from the 2016 draft starting and putting up league average numbers last season, so that shows Preller knows how to draft. If they are good enough to be in the majors that fast and play as good as the average MLB starter as rookies that reflects very highly on the guy that drafted them.
Who, besides Lucchesi, put up league average numbers last season?
Which two guys?
He was referring to Eric Lauer and Joey Lucchesi. But it’s only really true in Lucchesi’s case.
If everything goes right, any team, even the Orioles, can contend in like 2023.
GM has so many chips to play with, in that #1 farm
Feels like they can get anyone, but prob end up with Gray
Gray is the only one they should be in on. Makes no sense to go get a top arm with little control for a rebuilding team. Anyone they get should be because they’re buying low with the intention to flip (if it’s a rental) or has 4+ years of control.
Nailed it
Astros took 3 years to make the playoffs after starting their rebuild under Luhnow. The Cubs took 3 years to make the playoffs after starting their rebuild under Epstein. So why would it take the Padres longer?
Because while Preller’s rebuild has been three years, feels like Padres have been in perpetual rebuild, they don’t get the benefit of the doubt.
I think 2020 is a conservative estimate.
For one, not every team that undergoes a full scale rebuild will take exactly 3 years. For two, Preller mostly targeted younger guys with more upside.
That’s completely moronic to use other teams as baselines for a time frame. How long will the reds rebuild take? They’d already be past due by your barometer. You need to look at your teams roster and assess the situation. This current pads team is far too flawed to start moving top prospects for short term gain.
Because those teams never gave guys,like Hosmer stupid money during their rebuilds.
Jason Heyward says hello. Yu Darvish says hi. Each owed more than $100MM+
Astros are cheap… 2 SP and Gonzalez walking.
“During their rebuilds”
The Cubs made the playoffs the season before they signed Heyward.
Wanna try again?
No way! Gonna quit while I’m ahead.
With the benefit of Hindsight, stupid money though, shouldn’t matter when. I believe in a Darvish rebound more, and believe Darvish was signed at a discount due to WS at the time
Astros are trying to maximize their contention window. I have no issue with them letting Keuchel go for his ask and replacing Marwin for Brantley is a gain IMO. Losing Marwin will hurt if Correa or Altuve goes down but if everyone is in good health there’s no doubt I’d rather have Brantley as my everyday LF. Letting Morton go was the only thing I’d have a complaint about but they may know something we all don’t know about him considering they didn’t even extend a QO. This FO has certainly earned the benefit of the doubt.
No, they took longer than that. They started their rebuild in 2010 and promply put up 3 hundred loss seasons in a row and had there first winning season 2015.
Because the teams have different players at different levels of readiness? Was this a serious question?
Your inability to read or choice to ignore context says hello.
“It shouldn’t matter when”, yeah…just ignore what was actually stated because that gets in the way of your narrative. What a stupid comment.
Edwin Jackson. 4 yr 52mm.
It’s only been two years
And the cubs and gm Astros took a long time
Because neither of those teams wildly overspent for mediocre first basemen to build around. I don;t think they know how to get past the prospect collection stage.
@ bhambrave;
B I N G O
Preller’s background has been in acquiring prospects. Jon Daniels made the ML decisions, and Ron Washington – known for developing players long before the Rangers hired him – and his staff brought them along.
Preller’s actions with the Padres regarding anything but accumulating prospects have be downright awful. His aborted contention run his first year had agents and GM’s lining up to rip him off. The Shields contract finally expired. Kemp and his contract seem to be traded every year as a salary dump. While Trea Turner has some holes in his game, the Padres have nothing to compare to him @ SS (talk of Tatis, Jr. moving to 3B has already begun). And their are others……
Then we get to the Myers and Hosmer contracts. Why? Why so long? Why so much? I like both players. Think they’re decent and in the right situation can help a team win. But they are not cornerstone centerpiece pieces.
Preller’s comfort zone is as a prospect recruiter (he barley squeaked by a Commissioners Office investigation of his tactics while with the Rangers). Making him the head of Baseball Ops is ‘The Peter Principle’ – promoting an employee to his level of incompetence.
Great post. Great column.
The padres farm is so deep they could trade for kluber and still be number 1 by a wide margin.
Knowthemarket —
You might want to review when Luhnow took over, why he was hired, and what their stated goals were. Their full-on rebuild did not start in 2010.
redrooster: Great point. The Cubs prioritized drafting advanced college bats under Theo’s rebuild and also had an owner willing to step up big time with FA’s including SP Jon Lester which expedited their window to compete. The front office also made some astute trades during the rebuild, none more important than landing Jake Arrieta and Pedro Strop from the Orioles who blossomed under former pitching coach Chris Bosio.
Jason Heyward says hello??? Cubs went to the NLCS in 2015 without Heyward. So why is he saying hello and to whom?
3 years is not a long time
Double BINGO
Outinleftfield —
Based on the popularity of yor post, it would seem there are some who fear the truth. Effing sad.
Using your burner accounts to parrot your comments again eh?
Gray has one year of control. Why does one year of control make sense, but 2 (Realmuto, Stroman) or 3 (Kluber, Thor) doesn’t?
If they already have the best farm system, why would they need to flip players they trade for or sign for more prospects? Are those prospects going to be better than Tatis, or Mejia, or Urias, or Gore, or Paddack, or any of their top 10-12 prospects? Probably not. So why do that?
Gray won’t cost much of anything. Best the Yankees can expect from him is a couple of low level prospects. Guys not even on a farm system like the Padres top 30.
I got eaten alive by Yankee fans when I said Gray would not net them one of our top 10 prospects. They legit thought they were getting a package of Buddy Reed and Paddack.
“Hey, you originally got Chris Paddack for two months of a 39 y/o reliever! You should consider it an honor to get a full season of a guy who is 10 years younger and can actually start for him!”
Baseball fans: “Padres are a$$holes for stealing Tatis from White Sox.” Also Baseball Fans: “Cubs and Nats age geniuses for trading for Rizzo and Turner. Padres are Morons.”
Padres just cant evaluate or coach talent. It shows there farm is always top yet mlb club sees few results.
The Padres should quit being so cheap and incompetent. The GM is a cheater. No matter who they get or whatever they get the results stay the same. The only professional team in the 7th largest city. They should be selling out on most nights. It’s been mostly like this for 49years except for a few years.
He’s a cheater? You know it’s been almost 3 years since the Pomeranz thing. We can probably all move on now.
I have never heard a baseball fan say that about the Tatis trade. More like Tatis was a lottery ticket that the Padres luckily hit big on.
They haven’t cashed in yet dude hasn’t played game. Preller suspended by MLB not once but twice. Once with Texas Rangers.
why do u thing most teams wont trade with Padres.. They don’t trust them, most teams would have fire the GM and most of the people that were in on the big lies and cheating.
@ imindless;
……and how does that inexperienced manager fit?
Hahaha
Paddack pitched two months and then had Tommy John surgery. Even trade?
Oh boo hoo. You gonna cry now? Show me the baseball fan posts calling your poor baby Padres names for trading for Tatis. What a pathetic comment.
And yes the Cubs and Nats were geniuses for trading for Rizzo and Turner. Go cry to your momma now.
Because no baseball fan every said that about the Tatis trade. He was just a crybaby
Knowthemarket —
Yeah, he’s a cheatwr. Deal with it.
1) Suspended by MLB while with the Rangers for breaking rules regarding international prospects. Reduced from one year. He was an Asst. GM.
2) Suspended by MLB for keeping dual sets of medical records. As a GM.
3) Got the Padres fined by MLB for illegal workouts with international prospects and expenses to families. As the GM.
The guy thinks he’s above the rules. He has no ethics or integrity. And other GMs know it.
Next.
“7th largest city”; it is metro region that drives the revenue. I live in San Francisco, the country’s eigth largest metropolitan region but only 700k live in San Francisco proper. By metro region, San Diego is in the mid-20s.
Just FYI – it’s called an MSA: Metropolitan Statistical Area. And it’s mostly about area of influence and media reach.
AHahaaaaa!
If the Yankees were selling Gray cheap, he’d already be gone.
Now with the CC heart news, there is talk back East here, that if the Yankees don’t get what they want for Gray, they may keep him as insurance for CC.
Eventually, he may go, but probably in the July-Aug timeframe when teams are looking for that one piece to make it to the promised land.
While the Padres farm system is stocked, don’t get too cocky with that 1 90 win season in 20 years hanging over your head as fans….low level prospects indeed!
If the Pad’s don’t wish to meet the Yankees price, then so be it but don’t think Cashman is going to give him away for a bucket of balls as you suggest!
Good. Keep him. So Cashman has to eat crow and humble himself. And you’re not getting a top 100 prospect for him. Moron.
The Yankees may not want to sell Gray cheap but of other teams won’t pay your price then your stuck with what you have. They don’t dictate his market. Carrying a guy you can’t pitch in your home park is probably not the best use of a roster spot either. Cashman can play hard ball til he can’t anymore.
Man I hate the Yankees. They trade nobody without getting top prospects in return, and get your best player without giving up their own top prospects. Somebody stick it to Cashman for once! Let him hold gray all season.
Moron….well I seem to have gotten your goat…how’s it feel to always root for a loser of a team that couldn’t find a way to the playoffs if they were the only team playing.
Maybe you. should humble yourself jackass!
Each and every years stands for itself…for all the Yankees know he could turn right around and contend fo the Cy Young award!
The Padres are the ones keeping these rumors alive not the Yankees!
Funny how all this non-interest in Gray has sparked a firestorm of opinion by the usual armchair GM’s.
The Yankees aren’t “stuck” with anything…..its a hardball league buddy…and sooner or later somebody will blink!
Winning always brings about jealousy and the Yankees find a way pretty much all the time.
The reason there’s a firestorm is all these obnoxious Yankee fans trying to turn the screw thinking Gray is Pedro Martinez and asking for the moon in the comment boards, even though he’s a total bust, is in his free agent year, and hasn’t been good in three years.
Yankee fans are going to be disappointed in Gray’s return. Don’t expect a great return for a one year expensive average, at best, pitcher. You will get a prospect in the 20 – 30 of a team’s prospect at the best. You will not get a top prospect..
He will be gone and he will be cheap. Chapman has no leverage. He said that he will trade Gray and Gray sucked last season. What do you get for guys with 5 ERAs? Not much.
When did we last see a WS celebration parade in the Bronx?
They would not trade Andrew Miller or Chapman without getting top prospects back. Who would?
But you say they trade no one without getting top prospects back?
In the last year they traded Chase Headley for no one. Adam Warren for no one and Ronald Torreyes for no one.
So much for your theory.
Oh yea they can get a too 100 prospect for Gray. Maybe not from the Padres, after all Preller is not the most astute trader out there, but why call Rocky names and insult him when he simply was schooling you on baseball knowledge?
Boy Cubbluey has a mancrush on Cashman. Is he your idol?
You weren’t going to clear Headleys leftover money AND get a top 100 prospect. You moron.
I really doubt that Yankees will get a top 100 prospect for Gray. They may want one, but they won’t get one. Gray has only one year of control. At that price he will stay a Yankee.
Your #30 prospect is likely a utility infielder or more likely a future 40 man crunch candidate. I mean seriously we don’t need to overvalue all our prospects here. The Yanks can get a guy in the padres top 30.
Gray posted a 4.90 ERA in 2018, is one year out from free agency and will make ~$9m during that one year. I think I’d take Owen Miller over him. There are others fix-and-flip type pitchers the Padres could get for less money and no prospects.
A future MI with no power and can’t steal bags. Textbook utility man. I’ll give him up for Gray any day of the week. You have to give something. It’s buying low not taking for free here. I’m not grays biggest fan but if guys like Matt Harvey get 1/11 (1/14) he has a sliver of value. Textbook bounce back candidate. If it works then you can turn your Owen Miller investment into a whole lot more. If not what did you lose? A utility man for 2021? I can stomach that.
Again, considering the fact that he’s making $9m this season and then leaves as a free agent, there are better bounceback options available that wouldn’t even cost Owen Miller.
I disagree on better bounce back candidates. No one has Gray’s upside in the FA market and Harvey’s deal already showed you what teams are paying for “upside” The perennially injured Cahill got more than that.
Those guys also cost zero prospects
Okay, but one year of a player doesn’t typically get a top 100 guy. Machado barely got that from the Dodgers. Granted it was for 3 months but its Machado.
Gray may have some upside yet but it strikes me as a no.3 kind of upside for just one season that you have to cross your fingers for.
If I were the Padres and the Yankees don’t settle for a package around Reed or Nix then you just walk away and go sign Gio Gonzalez because the price is too high for a pitcher may pitch just as well as Gio.
Reed or Nix is way too much for Gray.
Orioles also got Dean Kremer for Machado. He’ll be top 100 at the midseason re-ranking.
They aren’t even top 100 prospects.
So? Gray is worth a lottery ticket at best.
why do u thing most teams wont trade with Padres.. They don’t trust them, most teams would have fire the GM and most of the people that were in on the big lies and cheating.
Padres literally just traded with the Indians cubs and red Sox a month ago clearing 40 man spots. Lol. Yeah teams dont want to trade with the Padres, why wick lockett and brewer got traded last month. Cause nobody wanted to trade with the padres.
Yeah I mean I’m an O’s fans but that’s a little bit of a stretch on Kremer. Every publication I’ve seen has him as our 4th or lower best pitching prospect. Behind guys like Luis Ortiz, Grayson Rodriguez, Dl Hall,Dillon Tate, and Keegan Akin. MLB.com has him below Hunter Harvey as well. I think he’s our 3rd best pitching prospect behind Hall and Rodriguez personally but that’s nothing but speculation if you’re putting Kremer up that high.
They probably can. I think that is the point. Most Yankee fans are idiots thinking teams like the Padres will give 55-60 FV prospects for a guy that had a 5 ERA last season. The Yankees may get a 45 FV prospect. For the Padres, those guys are from 21-30. For the Yankees that is Adams or Perreira at 12-13. We have got to be realistic about what 4.90 ERA pitchers are worth.
That is what Gray is worth. Miller is a 45 Fv prospect that tore up low A baseball with a .850 OPS. He is a comparable or slightly better prospect than Estrada who is #15 for the Yankees.
You don’t get much for guys that have put up an ERA around 5 in 2 of the last 3 seasons, a 4.59 ERA overall for those 3 seasons, and a 4.90 ERA last season.
baseball-reference.com/players/g/grayso01.shtml#20…
I think the Yankees could get a guy like Lawson, Olivares, or Miller from the Padres system. Lottery tickets. Not much more.
Alex Cobb?
Trading relievers on the fringe of the 40-man roster for org fillers when you need their roster spots to protect prospects from the Rule 5 draft? That’s barely a half-step above waiver claims. Let’s see Preller trade for impact players/prospects without having to comically overpay before we start running around saying other GM’s aren’t reluctant to trade with him.
Gray has never pitched as well as Harvey.
I know it’s speculation. Being Jewish myself I’m partial towards Kremer but the talent is there regardless.
Miller was a third round pick, #84. The 2011 pick who was #85 was shortstop Nick Ahmed. That’s the equivalent, and decidedly not a utilityman. Maybe that’s what the Yankees pick in the third round, but the Padres pick higher.
It’s almost hard not to laugh at what you just said. Mark Appel was the #1 overall pick and he’s not playing baseball. If you wanna stick close to home Matt Bush was your #1 pick. That means absolutely nothing. Miller is more likely a utilityman than a starter. If that upsets you I’m sorry it’s just a fact.
Stating a prediction and then proceeding to call it a fact. It’s almost hard not to laugh at what you just said…
Angry pads fan…. it’s alright. Not really my guy. It’s called a scouting report. If you read it it would Suggest all those things. Let me ask you how many guys play on a major league team? At last check it was 25. For some reason we consider a #30 prospect to be of some kind of consequence. But hey you and Zo up there like the logic that Nick Ahmed was the #84 pick so that must mean Miller= Nick ahmed.. if that’s the kind of logic you wanna use you go right ahead but don’t say anything to me.
SixFlags —
Welcome to the Padres fan base.
Oh, I know about scouting reports. I know that Miller is not a top prospect for a reason and he will likely end up a utility guy if he makes the bigs. It’s just that throwing around “facts” that are being based on what people think/suggest is going to happen gets annoying. Basically, speaking in absolutes gets old. Many fans (Padres fans and other teams as well) think like this and it gets tiring having to read it.
I didn’t even speak in absolutes I said it’s more likely he’s a utility man than a starter. That’s just the reality of the situation. No definite answer.
You might want to ask Larry48 where that top farm came from, if they don’t draft well and can’t develop players. There seem to be a lot of fans who don’t know much about the Padres except what they were 5-10 years ago under previous ownership.
We’ve had top farms before. 2012, for example. In 2014, when Preller took over, were ranked from 3-6, depending on your ranking of choice.
That farm ranking was deep but it was noted at the time, right here, that there were no stars or potential stars. The previous ownership went with high floor players, but wouldn’t risk a high ceiling pick who might wash out. Preller goes for the highest ceiling players available.
The farm rankings may be similar, but the owners who bought out John Moores after Jeff Moorad couldn’t get approved by MLB know you can’t win a championship with journeymen.
A ranking is a ranking. Rationalizing it away doesn’t make it any more or less valuable than this year’s ranking. Unless you’re willing to admit they are all arbitrary and meaningless?
The padres, like the Twins, I would guess have the same philosophy as the majority of teams in the MLB: why spend when you can sell mediocrity on the field. Let the public pay for the stadiums and smile all the way to the bank.
Well… my LOL was originally a response to another comment, which has disappeared.
As far as off season approach, all I can hope for is that they don’t make any more Hosmer style moves. If they deal prospects, it has to be for players they can control when they’re competitive. And here’s a hint: that’s NOT next year. So deal accordingly. Don’t deal Tatis or Gore for somebody with 2 years of control. That makes no sense. I’m can’t believe they’re even discussing JTR. That makes absolutely no sense.
seems premature and unwise to send out top level prospects who could contribute relatively soon to the big league club within a couple of years. no need to bring in anything more impressive than Gray in 2019. Timing isn’t right. Next year perhaps if the young guys are showing the potential to form a core that can rival other NL west teams.
When you are a bad team like Padres other teams are not going to help you. That means you will have to over pay for good players. They want you to continue to not know what you have. Trad, e good players and won’t trade poor players and lie and say you are in on all players but do nothing.
Being a bad team has nothing to do with it. Nobody is going to help a good team either. Players and prospects all have a perceived value, and that value may be different team to team. The Padres have a value for Gray, it’s maybe high or maybe low, but they will not exceed that with the values they’ve put on the prospects the Yankees may be asking for.
Expecting all of your prospects to become stars is a little unwise too. If you can get proven talent for an unproven prospect it can’t be a complete losing situation. And at some point the Padres have to start winning games. I also believe that Preller is capable of recouping value down the road if he needs to
Larry – enough already, we get it… you are grumpy. Hang in there, the Padres will win something again soon and you can wear your gear proudly again.
I agree that not all prospects pan out, but you also increase your odds of having a future star if you keep most of them. You don’t want to trade away the one future star in your system.
ex: Kluber
At the time Ludwick was a great return…
Kluber was not considered a top prospect. Fact.
I mean I knew San Diego had a good farm team, but this article makes it seem historic. I say we just get rid of the Major League team and work on improving our farm team. It is a sight to behold and something every Padre fan can be proud of. Why set ourselves up for failure when we can be the best at underdeveloped prospects?
We will screw this up somehow
Most of Padres minor players will fail or get hurt. That a fact less then 50 % will make it and only 5 % will be above average at ML level. Padres have zero above average players that have came up in there system. I don’t see that changing.
hillarytrup16 —
The truth of your post is somehow disheartening and refreshing at the same time. Sort of like reality. Kudos.
While it certainly isn’t “their time”, the division is weakening, the years of control are appealing, and the idea of adding an impact player to boost moral/drive/competitive spirit is real.
A guy like Kluber walking through the doors at spring training would probably pay dividends for these prospects
Hen — Agree. You know what else would help? A time machine.
Why? Chances are the wouldn’t have kluber right now anyways. He would have still been traded off.
It was a joke, you know, ha ha ha ha! Padres fans are soooooo serious. I guess that’s what happens when the last big game was game 163 against the Rockies about, what, 11 years ago?
Normal fan — yeah, I could use a time machine. So many mistakes. Ha!
Padres fan — Oh no, a time machine, well, uh, umm, uh, uh, ummmm, we’d just uh ummm, I can’t handle this. Was he being serious? I don’t know. I can’t tell. I better down vote. I’m freaking out.
That was also a joke, for I am a Padres fan, now and forever more.
What about 2010 game 162 vs. the Giants?
I thought about that but the momentum had already fizzled. That ten game losing streak kind of showed the inevitable. And I think the Padres were like 3 back with 3 to play, weren’t they? They did lead the division for 148 games that year if I remember correctly, but I wouldn’t call the last game meaningful. They needed outside magic to win the division. I don’t remember anyone thinking they had a chance with three to go.
3 back of the Giants with 3 to play. Won the first 2. Had their best starter on the mound for game 3. Would have made the playoffs if either they won or the Braves lost.
Naturally, they lost and the Braves won.
Okay, so a case can be made for 2010 but it lacked the energy and immediacy of 2007. In the end the Pads lost both times. Maybe the better question is, when was the last time the Padres WON a game that was truly meaningful (I do not consider winning one game in the 2006 NLDS meaningful, especially since they were down 2-0)? Leaving aside important milestone games by Gwynn and Henderson and Hoffman, we have what, maybe winning game 6 in the 1998 NLCS?
Thank God Hillary didn’t make it 16, we’d all be socialist or commies
Huh? What does that have to do with baseball? I’ll bite. Hillary, a moderate Republican, is a socialist? When did this happen? Was it before or after her Reptilian transformation?
great point here Hen
At some point the Padres have to start making moves that lead to wins. Going after a TOR seems like a great start. Especially with all the good young arms they have coming up. Kluber would be a great mentor for Lucchesi and Lauer
Lauer has a lot of development left. He needs to be in AAA. He’s just not quite ready.
The issue with the Padres is the park they play in. No one except peak Adrian Gonzalez could hit there consistently. It has to be demoralizing for prospects who have had great success in the minors to play in that ballpark. Eric Hosmer is overrated, certainly, but to see a 1b get a seven-figure deal and then hit nothing, has to be shitty for not only the fan base, but for the other players on the team as well. Hey, at least they will never have a shortage of cheap 30-soemthing pitchers trying to turn their careers around.
Peak Adrian Gonzalez and every opposing team…
Nope. Check the park factors for the last few seasons. Petco Park was above the league average in runs. It’s not the park; it has played mostly fair since they brought the fences in years ago.
It’s not that big of a factor. AT&T is easily worse for hitters. With the winds of SF consistently blowing in, and that huge ballpark, hitting home runs is extremely hard. Yet the Giants have been to 4 WS and won 3 of them with that ballpark as their home.
Giants have been to 6 World Series since moving to SF.
Candlestick
I heard that they are thinking of renaming McCovey Cove to Muncy Cove.
From what I’ve read it seems rather obvious that Preller is well aware of where his team currently stands as far as talent is concerned. He knows they won’t be competing next year, but he has his eyes on cashing in some of his smaller chips for bigger fish so he can then turn and sell them at the deadline.
It’s been stated many times that he checks up on the price of virtually every player to get a feel for what the market price will be (why the Padres are involved in every rumor) and I’m rather certain he’s just trying to buy a big ticket player for 80 cents and sell them either at the deadline or next off-season for $1.20. He said himself he’s been frustrated with his lack of ability to get after some players that he could’ve turned into more minor league talent.
He also places an extreme premium on higher FV value players, so in the long run if he turns 5 FV 45 guys into 2 FV 55 guys in the process of buying say Kluber and then selling him he will be happy. (Obviously those numbers are just to make the point)
Ultimately this is potentially one of the most stacked systems ever seen in the history of baseball but its stacked with more quantity than quality, and I believe he’s just trying to use these players to up the quality of the prospects in the system rather than attempting to jump start the rebuild.
Of course some of the players he would have interest in keeping (Syndergaard being the main one) but I would be surprised if they bought a Stroman or a Realmuto without the express desire to flip them again for more advanced and higher FV prospects than the initial cost.
HE WOULDN’T BE ABLE TO FLIP REALMUTO FOR BETTER PROSPECTS!!!!!!!!!!!!! HIS TRADE VALUE RIGHT NOW IS THE HIGHEST IT WILL EVER BE!!!!!!!!!!
WCR, I think what he’s saying is trade some a quantity, say 4 of out of our lower end prospects to acquire JTR, then flip him for 2 higher quality prospects. OKAY??
1. Who’s WCR?
2. Realmuto isn’t being traded for 4 lower prospects. Especially not to the Padres.
He said it in all caps, so you know he’s serious, OKAY?
@chesteraarthur When they don’t read my comment the first half-dozen times I post it these things have to happen. JTR’s trade value can only go down from here. He’s a proven commodity. This summer he’ll be a proven commodity that is half a year closer to free agency.
I believe there is a potential to buy low on Stroman and flip him later. Even if buying low costs you say Logan Allen as the headliner for example. I believe he has upside that hasn’t been tapped into yet and he’s coming off a god awful season. There’s no way to do that for Realmuto. He has 2 years of control and his value is at a peak. It’s going to cost top guys and by the time you want to flip him you are almost assuredly going to get less in return. Unless JTR turns into an MVP candidate in SD like Yelich did there’s no shot for a net gain in prospects
By low, sell lower as being DFAd
I don’t think he’s concerned with getting back a better package, he can afford to lose value during the flip with how much is in the system.
It’s true that Realmuto won’t have higher trade value than this off season, but ultimately Preller is seeing that he could turn some less advanced less blue-chip prospects into higher FV prospects that are closer to the majors, or perhaps even a piece for the major league team itself.
It doesn’t matter if the package is technically lighter than the one he ships out if it means the players he gets back will contribute to the team in 2020 when they really want to make a push. That also allows him to aim for the highest FV player he can get in return. IE Anderson Espinoza and Fransisco Mejia, he could’ve gone for volume with those trades (that likely would have been more robust packages) but he waited to get a blue chipper and as soon as one was offered he jumped on it.
The last part is the key to all the bickering with both Indians & Marlins fans. If you want a better return just ask for less players and aim higher up the list.
If the teams want multiple players in return it’s just not going to be the top prospects. Hence why they get the Padres involved.. They have quantity to offer at every level. Both the Marlins & Indians have a history of rolling the dice on many youngsters over just the 1 top guy.
“If the teams want multiple players in return it’s just not going to be the top prospects.’
_ _
@ Swinging Friars;
Usually I agree with you. Not here. Kluber compares to Max Scherzer…….
o Both are 200 innings workhorses.
o Both have fronted quality pitching staffs for years.
o Both are multiple Cy Young Award winners.
o Both have stayed healthy in their careers.
o Scherzer is 2 years older.
o Both are signed for 3 more years – Scherzer due $108m-plus; Kluber due $52m-plus.
Now…….
Do you think the Nationals would trade Scherzer today for one top prospect or 1 close to a top prospect and 1 middling one?
From the younger age and half the salary due, it seems that Kluber would have higher trade value, no?
I agree with most of this. You picked one of the few pitchers who are clearly better than Kluber for your example though
Scherzer is a freak and definitely not on the market
I think if you are looking for an over pay….it’s more likely to be too many lower level guys. An MLB piece and a bunch of 40-45 FV kids
There’s so many flaws in that logic. You aren’t getting Realmuto for less sought after further away prospects and then dealing him later for Higher regarded closer prospects closer to the bigs. How does that make sense? Thats nothing but an excuse for a bad trade… You could simply trade those prospects for a guy who will help you in 2020 now. Why would you trade for realmuto as an intermediary step? You aren’t going to get Realmuto for a package of lesser quantity that is far away for the MLB anyway.
“I don’t think he’s concerned with getting back a better package, he can afford to lose value during the flip with how much is in the system.”
Yes he freaking is! The only way trading for a guy with the express purpose on flipping him in a year makes sense is if you think the guy’s trade value will be higher!
“It’s true that Realmuto won’t have higher trade value than this off season”
Then trading for him makes no sense! The Padres gain nothing, let me repeat, NOTHING by having JTR on the roster for 2019!
Jbig – He explains it perfectly. If Preller can trade away 4 lower ranked (FV) prospects and later get 1 higher ranked (FV) it’s a win. And getting to have that bat in your lineup while you figure things out is good plus
And why not think he can? The Padres have the farm set up for this. There is quantity at every level. If the Marlins are asking for young guns the Padres match up well.
Not my favorite move, but Preller has shown he can pull it off
JT Realmuto isn’t getting traded for 4 lower prospects dumba$$. And there is no value in having that bat in the lineup for 2019. If anything it’s a negative cuz it hurts their draft position.
Jbig – How can you make an assumption like this? There haven’t been any names leaked on the Padres side (JTR trade). zero
Preller just might have a plan.
Have you heard what Miami is asking? Is JTR not coming off a career year with his control only evaporating? I can use my brain and tell you what’s not going to happen. You are not going to acquire Realmuto and Use him for a season and acquire more from that. That’s nothing but blind luck and Homerism if you think that’s a realistic scenario. If your argument is that Preller doesn’t like some of his prospects then why wouldn’t he
A.) acquire a guy who will help the padres next winning team now instead of getting Realmuto as an intermediate step. Or
B.)Swap those prospects for other prospects like the cards and Mariners did for O’Neill and Gonzales.
Simple really. If Preller sees a path to a better team this way then he will go for it. And why not?
It wasn’t us Homers who posted the rumor. Maybe use your brain to go over the Padre farm and see for yourself? I don’t know, getting bitter at people trying to help explain this is useless
Also, when you check the farm…. You’ll notice several highly ranked catching prospects in the lower levels, a couple of years from the bigs. Just might line up with the future departure of JTR??? Maybe they don’t trust Mejia to play defense? Who really knows…. But there are many possible outcomes that don’t look horrible
Trading for Realmuto then later trading him for an inferior return isn’t going to better the team.
The Padres don’t have to trade for JT Realmuto for those other catching prospects to be able to pan out.
I don’t disagree with that at all
My best guess is this is all smoke created by the Marlins…..Or…. The Marlins would prefer 4 or 5 young lotto picks over the 1 stud and 1 top prospect approach
Also just want to see both sides argued. And trust in Preller *The man was able to trade Shields and recoup some value! I trust he can make something happen with the game’s best catcher
There’s just no argument because you can’t trade 4 lower level FV prospects for realmuto. That’s you wishing that is reality. The reality of the situation is you’d be giving up Mejia and lets say Allen. That’s the reality. Are you going to get a better prospect than that? If you don’t like Mejia benhind the plate swap him with a team who may. Call the Braves up about one of their pitchers or Austin Riley/Camargo. There’s no argument to buy JTR at peak value on a non contending team. You can make excuses for why it was done but none of that makes it a good move. Kinda like giving up De Los santos for Frddy G only 10x as poor of a decision.
This isn’t an argument. The other side has no case. Preller won’t be able to make something happen with the game’s best catcher. His trade is at its pinnacle NOW. Not at the deadline. Not next offseason. NOW.
chill buddy
again, i was just trying to help explain since you were asking. Didn’t realize you were just trolling for a game of whack a mole
Usually I might agree but there’s no way to explain that logically. The marlins won’t take 4 lesser prospects from the padres when they could have top prospects from anyone else. I’m all for trading your quantity for quality but you don’t do that by buying guys at peak value. You do that with guys like Stroman, Gray, Bundy etc.
I don’t think flipping JTR is a reasonable expectation. The best you could hope for is a three-way.
Cheese – Thank You
most logical Padre comment I’ve seen in a long time
1 move won’t make the Padres better, but 3 or 4 mixed with young talent certainly could. It’s a numbers game and they have prospects to deal. Btw disagree about Hunter Renfroe. 2.4 war in 117 games isn’t bad.
Maybe he’s one of those guys that thinks “WAR isn’t a stat.”
It isn’t.
OF could be the Padres strength. No point in selling low on Myers – time to give him one last chance (or wait for his annual hot streak in CO and SF and then sell high!). Renfro has tremendous power…and tends to hit clutch HRs along with a rocket arm. Margot is a hard worker who may make a big jump in 2019. Jankowski and Reyes are nice backups.
IF – let Hosmer and the kids play while picking up Moustakas to fill the massive 3B hole (in lieu of a trade).
C – not an accident that Hedges got better when given pressure by the pickup of Mejia. Let them fight it out.
SP – “help us Oprah! Help us Tom Cruise!”
RP – always a strength, thanks to pitching coach Balsley
Front office- AJP is aggressive and a little sketchy, desperate to win. A combination that gives hope to loyal Padre fans
I’ve always found it weird that Wil Myers hits better in ATNT than almost any other ballpark. He must really hate the Giants.
It’s ridiculous and random how well Myers hits at At&t. Lol
Jed jerk off did the same thing in coors same goes for myers
Sometimes the park is just right
Coors is actually a hitter’s park though. AT&T isn’t.
Myers hits just as well in Coors and Chase Field, but I didn’t think I had to bring it up.
The only thing ridiculous is you Moron!
You still butthurt b*tch?
There is so much ground at ATT if you put ball in play you will probably do ok. Also Giants don’t do shift much .
The Padres are in a very similar situation to the White Sox this offseason. Both have young graduates who have struggled early on in their MLB careers. Each possess elite farm systems and also seem to be at least one season away from becoming legitimate contenders.
Like the Padres are attempting to do, the White Sox have already added a few shorter term veteran assets in SP Ivan Nova, closer Alex Colome, 1B/DH Yonder Alonso and backup catcher James McCann.
The one big difference between the organizations this offseason would be in the targeting of impacting long term free agents. The White Sox are one of only 3 known finalists for Manny Machado and also strong suitors in the limited Bryce Harper sweepstakes.
A lesser difference might be with the White Sox residing in probably the weakest division in MLB, with the one solid team trying their best to come back to the pack with cost cutting moves this offseason. The NL West is not as strong as most but the Dodgers payroll trimming is allegedly paving the way for bigger additions later this offseason. The Rockies remain viable contenders as well while also looking to add to their roster before opening day. It’s not a probability, but the White Sox do have a better chance to compete in 2019 if they can land at least one of the two elite FA’s this winter. If one of them can be signed early enough, most likely Machado, it could create a cascade effect for the remainder of the offseason. They might then be perceived as more legitimate destinations for some of the other top FA’s still on the market, including some that they have already been linked to in Yasmani Grandal, A.J. Pollock and Adam Ottavino.
Pads approach:
Matt Bush over Verlander and Weaver;
David Freese for the rotting corpse of Jim Edmonds;
Peavy for Richard;
Kluber for Ludwick;
AGon for Rizzo, then Rizzo for Cashner.
To be fair to the Padres, Kluber was hardly a great prospect when the three way Ludwick trade took place.
The top 3 moves were made by Kevin Towers, the next one by Jed Hoyer and the last one by Josh Byrnes. How do any of those moves have anything to do with what AJ Preller and Co. are doing?
The trolls believe that if the Padres made a dumb move in 2004, then they must still have that same mindset in the present day.
Dylan Bundy would be my target if I’m Preller. Baltimore wouldn’t require a ransom for him.
Then sign a guy like Marco Estrada and call it an offseason from the starting pitching front.
The extreme flyball tendencies Estrada possesses would work well for the Padres, also wouldn’t cost much.
I want Preller to get ANY of the 24,000 names in which he is reportedly interested. I don’t care what it costs.
Even one real big leaguer on the club might attract the momentary attention of fans who otherwise spend entire games trying to get their selfies on the big Petco Park screen. And, no, Elder Ian Kinsler’s endless Petco Popups won’t suffice.
I’ve gotten my selfie on that video board more times than I’ve seen Clayton Richard get a win.
When that selfie come up did everyone in the stadium shriek and run for their lives rather than catch what you had?
It got me a Dodger girl fans number… You probably go back to your hole in a subway after every Yankee game. If you can even afford to go to Yankee Stadium.
Padres havent done anything this offseason. Hard to critique their approach when they havent made one.
Well they did sign Ian Kinsler and weirdly refuse to DFA Jose Pirela despite needing a multitude of roster spots…
This site is bias against the Padres. That Jeff Todd guy threw a little jab at the Padres on one of his Q&As
During a live chat a while back Steve picked the Padres and Phillies as the teams that will wait the longest before their next postseason appearance. This over the Royals, Orioles, Marlins and Reds.
Yup. Another loser that picks on the weak, to feel better about himself.
Stop projecting
I can’t see the Padres making the playoffs any time soon. We need to be more careful with trades and with fa acquisitions.
We tend to turn right, when the better choice was to turn left.
@VegasSDfan Me neither but I don’t see how the Reds, Orioles, Marlins or Royals make it before the Padres do.
Jason Martinez is openly a Padres fan.
You may take issue with what a particular person says in the chat, but I hardly consider this website as biased against the Padres. They largely report on rumors and factual numbers.
Fair enough. Was just surprised about it. It also gets tiresome seeing all the Padres bashing in the comments. Why even click on a Padres story? Worry about your own team.
You get tired of reading people talk about a bad team being bad so they should all stop so you don’t have to read it? Sounds like a very California attitude.
Nope it’s all you losers picking on the weaker team to feel better about yourselfs. Remember when the Astros were losing 100+ games? They were the laughing stock of Instagram. And look at them now. And what have your teams done? It’s hard to make trade proposals with fellow Padre fans without dealing with the trolls.
No offense, but there’s a big difference between the Astros experience and what the Padres have done. The Astros decided on a definite rebuild and implemented a plan and stuck to it. The Padres seem to have been in a prolonged yet inconsistent and intermittent rebuild.
A lot of it seemed to spring up after the medical records incident since some big market teams were involved (Boston, Chicago). A lot of fans probably didn’t like seeing some small market team from the West Coast drawing attention to itself, so now they want to turn the Padres into the Cleveland Browns of MLB
I don’t know which fans might feel that way. Can you be more specific whom you think would feel that way?
Preller changes directions like the wind. One year it is rebuild then all in. Then wait and see. Appears he doesn’t really have a plan.
That seems to be the consensus among the hosts on MLB Network Radio every time the Padres are mentioned. I’m talking about former GMs like Jim Bowden, Steve Phillips, and Dan Duquette.
Get creative. 3B — Sano — trade a good reliever, and either Hedges or Mejia. Twins need relief and a catcher. And the Twins have a glut of SS that could be turned into 3B help. I think Sano would be available at the right price.
I would certainly not give up Mejia for Sano at this point. I don’t think the Twins have any incentive to give Sano up at a low point either. What you fail to realize is that if the twins deal Sano they then have a hole at 3B they need to fill again. They don’t have anyone to fill that role unless they want to try Schoop out at 3rd.
Good points. I don’t necessarily mean the Pads get Sano, just think a little more on the creative side. My case would be better if the Twins had MLB-ready 3B waiting. They only have a boatload of SS, some more ready than others.
Yeah, I agree with you. Don’t know how many young 3b are currently available. It’s a shame they can’t do something with Atlanta for Austin Riley or Camargo. The Braves would seem to need a long term solution at catcher. I know they have the prospect Contreras but he’s in high A Ball and they have Donaldson and Camargo already ready at 3rd. I mean on paper it could potentially work for a Mejia for Riley or maybe a Hedges for Camargo kind of framework. Not saying either deal is necessarily a 1 for 1. It’s unlikely but I’d hope Preller at least made the call
SD should work out a three-way with the Braves and Miami. The Braves get JTR, Prospects go to Miami and Atlanta, and Camargo goes to SD. Camargo still has 5 years of control.
SD also needs to think about cashing in some prospects. Next year they are going to have some serious 40-man decisions to make.
They can cash in the lesser prospects. Like the Braves will need to do shortly. There’s plenty of space on the 40 man for the top guys. SD needs to clear out at least one of their major league outfielders because there isn’t enough abs to go around. And if the Braves get JTR and they’re only trading Camargo they’re going to be chipping in a prospect. You aren’t trading Camargo and then having the pads pay for Realmuto for you.
I wouldn’t trade 5 years of Camargo straight up for two years of Realmuto. If the Braves did that, they could bypass SD altogether.
there’s more camargo’s floating around than JTR’s. That deal makes no sense for Miami. Miami isn’t going to let him go for a 1 for 1 for Camargo. If they would that deal would already be done.
I think an above average hitter who plays above average defense at 3B and SS and has five years of control is pretty rare.
Who voted in the poll that it was the Padres time right now? Over 20% said it was, so let’s hear from that 20%. Anyone have a good argument?
They need to add a CAPTCHA before voting 😉
I don’t see how you can make a compelling argument. The article already pointed out that they have one above average starter penciled into their rotation in Lucchesi. Lauer, Nix and Strahm are the only other young guys that will have a shot at their rotation early this season. None of those guys are potential front line starters. Those guys will largely be ready next season and beyond.
You have a glaring hole at 3B, a glaring hole at SS until Tatis is called up and a rookie at 2B. Your OF is the one spot I could hear an argument for a breakthrough. Those guys have a little bit of ML time under their belt and have shown at times flashes of serious potential. I could see a Cordero or Reyes/Renfroe/ even Will Myers potentially busting out in a big way. But, even if they do are you better than the Dodgers? You certainly can’t outpItch LA and I highly doubt you can outhit them in 2019
The only argument is that if we don’t start seeing some legitimate improvement in 2019, we need not worry about 2020.
As of now, we are a worse team than we we were in 2018, but a lot of people seem to think that Preller’s going to just flip a switch and we’ll suddenly be good in 2020. It doesn’t work that way.
How are the Padres a worse team than 2018? The only significant player they lost is Freddy Galvis. Tatis should theoretically replace his production and then they get a full season of Luis Urias and Francisco Mejia and will likely see Logan Allen and Cal Quantrill in relatively short order. Plus Eric Hosmer and Manuel Margot are probably better than they were in 2018.
A shortstop of Galvis’ caliber is pretty significant. We also had a legit third baseman.
Saying someone will “probably be better,” or “theoretically replace,” or that we’ll “likely see … in short order” is purely speculation and wishful thinking. It does not refute or rebut my claim.
Of course, we do still have Pirela!
I don’t see how the Padres can be worse than they were last year. Everyone who contributed except Galvis is coming back and his production can be easily replaced.
No, Galvis will not be “easily replaced.” And that isn’t the only hole we have, as you noted in your wishful thinking non-rebuttal.
I like Galvis but he had a .680 OPS. Unless you think Tatis is a bust, that is replaceable.
It may not be the only hole the Padres have. But it’s the only one they have that they didn’t have in 2018.
because am SD shill. go padres
Yaa first off change that miserable tag name of yours then we can start talking baseball
I’ll change my tag if you change yours. Why is my tag miserable?
Okay, I changed my name for you because you inspire me so much. Show me your inspiration. Change your name.
I just want you to know that everyone reads your tag as “No where to go butt-up.” And I can think a lot things one can do butt up. Maybe it is just your inspiration making me all confused.
It’s their time to start being relevant again. Their prospects are graduating. Not only do a ton of these kids not turn out to be all stars, but there isn’t room for all of them.
It’s an exciting time to be a Padre fan. The front office is in on everyone and our kids are starting to reach the bigs. Now is the Padres time
The writer did a good job of stirring up a bunch negative bs and then posed the poll as if there was any argument made on behalf of the “it’s their time” side. Pretty much set it up to be the world against the few Padre Homers out there.
full discloser, I’m one of those 20% Homers
Should Philly miss out on Bryce Harper I’d give them a call about swapping one of the padres young OF for one of the Phils younger arms. I think Pivetta has a solid arm and would be a nice starter to target if I were in SD’s shoes. They obviously have tons of pitching prospects on the way but they can figure out what to do with them a little easier than having 6 outfielders.
That’s not a bad idea from SD’s perspective at all but it seems to make little sense from the Phillies perspective. The Phillies already project to have 5 outfielders on their 25 man before you talk about Harper (McCutchen, Quinn, Herrera, Williams, Altherr), plus two of the Phillies last three first round picks have been outfielders (Haseley & Moniak).
The Phillies are awash in the minors with promising yet flawed outfield prospects (Haseley, Pujols, Ortiz, Moniak, Vierling, Listi, Cozens), while the FA market offers affordable options that won’t cost young players to acquire. Don’t get me wrong, guys like Cordero, Reyes, Renfroe, & Margot are all interesting players looking from the outside but at least how it looks, the Phillies may have a few of those guys already within their system not burning service time.
I like the idea but the Phillies are thin when it comes to reliable starting pitching at the ML level. They have a lot of pitching prospects but only Sanchez, Medina, & Howard profile as more than back end of the rotation or LOOGY guys. Sanchez & Howard are at least two, if not three years away and Medina may be up within a year but it looks like he’ll shift to the bullpen, further crippling their depth for impact arms. If the Phillies move someone like Pivetta, I think it would be in a package for a highly regarded player.
As the article states, Reyes, Margot, Renfroe, and Cordero have hurt their stock more than helped. I wouldn’t be surprised if Petco has a lot to do with it but that’s not a certainty. I think someone like Pivetta sits in that upper middle range in terms of trade value, he’s not on the level of someone like Tatis, Urias, Mejia, or Hedges but he’s more valuable to his current team than any of the outfielders would be. Although it’s something to think about, a pretty interesting idea and matchup of teams that need to fill certain holes on their roster.
Can someone please explain to me the logic behind signing Kinsler. I just for the life of me can’t figure out that move. Even if Urias is not ready right away 2 years is a long time to sign a guy in the twilight of his career. I feel the funds could have been used better by signing a bounce back 2B and look to either flip him at the deadline or keep if surprisingly contending.
This GM makes absolutely no sense to me. They are in on every trade of every name out there yet have not done anything. They should be looking to signing stop gap guys to hold down positions for the kids until they are ready with the hope to flip some at the deadline.
From what I’ve read it seems like the Kinsler signing was largely motivated by their desire to add more leadership to the club to usher in the new guys. Freddy Galvis was a big part of their leadership core last season and I believe they place a rather high premium on it. The money is chump change, they just let Richard and has 3 million salary go.
Any time I read “leadership” as a sell, I know it is going to be bad. Big Game James was supposed to provide leadership. Then Hosmer. All these guys have done is cost money.
Fortunately Kinsler isn’t making nearly as much as Shields or Hosmer
Sorry, but I can’t explain the logic of a signing that has no logic.
We should really give Wil Myers a pass for his 2018 season. The man was entirely affected by injury for almost the whole year! He’s a great bounceback candidate for 2019.
It would also help if he stopped complaining about having to practice and just have a better work ethic.
Do you know his injury history? Do you know why both the Royals and Rays were happy to let him go? Do his numbers justify his contract?
I’d like to see him bounce, too. Out of San Diego.
How’d that Trea Turner deal work out?
For all intents/purposes, I should be a Nats’ fan. I was born/raised in DC..and one of the first jobs I had as a little dude was walking distance to Nats Park. Heck, I was baptized at a church, walking distance to the ballpark in SouthEast, DC. But up until late this Summer, when I got transferred to NC for work, I’d lived in San Diego since 2002…fell in love with, what was even then, a rebuilding Padres ballclub. I had been a Tony Gwynn fan since I first saw him in an All Star game DECADES AGO. And I wanted to see his team amount to something. ‘Course they never have. And I never had the guts to bail on them to jump on a Nationals bandwagon or an Orioles or Mets/Yankees team.
Had it not been for what I think Preller will make this team into, I’d probably look elsewhere to support a team. Because the Padres have gone thru an army of GMs and owners and front office staff, and until Preller, have NEVER put forth a draft class that made ANYONE’s eyes pop out…until very recently. But I’d like for the front office and ownership to STOP talking about 2019 or 2020, as the years when the Padres will kick butt and take names. STOP IT!!!…unless they stack the team with bats and pitchers no one saw coming to SD, ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. You got young bucks on that team that haven’t even figured out what the heck their learning curve is supposed to look like!!…and Margot, Renfroe, Hosmer, Myers and Lucchesi, would have to have breakout seasons in order for them to be playing ball in late Oct. And that’s not going to happen either.
All this talk about the pitchers they’re in on is a bunch of BS, and is nothing more than ownership telling Preller to keep the rumor mills spinning regarding the Syndergaards and Klubers of the World, so that clueless fans will buy tickets. The Padres will bump into a World Series in 3 or 4 yrs. And by then Preller nor Andy Green, will be working for the San Diego Padres. Book it..
No one would support the Padres unless they are born or living in San Diego
I do, I wasn’t and I don’t. Go Padres!!
I know a lot of people born in SD, and don’t support the Padres.
The problem is that there are so many transplants in San Diego that a lot of people support other teams besides the Padres.
We took a friend to Padre game last year. And he doesn’t care about baseball. But he was rooting for the Braves to win because he wanted to see the Padres lose. Born and raised in SD. It’s our own kind too.
I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen stuff like that whenever I go to a game. A lot of the “fans” (especially the hipsters) care more about taking selfies with some overpriced IPA they bought than actually paying attention to the game. It’s kind of saddening.
Cubs didn’t steal Rizzo, they got a few years of decent Andrew cashier in return. Padres history they have been a minor league team for players to go elsewhere. Management has got to halt that or move the team to Portland or New Orleans.
Yeah, it’s the Owners and Management fault, but you want to punish the people of San Diego by taking our team away. Good job buddy.
they have one of the nicest ballparks in MLB and despite terrible results over the last decade, have had decent attendance. they aren’t going anywhere.
Padres need an innings eater and braves need bullpen. Tehran for Yates. You can sign a reliever when your ready to compete. This would also free up money for Atl to make other moves needed.
I am fine with that trade. Better yet add Camargo for Stammen, an outfielder, and a prospect.
Camargo is going nowhere besides you have Tatis coming up he is projected by most to move to 3rd.
Maybe over time but he is likely to stay at SS for the next few seasons until his defense becomes intolerable or another prospect supercedes him defensively. Camargo is a good piece but he is going to be a supersub this season with Donaldson at 3B and if Riley is ready would remain position-less moving forward.
I’d be more in favor of trading Swanson and putting Camargo at SS. Swanson is a very good defensive SS, but his bat hasn’t developed like we hoped, yet.
If he is available the Padres should try to acquire him. It would be nice to not have a defensive liability at SS. Galvis was a nice change (most likely a bad long term move) but otherwise SS has been rough the past several years.
I don’t know if the Braves would trade him because they’d be selling low, but they should consider it. Swanson has four years left of control, and his bat could still come around. He’s not a big HR guy, more of a gap hitter. He’s a fan favorite and part of their marketing strategy.
Yates is worth more than Teheran, cheaper, better pitcher.
2. This is a lateral move at worst. Padres have no need for 2 years or whatever of Teheran. Koby Allard would be a better target for the padres.
It’s the depressing team colors.
As a Padres fan, I really don’t like their current uniforms (though the camo uniforms are nice). It’s like they’re trying to be Penn State.
They should have stuck with the uniforms from the All Star game season a couple of years ago with the yellow trim. The more I look at the one I have hanging in my basement, the more I like it.
The Padres have enough prospect capital to put Myers and Hosmer into deals and just pay up extra prospects and get those two terrible contracts off their payroll, tanking teams may take them on just to get more rebuild pieces and the Padres will have done well to get rid of two sub standard players on well over their pay level.
I think this would be a mistake. You’d be better served to a) exchange “bad” contracts or b) send enough cash to make them viable players for someone. If you paid half of Myers’ remaining contract, he’d be useful. Don’t spend your hard won prospects just to get rid of bad contracts.
I think what Preller needs to do is look at the Astros, Brewers, and Cubs on how their rebuild went and just try and replicate that. I mean the Brewers and Padres started their rebuild at the same time and the Brewers got within one game of the series last year. So it just makes you think what the Padres are doing?
I believe that is Preeler’s problem, he watches what other teams “reportedly” do (especially the Dodgers) and tries to emulate those moves. Preeler does not appear to have a strategy just reactionary moves. I am surprised that he still has a job with Padres.
Name a reactionary move:
“What other teams “reportedly” do”
…haha this is so funny. Yes teams have to report when they make moves. Its not like fake news. Lol
The Dodgers spent over 2 billion (plus luxury tax) trying to win a ring past 7 years, Padres sure haven’t tried to “emulate” that
“reportedly” as in RUMORS! No, Padres do not have the financial resources of Dodgers (even though your $2B number is wrong), but going out and signing Hosmer was an overpay that took Padres away from its rebuild strategy. “Reportedly” pursuing Realmuto is a reactionary move that will take away top prospects and only give Padres 2 years before Realmuto leaves. Kluber is a 33 year old starting pitcher who will require top prospects going to Cleveland. Padres have the prospects to be a terrific team in the future if Preeler is patient and does not trade them.
when they went all in for Matt Kemp, Kimbrel, Myers, Norris etc
I think the “reportly” comment refers to the fact that although a teams makes a public move, no one else is in the heads of the people making the move and don’t know their motivation/strategy, or what their future plans are. If you try to recreate an apparent strategy but misinterpret what that strategy really is, then you are apt to fail.
Trading prospects is fine if you go for the right players. Don’t go for 33 year old vets. Go for the Hanigers and Camargos, quality young guys with 4+ years of control.
After you get in the neighborhood of contention, then you can consider trading for the established vets.
2 billion number is correct, past 7 seasons. That doesn’t include luxury tax. $$
However the Brewers made it last season was pure luck, they have no SP. They wont even make the playoffs next year with that rotation. Lo cain played wayyy over his head and hes old too. Yelich will never repeat a season like that. Films out on fat boy Aguliar. And Braun was like #3 hitter. That “rebuild” isn’t like The Padres at all. This was just a flash in the pan.
I think the Padres should be following the example of the Brewers and Tampa Bay; forget about starters. They’re expensive and they break. The Padres have shown an exceptional ability to develop bullpen arms; did you know that the Padres’ 2018 bullpen ranked, by fWAR, as the 6th-best bullpen of all time? Start from there, Embrace the opener – use the Milwaukee model, what they did with Hader. The Padres could stretch out Yates or Stammen or Strahm for 3-inning stints. They should go all in on that approach, because that’s the way baseball is moving anyway. They should get in on the ground floor and really think outside the box. They can’t afford a Nationals-style rotation.
Bullpening can burn out bullpens though. That gimmick by Tampa isn’t something that can work year after year imo
Well, we have no idea of that, do we? We have tons and tons of data that clearly show that running starters out for 220 innings a year breaks them.
I’m not sure why you’d stop the development of your starters as starters in a non competitive year. With guys like Paddack, Gore, Baez, Morejon, Allen etc in the minors they could have a frontline rotation in 3 years.
Or they could have three Mark Fidryches.
I’ll take a wait and see approach. We don’t need to reinvent the wheel. When you have the arms in the system you give them a chance. I don’t think we need to start developing top pitching prospects with openers. I think they might wanna let it ride for awhile before we determine they shouldnt start.
Astros and Cubs is the ONLY thing you’ll hear Padres fans talk about. As if it’s the only way to build a winning team and organization.
If you want to hear crickets ask about the Rays, the Brewers, the A’s, or the Indians, or any number of teams that got tired of losing and found their own way to get back to relevance.
In fact, it’s pathetically laughable that these same people would passionately argue that we were following Billy Beane’s “Moneyball” model. Until about August of 2014. Then they swapped one bandwagon excuse for another.
App poll link doesn’t work, no hyperlink.
The fact is until their kids get called up and actually start producing well there is no way to know how far or close they are to becoming a contender. As such sign some stop gaps and hold the kids from now. If they produce well at the ml level THEN make a good signing/trade or two
Padre fans are so desperate they actually believe in this fool Preller. He traded away 2 great bullpen arms for a C that they don’t even have faith in staying behind the plate. Mejia’s prospect value lies in the fact he is a C if he moves from there his value drops.
He signs Hosmer to that rediculous contract. What was the purpose of signing Kinsler or Richards especially when Richards recovery timetable doesn’t even fit the teams contention timetable. But hey whatever you guys got the best farm system in baseball.
Richard, if he works his way back to his previous ability, becomes at worst trade bait. Tampa bay got an intriguing prospect for a similar pitcher in Nathan Eovaldi. Preller has demonstrated he can find gems in prospects, Fernando tatis jr and esteury Ruiz not to mention Jose Torres was a throw in in the pomeranz deal and Jose Castillo was a throw in Wil Myers deal.
Kinslers purpose is to either:
A. Play 2B until mid season then shift urias from ss to 2b for tatis jr
B. Could be traded at the deadline just like he was with the angels.
Evoaldi has major upside though. Richard isn’t in the same boat
2013- 2017 Richard posted FIPs of 3.66- 2.60- 3.86- 3.32- 2.44.
When healthy hes a TOR arm. Idk what Garrett Richard you’re thinking of but his production before injury contradicts your statement.
The rays gave Eovaldi a 2 year deal and he pitched the 2nd year after recovering from tjs.
As a Yankee Fan I would hold onto Sonny Gray and hope he has they bounce back as a Yankee rather then deal him to the Pads or Cincy with those larger parks and no DH and less pressure ensuring better odds at a bounce back. Cash knows if we deal him now for a teams top 20 high reward high risk prospect and he has a bounce back that team will turn him around for much better prospect returns which they should. It’s the chance you take. Saying that I rather gamble that he finds himself in pinstripes having a big year!
Just my opinion but in what world did Hunter Renfroe struggle this year? only had 400 ABs and on pace for .250 avg and a 30/30 year. Seems pretty darn good to me. I wouldn’t exactly say he has “sputtered”… I am not a Padres fan whatsoever but I do hope they start to put some good years together
He had 2 stolen bases all season, don’t think he will have 30 stolen bases, he may be a 30 homer guy but the on base is bad and he can’t play defense. He is a 1-2 fWar guy which is serviceable but never a 30/30 type mookie betts type.
I was referencing 30/30 as in 2B and HR, not SB, sorry for the confusion
He will strikeout instead of BB, and that is what baseball has come to these days.
His defense in RF last season was very close to ML average.
Also has plus speed and an absolute cannon – I played with him in college years and he touched 99mph off the mound
I think the sputter comment was about September, when he had a .224 BA and a .276 OBP.
There are two factors in success. 1) Talent. 2) How well that talent plays I.e. are they relaxed, confident, execute good at bat strategies etc. Think 2018 RedSox, under Cora EVERYONE (possible exception of Kimbrel and Devers) had really good years. Padres need to focus on helping their talent play better.
This is the perfect example of an organization that is lost in transition… The problem with teams that try to be the Rays is that they struggle to establish an identity. Under Joe Maddon, the Rays always had an identity that flowed through the manager. New players came, old players went, but the identity of the team never changed.
Enter the Padres. This team has no identity or formula. They have a lot of high level talents, but the pieces thusfar have not fit together. I am not putting it on the manager, because they’ve changed managers and had some very good ones. This is on front office and ownership. They fail to strike hard at the right times. They sign a bunch of middle of the pack guys like Eric Hosmer when they are ready to contend not accounting for regression or injury. Lineups need an anchor. They need someone that when all the chips are down can bring them right back in a game. David Ortiz / J.D. Martinez with the Red Sox is a great example. Without that middle of the order bat, the Sox struggled mightily during slumps. With them, they really never lose more then 3-4 games in a row. The Padres have a habit of relying on guys like Hosmer / Myers, who are quality ballplayers, but they aren’t going to carry you when the chips are down.
I voted “NO” because there is absolutely no reason with this core (even with the elite prospect talent) to make any major moves until they establish what their identity is going to be. Are you going to be a pitching powerhouse like the Giants a few years back? Are you going to be balanced like the Cardinals were in Pujols era, frontloaded with SP talent? Are you going to be the Yankees/Red Sox and just demand greatness every year and put a team on the field to achieve it? Have your team rally behind true world series dreams. Or are you going to be the Rays and build your team around a charismatic manager who works almost exclusively with young players and bring in a few older veterans to fill out the lineup and provide leadership?
Right now, the Padres are none of these and nowhere close to finding their way.
This was very well said. In short organizational philosophy is key
You have to have an identity. As people, as businesses, as teams, we need it to truly feel like we belong and have purpose.
I feel like I’m watching Jack Nicholson asking Adam Sandler, “Who are you?” in Anger Management or Billy Crystal asking Robert DeNiro who he is in Analyze This. Hint: Preller is Sandler/DeNiro.
Great comment. Its like Preller read “Baseball GM for Dummies” and just goes through the paces. Without any real objective evaluation on those choices. The Myers deal and the Hosmer deal are huge red flags. I feel bad for the Padres.
I looked back to see if I commented on the Eric Hosmer signing and I did not. But I chuckled when they signed him and said, “Here we go again…” Awful. Hosmer has some pop, but he is not a piece to build a team around. He’s the piece you add when you have a hole at 1B or DH, most of the pieces in place, and you’re ready to go win.
I loved the move trading for Myers. I thought the change of scenery would help, but injuries never let him become the player he was capable of being. And now, looking back, losing Trea Turner to the Nats in that deal really hurt. He’s the type of hitter who would do well for the Padres.
The extension though, was the hitter’s version of the Homer Bailey deal. Paying top dollar for potential that hasn’t been fully recognized yet. This is a risk the Yankees, Dodgers and Red Sox can take with no problem. This is not the type of deal a small market team makes with Myers injuries and inconsistencies. To get rid of him, they have to eat $10 mil a year for 3 more years as the team option will not be triggered and probably take back a player of risk, rather then reward. That’s painful looking back on losing a guy that swiped 43 bags (NL leader) and hit 19 homers with a much more respectable batting average and OBP.
The poor Padres still have a long way to go to consider major free agent acquisitions if they can’t find a way to shed Hosmer & Myers money.
Preller’s biggest mistake was going for broke year one and for some reason Trading away Trea Turner and a couple other guys that could’ve been useful today like Mallex Smith.
Then he goes off and signs Hosmer and his odd and even year off and on again production.
Myers shouldn’t play anywhere but first due to his injury history but hey just plug in Hoz and his Albatross contract and watch your other high priced guy just fall apart all over the diamond.
Someday the North Tijuana Cockroaches will get lucky and maybe sneak in a winning season. Than fall back to where they’ve been for primarily the last 50 years.
Not since the late Kevin Towers as GM have the Padres made any head way. If the Padres are not in the playoffs by 2020 its time to say good bye to Preller. I’d rather have a GM who has some good past experience and realizes SP is utmost critical then fill in the balance of the team as needed.
The Padres feel that they can get away with guys that pitch to contact because of the pitcher friendly confines of the ballpark. I think this is short-sighted for a team that wants to compete, because when you play the heavy hitters in the playoffs, they are going to hit the ball out of any ballpark in the majors. The philosophy can help get you through a regular season and maybe to even a 90 win season. It’s not going to get you past the Division Series.
They are going to have to step up one day and find their Clayton Kershaw or Madison Bumgardner or Zack Grienke, and put the money on the table when they need to. If they can’t? Shut it down. Close the doors. They’re finished in that division.
I would suggest that they have a number of pitching prospects who are on track to do more than pitch to contact. Earlier you spoke of the reckless spending on Myers and Hosmer (I agree). But now you reference 3 pitchers with massive contracts, all of whom have been extremely successful in the past, but only one of which has rings, and all three have contracts that do or will hinder their teams. The Padres, as I believe you mentioned earlier, cannot make those types of moves like the Dodgers and Giants can. Therefore, drafting and developing, and spending on prospects in the draft and internationally is the way it gets done. I think THIS front office deserves a couple more years – improvement needs to be there, but 2020 may be too early. If the Padres don’t have stud pitchers in their system that can help them win a lot more games by say, 2021, then I’m not sure that any team does.
My, what a carefully crafted first sentence!
The San Diego Padres way to win ballgames is having good starting pitching,defense,speed and maybe 1 or 2 sluggers especially playing half their games at Petco.Our last 3 seasons we had no depth at SP our opening day #1 starters were James shields,Tyson Ross,Jhoulys Chacin and not much depth at all behind.Preller/Ownership set the team back a few years and depleted the farm system 2014 traded away Trea turner,Yasmani Grandal and a few young starting pitchers to try to compete in 2015. Padres spent about 80m on international talent in 2016 to restock the farm system and begin a “new” rebuild been slowly flipping vet players and getting quality prospects back. 2020 or 2021 at the earliest we will see a team trying to compete as most of our top prospects have an estimated arrival date of 2020-2022. Cubs rebuild from 2010-2014 thats 5 years. Astros rebuild from 2009-2014 thats 6 years.Braves rebuild was 4 years from 2014 to 2017 but Atlanta has always had plenty of success and good teams. Preller will be in San Diego another 5 years easily our ownership loves him and so far he has not traded away prospects hes obtained since his tenure began so we are building something long term here.
Padres , in my opinion, should trade for Sunny Gray and Joey Gallo, yeah I said Joey Gallo, you’re getting a cheap 30 to 40 HR player at only 25 or 26 with a few years of control that you can stick in the 5 hole and let him swing for the fences. Ranges are so thin they will take any prospects at this point.
Gallo fits best as a DH or 1B. Padres don’t have needs at either position. How about Moustakas?
moustakas would certainly take care of 3B for a few years and help Hosmer by bringing in a familiar face but I don’t know if they want to spend that kind of money.
the best solution might be to bring up all their young prospects and allow them to fail in the big leagues in 2019 when there is no pressure to perform, so they start to compete by 2021
It’s all smoke and mirrors, and the fan base keeps buying it.
When Preller was hired in 2014, the Padres said the target to be “competitive” was 2018. Several times during ST, Green and Preller said the goal was to make the playoffs. Even though most of us knew they were blowing smoke up our collective arses (aka LYING).
Go back to May of 2017. In an LA Times article by Bill Shaikin, he said the goal is for the team to be competitive in 2019. Seidler and Preller were quoted in the story.
This leads me to believe that Preller and the Padres: a) don’t have a plan, and b) really don’t know what they’re doing.
Cue the Preller sycophants.
Keep Joey Gallo. He’s a whiff king who made it clear that he “hates thurd base.” Where would he play? Honestly I would rather have a Ryan Schimpf reincarnation.
Oh wait … Gallo was a top prospect at one time, and we all know prospects are better than big leaguers when it comes to the Padres.
That’s what they need another strikeout hitter.
that’s the game right now , at least you will get a consistent power threat and for a fraction of the cost of anyone else out there hitting 30+
Think I would rather keep Hunter Renfroe right where he is…no thanks.
Agreed. Renfroe is coming off his sophomore season. I see him as a consistent 30HR guy with OK defense, a great arm, and (hopefully) a solid .250 hitter in the middle of the lineup.
He stays.
Now if you want to deal Myers or Margot, we can talk.
that’s the game right now strikeouts and HRs , at least you will get a consistent power threat and for a fraction of the cost of anyone else out there hitting 30+. and he is under control until 2023
For the people making the illogical argument that the Padres would be trading for players just to flip them for more prospects, think about this.
If they already have the best farm system, why would they need to flip players they trade for or sign for more prospects? Are those prospects going to be better than Tatis, or Mejia, or Urias, or Gore, or Paddack, or any of their top 10-12 prospects? Probably not. So why do that?
Well you do that because no matter how strong your farm is, it can always get stronger.
The reason their argument is illogical is because they are applying it to players who are obviously at the pinnacle of their trade value like JT Realmuto.
Why spend money and prospects to get lower level prospects at a later date? That is why it’s illogical.
Again, the idea is the prospects you get back won’t be lower level prospects. But this strategy wouldn’t work with JT Realmuto. It could work with say, Sonny Gray or Marcus Stroman depending on what their teams’ GMs are asking for.
Redroostee YourDaddy just does not want to accept your logical and well said statement no matter how many times you tell him
This is exactly why rebuilding is all a load of crap being sold to anyone who’s willing to buy it… you’ve got to get lucky to get one or two of your prospects to work out, and it needs to happen quickly in their development before the team loses control and/or gives up on the player.
The only way to win in baseball is with a balanced approach and through free agency. There is no way to cut corners and win a WS. You get what you pay for, and if the owner is cheap, you get a team with little to no chance. And when management makes dumb decisions, like committing to Myers like he’s the guy they are going to build the team around, and signing Hosmer to a bad contract at the wrong time which everyone but them kinda knew was going to blow up on them, you get this abyss that is the Padres.
Until MLB introduces some sort of actual salary cap/floor (not just the current luxury tax penalties), this is the way it has to be. Small market teams cannot afford to keep up with the rich teams. Like you said, making a bad free agency signings can really hurt small market teams. They can’t just throw money at the problem like Boston or New York. They have to undergo The Process.
There can be no parity in baseball until they fix unlimited free agency. The smaller market teams will always have a more difficult time putting a consistently good product on the field.
They need to have exceptionally good scouting, very good development, and extreme good luck in drafting year after year. Then, when they hit on those above average ML players, since they often can’t afford to keep them, they have a steady stream of quality replacements. Not impossible, but darn close.
Trade no top 20 prospects. Stick with developing our own talent.
When the Braves were at the stage that the Padres are at now, they signed borderline vets to one year deals to remain “competitive” and give their young guys a little more time to develop. no one was blocked, and as the young guys proved themselves they were promoted. That’s how Camargo, Albies and Swanson made it to the bigs, along with several of their pitching prospects.
At least they gave their fans a reason to come to games and cheer. Look at what the Reds are doing. The Rays. The A’s.
You know what will give fans a reason to come to games? Making the playoffs!
No kidding. And yet you find a reason to argue against any acquisition or trade that would make the team immediately better.
I’ll give you a pass on Realmuto because that deal really would be stupid.
Because the trades you are referring to are for players who are a year out from free agency who won’t be enough on their own to make up the ~25 win deficit it would take to get the Padres into the playoffs.
Every roster changes every year. Wins are tabulated one year at a time. If a good player is available at a position of need – even if it’s only for a year – go get him. If it’s “only” for two years, even better if it helps the team at a reasonable price.
NOT trying to improve every day, or every year is the only thing that makes no sense.
TRADING FOR PENDING FREE AGENTS ISN’T IMPROVING THE TEAM!!!!!!!!!!! THEIR PRODUCTION WILL JUST HAVE TO BE REPLACED IN A YEAR!!!!!!!!!!!! AND THE REPLACEMENT SUCCEEDING ISN’T DEPENDENT ON HOW GOOD THEIR PREDECESSOR WAS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You said it best yourself: “The only problem I have with Galvis is that Preller wasn’t able (so far) to extend him for the next two years. This team would have been – and will be – a lot worse without him.”
What part of “improving” don’t you understand? Was I not clear enough about year-to-year, and one year at a time?
By your logic, we should just forfeit 2019 (maybe 2020 too), and keep the team in Peoria. Because by then, somebody will flip the magic switch and we’ll suddenly be competitive. Until then, nothing matters, right?
Yes, even pending free agents can improve the team. Did you miss the part about how every team’s roster changes every year.
That said, I have no idea what point you are trying to make. Especially regarding what I said about Galvis (even though you took it from another context).
I understand everything about improving. You don’t. Trading for pending free agents doesn’t improve the team. For example, the Padres having had Freddy Galvis on the team in 2018 is not going to win them ONE extra game in 2019 and beyond. Not one. Trading for guys only improves the team while those guys are around. After that the team just goes back to what it would have been if you never traded for them.
Now you are just strawmanning. The Padres FO knows they won’t contend in 2019 or 2020 (at least I hope) and that these are the years to see what they have in young talent like Tatis, Urias, etc.
I’m using a quote you made on another thread to illustrate the fact that the Galvis trade was pointless unless he agreed to a sign-and-trade.
What would having ANY player for 2018 have to do with 2019? Did you actually read and comprehend my original point? Nothing. Sounds like you’re the one with Straw Man issues. By the very definition of the term.
Again with the hypotheticals and speculation.
No, the quote was from a thread where you were ticked off about trading a prospect for a quality SS, because you apparently enjoy crappy baseball. And yes, I wish they had extended him. Defense is part of the game, too. Especially at SS.
It doesn’t. So how does trading for pending free agent players improve the team? And how is making the team slightly less bad for one year worth giving up a guy who could have contributed for the long haul?
You are the one who enjoys crappy baseball considering you were in favor of trading a controllable player for a pending free agent player in advance of a guaranteed 90+ loss season.
I also wish they had extended Galvis. That’s why I said they should have made the trade contingent on a sign-and-trade.
“Could have … ” As in “maybe.”
There’s no such thing as “sign and trade” in MLB.
Yes it is a maybe. A pending free agent contributing beyond the one year is a “not” and always will be. If you’d rather have a guy who won’t contribute than a guy who might, then you are the one who prefers watching crappy baseball, not me.
Sure there is. When the Blue Jays traded for R.A. Dickey after 2012, the trade was contingent on a sign-and-trade. I’m pretty sure that’s what happened with Adrian Gonzalez and the Red Sox after 2010 too. The Phillies tried to do it with Manny Machado last offseason but the Orioles said no.
Sign and trade is illegal in MLB. Look it up.
And I’m not going to argue your straw man.
It’s not a straw man when you have explicitly said you would trade a prospect for a pending FA in advance of a season in which the team was never going to compete.
I did look it up and you’re wrong again.
nytimes.com/2012/12/17/sports/baseball/mets-agree-…
You didn’t look up anything.
It’s in the CBA: Article XX (B)(5)(a)
Which explains this…
“The deal is contingent on Dickey and the Blue Jays’ agreeing on a contract extension during a 72-hour negotiating window, and the sides were involved in preliminary talks Sunday.”
This is what the Padres should have done with Justin Upton and Freddy Galvis.
I have provided you with the quote straight from the horse’s mouth, but you’re probably going to ignore it as you always do.
By the way, the part of the CBA you referred to is regarding trade of a recently signed free agent. That rule doesn’t apply to players who sign contract extensions.
But go ahead and cower back into your little hole like you always do when you know you’ve been beat.
LOL. All you’ve done is demonstrate that you don’t know the meaning of “sign and trade.” So now you’re trying to change what it means to try and make your point. Effing ridiculous.
You’re predictable. When you are proven wrong, the first thing you do is get snarky and insulting.
Go get a life. Jeez, just Google it. Then you won’t have to parade your ignorance around in the pursuit of always trying to prove you’re right – even when you’re not. You go and cower until you figure it out.
Look kid, I’m not here to argue semantics with you. Padres’ trades for Justin Upton and Freddy Galvis should have been contingent on them signing extensions with the Padres. Yes that is allowed. If they do trade for JT Realmuto (which I’m not in favor or in any capacity) they should do the same thing.
Oh, now it’s semantics? I’m surprised you know the word. I’m not surprised you don’t know how to use it in context (e.g., using it as an excuse to backtrack).
Again, I’m not going to argue a point I never made. Yes, it would have been nice to get an extension on Galvis, but Preller couldn’t or wouldn’t. And dealing for Realmuto would just be stupid with or without an extension.
Stay in school, junior. I guarantee I’m older than you.
It is semantics. You knew exactly what I meant, but are trying to argue whether or not “sign-and-trade” refers specifically to free agent signings vs. extensions rather than the actual point I was making.
Getting an extension on Galvis was necessary. The Padres did not (and were never going to) contend in 2018 so the only reason to make that trade was to eliminate the risk of him signing elsewhere after the season by getting an extension as part of the trade. Ditto Justin Upton.
I seriously doubt that. Either way your argument is still weak.
“Sign and trade” has a very specific meaning in professional sports. It’s only semantics in your mind, like when when you try to say it means something else just to defend your ignorance.
I guess I gave you too much credit.
Again, you know what I meant. I’m not here to argue the technical definition of a “sign-and-trade.”