DEC. 22: The Dodgers remain in talks with the Indians regarding Kluber, Morosi reports. LA isn’t open to trading slugger Cody Bellinger for Kluber, though it’s “willing to discuss” young outfelder Alex Verdugo, per Morosi. Regardless, it’s unlikely a Kluber deal will come together with the Dodgers or anyone else prior to Christmas, Morosi tweets.
DEC. 19: The Indians are still holding discussions with rival organizations about star right-hander Corey Kluber, according to Jon Morosi of MLB.com (Twitter links). In particular, it seems the Reds are actively engaged with the Cleveland brass.
Needless to say, this isn’t the first we’ve heard of the Indians dangling a significant pitchers. Kluber and teammate Trevor Bauer have been in the rumor mill for much of the offseason.
Still, it’s significant to learn of ongoing talks, particularly since little has emerged on that front in the past weeks. The Indians’ strategy had been uncertain following a pair of contract-swapping moves — see here and here — that significantly reduced the team’s 2018 payroll. Easing the financial commitments, while staying ahead of an underwhelming pack in the AL Central, had been the seeming driving force behind the concept of dangling Kluber in the first place.
No doubt salary considerations will remain important, but the Indians surely have less pressure to pare costs. Parting with Kluber (or Bauer) will not be undertaken lightly. That explains the fact that, per Morosi, the Indians have asked about top Reds prospects Nick Senzel and Taylor Trammell in trade talks. Morosi himself had previously cast doubt on the possibility of a match between these clubs. The Reds, no doubt, are exceedingly hesitant to give up either of those two key young assets, though landing a controlled ace will necessarily sting.
A variety of other ballclubs remain engaged on Kluber, presumably. Morosi cites the Dodgers, Brewers, and Phillies as being “among the teams that have shown interest,” though it’s not clear whether that’s intended as an update on the current state of affairs or a glance back at the recent slate of rumors.
redsfan54
Trammell? Maybe. Senzel? Indians can go discuss talks with another team.
dray16
did the reds plan on getting a top 5 pitcher for little to nothing? neither of those two have accomplished anything, and may never accomplish anything.
brewcrew08
You so understand what the word “prospects” means right?
johnrealtime
I think dray is trying to say that people overvalue prospects often and Kluber is a bonafide ace. You have to pay for talent with talent, and a prospect is potential. I know it’s early but look at the Sale trade
The Ghost of Bobby Bonilla
I doubt the Indians want Trammell. He’s still at least two years away from the Show. I could see Senzel, along with Siri and Aquino though.
joeshmoe11
If they want Siri instead of Trammell then by all means. Siri is raw as hell and less of a sure thing than Trammell, if you can consider a prospect “sure thing”
heater
The point is it will take the nearest thing to surefire Major League pieces to get Kluber. Fringe prospects won’t get it done.
Knowthemarket
My view on prospects is somewhere between Redsfan and Dray. You both sound like fans of your team.
That being said, Senzel or Trammel are both capable of headlining a package. It will take more than just either but probably not both. That is not what the article said.
When it comes to Kluber, you will have to give up someone you don’t want to lose. When you trade Kluber, you are giving up an ace and will never feel like you got enough.
Prospectnvstr
Are the Reds trying to get Kluber,the 2 time Cy Young award winner fr Cleveland? Or are the Indians trying to get a couple of (possible) future stars aka top prospects from Cincinnati?
Polish Hammer
Cleveland is trying to get a good corner OF bat with contractual control, a good bullpen arm and a top prospect.
RealCarlAllen
Not sure why this is being downvoted. It’s okay to have a prospect you aren’t willing to move, and Senzel has a legitimate Brian Dozier comp. Trammell isn’t exactly a lousy prospect – top 25 in MLB iirc. I’d rather move Trammell and two other top 5 prospects than Senzel – and I don’t know that the Indians would get a better offer. I don’t see Verdugo as a better prospect than Trammell
hockeyjohn
Cleveland is looking for MLB ready prospects, particularly outfielders. Trammel is not MLB ready, Verdugo and Senzel are.. Dodgers can add to Verdugo as well. We will see what happens. If Cleveland does not like the offer, they can keep Kluber or Bauer.
DjRed
Exactly why Winker will be involved. Winker, Trammell, and Tony Santillan for Kluber.
Then the reds OF will look like Kemp/Schebler LF Senzel CF and Puig in RF.
lm1330
Verdugo has performed at higher levels of baseball.
DjRed
Vertugo is projected a lot lower than Trammell.
pinkerton
I feel like Cincinnati should not give up both Senzel and Trammel.
User 4245925809
Look at what Chris Sale cost Boston and that is possibly what Cleveland is basing the cost of 3y of Kluber.
remember.. it cost 2 top kids in Michael Kopech and Yoan Moncada (and more) for 3y of a comparable Ace. I see no reason for Kluber to be any cheaper.
Brixton
Kluber is owed a lot more money and is 5 years older
Luckybrew
Brixton you hit the nail on the head 5 yrs is a big difference.
Ichiro51
Kluber has never been injured like Sale
Priggs89
Did Sale have a serious injury while pitching with the White Sox that I missed? He made 30+ starts in 3 out of 5 years, and the two he didn’t, he made 29 and 26. Injuries were not an issue for Sale.
SeanC318
Kluber is still super cheap in terms of elite pitching for years of control. Kluber also got a late start to his Major League career. Not starting until 2013, so he doesnt have the wear and tear you would expect a 31 yr old pitcher to have
daved
And Boston won the WS by getting Sale and the White Sox still suck. Prospects are cool. Parades are cooler. -Casey Stern
ksoze
Yes, but the Reds might need Kluber, and Dallas to get them there. Then we can start talking about Parades.
Priggs89
I mean, the White Sox also have 10+ years of control left for the 2 of them (not to mention Basabe in AA), so I think it’s a little early there chief.
ChiSoxCity
I mean…the White Sox traded Sale only a few years ago. They “sucked” because they’re rebuilding the farm system and big league squad, which takes atleast 3 years. It’s cool if fans of other teams wanna trash the White Sox, but atleast do it intelligently.
Judge Judy
They also had to pay 12M in luxury tax
Samuel
” it cost 2 top kids in Michael Kopech and Yoan Moncada”
_ _ _
And exactly what have those 2 gentlemen done for the Sox since they acquired them?
The Indians have prospects in their system and young players on their team that perform as well as those guys have.
Why would the Indians trade a 2-time Cy Young award winner, healthy, on a contract lower then the Phillies gave a deteriorating McCutchen, for 2 guys like that, and a couple of stiffs they can pick up on the waiver wire?
ksoze
There is no way they’d get both Senzel and Trammell. I am sure the Reds would consider moving one but not both. Honestly if it took Senzel to get it done, I’d be less enthusiastic, but if Trammell was the centerpiece, I’m in.
RealCarlAllen
Not sure why this is being downvoted. It’s a very fair and accurate comment.
titanic struggle
I agree pinkerton. Both of those guys have the potential to be dynamic players at the big league level and are not worth giving up for two years of Kluber. If the Reds were a big market team with more0 money to throw around then maybe, but the future of pitching in baseball is changing. Big money “aces” that pitch every 5 days and go deep into games are going to be a thing of the past very soon. We’ll start seeing more and more starters going only 3-4 innings like we did last season. Go get Gio and try to swing a deal with LA to get Alex Wood.
wrigleywannabe
Your weed must he real good
titanic struggle
It is…
dcrising
LOL, starting pitchers will always continue to pitch deep into games as long as they’re effective, which they still are. I do agree there is a judgement call teams need to make between keeping prospects or trading for MLB talent. Prospects are exactly what you think they are though – prospects, they don’t pan out much more often than they do. Yoan Moncada, dealt in the Sale trade, was as untouchable as Vlad Guerrero Jr is today. He was traded and many think he won’t end up planning out after 2-3 years in the show already.
On the other side, smaller market teams rely more heavily on prospects impacting the MLB club because of their costs. Big market teams can makeup for lost prospects more easily through spending.
Oh well. Only time will tell if a trade was worth it. Morale of the story, if the Reds want Kluber, they’ll lilelyhave to give up Senzel or Trammell or even both.
DjRed
No way both would be traded. I think Senzel will be a star for a long time for the reds. Trammell is going to be a stud as well, but could be dealt for right player.
Jessie Winker is a hitting and OB machine that could be moved.
DjRed
And they won’t.
mack22 2
So… do it already
youthinkwhat
First Kluber trade article that didn’t cite the Yankees as possibilities… which could mean we will be reading Kluber to the Yankees in the coming week.
acarneglia
Works for me
sufferforsnakes
Just stop it.
Ty1990
I would do Tremmel, Gennett, and Iglesias, or Suerez, Amir Garett, and Anthony Discalfani. Think both of those would fit and be good for both teams.
c1234
That is way too much
brewcrew08
You realize Kluber has 3 years left of control right? Relatively cheap too considering how costly elite level arms are nowadays. He is going to get a huge return
Ty1990
I’m just trying to be realistic. Kluber is a top 10 pitcher in all of mlb. If you get him, he takes a spot for one of your pitchers anyway. discalfani only has a couple years left and would be disposable. Gennett would be perfect fit at second. Also I said or. Which one do you not like? What do you propose?
claymc
Reds aren’t giving up Suarez. They just extended him for years on what’s probably one of the most team-friendly deals in all of baseball, which is what they require to compete in one of the smallest markets in the league. I’m not saying Suarez is necessarily more valuable than Kluber, but he’s a piece that’s likely considered to be untouchable, especially with a strong farm system to trade from.
norcalguardiansfan
Kluber is a top 2 pitcher in all of baseball – 5th at worst.
Samuel
@ claymc;
Kluber-Reds trade is a bad match.
You can argue that the Reds may have the talent, but if the Reds paid the going rate, it would stop their current build in its tracks. The Reds are simply not deep enough in quality talent. Nor will a Kluber pitching once every 4-5 games square away that staff.
Kluber is attractive to a win-now team with a strong roster and farm system – Yankees, Dodgers, Astros. At this point in their rebuild, even the Braves are a stretch – they would be better off developing their young pitchers.
Indians FO is doing DD calling around. But unless the Yankees start with Andujar as a centerpiece, or the Dodgers open with Verdugo and one of their Catching prospects, the Indians are better off keeping Kluber……which is what I believe will happen. For heavens sake – Carlos Friggin Santana is being paid more then Kluber.
hockeyjohn
Gennett has only one year of control. The Indians want players with control.
Ty1990
I think the Reds have several pieces that could be used to get klubber. I mention Suarez because Senzel can slide right into third and his contract is so team friendly that him plus one other could be a legitimate proposal. I just think the Reds should be willing to take a risk like this one.
While Gennett is a one year rental, he would fit nicely as a win now kind of guy that could be a extension candidate for them.
sportznut1000
hahahaha i wonder all the time if people actually think of what their rankings are when they say “top x” top 10? so what 9 pitchers do you have in front of kluber? or what 5 at the very least that doesnt make him a top 5 pitcher? ill give you chris sale, max scherzer and jacob degrom as top 3. then its clayton kershaw and kluber to round out top 5 with aaron nola right behind followed by blake snell, gerritt cole and luis severino in that next “top 10” category
xSpecBx
And the Indians have no incentive to trade him within the AL because if they hope to contend they’ll potentially be going up against him at some point in the playoffs. Kluber is gonna stay an Indian most likely unless an NL team blows them away.
Related the Kluber, I wonder if his more recent stats are inflated by pitching probably half his games against inferior AL central teams.
gson
This is closer to the return value it would take to get Kluber & well stated. .
There is one other possibility.. The inclusion of the Miami Marlins & JT Realmuto in a three way deal. Something to consider.
johnrealtime
I think if the reds were to trade Iglesias as part of a kluber package, they are better off getting a third team involved to maximize Rasiel’s value
zachary08
I don’t care if it’s Trammel or Senzel or even both to land pitching
claymc
The Reds have a REALLY deep system at 2B. Senzel, in my opinion, is expendable. But I’d be really hesitant to deal Trammell. This farm system isn’t flush with top-end OF talent, nor do they have the money to spend on OF if they truly are focused on spending every last penny on pitching (which is what most of us fans are hoping they’re doing).
I don’t hate our current outfielders. I think Winker still has plenty of room to grow, and Schebler is one of the most under-rated corner outfielders in baseball. But that being said, I’d still try to retain Trammell at all costs as this team’s outlook at OF is far murkier than middle infield.
Michael Chaney
I actually feel that Senzel could play the outfield if that’s where he was needed. I think they played him there a little in the minors last year, unless I’m getting him mixed up with someone else.
lm1330
Winker
Senzel
Iglesias
Stephenson
For
Kluber
Minor leaguer
That is what you are most likely looking at to do the deal.
Ty1990
Then the Reds hang up immediately. If im giving up Senzel, the number six prospect according to MLB pipeline, I’m not throwing in a piece like Winker. I think Senzel and Iglesias plus schebler or Gennett might work.
I know he only has one year left, but Gennett plus Senzel! Just think of how perfect that line up would be. Perfect mix of power and on base.
Then You would have Iglesias for 3 years on a team friendly deal who can work multiple innings. You would be lights out with Brad Hand in the 8th and Iglesias to close it out.
jbigz12
If I’m the Indians and you’re giving me Senzel, Iglesias and Gennett. I don’t give a sht about Jesse winker. He’s a pro hitter but the man doesn’t have much pop and is an ugly outfielder. He’d definitely be the fourth piece to me.
kenly0
I think it would take at least 3 of Iglesias, Suarez, Senzel, Winker, or Trammel to get the Tribe to trade Kluber.
lm1330
agree
zachary08
Gennett, Trammel and Greene would be my first offer
bleacherbum
The Padres need to get involved.
One of RHH OF’s -Hunter Renfroe or Franmil Reyes, One of LHP’s -Joey Lucchesi or Eric Lauer, and CP -Kirby Yates for Kluber.
All of those players fit for CLE now at the big league level. You get Brantley’s replacement in LF with one of the outfielders, you get a young controllable rotation piece in Lauer or Lucchesi, lastly, you add Yates to the back end of Cleveland’s bullpen with old friends Brad Hand and Adam Cimber. Yates is also controlled for 2 more seasons.
Kluber is the stopper the Padres haven’t had since Peavy. If the cost is what I mentioned they should take that next step. Because a deal like that doesn’t deplete the farm system and it provides clarity to the big league roster.
Myers has a corner outfield spot back to try to regain value. With one of Reyes/Renfroe gone. The Padres can then address 3B from now until spring training. Whether it is Moustakas on a short term deal, a trade for Franco or Profar – 3B will be addressed after a big deal in which I hope is bringing and ACE to San Diego.
padresfan619 2
well said bleacher bum I would take that deal
Priggs89
As a Padres fan, I’m sure you would take that deal. Awful value for the Tribe.
sufferforsnakes
Not even close to good enough.
RedRooster
Gonna take way more than that bruh
nmc420theambassador
even as a padres fan, i love laughing at these ridiculous offers
Polish Hammer
Padres fans seem to come up with the most lopsided/ridiculous trade scenarios of any fan base.
bleacherbum
Yeah but not a ton more. There is a lot of club control left over Reyes, Lucchesi and Yates. All would play a big role on the ‘19 tribe roster. Add Logan Allen and I would make that my final offer.
That would be a pretty nice package coming back to CLE for 3 years of Kluber.
Franmil is a RH version of big papi. Tons of energy, can hit the ball a mile, and showed huge strides with his plate discipline towards the end of the year, he just is an AL player. 23 years old still. He would be a nice fit in that lineup behind Lindor, Ramirez and co.
Carrasco
Bauer
Clevenger
Bieber
Lucchesi
Salazar comes back at some point you have to figure, Logan Allen is basically big league ready, Triston McKenzie will be up before you know it.
Idk that deal makes sense to me, Yates and Hand get to pitch together in high leverage situations for another 2 years plus.
Samuel
I like Franmil a lot…….
But he’s overweight and coming off of knee surgery. Additionally, like most – if not all – AL teams, the Indians do not use a full-time DH. Players are rotated through there on daily match-ups; breaking guys back in after injuries; and to rest tired players by giving them some time off from playing in the field. Franmil needs to be able to play a position.
He’s a nice throw-in, but hardly a centerpiece for a 2-time Cy Young award winning ace pitcher on a team-friendly contract.
The pitchers are nice, but the Indians already have similar guys.
As for the Padres – I don’t see them as a win-now team. It takes a few years for prospects to adjust – or not – to the higher paced, competitive major league game. The Padres would be wasting at least 1.5-2 years of Kluber’s contract waiting on guys…..same as they’ve been doing with Myers and Hosmer.
jbigz12
When you just throw in Logan Allen that changes things. Logan Allen is regarded higher than anybody in your initial proposal except for Yates. I’m not saying that deal gets it done by any means but adding him in is very significant considering he’d be the 2nd piece.
Pacific Wave
It would be nice for the Padres to get involved. However don’t count on that. The same old Padres year in and year out.
Michael Chaney
Yeah that’s gonna be a no from me dawg
bleacherbum
Then go Fleece BVW in New York or something for Conforto + because that’s a fair offer from San Diego’s perspective. A rookie left handed starter that more than held his own in the hitters paradise that is the NL West. Without starts in AZ his numbers would look legit. He got roughed up there a few times. But he gives that rotation the LHP they don’t have.
Reyes is going to be legit. You can tell by his approach. It’s like Juan Soto, he doesn’t give up at bats. He has value in the industry but because he wasn’t a shiny prospect no need to downgrade his inclusion in the trade.
Yates has been an elite setup man since San Diego tasked him with those duties 2 years ago. He isn’t a fluke either and replaces everything Cody Allen left and more.
& if you really want to- instead of spending money on the LH relief pitching market to address Miller’s departure. Why not give Logan Allen a look. Kid who the Padres got back in the Kimbrel trade had microscopic numbers in AA and AAA, almost was promoted at the end of the season. He will provide value as well.
Don’t snark at this proposal, it is actually pretty good.
Burgeezy
It’s actually not
Michael Chaney
Yeah, that’s definitely a fair offer from the Padres’ perspective. But that’s, quite frankly, an awful offer to the Indians, and you’re not acknowledging that.
Just because it makes sense for one team, doesn’t mean it makes sense for the other.
Samuel
I see you’re a Padres fan…….
You sold me!
Those guys Cleveland gets are all wonderful – especially those pitching in the “hitters paradise that is the NL West” – like Petco, Dodger Stadium, AT&T Park, and the one in Phoenix that made adjustments to help pitchers in 2018.
I know you’re being generous, but unless the Indians also throw in Lindor, it just would’t be sporting to take advantage of your one-sided offer.
hockeyjohn
Bleacher Bum, no way would that deal would get Kluber. Any trade for Kluber would have to include a couple of your top 100 prospects along with an mlb outfielder and a bullpen piece. Again, Cleveland will only trade him if they get their price and meet their needs.
xabial
Why! I thought with their recent financial motivated trades, there’s no need to, they’re not as desperate to trade their aces
ken48tribe
But now the purpose of trading Kluber would be to fill a hole or two and restock the farm system.
brewcrew08
Why do the Reds want to trade their future for Kluber? They wont even be competitive for the next 3 years. Then Kluber walks. Trading your top level guys make no sense
claymc
If the Reds front office is serious about adding top-end pitching talent (a big if, I know), I wouldn’t be so quick to count them out. No one will claim they’re a piece or two from being World Series favorites, but they could easily be a piece or two from being competitive. They already have a top-10 offense with expected gains in all 3 OF positions being realized in the very near future. Votto “should” age gracefully, and nearly the entire offense is under control for 3+ years. The bullpen took a huge step forward last year and I’d argue they’re on the cusp of being top-10 as well. The only glaring hole in this team is a complete lack of starting pitching. If they added a pitcher like Kluber and maybe one more mid to back end of the rotation starter to their current rotation of Castillo, Roark, and DeSclafani, I wouldn’t be surprised if this team is playing wild card caliber baseball very soon.
It’s easy to hate on the Reds. But they’re slowly coming out of this rebuild and are going to catch a lot of Reds haters off guard.
norcalguardiansfan
If this report is true, the Reds clearly believe they are about to break out. That is the only reason I can think of to trade for someone of Kluber’s status.
RedRooster
They wont even be competitive for the next 10 years.
FTFY
zachary08
Throw in Garrett with the Gennett Trammel Greene package
titanic struggle
Umm… NO.
Yankeepatriot
The central is so bad that they can cut salary and reload the farm with a kluber trade and STILL win the division in 2019
Marius
I hear you. I have no idea why the ChiSox haven’t gone all in on this year’s Free Agency. They could own this division for years with some key additions and all of their young core starting to produce.
Priggs89
Because outside of the two 26 year olds, there isn’t any free agent worth overpaying for this year. They’re better off saving their money and waiting for Arenado/Rendon and some of the pitching next year.
DannyP
I think the Astro’s should offer Tucker + some lower level prospects for Kluber. After signing Brantley the Astros have enough depth in the outfield and could use another Ace. Imagine going against a playoff rotation led by Verlander, Cole, and Kluber. paired with their solid lineup.
baseballpun
Under no circumstances should Cleveland trade Kluber to an AL club.
Polish Hammer
Especially not Houston, a team they need to get through to get what they want (title).
RedRooster
If they planned on winning a title anytime soon this article wouldn’t exist
Samuel
What makes you think this article is true?
Polish Hammer
Cock a doodle doo…do you realize a team trying to get over the hump could deal from depth to fill needs? It’s not a dumpster fire, not even a salary purge anymore. They have to trim some payroll and already have, but the interested generated in Kluber when everyone thought they could get him is too much for the Tribe FO to not consider to put together a solid lineup card. Kluber is a beast, but take him out of the rotation and fill it with one of the other candidates and they still win the division and make the playoffs. Now some offense could get them advancing.
RedRooster
They make the playoffs without Kluber because they play in the weakest division in baseball. If I’m Antonetti and I intend on making the playoffs and actually going far in the playoffs trading Kluber is the last thing on my mind.
norcalguardiansfan
I couldn’t agree more. Moving Kluber to another AL club is self defeating.
thelastonetodie
Way more than tucker, I know they won’t trade Whitley but their 2,3 prospects and a couple lower ones maybe
Indiansjoe
If Whitley is truly untouchable then Kluber will never end up there. The talks should start with tucker and Whitley or move on.
ksoze
@indiansjoe, are you insane, no way do you get Tucker and Whitley. You are way overvaluing 3 years of control.
jbigz12
If the stros put tucker and Whitley on the table the deal would be done before Antonetti could say yes. The Astros have a very deep system and could that deal done with one of them + some of the others. No way CLE gets both
thelastonetodie
Way more than tucker, I know they won’t trade Whitley but their 2,3 prospects and stasi and a lower grade prospect
hockeyjohn
A trade for Kluber would cost Tucker and Whitley, James, or other higher prospects. The price would be high.
rdsfan05
Is this as ridiculous as I believe it to be the reds are not on the level of the the brewers, cards, or the cubs much less the power houses like the Yankees dodgers stros or red Sox’s and to give up the farm for a guy at the end of his career when we’re still a two to three years out of contention
thegreatcerealfamine
Well said, the Reds have some really exciting prospects in their system, and it would be a shame to trade top prospects for a pitcher of his age. If they’re gonna go get some top pitching best to wait till next offseason and sign a couple free agents.
Psychguy
LA greater need at catcher and building a better pen especially if they are going to lift starters after 5 or 6 innings.
dodgerskingsfan
need a 3rd starter with WS B2B losses…. dodgers will get bp help and C too, but need 3 horses at the top of the rotation
WarrenSpahn
totally agree with this. Dodgers can only rely on Kershaw and Buehler next season. Rich Hill and Alex Wood get rocked way too much. Ryu is always injured. Kluber would be a fantastic fit…
norcalguardiansfan
I’m really skeptical that the Indians will trade Kluber this winter. Their financial motivation to move him is gone, so a team that trades for Kluber will really have to bowl the Tribe over.
It was gonna hurt, before. Now, it will be really painful to get him……I’m seriously wondering if any team will pay up what the Indians are likely to ask for.
baseballpun
They freed up some 2019 money so they could still sign a bat. They really should keep Kluber and go all in this season while the rest of the division isn’t really posing a threat. They can trade Kluber next off-season if they feel they need to kick-start a rebuild/re-tool.
Michael Chaney
Winker, Senzel, Tony Santillan, and a PTBNL for Kluber. Who says no?
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
That’s probably very close to a “yes” on both sides. I think the Indians might ask to swap out Winker for Siri and for the Reds to add a lotto ticket to that.
ksoze
I’d much rather trade Siri than Winker. I still wouldn’t do this trade. I keep Senzel, and go all in on Dallas Keuchel. Trammell as the centerpiece, and I’m in.
rdsfan05
That’s a really fair trade in my opinion but I just don’t like it on the reds part Bc kluber has a huge price and for good reason, yet this just doesn’t make sense right now for the reds
Marius
Kluber to the Reds makes no sense at all. He is a guy to put a team over the top. I could understand if he had four or five years left on his contract, but the Reds haven’t even completed the re-build yet.
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
As we saw in 2018, the NL Central could easily be up for grabs in any given year. The Reds could give it a shot for one or two years with Kluber, then if not in contention, trade him again and recoup pretty close to what they gave away.
Marius
Maybe when they start sniffing a .500 record will I believe that the Reds are ready to overthrow the Cubs and Brewers
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
Maybe, but if you are Cincy and add Kluber, you automatically just added probably 10 wins to your record just by upgrading the rotation and dropping your worst starter. That’s a big step in the right direction.
Not even to mention how many more tickets you sell in his 30 or so starts. You probably add half a million to your attendance as well.
Marius
So they go from a 67 win team to a 77 win team and lose two to three core players who will most likely be above replacement level
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
You just never know though with prospects. I remember the Tribe trading Sabathia and getting “can’t miss, future High WAR” prospect Matt LaPorta. He was horrible. The lotto ticket in that deal was Michael Brantley.
Teams and fans WAY overvalue their prospects.
Marius
I am a Jays fan so of course I overvalue my Guerrero Jr lol
Tim Newport
That’s exactly why it usually takes several prospects. You can’t say that a half season of CC wasn’t a small price for all the play you got from Brantley, can you?
rdsfan05
That doesn’t make sense your saying jump start the rebuild again why not just finish the rebuild
augold5
Having the best two teams(by record) in the NL doesn’t make the NL Central a toss up. With Goldy on the Cards this could be the best division in the NL. If anything because the Reds are in the NL Central it would be stupid to try and go for the division title. They have too many holes right now to compete with the top teams in the division. They are better off waiting a couple years, see how some of the prospects pan out and trade from depth to fill the holes. Trading the top of their farm for an aging ace with 3yrs of control is a risky move and one that most likely doesn’t get them to the playoffs
RedRooster
What? The Central had the teams with the two best records in the NL and neither one is losing anyone important this offseason.
And the Reds are not going to get nearly the same return for a year or two of Kluber that they gave up for three years of him.
Black Ace57
I would be fine with the Phillies trading any prospect but Sixto for Kluber.
halfbakedmcbride
I think this is exactly the kind of trade where Sixto is involved…
Black Ace57
I feel like Adonis Medina, Adam Haseley, and then Alex Bohm/Jhaylin Ortiz/Another pitcher is a competitive offer. If Kluber was 2-3 years younger I understand giving up Sixto but not at his age.
hockeyjohn
Cleveland needs MLB ready outfielders in a trade for Kluber. Philly has no MLB ready top outfield prospect to trade, There are also no current outfielder on the Phillies team that moves the needle. If a trade is made, I don’t see a trade without including Sixto.
MahatmaGagne
Verdugo is what distinguishes the Dodgers ahead of other teams vying for Kluber. He is MLB ready and Dodgers March uo well
Regi Green
I’d be fine with them giving up a package including Sixto…
Nl east is tight,and adding Kluber to the rotation,could be as big as adding either Harper or Machado to the lineup…with a very reasonable 3 yr commitment.
David Makai
I think getting Kluber would be a little less impactful to the Phillies then signing Machado, and Especially Harper. But yeah getting Kluber would be huge.
codylg
Remember when the Yankees tried getting Trammell for Gray? Haha
thegreatcerealfamine
Where did you see that?
codylg
nypost.com/2018/12/10/yankees-asked-for-stud-reds-…
xabial
cereal, take a guess the author of that nyp article…
thegreatcerealfamine
I saw that garbage and of course chalked it up to, Joel being Joel. I still can’t believe that hack has a HOF vote.
Slevin
So other teams don’t use high asks?
MetsYankeesRedSox
I don’t attempt anything important when I’m high.
Slevin
Putting the jelly up ones nose tends to have that effect
Burgeezy
In the past the Reds have required more from the Indians in potential trades then they did from other teams so I hope the Indians turn the table on the reds and do the same. I don’t see a trade occurring between the two teams.
zacbinks
If anyone has trouble believing the majority of people in the world are morons, I just tell them to go read internet comments.
Psychguy
Well look who is in the White House and how he got there.
zacbinks
1. Don’t bring politics here.
2. Trump is the president because he out played his competition and won a popularity contest. The presidency is old fashioned and heinous.
Psychguy
I bow to your superior intelligence, perhaps not.
zacbinks
There are plenty of intelligent people, I’m probably not one of them but I still think.
Anyway a Reds trade for Kluber would be lesser on paper than what the White Sox got for Chris Sale because Kluber is older and Sale wasn’t owed much cash at the time. Taylor Trammell would definitely be the starting point to the conversation though. Suarez and Senzel, definitely not.
baseballpun
Funny how “don’t bring politics here” is only ever said in response to one brand of political comment.
norcalguardiansfan
Sale, as good as he was, wasn’t as successful as Kluber, though. I think the Indians should ask for at least something about the level of the Sale deal. 2 top 100 prospects or equivalent, controllable major leaguers, an established relief pitcher and a low level prospect would do it.
zacbinks
You and 99% of the users here might all agree Kluber has equal or higher value than Sale did but it’s just not true. Baseball is an analytic driven game and analytics show that players past age 30 suffer from injuries at a higher rate and overall play decreases. Sale was 27 at the time of trade, so the Red Sox were getting him in his “prime” years.
You and I can disagree that Kluber will degrade over the next 3 seasons. Our opinions don’t outweigh what the analytics show, which is ultimately what will factor into the lessening of Kluber’s trade value.
beyou02215
Verdugo, the catching prospect the Dodgers like less (Ruiz or Smith), maybe Rios and a pitching piece.
tac3
I like Kluber, one of my favorite pitchers to watch work his craft, but the Indians have beaten him like a rented mule the last few years, I’d be weary. With that said, I’d make an offer, but I’d go with a “B” offer be an “A” level offer, and I’m sure that doesn’t get it done. He’d be nice to have at a fair price, not an overpay
Michael Chaney
The only way a team gets him would be in an overpay. Aces don’t just come for free, especially from contending teams.
Dbird777
You’d be wary. Kluber’s the one who’s got to be weary.
yamsi1912
Make it happen Angels.
socalbum
Are the Indians trying to trade more payroll to make a big offer for Harper? They have significantly reduced payroll already so why trade one of the top starting pitchers in MLB when he is still under control for 3 years — at the team’s option??? Even Dodgers with more starting pitchers than they can use would love to have Kluber, so why trade him if you are planning to compete for WS?
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
That would be the shocking plot twist of the century. Tribe trades Kluber for a haul of prospects, then signs Bryce Harper to play RF. As Jim Carrey says: “So you’re saying there’s a chance??”
socalbum
Not trying to predict, I just don’t understand the reasoning behind trying to trade Kluber now that payroll has been substantially reduced. Perhaps I am overvaluing Kluber, but I think he is terrific and would love to see him somehow move to the Dodgers
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
I’m trying not to be a cynic, but I think it’s just a matter of the owner telling the FO to cut payroll.
Despite the success Cleveland has had these last few years, for almost the entire time Dolan has owned the team, he has been a really cheap owner that would embarrass the Pirates, Mets, or Marlins ownership.
I hope I’m wrong, but I’ve seen the cost cutting way too much for ten years and only investment in the team for the last two or so.
The Dodgers and Indians do match up really well for a deal. Probably the best of any team.
Burgeezy
The narrative that Dolan won’t spend in the Indians is old and tired and simply not true. They have had record payrolls in recent years and spent big money on free agents that have had varying degrees of success while attendances has continued to decrease. There is no point in spending money just to spend and the retooling of this roster has as much to do with winning in the future as it does with cutting dead weight for the upcoming season.
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
Oh please. In 2001, the Indians had a $93.4 million payroll. They did not exceed that number under Dolan’s ownership in any year until 2016, or FIFTEEN YEARS LATER.
These fans that show up to defend Dolan and say he spends aggressively clearly cannot think any further than the most recent 2 years.
Think I’m making that up? Go to Cot’s Contracts and see all of the Indians’ payrolls since Dolan bought the team at the turn of the century. The Indians have had a great run these last three years in spite of ownership. Not because of it.
Burgeezy
So the moves the front office makes to build a winner have no bearing on the ownership whereas when they don’t spend or send out costly underperforming veterans it is directly reflective of the team’s owner being a cheapskate? That is a ridiculous and asinine notion. Ownership is responsible for every successful move this team has made whether they were directly or indirectly approved.
The Indians team that Dolan acquired was going nowhere and the same can be said for many years in which the payroll did not exceed the arbitrary number you chose. Also, consider the level of attendance of those late 90’s team versus those of the mid 2000’s, early 2010’s, or even the last couple of years. It is order of magnitudes easier to spend record levels of money on payroll when consistently selling out the ballpark than it is when you rank in the bottom third of the league despite fielding a winner.
There is literally no point in dumping money into poor contracts via free agency when the team is rebuilding, which is what it was doing for the bulk of the 2000’s hence lower payroll levels. When it developed quality players they were extended and at times those contracts hamstrung the team and its payroll like Kip’s is doing now. There is little to no point in signing aging veterans to expensive contracts based on past performance. That is what losing teams do.
norcalguardiansfan
Thank you, Burgeezy.
Snapper
Burgeezy you apparently don’t follow the Cleveland Indians. The Dolan’s are cheap. Plain and simple. They do not have the financial means to compete with other owners. Most owners of pro sports teams see owning said teams as a toy or hobby. The Dolan’s try to make a living off the team. That doesn’t work. There are numerous examples as proof. As a life long tribe fan, I just wish the family would sell the team.
Burgeezy
No I most definitely am a Tribe fan, lifelong tribe fan. I am quite aware that they are a small market team and have to operate as such, which is apparently something you and Julio don’t understand. If they were truly trying to make a living off of the team ticket prices, concessions, and memorabilia would be quite more expensive. Truth of the matter is that Progressive field is one of the cheaper venues to catch a game at. Be careful what you wish for.
WarrenSpahn
i.e. Dolan is cheap…
norcalguardiansfan
I have been a Tribe fan since 1974 and I agree wholeheartedly with Bureezy. I’m really sick of this Dolan is Cheap stuff. Over the past six years the Indians have the best record in baseball.
THE BEST RECORD IN BASEBALL.
I understand that they haven’t won a World Series, but that is largely a crap shoot. What more do you want from this ownership?
lm1330
Indians really are not cheap if you look at revenue coming in compared to payroll. Based on that, I would think they have been in the top third in baseball.
Michael Chaney
If anything, I imagine they’d make a massive extension offer to Lindor before swimming in the Harper or Machado markets
indiansfan44
I said it as a joke at the start of the Kluber trade rumors to trade him and go after Harper but is it really that out of the question now? From what I understand the Indians count buyouts for next year into this years budget so they saved 10 million this year with EE gone 8 with Gomes and 9 with Alonso so around 25 million depending on things like the salary of the guys in the Gomes trade. Kluber is another 17 million so 42-44 million saved if it’s all near ready prospects and no big salaries in return. More than enough to offer Harper a deal in the 30-35 million range and have money left for relief help. Plus you cleared 17 million for the next 2 years with Kluber traded and 17 million more with Kipnis gone and Yu Chang looking to be nearly ready to take 3rd in 2020 with Ramirez sliding to 2nd.
It’s a REAL Longshot but who knows.
norcalguardiansfan
Not happening.
renegadescoach
People still don’t understand that the Indians are not rebuilding, they’re just “reprioritizing” different areas of need. They have an excess of excellent SPs so they are dealing one of them to improve in other areas.
To that end, I’d say the Phillies make a lot of sense here, as they can help the Tribe in another way: they can take Kipnis and his salary of their hands. How about a trade of Kluber and Kipnis to Philly for Odubel Herrera, Vince Velasquez, Maikel Franco and one of their suddenly abundant bullpen pieces? Ramirez can slide to 2B, Franco takes over at 3B, and Odubel solidifies the OF.
As for Philadelphia, Kipnis can play a super utility role or take over fulltime in CF when Quinn inevitably gets hurt.
beyou02215
I think the Indians need a top tier, close to the majors prospect coming back, and Kipnis only has 1 year left.
Burgeezy
Kluber will cost more than the Phillies’ spare parts.
Juggy
Cleveland does not want those bust from Philadelphia believe me I went to at least 30 Phillies games last year … trade with San Diego
hockeyjohn
3 average or less players for a two time Cy Young pitcher. No Chance.
carlosrosette76
AJ Preller here is a Pitcher we can get back to a SD Padre Uniform, let”s make a Trade,…. Send One of Framill Reyes or Hunter Renfroe , 2 Minor league Pitcher . for. Corey Klubber or Trevor B. will be nice . We need Pitching they need Outfielders they just lost Brantley …
Michael Chaney
Why do all Padres fans think Franmil Reyes is the next Babe Ruth? He won’t move the needle much in an offer for an ace.
agentp
Andujar, Frazier, Florial, Chance Adams and Jordan Montgomery for Kluber.
I’m sure the Tribe could do better but for a team like them, who still expects to compete, getting back so many guys so close to the show (or whom have already experienced success in it) is better than a prospect in the low minors whose name has more shine than their accomplishments.
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
You clearly cannot be a Yankees fan, because frankly, the Yanks are giving up too much with that proposal.
I’m shocked actually, after seeing so many Yankee fans saying, “Sonny Gray for Kluber”.
beyou02215
The Indians would do that. Not sure NYY would.
rdsfan05
That’s a huge overpay with andujar who’s an elite hitter even tho he is a horrendous defender; along with Frazier who could be a reliable guy and florial and chance Adams who had down years in the minors but could be very average to slightly above average major leaguers and Montgomery is just over kill to that package
Indiansjoe
Adams is so good the Yankees have not given him a chance 2 years in a row, andujar is dangled in ever conversation because they don’t have a place to play him…no team but maybe the padres gets Kluber without including the number one prospect, which in that case would have to include makensie gore, so that package would actually be close to what gets talks started. But I don’t know that would be enough to send a top 3 pitcher in al to a fellow contender. But hey maybe see if you can get sale, verlander or snell for that
agentp
I don’t think it’s enough, Frazier and Gumby are hurt. Andujar has great potential but if he’s truly one dimensional, that’s not a huge haul from the Tribes stand point. The Indians can do better than my opined deal.
lm1330
Andujar is terrible at third. That is why the Yankees are shopping him.
costanza
Might as well throw Judge, Torres, and Severino in too.
agentp
Really? You’re comparing multiple years of sustained success with Sevy and Judge with the group I mentioned? Getting a stud like Kluber is gonna hurt. He’s one of the best pitchers in baseball on a team friendly deal for three years. Pitching is expensive. Look at what guys who pitch to 5 ERA get nowadays. Harvey and Lynn come to mind as prime examples of guys that appear to be no better than replacement level cost, and they’re each over 10M AAV, they are just some recent examples that demonstrates that fact.
Jason Hall
If the Reds get Kluber would they have enough left to go after Pollock to cover CF or would they be done other than low end FAs. What’s Kluber cost a year? If they give up Senzel or Trammel, Scooter could be kept for second and Pollock could take care of CF if they could swing both of there contracts. Especially with Bailey coming off the books next year.
Colorado Red
Hard to get Pollock, but I do think they could do it.
I would give up Nick, Iggy, and a low level lottery ticket.
Marius
I wouldn’t give up 6+ years of Senzel for two years of an Ace unless I had a shot at the World Series
Michael Chaney
Kluber is under control for three years, not two
Marius
Roger, thanks. Same rule applies though. Give up stud prospects only when you know you have a shot. Kluber alone won’t do squat for a 67 win team.
ksoze
Kluber or no Kluber the Reds will be higher than a 67 win team. If they were to make no changes beyond what they have done already, I’d guess mid 70’s in wins. Add a stud like Kluber and you’re fighting for a wild card.
1988wasalongtimeago
If my Dodgers don’t make this trade how else will we embarrass the fan base and lose in the World Series again?
MetsYankeesRedSox
By not firing Dave Roberts.
Julio Franco's Birth Certificate
I just heard Chris Antonetti on the radio in Cleveland asked “Do you have a budget for 2019”? He said very emphatically, No.
LOL, even the sportscaster (who is very friendly to the Indians organization) called him out and said who operates without a budget for the current year? Oh boy – this is a cost cutting move. Flat out for Antonetti to lie like that.
bucketbrew35
The Cleveland Front Office is so damn cheap.
Bald Vinny
Devers for Kluber.
MachoMan for 3rd.
Charlie 12
Devers is too much…maybe Holt instead
Slevin
Josh Ockime, Jay Groome, CJ Chatham, Swihart for Kluber and Kipnis. Get it done DD!
CalcetinesBlancos
Tribe would be stupid to move him for anything less than a ridiculous haul. AL Central is very winnable for any team, and if you trade Kluber you might as well trade Lindor too.
bobtillman
Ercerg (not as good as rated), Burns (better than he’s rated) and Santana should get it done…….
bigm
If the Yankees want to compete with the Red Sox and Astros they need to make the Kluber trade or they will be third best again next year. The only upgrade we got for starting pitching is Paxton and he’s known to get injured a lot. Sevy Tanka Happ and CC didn’t get it done last year or year before so what makes Cashman think it will work this year. Trade who you need to trade to get Kluber then yAnkees jump from third best to #1 on paper. Most of these prospects won’t even play for yankee
codylg
The Yankees will offer Gray for Kluber and then Kluber will be called “another Sonny Gray” when Cleveland tells them to pound sand.
Adam6710
While I agree about that rotation on paper, let’s remember they won 100 games with 2 dozen starts going to scrubs like the not-ready Domingo German, Chance Adams, Jonathan Loaisiga, and Luis Cessa. 15 terrible home starts by Sonny Gray.
And in a playoff series, replacing Sabathia with Paxton is a HUGE upgrade.
But like I said, on paper that rotation does not impress the Red Sox or Astros.
Yankeepatriot
The astros only have cole and verlander left. While that’s a great tip 2 the rest of their rotation is blank right now and as such the Astros while still a good team aren’t looking as strong as the previous two years at this time. Also while sale is great let’s not act like the Sox have an amazing dominating rotation
bdpecore
Kluber will likely cost the Brewers Keston Hiura, Corbin Burnes/Freddy Peralta and Corey Ray which might be worth it if Corey can get them over the hump and into the WS especially if Jimmy Nelson can even get back to 75% of his former production. Sign Jed Lowrie and call it an offseason.
Juggy
Kluber, or Bauer definitely needs to be be traded and go to a winner like the Yankees, or the Red Sox’s so at least he would have a shot at a potential World Series.
norcalguardiansfan
Ya, you’re right, Juggy. It’s not as if they have ever been in the World Series, or anything….
…..not much of a memory, huh?
ncbravesfan95
I’d be in Kluber for Ender and Teheran
Begamin
Yeah i still do not see the Indians trading Kluber. Bauer maybe, but I think that is extremely unlikely too.
Dbird777
Agreed. Especially if they think they’re going to land a Quintana-sized haul for him. That was an outlier of a trade, and one the Cubs will probably end up regretting.
Begamin
The Cubs did not handle a lot of trades well. Still cant believe they gave up Torres for a couple months of Chapman
ReverieDays
You make trades to win the World Series. The Cubs made that trade and won the World Series. Why stockpile talent if you dont ever win? Torres is good but might just end up another Starlin Castro. Doesn’t really matter because Chapman helped carry the team the entire second half and the postseason.
Dbird777
Trammell, okay. But NOT Senzel. Scooter or Barnhart, yes. NOT Winker.
hockeyjohn
Dbird Cody Anderson not Kluber. Yo7 have to give something to get something.
Dbird777
Trammell’s something.. Scooter an all-star and Barnhart’s an upgrade over anything the Tribe’s had at C for a long time. I’d throw India in. That’s a pretty good haul for Kluber.
titanic struggle
I’ll say it first…Sometimes, the best trade you make is the one you don’t make. I wouldn’t trade Senzel for anyone right now.
bravesfan
Braves need to be in this sweepstakes… at least be in the rumors somehow so braves fans feel like you are trying.
Erie4312
Maybe Braves could get him for Riley, Drew Waters, Bryce Wilson, and Allard
bravesfan
Umm yea I would say that safe to say lol. But that’s overkill and way too much. 4 top 100 prospects? All of which look legit… I mean that’s just silly. Two top 100 prospects + 1 top 25 in our organization is more than enough. Throw in one project lower lvl minor that people always seem to love for good measures.
Indiansjoe
You don’t have the major league pieces to accompany 2 top 100 prospects, so yea it’s gonna take more than 2 top 100 prospects….this is a must win trade scenario for Cleveland. They either clearly win or walk away with one of the 5 best pitchers in baseball still on the team. This is an overpay or move on situation
tigerbreak
O’Neill, Martinez and spare parts don’t even get you in the conversation for Kluber, lol.
Kluber is a capital “A” ace that you control for 3 seasons. The discussion starts with above average MLB regulars with 4+ years control or your very best prospects.
STL would have to give up something like Bader, Reyes, Gomber+ to be in the conversation.
Nathan
I think it’s more of an “and” situation. Above avg outfielder (ideally) AND top prospects
jbigz12
I’d probably do Bader, Reyes, and Gomber for Kluber. Reyes has health issues but at minimum you shove him in the bullpen and let him eat guys alive. On top of that you get Bader for CF and Gomber gives you another lefty starter/swing man type with upside. I’d probably be happy w that return if I were Cleveland.
stansfield123
I hope the Yanks are still in this. If they could get Kluber without giving up Andujar, that would be a massive coup.
It would be hard, because their farm system is no longer what it was (mainly because of promotions, trades played a lesser role, which is pretty awesome), but if they gave up everything they have left (Frazier, Florial, Loaisiga, Abreu, even draft picks if that’s what it takes), and throw in let’s say Gray and take on Kipnis with all his salary… that just might get it done.
And then they would be all set, except for the bullpen….which happens to be the area most easily filled out of free agency, this winter.
It would also allow them to massively improve the team, without taking a huge long term risk with Machado. And sure, it would pretty much wipe out the upper levels of the farm system, but that’s okay: the infrastructure and know how are staying put, so they should have no problem rebuilding the farm system for when they need it next, in 3-4 years.
tigerbreak
Andujar, Florial, Loaisiga and a flyer guy like Montgomery ought to get it done.
MDNyyClipper07
I wouldn’t quite consider Montgomery a flyer guy
titanic struggle
Yankee fans…always singing something for nothing…
BrewCrew54
What would the Brewers be trading in a deal for Kluber? Certainly the Indians could care less for Santana, Thames or Broxton.
Erie4312
Braves- Verdugo, Puig (Dodgers send 6-7 mil to ATL of Kipnis contract)
Dodgers- Kluber, Kipnis
Indians- Pache, Gohara, Will Smith
Indians then can sign a OF for 2 years until Pache arrives, also get promising starter and catcher
ATL gets Puig for 2019 and then Verdugo is closer to MLB than Pache, OF is set for next four years and they can acquire pitching help next (thru FA)
LA gets Kluber for a push to WS
Indiansjoe
Lol, no! Verdugo, Puig, Dustin May, Ruiz and woods would be a deal that Cleveland would have trouble walking away from. Puig gives them a bat this year and qo pick next. Don’t need braves involved for the dodgers Indians deal
Erie4312
Braves are in to save the dodgers farm system
Knowthemarket
Braves fan here and I don’t see why the Dodgers would need the Braves either. In fact I think the Dodgers could keep Wood and May and the trade would still be a little over pay still.
Syndergaarden Cop
puig is trash, dont want him. also doubt the braves want a rookie starting in the OF, sounds like they want a more proven commodity like peralta, haniger, etc.
WarrenSpahn
You have to like the way Puig rattled punk-az Bumgarner though…
olereb
Braves don’t want Puig, at least I hope they dont
hockeyjohn
Atlanta is getting more than they are giving up. Verdugo better fits Cleveland’s needs than Pache does as Verdugo is MLB ready. I like Atlanta’s top end pitching prospects, but you don’t have the outfielder that we need.
Priggs89
They do if they make Inciarte available, which wouldn’t be a huge stretch if they added 2 MLB-level outfielders in Puig and Verdugo.
augold5
Santana wouldn’t be the headliner, but he certainly could be a player they covet
indiansfan44
Don’t forget Verlander and Cole are free agents after 2019 as well. We also can’t forget Verlander will be 36 this year and age will catch up to him eventually. The offense is in good shape for a few years but if they don’t address the rotation long term they are going to be in trouble.
Samuel
Finally……..
Someone got it!
Verlander is already pitching at around double Kluber’s salary. Cole is going to want big bucks.
Getting Kluber for something like $50m over 3 years keeps the Astros in contention.
slider32
Billy Eppler, this is your chance to get a great pitcher, give them Calhoun, Adell, and Thaisis, for Kluber., and then sign either Miey or Fiers, Soria, and Herrera.. Then go and sign Jones or Markakis. That will give you a good chance at a wild card. Otherwise trade Trout and rebuild.
tigerbreak
This isn’t even close to what would get Kluber. Adell, Canning, Jahmai Jones, and Chris Rodriguez keeps them from hanging up on Eppler. Calhoun is an average bat, and Thaiss is off C and 1B power types are a dime a dozen.
Knowthemarket
You want to hold onto your top pitching prospect, I get it. Can you do that and still get Kluber? I don’t know, the Angels farm is pretty shallow. Adell is a legit headliner though. But where I scratch my head is, why do you think the Indians would want Calhoun? It looks to me like you went through your roster and found a player that is pretty neutral in how he impacts the Angels roster and passed him along as a trade chip.
ekrog
Maybe the Reds can package up Scott Scudder and Jack Armstrong. It worked in 1992.
Central Valley
Kluber or Bumgarner?
titanic struggle
Hahahaaaa!!!
astick
I wonder if India, Gutierrez, Long and Siri would land Kluber. Long and Gutierrez are close. Siri is a wildcard and India profiles similar to Senzel. With Kluber’s age, albeit he is great, I think that is a fair deal. Yeah? Or am I a loser that can go to hell?
hockeyjohn
astick, your proposal is nowhere good enough to get Kluber. I will just leave it at that.
astick
Thanks for not making fun of me. I appreciate it.
titanic struggle
Maybe add a Schebler…
Priggs89
Man, most of these trade proposals are laughably bad.
Note to all – If you want your team to trade for Kluber, it WILL hurt. He’s not being traded for your spare parts. We’re talking TOP prospects and/or TOP young MLB talent. And “top prospects” doesn’t mean top 100 guys, it means top 25ish (likely 1 in or close to the top 10). He’s one of the very, very few legit aces we have in the MLB, and he has 3 years of cheap control left.
And this is all coming from someone that definitely isn’t an Indians fan.
Dbird777
Let the Tribe keep him as they slowly go downhill then.
Priggs89
Oh darn, another year of making the playoffs. Whatever will they do?
Dbird777
Yeah, another year of getting destroyed in the playoffs lol. But sure, go ahead and delay the inevitable.
Jeremy Howdyshell
Their roster outside of SP, SS, 3B, 2B is laughably bad. Even in the AL central they might not get back to the playoffs without trading Kluber or Bauer
RIPprosports
Puig Kemp Verdugo May for Kluber.
That’ll be Indians starting outfield, a good pitching prospect, and frees up room for Harper on a short term but high paying contract for the Dodgers. Everyone is happy!
Priggs89
How much money is LA eating?
RIPprosports
0
That would be the Indians 2019 starting OF. If another prospect is needed to make you happy cool, but I think this would be good. 2 major league players with a stud OF prospect and a good pitching prospect.
norcalguardiansfan
Verdugo, Peterson, May and Ruiz for Kluber and pieces.
RIPprosports
PeDerson plus the Dodgers 3 top prospects isn’t worth it for Kluber and “pieces” next.
norcalguardiansfan
Ok. Then the deal doesn’t get made. Next.
titanic struggle
Their fans don’t want a “deal”…they want to r as pe someone…stay home Reds…
hockeyjohn
Reds fans want steak for the price of a hamburger.
DjRed
Awe…pour some A1 on it and the taste isn’t too different. I mean, It’s not like a lot of us reds fans haven’t witnessed a WS. Those are to prime rib like winning a crappy division is to steak in a skillet.
hockeyjohn
No way Cleveland takes on Kemp let alone Kemp and Puig. Kemp has negative value due to his large contract.. No way Cleveland takes on Kemp’s 21.5 million dollar contract. If you have Cleveland take Puig and his likely 12 million dollar contract, then at least another top prospect comes to Cleveland with Verdugo and May.
RIPprosports
cool no deal
Indians keep winning their division and go no where, We’ll keep winning everything except the WS!
hockeyjohn
Cleveland made a World Series in 2016 so we have made it as far as the Dodgers have. I still don’t see why you would think that the Indians, who are a small market team,. that are only considering trading Kluber from their starting pitching strength to redistribute their payroll to help needs in the outfield and bullpen, would trade Kluber and take on twice as much money, Let’s Score Some Runs, think of the other teams needs as well when proposing trades. Then you won’t be so hurt when your proposals are discussed.
RIPprosports
cool no deal
Indians keep winning their division and go no where, We’ll keep winning everything except the WS! I’ll keep posting this to all the Indian fans since it’ll apply to all of you. You won’t win anything with that scrub OF.
norcalguardiansfan
This is fine. We don’t have to trade Kluber. I’ll take our chances With our starting rotation and our attempt find a diamond on the scrap heap in the outfield. We’ve done it before. Well do it again. And in the playoffs anything can, and does, happen.
RIPprosports
True that! Anything can happen
iverbure
The entire reason for the Indians trading Kluber is to shed payroll… good lord these people. And Matt Kemp sucks. You realize in order for the dodgers to trade him they will have to eat at least 8 million and include a prospect or something of value just to get some team to take him right? The Indians probably wouldn’t want kemp even if he made 5 mil due to his god awful defence.
RIPprosports
Indians have shed payroll. Eventually they will have to do something via trade or spend on some FAs to address that horrible OF. Kemp sucks, but he’s an upgrade for the Indians OF. Basically, the Dodgers can trade a starting OF and some prospects ( not their top 3 like some suggested) for Kluber. Few teams , if any, can give them that kind of package.
hockeyjohn
LetsScoresomeruns, you expect to get three years of a two time AL CY Young award winning pitcher on a good contract for an overpriced OFon a one year contract and prospects not in your top three? Would you trade Kershaw for an overpriced 1 year outfielder and a teams prospects not in their top three? I doubt it.
RIPprosports
Actually if you don’t buy an OF you might not even win the division
Good Luck
hockeyjohn
You want Harper and want to push your trash, Kemp, on other teams. Cleveland’s front office is too smart for that. Cool Let’s Score Runs.. You’ll won’t get two time AL Cy Young winner Corey Kluber.
The off season is not done. Cleveland will get some outfield help. With or without Kluber, Cleveland has more solid starting pitching than the majority of teams in baseball, No one in the AL Central will come close.
RIPprosports
Harper and Kluber as Dodgers does sound great. It sounds like a WS team. I can think big. With or without them we will still be a WS caliber team. Indians on the other hand, with or without Kluber, will still just win the division in a horrible division. Kluber or your deep rotation will not take you anywhere with that horrid OF. Indians are not on that level. Your smart FO will eventually have to make a big decision and you might not like it. Just be prepared.
iverbure
Playoffs are a crapshoot. Plenty of times the best team in the playoffs doesn’t win. Take the 1988 dodgers for example. Not even close to being the best team, and yet they won it all despite losing their best hitter after game 1 of the WS.
Indians should do the smart thing and get controllable assets back for Kluber now and still be huge favourites in the AL central. Come July there will be a plethora of teams giving away free agent to be players who can and will be had for .60 cents on the dollar and the Indians can upgrade whatever needs a upgrade. This is how smart small market teams stay competitive, going all in is too risky and rarely works.
iverbure
Do the Braves not seem like the most logical fit for Kluber? Indians get him out of the AL, not sure how important this is but even with Kluber off the roster Indians are still a playoff caliber team in that division.
Braves are loaded with prospects, and ones who are close to Mlb ready who the Indians would probably love to get their hands on.
AA for years in TO all he talked about was controllable talent, when Kluber has 3 yrs.
Braves lack a stud SP, not that folty can’t be that if he builds on last season. Kluber is cheaper in terms of $ than Greinke.
steelerbravenation
Problem with the Braves is the prospects that are MLB ready are pitchers and the Indians are looking for positional mlb ready players.
steelerbravenation
As much as I hate to admit it I think the Padres actually make the best partners for the Indians.
Gore, Renfroe & Buddy Reed
Wahoo What a Finish!
So far yes… but still not enough of a return for the Indians to do it.
RunDMC
Why do you think so highly of Renfroe? Not a contact hitter. I would expect LAD would be a better fit with Verdugo, who has a higher ceiling and more control.
steelerbravenation
It’s not that I am high on Renfroe I just think that he would fill a position of need for the Indians and losing Kluber’s contract would free up money to sign another while San Diego has the prospects to give Cleveland a future stud arm
I just don’t feel the Dodgers have that secondary stud that they will be willing to move for Kluber.
I just feel that the Padres have the ability to offer the best overall package.
Unless the Braves are willing to move say Inciarte, Riley and a MLB ready SP prospect to take Kluber’s spot in rotation. But I feel that opens up to many holes for ATLANTA
Wahoo What a Finish!
If I’m the Indians I’m either getting Bellinger or I’m just simply hanging onto Kluber. There’s no need to trade him and the only reason we are shopping Kluber is to see if we can get a significant player in return to fill some gaping holes in our lineup. Sorry LA… Bellinger or go pound sand.
RunDMC
That’s like demanding Acuna from ATL – good luck with that. Verdugo is a great prospect and LAD have other guys that could easily suffice your needs. I’m saying this though I really want ATL to land them, but Verdugo seems like a better positional prospect than any of our guys: Austin Riley or Christian Pache.
steelerbravenation
It’s not so much that he is necessarily gonna be better than either of those 2 it’s more like Verdugo is more MLB ready to step in and play now.
imindless
Looking like verdugo is enough plus prospects sorry bud!
Wahoo What a Finish!
If that was enough the trade would already have happened. Sorry chief.
astick
Sorry, Ace.
Wahoo What a Finish!
Sorry sport
imindless
The fact that its been stated that a package around verdugo speaks volumes. Just deciding what prospects they want to give up. We will glady take kluber!
heater
Bellinger straight up for Kluber would be a steep price.
Wahoo What a Finish!
We are talking about a top 5 pitcher in baseball with multiple years of remaining club control on a fairly club friendly contract. That will drive the price up.
imindless
Who cant perform in playoffs since 2016….looking more like kershaw than an ace
Prospectnvstr
Are you serious? Kluber is a 2x Cy Young winner under contract for 3 more yrs at a VERY reasonable price (in MLB terms that is)17 M, 17.5M & 18 M. They’d have to definitely throw in a couple of midrange prospects as well.
zachary08
Gennett, Iglesias, Siri and Greene for Kluber
hockeyjohn
One year of Gennett does nothing to help the Indians. Nor does a AA outfielder that hit .229 and won’t be ready until 2020 or later. Sorry, Zachary, try again. Your offer is rejected.
ksoze
Gennett won’t work for the reasons said above. I think the trade the Reds need to do if they want Kluber bad enough has to center around Senzel. No other team in the discussion has a better prospect that could be dealt. Personally I don’t want Kluber bad enough. My guess is Kluber stays where he is in 19, or until the trade deadline at least.
steelerbravenation
What ppl fail to realize is the Indians are looking for positional players that will help now plus a stud for the future. It’s more than just 1 difference making player.
zachary08
Steelerbravenation, please read my comments
RIPprosports
Would love the Dodgers to get Kluber but they need a catcher. Need to use their prospects to get Realmuto
restingmitchface
Jeter needs to come back down to earth with his asking price first.
Jeremy Howdyshell
Traded away the whole team for nothing and now has to ask for everything from his only legitimate piece left.
agentp
I still think as soon as the Yankees sign Manny they’ll trade Andujar, Frazier and Chance Adams for Kluber. Maybe a couple more prospects on the Yankees side. I feel the CC issue has created more urgency to have a better number 6 penciled in there. With a guy like Kluber you’re getting a new ace. Those are expensive.
Wahoo What a Finish!
As an indians fan I’d do that trade in a second
hockeyjohn
Because of Frazier’s concussion problems, I would require a much better pitching prospect than Chance Adams. I would turn it down otherwise.
Wahoo What a Finish!
I don’t think you get it but never hurts to ask.
lm1330
Chad Green added makes that deal work.
puigpower
This is a no-brainer for LA. I can live with Austin Barnes and a cheap option for a staff with Kluber in it. Then again, trading Verdugo means the Dodgers probably sign Harper. Also cool.
goldenmisfit
If this man getting Harper and adding Kluber to Kershaw and Buehler I would definitely have no problem parting with Verdugo
yes
Verdugo, a minor leaguer, averages 10 HR per 500 ab.
What insanity.
rnelson
Trammel, Stephenson and low level for Kluber.
hockeyjohn
Senzel, Winker, and Hughes for Kluber. Why would Cleveland want Stephenson?
ksoze
@rnelson is probably talking about the catching prospect Tyler Stephenson. There is no way the Reds would trade both Senzel and Winker.
DjRed
The reds aren’t trading Senzel.
hockeyjohn
Then the Reds aren’t getting Kluber,
DjRed
I didn’t say they were. If Kluber were 27-28 then yes, but two maybe three good years left isn’t worth it.
harmoney101575
HARPER IS GOING TO ATL…. NOT THE DODGERS, NOT THE YANKEES…. BEST FIT IS ATL… BOOK THAT DANO!
Roosterbat
ya don’t ever trade guy like Kluber unless, of course, you are from loserville. AND.. and have a fan base who buys this product every damn time it is presented to them……it will always be a minor league town until their fan base says enough is enough…
and stays home.
is there a fan base anywhere in the whole world that would except this? whats the upside?….one SuperBowl appearance? or maybe another World Series in the next 20 years? ….even 1 world series victory will make this city happy for the next 100 years…..loserville
pd14athletics
Am I crazy to think A’s could be in on Kluber? He’s got an affordable contract even for the A’s, plus they could flip him in a year or two. If you think A’s could be interested, are Fowler and Barreto a good starting point? If Verdugo is being considered, I feel Fowler is a comparable. Bat might not be as good, but I feel he has better wheels and D.
Frisco500
Tho I think Verdugo is overrated, he carries a lot more value than Fowler. Kluber is one of the best pitchers in baseball. Cle would probably hang up the phone if they were offered a defense first guy along with a prospect or should i say suspect like Barreto as the centerpiece
wrigleywannabe
I wanna play…. Happ, Heyward, Russell, Caratini and Chatwood for Kluber.
The Cubs would need more, though. All that quantity of potential stars and bounce back candidates would be too much.
Send us Lindor, too and we’ll call it even.
Jeremy Howdyshell
From the Reds: Johnathan India (elite prospect for 2nd, 3rd or corner outfield would be #1-2 prospect in Tribe system), Shed Long (good MLB ready second baseman would be heir apparent to Kipnis), Jimmy Herget (strong MLB ready bullpen arm), Aristedes Aquino (good defensive MLB ready outfielder with a lot of power) Matt Kemp with the $7M from Dodgers (would be a great DH or could platoon left with Kipnis and Santana solidifying Tribe outfield for this season without adding a terrible payroll hit), Curt Casali (better catcher than any the Tribe has with 4 seasons of control), David Hernandez (solid bullpen addition for this season). This would give the Tribe a top 100 prospect, and would fill their current needs with MLB ready ready talent and some proven players at needed positions. The Reds would get a legitimate ace and would be mostly sacrificing from areas of organizational depth. This would also be an even trade in salaries allowing both teams to still pursue free agents for their remaining needs, but as a Reds fan I would rather just sign Dallas Keuchel.
sid
Sorry man: the “Im a fan of this team, we will give you a poop platter and not Senzel or Trammel” will not work. The Indians front office is not stupid. They have an ace, the most valuable thing in the sport who is signed for 3 years. They are not getting swindled for a bunch of C+ prospects
Jeremy Howdyshell
The Indians have already been considering Verdugo from the Dodgers who is less highly regarded than either Senzel or Trammell. He’s on the same tier of prospects as Johnathan India so India should be on the table as a centerpiece. Even an ace (mind you a 32 y/o) ace is not worth two top 100 prospects if they want anything else especially on a team in desperate need of outfielders, bullpen and even a serviceable catcher. This would give them a top 100 prospect give them MLB ready talent at two positions of need, a 2018 all-star outfielder and a proven set-up man for the bullpen. The Indians can’t afford to build another contending field for this season out of free agency unless they get a proven outfielder and a proven bullpen arm for this season in a trade for a starting pitcher which they have more than enough and is one of only 4 good positions on the team. If they really hope to continue contending now and in the future a few positions of high quality players, several above average MLB ready prospects and a top 100 prospect is the best offer they’ll get. The only piece they could really even hope for would be one of Scott Schebler or Scooter Gennett in addition.
yes
They better not because if that happens , I am done. with them.
Jeremy Howdyshell
Then enjoy watching your Tribe go back to being garbage as they fail to field a team capable of scoring more than 2-3 runs per game because of having their entire budget wrapped up in pitching, and with no farm system to fall back on as those pitchers’ contracts quickly expire and they demand more than Cleveland can afford to pay. Cleveland needs to trade one of Kluber or Bauer or they won’t be relavent much longer, and their rebuild will be atrocious to watch.
RePete
I would have to think that any deal the Reds would put together would include Kemp now. They currently have a glut of corner OF’s, and that is an area of need for the Indians.
Jeremy Howdyshell
The Indians have already been considering Verdugo from the Dodgers who is less highly regarded than either Senzel or Trammell. He’s on the same tier of prospects as Johnathan India so India should be on the table as a centerpiece. Even an ace (mind you a 32 y/o) ace is not worth two top 100 prospects if they want anything else especially since the Tribe is in desperate need of outfielders, bullpen and even a serviceable catcher. This would give them a top 100 prospect give them MLB ready talent at two positions of need, a 2018 all-star outfielder and a proven set-up man for the bullpen and a catcher who at least won’t be a liability. The Indians can’t afford to build another contending field for this season out of free agency unless they get a proven outfielder and a proven bullpen arm for this season in a trade for a starting pitcher of which they have more than enough and is one of only 4 good positions on the team. If they really hope to continue contending now and in the future a few positions of high quality players, several above average MLB ready prospects and a top 100 prospect is the best offer they’ll get. The only piece they could really even hope for would be any one of Scott Schebler, Scooter Gennett or Michael Lorenzen. If they want Iglesias then Herget and Long would both be off the table.
Jeremy Howdyshell
Sorry everybody. Was meant as a reply. Phone glitched out and this got posted here.
hockeyjohn
Verdugo would be a piece in a trade with the Dodgers, Verdugo makes sense as he is an outfielder that Cleveland needs and is MLB ready. India is not MLB ready and 2B is not a position of need as the Indians are hoping to play Jose Ramirez at 2B. Again, the Indians DO NOT have to trade Kluber and their are several teams that are interested in him. If the Tribe doesn’t get an offer that they like from the Reds, they can talk to other teams or just keep him.
Jeremy Howdyshell
Just like India would be a piece in a trade from the Reds. You’re fooling yourself if you think the Tribe can get by without trading Bauer or Kluber. Save for 3B and SS their roster is hot garbage and they still have more than $115M in commitments even after the trades they completed meaning they don’t have the money to solidify more than a couple of their many needs without getting a return in a trade that only an ace can provide.
Burgeezy
They have the best rotation in baseball dude
Jeremy Howdyshell
But that and SS are all they have. Even the best rotation in baseball can’t win with a 2-3 run per game offense and a garbage bullpen.
hockeyjohn
That, Jeremy, is why the Indians are considering trading Bauer or Kluber to fix the needs they have in the outfield and bullpen with MLB Ready Controlled talent to help in 2019 and beyond. How does India help the Indians in 2o19? They have Santana and Jake Bauers for 1st and DH. Bauers was a top 100 prospect that can also play outfield. They also have some prospects ready to help this year. They are more than Lindor, Ramirez and the starters.
Cincinnati is not the only team that has top 1oo prospects that can help Cleveland. Also Cleveland has already saved money in their previous moves this offseason and can spend that money to help the outfield and bullpen in the free agent market, Their payroll last year was over 130 million.
Roark and Wood will help, but they are middle to bottom of the rotation starters. Kluber and Bauer are ACES. To get an ACE it will cost plenty.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
Schwarber, Happ, Chatwood and cash for Kkuber. 4 years for each Schwarber and Happ. The Cubs send them a starter and 100% of his Salary. 10 years of control for 3 years. Schwarber would finally be a DH. Happ can play just about anywhere. Chatwood after one season with the Cubs needs a change of scenery.
hockeyjohn
Cleveland does not need a DH and you can keep Chatwood.
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
They don’t have a dh and Schwarber is pretty good in left as well. Chatwood could be released.
hockeyjohn
Carlos Santana will likely share 1B and DH with Jake Bauers acquired from Tampa. Also Schwarber is not a good defensive outfielder and a career .228 hitter is not what the Indians should be targeting in a Kluber trade.
gocincy
Schwarber is a joke. In a few years, he will be non-tendered by the Cubs.
Roosterbat
nonno no and no cash..ya keep the best pitcher in baseball
Joeypower
Jeff please stop calling Cleveland (The Indians)
BrandonGregory74
I’d want Bauer over Kluber anyway. More flexibility and less long-term commitment.
restingmitchface
He’s also coming off a career-year with very little track record of success. And he seems like a complete jerk.
Roosterbat
lots of discussion about nothing. ya keep the best pitcher in baseball and you move forward by spending MORE money…..loserville USA loves to discuss their NFL draft choices and ‘rebuilding” strategies. …..
it is very very very simple. the model has been presented…….Patriots model works every single time………so if ya need to practice your typing or try to sound intellectual then keep writing nonsense. Kluber should never be traded but then again., neither should have Manny, vizquel, thome and belle…… or jim brown
yes
Remember (some of them don’t) the Blyleven for the 3 Stooges trade, fans?
JKB 2
I am surprised they are still looking to deal Kluber after they saved payroll on the trades the past few weeks.
gared2004
As a Reds fan, the opportunities to get a player like Kluber are rare. The tribe deserve a quality haul for someone like Kluber and the Reds can give them one. Trammell, Jonathan India, Schebler, DeSclafani, and even a PTBNL if need be. If you think it wouldn’t make a difference for them THIS year, I am not sure what you are looking at. Rotation: Kluber, Castillo, Wood, Roark, and Mahle with an everyday lineup with some combination of Scooter, Peraza, Votto, Puig, Suarez, Winker/Kemp, Senzel and you think that is not a roster that could at least compete for a wildcard in what has already become a more wide open NL Central?
DjRed
Good post. Basically a brand new coaching staff with a brand new philosophy. That’s not talked about too much. While I love the direction, the drive may take longer than we’re expecting. I hope not!
gared2004
You are right, the new staff and culture will definitely make a difference – it already has. Having Ward made an impact in getting Puig to begin with, and will help him adjust during his time here. If Cleveland preferred Lorenzen instead of Disco then our rotation would be even better with Disco at #4 sliding Roark to the #5 and having Mahle, Reed, Romano for depth. Unfortunately, it looks like Stephenson is going to flame out. At the very least, he needs a change of scenery.
DjRed
Perhaps Dereck Johnson is the change of scenery he needs, we’ll see. Definitely hasn’t lived up to the hype to this point.
hockeyjohn
The goal the Indians have in trading Kluber is to make the team better in 2019 and beyond. While Trammel and India would hopefully help beyond, Schebler and DeSclafani do little to help 2019. DeSclafani’s 4.93 National League ERA would not play in the American League and Schebler, at 28 years old, is what he is, an average or below average outfielder. I just don’t see this package getting Cleveland’s front office to say yes.