The Cardinals have discussed Bryce Harper as part of their talks with Scott Boras about the agent’s various clients, though it remains to be seen if the Cards are truly pursuing the free agent outfielder, Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch writes. St. Louis wasn’t one of the teams that asked for a private meeting with Harper and his camp in Las Vegas, for instance. As part of a wide-ranging talk with Goold and other reporters yesterday, Boras didn’t rule any team out of the Harper sweepstakes, and made particular mention of the Cardinals’ resources. “This is about winning and it’s about a good franchise and ownership, and the reality of it is that franchise is worth billions of dollars and they’re a top-10 revenue team,” Boras said.
Here’s more on the Cardinals’ offseason pursuits…
- Jose Martinez has received a lot of trade interest from rival teams, GM Michael Girsch told reporters (including MLB.com’s Jenifer Langosch and The Athletic’s Mark Saxon). The Cardinals have explored various possibilities for a Martinez trade, including moving him for relief pitching or even simply a prospect package. Though Martinez has hit very well in his brief career, he doesn’t have an everyday role in St. Louis now that Paul Goldschmidt is occupying first base, and Marcell Ozuna and Dexter Fowler are in the corner outfield spots. Keeping Martinez as a backup at all positions is also less than ideal given Martinez’s poor defense. As part of a reader mailbag piece, Goold mentions that the Rays have had interest in Martinez in the past, and could be a fit again since Martinez is probably best suited for DH duties on an American League team. The right-handed hitting Martinez would be a nice complement to Tampa’s current left-handed hitting first base/DH mix of Jake Bauers and Ji-Man Choi.
- Goold covers a wide variety of Cardinals questions in his mailbag piece, and he also mentions that the team has been in touch with Francisco Pena about returning as the backup catcher. Jesus Sucre and Rene Rivera are also mentioned as names who could be comfortable with the limited playing time that comes with backing up workhorse catcher Yadier Molina. Goold cites former Oriole Caleb Joseph as one available catcher who is looking for a larger portion of playing time.
- The Cards haven’t been active on the starting pitching market, according to Goold, since the team is largely comfortable with its current rotation depth. Adding another starter can’t be totally ruled out if the right fit can be found at the right price, though the Cardinals generally seem to feel that there isn’t a clear enough upgrade available at a price point that works for them.
Not joining the glut of teams walking in and out of his door while in Vegas could be a good thing. Meet with him and his team while they’re the only thing on his mind, not cluttered with 6-10 other teams.
The market for Harper seems really really small. The predictions (here and elsewhere) will likely prove inaccurate.
Go and get it Rays. Cheep efficiency is there brand name.
My phillies will be bad again. Bad G.,M And Manager well at least they won a world series,in 08 take at least another 30 yr with this owner, gm and manager. and bad scouts ,Moniak as the first pick was so bad,
they signed andrew m. for 50 mill. they will win it
all
Nah
While many fans stay on the Harper wagon as a barometer for the Cardinals off season, i’m sticking to other topics. Not trading J. Martinez would be a failure in my view. That and not greatly improving the BP from the left side are what i want to see most from this point on.
Honestly, that Genesis Cabrera guy has the makings of a lock down lefty. Shreve strikes a ton of dudes out too. I want no part of paying big free agent dollars for relievers. I think the best option is to flip Martinez for a couple Leone level up and comers that have 3+ years of control left.
LOL
Sarcasm?
I hope it was
J. Martinez doesn’t have that kind of value.
Lmao shreve is good for a homer every outing
“Cardinals generally seem to feel that there isn’t a clear enough upgrade available at a price point that works for them”
In other words………”There’s no trash for pennies-on-the-dollar available in the market right now”
So True
I was proud the Cardinals deal for Goldschmidt!! Great trade!! I thought maybe Mozeliak had turned the corner as far as his acquisition philosophies. Then I heard him on the radio!!! Same ole Mo now. Get Harper. He wants to come to St. Louis.
There’s no doubt that getting Paul Goldschmidt was a great move on their part.
But they have more holes to fill and Goldschmidt alone won’t make them a playoff team.
There is still time for Mo to make the improvements that he needs to…. but they probably only have Goldschmidt for one season so they need to go all in this year.
Report Cards go out in the middle of February…..lol
Nobody wants to go to STL. That’s a joke. Also why its a huge risk trading for Goldy with only a year left under contract.
Goldy said every player in baseball would love a chance to play in StLouis.
Was that before or after he was traded? I don’t doubt that players respect the Cardinals organization, but don’t kid yourself into thinking the city of STL is an attractive destination
Have you ever lived or spent time in St. Louis?
I in fact have/do. Have you? The Zoo is pretty nice. Maybe they can attract some animal lovers!
Yes the Zoo is very nice.
Most players live somewhere else in the offseason anyways, I don’t think it is that big of a factor. Most players will go where they are paid the most money. There is a pretty long track record of home and opposing players enjoying the atmosphere on STL, Harper included.
I agree that players follow the money and that location probably doesn’t make much of a difference. There are several great places to play ball around the league, so I think it would be ignorant to think that Busch Stadium is going to tip the scale for someone unless his other option is San Diego or something. The real issue here is when someone says “He wants to come to St. Louis.” Maybe I missed something? If we are talking about where he “wants” to be there are more obvious locations to guess.
Trade Reyes and some more prospects for Trevor Bauer…Bauer, Martinez, Mikolas, Flaherty, Wacha or Gant or Gomber would be a great rotation…build the bullpen up with money or trade and call it an offseason…that’s a playoff team
its clear the cardinals are about making the dewitts as much money as possible while staying competitive enough to keep high revenue. they wont go for harper, even though they “tried” to take on stantons big deal which they knew hed use his no trade but could show fans hey we tried! getting goldy for 1 year and adding a couple relievers will be enough for them to say they did something so dont rage on us like last year. next year they will be in a worse spot with guys leaving, and will do the short term fix to make money now. rinse and repeat. open your wallet my goodness. they bought this team for 180 mill, its worth over a billion now, theyve already made their money back by far, and rake in hundreds of millions in revenue every year. gettint sick of their cheapness even if they are the 7th highest payroll.
dont care if it creates a logjam at a certain position, how often do 26 year old superstars become available?
Bottom line is that it’s still a business. The Cards spent $160 mil last yr. And as usual they got value. They usually don’t burden themselves with bad contracts….Fowler the exception as his performance plummeted for some reason. Harpers bloated deal will be a bad contract for whomever signs him. Often injured….more hype than performance.
i understand that, but its not just harper. they will never go superstar shopping under this regime just lowball offers and leaked maybes to look like they tried.
and the fowler signing was bad as soon as it happened, it was a reactive panic move. at his best he doesnt justify that deal in my opinion.
as far as not burdening themselves with bad contracts go have you heard of greg holland? brett cecil? mike leake? mark reynolds? brandon moss? i can name more if you want
just want them to act like a top revenue team which is what they are.
I am of the opinion that they are waiting until next year to put up the ridiculous money. They will have a chance to land Goldschmidt long term and/or Arenado, and those two players fit DeWitts idea of a superstar much better than Harper, not to mention they have both been much more consistent throughout their careers. He’s been very picky on who he goes in on. Not saying if that’s they right or wrong way to do it, but it seems that that may be why they are being more conservative with Harper.
Maybe you don’t need to buy superstars for retail value? Maybe that’s why teams cycle in and out of competitive windows?
Hard to complain about a front office that never produces a losing season and is consistently averaging 90 wins for 20 years in a row.
One year contracts are not very good examples of bad contracts. Cecil and Fowler absolutely. Reynolds, Holland, Moss, Leake No.
They do act like a top revenue team. They spend relative to their revenue position in the league. Or did you mean you want them to spend money to appease fans like yourself that are going to complain regardless?
Completely Agree… It’s truly getting old knowing your obvious weaknesses on this team and never truly addressing them year after year. Hell the DeWitt Family and FO should at least spend money every 2-3 years not the penny pinching approach all the time. I would say even if they picked up 2 relievers they are not getting to 1st place in Central Division.
He has youth and upside, injuries happen. His contract will be structured for him to opt out and at some point the Cards will have an option clause too.
The opt out is usually in favor of the player. Should he over perform the contract (don’t know how that would be possible) he will seek even more somewhere else. He’s had one great yr. Trout and maybe Betts would be worth that kind of money. Not Harper. Not consistent enough.
there is no chance they open the wallet and outbid everyone else for betts or trout.
none.
Of course not but they are a couple of players who may be worth such a contract
…. they aren’t even on the market.
True but they are usaully within the first 3 or 4 years of the contract, the Cards could have an opt out clause for somewhere after 7 or 8 years with a buy out. If you commit that much money and time to one person you have to have a bailout just as the players do.
Then quit being a fan.. You dont like people making money.. Bet you work for free
Unless Mo has another lefty power bat in mind, that’s obtainable, affordable and controllable, he has to get Harper. He hasn’t landed a big time FA in 3 years.
excellent post. after harper signs somewhere else they will say they tried and made an offer so it seems like they did but truly did not.
Harper will end up in STL
At least 3 games a year, unless he goes to the AL.
Martinez seems like a good fit for Seattle assuming they deal Santana and/or Bruce. Too bad they already gave away Pazos.
Silly me, I should’ve known dealing away Santana wouldn’t mean a 1B/DH spot was opening up.
Cards need a better defensive shortstop….they’ve had trouble up the middle. Maybe talk with Texas about Profar.
DeJong isn’t going to win a gold glove, but he is above average defensively.
What is is with the hate on the left side of the infield lately? Both DeJong at short and Carpenter at third rated above average defensively last year. DeJong in particular finished near the top of shortstops according to defensive metrics. He’s not incredibly flashy, but he makes the plays, so who cares?
DeJong was second or third in baseball at shortstop in defensive runs saved.
And he and Wong combined for the best defensive runs saved combo in all of baseball.
Add Bader’s elite season in center…
And I’m wondering why you think they weak up the middle? are the cards pitchers bad defenders or something?
DeJong is quite good all around.
fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=ss&stats=fld&#…
The Cardinals are bad about this and most other teams are as well but as a Cardinals fan i notice it more from them but the front office never makes the big move to put the team over the top. You got Goldy so why not get that high end FA to put them clearly ahead of Cubs and Brewers. the money is there, so use it. its a BS comment to say they have given out big money to FA before, but lets face it, the Pujols, Holliday, and Waino deals were not big deals and were actually very team friendly. The team has signed players to big deals but the problem is they gave them to wrong players and bite them ie Ceicel, Fowler, Leake. just bc management made a mistake doesnt mean you shy away from making the deal to send your team over the top bc of the what ifs. Is Harper a territory you would rather not expand your budget too, sure, but will he put your team in a better position to win and win now, absolutely. The fans are there, the tv contract is there, so the money is there. its time the front office gives the loyal fans something to be excited about instead of going into every opening day saying well we could be good but i doubt they are good enough to win it all unless we hit some luck along the way.
Matt Holliday’s deal was the richest free agent signing in 2009…it was a great deal but the Cardinals made the biggest signing that year with Holliday
proxy.espn.com/mlb/freeagents?year=2009&type=…
Sorry, but the Pujols, Waino and Holiday deals were much bigger (particularly when adjusted for inflation) than Cecil, Fowler and Leake. Pujols’ and Holiday’s deals ended up being team friendly because their production was excellent, but it was not a given. Waino’s was not really a good value for the team, even if it was below market. Stop with the narrative that the Cardinals never sign anyone expensive. It has been a while (2010) since they landed a big fish. But you know, you can only land a big fish once every five to ten years since they eat up a large portion of your salary. Yes, they should have signed Max Sherzer instead of Cecil, Fowler, and/or Mike Leake.
Maybe they sign Harper, maybe not. I agree that it seems like a great way to upgrade the team but I have zero skin in the game, relatively speaking.
They have not landed any big fish. Signing someone to an extension is a lot different than going out and bringing someone in to the core you already have. My point is that they dont make those moves. They cant close on free agents that hasnt experienced what its like to play for the Cardinals. Pujols, holliday, waino all biggest deals in team history and all were resigned. They always shy away from the big money to land the big fish
This is absolutely false. First, if someone doesn’t want to play in STL that’s just how it is. If they overpaid to convince someone that doesn’t want to play here(Fowler) then you’ll complain it’s a bad deal. Despite what conspiracies you’re into they have been in on David Price, Heyward, Pujols, attempted to take on Stanton’s contract. They spend almost every year relative to their place in revenue. They are a top third revenue team and spend in the top third of salary.
you proved my point exactly, they cant close a deal. if things arent working you have to try a different approach but the frustration that most cardinals fans have is that it seems to be the same comments from the front office every year. We tried but we didnt win happens every off season.
Every team who wins it has luck. What whiney Cards fans want is a win the offseason thing. Winning the offseason means jack..
Funny how Central division teams are openly complaining about Cards getting Goldy, yet it doesnt register for the cry babies.
Stop pretending to be fand if all you are gonna do is cry and complain about how the world is so unfair.. DeWitt and Mo are giving you the team your heart desires.
Harper to Yankees!
FACT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
For those bashing Mo for not making moves lets just see for a moment…..
Catcher – Yadier Molina – A lock
First base – Goldschmidt – Top 5 hitter in baseball
Second base – Kolton Wong – One of the best defenders at his position in the game
Shortstop – Paul DeJong – A young hitter who signed an undermarket extension that has the power potential to hit 40 HR’s and is a top 10 player in defensive WAR
Third base – Matt Carpenter – The heart and soul of Cardinal’s baseball, one of the best at the hot corner.
Corner infielder – Jedd Gyorko – He can play every infield position except catcher, A fantastic super sub bench piece who gave 2 WAR effort in a shorted year.
Middlr infielder – Yairo Munoz – Excellent find by Mo and company. He looks to eventually be an everyday player.
Leftfield – Marcell Ozuna – A beast who played 2/3 of last season injured but still turned in +3 WAR
Centerfield – Harrison Bader – A young, up and coming CF with great defense and good bat, he’s affordable and he’s going nowhere anytime soon.
Rightfield – Dexter Fowler – Yes, Fowler had a bad year, but when they signed him they married him to the team for the time being. He deserves to have a second chance.
Reserve outfield – Tyler O’Neil – This guy is going to be a freakish power hitter and still under control for 6 years.
Starting Pitchers – Jack Flaherty, Miles Mikolas, Carlos Martinez, Adam Wainwright, John Gant, Austin Gomber, Daniel Poncedeleon, Michael Wacha, Alex Reyes – Flaherty looks like a young ace in the making, Mikolas IS an ace right now, C-Mart is signed long term to a team friendly deal and when healthy he’s no less than a #2, As a Cardinal fan I will never give up on Waino as long as he’s out there, Wacha is a wild card but when healthy he’s a solid 3, Reyes has perhaps the highest upside of all if he stays healthy, Gant, Poncedeleon, and Gomber all showed they were capable starters last year. No to mention Dakota Hudson.
Bullpen – Dakota Hudson, Shreve, Hicks, Brebbia, Cecil, Leone, Mayers, Gregerson – This is clearly where they need to upgrade, however, with Hudson, Hicks, and Brebbia they have a core, I bet one of (or both) Cecil and Gregerson will bounce back.
Odd man out – Jose Martinez – He will be traded I’m certain for bullpen help.
So with all of this being said, please tell me what Mo really has to do to improve this team? The Cardinals have a VERY GOOD TEAM already. Some of you Cardinal fans are getting too caught up in the offseason….relax and calm down, True Cardinal fans know Mo has done a great job overall to keep them competitive. So quit being fair weather redbird fans and get with it! 2019 In Mo we trust!!
The typical sheeple. “Competitive.” Mo and DeWitt have you hook, line and sinker.
You lost me at Carp being one of the best at the hot corner.
He had 5 WAR last season, how many Thirdbasemen had 5 WAR? Not a lot. Stay fair weather my friend.
I agree with your post for the most part but Carp isn’t one of the best at the hot corner…He had limited playing time over there last year….although I believe he will be just fine at third, you might have overstated his value there.
I think the cardinals need to make a lock down bullpen and they will be fine this year…and like I said above…I would love to see a trade for Trevor Bauer…that would give us one of the best rotations in baseball
I don’t give bonus points for making routine look difficult.
Ive got a 10yr old grandson w/a better arm from the hot corner, bootlicker.
Plus I love how the organization builds serviceable to good players from their farm to round out their team. In the high minors they have Garcia, Urias, Knizer, Hudson, Aronzarena and some love RP arms among others to fill in as folks get injured.
Blessing and a curse, since they may be content with average depth and not make a splash….
Always hearing about the Cardinals talking about a price that’s comfortable for them but they are discussing Harper? This is just lip service for their fans they will never get a guy like Harper just like they let pujols go because he wanted a huge contract. Do not blame them for being financially responsible just don’t blow smoke up your fans rears
Can you honestly say that we missed on the Pujols contract, though? He is nowhere near the beast he was for his years in St. Louis. He has not played up to an AAV level for the contract he signed with the Angels. His contract was clearly paying for past performance, not future possibilities. Don’t get me wrong, I really hated to see him go, but it seems St. Louis really dodged a bullet on that one.
I hate the idea of Fowler being the everyday RF’er. He can be a bench bat, but you have to go out and get some for RF. O’Neill isn’t ready, if not Harper why not Michael Brantley? We need another lefty bat in this offense and he provides that with some pop. The Bullpen should already be better with a full season of the young guns. I’d like to add Britton and Kimbrel if we don’t sign Harper.
Carp 3rd
Bader CF
Goldy 1st
Ozuna LF
Brantley RF
DeJong SS
Molina C
Wong 2nd
Bench:
Robinson
Munoz
Fowler
O’Neill
SP:
Mikolas
Martinez
Wacha
Flaherty
Waino
BP:
Gomber
Britton
Hicks
Hudson
Kimbrel
Poncedelon
Reyes
Leone
Cut greggerson and trade Goyko and Martinez for some AA-AAA lefty arms,