8:27pm: USA Today’s Bob Nightengale tweets that, in addition to the five-year offer from the Red Sox (which he pegs for “at least” $120MM), Martinez has discussed both long- and short-term scenarios to return to the Diamondbacks.
A shorter-term deal to return to the D-backs would come as something of a surprise, though it’d be somewhat similar to Yoenis Cespedes’ initial deal to return to the Mets. Unable to find the long-term pact he sought on the open market in the 2015-16 offseason, Cespedes instead returned to the Mets on a three-year, $75MM contract with an opt-out after the first season of the contract. He’d go on to sign a four-year, $110MM pact with the Mets the following offseason.
Nightengale reported earlier today that the only other formal offer that Martinez had received outside of Boston was a one-year pact to return to Arizona, though certainly that doesn’t mean that Martinez and Boras haven’t discussed other parameters with the Diamondbacks (or potentially with other clubs whose interest has yet to be firmly reported).
7:30pm: Boras, unsurprisingly, rejected the notion that Martinez is unhappy with any potential suitor, writes Michael Silverman of the Boston Herald. Rather, the agent tells Silverman that Martinez is “involved in multiple negotiations and is pleased with the participants and the good faith process,” calling suggestions to the contrary “not accurate.”
12:15am: The staredown between J.D. Martinez and the Red Sox doesn’t appear to be all that close to ending. Evan Drellich of NBC Sports Boston spoke to agent Scott Boras Tuesday evening, with Boras making clear that his client is willing to wait until after the start of Spring Training to sign a contract. Meanwhile, Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic reports (subscription required) that Martinez has become “fed up” with the lack of flexibility on Boston’s part and may actually prefer to sign with another club at this point.
“The dialogue is ongoing, we have not reached any kind of agreement,” Boras tells Drellich, noting that Martinez doesn’t necessarily need a full Spring Training to work himself into game shape. “Particularly for position players, these guys are in great shape, they’re ready to go.”
Boston has reportedly offered Martinez a five-year deal in the neighborhood of $125MM, and to this point there hasn’t been much in the way of serious competition that has been widely reported. The D-backs would love to retain Martinez, but they’re already facing a record payroll in 2018 without Martinez in the fold and have an onerous commitment to Yasmany Tomas on the books. Beyond that, one has to imagine some concerns from the Arizona brass when it comes to Martinez’s glovework in the outfield over the course of a long-term pact.
Rosenthal reports that the Red Sox don’t seem anxious to up their bid. President of baseball ops Dave Dombrowski preached to Rosenthal a “wait-and-see” approach when it came to Martinez, expressing some confidence that Hanley Ramirez could rebound and ably fill the team’s DH slot in 2018 (though that belief seems more like lip service than anything else when made against the backdrop of a reported $125MM offer to another right-handed bat that would clearly supplant Ramirez as the primary designated hitter).
“I don’t have a (timetable) on it because I really don’t know,” said Dombrowski to Rosenthal. “Perhaps if I was losing options, juggling three guys, or if we were in the starting-pitching market where there are four (top) guys, I would say, ‘Hey, I need an answer now, or I’m going to turn to this guy.’ But we’re really not in that situation.”
Beyond the lack of competition for Martinez on the free-agent market, Dombrowski also suggested that the trade market could yet be a viable approach. The veteran exec called it “amazing” to be hearing of so many players available in trade talks at this juncture of the offseason.
“At this time of year, you normally don’t get phone calls out of the blue about such-and-such being available,” said Dombrowski. “I have. I don’t know what’s going to go on.”
Outside of Boston and Arizona, there’s been little talk of serious competition for Martinez’s services. The Giants and Blue Jays were both rumored landing spots at one point, but both have made multiple outfield acquisitions since that time. It’s certainly possible that a spring injury creates a new opening for Martinez, and the very presence of a five-year offer in the currently reported range suggests that the Red Sox feel there’s some degree of competition a bit below that level (perhaps from the D-backs, though that’s purely speculative).
Kayrall
If he’s actually “fed up” then good for the Red Sox. They will be dodging a bullet in the form of an albatross contract for an aging, one tool, player.
juicemane
This is all the Jason Heyward effect. Big reason Cubs aren’t a way better super team
John peterson
So true! If you could merge heyward with jdm, cubs would have a really good player. After the bust heyward has been, no team wants to touch a long term deal again, at least heyward was 26 when he signed, unlike jdm, but heyward has been brutal on offense. 260 pounds, hits like a hs string bean.
BlueJayFan1515
Is JDM slow, or just has slightly below average speed? I have only seen him play a couple times as a Jays fan.
jakem59
He’s real slow
stymeedone
hes about average. maybe a little below. I would not call him slow, or say he clogs the bases.
RunDMC
Aging & one-tool, yes, but that tool is pretty good. I believe it was MLB Network that published that since 2016 the 5 highest OPS+ was Trout, Votto, Altuve, Freddie Freeman and JD Martinez (in that order) – with 800 PA minimum.
All of those are more complete defensively than Martinez, but man – pretty incredible.
jakem59
But in that span he’s 60th in WAR, his defense is THAT bad. Dead last in overall defense value in that span among qualified players. He’s not worth the contract he’s demanding, at all
RunDMC
Agreed, but if you have the luxury to be able to take that out of the equation by DH-ing him, which BOS did the best of anyone with Big Papi for years – then Martinez could be the replacement they’ve been looking for, albeit at a steep price. Can’t have your cake and eat it too.
btharveyku08
Certainly SEEMS like they can have their cake and eat it too … No one else is coming close to 5/125 for him yet.
jakem59
JDM is the one trying to have his cake and eat it too. He’s looking for top 5 money when he’s a one dimensional player with an extremely limited market. DH’s don’t make that kind of scratch unless they’re an older player on the back side of his career playing out a fat contract (Pujols, Miggy). Is JDM worth 3-4 times as much as Carlos Santana and EE’s deals?
BlueJayFan1515
He is much younger, it’s amazing how much value age has. He also hits around .300, unlike EE and Santana.
jakem59
He is not much younger than Santana, who can still be serviceable in the field. If teams are still paying top $ for batting average they deserve to be stuck with that contract.
chgobangbang
Big papa as DH never made more than 16 mil a year? Just sayn
czontixhldr
He’s not even worth the reported 5/120 he’s been offered.
As a Philly fan I’ve seen this act before with Ryan Howard.
padam
Heck, Santana is good glove material.
padam
Gold.*
brucewayne
Does Martinez really think that he’s worth MORE than $25 million a year? Maybe he’s just getting some bad advice!
badco44
Gotta take what the market bares…this is not the cry baby league… and I’m sure like EE it starts back sliding soon… so figure it out dummy!
John Deas
He’s not half the hitter Ortiz was. He’s so bad defensively, that its laughable that any NL teams are interested in him. Whatever team signs him for more than 3 years will regret it. An Encarnacion contract sounds about right. He might be a better hitter than Encarnacion, but Encarnacion can play the field.
Kevin 23
Encarnacion was 4 years older than Martinez when he signed.
czontixhldr
Maybe he was 4 years older, but he could still field his position. 😉
brucewayne
He’s not half the juicer that Ortiz was either!
water boy
Troll
Steve kruse
Boras is very bad for baseball and the players.
The whole league is stagnant because of his
Arrogance.
padam
Agreed.
Pedro Cerrano's Voodoo
Thirded.
czontixhldr
I actually don’t have a problem with Boras. He’s just trying to get his guys paid the most money possible. It’s called a free market. And one things agents try to do collectively is set precedents with contracts every season and try to push AAVs higher and for longer years.
Unfortunately for the players, agents (not just Boras) are whining about a market that they have created and misread this offseason. Here’s a quote from Steve’s piece on another thread:
“While the Orioles have been in touch with the majority of free-agent starters available, they’re content to wait out the market for now to see if they can ultimately secure some rotation help on shorter-term deals, tweets ESPN’s Jerry Crasnick. Owner Peter Angelos is wary of locking in another four-year deal just months after Ubaldo Jimenez’s four-year, $50MM landmine is finally off the books, he adds”
Even bad four year deals leave a sour taste in ownership’s mouths. Can you imagine what the 5+ year deals have done – the Wells, Howard, Ellsbury, Zito, Panda, JSantana, Hamilton, etc.
Just look at Cots list of highest paid players – the mega deals: legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/le…
13 of the top 25 have either had dead money attached to them, or will have dead money attached to them as the players age, and I’m not even including the Stanton contract. If you use the top 30 you pick up the Ellsbury and AGone deals and it becomes 15 of 30. That’s 50%.
So a front office guy looks at the history of these deals and has to think “I have a 50% chance that this contract is going to make me look bad and potentially cost me my job”. And the FO guys are not the owner. They’re NOT the ones making the big bucks like the players and owners, so why would they stick their necks out and recommend one of these deals to the guy who writes the checks?
In short, agents and players have become victims of their own success as front offices are finally waking up to the fact that these mega deals have as much chance of blowing up as they do succeeding.
The market is going to readjust. We’re seeing the beginning of that.
kingbum
Don’t give me that shit it’s the agent’s job to get the best deal possible for his client the player, not the team. It’s up to Boras to get Martinez a deal that Martinez likes, the problem is no one is bidding against the Red Sox so the only tactic Boras has in his arsenal is to stall. Dombrowski is calling Boras bluff and clearly decided to wait for Boras to come back to planet Earth which he eventually will. Boras is trying to make Boston bid against itself and Dombrowski isn’t falling for it. I don’t blame Boras for trying this will be JDM’s last lucrative deal so it’s penny squeezing time if you have leverage.
mookiemvp
He is fed up with the Sox. Well everyone is fed up with horrible contracts and paying someone for previously being good. If people actually lived up to their contracts then teams wouldn’t be afraid to offer them. JD can be fed up all he wants but the Sox should not increase their offer. Why would you outbid yourself? Either he takes the offer he’s given or he sits out and waits while his value only plummets. His value won’t increase by waiting it out
jchiaratti
If he waits til ST he’s likely to get an Edwin Encarnacion type deal… I mean, isn’t he basically EE?
redsoxu571
He’s potentially still ascending (whereas EE was holding steady or declining) and is younger, so not quite, but there are a lot of similarities.
realist101
Martinez is 4.5 years younger than Encarnacion, so he’s 3.5 years younger than when Encarnacion got his deal. That age difference is a pretty big deal.
In terms of average aging curves, though, it’s not reasonable to expect a 30 year old player to be “ascending”. There are outliers such as players overhauling their swings to get more lift, but the expectation for someone who is already a really good hitter is that he’s declining due to age at 30. The question is just how fast that decline happens.
One complicating factor, though, is that Encarnacion has better plate discipline and contact numbers. You see it in his walk rate (always at least somewhat higher than Martinez) and his K rate (always a lot lower than Martinez). Also see it underlying stats: Encarnacion chases less out of the zone than Martinez, and Encarnacion has higher contact rates when he swings at pitches both inside and outside the strike zone.
So I think that the concern with Martinez’s profile and how it ages over the next five years is that he’s so dependent on just hitting the crap out of the ball to get both a high BABIP and high ISO. I’m pretty sure that generally doesn’t age as well as a more balanced approach with more contact and more walks. Martinez isn’t as extreme as Chris Davis – Davis has always struck out more – but that sort of decline is the fear for guys who have a lot of swing and miss to their game and rely heavily on results on batted ball contact (i.e., don’t walk a lot relative to K rate).
atomicfront
He is a poor man’s Edwin Encarnacion.
Empire Exoticz
Noone gets paid for being previously bad. Also, many times you see teams going to arbitration with players for 500k difference l, when they are getting a bargain. He knows this will probably be his last Contract, so he wants as much as he can push for.
Cookiehead Jenkins
Jason Hayward got paid for being previously bad lol
ryanw-2
5.8, 3.7, 6.2, and 6.5 WAR in four years before he signed that contract is bad?
yankeefan63
Those are not JD Martinez WAR values.
Woodcutta
Where did he say they were? ….”before he signed that contract….” might be a clue.
InPolesWeTrust
Drink your coffee. Relax woodcutta.
dirtydan
They’re Heywards
saintchristafa
Do you watch baseball?
markl-4
Is he going to be a DH in Boston ?
If so, then only his oWar numbers are applicable.
ffrhb14Sox
This shows some of the fallacy of WAR, Heyward wasn’t even valuable enough to start every playoff game. If his WAR is that much better than average why give him that much money and frequently start an average over him?
newagescamartist
You think Jason Heyward was bad before signing? Come on now.
DVail1979
It’ll never happen but would NFL style contracts be good for baseball? Say sign Martinez for 8 years and $200 Mil but only $75 Mil is guaranteed … if he keeps playing we’ll year in and year out he gets his $200 if not the Sox cut ties and pay him $75 Mil
Chris
Good for the owners. Terrible for the players. Opt out deals and/or mutual and team options seem to be the best way of cost control. But I’m no salary cap expert. Just my personal opinion
AndThisGameBelongsToMySanDiegoPadres
Opt outs are not good for cost control! Quite the opposite actually. Player will only opt out if he can get more money.
redsoxu571
That shows how off base all the whining from the player and player agent side this offseason has been. MLB players have it GREAT, no hard salary cap limiting team spending (though it’s creeping there) and fully guaranteed contracts. Now that teams have woken up to the fact that guaranteed contracts can’t be ridiculously long, it’s nothing but crying by the players. It’s not that I’m “with the owners”, I’m just against contracts being so long that teams get hammered with multiple worthless seasons.
teufelshunde4
Players should pivot and ask for huge money over short term.. Instead of trying to get 5, 6 or 7 years out of a team. Ask for 3 at a ultra premium rate. Harper & Machado will get 7 to 10 year deals due to age.
padam
Football is only like that because of the nature of the game. You don’t see that in any of the other sports.
brucewayne
Opt outs are ONLY good for the player!
Colorado Red
An argument can be, they are payed much lower before FA, should this should help balance it out some.
tigergreg
I’d rather see them boost the $ on the earlier years than pay megamillions for declining/useless years to “make up” for early years.
Rob L. 2
It’s paid, not “payed.” Tell a friend.
czontixhldr
Better to get payed than played.
Dave 41
If the Red Sox know their offer is the best one out there and no one is competing with them, why should they up their offer. They would only be bidding against themselves. JDM needs to realize that
Caseys.Partner
The Red Sox know that how?
That’s collusion.
pasha2k
You’re right
MikeGreenwell
It’s reading a market, poker, and negotiation—not collusion. Sox offer has been hanging out there for weeks and no change. If there were a better offer they’d sign elsewhere/put a deadline on Sox/Tell Sox they superior offer so they know what it takes to win the bidding war. They either don’t have a competitive offer or if there is one, JD doesn’t wanna go to the team making that offer. Soft market, Boras overestimated, bluff called, no reason to bid against yourself.
InPolesWeTrust
Thank you Gator. Well said. Can’t believe DD is using fiscal responsibility. I’m happy Cherrington isn’t still in charge!!
Colorado Red
No it is not. Unless they talked to several other owners who agreed not to bid more, IT IS NOT collusion.
jollybucnroger
People love to use the word collusion to describe things these days. Maybe they know it’s the best offer because they made the offer weeks ago and if JD had received a better one he likely would have taken that better deal. But since he is still
Unsigned it’s fair for BOS to assume they have made the strongest offer. Not everything is a conspiracy.
qbass187
How? Is this DD’s first foray into free agency? You think these front offices don’t have contacts in agency’s and contact with other GMs? Come on. Smarten up
Caseys.Partner
Read the wiki on collusion. Knowing the other offers is one of the four collusion convictions.
BadlyBent
Is there a wiki on common sense? If you make someone an offer and refuse to budge, but they keep asking for more, and you keep saying “No”, and they don’t sign with another team, then there is no other team. Yours is the best offer and you don’t keep to know the others.
Nobody gets “fed up” with the team making the second best offer.
brucewayne
It’s not collusion or they wouldn’t be signing anybody to improve any team!
Pedro Cerrano's Voodoo
Alright we know it’s you Boras
brucewayne
BS!
pasha2k
Way to go DD! Go and blow up another season making an enemy of JD even before he signs with someone. DD blew up last season by not replacing Ortiz, do winning the division is one thing, but the last two , they were before the second round.
redsoxu571
So much stupid it hurts. So in order to “not make an enemy” of a player who is basically saying “pay me even more even though nobody thinks I’m worth this”, Boston should just give him the money? Also, you can’t say that a season was “blown” when it was a division winner, especially when virtually the entire lineup underperformed (the lazy idiot says it was the loss of Ortiz, the smart baseball person – most people around these parts – actually looks at the entire team).
Poundsy24
Well it was partially due to the loss of Ortiz… not just his own production but his ability to increase other players production as well. That’s why I think instead of spending $125mil on JDM the Sox could spend $5-$10mil on a guy like Matt Holiday and get some decent production from an aging vet and help the young guys at the same time. Almost like a David Ross-type but more productive. I think he played a huge part for the Yanks last year, imo
pasha2k
If that were so why isn’t he still with the NYY?
pasha2k
The BIG boys will never come to Boston, the media n fan actions keep them going elsewhere. NYY or LA. Harper will go to a much friendlier place then in the trenches in Boston.
bosox55
Boston is in a tough position right now because of bad contracts, Sandoval, Hanley, Price. Now you want DD to bid against himself for a player who is on the wrong side of 30? I’m glad he is finally showing some fiscal responsibility, maybe the Sox will actually be able to resign Mookie in a couple of years, if they stop handing out bad contracts.
passed_balls
And people say Red Sox fans are dumb as rocks. LOL
fox471 Dave
“Make an enemy?” What is JD going to do? “Make an enemy!” Geez.
iverbure
It’s quite obvious to me that the Redsox are the only suitor for JD Martinez. If I were DD I’d publicly pull the 5 year deal. And publicly offer a 4 year deal.
If some team wants to take advantage of that and give him 5 years then wipe your borrow and thank whatever deity you pray to for the good fortune.
pasha2k
You gonna feel that way when Mookie waves bye bye?
Chris
You do realize overpaying JD is one way to assure you can’t pay Mookie?
pasha2k
Mookie will be gone, face it.
fox471 Dave
No he doesn’t realize or understand it. Shouldn’t one have to pass some sort of test or be over 16 to post on this site?
walfu
And what exactly does JDM have to do with Mookie?
InPolesWeTrust
When I comes around to ponying up for Betts, having another 25m/year player can making it increasingly difficult to make that a reality. Gonna have to start paying these kids in a few years and having the foresight to not get in bed with Boras on this one may be best for the Sox now and in three/four years.
nyy42
Ask MM what Chris Davis has to fo with him down in Baltimore!
nyy42
do
Caseys.Partner
Why don’t the Pirates step up and offer a one year $40 million pillow for Martinez? The Pirates have the room for a one year deal like that.
bross16
Because that’s not how it works
Cincyfan85
The Pirates have never had an opening day payroll over $100 million, and you expect them to drop $40m on one player who MAYBE deserves $20m a year? Why would they even want him (especially for 1 year) after trading away McCutchen and Cole? Plus they already have Polanco, Marte, and Austin Meadows. Makes no sense.
Cookiehead Jenkins
They don’t necessarily have Meadows…yet.
Pirates should offer him the same deal as the Sox, but with an opt-out after 2 yrs. He can play RF like he wants at PNC Park, which is smaller, and play next to Marte in CF.
As long as he hits like he has, he would definitely opt-out. Or, the Bucs could flip him for prospects.
mlb1225
Pirates wouldn’t be able to flip him for prospects. The reason he isn’t signed right now is because of the price tag he’s put on himself (along with Boras), the amount of years he wants, and his age. Nobody would be willing to give up top prospects for a 30+ year old, who’s getting paid $20+ million a year.
brucewayne
Why would the Pirates give him an opt out?
Caseys.Partner
You think Pirate fans would boycott the games if that bloodsucker Nutting bought J.D. Martinez for the 2018 season?
jbaker3170
Wow, really?? Congratulations for perhaps posting the most asinine comment of all time on here
Cookiehead Jenkins
It’ll never happen, I know this! But I’ve seen much dumber comments on here, so you can relax and take your anger out somewhere else. I didn’t realize impressing you was a requirement for posting here.
chesteraarthur
its not a requirement, as you were obviously able to do it anyway, but if you make dumb posts, you should be ready for heckling. That said, I’m pretty sure that comment was to Caseyspartner, not you.
nyy42
To finish 3rd? Why?
RedFeather
This made my day.. “Pirates trade Mccutchen and Cole, sign Martinez on a one year $40 million deal”. Genius
Caseys.Partner
Yeah, the Pirates didn’t deal them for high ceiling A-ball prospects, they dealt them for guys who will be playing for the big club this year.
Colorado Red
You would still lose a high draft pick.
JDM would not sign it.
Poundsy24
Since JDM got traded mid-season there is no draft pick compensation tied to him. Just a friendly reminder.
Caseys.Partner
And if the deal is less than $50 million there is no draft pick attached.
realist101
That’s not accurate. Go read the QO offer description at MLB.com.
geejohnny
And then cringe when he has an off year and puts up Cutch like numbers which they could’ve had for 14 mil?
66TheNumberOfTheBest
Why don’t the Pirates “step up” and offer an INSANE amount of money to a player who won’t make the difference between a playoff spot or not?
Because they aren’t stupid or a charity for spoiled and entitled ballplayers.
brucewayne
So they can prove to the idiots that it’s not collusion ! LoL
MafiaBass
Because he doesn’t want to be a free agent this coming offseason. Maybe 2/70 could get that done, but I don’t know if JDM would take that, and I doubt the Nuttings would spend that much
mlb1225
1.) The Pirates would never do that, at least while they have Nutting and Huntington.
2.) Martinez is not worth anything close to $40 million.
3.) Pirates fans would still be angry because they could’ve used that $40 million on multiple things, like extensions, and a multitude of quality free agents.
yesgeo
40 million is a pillow.? u banged your head.. over pay for underperforming players is a chronic problem now…
Pedro Cerrano's Voodoo
No doubt, this is a Boras account.. 40 mill …Pirates…sheesh
Dodgethis
Contracts are set by the market, not by players. The market changes monthly sometimes weekly, so for a player to claim “I want x amount of dollars because so and so got that much last year is absurd. It blatantly ignores the nature of the market system.
That said, the current scale of costs and salary is outrageous. MLB uses monopoly protections and special government rules to effectively kill any competition, and then raise the prices through the roof. Any company getting any form of government assistance should be capped on what they can charge. Our tax dollars are going towards these outrageous contracts and even more outrageous ownership profits.
CursedRangers
Spot on. JD’s comments towards Boston are borderline comical. But your point about the public paying huge bucks for stadiums needs to be addressed. Clearly there is a ton of money flowing through baseball. Yet cities, and their tax payers, keep throwing hundreds of millions of dollars to building new sport shrines. This money could be going to schools, police, fire, infrastructure, etc… Teachers work their tails off for $40-50k. Then you have JD spout off over his unfair $125M contract….
66TheNumberOfTheBest
MLB’s antitrust exemption and it’s effect are completely overblown. Other than MLB being able to prevent franchise relocations, how does MLB function differently than any other pro league? They have no such exemptions.
And MLB has the cheapest tickets of the major sports.
jbigz12
Maybe their tickets are the cheapest because they play 162 games a year compared to 82 in the NBA and 16 in football. Who knows though, you know?
dudeness88
Our tax dollars are going to players contracts.. when you think you’ve heard it all haha
davelsu
he’s really worth about 4 yrs $60 mill…If 5 years $125 million is on the table..He really should grab it. waiting only helps the owners.. Boras can’t be that stupid. you have to recognize the current market. I would pull the offer if I were the GM. Way out of line if the offer is even true.
bluntforcekarma
Damn right.
User 4245925809
Isn’t he? Boras thought Jason Varitek was a 50m man after the ’09 season, the same Varitek who had to come begging boston to resign him at 2/5m in the end.
Boras’s ego/vanity knows no bounds.
JFactor
And he had Drew and Morales miss 2 months in 2014 because he misread the market.
redsoxu571
Not quite true. They had draft pick compensation attached to them and that suppressed the contracts offered to them. They sat in order to wait out the end of the comp pick effect, figuring they would get better contract offers at that point.
bluntforcekarma
I realize Martinez is a Boras client but the idea that a 5-year $125,000,000 contract isn’t good enough for a 30-year-old player with limited defensive ability seems asinine. That’s guaranteed money (and security) for a guy that was asked to leave the Astros just 4 years ago. SMH. Long contracts just aren’t a good deal for teams.
Paul Heyman
I can’t stand anymore of this s**t. I really can’t. JDM just needs to accept the deal he has at hand, or just play in Japan or the KBO for a year or two.
scuba17
He’s “fed up with Boston’s flexibility”? Seriously? There are no other suitors for him, he’s a luxury for them, and he isn’t worth that much anyway. We aren’t talking about a HOFer here. He would be one of the highest paid players in the game, yet that isn’t good enough. Greedy players like him (along with greedy Boras) are the reason for this slow offseason. Offers are on the table, but everyone wants that little bit more that won’t make any significant impact on their financial lives anyway. What a joke.
scuba17
To put this in a little more perspective…if he signed that contract, retired at the end of it, lived to be 90 years old, and even got half of that contract taken out in taxes, he would in essence have $60 million for the next 60 years of his life. Can’t live off $1 million a year? These guys are unbelievable. They should be thankful they even live in a time where this kind of money is thrown at them (to play a game no less) and stop acting like greedy little kids who aren’t getting their way. Plenty of people would switch positions with them in a heartbeat.
InPolesWeTrust
Too bad pro athletes don’t look at it like that.
pasha2k
Boras is the problem. He fills his clients head with his former successes before the luxury tax. Boras has no use for a middle of the pack player only ones he can deal to the NYY
DarkGhost
I wonder if Boras has gotten so far in his head he looks for a one year deal and tries to hit the market next year. Teams that try to get in on the Machado and Harper race and miss out might over pay for Martinez next year.
Cincyfan85
I don’t see JD ever getting a contract over 5 year $125m, especially not next year. He will have sat out for an entire year at that point because he’d “fed up.” LOL
dlevin11
Take it or leave it JD. Sox will not be held hostage.
Bocephus
Kinda looks like they’ve already been.
pasha2k
Don’t blame the player when Boras is involved. And how do we know what JD said is true?
Colorado Red
I do not give him a 1 year contract, and lose the draft pics.
(I know it is not the same compensation, but still a hit)
axisofhonor25
Whoa man. I don’t think “fed up” is something you say and expect Red Sox nation to sit well with it. Your getting a 5 year deal with 25 mil each year and your fed up? What does Scott Boras do to these guys? I remember when JD was no more than replacement level with the NL Astros. Changed his approach and mechanics at the plate and all of a sudden he’s running his mouth? Take the contract and have a chance to win championships man cuz it ain’t coming in Arizona, at least not yet.
axisofhonor25
“You’re” not your
CursedRangers
I was thinking the same thing. If he signs now he is going to get booed like no tomorrow. Maybe that would be good for David Price’s ego…
MikeGreenwell
This may become a touchstone example of agent(s) negatively affecting the market health, instead of facilitating a truer market equilibrium and getting paid along the way. Players union is strong and exists to prevent underpaid athletes. Acting in the best interest of your client doesn’t necessarily equate to the most money/longest term…if those holdouts delay 90 athletes from signing by spring training. I fear a lot of guys will have to take smaller deals AND have fewer options due to a time crunch and teams planning their rosters. 125MM for a guy with 4 yrs of great play on the wrong side of 30…would love to see how many other players have that deal and how they compare. More teams tanking and relying on young (cheap) talent more than ever…but agents should see that and get their clients jobs—then the best jobs available. Shame to see so much proven veteran talent unsigned this late in the offseason.
InPolesWeTrust
Gator, thank you. Could this also be teams unwilling to pay Martinez 25m per because that will only be used against teams when they’re fighting for Harper and Machado?
chesteraarthur
That flexibility thing is straight from boras too. It sounds a lot better than “boston wont give into my demands”
brucewayne
If this happens , and it could, there is going to be an even bigger gap next year between the small market player
brucewayne
and the huge salaried player!
ramon garciaparra
Screw this guy. He’s just a dh anyway and they have other righty hitters. Sign Logan Morrison for a lot less money or Eduardo Nunez who could actually play some defensive positions. Last thing the Red Sox need is another aging, overpaid, overrated outfielder named JD. We went this route before. Why do the Sox insist on paying guys in their 30’s with only declining stats ahead of them? The guy is a DH. Go to Plan B.
stubby66
Maybe Boston is farther ahead with Braun or Santana. Shorter and they are almost the same players.
MilTown8888
Not a bad idea to trade then spend the free agent money to replace what you gave up. Except I dont think Boston is a match for Milwaukee to get Santana. Boston is pretty thin at 2nd base and starting pitching. Also Braun has full no-trade.
stymeedone
The Red Sox are looking to sign this type of player because: 1) They are looking to win now. 2) Most players are 29 or older by the time they become FAs. 3) Their system doesnt have the depth necessary to trade for the young stud.
redsoxu571
The Red Sox are looking to sign him because he is a fairly good fit and available for nothing but cash. Trades aren’t ideal when your roster is largely complete and you are looking to upgrade rather than fill a hole.
Boston is not looking to “win now”. It’s looking to “win now AND later”. It probably feels that Martinez will be a successful primary DH and occasional 4th OF for 4-5 years while offering big hitting. And the previous poster saying he is “in his 30s” is misleading, seeing as he is only just entering his 30s starting next year (very different than being 32 or 33 next year).
Pedro Cerrano's Voodoo
I’ve been wondering about a Sox / Morrison match for a while now. I imagine he could be had on a 3 / 57-60 deal.
wiredrunner
I’d rather see the Sox do nothing than sign Martinez.
pasha2k
Stupid comment. If they signed Davis or Arrieta, that could be the answer
wiredrunner
Imagine if you could understand what I wrote.
ramon garciaparra
You would think an organization that for years has wildly overpaid for free agents like Sandoval and Crawford and Hanley and Drew and Price and Renteria and on and on an on would at some point realize that this is not a sound strategy. Either wait it out for a bargain or do what other teams do and turn to their system and give a guy like Castillo or Brentz or Travis an opportunity. If one fails then go to the next one. Better than another albatross contract that will haunt them for years.
redsoxu571
Don’t be a moron. Just because a signing doesn’t work out and the contract ends up bad doesn’t make it even an overpay, much less a “wild overpay”. Boston’s offer to Sandoval wasn’t even the best offer he had. Renteria’s contract was nothing big, JD Drew for all his low energy was a fairly good player (averaged more than 3 WAR a year with Boston). Crawford was the expected contract and it just went all wrong, Price was a willing overpay to get him to sign with the team when he probably would have rather not (and at the time they projected that he would opt out anyways). Ramirez has been up and down…shocker.
Then again, you actually think he team should give Rusney Castillo a go, which shows you aren’t the most informed baseball fan (for the record, if they played him he would be back on the 40 man roster and his fairly large salary would apply to the luxury tax again).
beyou02215
If I were Boston, I’d be playing the trade market really hard for a bat. Hopefully they are.
redsoxu571
If I were Boston, I wouldn’t go out of my way to overpay for a bat I don’t NEED in any way, signing, trade, or whatever. The team’s tough offensive season last year was largely due to many individual players having a disappointing season, so it should be better, perhaps much better, without any further moves. Doesn’t mean that you ignore room for improvement, but why should the team play “hard” on the trade market?
beyou02215
Seems like the Sox are resigned to finding a bat. If they are, they’d be better off trying to trade, or signing a much less expensive FA (Alonso would have been a nice fit) than anchoring themselves to Martinez for a long period of time.
fellerms4
Play for the love of the game. Goddamn your going to make 25 Million a year. Seriously who makes that? A game u grew up loving and wanting to play. Be a role model for our young athletes. Simple, but all a player wants now is prestige. Not baseball, all about the money. I hope you all go on strike. That’s what baseball needs
Bocephus
Yea that’ll help their popularity.
Kslaw
How does baseball need a strike?
brucewayne
You talk about role models
brucewayne
and yet you use words like GD?
timtim007
He is asking to be plunked by the Red Sox pitchers if he keeps verbally degrading the organization. Red Sox players and fans have long memories
Dat boi
My sources are telling me JD’s best offer is from Boston and is much higher than the other offers.But,JD thinks Red Sox fans are annoying and whiny and he got a call from David Price to confirm that
wiggysf
I think your sources suck.
Michael Zeitz
The Sox need to move on and give pillow contracts to moustakas, Nunez, and lance Lynn. You can likely get all three on 2 year contracts. They can also trade for a guy like schwarber. All this and leave themselves open for a mookie/Xander extension and go after one of the big boys s next off season.
InPolesWeTrust
Do not extended Xander.
redsoxu571
Yeah, why would you want to keep an ultra-pedigree talent who is already very productive and will only be 25 next year? Peaking from 26-30 is SOOOOOO twenty years ago, if my young stud doesn’t become a superstar by 23 I want him gone!
PeterDipersio
I wouldn’t sign him at all! He is 30 by the time his contract would end he would be 35. Players of that age start to decline. The Yankees will find this out with Stanton as well
st1300b 2
Cmon MLBTR who are the such and such being offered that Dombrowski refers to?
mike156
Weird negotiating strategy. Players are worth what people are willing to pay. There’s no insult in it, unless teams are acting in concert., and that’s not been proven. If Martinez wants to wait for higher offers, that’s his business. But he’s only going to get paid what the market bears.
Goose
Boras and the other agents know they are in a rock and a hard place so the are going to the nuclear term ‘collusion’. MLB put the breaks on the Dodgers because their spending got to the point that the revenue streams couldn’t support it. The Yankees, Red Sox, etc… big spending teams don’t want to get with the luxury tax as it become punitive year after year unless you get under it. Machado and Harper are out there next year so if you can open any payroll space they are more desirable at 30 to 35 million a year than a 1 tool Martinez.
Martinez has played more than a 130 games once in his career.
brucewayne
At no time did the Dodgers have any kind of spending limits put on them by MLB !
dcnatswin
Vastly different players but the last guy to misjudge his own value this poorly was probably Ian Desmond turning down the $107 million extension offer.
Harry h
This guy reminds me of albert P.of the angels except no track record.And every day I say to myself why doesn’t albert just retire.? Meaning if the red sox pay him all that money they are going to be saying the same thing as me 3 or 4 years from now !!! GOD I wish they never signed Albert to that crazy deal !!!!
tharrie0820
What constitutes a track record? For his career, Martinez has a 130 OPS+. If you just count the 4 years after he retooled his swing, it’s 150. How long do you have to keep something up for it to be considered having a “track record”?
panderson7796
So he’s fed up that the Red Sox aren’t trying to outbid themselves?
redsoxu571
Pretty much. What an insult, right?
Harry h
I remember wean Albert P.was offered a TON of money by St.louis and it just wasn’t enough and St.louis finally had to good by .And now the Angels are stuck with him and a bunch of other crazy contracts for players that don’t even play anymore that’s why the Angels can’t even move anymore on the free agent market this year.take your money and run J.D. If you can even make it to 1st.base in 5 years.Lol
brucewayne
Who are these other players the Angels are paying for that don’t even play anymore? LoL
brucewayne
By the way, the Angels have been very active in the free agent market this off season!
InPlayRuns
Probably should’ve kept his mouth shut, now he removed all doubt.
Yankeepatriot
The Sox should offer him a 24 hour deadline. Teams report next week for goodness sake lol
Triteon
Lack of flexibility works both ways, JD. You can either understand that, or risk becoming baseball’s Latrell Sprewell.
garywang00
“Fed up”?! Give me a break, you are getting 125mm to play the game you love. That’s not enough? You are a one tool player who has had a surprising 2017 no track record of maintaining that HR pace wants more money than mike trout?!
Wake up and be blessed you are playing baseball making an amount of money that you will never be able to comprehend.
I am just sick hearing people complain how the lottery jackpot is not big enough and tax is too high !
NicTaylor
Ok Boston, withdraw the deal and offer it to Mookie instead… dodge that bullet
socalbum
Bosox have been overly patient with Martinez. Give him 24 hours to make a decision or the offer is permanently off the table.
Yankeepatriot
It’s probably because no other team has made Martinez an offer
socalbum
does not matter. at some point it is time to “fish or cut bait.”
Yankeepatriot
Agreed. They have a team to run and can’t be handcuffed by one player
BadlyBent
Boston should decrease their offer by $1M/day, and $2M/day once spring training starts. That will give JD some incentive to sign with that other mystery team.
Psychguy
JD there’s no crying in baseball!
brownbomber
Dont know why he’s catering to the red sox anyway. He should be looking elsewhere
tigertom0210
If you don’t like the offer, JD, go somewhere else. Oh, wait… there is nobody else.
jdodge22
This is a stupid move by boras. He can’t just swallow his pride a tiny bit and accept what is a very fair offer considering there’s nothing close. Instead he tries to make the Red Sox look bad by making them look cheap. Why on earth would they offer more money than their already top offer. Give dombroski credit for not putting the screws to him and giving a deadline to accept. Probably because he knows how soft and delicate these players are. I was firmly in the camp of pay him whatever he wants. But now watching what’s happened over the past few weeks with everything I’m not even sure I want him in an already unlikeable clubhouse
anarchoburrito
As a Sox fan I was never particularly high on going after him and now I am 100% on board with letting him walk. His value was overinflated by the weak market. He was never in a million years going to be the solution to our power problem. We aren’t going to be able to outslug the Yanks, but we CAN out pitch them and get more guys on and into scoring position. I’d rather save that money and try to extend Mookie, Craig and Sale than have a repeat of the Panda fiasco. In fact, I’d rather have a full season watching Sale smoke guys and awesome outfield defense and finish a solid second in the division than cut the legs off the future with another albatross.
lasershow45
Agreed. I’d rather them save money now, extend Betts, Sale and Kimbrel, wait a few years and pay up for Arenado.
Yankeepatriot
It’s about time Boras took a loss anyway. He has had waaaay too much power in negotiations over the years
reflect
I find it amusing how much fans hate on agents for doing their jobs.
socalbum
Not all agents, only those who try to control the market and make inflammatory comments.
reflect
But none have tried to control the market (which is not even possible) and those inflammatory comments come as a result of being asked inflammatory questions. Would you prefer they lie?
Colorado Red
Put pressure on him.
Say the office is good till the players report date.
Then withdraw the offer.
With his holes in his game, it is a good offer.
san888
If there was a better option he would take it. Sox should not bid against themselves. How many bad signings do they want. Panda, Price, Hanley, Rusney and the took on Allen Craig. Why not just throw away more money.
manos
He’s lucky to be offered 5-years $125 million. He’s not worth it imo so he should get while the gettin’s good because nobody else is going to offer him more than that.
66TheNumberOfTheBest
Suddenly the concept of MARKET economics eludes the players and the agents.
He’s fed up with his ONLY offer.
Delusional and entitled.
FYI- Anyone wondering how DD and the Sox know they are JDM’s only suitor? He keeps threatening to sit out spring training and/or the season rather than threatening to sign with another team. He’s openly (inadvertently) admitting that he has no other suitors.
AM21
I wanted the Sox to sign JD so badly. In light of this, and his comments…
JD Martinez can go f**k himself. I hope he signs that albatross of a contract elsewhere.
SG
This story has got to be a bad joke.
Can you actually imagine JDM being fed up with a $5/125 offer from Boston and may sign elsewhere due to their “lack of flexibility”?
Boston’s got to be crazy to offer that much.
Is this actually believable?
Or is this just more Scott Boras BS?
Hey JDM where are all the better offers from other teams?
Todd Frazier just got a whopping $8M/9M per year for 2 years.
Lorenzo Cain got $5/75 and he can play the outfield way better than you.
Here’s a hot tip from Warren Buffett (see what ARod did to Boras) take the $5/125.
New York Yankees third baseman Alex Rodriguez splits with Scott Boras
espn.com/new-york/mlb/news/story?id=5527332
Sep 3, 2010 – New York Yankees third baseman Alex Rodriguez confirmed Friday that he has split with longtime agent Scott Boras.
celtspatssoxsftw
Just sign him
sdaniel8935
I don’t know about Martinez, but somewhere around $25 million a year for five years sounds pretty nice for a guy who has found his swing at this stage of his career.
takeyourbase
Fed up with the Red Sox? . Pfft….. Go find a better deal then. Oh, there isn’t one?? Well gosh darn. Guess your not so entitled after all
JV
Scott Boras is bad for the game of baseball!! Dishonest and divisive!!! He can take that 5/125 offer from Boston and jam it!! Sideways!!
notsofast
How is it that, all of a sudden, the luxury tax matters to all the teams at once? Teams that are impacted by the luxury tax like the Dodgers and Yankees make money hand over fist and their market value is sky high. Throw in Red Sox, Cubs and Nationals. Teams with a clear cut chance at post season success yet not willing to go get that missing piece. Can you spell COLLUSION!
Yankeepatriot
How is it collision when teams don’t want to be suckered into giving elite money for upper tier talent ????? These players are extremely overvaluing themselves (especially Hosmer)
brownbomber
Read notsofast statement. Thats how
socalbum
No need for COLLUSION, the CBA CBT penalties are more than enough incentive for teams to stay below the threshold for 2018 and reset for 2019 FA class that will likely include Harper, Machado, Kershaw, Dozier, Blackmon, Jones, etc.
66TheNumberOfTheBest
“How is it that, all of a sudden, the luxury tax matters to all the teams at once?”
Because they changed the structure of the luxury tax to make it far more punitive in the latest CBA that the players and their union signed.
But they were too busy negotiating for an executive chef in every clubhouse to notice that they were getting fleeced. No one’s fault but their own.
sully51
Because the luxury tax was a component of the CBA, and started affecting all teams the same year. All the big teams are hitting the biggest penalty at the same time because they all spent over the limit every year since it was ratified. Being over the limit thus far meant paying extra money. Next year it means MORE extra money AND loss of draft picks. They’d be stupid to do that for anything less than a guaranteed superstar (hint: JDM isn’t that).
Pablo
They care because of next years free agent class. Big market clubs can’t wait for it and are willing to roll the dice this year and maybe save tens of millions in the process.
notsofast
This is professional sports where winning a championship is paramount! Throwing away an opportunity to win in 2018 because there’s an abundance of talent in the 2019 FA class doesn’t make sense. That all teams think this way smells of collusion… I will also add that all teams have long term strategies in place, it’s not like the upcoming FA class came out of nowhere. Are we to think that ALL the teams all of a sudden came to the same conclusion all at once?
Nuggethoarder
Actually, it makes perfect sense under the constraints of the CBA. If I were running a team, I wouldn’t be interested in any long-term contracts unless I wanted that player for the duration of the contract. Strategically speaking, signing a player for 5-7 years to fill a need for one year is just silly. Maybe you sign them for a projected need of 3-4 years, and consider the last two years or so as a wash. But to sign them so you can compete for one year? Nah.
bosox55
So you are advocating bidding against yourself for JDM?
66TheNumberOfTheBest
1) Which team has an opportunity to win a championship in 2018 that isn’t making the moves needed to do so?
2) The Rockies, Brewers, Angels, Twins, etc are all signing players. Did they miss the collusion memo or did they, in fact, come to a different conclusion?
czontixhldr
Your past assumes that siging one guy guarantees a title.
Not so.
The baseball postseason is a crapshoot. Teams are better off trying to make it every year instead of hoing all in for one year.
brucewayne
It’s not collusion or nobody would be getting signed to big contracts
Le Grande Orangerie
PSST! PSST! It’s an inside job! Get the tinfoil hats out!
Jimcarlo Slaton
When you say all the teams, how many are really in a position to even have luxury tax concerns? Only a handful of teams have ever gone over or come close to going over.
Since baseball is foremost a business to ownerships, I think L.A., NYY, etc. have decided that paying the luxury tax under most circumstances isn’t a good business decision.
brucewayne
It’s not collusion! It’s called getting smarter by using modern day analytics !
Le Grande Orangerie
The funny thing about the JDM/Boras attack on the Red Sox, is that it’s the clearest indication there could be that there is only one team offering a market for this guy. Boras will be left holding a lot of bags when Spring Training starts. I suspect the Red Sox could have this aspiring DH on a 4 year deal at $80 million and no one is going to outbid that. I suspect someone could have Jake Arrieta on the downslope at 32 in March, for about the same.
Scott used to have Tom Hicks in Texas to bail him out, then Mike Illitch in Detroit and Ted Lerner in DC to bid against themselves. If Lerner has learned then Boras has nobody left, because Hicks went belly up,and Ilitch has passed away.
Scott is the Music Man of baseball. He’s Robert Preston telling the good citizens of MLBcity that they got trouble. Only instead of pool, it’s (take your pick) collusion, tanking, profiteering etc. How did that con man in The Music Man fare in the end, anyway? Scott and his clients should check it out.
tgovey
The Sox are in position to low their initial offer. They don’t need JDM and he doesn’t have many options otherwise. This would put pressure on Boras and reduce long-term risk for the Sox.
Like I said, they don’t need him or that big contact.
bosox90
I’ve been on the fence about the Red Sox paying JDM $25m a year for five years. This squarely knocks me off the fence, to the side that believes that money can be very well spent elsewhere. Re-sign Nunez. Sign Watson. Extend Betts. I’d be much happier with that than for them to push further with JDM. Signing him to five years screams MISTAKE.
triumph13
I would agree with you here… if Boston were able to extend Betts or even Xander. But Betts has already stated that he is going year to year, and with Boras with Bogaerts (and his declaring before last season that Xander is one of those franchise style stars like Trout/Harper), I’m guessing they’d have to overpay to extend him as well.
Simply signing Nunez & Watson is good, but wouldn’t it seem like the same critique from last year would carry over? Team is full of doubles hitters, they need a HR middle of the order guy? Maybe do this and see how things stand at the trade deadline?
At some point the Sox need to blink – either offer him a vesting option/buyout year, or a deadline so they can get out of the stalemate and move to other options.
leprechaun
I love seeing all these Boras clients waiting and waiting he caused a lot of these problems with players getting way over payed. Hope the Red Sox walk away
pplama
If Rick Hahn isn’t being unreasonable, trade for Abreu instead? Get him for the next 2 years at under $40mil and he’s out the door before he turns 33.
bosox90
These all just read as panic moves because the Yankees got Stanton. I don’t want to see more prospects walk out the door for two years of a great hitter. I hope they hang tight with what they have and get someone they NEED (Nunez)
Rickeo02
I just hate it when my boss lowballs me like this
Soxman81
This feels like Edwin Encarnacion all over again. JD may want to rethink his strategy or fire Boras before that $125m offer becomes an $80m offer, or worse still a one year pillow contract like Nelson Cruz got.
He’s a DH. I find it laughable they’re trying to sell him as an OF. He’s terrible defensively.
sandman12
Upset with Boston? Just sign with the next team on your list.
cwsOverhaul
Easy business decision. Let it leak you have pulled the offer. Public shaming the high bidder and JDM ultimately getting a worse deal could be a turning point for Boras (and gift to the younger competing agents who may snag clients that would have in the past gone to him without question ). Frustration/emotions getting the best of the iconic agent in a new era of smarter FOs. Megastars in next offseason can use just about any agent and get what they want.
luvbeisbol
DD and BOS ownership are too savvy to pull the offer and leak it. It would feel good for a minute but it would just be chest beating, trying to humiliate Boras. Boras has other clients and isn’t going anywhere.
DD is playing it right. No need to say anything inflammatory. He can do anything he wants, there’s no urgency. If JDM and his agent end up signing at this price point, that’s humiliation enough and you want this expensive player to come aboard with some mojo.
If the offer has to be pulled, DD tells Boras he has x days or hours to take it. But if he does that he has to follow through and pull it. He doesn’t just leak that the offer is pulled.
As a Tiger fan I look forward to JD getting booed in BOS, after he hits lots of solo HR’s and strikes out to end home games. He won’t like it there, unless BOS wins it all which it won’t. The park doesn’t really favor him, though he has plenty of power to hit anywhere.
This negotiation, for students of conflict, is like the Iran Iraq war of the 1980’s. The only bad thing is that it will end. Every day it continues is delicious.
cwsOverhaul
Yes of course any pullback would be after setting the date to accept what is likely the best deal in terms of years and $ that client will see. While Boras has other clients, there are strategic points where you put a perpetual bully in their place. Star Player x Boras has in the future isn’t going to turn down the best offer bc Boras himself has hurt feelings that the club pushed back on another of his client’s negotiations.
SupremeZeus
When the only other team mentioned by reporters talking to Boras & GMs on a daily basis is the Dbacks, it becomes pretty clear that (currently) the Red Sox are JD Martinez’s lone suitor. The stars are lining up well for the Red Sox on this one. Just wait them out and in a perfect world you might get JD on a shorter deal. Keeping your powder dry and waiting until the non-waiiver trade deadline is certainly another viable option for the Red Sox as well.
butch779988
DD should tell Boras he has until Sunday to accept 5/125 or the offer is void and go in another direction
raef715
if i was trying to sell my house, and had only one offer anywhere close to my asking price, and they declined to up their offer, i cant imagine telling them that i was fed up because they refused to bid against themselves..
seamaholic 2
You might well decide not to sell your house though. Happens all the time. Bad example dude!
seamaholic 2
The fact that there isn’t a 2nd bidder for arguably a top 5 hitter in baseball is proof enough for me that at least some teams are colluding. Maybe not formally or in writing like in the 1980’s, but that’s ridiculous. In no other FA year would a guy that good — a freakin’ 600 slugging percentage people — not have a couple teams bidding against each other. Personally, I think the big market teams realized that they couldn’t spend freely this off-season due to lux tax concerns, and make a pact at some point that they would not exceed certain limits on certain players, thereby keeping prices down and allowing them to fit good vets into their payroll. The Sox have Martinez in the sights, the Yanks have Moustakas (probably was originally someone else until Stanton fell in their lap), and watch, the Dodgers will end up with Darvish. All will be screaming deals.
czontixhldr
“The fact that there isn’t a 2nd bidder for arguably a top 5 hitter in baseball is proof enough for me that at least some teams are colluding.”
No, it is not. You tout JDM’s SLG for one season as though it’s sustainable. Wanna bet? Are you seriously suggesting a team should pay him based on one season where he didn’t even play 120 games?
Martinez is a very good hitter, but that’s it. He’s so flawed defensively that even in the year he slugged .600 he didn’t even put up 4 fWAR and only put up 2.6 rWAR.
He’s a walking injury waiting to happen who couldn’t even stay on the field inhis ’20s.
Personally, I think the Red Sox are insane to offer 5/125 – assuming they have.offered that contract. I’ll be shocked if he lives up to it, because he provides less than zero defensive value and he’s likely to spend 1/4 of the season on the DL.
brucewayne
More conspiracy theory nut jobs ! Time to invest in tin foil !
am17tibe
JDM is fed up with the Sox? If I were the Sox I would pull the 5 year deal and now offer him 3 year 60 mil and tell him if he can get a better contract to have at it.
Sideline Redwine
“Fed up” with $25 million a year? Laughable. Talk about entitled…
Yeah, the guy is good, not that good. I hope he sits out until the all-star break. I have never been enamored of the owners, but they are finally getting it right: too much money has been doled out to players over the past ten years, and the lesson is finally being learned.
DMC23
Red Sox should start decreasing their offer. Boras is trying to get them into a bidding war with themselves. What better way to show that isn’t going to happen?
SG
Makes you wonder if past reports of JDM getting a 5./$125M from Boston and Hosmer getting a 7/$140M offer from SD are accurate?
tigerdoc616
We used to joke in Detroit that JD stood for just dingers. Not exactly true, but he did hit plenty of dingers, 99 total in parts of 4 seasons in a Tigers uniform. But he also hit .300, had a .912 OPS and had 285 RBI’s. He also hit 45 hr and 104 RBI’s last year for the season. He ain’t much in the field, but passable in the OF given he hits for power and average and drives in runs.
But given he was a late bloomer and he is now 30, 5 yrs and $125M is more than fair for a guy like JD. But his agent is a parasite so seems unlikely he’ll sign for that anytime soon. But if he waits, he might just be left without a chair when the music stops. So my advice to JD, fire Bora$$, get a new agent, take Boston’s deal.
astros_fan_84
What happens when Boston goes a different direction like Logan Morrison or Nunez/Watson? This could really be explosive on the player side.
Personally, if I was DD, I would lower the offer. Why do business at all with someone who insults you? Do you really trust that player to deliver?
hozie007
So either Ken Rosenthal is a liar …or Scott Boras is a liar…..someone is not being truthful. Either way, this potential deal is tainted all around.
Ryan Tanana
Going with Ken on the truth.
66TheNumberOfTheBest
“Rather, the agent tells Silverman that Martinez is “involved in multiple negotiations and is pleased with the participants and the good faith process,” calling suggestions to the contrary “not accurate.””
Funny, when a media leak irritates the Boston fans and jeopardizes the only real offer his client has Mr. “Teams are MURDERING seasons and the fans are DYING” is suddenly pleased with the “good faith process”.
Harold Reynolds said it well…if JD gets off to a slow start in Boston…after these comments…
Not gonna be fun for him.
Solaris601
Even if Martinez does accept Boston’s offer, that’s just the beginning of the drama. Then comes the issue of who is gonna get the lion’s share of DH ab’s this year – Martinez or Hanley? How often do they play him in the OF? How often does Ramirez play 1B? And will this situation prevent Ramirez from getting the 497 ABs needed to trigger his 2019 vesting option? The latter will be quite a distraction if it develops. In a way it could be a blessing if the Red Sox don’t end up with Martinez.
infractor
125M for a DH is more than enough. About time teams stopped overpaying 1 dimensional, aging players.
Don’t misunderstand – the owners are not saints in all this. But the players (and, more to the point, their agents) throwing tantrums after ONE offseason of slow movement following multiple offseasons of massive overpayments is utterly asinine. Bloody children, the lot of them.
Ken M.
And people thought Ortiz was crazy for demanding 15M.
infractor
It’s crazy to think, eh?
JD is no better a hitter than Papi. The biggest difference is that Papi was a proven pressure player and likeable. And 10m less per year. And I’m not even one of the guys who liked him!
darkstar61
Jd is an idiot for not taking that offer
Bostons offer will not stay on the table forever. There is reportedly no other team willing to offer anything near what the Sox are, so there is zero reason for their offer to increase. They are expecting to compete though too, and that means they will be forced to fill their needs thru other means soon if he continues to play this game.
He waits much longer and even his offer from Arizona may plummet, leaving him no desirable fallback or leverage when Boston loses patience.
He continues to play this game and I believe he will be a case study in how not to negotiate a new multi-year, multi-million dollar contract
RyanR
That’d true, that’s a lot of money especially if you love what you do. It’s better to just take the decent contract and not appear like a greedy person to all the fans. Take it and be happy, because it won’t last forever.
mlb1225
Red Sox could easily turn their money to someone like Logan Morrison. It would save them a lot of money, and the only thing they’d sacrifice is a batting average above 280.
czontixhldr
DD must want a RHB, otherwise would they have signed LoMo already?
mlb1225
I guess that’s why they haven’t pursued LoMo, or at least not yet.
darkstar61
This situation really isn’t all that different than the Encarnacion situation last season – with the big exception being that EE had multiple teams pursing him, while JD has merely 2
Edwin was asking for 5/125 and had turned down Torontos offer of at least 4/80 (with 5th year option pushing it over 100 million) in early November
Nov 11th – Tor signs Morales
Nov 23rd – Hou signs Reddick to big deal
Dec 3rd – Hou signs Beltran
Dec 5th – Tor signs Pearce
Dec 7th – NYY signs Holliday
Dec 15th – NYY spends rest of cash on Chapman
Dec 18th – Bos signs Moreland
Boston finally giving up on Edwin was apparently the turning point, as merely days later (Dec 22nd) EE ditched his asking price of 5/125 to instead accept 3/60 from Cleveland
JD better be very cautious here – Boston does what they did last year, this time with Morrison as you say, and Martinez will see his market collapse nearly completely
triumph13
I’m sure JD expected to get multiple offers at $150M or more… Instead he got one offer over $100M, and it’s a place he’d rather not go to.
JMO, but I think at this point… JD is just hoping Arizona can offer him something close to what Boston is – enough to give him reason to return there.
Are the Sox ok with waiting this out into March? What if they do, and he goes elsewhere? Are they fine with standing pat at this point?
Also- If they signed him… wouldn’t they still be looking at a LH reliever? Or does JD handcuff them there? Ive heard no news on that front.
AUTiger7222
Players are crying collusion yet unsigned players like J.D. Martinez got 5 year deals for $120M on the table from the Red Sox. Players have no one to blame but themselves for not being signed.
stratcrowder
Yada yada yada….
billybilly
There really is nothing wrong with MLB teams being prudent. It’s like buying a car. If they won’t agree to what you’re willing to pay ie what you value it at it’s ok, you don’t buy the car. You’re not cheap for not collapsing to the other persons wishes. It’s smart business
dbec72
Boras is lying about having several teams interested in him unless he counts teams willing to give him a 3yr 45mil deal as interested..
seamaholic 2
Agents don’t bluff. If they ever did, that would be their last client.
Expos_1994
Why would any team gave a player more then 3-5 years when we have seen pretty much all 7-10 years been huge albatross for teams and fans base.
Toward the middle point of there contracts and even some start to finish like Zito, Pujols.
For example Im sure the Phillies fans prefered the last season with kids fighting for there playing time then the last 2-3 years of Howard and is old folks teammates.
mike156
Amazing to me that we fans mostly side with the billionaire owners, many of whom have also received our taxpayer dollars. It’s always the player who is greedy. Martinez is a free agent. He’s entitled to bargain as long and as hard as he possibly can until he gets a contract he likes. If he ends up shooting himself in the foot, like several other Boras clients has (Boras is usually but not always successful) than that’s his problem. He doesn’t owe it to anyone to take less than he wants–and the teams pursuing him don’t have any obligations to meet his demand. If he ends up with a late start….that’s the risk.
chesteraarthur
Yes, this is all true. I can only speak for myself, but the issue arises when they (player or agent) start whining that things aren’t going their way. It is up to JD if he thinks he’s worth more than the offer he has, but I don’t want to hear him crying to the media about it.
czontixhldr
I don’t side with the owners or players. I think the players deserve everything they can get.
But as a Philly fan I’ve seen my team hamstrung financially by bad deals. I’ve also seen other teams get little for the money – particularly on long-term contracts.
I think players aren’t paid enough when they’re younger – the minimum salary should be higher, at least 7 figures. If players sign 200MM deals at the age of 23 that end at 32 I’m OK with it.
I just don’t want my team entering into deals that hurt more in the long run than they help in the short. I don’t want my team paying a bench splinter 20-25MM yr. for little or even nothing when they could allocate those resources to a player(s) that actually provides value for those dollars.
AmericanEducated
This. As a Giants fan they have/are taking plenty of bad/boars contracts. And it makes you hate that player and the GM that signed them.
Blame moneyball I guess, but the last thing fans want are negative WAR old players keeping your team from competing..
bradthebluefish
“I’m so fed up with the Red Sox’s $125 million offer that I’ll sign with Arizona for half the money”
brucewayne
Yea! That will teach em huh? LoL
brewcrew08
So he has a 5yr/120M offer and he hasn’t taken it? How can he possibly value himself more than that? All things considered given Cain went for 5yr/80M and is better defensively and on the base paths and just as good of an on base guy. Paying a 40M “premium” for the power numbers seems more than fair to me.
gibba192471
Please go back to Arizona, you aren’t mentally tough enough for Boston! They will eat you alive you bum!!
bigmike0424
For those who think Boras isn’t all that smart with how he does his business, you do know that he for his clients that are about to be free agent next yr, he been working on that also as he does his research on what teams could be bidding on for his guys the next season and the next season….
realist101
If GM’s are talking with Boras about his FA’s for next year, that’s textbook tampering. Those players are still under contract to other teams. In practice, it would be really tough to catch anybody, but that’s the sort of thing that MLB would throw the book at a team/GM if they found out about.
I think – though I’m not certain – that would also be a really big problem for Boras, potentially to the point that the MLB could go to an arbitrator and force the MLBPA to decertify Boras as an agent.
Phillies2017
Anybody who gives into Martinez is an idiot.
stansfield123
If I was running the union when the current CBA expires, my reaction to all this nonsense about “aging free agents” being overpaid would be very simple: You don’t like “aging free agents”? Fine. We go on strike until owners agree that ALL players turn into free agents in their age 26 season. And the luxury cap starts at $250M, and goes up by 3% every year.
No negotiations. Those are the conditions. Simple and to the point. Want six years of team control? You can get them, by calling kids up at 19.
realist101
That’s not a terrible idea, but here’s your practical problem: a big slice of union members would absolutely hate the transition to that system. Specifically, it would be the 30 and older guys who already put in their time under the current team control system and are now free agents.
Free agents make what they make, relative to production, in part due to scarcity. They also make it in part because teams set payroll budgets relative to team revenue, and they have money available to bid to fill holes based on what’s left after minimum salary and arb players.
Under your system, a higher percent of MLB revenue would almost certainly go to the players over time. In the transition to it, however, some players with service time at or right on the cusp of free agency would almost certainly see their career earnings decline compared to the current system.
impliedi
Flooding the market with free agents without increasing the number of buyers (teams) would bring the largest contract values down, not up.
If I were the owners in your scenario, I’d say “fine, but using an age instead of years of control means that we’d have to lose the arbitration process, so every player will make league minimum until they turn 26.”
czontixhldr
I don’t think it will be that extreme, but I think you’re on to something and it’s headed in that direction.
Unfortunately for the players it’s going to take the next CBA before that happens, and a lot of the older guys aren’t going to get paid like they’ve been used to.
darkstar61
And you’d be ousted near instantly, with the players losing countless millions of dollars because they would be forced to sit out the game indefinably until that silly demand was ditched completely. Hit hardest would be the little/young guys, but all players would suffer both in the short and long terms
Reality is, players over the age of 30 can still get massive contracts, they just cant as easily get the insane lengths at those amounts they demand. That is a problem with their expectations, nothing else. Teams are not in the wrong for realizing that almost no 5/6 year contract to a 30+ yo is going to be worth the money in the 5th/6th year, and therefore they can only offer the AAV desired over a shorter length
Martinez has exactly 2 teams seriously interested in him. One of those two teams is willing to offer him in the range of 5/120 – more than he is going to be worth over that period. The other team offering is known to not feel he is worth that/that they cant afford that and have offered less. No other team has the need or available funds to offer in the ballpark. That means he has been offered over what his value is, and has only one team even capable of offering that, but is still demanding more.
If JD really thinks he is going to be worth more over the 5 years than what the market says, and doesn’t want to sign for what the market is, then fine – let him walk away from the game as hes waiting for his demands to be met. But teams can not be forced to pay everyone every insane demand they make just because they make it*
(*this is especially true for a guy like JD, who has been worth less over the last 5 years than he has been offered for the next 5)
SG
Am I hearing this right?
Scott Boras is now saying Steve Adams’s and Ken Rosenthal’s reporting is “NOT ACCURATE”?
“7:30pm: Boras, unsurprisingly, rejected the notion that Martinez is unhappy with any potential suitor, writes Michael Silverman of the Boston Herald. Rather, the agent tells Silverman that Martinez is “involved in multiple negotiations and is pleased with the participants and the good faith process,” calling suggestions to the contrary “not accurate.””
Can either Scott Adams or Ken Rosenthal please explain why they would put their name behind “inaccurate reporting”?
Solaris601
Boras regularly refers to statements as inaccurate if the dollar figures are even a penny off or all the terms of the offer are not included. My sense is the terms reported are likely accurate, and you can’t blame reporters for omitting undisclosed terms.
SG
That being said, how do you know any of the reports are correct from a Boras client? It would also seem to me that the Red Sox never offered 5/$125M for JDM as I see no way JDM is worth that considering Cain got only 5/$75 and Cain has a higher WAR and is a much better fielder. So I’m thinking JDM will be lucky if he gets 4/$60M.
Bosox2013
Full disclaimer I do not want the Red Sox to sign JDM but since Dombro has allegedly already offered up $120 – 5 Years he has played his hand at the negotiation table. A fair compromise could be $126 – $128 on 5 Years but front load money in year 1 at $30 – $32 and a Player Opt Out after year 1. That could be a win, win situation. Granted JDM probably doesn’t want to go back on the market next year and risk all of this again but he’ll have a new crop of free agency to help set his price and for the Red Sox they can re-evaluate there “power” needs next year if he departs and if he doesn’t opt out then oh well because Dombro is already willing to commit 5 Years.
SG
PS – the 5/$125M offer is “inaccurate” per Boras himself. There is absolutely no way of knowing what’s going on unless you’re DD or Boras. The JDM story has been filled with BS since the WS ended. It started out he was getting $200M, now it’s maybe down to $125M and Cain, a better all around player with a higher WAR, only got $75M. So your guess is as good as mine.
Soxman81
I’m so sick of hearing about JD Martinez being upset about his lack of better offers. Eff this guy. Seriously. I wish the Sox would pull the offer at this point. Save that money for next year and go hard after Harper, Donaldson, etc.
Martinez is a nice hitter, but last year was an outlier season. He’s terrible on defense, so he’s essentially a DH, and he can’t stay on the field.