It took over three months, but the premier free agent in this year’s class finally came off the board Saturday. Right-hander Yu Darvish agreed to join the Cubs on a six-year, $126MM guarantee that includes an opt-out clause after 2019. As you’d expect, a bevy of media reactions to the agreement have come in over the course of the day. Here’s a look at several…
- When the offseason began in November, Darvish “wasn’t really” on Chicago’s radar, Sahadev Sharma of The Athletic reports on Twitter. However, it seems the Cubs benefited from this winter’s slow-moving free-agent market in this case, as it helped lead to a lower-than-expected price tag for Darvish and a major splash for the North Siders. Darvish went into the winter seeking an accord along the lines of Stephen Strasburg’s (seven years, $175MM) or new teammate Jon Lester’s (six years, $155MM), Patrick Mooney of The Athletic details (subscription required).
- While there’s a well-known fondness between Darvish and the Rangers, with whom he has spent the majority of his career, Texas was “not even close” to landing him, Jeff Wilson of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram hears. Evan Grant of the Dallas Morning News adds that Texas didn’t make an offer to Darvish, and the club wouldn’t even have been willing to guarantee him $75MM in total if it did. The Rangers have a glaring need for a front-end starter, but they’re not close enough to contention to splurge on one, Grant writes. Rangers general manager Jon Daniels, who has a good relationship with Darvish, spoke highly of the 31-year-old on Saturday. “I am very happy for Yu and hope he gets everything he wants,” Daniels said (via Wilson). “He will go down as one of the best pitchers in Rangers history. I expect he’s going to be very good wherever he goes.”
- The Dodgers, Darvish’s other ex-team, made him an offer, but it fell short of the Cubs’, Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic (subscription required) and Bill Shaikin of the Los Angeles Times report. Contrarily, Jon Heyman of FanRag tweets that LA was “said to have offered in the same ballpark” as Chicago. Although, signing Darvish would have made it difficult for the Dodgers to achieve their goal of staying under the $197MM luxury tax threshold in 2018.
- Likewise, tax concerns stood in the way of a Yankees-Darvish union. New York never even made Darvish an offer, Rosenthal tweets.
- The small-market Twins aggressively went after Darvish this winter, even meeting with him in Texas at some point, per Mike Berardino of the Pioneer Press. Their offer to Darvish was for at least five years and $100MM, according to Heyman (Twitter link). The Twins’ courtship of Darvish went for naught, though, perhaps thanks to their dislike for opt-out clauses and a wariness toward giving him a sixth year, writes Berardino, who adds that they could now look to top available starter Jake Arrieta. On the trade front, Rays righties Chris Archer and Jake Odorizzi remain on Minnesota’s radar, relays Berardino, though he suggests the Twins would have to give up too much for the former. Meanwhile, Rosenthal reports that there’s a belief among rival executives the Twins could still add a starter via both free agency and the trade market. Along with Odorizzi, he lists free agent Alex Cobb and Astros righty Collin McHugh as hurlers who have drawn Minnesota’s interest.
- The upstart Brewers were part of the Darvish derby, too, and the belief is that they also submitted a proposal of at least five years and $100MM, Heyman tweets. However, Rosenthal hears that Milwaukee’s offer “was not as competitive as reports indicated.” Further, Rosenthal suggests that the Brewers may have primarily been in the running just to drive up the price for the NL Central rival Cubs. Regardless, with Darvish now out of the mix, Odorizzi and the Athletics’ Jharel Cotton are trade possibilities for the Brew Crew, according to Rosenthal.
- In addition to the previously listed Twins and Brewers, the Dodgers and the Phillies are still targeting starters in the wake of the Darvish deal, Jeff Passan of Yahoo Sports tweets. Philadelphia is aggressively pursuing a short-term addition, per Mark Feinsand of MLB.com. Andrew Cashner, Chris Tillman, Jaime Garcia and Jason Vargas are all possibilities, Feinsand adds.
- Keith Law of ESPN (subscription required) has mixed feelings on the Darvish pact. While it “appears to be a bargain salary,” Law has reservations about the length, contending that it’s one or two years too long, and he doesn’t regard Darvish “a pure ace.” Darvish has become too reliant on his cutter and not reliant enough on his slider, which has led to vulnerability against left-handed hitters, Law observes. However, Darvish may have “some untapped potential right now” if he leans more on his slider, per Law, who at least sees him as a significant near-term upgrade for the Cubs.
robert-5
First
RedFeather
Cardinals front office: “meh, we feel good with what we have. At the end of the day, we will make moves that make sense”.
This Cardinal way is straight up ridiculous!!
It like the Steelers going out and signing Ryan Leaf to replace Big Ben. What a joke.
-Cards fan
dazhk
Yep Mozeliak is delusional and De-Twit is laughing all the way to the bank.
fannclub6
Cards are competitive every year for a reason. If you’re a real Cardinal fan you should be glad Mo didn’t saddle us with that contract (ref. Pujols, Heyward, Price). Have some faith Red Feather
kenly0
The Cards offered all 3 of those guys close to 200 million each.
fannclub6
They made a serious effort but when the price gets too high they back away. The Darvish contract will ultimately be regretted by the Cubs also. They didn’t learn anything from Heyward
JrodFunk5
Jeez, a lot of complaining when your team is one of the best run franchises in sports. Trust me, as a Tiger fan I can tell you you don’t want these mega deals
madmanTX
Lol best run except when they hack other teams on their computers?
dave13
You ever offer positive thoughts or just troll every team that your not a fanboy of? You never have anything worth posting why bother?
Bryzzo2016
That’s a damn good question, dave13. Can’t think of a more pathetic and shallow existence than being a troll. He’s not even a clever troll,
Braves Homer
If you ain’t cheatin you ain’t tryin! Ha!
fannclub6
Stupid statement.
brucewayne
So the whole team was hacked ? Cool story Bro! You’re an idiot!
nyderek27
There are no small markets in baseball. The Twins owners have millions to spend.
wrigleywannabe
they are still a small market
JoeyK
City size, I guess. Pocket size. They are feeding Twins fans bullshit.
GareBear
Size of an owner’s wallet has little to die with market size. Baseball is a business venture for these businessmen, they have money but unless you were Mike Illitch then you aren’t going to spend more than the baseball ops makes; otherwise it is a bad investment. Hence, NY/BOS/LA are always going to have a bigger market then Minneapolis or Kansas City. However, baseball markets aren’t only by population. St. Louis is smaller than Miami but it’s baseball market is far superior. There are small markets even if all of the owners are high rollers.
jasonpen
The reverse of that is: the more you win, the more you make…
You have to spend money to make money.
FredBlassie
The profit in owning a team comes from the rising value of the franchise, not from cash flow through operations.
jd396
It’s gotta be fun riding unicorns to work on your planet
mikeyank55
Small market=
Small mind
Small wallet
#1 Small Market team=
NY Mets
pohsib_54
Polads are top 10 for wealthiest MLB owners. Small market is about demographics not pocket books. You don’t stay rich spending more than your team can earn for you.
robert-5
Cardinals17
As the Cardinals sit on their thumbs and say they’re excited about what they have!!! Guess they are. They’re happy with putting $260 million into Ballpark Village rather than top tiered ballplayers. Not much fans can do about that. However, I’m going to put my little bit of money into Dish TV where I can watch all of the ballgames without paying over $750 for my family to go to a game at Busch Stadium. If the Owners don’t want us to come to the games. I guess we won’t go.
brucewayne
Actually the Cards are not putting all the money up. They have a partner that’s putting up a ton of money also!
One Fan
So there goes Keith Law taking both sides of a position. Hard to be wrong going that route
Paul Heyman
Brock Lesnar
bk1369
This made me chuckle
bigdaddyt
Best outcome is from that guy who was almost dead on about his prediction. Also having the hot stove turned up a notch comments
limjaheytrailerparksupervisor
Cubs overpaid on Darvish but I hope this gets the market moving. Hosmer and JD Martinez should take the best offers they’ve been given cause this off-season has been so boring.
ChiSoxCity
Darvish got less than projected market value. By definition, that is not an overpay.
limjaheytrailerparksupervisor
6 years for a 31 year old pitcher I’d say thats too much. If the cubs are lucky he opts out after 2019 so they’re not in the hook for his mid 30s.
stratcrowder
First of all, you can’t possibly judge it until it’s been fulfilled. Same thing with trades.
AndThisGameBelongsToMySanDiegoPadres
If he is pitching at a level that he would opt out the Cubs would want him to not opt out.
One Fan
But you did not respond to Chisoxcity schooling you on your overpay comment.
Cubs pay about $4m per year less then what was projected so by definition its not an overpay at all.
You may not like it or you may be just jealous your team was not able to land Darvish but its not an overpay
ThatBallwasBryzzoed
More than 4 years for any pitcher is too much and too long. But this deal is essentially 3 years with an opt out after 2 or 4 years with an opt out after 3. The last 3 or 4 years would really be options. If he opts out either time. The cubs are off the hook for 84mil and 73 mil. Not a.baf gamble when you break it down.
wellhitball
As Branch Rickey said: “Better to let a player go one year too early than one year too late.” (the quote was actually about trades, but it fits with opt-outs too.)
iverbure
If Darvish opts out its actually good for the Cubs they can re-evaluate whether or not they want to resign him for his older seasons. Not sure why everyone on here thinks it’s bad if guys opt out it’s always good to get out of long term commitments to players in their 30s
AndThisGameBelongsToMySanDiegoPadres
No. It’s not good for the Cubs. If he’s playing well enough to opt out the Cubs would WANT to be on the hook for his older seasons, or at least he would figure to draw some trade interest. It’s only good to get out of long-term commitments to players in their 30s if they aren’t earning those commitments and if Darvish opts out it means he is earning it.
Varangian
Opting out IS good for the Cubs. If he’s good enough to want to opt out then that means he’s performed pretty well for you while he was there. Then you’re not still on the hook for his older seasons, and you can resign him or go after another FA if necessary.
AndThisGameBelongsToMySanDiegoPadres
If he performs well enough to opt out you WANT to be on the hook for his older seasons. If he doesn’t get an opt out and he performs well in those early seasons you can either keep him or trade him for prospects. Him having an opt out is BAD for the Cubs.
Cachhubguy
Yes. And baseball is exactly the same as it was in 1960.
BlueSkyLA
Exactly. Further, if he stinks or is injured during the pre-opt-out years, he doesn’t take the opt out. How often have teams been stuck paying that kind of dead money? Quite often. Not sure how it isn’t understood that the value of the opt-out is entirely to the player.
brucewayne
Opt outs are never team friendly! It’s always an advantage for the player!
jd396
We’re talking about baseball players signing contracts, not selling mattresses
swanhenge
Not so sure if it was an overpay. 20-22M seems about the going rate for a front line SP around the league. I suppose it’s all relative, but for the way this off season has gone, it’s good to see the top pitcher set the market. The rest of the FA Ps now have a number to go from.
Coast1
I’m thinking that the Cubs were offering something like 5 years/$120 million and Darvish got them to add a 6th year on but only adding $6 million to the deal. The Cubs probably feel he’s worth that gamble and they get a lower AAV for luxury tax purposes.
robert-5
Agree, they gave him the 6th year, but he took less AAV.
seamaholic 2
Suspect it was the opt out that got him. That’s super valuable and probably kicks the deal up to effectively around $140m
bigjonliljon
Exactly. The extra year was for 6 million only. No brainer
One Fan
Oh please explain how the opt out now costs the Cubs $140 m instead of $126 over 6 years
First idiot if it goes 6 years it means he did not opt out. Next if he opts out it costs the cubs nothing more. So where is the magical extra $14m come from?
Let me guess. You just pulled it out of your ass
Varangian
Quit name calling. It makes you sound immature, and people don’t take you seriously. Didn’t your mommy teach you better?
One Fan
I love the morons who say overpay no matter what.
Please educate us mere mortals. What was the proper market for Darvish
madmanTX
Lol pay him based on the quality of his starts. That’s fair.
dcnatswin
Don’t you just love how easily Keith Law can diagnose and solve a problem that pitching coaches and Darvish himself haven’t been able to figure out? Just throw the slider more to lefties and Yu will be a frontline starter again…. done
sufferforsnakes
Yeah, if he throws his slider like Law wants him to, his elbow won’t last 6 years.
bbatardo
Funny part is throwing his slider too much might have lead to TJ surgery too.
wrigleywannabe
or, he is stating the opinion of many baseball people, that is rooted in common fact
dcnatswin
It’s a fact that he’s not as affective without the slider but to say he has untapped potential he can tap into simply if he throws it more, as Law wrote, is an over simplification that ignores the factors that led to him using the pitch less in the first place.
Dag Gummit
Common fact? You mean like the common fact that the slider generally increases platoon splits and the cutter frequently reverses them. That would be a common fact, I suppose. Knowing that, it’s a bit odd that Law would imply it’s the opposite for Darvish. It’s certainly possible, but would be highly… Uncommon.
WubbaLubbaDubDub
Keith Law is as good at being an alleged “insider” as he was at being a GM.
TomBradyrings
I believe Arietta will outperform Darvish over the next 6 years. I’d bet on it.
tuke17
Highly doubt Darvish is a Cub after 2 years so it really won’t matter.
Bryzzo2016
Haha, you think he’s gonna opt out at age 33? I know his 21m AAV is below market value, but that would still be a tough gamble.
Coast1
I don’t care how good he is no one is going to give a 33 year old starting pitcher more than the $84 million he’ll have left on his deal.
michaelw
Really. Coast 1. Lol
Zack G will make 34.5 million a year at 35, oh n 36. Oh n 37 oh and 38. Your point. Get lost
kenster84
as Greinke cashes his $30 million+ checks for the next 4 years
robert-5
If he pitches well at all, and salaries continue to rise, I would expect him to opt out. Good thing for Yu is he has security of 6yrs and $126M if anything goes wrong.
tuke17
When you’ve been making anywhere between 15-21 million a year for the past several years with another garunteed 50 over the next 2, money isn’t the end all, be all of decision making.
Joe Kerr
and since I watched Arrieta get worse over the last 3 years, I would take that bet with you.
iverbure
You owe this guy some money
Gocubsgo1986
Arrieta has lost 4 mph from his fastball in the past 2 years, points directly at the shoulder. Ligaments are stretched and minus that elasticity, rotator cuff or labrum tears. Tommy John is no big deal since the elbow only goes 2 ways, a shoulder goes all ways and never feels the same after an injury
whosyourmomma
Interesting thoughts. It appeared to me that Arrieta looked stiffer in his delivery last year (not sure why or what caused that). Depending on what team Arrieta goes to I’d rather have him than Darvish. Either way, Cubs spent or traded a TON on pitchers the last few years!
Bryzzo2016
No one knows Arrieta better than Theo and the Cubs. It’s pretty clear that they got his best and he’s already started his decline. I hope he signs quick and nets the Cubs another draft pick. I love that Yu came with NO draft pick compensation.
One Fan
Whoisyourmomma
So you will take Arrieta but it depends on which team he signs with?
In other words, like Keith Law, you really say nothing and no nothing
Shawn McLaughlin 2
He probably “no’s” how to spell know.
whosyourmomma
Haha, pretty funny when the guy insults someone’s intelligence and he doesn’t know it’s “know” not “no”. All I meant by it was if Arrieta goes to Colorado or Texas (just as examples) versus say the Giants well that can change things.
dewssox79
same.
twentyforty
No you wouldn’t. That’s insanity if you think that.
bigjonliljon
I’ll take that bet. His velocity has dropped huge. His violent delivery already leads to control issues… could soon end up TJ time. Cubs know him better than any one, yet they wanted nothing to do with him. Hint…hint
iverbure
Time to pay up.
One Fan
Oh Tom Brady is going to bet on it! Wow so impressed. First learn how to spell Arrieta big guy. Then make your bets
Cachhubguy
You’d lose.
classicmixup
Then maybe the Wihte Sox should sign him. Plus, I doubt it.
classicmixup
Typical of a trolling White Sox fan
bigcokeslushy
If this is what gets the offseason going, I think we can all agree that this is great
Goose
Well Boras is going to be pissed. This goes to show Martinez the market is not going to pay his guys multiple years, north of $25+ million a year.
spartan-i7
Giving $120mil to an extremely injury prone pitcher who will be turning 32 this year and is coming off of a lackluster season in which he repeatedly choked during the most significant moments for his team. Don’t see how any Cubs fan could love this deal…
MC Tim C
I’m not sure how having TJ once makes someone extremely injury prone. The Cubs got Darvish for less than expected, and he should be better moving to the NL. It seems like only bitter Dodger and Brewer fans think this was a bad deal.
spartan-i7
Not a fan of the Dodgers, Brewers, or any other NL team for that matter, and one doesn’t need to be in order to recognize the amount of glaring red flags associated with this signing.
twentyforty
You apparently couldn’t recognize water if you fell out of a boat.
wellhitball
Not to mention he should be better pitching half his games at Wrigley with the Cubs’ defense instead of pitching in Arlington.
madmanTX
That’s hilarious: I didn’t know that Chicago could defend against 400ft home run shots or their superior defense could prevent those games when Darvish gets shelled.
wellhitball
Not the 400ft shots, but the ones that barely made it over the fence in Arlington will be nothing but loud outs at Wrigley, PNC, and Busch.
How does having better defense not help him? Sounds like you’re just salty the Rangers had to let him go.
Dag Gummit
Conversely, not having most road games in Seattle, Anaheim or Oakland will hurt any pitcher some. It’s most likely still net favorable to his ERA and RA9, but may not be as significant as many will think — especially given that no one really knows how Wrigley will play until they see how the flag blows that day.
brucewayne
Plus add in a lot of games at St. Louis, Milwaukee, Cincinnati
brucewayne
and Pittsburgh on top of Wrigley
brucewayne
That’s a lot of hitter friendly ballparks !
tuke17
“Extremely injury prone”????
Bit of a stretch I think
spartan-i7
Missed all of 2015 with torn ligaments in elbow, missed significant time in 2016 with shoulder stiffness and a neck soreness, missed some time in 2017 with back tightness, missed time in 2014 with elbow inflammation
“Extreme” might be a bit of an exaggeration, but still….
tuke17
He missed 15′ with TJ, 15 day DL to start 16′ (additional recovery time at the start of the season), 15 day DL mid season for shoulder stiffness and 10 day DL in 17′ for back stiffness.
Outside of the TJ surgery he has been very healthy with only and additional 25 days spent on the DL for ailments not related to the TJ procedure.
iverbure
Tuke I think you got that down vote for inconvenient facts. Remember when the internet didn’t exist and you just had idiots spouting off and you couldn’t fact check them within seconds.what a time to be alive now.
wrigleywannabe
Stop regurgitating talking points. His postseason experience is still limited and started out well.
Maddux got rocked early in his ps career.
Kershaw has a 4.35 ERA postseason and 4.75 I. the LCS
Bryzzo2016
Hahaha, this bitter trolls are very transparent. 21 m AAV with no draft pick compensation. I’ll take that ALL day.
desertbull
Theo has a fist full of rings. Ill trust him until he stops winning.
One Fan
Hey spartan educate us on how TJ surgery makes someone extremely injury prone
iverbure
How about now
Cachhubguy
They just got a lot better. That’s how.
bary52
First these guys have to come down to reality. The big bucks will be spent next year. This class of free agents are weaker and the owners are saving their cash for next years free agent class.
sufferforsnakes
Dang, he’s gonna be (baseball) old when that contract nears it’s end.
AM21
Meanwhile, in Boston…
::crickets::
ChiSoxCity
This article is nonsensical. Darvish went to the team most people thought he would, and for less money. The Cubs had the financial flexibility to offer the most money. I get that a vast majority of the media based in the northeast, but their need to downplay any and every positive aspect of Chicago undermines what little credibility they have left.
MC Tim C
Exactly. This is a good value signing, and Darvish can always opt out after 2 years. The butthurt Dodger and Brewer fans are trying to make this out to be a terrible signing.
Kenleyfornia74
Good value? He is over 30 had TJS and has got worse as the years go on. It can definitely backfire on them.
bigjonliljon
Modern medicine… guys are coming off TJ stronger than ever. His is in the past and he’s better than pre TJ. Arrieta will have his soon.
One Fan
So he had TJ surgery so what? Its not a big deal and has not been for many years
Cachhubguy
What’s backfiring? If they win another WS, it will be a good move.
SoCalStuntman
Haha you need to take your comedy act on the road and hope it pays your bills! Butthurt Dodgers and Brewers fans!
Kenleyfornia74
Anyone who thinks a Cubs contract might not work out is butthurt. Let me guess was Jayson Heyward a good contract too?
SoCalStuntman
Huh?
Cachhubguy
He helped them win a WS. So yes.
bigjonliljon
Well said
robert-5
This deal by far made the most sense. As previously mentioned, the Cubs have given up much in terms of prospects the last couple years for pitching, so trying to swing another trade for a controllable young starter didnt make a ton of sense. Then when you look at the Cubs firsr target, Cobb and realize he’s tied to a draft pick, going up the ladder and paying more money for a better pitcher in Darvish, with no draft pick compensation just made too much sense. You’re really not “saving” anything by going with the inferior Cobb bc you have to turn and surrender a draft pick for him. Also, it’s not a foregone conclusion that we will receive a pick for Arrieta. We can assume so, but he could go unsigned for quite a while if he’s unwilling to lower his price. Don’t recall the exact rules (anyone?) but eventually that draft pick falls off…maybe just after the draft?
Good signing by Theo and Jed. Six years is long but Yu may very well opt out and make that a moot point.
bary52
Lets get this offseason rolling now…
SoCalStuntman
Overpaid, but hey, Cubs fan, best of luck with him.
wrigleywannabe
nope…less AV than he would have gotten elsewhere
bigjonliljon
Over paid?? Obviously you haven’t read the tons of predictions expecting Darvish to sign for more money. Research a bit more before trolling.
One Fan
Socalstuntman is a little troll who is very pissed off Darvish chose the Cubs over the Dodgers.
Thats right troll the Dodgers went after him and he chose to leave the Dodgers, a team he was comfortable with, for the Chicago Cubs.
The draw and allure if the Cubs and Wrigley were too strong. Ouch Dodger fans!
Blue_Painted_Dreams_LA
You’re trolling isn’t significantly great either. The Cubs offered 25M more and you’re acting as if the allure of Wrigley and the Cubs is all so mighty. That’s a good one. Darvish was comfortable will the Dodgers and wanted to return, but a deal being contingent on moving money, 25M, opt outs, and no trade. Yes I’d say he made the right choice. I wish him good luck in Chic, but get over yourself it’s a little comical.
michaelw
They really didn’t. The Dodgers were close than you think for what I’ve read. Over 120 but couldn’t move an old over paid Bum like Kemp. Lol
Blue_Painted_Dreams_LA
But they really didn’t they went 100/6. Plus the opt outs and no trade clause add more value to that contract. Like I said, it was an easy choice for Darvish.
BlueSkyLA
Why would the Dodgers have not also offered an opt-out? Clearly they aren’t religiously opposed to them, and they lower the AAV. So everything points to the Dodgers having made this part of their offer too. The issue as you point out was the need to find the payroll space, and possibly the total dollars. The biggie was the former. If the Dodgers are religiously opposed to anything, it is exceeding the luxury tax threshold this year. Obviously they just aren’t going to do it, not for for anyone.
One Fan
Why don’t you enlighten us all with your wisdom Blue Painted Dreams and educate us on how much more its costs the Cubs to offer the opt out and ntc.
Blue_Painted_Dreams_LA
Like you said they aren’t religiously opposed to the opt out. But I’d say they are somewhat religiously opposed to the NTC and yes the luxury tax. So in terms of contract numbers they didn’t come close for a reason and the NTC/opt out adds value to Darvish. Plus having him wait on a market contingent on shedding salary when the cubs went to 6 years 25M+ it’s an easy call for Darvish and his agent.
Blue_Painted_Dreams_LA
@one fan maybe you need some better reading comprehension skills. Your argument was completely wrong and you attacked a portion of the statement like a child and are still wrong. Who said it cost the cubs anything more to offer the opt and NTC? It actually lowers their potential commitments, because the Opt out/NTC have inherent value to Darvish. It’s not that difficult to understand. I didn’t even attack the contract it’s a good one for Darvish. But c’mon your trolling is still pretty childish.
BlueSkyLA
Pile a NTC on top of an opt-out and it becomes difficult to find scenarios where the NTC could be important. If the player opts out the NTC is voided. If he doesn’t, it would likely be due to performance and/or injury issues that could make him virtually untradable.
How much less (if anything) the offer the Dodgers made to Darvish is uncertain but for sure any differences were made irrelevant by the Dodgers’ inability to clear the necessary payroll space.
Honestly, I am relieved. I did not want to see Darvish return to the Dodgers.
gooddumps
Wasn’t Jay Cutler’s contract worth $126 million?
One Fan
Jay Cutler? Who cares
PLAYTOWIN
Cubs better hope Darvish is “really healthy”. If he is, it is a good signing even if there are only 4 or 5 teams who could afford him considering the risk. The Cubs, Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers, Angels can afford flops….not many other teams can.
whosyourmomma
Trivia question who was Cubs best playoff pitcher last year?
Answer- Jake Arrieta. Theo and/or Joe pitched him late in series & it came back to bite them. That was the writing on the wall for me that Jake wasn’t coming back to Cubs.
bigjonliljon
Similar to how they pushed Chapman in the 2016 WS run. They knew they weren’t resigning him so they used and abused that arm. Did sane with Jake. But let’s not forget the crap 1st half Jake had. He did better 2nd half… yes. But used and abused an arm they knew they weren’t k doing.
One Fan
Yea sure that 6 innings he pitched in the NLCS really abused him. You guys got it all figured out
One Fan
It came back to bite them? He pitched late in the series moron because that was when his turn came up dummy. How is that for your trivia
66TheNumberOfTheBest
Here’s why I found Tony Clark’s “sacred bond” comments to be such horse flop…
Darvish was going to wait and wait and wait until he got a decent offer from a top 5 team, no matter how much money the Twins or Brewers tossed at him. It’s like college sports, the top teams recruit the top players and stay the top teams.
Tony Clark and the MLBPA never cared at all about the competitiveness of small market teams as long as the players were getting paid. His sudden concern was beyond self serving and disingenuous.
22222pete
If that was the case MlBPA never woukd have agreed to giving teams 6 years control over players which primarily benefits small market teams not would they have agreed to revenue sharing and the luxury tax. Maybe Twins and Brewers should have upped their offer, 5/100 is a joke. One more year and an opt out is all they needed to do
Pablo
Darvish never wanted them, he refused meetings with them for months. He only sought top teams. I wouldn’t offer my top money either. They made offers as a formality hoping to have a place at the table.
bigjonliljon
Clark got schooled on last CBA. No cap led to a real cap. He didn’t see that coming
slider32
Seems to me that the market is about right with this signing, Darvish at 22 million looks right to me. Arrieta gets a little more per year for less years. Both Lynn and Cobb should get 4/65.-70.
22222pete
Pretty light for a guy coming off a 3.9 bWAR season
chgobangbang
Rangers GM states one of greatest pitchers in their history? He has 56 career wins
OntariGro
And if Wins alone weren’t a pretty bad way to measure pitching greatness, that would mean something.
Darvish’s Ranks on Rangers All-Time Pitching Leaderboards:
bWAR (for Pitchers): 4th
ERA: 4th
W/L%: 5th
WHIP: 3rd
Hits/9 IP: 2nd
K/9 IP: 1st
K: 4th
K/BB: 1st
ERA+: 1st
FIP: 3rd
Adjusted Pitching Runs: 3rd
Adjusted Pitching Wins: 2rd
WPA: 5th
So….yeah,…checks out.
bigjonliljon
2016….. 2018 sounds doable. Yee haw
desertbull
No one cares about the 5th and 6th years of this deal. The Cubs window is NOW! They cant resign all of Bryant, Rizzo, Russell, Contreras, Baez etc. go for it now then start over in 2023.
One Fan
Why cant the resign them all they are a cash cow and have billions more on the way in two years when they launch their own TV network.
Sorry troll but the Chicago Cubs are here to stay as a force to be reckoned with troll
chesteraarthur
Your posts are incredibly annoying. You come off like a pouty 12 year old
One Fan
That is funny coming from chesteraarthur the troll known for his comical trolling posts
michaelw
TBH I think KB will be signed no matter the money. Rizzo will be older n really think he’s more of a Chicago guy for life not the money. Russell probably be traded by then. Lester, Zobrist n Heyward contracts will be over.
A lot can change by then. You play for today not 5 years from now.
carlos15
They’ll be regretting this deal by the all star break.
michaelw
Carlos15. – Yawn – so will the Brewers and Cards. By that time they be fighting for a WC spot. Lol
ChiSoxCity
I don’t understand your logic. Darvish is a depth acquisition, not a staff ace candidate for tge Cubs. I don’t see how they’ll “regret” adding depth that almost no other team in the league has.
One Fan
Exactly ChiSoxCity. He is not an ace nor is he being paid like an ace
One Fan
By the All Star Break … wow that would be pretty quick. Lets see how that prediction works out for you
Pablo
I think at this point the market is so low signing Cobb, Arrieta or Lynn is too much money. The value of the picks tied to them is now overweight compared to their cost/value. A team could draft a midrotation starter for the pick and not spend what they ask.
Darvish just showed what the market is at, and those players aren’t worth their draft pick. Teams that need to push themselves into WS contention don’t need a number 3/4. They need an ace.
Regi Green
Darvish’s deal might be a year or 2 too long,but he could pitch good enough in those last 2 years for it to be worth what he can give them in the first 4.
pd14athletics
Cotton? Can someone fill me in there, I do not subscribe to The Athletic but have not heard rumors of A’s trading Cotton before. Not thrilled to hear he’s name thrown out as I’m excited for his future, but I guess it all depends on return!
dynamite drop in monty
First
leftcoaster
Huge mistake by the Cubbies.
michaelw
Yawn @ left.
The haters will be out in full Force
One Fan
“Huge mistake” by the troll jealous his team could not land Darvish and mad the Cubs are a destination free agents want to come to
tuke17
How so?
rememberthecoop
Look, it’s a risk and it ultimately may bite them in the ass. But the Cubs are in their window of opportunity and they needed a good starter badly, so they did what they needed to do. As a Cubs fan, I’m happy even though we all know the issues of signing pitchers over 30 to long deals.
ASapsFables
I believe the Cubs will align their rotation as follows:
1-Lester (L)
2-Darvish (R)
3-Quintana (L)
4-Hendricks (R)
5-Chatwood (R)
Lester would get the opening day start based on his seniority with Darvish dropping to the #2 slot. The Cubs would likely prefer to separate their pitchers as indicated above.
If the Cubs opt for a 6-man rotation as some clubs seem intent on trying in 2018 they could utilize southpaw Mike Montgomery in the 5th spot and drop Chatwood to #6. This would give them a nice L-R-L-R-L-R rotation split.
The Cubs have employed a 6-man rotation in the latter portion of the past two regular season to help ease the innings toll on their starting pitcher as they headed to the playoffs. Having reached the NLCS in each of the last 3 seasons that included a full 7-game World Series victory in 2016, they were wise to implement the 6-man rotation to keep their pitchers fresher. Perhaps they will consider that option earlier rather than later in the coming season.
megaj
You can copy and paste this comment for later use if you want: BY THE END OF 2018, TYLER CHATWOOD WILL HAVE BECOME THE CUBS BEST PITCHER. It was easily the best move made all postseason by any team. His stuff is great, and now he is pitching in a better park with a better defense and pitching coach behind him.
iverbure
Please tell us how you define best.
iverbure
This didn’t age well
dbec72
It is risky, but so are the others and lower upside. Maybe the others will figure out their market is not close to what they are asking. Jake at 5yr 90mil, Lynn 4yr 65mil and Cobb 4yr 55mil seems about right.
michaelw
You had to know trolls and haters would be out tonight. Bottom line is it gives the Cubs a great 5 man rotation and 6 if they really want.
If another team signed YU their fans would be happy. If they say different they are full of $@ hit. Trolls n haters will be haters.
Funny the Brewer fans had the division won. Got news for you they weren’t even favoured by the experts in MLB after the trade n signing. Cain please over Pay yep point that direction.
Stratton, Yelich, Ozuna, Gordon together could win for Miami and they were under 500 you think one guy will bring them to the promise land. Either your stupid or just in denial. I admire the spirit even if it’s in outer space
21 a year is a steal. You guys want to talk about over Pay. What’s Zack G making at 35, 36 ummm 37, 38 ??? Come on don’t be afraid you can say it. 34.5 million at 36 – 37. Lol 38. Over Pay yeah go troll their. How’s Prices 217 million doing since he signed? lol What’s Zimmerman, Cueto and the Shark making. What was their era? W-L record War? Please haters grow up and get a life. Being haters n trolls on MLB board no way to go through life. There’s better entertainment.
Can’t wait till JA signs a 5-135 million dollar deal or 6 year 130 deal. Maybe even more. That be a great signing right. I’ll be watching the boards to post reminders. When he signs where ever he signs I remind you all at the end of 2018 and compare stats. No excuses now. But be ready for your name to be called. I rest my case.
michaelw
Twins offered more money and he turned it down. Sad.
michaelw
Because the contract is so low the Cubs still have 14 million to blow this year. Scary ain’t it. Lol
ChiSoxCity
Wrong, read the article again.
Daniel Youngblood
If the Rangers are going to play the “not close enough to contention to sign a real starter” card, they need to trade Beltre, Hamels and Choo and better position themselves for when they are.
Unexpected teams compete for the wild card every damn season, and that front office is throwing in the towel before the season even starts with that rotation they’ve built.
Ezra77
Well they just kind of messed up what the brewers were trying to do
axisofhonor25
All in all there isnt a lot of risk unless he chooses to not opt-out and gets injured down the stretch but this is still a great signing for the Cubs. This rotation for the cubs is going to be arguably one of the best in the majors in 2018. Yeah he had TJ but TJ surgery has been mastered to the point where someone can come back and pitch like nothing changed or with minor adjustments. Arrieta was declining and they went out and got their guy. The opt-out is good for Darvish if he wants to leave, but if wants to win a championship, he could more then likely stay with the Cubs since they will be perennial contenders.
Another thing, Darvish could have his best years in Chicago, he’s got Contreras that he’s throwing to who is a really good pitch framer and can throw outs runners. The infield defense is fantastic giving him great groundouts. The only liability is Schwarber in the outfield, but otherwise heyward was great in UZR last season and will rob some outs too especially since Darvish’s flyout rate is close to 40% career. With the better pitch framing and the he defense, he can really rack up wins and strikeouts.
Great all around signing by Cubs. Twins missed out.
chesteraarthur
Contreras is actually a bad pitch framer.
axisofhonor25
Not as bad as Montero.
axisofhonor25
Actually I stand corrected. Montero was pretty decent in 2016 but Contreras was grades -17. Thanks for the correction
AndThisGameBelongsToMySanDiegoPadres
People who think opt outs are team friendly don’t seem to understand that if the player is playing at a level where you prefer it if he opts out, he’s not opting out. Take a look at the players who had opt outs and DID utilize them. The first one that comes to mind is Zack Greinke. Don’t you think the Dodgers would have preferred him to not opt out? How about Justin Upton? Don’t you think the Angels would have preferred to not be forced to tack on an extra year to keep him? I rest my case.
iverbure
People who don’t think players opting out don’t realize in order to opt out that player had to pretty much have a great year and in which case you got surplus value from in a season in which you were contending which is even more valuable. Team can re-evaluate whether or not that player will sustain his success going forward or see if they have depth in the minors.
I’ll take a great season and have the guy opt out of long term money every single time whoever it is if he’s 32, don’t care who he is. I want the guy to perform at a high level in years in which I’ma contender. We win and he has a great season and opts out great. If I’m the GM and doing my job well I’ll have a starter at AAA who is league average ready to take his spot next year and I’ll take his money and re invest it in younger players, this is how good GMs stay competitive not by handing out long term deals and hoping a SP somehow he bucks the age curve and is great into his age 36 and 37 yr old seasons.
OntariGro
No dude, a pitcher confidenr/comfortable with opting out and leaving 4 years, $84 million on the Cubs table to become a free agent before his age 33 season, would have to be pitching like an ace’s ace, and sustainably, like a Maddux or Johnson 30s. There’s no reason to risk it otherwise. There’s no 33 year old handing back those years/dollars with his fingers crossed like “here’s hopin'” He’s going to go get paid for many years and pitch like a beast for someone else.
And as the GM “doing [your] job” you’re bringing up a rookie to take the rotation spot next season who will PROJECT at league average. You’ll have to keep those fingers crossed on that. That’ll leave you with about $19-$20 million off the books. Ownership will decide how much of that will actually make it back to your budget for the season.. A lot of it would probably go to raises/arbitration., maybe a utility/bench/fringe-y guy with “personality issues..”
Congrats! You’re a magician.. You’ve transformed our “Ace” and contender-status into a “soft rebuild.!” Bad GM! Bad!
There’s a reason teams don’t just offer opt=outs unbidden. 100% benefits the player, and agents looooooove ’em.
AndThisGameBelongsToMySanDiegoPadres
Look Einstein, the player could have had a good season even if he didn’t have the opt out. And if they didn’t think he could sustain the success going forward they would be able to trade him without eating salary and probably get back a prospect.
I’ll take a great season and not having the guy opt out of long-term money (below market value) or me being able to trade him over him opting out any day of the week. Losing a player who you have signed below market value for no return is never good for the team. Opt outs eliminate all the upside for the team and none of the downside.
We win and he has a great season and stays with the team is better than him opting out.
Anyway, as OntariGro pointed out, Darvish isn’t going to opt out unless he is pitching at a level well above what is left on his contract and if that is the case, you are going to be wishing he didn’t opt out.
reflect
When you consider the value of the no trade clause and opt out, it’s basically right in line with what MLBTR predicted.
One Fan
So explain your position and state the magical value or extra money its costing the Cubs. So that would be around $45m in magical value the Cubs are paying
kgreene3
Brewers are in it to drive up the price, I love it.
Z-A 2
Isn’t Arrieta better than Darvish, and healthier?
classicmixup
No. There is something wrong with Arrieta. There is a reason his velocity continues to come down and the Cubs know it
sandman12
The Darvish contract is the newest albatross. Years of regret ahead for the Cubbies.
all in ad
Darvish didn’t deliver for Dodgers when pressure was on in the playoffs. Look at those stats. Pitchers work every 5 days….no way they deserve these huge contracts/guaranteed $. I won my fantasy league with all relievers. Got kicked out of the league and they changed the rules….minimum innings….some small market GM take note. Starters only pitching 5 innings/100 pitches anyway. I would spend on everyday position players.
classicmixup
Fantasy is different that is why they call it fantasy
One Fan
@all in ad
Nobody gives a crap about you and your fantasy league baseball team (and your were not kicked out liar).
Dad
He won’t be a number 5 starter in that band box that is Wrigley Field .
classicmixup
What a profound statement!
One Fan
Only novices think Wrigley is a band box
Bryzzo2016
Exactly, check the facts. The wind blows in a lot more than it blows out. It plays much more as a pitchers park overall.
tigerdoc616
Not sure a good idea for Darvish to opt out after 2019. He’ll be 33 then. Getting 6 years at $21M per at 31 years of age was a good deal for him. But after that 2019 season, unless something changes, you might just have Mad Bum, King Felix and Chris Sale on the open market, along with Rick Porcello, Michael Pineda, Gerritt Cole, and Sonny Grey. Not thinking Yu, even if pitching well, is going to want to try to get another deal in that market.
DodgerBlueSince82
Before his signing with the cubs, sources reported that Darvish preferred to resign with the Dodgers even for a little less $ than he was being offered elsewhere. Reports also insinuated that his reasoning for the contract delay was in large part due to his desire to make up for his disastrous WS starts, and do his part to help the team make another run at bringing a World Series Championship to Los Angeles. Because the Dodgers weren’t willing to offer quite as much as the cubs without going way over the luxury tax, or just needing too much time to try and trade Kemp’s contract and clear the money, he subsequently signed with the cubs. If the reports of his delayed decision making process are true though, I have gained a lot of respect for him as a competitor and as a person. If that info isn’t true, forget the respect comment. Lol.
However this deal went down, I’m so tired of the Dodger Fans who have continued to put all the blame on Darvish for his disastrous WS starts. If the astros were able to figure out he was tipping pitches in games 3 and 7, how is it that no one on the Dodgers staff or any of the players noticed? Attempting to gain a competitive advantage by stealing signs or pitcher’s tendencies have been part of the game for a long time. It’s everyone’s responsibility to make sure these things aren’t happening during games, even more so in the playoffs and WS!
Any Dodgers Fan who didn’t want Darvish back for 2018 because of the WS doesn’t understand baseball. Having a deep/quality starting rotation is paramount for a team’s success over a 162 game season and into the playoffs. Darvish would be no less than a #2 in 90% of the leagues starting rotations. Whether slotted as a 2 or 3, he would have been a valuable addition to the Dodgers.