It seems the Yankees and Pirates have lost momentum toward a prospective deal involving righty Gerrit Cole. Per Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic, via Twitter, talks have “cooled” since the Winter Meetings wrapped up. While Cole’s talent would be a welcome addition to just about any big league rotation, the Bucs are reported to have a lofty asking price on the former No. 1 overall pick, and the Yankees don’t necessarily need to feel urgency to finalize a deal. New York has already agreed to bring CC Sabathia back on a one-year pact, and he’ll join Luis Severino, Sonny Gray, Masahiro Tanaka and Jordan Montgomery in a mix of quality rotation options (with prospects Justus Sheffield and Chance Adams looming in the upper minors).
A few notes out of the Bronx…
- Rosenthal also writes in a notes column (subscription required/recommended) that despite that group of starting options, the Yankees have some interest in free-agent righty Yu Darvish. A serious pursuit could require shedding some other salaries, as the Yankees have a known preference to dip under the luxury tax threshold and surely would like to enter the season with some degree of leeway in that regard, should the need for in-season additions on the trade market arise.
- While Darvish may seem a curious fit given that quality group of options, George A. King III of the New York Post also hears that the Yanks do have some degree of interest. New York is monitoring the Darvish market to see if his price comes down at all, per King, who adds that the Yankees do still want to add another starter even with the aforementioned arms in tow. Even if Darvish’s price drops to a lower level than expected, the Yankees would likely still need to move Jacoby Ellsbury’s salary (or a significant portion of it) in order to work him into the mix and remain under the tax barrier.
- Jacoby Ellsbury “might consider” waiving his no-trade clause for a few teams, reports Jon Heyman of FanRag Sports, who suggests the Giants as a possibility in that regard. That’s probably music to the ears of many Yankees fans, though it’s worth noting that there’s no indication that the Giants would want any part of Ellsbury’s enormous contract. San Francisco has a need for a center fielder, but the Giants have their own luxury tax concerns. Even if the Yankees are willing to absorb a significant amount of the remaining $68MM+ that Ellsbury is owed, there’s no indication that the Giants view him as an upgrade. San Francisco could, for instance, simply sign a player in the Jarrod Dyson mold to a considerably shorter-term deal, knowing that he’d be a vastly superior defensive option with lesser financial risk.
Nobody wants Ellsbury, he hasn’t produced anything in years.
yeah but he can still give you a .280 season with above average defense with about 25 steals.
I’d rather have Jarrod Dyson.
He hasn’t hit .280 for the yanks in the past four years. What makes you think he’ll do it now?
As a Boston fan, I loved it when the Yankees overpaid for him! I knew his productivity would decline with age
Whoa! Have you shared this knowledge of productivity and age with anyone else? That’s quite the new-school approach.
How’d Pablo Sandoval work out for you? Also Hanley Ramirez?
How did that second ARod contract work out? the last Jeter contarct? Jacoby?
The panda man failed and you gave millions lol
uh the second arod contract got the yanks a ws so i would say fine and jeter is jeter
I really think that both party’s have been snickered by unproductive atheletes… maybe the whole player paid process sucks
And I would add that Jeter’s “Retirement Tour” sold more seats so you can’t judge that solely on the stats.
Well the last Jeter contract got us both Jeter and Stanton so I’d say it worked out pretty pretty good
Remember when Sox fans use to claim NoooMaaaa was better than Jeter? How did that work out for them?
Rusney Castillo & Allan Craig.. RIP…
why are we even talking about nomar? thats a useless point to bring up.
im a red sox fan, but both teams have gotten burnt by bad contracts. thats why the yankees are trying to get under the tax & thats why we see the sox taking a more conservative approach this offseason.
u guys just wanna find reasons to argue lol
Wow have you heard of sarcasm?
Butt-hurt much?
Jeter was worth every penny moron! And aroid as much as I don’t like him still help does win the World Series! Red Sox will fail mightily this season can’t wait to see that
Well A-Rod was key in us winning the WS in 2009 and Jeter was good until his final season.
Hey Peter. We’re going to love beating Price up again this season. His contract will make all free agent signings in the past 10 years seem productive.
And the best part for this over the hill, over price pitcher is that he has such a nice temperament as he has adjusted so well to the sweet Boston fans and press
Isn’t it great how the Red Sox organization has learned to cheat in diverse ways?
Like vanishing Rusney and Allan to Pawtucket Prison so that they can get around the salary cap…
And how did you like Dustin’s cameo role in the holiday commercial for the Apple Watch? I loved his line, “some people are stressed to beat the clock with Apple Watch. Our team wears ours proudly to beat the other team by stealing signals”.
Giants fans, don’t listen to Red Sox fans. He was “feared” when he played for the Saxx. He’s healthier and ready to play at 2.5+ WAR.
He’s barely a .260 hitter now and his SB are nearly non existent.
NO that’s not accurate. as you need to check your facts….he’s a .260-.265 hitter and hasn’t had under 20 steals over the past 4 years.
While I agree his days of considering him elite are past, I don’t think its fair to consider him trash……keeping him on the field, you’ll get better than average defense, he can and will steal (the Yankees don’t run much), and he can get hot as far as power hitting the gaps well.
His salary is another question, but sooo many players are being paid well above what they actually perform at, you can’t say the he’s grossly overpaid….just a tough fit for clubs up against the luxury tax limit.
Dude, nobody wants him. Not at that contract, not at that age, not with those imploding numbers.
In one of the greatest hitters’ parks for lefties, Ellsbury has a .716 OPS in his 4 year Yankees career, is bad defensively, and is owed $68.4M over the next 3 years, his age 34-36 seasons. He is grossly overpaid.
Ellsbury’s contract is the definition of an albatross contract. That’s why I would package him and say Betances to San Francisco or LA plus maybe 30 mil for a catching and 3rd base prospect.
Ellsbury had a 1.6 WAR last year with only 400 abs, he could start for half the teams in the league. A one WAR player is worth 8 million a year, so I do think he will get traded. The Giants are a good fit, they were near last in the league in Cf and RF last year He is an above average hitter at .260
.260-.265 (more like .260 to .262) …. is barely a .260 hitter.
for a guy who’s game is his legs 20, 21, and 22 steals are unacceptable.
he is trash. He should be put into a giant hefty bag and sent to Staten Island because that is the only Yankees franchise he’s good enough to play for.
Stop with the Ells to LA. It’s not going to happen. The dodgers have absolutely no reason to block either Verdugo or Diaz. Even in a swap for Kemp it makes no sense. A sunk cost is a sunk cost.
I don’t think anyone expects him to be traded WITHOUT tons of money being sent along with him.
a) Yanks should eat enough to make Ells a $7 mil per player. I think that’s his market value.. He CAN still be a useful player on a contending team.
b) The Yanks should NOT add Betances of any meaningful prospect to facilitate a Ellsburydeal being done. They SHOULD consider trading a fringy guy who is blocked and at risk of being exposed in next years draft. A guy like Brian Mitchel who went to the Padres with Headley is a perfect example of the kind of prospect they can afford to lose.
With that estimation he’s a $12.8m player. While I agree with your assessment in that he’s not a total piece of dead weight, as say Edinson Volquez is, the Yankees would need to pay down the contract to nearly half, and even then could only anticipate a marginal return. Especially seeing as how they lack leverage in some respects based on the crowded oufield and an obvious desire to move on
Headley has 1 year left and was actually overall productive for the yankees last year.
If bryan Mitchell is worth a 1 year league average cost for a league average productive player then itll take 3x bryan mitchell worth to get rid of ellsbury at league average cost who is clearly not a league average player for the next 3 years.
1.0 WAR being worth $8 million is a misconception. In 2017, 1.0 WAR cost $4.4 million. You get that by taking total salary paid and dividing it by total WAR achieved.
Fangraphs theorizes that 1.0 WAR will cost $8 million on the free agent market, That’s a cost, not what something is worth, since a lot of players produce WAR cheaply. Alonso got $4 million per WAR. Carlos Santana got $5.9 million. So 1.0 WAR is even cheaper on the free agent market.
@slider32 “The Giants are a good fit,…”
Keep telling yourselves that Yankee fans. I guess that’s the only way to keep the fantasy of trading Ellsbury alive. But, it’s not a good fit, and the Giants FO is a lot stupider than I thought if they acquire him.
They just got rid of Span because he’s bad defensively, why would they take on another bad defender saddled with a 3 year commitment? Ellsbury had a -3 DRS, and a -8 UZR/150 in CF in 2017. Jarrod Dyson is a much better option, but barring that, internal options of Steven Duggar or Austin Slater, are far preferable to Ellsbury.
Why do you have to bring logic and stats into the conversation?
What? No way betances is included are you crazy? Gerardi screwed him up and hopefully BOone will Fix him. They are already willing to pay half of his salary that should be plenty. It was a dumb contract to begin with
Girardi didn’t treat Betances well either!
Above average defense? He was worth -3 defensive runs last year. If that is average… JD Martinez’s -5 DRS gives him above average defense.
Jd is overrated also. Watch baseball once in a while before you comment please! He’s going to be overpaid just like everybody else
JD is such a nice person that he will be cut up by the friendly Fenway fans.
Who wants to add to this post the list of players who were DOA when they became Red Sox?
If this were true, he wouldnt have already been moved. No ones taking this unless elite prospects are attached.
When he’s not injured. And he’s always on the DL
Same thing with Longoria but they traded for him!
Longoria has averaged 143.5 games a season for his career.
Ellsbury hitting .280? Hahaha
Ellsbury had a 1.6 WAR last year with only 400 abs, he could start for half the teams in the league. A one WAR player is worth 8 million a year, so I do think he will get traded. The Giants are a good fit, they were near last in the league in Cf and RF last year
Someone would take him for cheap, get real. This notion that none of the other 29 teams wants him is really annoying. If the Yankees were to cut him, making Ells a free agent, many teams would be interested. The problem is he’s owed too much, that’s what teams don’t want. The Yankees will eat probably $50 MM + to facilitate a deal.
exactly he is still a major Leaguer but closer to a 5 million a year player than a 20 milion a year player
I’ve proposed three years of Jacoby Ellsbury at $68.5 million to Arizona for three years of misfielder Yasmani Tomas at $46 million. The Yankees clear space under the luxury tax threshold, especially with Tomas’ even lower AAV. The Yankees could waive Tomas or deploy him DH against left-handers, sending Aaron Judge or Giancarlo Stanton to the outfield to replace Brett Gardner, who this year had sever platoon splits. Ellsbury, who might waive his no-trade clause to go to Arizona, would provide a modest upgrade in a decent Diamondback outfield with A.J. Pollock and David Peralta.
I don’t see an extra $22 million over the same time span being worth a “modest upgrade”. Tomas is younger and cheaper, and while the Diamondbacks might want to shed his salary or give him a fresh start elsewhere, they’re not going to take on the $22 million difference to do so. The Yankees offering to cover the difference between Ellsbury’s and Tomas’ contract doesn’t do anything for the value either as Tomas is still the higher upside player.
Steamer600, which assumes 600 plate appearances for each hitter, projects 2018 WAR of 0.8 for Jacoby Ellsbury and a negative 0.1 for Yasmany Tomas. The 0.9 difference in projected WAR justifies the added $7.5 million in annual salary. The Diamondbacks can’t afford Tomas’ glove at any position in the field.
No doubt speaking of oft injured pollock leads the way in that category
That’s not true, he has 2 kids…. lol
But Cashman “Stole” him from the Red Sox. Another brilliant move!!
If I’m Cashman and I get to the end of spring training and Ellsbury is still on the roster I demote him. Ellsbury has the right to refuse the demotion. If he does he loses his guaranteed salary. If he accepts the demotion then the Yankees are still in a better position. They’ll have to pay his salary anyway but then he isn’t dead weight on the major league roster.
I don’t buy the Darvish rumors unless his price goes WAY WAY down and they find themselves with around 10M less salary (from an ellsbury dump).
The Giants aren’t going to sniff Ellsbury unless every one of their other options don’t pan out and Ellsbury is south of 8M / year.
It seems they went out of their way to make a path for Torres and Andujar to have a shot at the club in 2018 with Torres most likely. I see him at 2B. I think what they really want to do is bring Frazier back to cover 3B while they ease Andujar in and provide backup to Bird at 1B. If he wants to be super utility guy in the middle all the better.
It seems like they want to go to a six man rotation since the numbers show most of their rotation is stronger with an extra days rest. Especially Tanaka and CC.
Tenured players that refuse assignment don’t lose their salary. There’s no way the MLBPA would agree to that and if it was true all teams would use it to get rid of burdensome contracts. If Ellsbury refused a demotion the Yankees could DFA him but the team is still responsible for his salary. If he gets picked up by another team after clearing waivers the Yankees are responsible for all of his salary EXCEPT the pro-rated MLB minimum.
nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/5-options-…
That specifically says if he refuses assignment And elects to become a FA
I love how people read one article and become an expert with that one article as their only citation.
Tim McCollum did say if he refuses assignment and he elects FA. Tim McCollum did also say that it would be better even if he elects to stay with the Yanks and accepts the demotion, it may be better for the team if he does. Can fill his roster spot with a younger, more productive player. That said, most teams will not do that as it can be bad PR for fans, admitting you badly overpaid and made a huge mistakes. Also bad PR for other players you want to come as a FA. Who would want to come sign with a team that is willing to potentially embarrass you by demoting you mid contract? That is why most MLB teams will not do that. Also, yoyo137, have read the same thing about demoting players would cause them to lose the guaranteed money if they chose to decline the assignment in many other publications. It is not just a one article thing.
I doubt there would be bad PR as it’s obvious to just about anyone it was a bad overpay and a mistake.
that said the point of the effect on potential future signings is very likely the reason they wont have the cojones to do it.
Thanks head of the Tim McCollum fan club.
Well we’re certainly glad your not Cashman!
NYY will find someone to take him if they eat enough money, but his NTC will hold up a potential deal.
I’ve read twice now that he may be softening on that. He apparently is starting to see the writing on the wall. He’s gotta know he has no future here.
Ellsbury is just one very bad contract. They will eat 3/4 of the contract to get somebody to take him. Not sure why they keep placing him in these trade rumors when everyone knows he is not wanted by any team.
I’m sure a team would take a flier on him at the right …. very low … cost. Ells is perfectly within his rights to refuse a starting gig on a rebuilding team vs hoping for an opening on the Yankees.
Same thing was said about Headley, Kemp (SD trade), and many other players. Some team will take him if the price is right or if they’re getting another player in return.
Those players did not have a NTC either. That’s the bigger hurdle. Eating money is not the issue.
Kemp had a NTC. A lot of
Players do, but they typically waive them when they realize or are told that they’re not wanted anymore.
Exactly, the idea that NO TEAM wants him is so annoying. Even Vernon Wells got traded. Every one is tradable
He has nearly $70 million worth of future in the Bronx.
I’d drive across I-80 and take Ellsbury from NY to San Fran by myself.
As long as the Yankees give you a suitcase containing the rest of his salary to take with you, then perhaps you’ll get an acknowledgement when you pull up to 4th and King.
Far better for the Giants to sign Dyson to a short term deal and do everything in their power to get Steven Duggar ready for the majors in 2019, if he doesn’t break through this season.
I call shotgun
Don’t ever second guess Ninja Cash
Darvish is coming to the White Sox
Why? why would anyone want to go there? They’re terrible.
The White Sox are an up and coming team with a top 3 farm system. A guy like Darvish could make the Sox good enough to contend for the division next year. That said, the White Sox should stick to the plan of building up their farm system for a few more years before positioning themselves to contend with big time FAs.
Lol, the White Sox are a bit more than Yu Darvish away from the Indians
I needed a good laugh, the white sox contending next year, that’s pretty funny
Chicago White Sox 2018 World Champions…….
Enjoy the ride
No….Jesus couldn’t help the Sox contend next year. The entire pitching staff is a wreck. You have too many holes to fill. You can have a top 3 FARM but how many of those guys will make an impact at the mlb level in the next 2 years? Why would Darvish want to endure that?
As a fan, I’m excited for the White Sox future and finally having a team that could be fun to watch, but I hate when White Sox fans post comments like this. Let’s wait and see how the young guns grow before saying things like this. The Sox could turn into the Astros or they could become the Reds who are continually in a rebuild. This team will not contend next year for anything except maybe a top 5 pick in the draft. A lot of the prospects are still a year or two away from even making an impact on the big league club.
The same reason why a free agent would go to Atlanta…obviously not to win right away.
Ellsbury isn’t as good as was Span at this point of his career, yet the Giants just made the Rays take on his cheaper 11m for 2018.
Even if SF wanted/needed another CF, wouldn’t they have just kept the better Span? Ells can’t throw and pardon me.. But he never, ever took good routes toward balls in his career as a CF. crisp before him in Boston was a better glove guy. How ells ever got that GG was one of those freebie things.
$11 mil is about half of what Ellsbury makes, and the Yankees are obviously going to pay more than half of Ellsbury’s contract.
If Ellsbury was a FA, he’d probably get 2 year/$15 mil.
Oh and Span is worse defensively than Ellsbury, though of course Ellsbury has the worse arm.
Good lord, Span’s arm is like a noodle. And Ells is worse???
Span was one of the absolute worst players in MLB this last year btw.
no he wasn’t, not even close.
It’s all perception and how much a guy is getting as compared to performance amongst the local fan base. media doesn’t help either.
Wow, comparing Span and Ellsbury….both on the back sides of their career with their best days behind them.
But again, the typical denigration of a player (Ellsbury) that dared leave Boston so now he’s a bum….just like Damon was, Clemons the traitor, and of course when you did’t get the AROD trade buttoned up, he was a bum also.
Can’t you just agree that he played some pretty good ball for the Sox when he was on the team and had a habit of running into walls trying to make the catch, that’s how hard he played?
He had 1 good year for the Yankees, but nobody can say he doesn’t come to play.
Didn’t take good routes to the ball????? Comparing his overall game to the overall game of Crisp is just a joke.
Watch Football please!
Oh please, Yankee fans (and most other team’s fans) do the same thing when their big-name players demand a trade or sign elsewhere. God forbid a player turned down the Yankees in free agency (Robinson Cano and Shohei Otani would be prime examples of players spurning NY and most of the casual fan base completely trashing them afterwards).
And when he compared Ellsbury to Crisp, he compared their defensive work. I’ve never watched Ellsbury or Crisp extensively to tell you who is better or worse defensively, but taking good routes to the ball is one of the most important things defensively. The faster players/guys with a good arm can get away with poor routes because they have a special tool that makes up for it. For example, a guy like Kyle Schwarber needs to take near-perfect routes to the ball because he doesn’t have the speed to make up for a misplay. The perfect example of this would be Yoenis Cespedes’ from-the-warning-track throw at the Angels stadium when he was with the Athletics. On that play, the route he took was actually a terrible route but he made up for it with his cannon of an arm. If Cespedes actually takes the correct route on that play, the highlight-reel throw never happens.
nonsense. Cano didn’t “turn down” the Yankees because they didn’t make him near the offer the Mariners didn’t. Many fans have wanted him back since he left including the guy in this thread who thought we should trade ellsbury to get him.
Ohtani didn’t spurn NY because he didn’t consider them long enough to turn them down.
Good point on routes taken and throwing arms that people will flat out miss and some of us look for, especially when attending miLB games that can see entire field on where televised games one can’t most of the time.
ells somehow got a reputation for being an above average defender, yet he would take round-about routes way to often on liners and fly balls, something a CF with a well below average arm just cannot do. Crisp? His arm was probably worse than was/is Ells, yet he was generally in throwing position when he got to a ball, or had caught it. rarely was he in poor throwing position and his reads/instincts were terrific. he was demoted to 4th OF because of ells simply because of the bat. the speed between them was close and crisp had the glove.
finding a CF who has terrific “off the bat” route ability.. Such as Kairmaier and JBJ is one of the rare things in the game, it’s like lousy armed outfielders early on must learn (or should have) to have better instincts/route ability than guys with superior arms to make up for their short coming, yet have noticed especially since the 80’s bad throwing CF have become more and more common in the game than they once were.
I don’t think Ellsbury even had one good year with the Yankees. And I always viewed that contract as a bad signing. We already had an Ells on our team…Gardner. And Gardner has performed better in all 4 years Ells has been on the team.
Terrible player on a terrible deal and a full no trade, how does Ellsbury keep coming up as a trade piece? Brett Gardner makes a lot more sense.
Gardner’s too valuable to the Yankees. He’s a clubhouse leader and he posted a 4.9 WAR in 2017
Why would the Yanks trade a 4 WAR player to play a 1 WAR player? Trading Gardner makes zero sense.
People might actually want Gardner, he’s in the last year of his deal, he’s getting old, and they’ve been trying to move him for 2 years prior. If they need to trade an OF and cut salary, he’s the guy.
They’ve only been trying to move Gardner because it is near impossible to move Ells. If Ells contract is off the books, Gardner stays until his contract is over, And probably will test the open market or get a max 2 year deal from the Yankees.
In the 2 years they’ve tried to move him he’s actually gotten better. He was a 3 plus WAR two seasons ago and a 4 plus WAR last season. The Yanks also have an option on him for next year so if he’s solid again, they may exercise that option.
Yankees should down some of ellsbury deal while including a prospect to help offset the cost. This will lower their luxury tax hit while giving the giants a prospect or two they desperately need. Just price the surplus value of the combo of ellsbury plus prospect plus salary relief to equal or better what signing Bruce would cost.
Except the prospects would be frazier and 2 of acevado, perez, abreu if youre looking to get rid of 70% or more of the contract.
If yankees dont want to deal away prospects theyll eat 80% to 90% of the money.
Oh please just stop. Ellsbury is terribly overpaid but in no world would the Yankees need to pay down 90% of his contract to deal him. He’s worth somewhere between 5-8 million per year at this point of his life. If the Yankees pay him down to that level someone will be interested in a guy who can still play Cf and table set.
I predict they will eventually cave in and pay his contract way down and dump him for a live body and about 6 million per year salary relief. If the team feels it has some spare parts to throw in like Estrada, McKinney or that type of guy we might get around 8-9 million per year in salary relief.
JJ, rework your math there buddy. The Yankees would have to eat 2/3 of the remaining.
Exactly!
Ellsbury 1/2 Contract+Betances+Romine, for a catcher prospect, That’s It.
The media needs to stop trying to make Elsbury to the Giants happen. They already have a bunch of old, bad outfielders.
Define a bunch. Hunter Pence is old, Gorkys Hernandez just turned 30. Everyone else is under 30.
I agree that Ellsbury makes zero sense for the Giants. More than anything, they need someone that can cover a lot of ground in CF. The infield defense looks to be pretty good, but the outfield defense is… not exactly exciting to put it mildly (especially if Shaw is in LF).
I’ll give you Frazier to take half ellsburys contract
No darvish cashman, NOOO !!!!!
Very glad to hear talks have cooled regarding Cole. Pirates were asking for too much. Signing Darvish is an interesting idea.
Cole is a bad idea. He has been mediocre the last 2 years
Trade him for 2 bats and a case of baseballs
The Yankees should send Frazier down to AAA instead of having him sit on the bench. Ellsbury as the 4th outfielder this year and when Gardner leaves then Frazier takes over for him and Ellsbury continues to be the 4th outfielder.
Ellsbury is just as good as any other backup outfielder that they can get. Better to just have him fill that role then pay to get rid of him and have to pay someone else to be the backup.
The problem is Frazier & Ells are currently the Yanks 5th and 6th outfielders. Not 4th and 5th. Anytime the Yanks play a NL team, both Judge & Stanton play the field. Plus anytime Sanchez is the DH, Judge and Stanton both probably play the field
Why don’t the Pirates eat 30 million of Ellsbury’s contract in a Gerrit Cole deal?
Yankees get Cole, Josh Harrison and a useful but not top end prospect like Clay Holmes Kevin Kramer or Stephen Alemais.
Pirates get Torres, Sheffield, Ellsbury and an A ball player with potential.
Yankees would have 2 years of Cole in the rotation, Harrison starts at second this year and can become a superutility bench piece for two more seasons if the Yankees upgrade before 2019 opening day and the prospect is basically just to even out the deal. Yankees also get to clear up their outfield logjam and effectively a 30 million down payment on Machado.
Pirates get a long term solution at shortstop in Torres, a solid lefty for the rotation with six years of control in Sheffield and a lottery ticket. Pirates should then trade Cutch and have Ellsbury start in left until Meadows is ready, then Ells becomes an overpriced fourth outfielder instead of the ridiculously expensive 5th outfielder he is currently.
lol
Those three letters are perfect for this post.
I was thinking more of rotflmao.
Got love love Yank fans spirit. They have the mind of one of snow whites dwarfs. Lol
Your comment is ridiculous on so many levels. You seriously think he would waive his NTC to be the 4th OF on the Pirates?
Maybe. Considering Polanco and Meadows have had issues staying healthy the last couple years he would at least play. I’d put the over/under on plate appearances as a Yankee behind Judge, Stanton, Gardner, Hicks and Frazier at 50 and take the under.
Joe that’s not even the start of it. But a good starting point
now THIS is funny stuff
Frazier instead of Torres.
Many financially solvent teams Overpay then regret it. Most recently the RSox did it with Crawford–got bailed out by the Dodgers. Next it was Sandoval got burned badly.
Ells was OK for the first 2 + years. If they want to see him go away—Pay him, you can afford it.
He has multiple skills–good fielder, 4 th outfielder, can steal bases, still has some power, especially in NY. He has similar batting skills to JBJ–I’m sure the Yanks would prefer JBJ at this point of their careers and salary demands.
Oddly enough, Ellsbury is a victim of narrow analytics that don’t favor his game and a contract placed in front of him by a desperate Yankees team 4 years ago.
It should be noted – Ells still could be a strong leadoff guy, something he’s not been used as since going to the Bronx. If he were, he could be a disruptive force at the top of many lineups. Ask the 2016 Jays how much their offense missed a disruptive leadoff man. Or the 2017 Cubs for that matter. Just because OPS favors home runs doesn’t mean leadoff skills should be discounted as they are. He’s not a middle of the order guy. He’s a leadoff guy, still a good defender, and he’s got a decent worth to a lot of teams.
Before his 2015 injury, I believe it was, Ellsbury was a force at the top of the line up with Gardner. The skills there. I think he’s lazy and fragile. Gets hurt then gives up. Change of scenery may help
Only lazy like Cano. Ells’ problem actually is Gardner. With a stacked lineup, Gardner is now indispensable. And on the right team, I think Ells could be just as valuable.
Cano has 20.4 WAR in the 4 seasons since he left the Yanks, while Ny starting second basemen have posted only 4.6 WAR since. And Yankee fans still have behind hurt.
On-Base Plus Slugging doesn’t favor one or the other. You can make up for a lack of power by getting on base more. Or vice versa. Or both. Or neither. But it doesn’t favor home runs.
Absolutely does. That’s an absurd statement. A home run in a single AB generates a OPS of 5.000. A player who draws a walk and steals Second has an OPS of 1.000. You don’t have to be the Unabomber to do the math on that.
Does catcher interference and a steal also get you a 1.000 OPS?
Happy to hear the Cole trade talks have cooled. He’s not worth the price the Pirates were asking. Unless lowered why bother selling the farm when there are 5 capable starters that brought the Yankees to the ALCS. You could even say they’re in a better position this year because Adams and Sheffield are closer to the majors. If Cashman really wants another SP, then take a flier on a guy for a 1 year deal or find a 4th/5th starter on a a team that someone trying to dump.
Darkish is an intriguing idea as long as it does clog up the payroll. Cashman has done a great job so far, no need to make any rash decisions.
And everyone needs to calm down with the cliche “No one wants Ellsbury” idea. He’s going to come cheap one way or another, whether the Yankees cut him, or eat salary. Probably have to eat at least $50 MM of what’s left, if not more. They’ll do it to save any money. He’ll waive his NTC for the right fit, say ARZ or SEA.
Darvish**
Another Yank fan. Want want but be a cheap @$$ like most are anyway.
Get something for nothing. Pay top dollar for our players but pay little fore everyone else’s. Typical NY. Lol
Better enjoy that staff. Hate to see you pay too much money for someone lol
Wow, it’s almost like baseball is a business, and teams want to maximize their potential without paying any more than they have to.
Ells would still get something like the Span contract as a FA. I say Ells, $13M AND Clint to SFO for Pence. Pence accepts his bench/dh role, yanks get some $ relief, Giants fill 2 spots.
Stop with Ellsbury to the Giants scenarios. It’s not going to happen. SF wants to improve the OF defense. CF is the most important defensive OF position. Ellsbury had a -3 DRS and a -8 UZR/150 in CF in 2017. Worst of all Ellsbury’s contract runs for 3 more years. Even with the NYYs paying half, SF does not want to take on a 3 year commitment to a bad defender, when they have better options, including internal ones. Pence is off the books next year, so swapping him for Ellsbury makes no sense for the Giants.
There need to be a contract swap with Seattle. Ellsbury for Cano!
move Gordon back to his natural position and give them a true CF in return
yeah ….. that’ll happen
Cano was actually useful for the mariners. 12% better than league average wRC+.
Steamer600, which assumes 600 plate appearances for each hitter, projects 2018 WAR of 3.0 for Robinson Cano and 0.8 for Jacoby Ellsbury.
The Seattle Mariners don’t need to downgrade,
Steamer600 would make more sense if Ellsbury didn’t produce 1.7 WAR in 409 plate appearances in 2017.
Another persons garbage could be another mans gold you never know
Then again like old wine maybe He get better as he gets older sitting in the Yanks wine cellar cause no ones going to buy that bottle or want it.
You’d think the giants would be all over ellsbury esp if they can squeeze some top tier prospects out of the deal for taking more of the financial obligation.
Yankees might include frazier, a pitching prospect or 2 if the giants take the contract outright.
All teams should be demanding frazier + for an ellsbury deal. Yankees only rebuttle is they keep ellsbury, which will put them in a mess come 2020 2021 when stanton opts in cause between him and ellsbury thats 50 mill plus arb for judge severino bird and what theyre paying chapman yankees will be in serious financial constraint those 2 years.
That is the only way you can shed a contract for a bad contract. See the Pirates and the Liriano Contract. They had to add Ramerez and McGuire in the deal to get Toronto to take the salary. Pirates fans, being the mindless lemmings that they can be, all parroted the Pittsburgh talking heads and cried about the deal from day 1. Hindsight shows that losing those 2 guys was not as bad as keeping Liriano and his horrible pitching.
There is ZERO chance the Yanks are adding Frazier or any other valued prospect just to move Ells contract. The Yanks greatest strength remains to be their financial ability. To forgo that advantage just to save some money would be something I can’t envision any team to do so.
Then there is ZERO chance the yankees are getting rid of most if not all the ellsbury contract.
Did you even read the article? “Even if Darvish’s price drops to a lower level than expected, the Yankees would likely still need to move Jacoby Ellsbury‘s salary (or a significant portion of it) in order to work him into the mix and remain under the tax barrier.”
Financial ability? The fact they have to move his contract to pursue top tier guys at reduced prices says they have 0 financial ability available.
AND
Each year judge, severino, bird and the rest get more expensive on top of paying chapman 15 mill a year till 2021.
Yank fans can’t Handel the truth that’s why someone disliked your comment. But they can dance around with all their great trade ideas they want. Your 100% right.
Yep there is zero chance anyone taking on that bad contract so have fun with him and paying that. Lol
A preference to dip under the luxury tax level. Heh.
The Yankees are under the threshold right now WITH ellsbury. Send him to the minors. Let him play in Scranton-Wilksbury for a season. then next offseason he’ll be a lot more amenable to be traded. And cheaper too with Only 42m owed.
Let the pirates and the giants be the last place teams they are and keep our prospects. Then they too will be more reasonable in trade discussions
1. Reds were last place not the pirates.
2. Uh, Ellsbury isnt going to help them much to climb the standings.
3. Giants can sign dyson and get more production or cain and get way more production and the pirates are getting back polanco or marte who missed time last year due to PED I think.
So, soon as the giants sign dyson or cain yankees will be stuck with ellsbury
Because Ells has more than 5 yrs. MLB service time the Yanks can’t send him to the minors without his consent. He stays on the 25 man roster or they cut him and he gets all of his $$$$ which count towards the Lux Tax. If he signs with another team the Yanks only get back the min. This is why the Red Sox are still paying Panda 18MM (and will probably go over the Lux Tax in 2018) and the Giants get him for the min.
The difference between Panda and Craig/Castillo was that neither Craig or Castillo had 5 yrs so if they did not accept the AAA assignment they would have to give up the $$$. The Sox then removed them from the 40 man roster and their contracts did not count towards the Lux Tax.
Thanks for the clarification.
Best can hope for is shark for Ellsburry, mongomery + cash. To send the bum to giants!!
Wow. Ellsbury has made only one all-star team in his career, which came in the year that he should have beat out Verlander for the AL MVP. Would have thought he was sitting on 3-5 all-star appearances.
Ellsbury, Clint Frazier, Ronald Torryez.
For Joe Panik. Giants eat all salary from Ellsbury
And we have the $$ to land Darvish
Ellsbury and his entire contract, Frazier, and Acevado would get the yankees a prospect back. Frazier and Acevado make up for the giants taking on 68.5 mill
If the yankees want 3 years of joe panik itll cost a lot more then frazier and acevado.
So you are saying that Joe Panik is worth Frazier, Acevedo +? I don’t think so.
No im saying taking on 68.5 mill, frazier, acevado, and another prospect or 2 is worth giving up 3 years of your 2nd baseman who has elite bat control. the dude rarely k’s having posted 11.5, 9.7, 8.9, 9.4 k rates and posted similar rates for walks.
why would the giants give up a bat like that just to take on 68.5 mill, a top prospect, and a bad utility guy?
you saying frazier is worth 68.5 mill? LOL he isnt, not even close. Frazier, acevado are worth taking 68.5 mill with the yankees getting really no one back.
If they want panik it would be frazier acevado abreu and another lower guy with giants taking the 68.5 mill
Your a moron. How about Ellsbury, Torres, Fraser, Adams for Shark and Panic and 2 million and the Yanks pay all of Ellsbury and Panics salary. And Darvish is over rated like Grey n blows anyway. Get over yourself.
The last thing the Giants need on their roster is another position player in his mid 30s. Even if he was available at league minimum, SF would not be wise to plug him into CF. They need a guy in his mid-20s with fresh legs, speed, and an above average arm to patrol that Grand Canyon in CF. Ellsbury would inevitably injure himself running down balls to the gap and deep center.
Ellsbury, Frazier & Betances for Shark & Krick who says no and why
I say no because even in a Ellsbury – Shark trade one for one just forget the others for a min the Yanks would add more money not subtract it. People forget the 90 million dollar deal he just signed with SF
Shark didn’t “just sign” He signed a 5 year deal 2 years ago.
I know that they still wouldn’t shed a lot of money. It would also take some top prospects for SF to even talk on the phone.
Problem with Yank fans they think out their @$$ not their head. They want want want but want to send garbage in trades. Their players are the best other teams are over rated. Get over yourself. You won’t find no $ uckers this time get over it and stop
pipe dreaming. Funny when they want a player he’s the best thing since Jesus walked the earth. When they go else where he’s over rated n garbage. The Yankee fan way. Get over it.
Wow, butthurt much?
are you saying he’s wrong? i saw multiple comments from yankee fans among other saying ohtani was a bust and was most likely going to get hurt when he signed with the angels.
Does everybody forget that the Yankees currently have 6 outfielders on the roster? They only talk about Judge, Gardy, Stanton, Ellsbury, Frazier, but what about Aaron Hicks?
Hicks is their starting CF.
Forget about a trade to the Giants. SF doesn’t want him. Arizona is gonna need a new CF after this season as Pollock is a FA. Ellsbury plus a prospect and money for Descalso and Corbin. Both are free agents after this season so Yanks give another season for prospects to develop. Also gives them certainty in the infield with another veteran.
Ellsbury isnt worth his contract but he is still a serviceable CF. If Yankees eat enough of his contract they’ll be able to find suitors willing to trade maybe a low level prospect for Ellsbury and cash.
Its all up to Ellsbury at the end of the day, but hes not going to start in CF.
He’s marginally serviceable at best. But no one wants a below average hitter, a below average defender, especially in CF who comes with a 3 year commitment. There are just so many better options for teams looking for a CF.
Why not sign Ben Revere for CF? He was only at $4M last year and is athletic and can SB so he can hold the leadoff spot on our roster. Than offer Jay Bruce $11M @ 4 Years and see if he will bite on longer term but less $. He said he wants to play by the bay and he would provide corner OF power.
Lineup would like something like this:
1. Revere CF
2. Panik 2B
3. Longoria 3B
4. Bruce LF
5. Posey C
6. Crawford SS
7. Belt 1B
8. Pence LF
9. Pitcher
2019 yankees lineup
2018 American League All-Star Lido
Just above this on google, was Jay Bruce saying, thru his agent, he’d LOVE to play for San Francisco.
BOBBY!
ALL I WANT FOR XMAS IS A POWER HITTING OUTFIELDER!!!!
ellsbury for another bloated contract, maybe pence?
How, in a world of Matt Kemp trades, can anyone honestly say that Ellsbury is untradeable??? Yes, clearly the Yanks eat money, but untradeable is simply a ridiculous statement that so many of you keep saying.