The Cardinals “float[ed]” a trade proposal for Sonny Gray before the Athletics shipped him to the Yankees, according to MLB Network’s Ken Rosenthal. In concept, at least, St. Louis would have considered sending young outfielder Stephen Piscotty to Oakland along with a promising starter (Luke Weaver or Jack Flaherty), though it seems talks never got going. Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch looks closer at the Cards’ lack of action on deadline day. Top baseball decisionmaker John Mozeliak acknowledged “a level of frustration” that nothing got done, though he also said the team wasn’t inclined to make deals just for the sake of action. Ultimately, momentum never built toward a deal for Lance Lynn, and the club’s other chatter never materialized into a trade. You’ll want to peruse the lengthy column for all the details.
Here are some more post-deadline links of note:
- The Dodgers’ acquisition of Yu Darvish came together quite late, as Jeff Passan of Yahoo Sports explains in fascinating detail. It became apparent the Dodgers wouldn’t get Zach Britton from the Orioles within a half hour of the deadline, but the team had already “abandoned hope” of landing Darvish. The Rangers, meanwhile, had run through their alternative trade partners for the ace righty and found none availing. The paths of the two organizations converged just twenty minutes before the deadline. You’ll certainly want to give the story a full read; Texas fans will also want to check out this piece from Evan Grant of the Dallas Morning News on the team’s unannounced but still-evident rebuilding path.
- In the end, there just wasn’t that much demand in the marketplace for Darvish, Rosenthal also notes — so much so that the Dodgers were nearly in position to land both Darvish from the Rangers and lefty Zach Britton from the Orioles. That said, there was “some overlap” between the prospects in both potential deals, and it obviously would’ve required a steep overall price to get both arms. Instead, Los Angeles added two different lefties, Tony Watson and Tony Cingrani.
- As regards Britton, Rosenthal had some stern words for how things played out. The Orioles spurned not only the Dodgers but likely also the Astros. For Baltimore, the deadline approach “was disturbingly short-sighted,” by Rosenthal’s reckoning. And when Houston wasn’t able to find another top-end arm, says Rosenthal, its body of deadline work became a “lost opportunity.” It does seem worth bearing in mind, particularly regarding the Astros, that the August trade period appears to be full of opportunities for making further moves if the need is there.
- Over in Toronto, the Blue Jays ended up holding onto righty Marco Estrada and then watched him turn in a strong outing last night. As Shi Davidi of Sportsnet.ca writes, Jays GM Ross Atkins suggested yesterday that the organization may yet see Estrada as a part of the team’s future — though his contract is up at year’s end and he perhaps remains a plausible August trade piece. With Estrada remaining in Toronto through the deadline, said Atkins, “we’ll start thinking about not only how he impacts us now, but how he can potentially impact us beyond 2017.”
- Be sure also to check out the trade deadline rundown from Sportsnet’s Ben Nicholson-Smith, who assesses some winners and losers from the day’s action. ESPN.com’s Buster Olney also issued deadline grades in an Insider piece.
- With the Braves holding on deadline day, MLB.com’s Mark Bowman takes stock of the months to come. Second baseman Brandon Phillips, reliever Jim Johnson, and starter R.A. Dickey could all be possible August trade chips, he notes, while the inclination of the organization remains to consider deals involving first baseman Matt Adams over the offseason. Meanwhile, Atlanta continues its long-standing pursuit of controllable pitching, though that’ll surely await the end of the current season.
NicknewsomeATL
Braves called up Sims 😀 this is the start of when our guys start getting chances to contribute in the majors. We’re gonna start being the Braves again. Sadly Sims has to start against the Dodgers
Perksy
What kind of starter does Sims project as?
SoCalBrave
his ceiling would be a #2 starter, but most likely he’ll be a #3 or #4.
zclee06
More like 4 or 5 really but he want even be a starter with the braves orginization
CompanyAssassin
Thanks for getting my hopes up after the fact Mo!!!!!!
cazick
It’s status quo for this FO. “See fans, see. We tried.” They are never willing to go past their comfort zone. I’ve read this book before. There are too many words to be said about this current organization to fit into this text box.
chief33
I completely agree with your viewpoint. My thought is, he called the team out saying everyone was accountable for their poor play, as well as they should be. But in my opinion, this also includes the front office.
Polymath
You never make a trade unless it improves the team — present or future. If none were available, then the status quo is the best option.
The Cards could use bullpen help, better defense, or a middle of the order bat. Starting pitching is their greatest strength. Gray would be nice for most teams, but shouldn’t have been a top priority for the Redbirds.
As Kenny Rogers once sang …
Bigbub75
Glad they didn’t get that trade. They did need to dump some players but Gray is not a great pickup. They should have traded some others for prospects.
jdgoat
If Estrada can manage to be even half the pitcher he’s been in his time in Toronto, I’d be thrilled to have him resigned. There’s only three pitchers slotted in the rotation next year, and even if he’s not Acestrada anymore, he’d still be a fine back of the rotation pitcher. He really only has had two bad months over the past three years.
jaysrule1399
Except for the fact that AL teams have learned to hit Estrada. You could argue that he was never an ‘ace’ type of pitcher. Solid three guy, fringe second starter.
jdgoat
I think it’s just more of a down year along with him being unlucky. His strikeouts are up this year, and he was still really good over the seasons first two months. June and July were awful, but I’m hoping it’s just a rough stretch and Jd can bounce back, either with us or someone else next year
philwauke
could someone explain the different trade deadlines?
thegreatcerealfamine
Theirs on article on the waiver wire on here.
alexgordonbeckham
Are the Rangers really rebuilding? Selling off expiring contracts to get something back doesn’t necessarily mean they are rebuilding.
socalblake
Would love to have heard the conversation between the Dodgers and O’s. If for nothing but entertainment.
orangeoctober 2
If I had to guess, the Orioles probably wanted one of Buehler or Alvarez to be involved and the Dodgers balked at that. I can see it from both sides. The Dodgers not wanting to give up their top top guys and the Orioles wanting to get a package in between what the Yankees got for Miller (I think had 2.5 years of control left) and Chapman (half year rental). Britton has 1.5 years of control left. Maybe the injury issues caused teams to offer less. If he stays healthy the rest of the season and looks like his old self, they can always re-visit in the off season.
hodor 3
O’s probably channeled their Just Another Fan innate spirit and Dodgers laughed, excused themselves and politely power-walked away.
Kylesamac
Listening to Astros owner Jim Crane in the broadcast booth yesterday suggested the Astros had a deal for Britton but Angelos squashed it.
orangeoctober
This wouldn’t shock me at all. Hopefully maybe someday things will get better when John Angelos eventually takes over. I’ve heard rumors that he has wanted to do things differently (especially as far as free agent spending) but is constantly overruled by his dad.
ironwolf811
Me neither. Angelos has been a meddling owner since he took over the team. I can remember when Davey Johnson was fired—after doing a great job in ’96 and ’97. Angelos made up some bogus excuse for firing him, saying he refused to tell his wife to stop doing her own charity work which conflicted with the O’s charities.
Both most of the papers said it was more of an ego thing. Angelos didn’t like that Davey thought for himself and didn’t back down from his own opinions.
All you have to do is look at how many GMs have come and gone since Angelos took over. He’s chased so many off, I’ve lost count.
jimmertee
Sounds like he runs the place by chaos, which is a valid mgmt strategy but I am not sure if it is appropriate in professional Baseball.
SimplyAmazin91
Piscotty plus Flaherty/Weaver may have beaten the Yankees offer.
TraderRyan9
Piscotty blows. Athletics should have just kept gray. They got screwed
stl_cards16 2
Piscotty has definitely struggled this year. But his peripheral stats don’t look too bad. With the off-field stuff he’s had to deal with this season, I think it’s not crazy to expect a bounce back.
wkkortas
If you compare what Sox got for Quintana with what A’s picked up for Gray, that’s a fair assessment. It’s long since past time to bury the Billy-Beane-is-the-smartest-guy-in-the-room myth.
arc89
Beane gambled on the A’s future. High risk high reward trade. Problem is more than half TJS pitcher either get hurt again or never much a factor. Flower is another high risk player. who could come back as a top prospect or come back as a 4th outfielder. Mateo can’t play defense so he better learn to play the OF or its a bust. In 2 years we will know who won the trade. Right now Cashman is far ahead of Beane on the trade. Beane better have a lucky rabbit foot.
jd396
Sometimes I think Beane thinks the whole point of the game is to grow players for other teams.
driftcat28 2
I think the A’s did well on what the received
TraderRyan9
Lol at the cardinals. That offer is garbage for a top, young, controllable starter. I would have laughed at hI’m and hung up
However the Yankees offer wasn’t anything either.
Athletics got screwed
thegreatcerealfamine
Post it again and maybe you’ll feel better.
thor would look better in red
for a starter who doesn’t have a good health record and he gets hurt again in two months and the A’s are stuck with nothing…
rycm131
I agree. The return was not good for Gray, but this was obviously the best deal out there and I think Billy B realizing the risk of Gray getting hurt and the A’s ending up with nothing (say he has TJ surgery) was to high to not take a trade
Of this sort. I hate most trades he makes and am an A’s fan. But being realistic if there was a better trade out there, he’d of made it and the fact that there wasn’t tells you what the market feels of the “risk” of Sonny Gray’s health. His talent if healthy is obviously great.
frontdeskmike
Sonny Gray equals Rich Harden.
pspahn
Maybe he’s Gio Gonzales though.
Chucky25
as an A’s fan,I think most GM’s wouldn’t give up there best prospects because they were scared of Gray getting hurt again,I think he’ll be fine,I’d be more worried about him pitching in the smaller stadium in the east than him getting hurt again,Yankees have deep bullpen,which will help Sonny
mattm-13
You’re an idiot. Piscotty is a good hitter whose had a terrible year because the whole lineup has. He’s young, cheap and talented if that offer was on the table it’s a great offer that smoked the accepted offer
STLCards33
I still think that’s better than what the Yankees offered. And I wouldn’t have been surprised at all if the cardinals thru in a fringe top 30 prospect but oh well
Josh_111
So apparently the O’s were just supposed to give away Britton for less than he is worth. It’s not their job to just give the Astros what they want for whatever they offer. The Astros should have offered an elite prospect, which they clearly didn’t. Britton will have even more value after he saves a few games and is signed through next season. If anything, Rosenthal is being shortsighted.
jkwdbu
Your GM thought he was getting a good deal from Luhnow. I’m sure the package was a strong haul.
jlahman
jlahman
dcrising
It’s probably more a sense that the O’s didn’t do more at the deadline, not just on Britton. The one significant move they made was to bring in a rental starting pitcher. Especially given that nearly their entire rotation will be FAs this off-season (Tillman, Jimenez, Miley, and now Hellickson), the move is surprising that they didn’t go after controllable arms.
MaverickDodger
Based on the pitchers mentioned performances this year . . . It’s good for the Os that they’re Free Agents. Gausman and Bundy are the building blocks for the rotation. Yes they need more and higher quality but that possibility is higher on the open market than in their farm system or through trades
tmengd 2
they had already agreed on prospects with Astros, exchanged medicals too, but ownership stepped in at last minute and vetoed it, if Jim Crane was talking about the Orioles
Kylesamac
This deadline was going to be the most you would get for Britton. Now the value decreases dramatically as he enters his walk year this offseason and next deadline. You will be lucky to get two prospects for him next go around.
Aril
i think the O’s can get a Chapman deal like the Dodgers offer before his DV
Corey vauman
the cardinals are all talk
thegreatcerealfamine
Yankee fans they practically stole Gray and none of the prospects they gave up will matter in the long run.
walls17
because you can see the future lol
thegreatcerealfamine
I was talking from the Yanks side since,Kap is injured and won’t be ready till 2019,When healthy Fowler is blocked,and Mateo is not ready and is blocked..so yea that’s seeing the future from the Yankees side smart guy.wtf
rycm131
I agree. They should have a spot
On the A’s, but not on the Yankees. Keep in mind the rumor that they’d go after Bryce Harper and with the money coming off the books they can go get stars while a team like the A’s can’t do that.
thegreatcerealfamine
I think theirs gonna be some decisions this Winter one on Castro,and they need someone at third. Do they wait till the winter of 2018 for Machado or go after Moose this year.
southbeachbully
They have a 3b named Andujar who they feel can play 3b. His bat seems about ready but they sent him back down to AAA to work on his defense. With Headley playing there it’s no rush to bring him up. Obviously, if Machado hits the market then they will pursue him but I think we’re ok with moving either Castro or Torres to 3b or Andujar winning the 3b job. Good problem to have tho.
Chucky25
I see Harper going to the Cubs,before the Yankees to play with Bryant
Kraycik
That’s a good description of Orioles ownership; “disturbingly short-sighted”
Triteon
In Mo’s defense, the last time he made a deal “just for the sake of action” he signed an aging, minus-defense CF — coming off a career season — to a 5-year contract. Sometimes no action is better.
CompanyAssassin
I assume you mean Fowler? With the exception of the injuries he’s been relatively decent. His BA isn’t fabulous but its decent and he’s been putting up way better power numbers than he has previously.
rycm131
What’s hype ceiling on him? .280 15-20
Bombs?
Ace of Spades
And mike leake
Triteon
I loved the Leake signing when it happened, but aside form the early part of this season he’s been underwhelming. In his defense, he shows up every game, makes his starts and gets through 6 innings, all while basically pitching to his career averages. Still, he (and the Cards) have little to show for it.
walls17
Cardinals need to rebuild but they never will unfortunately for them
beaubeadreaux
Cardinals will be OK. They have a good farm w/ high end prospects ready next year. They do not need a rebuild, or even a retool. They can add a piece or tool in the offseason & being up guys next year. I’m a Cubs fan, so I’m in no way biased towards the Cardinals
CompanyAssassin
Yeah I don’t get people saying there needs to be a full rebuild or even much of a retool. The FO needs to realize some players won’t amount to much (Grichuk) and others need to be given a consistent chance (Pham). I think Pham finally broke through but I’ve been saying he’s got it since 2015. Get a solid SS, RP, and give the best players the most consistent playing time. That’s all it should take but the FO doesn’t like simple solutions.
barkinghumans77
We have some young SS prospects who just might pan out. Not counting Paul DeJong. Unfortunately with all of the Cards success in recent years, a certain number of vocal fans lack patience. I really like Pham also. Bullpen needs attention but the rotation should be solid moving forward.
Cardinals17
Would you want Mo to actually rebuild a new team??? He built this one!
Wainofan
Sonny gray would have done nothing to improve cards, flaherty and weavers upside is above gray and we don’t need another starter
Cardinals17
Wainofan—- I partially agree with you. However, if the organization is stupid enough not to resign Lance Lynn, they would need a proven MLB pitcher. Not any more question marks. Flannery and Weaver need to start out like Wainwright, Lynn, Martinez
FBA17
Britton having his worst year in 4 years. Baltimore won’t be in it should have got as much value as possible. Other teams remember how dominate he was last year and hoping to get that the next two months. Baltimore always screws things up.
RunDMC
Coppy/Teheran is in the same boat. Nice contract is the only thing that looks promising, but he couldn’t be consistent if he starred in GROUNDHOG DAY.
Richard 3
Britton was injured, not having a poor year. He has 57 consecutive saves. Guess you were in on the talks, so you know who the Orioles were offered. So how was this a Baltimore screw up, Mr. Know it All?
tmengd 2
Jim Crane said today on ESPN that the Astros had an agreement with a team, agreed on prospects and even medicals exchange and an owner stepped in and vetoed the trade at the last minute. So that is presumably the Orioles I am assuming.
socalbum
pretty fair guess
jimmertee
If it was the O’s, it wouldn’t be the first time that ownership overuled the Orioles’ baseball people. It happened when Pat Gillick was GM. He had a deal in place to acquire a first baseman [rumored to be Allstar John Olerud]and Angelos allegedly vetoed it. Gillick quickly resigned and went on to join the Phillies and built another World Series winner.
jd396
Angelos is the new Loria
socalbum
Jeff Passan’s description of the 15 minutes before the Darvish trade was completed just doesn’t sound like the methodical Dodgers FO. If the discussions had been ongoing for a couple of weeks I think both Dodgers and Rangers would have already reviewed all medicals and possible trade packages. Passan may be spot on with his article, but I am shocked it accurate.
norcalblue
I think you make a fair point about the medicals; particularly Yu’s medicals. Other than that issue though, Passan’s account seems very plausible. Clearly, the Rangers did not want to move away from Verdugo and it is even more clear that LAD would never include him. As Passan explains, Dodger FO was in a strong position, feeling little pressure to take action and so they moved on to what they perceived was their highest priority: a lefty set-up man for Jansen.
When Daniels called, the conversation really moved to new topics: prospects that Daniels would take for Yu that did not include Dodger untouchables. Calhoun, and the single A prospects were just not assets Daniels wanted to discuss until it was clear to him he had no other options and that happened very late. I think Passan does a nice job of capturing how these deals come together very late.
s d tucker
Another trade deadline passes and Mo and the Cards talk about what they need and how they are active in talks,doing their due diligence, open for business, exploring all avenues available in order to land that “Big Bat” or that ” controllable asset” that makes sense not only only for this year but for the long term. Ownership and upper management admit that they see holes in the roster. A roster that they built. A roster void of stars or even a star. And still they make no moves at the deadline. None !!!!!! Could not find the right deal, there was a level of frustration that no deal was made, didn’t see the need to make a deal just to make a deal, or to win the news day. Seems like it’s the same message over and over and over again !!!!!!!!! But nothing really happens !!!!! Somehow the Dodgers were able to make some moves ??? The Cubs made some moves ???? The Nationals made some moves ???? The Yankees made some moves ??? The Astros made some moves ??? Even the Brewers and the Pirates made moves ??? But the Cards decided to stand pat with their mismatched roster, their glut of outfielders both at the major league level and minor league level, and a system loaded with pitching prospects at the lower levels. They also decided to keep their pending free agents (Lance Lynn, Seung Hwan Oh) without getting anything in return even though there was a fairly strong market for starters and relievers at the deadline. Other teams make deals and the Cards talk about making deals that never seem to happen. The Cards seem to value their prospects more than other clubs and that makes it really hard to make a trade for the kind of star player the Cards need to acquire (Donaldson,Machado,”Big Bat ????) . If they can’t let go of some of these prospects and have the balls to overpay for the right guy, which Mo just can’t seem to do, then they will have to wait until they develop that guy (Pujols) from within their system. Those kind of guys don’t come around very often. All the while the Cards draw 3 million fans and claim to have financial flexibility to add a core player or two. I have heard this for years and still nothing !!!! Come on Mo !!!! Quit making excuses and make some moves. Not just the safe moves. Identify that core guy, that superstar that the Card fans deserve and go out there get him even if you have to overpay !!!!!! We are waiting ??????
jimmertee
I hear your frustration. Same as me for the Jays. The Jays are going nowhere and they still hung onto players they should have let go. Maybe the offers weren’t very good, but I doubt it. Some team executives are so fearful of making a bad deal, they don’t make deals at all. They operate safe, which can assure longterm competativeness but doesn’t do a lot for winning now. That kind of safe attitude also ensures a longer term job security for the GM.
Cardinals17
The Cardinals seem proud to publish all of the non-deals they supposedly were negotiating. Why would the Cardinals even think the A’s would trade a proven MLB starter for two players that can’t stick on a MLB team and one that’s never pitched in the bigs at all.