Cubs hurler Jake Arrieta still expects to talk to the team about an extension before free agency and believes a deal is possible, writes Gordon Wittenmyer of the Chicago Sun-Times. However, Arrieta noted that extension talks aren’t his No. 1 priority as he focuses on his health and on the team’s chances of replicating last year’s World Series victory. President of baseball operations Theo Epstein, too, said he planned to meet with Arrieta’s agent, Scott Boras, but as Wittenmyer explains, an extension still feels like a long shot. Boras has already compared Arrieta to right-hander Max Scherzer, who signed a seven-year, $210MM contract with the Nationals two winters ago. Wittenmyer writes that the Cubs aren’t likely to be open to a mega-deal — Jon Lester is just two years into his own $155MM pact — which could lead to Arrieta landing elsewhere in the long run. For the time being, Patrick Mooney of CSN Chicago tweeted yesterday that there are no talks scheduled between Boras and the Cubs.
Here’s more from the game’s central divisions:
- Pirates owner Bob Nutting spoke with Bill Brink of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette about a host of topics as he looks back on ten years in his current role. Nutting extolled the “transformation in every aspect of the organization” that has occurred in that time, describing the wide-ranging changes that have been undertaken. He also addressed concerns from some quarters with the team’s payroll, explaining that spending on MLB salaries isn’t the sole area where the organization is focused. “It’s how we’re drafting, it’s how we’re funding our international operations,” he said. “How we develop that talent, that broader picture of both investment in facilities, people and systems in our development system, which has completely transformed from what it had been and frankly what many other clubs are still doing. While the headline number of payroll is important, and we will invest there because we need to to win on the field, it’s also really important that that can’t be the sole metric that we use internally.” You’ll want to give the full interview a read to assess Nutting’s comments for yourself.
- While the Royals traded away several pending free agents, the club kept several others and obviously signaled its intention to compete with its overall offseason approach. As Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports reports, Kansas City is still holding out the possibility of finding a way to keep one or more of its remaining players who’ll hit the open market after the 2017 season. Whether that could mean extension talks this spring isn’t clear, but it seems that the Royals will at least consider some kind of play for Eric Hosmer, Mike Moustakas, and/or Lorenzo Cain.
- Righty reliever Matt Belisle landed with the Twins after a bounceback 2016 campaign, due in some part to lobbying efforts from a few noted former teammates. As Mike Berardino of the St. Paul Pioneer-Press writes, LaTroy Hawkins and Michael Cuddyer didn’t exactly press the veteran to join the Minnesota organization, but their involvement in the process seemingly helped Belisle gain comfort with the idea of heading to the rebuilding club. “If Cuddy and LaTroy believed in it, I know I would too,” he explains.
chesteraarthur
Give it up jake they aren’t paying you 25 a year for more than 5
bigkempin
They gave Lester 6/155 when he was the same age as Arrieta. You assume they’ll only go 5/125 on Arrieta who has far less mileage on his arm?
chesteraarthur
can’t afford 2 pitching contracts like that to aging pitchers at the same time. 50 mil to 2 30+ pitchers for an extended time frame is a rather risky proposition.
bencole
Sure. But more money can always buy back your mistakes. This team has so much money it should never be out of the top 4 in MLB in payroll. Ever. And who you going to replace him with, that can be an ace on a World Series champion next year and the years after. Money is never an excuse not to win, especially not with a team that has plenty of it. I agree that there probably isn’t great value in an Arrietta extension (in fact it’s probably bad value) either but if the last $75 million is a bad investment then just throw another $75 million in so it doesn’t hurt your team. Otherwise, how do you replace those wins?
roughneck
With the new cba, nobody wants to go over the luxury tax. I imagine the Cubs prefer to use those funds to lock up Bryant, Russell, Schwarber etc
downsr30
Arrieta throws a high velocity cutter.. he actually didn’t have a feel for it last year and that was his difference maker in 2015. If you look at fangraphs pitch percentage, there is significant difference between his cutter usage the last two years and even Arrieta vocalized his struggle to get a good feel for it..
Starters who utilize that cutter/slider tend to run into elbow issues.. I think the fact that Arrieta has less mileage could set him for an inevitable elbow injury in the coming year(s). Lester is much more likely to be able to pitch with success as an aging pitcher with a decline in velocity. One of Arrieta’s strongest factors is his velocity combined with his strong movement on his pitches. Without that velocity, I’m not convinced he will be as successful or close to it. Lester is a much more proven pitcher with more orthodox mechanics and sustainable attributes.
I would not sign Arrieta past next year whatsoever.
Red Ivy
Either we resign Jake or we give up the farm for an ace. Via Redsox Chris Sale.
chesteraarthur
Or…they do neither and roll with Lester and Hendricks at the top of their rotation.
Red Ivy
If Mike Montgomery exceeds expectations absolutely
pjmcnu
Hendricks is a #3. A good #3, but a 3. They roll with him as a 2, and things get worse. Not to mention, their rotation depth is shot. They already let Hammel & Wood walk. And they have no good SPs in the upper minors that I’m aware of.
chesteraarthur
Hendricks was 13th in fwar for pitchers last year and was 28th the year prior. How are you getting that he is a 3? Cuz he doesn’t throw hard? I’d like to hear a legitimate argument for why it is that you consider him to be a 3.
RunDMC
Is this the first time we agree? Would love the luxury of a #3 leading the league in ERA and having the 2nd-lowest WHIP (Scherzer).
chesteraarthur
I didn’t even want to touch era because then people would just try to blame the cubs defense for his success. He gets criminally under rated because he doesn’t have 95+
Red Ivy
If Lester or Hendricks go down with no Jake or a replacement for him you can kiss a deep post season run goodbye
chesteraarthur
yeah, having no starters certainly hurt the 2015 royals and the 2016 indians losing 2 of their best starters before the ws really stopped them from competing there too. they have the offense to make the post season, then you just need to get hot.
Mikel Grady
You can’t argue with certain fans. Hendricks should have won cy young. Teams will figure out location and change of speeds is better than 101 mph pitchers who blow out arms. Hendricks is a pitcher others are just throwers. Greg maddux had a decent career for not throwing gas.
chesteraarthur
Scherzer deserved to win that cy young. Kyle was definitely a strong candidate, but I have no issues at all with him not winning it.
bigkempin
Hendricks is a good pitcher (career 3.29 FIP) but he also doesn’t blow batters away (career 7.7 K/9) He’s a groundball pitcher and relies heavily on the Cubs D. He had a 2.13 ERA with a 3.20 FIP.
chesteraarthur
He was 13th and 28th by fwar (which uses fip). Try again.
Red Ivy
So both the 15 royals and 16 Indians had impeccable bullpens. The 2017 Cubs should have a wonderful bullpen but I wouldn’t put them in that category.
lucienbel
I can only hope that this comes true. I personally enjoy watching location/strategy over 96 every pitch. None the less, speed doesn’t hurt.
Red Ivy
I have no clue how a thread about Jake Arrieta’s value turns into a convo about Kyle Hendricks value.
Mikel Grady
Ha ha fwar hall of fame voters will say who cares
Mojo2929
Agreed. You only need to get hot at the right time. It takes 25 guys to win a WS. One guy (no matter how good) won’t make or break a solid team like the Cubs.
Daryl125
Sample size of one year. Check the rest of his career and tell me he’s still a #2. Everything kind of fell into place for him last year. Solid pitcher, but he’s definitely not a #2. Hope he repeats though.
Ry.the.Stunner
Honestly who cares what HOF voters say? Half of them refuse to vote a certain player because they believe nobody should be unanimous.
Red Ivy
The 2016 Cubs didn’t rely on getting hot. When our backs were against the wall in ever post season series via the Giants, the Dodgers, and the Indians that’s when the Cubs channeled their inner Brady. Not when we were “hot” That team was so rounded it was a next guy up philosophy 24/7 and “That’s Cub.”
Red Ivy
The 2016 Cubs didn’t rely on “getting hot” that team was loaded from shoe strings to helmets 24-7. When we were getting ran through the dirt via the Giants, the Dodgers, and the Indians you think we got “hot”? Nah that’s called clutch. Now “That’s Cub”
TrueOutcomeFan
Definition of a number three: 1 pitch, 2 avg pitches, avg command, avg makeup
Hendricks has to command, which makes his pitches play up. His make up is . At worst, right now, he’s a 2 and last year he pitched as 1. His career is too small a SSS to say what he truly is. He is definitely an outlier from traditional scouting methods.
The Cubs rotation depth, with additions of Anderson, Butler and Mills puts them in much better shape than most teams. Their 2016 staff was the best in baseball. Losing Hammel, Wood and Chapman, replaced by previous players mentioned along with Duensing, Uehara and Davis arguably puts them in a better situation over all. There is AAA replacement depth if needed.
In an era of specialty and data driven play, one could argue there is more quality pitching available than at any point in baseball. With arguably one of the top three front offices in baseball and the payroll flexibility they gave themselves this offseason, the Cubs will have the ability to make moves in season should the need arise.
Solaris611
There won’t be an extension as long as Boras is a part of the equation. Cubs know he won’t budge on the years or the $$$, so they’re actions indicate they’re moving on.
RunDMC
I wish Matt Wieters would log on and vote down this comment. Look how that Boras budge has worked out for him.
mpoweror
Yep…. the FA market has gotten soft over the past 1-2 years. A few teams are still bidding high, but most are not… and most FAs have been accepting SMALLER deals (fewer years for less $$$).
Boras-type tactics/expectations are out-dated & failing… If Boras were my agent, I’d fire him. Boras is really hurting his clients in this new MLB FA paradigm.
Mikel Grady
Sad but true.
metseventually 2
I’m the only one who giggles at Nutting?
Damn.
GeauxRangers
Nope. Me too
SupremeZeus
Arrieta is going to FA and he will sign w/ the highest bidder. I don’t expect that to be the Cubs. Simple as that.
cubfanforever
I agree, very rarely does a Boras client sign an extension.
He will go to free agency and sign elsewhere.
He’ll be 32 when his contract is up and probably want 5 years.
Cubs will not make that commitment and I agree with that.
mpoweror
Boras is living in the past , and it’s hurting his clients.
If Boras thinks JA will get 5/$100+ @ 32yrs. old, he’s smoking the shrubbery…
bravesfan88
Everyone MUST WATCH THIS VIDEO!! It is hilarious, and features Greg Maddux in a disguise playing a prank on Kris Bryant!! Bryant’s reaction during the prank is absolutely PRICELESS!!! A TRUE MUST SEE FOR ANY BASEBALL FAN, especially old Braves fans and any current Cubs fans!!
espn.com/mlb/story/_/page/QTP_170216MadduxpranksBr…
I would go into some more details on exactly what is so priceless and hilarious about this video, but I don’t want to ruin for any of you guys that haven’t seen it yet!! ENJOY!! lol
chesteraarthur
haha thank you for that.
“Do you still want my bat?”
“nah”
skip 2
88 what was so hilarious about it? You got just a little carried away with that.
cubssssss
If Arrieta throws another full season of sub 3.2-ish baseball, it would be hard to let him go.
The Cubs could sell the farm for an ace (though the farm is already getting thinner and thinner), or they could pony up and pay him market value.
I very much hate the idea of giving 31-32 year olds 7 year deals because you know they (most likely) won’t be performing at the same level near the end of the contract, but let’s face it–the Cubs have an incredible pool of young talent locked up until 2021, lack any true upcoming aces in the farm system, and, most importantly, have the money to spend. Not only that, a lot of the pitchers who get 6-7 year deals at Jake’s age already have much more mileage on their arms (Jake has yet to surpass 1000). Also, there are few players who take care of their body / health like Arrieta does (not that his regime necessarily lowers the risk of an elbow injury, but it still matters, especially in the latter years of the contract when his age becomes an issue).
Ideally he’d take a 7 year deal with an opt out after 3 to 4 years, but he’s going to get 30 million a year somewhere (with a strong 2017), I wouldn’t mind it being with the Cubs.
chesteraarthur
I hope to the spaghetti monster that the cubs don’t base a 210 million dollar investment on jake arietta’s 2017 ERA.
cubssssss
A strong 2017 season would solidify his previous body of work and illustrate strong continuity–i.e. that he truly is ‘ace’ and should be paid like one–which would make him a safer bet as far as production goes over the length of the contract. Clearly his contract will not be totally based on 1 year. I don’t think 2017 will have much effect on his ‘floor’ as far as his contract goes, but another campaign in the low 2’s would definitely affect the ceiling of his contract, probably ensuring him 30 million.
cubsfan2489
Since you are obviously a bandwagoner, Arrieta is definitely a Ace. He’s pitched like one since 2014. He’s going to demand most likely Stras money. By the way, I assume you don’t play for the Cubs or have any ownership in them, so it’s “they” not “we” when talking about them. Thank Dan Bernstein for that one.
cubssssss
So you try to delegitimize others by calling them ‘bandwagoners’ because you disagree with them? Also, who is referring to the Cubs as “we”? If an individual associates with a team and / or fanbase, they can be viewed as part of the ‘in-group’, therefore making them part of the ‘we’. Dan Bernstein is an idiot and should be thanked for nothing.
It would be great to get Arrieta at Strasburgs price (25 million a year). I agree that that is probably what he should go for, but as I was saying, another stellar season like 2015 could put him in the Scherzer / Greinke range.
Also, prices inflate…While Arrieta might be worth the same as Strasburg when he signed an extension, this will be a year or more later and IN FREE AGENCY–a time when teams continually outbid and overspend.
ronnsnow
Chester, you’ll have to excuse most Cubs fans who’ve only started paying attention to baseball in 2015
Mikel Grady
Darvish cueto otani Tanaka good options of boras holds Cubs up
chesteraarthur
Yes. I honestly think the cubs will avoid another huge sp contract in the next couple of years with an eye to otani when he becomes available. Locking up 50ish mil a year on two 30+ sps is a scary proposition.
Mikel Grady
I hope they get otani
Ry.the.Stunner
Based on the new CBA, I don’t think Otani plans to make himself available this upcoming offseason.
skip 2
He’s not getting a 7 year any where!!
tim815
The Cubs will have a long and successful run, only if they begin to develop their own pitching internally.
I think that is the plan.
Mix and match with some shrewd FA signings, and trades.
However, at some point, their _hitters_ are gonna get spensive. To counter that, the prospects will need to produce.
jdgoat
I hope Kansas sells off their remaining guys for the sake of their fans, cause if not, they will be trash for a long, long time
lesterdnightfly
You mean the Kansas that plays in Allen Fieldhouse ? How in the name of Ali Faroukmanesh can even Bill Self sell off his guys? Kickbacks from the NBA? Hmmm…….
rc21pa
Bob Nutting is so full of it. He never spent anything so he will always saying anything to turn his attention away from payroll. Worst yet every sports writer especially in Pittsburgh plays right into Nutting’s BS out of fear.
66TheNumberOfTheBest
Yinzers gonna yinz. Madden’s minions march merrily.
He did everything he listed above, which is exactly the plan they laid out when NH was hired. Built first class facilities in FL and the DR. Signed Marte and Polanco as a result.
Got Josh Bell by overspending in the draft. IN FACT….MLB changed the draft spending rules because the Pirates were spending (wait for it) TOO MUCH.
Their payroll ranking is the same as their revenue stream ranking. The only teams that spend less are the teams that make less. The only teams that spend more are the teams that make more. Yinzers never whine about how Nutting should increase ticket prices so he can field a better team.
If after the Pirates get a new cable TV deal replacing their current terrible one (if you want to fault him/them….there’s your avenue….it’s their own fault they made that deal) they don’t up the payroll, then feel free to yinz.
mpoweror
belltolls – thank you for this…
i get sooooooo sick & tired of Pgh “fans” who feel entitled to spend someone else’s money..
it’s a business, not a charity/hobby.
and i wouldn’t get too excited about a new TV deal in Pgh… even a ‘good’ TV deal in Pgh will be relatively small by MLB standards. IOW, a new/better TV deal will NOT cause payroll to jump 50%, or even 25%… no way. Pgh market is not big enough to expect a $blockbuster$ TV deal.
theruns
The Pirates are building a lasting foundation. They are doing things the right way, from the ground up which is the only way for them to do it economically. They do indeed put legit resources into this and it is paying off, they have a superb farm system, one of the best in baseball.
There will always be uninformed fans that want to scream and yell about spending.