SUNDAY, 6:32pm: Shortstop Gleyber Torres, one of the Cubs’ top prospects, has been scratched from the lineup for Chicago’s High-A affiliate tonight, according to Sports Illustrated’s Kenny Ducey (Twitter link). Torres was known to be of interest to the Yankees, and Heyman tweets that the Cubs have an offer of Torres and more on the table for Chapman. Torres was a consensus top-50 prospect (#28 from MLB.com, #41 from Baseball America and Baseball Prospectus) in preseason minor league rankings, and the 19-year-old is hitting .275/.359/.433 in 409 plate appearances this season.
3:52pm: Yankees owner Hal Steinbrenner still hasn’t given general manager Brian Cashman the green light to sell off top veterans, including Chapman, according to Heyman. As of now, the Indians, Cubs, Nationals, Rangers and a mystery team are pushing for Chapman. (Twitter link).
12:57pm: The Indians have the best names on the table for Chapman right now and a trade could be close, a source told Bruce Levine of 670TheScore (Twitter link). The Nationals are also aggressively going after Chapman, notes Levine, and Keith Law of ESPN hears (on Twitter) that Erick Fedde, Koda Glover and another prospect will head to the Yankees if the two sides strike a deal. Fedde, a right-hander, is Baseball America’s 61st-ranked prospect.
11:03am: The Yankees are dissatisfied with the Nationals’ offers, who are behind at least three other teams (including a mystery club) in the Chapman derby, writes Heyman. Further, the remaining $5MM on Chapman’s contract could make it difficult for a team like the Indians to acquire him, as the Yankees are currently unwilling to eat any of that money.
Meanwhile, the Giants sense that the momentum is elsewhere in regards to Chapman, tweets Andrew Baggarly of the San Jose Mercury News. The Yankees are giving the Giants “radio silence” and don’t like San Francisco’s farm system as much as other suitors’, adds Henry Schulman of the San Francisco Chronicle.
10:06am: The Cubs are “strong” in the mix for Chapman, according to Rosenthal. The Dodgers and the previously reported teams have also been in pursuit (Twitter links).
8:46am: Chapman is the Nationals’ No. 1 target, per FanRag Sports’ Jon Heyman, who adds that the Yankees are interested in Nats right-handed starter Joe Ross. The Giants are also in the Chapman sweepstakes, but neither they nor the Indians are progressing toward a deal with the Yankees. The Cubs are higher on Miller than Chapman, though it doesn’t appear the former is going anywhere.
Although Ross has been out for several weeks with inflammation in his throwing shoulder, it’s fair to say he’d be a significant pickup for the Yankees in a Chapman trade. The 23-year-old has thrown 172 innings and put up a 3.56 ERA, 7.74 K/9, 2.46 BB/9 and 46.6 percent ground-ball rate since debuting in the majors last season. Unsurprisingly, there’s “no chance” of Washington moving Ross for a rental, a source told Heyman (Twitter link).
8:38am: The Yankees have asked the Nationals, Cubs, Indians and a mystery team to submit their best and final offers for Chapman, an industry source told Ken Davidoff of the New York Post.
SATURDAY, 10:18pm: A Chapman trade isn’t necessarily imminent, but the Yankees are ready to conclude the process, tweets Rosenthal.
9:32pm: The Yankees are telling teams that they’re nearing a trade involving closer Aroldis Chapman, but they plan on keeping fellow left-handed relief ace Andrew Miller, reports FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal (Twitter link). There’s no word yet on where the Yankees will send Chapman in advance of the Aug. 1 non-waiver trade deadline.
As of earlier Saturday, the Nationals were pursuing Chapman – to whom they’ve been connected for months – but they haven’t shown an eagerness to part with top prospects for the 28-year-old free agent-to-be. Fellow contenders like the Cubs, Indians and Giants, among others, have also been linked to Chapman, whom the Yankees acquired from the Reds for an underwhelming prospect package during the offseason amid his domestic violence issues.
The flame-throwing Chapman served a month-plus suspension to begin the season because of his off-field misdeeds, but he has been his usual dominant self on the mound since. Over 31 1/3 innings this year, Chapman has pitched to a 2.01 ERA while notching 12.64 strikeouts and walking 2.3 batters per nine innings, and converting 20 of 21 save chances. Chapman’s strikeout rate represents a career low, though his walks are at a personal best and he hasn’t shown any signs of losing velocity, having exceeded 105 mph on Monday. The exact speed (105.1) is the fastest pitch ever on radar, tying Chapman’s record from 2010.
For the Yankees, dealing Chapman would be an admission that they’re not all in on contending this year. The Bombers dropped a 12-inning decision to the Giants on Saturday and fell to 49-48, which puts them 7.5 games behind the AL East-leading Orioles and 4.5 out of a Wild Card spot. On the other hand, judging by their decision to keep the 31-year-old Miller – who has outperformed Chapman this season – they haven’t abandoned all near-term hope. Miller is locked up through 2018 at $9MM per annum and would surely merit a significant return (even greater than what Chapman will bring back), but the Yanks look prepared to hold him and hope he’s part of playoff teams in the Bronx over the next couple years.
Even if the Yankees part with Chapman, he, like Miller, could conceivably be part of their plans beyond this season. Chapman would have to hit free agency and New York would have to be motivated to re-sign him, of course. He seems likely to exceed his 2016 salary ($11.325MM) on a long-term deal in the offseason, and it stands to reason that the Yankees could be the club to give him that contract on the open market. For now, it appears Chapman will head to a team in better position to compete for a World Series this season.
Cubs? Kinda have a feeling
Yankee scouts were in Columbus and Akron, all week looking at OF Cowgill and P Cleavinger . They were in Clevalnd and Baltimore scouting Almonte …
..Good chance Chapman drops into Cleveland
Yankees scouts were all over. They’re regional teams. The scouts in Akron would t affect their southern league scouts from being in Tennessee to see the Cubs…
Gets to Cleveland: “Take me back to Cuba. Please.”
Is Cleveland that different from cincy?
Almonte? They can have him, the Tribe should’ve dumped his ass as soon as his suspension was up. Considering he can’t play in the playoffs he’s stealing ABs from others that will make a difference come postseason.
Yeah but people scout all the time. Cubs scouts been in NY, Miami, Oak, TB and Atlanta over the past 3 weeks.
Clev does sound about right but nothing is for sure.
CUBS GOT HIM BOYS!
Wish the jays
Cubs?
my guess is nats possibly giants got in
Neither. NY doesn’t like what Wash is offering they want prospects. SF is not even in the mix.
If I was a beating man to lay odds.
1-1 Clev
2-1Cubs
5-1 Texas IF they don’t land Sale If they land Sale 1000 – 1
20 – 1 Wash
30 – 1 LAD
50 – 1 SF
100 – 1 Boston
10000 – 1 he stays in NY
He’ll be excellent in DC.
Chapman > Nationals
For Fedde and Ward
Fedde is 23 and said to be not far from ML….Yanks will do this Monday
He’s in A ball and he’s 23.
Sorry Theo and Boys swoop in hahahaha -Go Cubs!
By giving up significantly more than the Nationals offered if the rumors are true… Not a huge win if that’s the case…
Giants my guess
Dodgers for verdugo
Yeah this sounds more reasonable that they would keep Miller with tears still left in his contract
Actually the tears are in Teixeira and A-Rod’s contracts. Great typo.
Oh how true this is.
Got to be careful here. Giving up a top prospect for a guy who may or may not throw 105 mph, home speed guns hmm, but strikeouts over 9, while good is at a career low, only thrown 31 innings, so around 50 for the year, and on 3rd team in 6 months. He will help any team that gets him, but better make playoffs and not do what Baltimore did in 14, trade E-rod for half a season of Andrew Miller to watch him walk away
May or may not throw 105mph? Really? Even if the home gun is juiced something ridiculous like 5mph, he’s still the hardest throwing pitcher in baseball… I don’t think any team cares if he throws 102 vs 105. And yes, his strikeouts are a little down, but they are still elite, and his walks are also at a career low. Another thing teams won’t be concerned with. And he’s “only thrown 31 innings” because he was suspended in the beginning of the year. If anything, that’ll help his value because his arm is fresher than it would’ve been otherwise. Also, he’ll be on his 3rd team in 6 months because his original team is actively trying to lose and his current team is average just about everywhere except the bullpen (where he’s at). None of those factors will negatively affect his value.
That’s why the Yankees are trading him and not trying to resign him. All those reasons makes sense. I would think with your reasons a 5 year 60-65 million dollar deal is in his future. Closers always win World Series..
Agreed. Who was the last team to win a WS that had a poor closer? 2001 DBacks maybe?
Who said they aren’t trying to resign him? The Yankees can trade him and resign him. A prospect haul and Chapman on a long term deal makes way more sense than just giving him a big contract.
Most players who are traded and then hit free agency go back to original team. It was a cheap rental that they hoped a 3 headed bullpen could make up for flawed starting pitching and aging offense. It didn’t, Hal has not allowed for any big contracts to free agents who will be paid past their prime. They are trying to rid of bad contracts, not create more. However, if they really thought his numbers are great and worth it, they would trade Miller and sign Chapman, but again Hal isn’t going to spend 25 million on 2 bullpen arms, when there are holes all over the place
The Yankees can’t sign Chapman. At least not until the season is over. He wants to test the open market and he has every right to do so.
Trading Chapman doesn’t bar the Yankees from signing him in the offseason and I do expect them to make a genuine effort to re-sign him regardless of what they do at the deadline.
There have been several depending on your definition. The 2014 Giants didn’t have a great closer. The 2011 Cardinals didn’t really have a shutdown closer. The 2003 Marlins had a horrible closer (Looper) the majority of the season, although Urbina did well in the playoffs.
@ Mbolled The bullpen is the reason NYY is hanging around 500. Without the big 3 New York sits next to the Rays.
Probably very true, but the Yankees have so many holes with weak starting pitching, weak 2017 free agent pitching and aging expensive hitters, they will not spend 15 million for 5 years when still rebuilding. Million makes 9 and does the job very well. They got what they wanted, a trade chip with no intention to resign, and will be on 4th team in a year
I dont think it’s closers that win games. I think it’s the bullpen as a whole, especially the late inning guys. The rangers had feliz in ’11 and he choked.
San Francisco three times. White Sox in 2005 . A good closer is certainly not vital to World Series success.
Giants had Romo and Wilson. Check out their stats those seasons. White Sox had Jenks and Hermanson. Check out their stats that season. Ray Ray gave a good example with the 2003 Marlins , but that was a long time ago.
Kim stunk in the WS but had a good season overall. 2003 Marlins had Braden Looper who wasn’t exactly lights out. But true, it seems a true WS contender must have a closer.
Uh what? 2005 White Sox had the best bullpen in baseball. Hermanson was aces and when his back went out, Bobby Jenks stepped in. To quote Mike Ditka: ‘Who u crappin’?”
Hermanson wasn’t very good in 2005 and Jenks was a rookie who gave up a hit an inning (or close to it.) Wilson did have one dominant year in there but Romo has been a pitch to contact type. I think of Mariano when I think about shutdown postseason closers but many teams have won without them.
Hermanson struck out, what, 5 batters per 9? Jenks gave up a hit an inning. That team was quite good and I loved them – I lived in Chicago in 2005 and participated in all the celebrations after they won – but the closer was a weakness. The non-closer relievers – Pollitte and Cotts, were the stars of that relief staff.
Funny they just did that so there goes your theory out the window – EXPERT bahh
Unless they sign and trade. Like they just did. So much for your other Theory your 0-2 now
The Yankees will try to resign Chapman in the off season so there goes your point
Speeds were verified by stat cast, not the radar gun.
Yet strikeouts per 9 are down and getting traded and not resigned. Most teams don’t trade dominate pitching.
Teams not in contention do at the trade deadline almost every year. And his K/9 decrease could simply be him not throwing as hard as often to have better control, which would also explain him cutting his BB/9 from 4.5 last year and 4.2 for his career to 2.5 this year.
The Reds traded him because they did not need a dominant closer in a rebuilding phase. The Yankees are trading him because they do not need a dominant closer in a losing year.
K/9 are down. So are BB/9. H’es still dominant though.
Lastly, your contract has to run out for you to get resigned. He’s still on his first and only MLB contract.
Different league.. DH makes a difference… Not fanning a pitcher that looks like he just picked up a bat for the first time in his life…you know, the guy that all the so called NL purest can’t do without watching to hit…what a joke
When do closers ever face a pitcher in the national league. They face a pinch hitter, usually a starter who was benched that day and ready and healthy to hit
Lol who sends up a pitcher to bat when losing in the 9th?
You thinking a pitcher bats in the 9th inning in a save situation is the joke.
Radars are universally regulated by PitchFX, not home teams.
The radar readings you see are from PitchFX. It’s a league wide and connected system, so the home parks can’t change the speeds to read higher than the actual speed.
Actually MLB doesn’t use home guns, they use a league wide third party called Pitch FX.
The radar guns in every MLB stadium are through the pitch f/x system which is run by MLB. This has been true for a few years now. The system was implemented to compare pitch location with umpire strike zones to make sure they are consistent and also to give teams and MLB data on every pitch (speed, break distance, etc). So there is no more home cooking-the speed you see is the speed as clocked by the most accurate gun available and run by the league.
we will trade arron loup straight up for chapman make it happen LOL jk what do the yanks want for him
As of Saturday, the Orioles are leading the AL East, not the Red Sox.
I think the sox r more to worry about as a blue jays fan
The Red Sox pitchers are making the Twins look like the 27 Yankees. Painful to watch.
I like it
No Sox pitching tonight
Yeah ugly is an understatement
That game was pretty crazy early on. Did you see the wind?! Not blaming that for the pitching sucking by the way, just commenting on how crazy it was. Guys couldn’t see for awhile, extended breaks between pitches, and a tv monitor flew off the wall in the NESN booth and clocked Jerry Remy in the head.
I hope the Indians can swing a deal for him without giving up too much, but I’m guessing Nats or Cubs
I can think it a lot teams that would go hard after him. Giants, Dodgers, Nats, Cubs. I wonder who get him. I wonder if it’s the Dodgers for the 2nd time lol. I hope it’s the Dodgers.
Nationals
Cleveland swoops in and overpays for Chap.
I think these players are a good return for Chapman. Let’s hope other teams get involved and drive up the price!
Nats – Fedde
Cubs – Happ
Indians – Bradley
Giants – Arroyo
Rangers – Ortiz
Dodgers – Montas
Cardinals – Flaherty
Arroyo for Chapman? Bwahahahahahaha… That’s not a good deal, it’s an insane deal and the Giants would never, repeat after me, never trade him for a rental. They’d package Panik first and promote Arroyo.
Zach Wheeler begs to differ
Actually, Arroyo is exactly the type of prospect I would expect to be the headliner in a Chapman trade. Andrew Miller was moved at the deadline in 2014 as a free agent to be. He was traded for Eduardo Rodriguez who was the #65 ranked prospect in the preseason, but was struggling a little as a 21 yo in AA. Arroyo was the #62 ranked prospect in the preseason, but has struggled as a 21 yo in AA so far this year. I still feel Chapman has had a better track record than Miller did at the time of his trade in 2014. Chapman also has many teams vying for his service right now, so I think his value is higher than Miller’s was then. I would not be surprised to see another low prospect being added as a sweetener and could see a Giants trade looking something like Arroyo and one of the SP in AAA, possibly Mejia, but likely Blackburn or Blach.
wow you think the Giants would trade panik before they trade a prospect?
Of course it is not a good deal. It’s their number 1 prospect. But the Giants have the weakest farm out of the clubs interested. If they want to outbid the other teams, they would have to use Arroyo to do so. If I was the Giants, I wouldn’t do it… but they do need bullpen help.
who do u all think the reds will get for bruce
Probably one or two prospects
A number is not “who”
“Prospects” are a descriptive noun, in this case, describing “who.” So, yea, maybe one or two of them.
Anyway, it probably doesn’t pay to drop specific prospect names in this case, since it hardly ever works out that way. Sit tight, wait and see.
The Cubs don’t need a rental, they are looking for pitchers with team control
A rental won’t cost as much in terms of prospect capital as a pitcher with team control
About 2 weeks age Theo said rentals make sense this year.
Cubs are working on the extension boys relax
Chapman will never take an extension
What if it’s a team out of left field like Miami or Houston..
Miami is my dark horse
Boston
Cardinals?
I’m going to go out on a limb here and say he’s going to the Dodgers for puig.
Ill do that
The Dodgers are my first guess and Puig one of the guys I think is most likely to be in a deal for him.
I hope you’re wrong, but it could happen. The FO trades whoever ESPN says needs to be traded. That being said, Puig has raked since coming back, has value, and would likely be used in a deal for a top-tier starter before a rental reliever.
Puig feels like too much for Chapman. With Toles looking like he might be able to play on a daily basis, the Dodgers can trade from a position of strength and get more for Puig than a rental.
I just wonder when Upton is going to be traded. It’s taking a long time for him to be traded since we heard a deal was almost done yesterday. I know Upton and Chapman will both be traded but I hate hearing trades will happen soon because then I can put my phone down until happens lol
A long time since yesterday? Impatient are we?
Exactly what would the G’nts offer to NYY for Aroldis?
Im thinking pitching prospects
Any in the top 100? (Like 80-100 range)
I doubt the Giants would give Bickford or Beede for a rental, They have other arms who could improve in Crick or Blackburn, the real bonus the Giants can offer on top of one of those is possibly the next Chapman if someone can teach him to throw strikes consistently in Ray Black.
You have to figure that if the Yanks are pulling the trigger this early, they got a prospect that they really want. Otherwise they would dangle him up to the deadline before someone caves. They certainly wouldn’t be settling for a lesser prospect on July 24.
By waiting, there is one less team looking. The Cubs got Montgomery. Wait too long and there will be less demand, and fewer offers to choose from. Abad may not be Chapman, but once a team acquires Abad, or McGee or Smith, they are no longer looking to pay what Chapman will cost. He’s not the only lefty reliever out there.
If they got an amazing offer they wouldn’t shop it around for something better and risk it going away.
I’m guessing they have a pretty good offer and aren’t quite satisfied.
Unless it’s a really good offer from the Red Sox. 🙂
Chapman to Nationals for Fedde and a lesser prospect…fits perfectly for both
If it is going to require a top prospect I pray it isn’t the Cubs. Looking at the pile of sh** the Yankees gave up to get him makes him not worth a top prospect IMO. On top of that he’s a free agent at the end of the year meaning you are only guaranteed 2 months of him, 3 depending how far you make it into the playoffs. Adding him doesn’t guarantee anyone a WS ring. You have to be leading the game in the 9th inning for Chapman to make a difference. He’s useless if you’re trailing, so I don’t get why people think he will make you that much better of a team. Sure he’s great, but again, hardly makes you a guarantee to win anything. The offense needs to score runs, the starting pitching needs to hold the opponent down, and the bullpen leading up to Chapman has to hold the lead in order for Chapman to make you a winner. Lots of variables before you get to Chapman. So IMO, not worth a top prospect. ONLY way I’d say he is worth a top prospect is if Hoyer and Theo are confident and willing to re-sign him. But I have a feeling the Yankees are going to give him some ridiculous contract no sane team will be willing to match let alone beat. When Caleb Cotham was the centerpiece of the 4 players they sent to Cinci to get him, I don’t know how you justify a huge asking price.
Now I know people will act like they know better than me and say, “well, they only gave up those 4 crappy players because Chapman’s season was in question and he was facing an 80 game ban.” I love it when people say this because it proves my point and they are agreeing with me without realizing it. If Chapman was only worth 4 crappy prospects because he MIGHT have only been playing half the year for the Yankees due to an 80 game suspension. Why would he be worth more now to only play for 1/3 of the year for his new team? So if Chapman is worth 4 crappy prospects for POSSIBLY half a season, what’s he worth for a GUARANTEED 1/3 of the season? Logic would say less than what the Yankees gave up to get him. If I were the Cubs I wouldn’t offer more than John Andreoli and maybe some other random prospect…… that’s it. Someone like Zac Rosscup. Only way I’d offer more is if I could get reassurance from Chapman he will sign a contract with the Cubs. As for that I wouldn’t give him more than 4 years and $56M which works out to $14M/season. More than reasonable. But the Yankees will likely be the over paying fools they are and likely offer him a 5 year $90M deal at $18M per.
Dude, stop writing novels. You’re a moron. Rosscup isn’t a prospect FYI. Stop writing these novels on here and get a life
No sh** Rosscup isn’t a prospect. He’s a AAAA type player – like the pile of crap they gave the reds to get Chapman. Reading is hard though, and you clearly don’t like it. You said it twice in two of your four sentences.
As a Yankee fan, I’d say it’s unlikely management will splurge for Chapman in FA–highly unlikely. Too many other issues.
KevinS, you’re probably right. Unless Miller gets traded
They might they have a lot of money coming off the books.
You’re delusional if you think the Yankees are offering that. Matter of fact you’re already delusional for thinking Chapman is worth Less now than he was in the offseason
Why was he worth 4 throw away minor leaguers in the offseason, but worth more now? It’s not like he’s doing anything different this year than in years prior? So he’s worth 4 crap no name minor leaguers/quad A-type players for POSSIBLY only half the season, but for definitively only 1/3 of the season he is worth more? Would love to hear that reasoning. Not only from you but from the teams actually interested in giving the Yankees what they want despite knowing the same things I do. How does a GM sell the idea of giving up a top prospect for a rental closer to play for the team for only 2+ months to the team owner when that rental closer was had for WAY less in the offseason? So glad the Cubs aren’t one of the headlining teams on this rumor. They’ve already over paid for a reliever with no track record of success other than the last 4 months.
Because it’s the deadline and there are many contending teams that had bullpen struggles. Chapman pre-season came with baggage with the suspension. He could have been suspended longer or shorter but nobody knew how long it would be. Blame the Reds for selling him low. Doesn’t mean the Yankees have to
He’s worth more now because he could be a key piece to teams winning it all.
He’s also worth more now because when they traded for him, teams had no idea how long his suspension would be for. They could have traded for a guy who would have been suspended for a year.
He always could have been a key piece to teams winning it all!
He is worth less now. When the Yankees traded for him they were getting a full season of him and a draft pick. Now an acquiring team would only get two months of him and no draft pick. And don’t even try it with the “But he might have been suspended 80 games” thing. If he had been suspended 80 games, He still would have been allowed to play in more games this season than any team that trades for him now will get out of him AND his free agency would have been delayed a year so that would add to his trade value.
See below. I guess DBacks could get Swanson, Inciarte and Blair back, right ?
You never value a deal by seeing how they got him in the previous trade dude. That’s stupid.
KB man I’m a Cubs fan too so I’m just gonna say this once, the market sets the price. Demand determines what gets paid for an asset. If teams are willing to give a top 100 prospect for Chapman, that’s the price. Not what the yanks gave up for him
Well, the DBacks are shopping Miller, and by this guy’s logic, he’s worth Swanson, Inciarte, and Blair… Just to put it in perspective.
** By KB’s logic
KB and TheWestCoastRyan, I’m going to assume neither of you were economics majors. We’re talking two completely different, independent markets, and his price will be set by the demand for and scarcity of his services. That’s why average players get overpaid in poor free agent classes, and good players can get underpaid in deep free agent classes. Where else can you get elite relief help right now? Nowhere, so pay up.
KB do yout hink the Cubs are that stupid, and Theo is in 5th grade like most of these posters. If they give up a top prospect don’t you think, the Cubs, Theo and anyone with a brain would say Sign and Trade. Like Sign for 3 – 4 years at this much money then trade. Makes sense don’t it. Cubs are not stupid like Toronto or the Mets.
KB why keep embarrassing yourself with your fixation on what Chapman cost the Yankees. It has no bearing on his current value.
Zac Rosscup? You just lost all credibility
My guess is Giants, and the announcement comes after they end series so he can pack up and go with them
Ha. Wouldn’t that be something.
Yankees will trade Chapman and probably not get back as much as they gave for him. They essentially rented him for 1/4 of a season due to his suspension. We gave 4 prospects. Lets see what we get back?
They will most certainly get back more than they gave up. The 4 prospects they gave up were weren’t anything great. That’s the genius of this move by cashman. He bought when chapman’ value couldn’t be any lower knowing his value would increase at the trade deadline.
Jagielo was a 1st round draft pick, Rookie Davis is 8-3 2.68era, Tony Renda is batting .326, and Caleb Cotham made the Reds out of spring training before he got hurt. Not all-stars but we didn’t get Chapman for nothing. Especially if Jajielo blossoms into a power hitter at 3B.
If chapman didn’t have the pending suspension at the time, that package of players doesn’t even come close to getting that deal done.
Davis was always a good prospect.
The only player in that deal that was a top 20 prospect was Eric jagielo, and he rated as a B- talent because of questionable defense, a high k rate, and if I remember correctly, knee issues.
I agree. But lets see what amazing deal Cashman pulls off. I hope its at least as good as the Dustin Ackley deal.
pinstripetears – Jagielo is a .254 career hitter in the minor leagues in 1,015 ABs with a .344 OBP and a .781 OPS. Not exactly great, and this is the “best” player in the deal? Highest level – Double A
Rookie Davis has decent minor league numbers. He too is only in double A though. He MIGHT be the most promising prospect they gave up for Chapman
Caleb Cotham is quite possibly the worst reliever in MLB right now. He’s given up 20 ER in 24.1 IP for a 7.40 ERA. He’ll be 29 years old in November and only has 34 career innings pitched at the ML level. In the 9.2 IP he made with the Yankees last year he did slightly “better” with a 6.52 ERA. He’s given up 7 HRs in those 34 innings pitched as a reliever………. solid….
Tony Renda. Not bad averages-wise in the minors……. but he has no power, no speed, and is nothing special defensively.
NONE of these prospects were or are ranked. They aren’t what you’d call prized possessions by any stretch of the imagination. None of them even come close to measuring up to the likes of Joe Ross, if that is indeed the player they get or quality of player they get for Chapman. There is nothing special about the players the Yankees gave up to get Chapman. No, by the literal definition they didn’t give up “nothing” to get Chapman. They did give up players. Just unimportant, irrelevant players. None of these guys crack the top 10 on the Reds top 30 prospect list. Renda isn’t even ranked.
Tony Renda. Not bad averages-wise in the minors……. but he has no power, no speed, and is nothing special defensively.
He has 103 steals in the minors and has only been caught 21 times. I’d say that’s a lot better than “no speed.”
They gave up NOTHING to get him. And he has been playing since May 9th. That’s d*** near 1/2 the season (3 months), not 1/4.
Is it dark in the room you’re typing in?
I hope you’re joking. The Yankees have up almost nothing for chapman. I’m willing to bet you’re a troll pretending to be a Yankee fan.
Discounting Chapman based on what the Yankees gave up last December is easily the dumbest thing I have read on these comment threads.. Ever.. kudos to KB for having a less than firm grasp on how buying low & selling high works…
I’m not saying it will happen. I am saying if it were a just world, it would come into play. If I were a GM I wouldn’t be over paying for a rental closer in Chapman. The recent price paid for a player has to be taken into consideration if you’re thinking of buying said player. Saying that is stupid makes no sense.
Also, please Yankee fans. Tell me how the Yankees bought Chapman low? He’s always been a solid closer. You say you “bought low” on him because of his off the field discretions possibly costing him 80 games in a suspension, which means you bought him assuming you’d only have him for 1/2 the year? Correct?…….. yes. So as a rental player for the last 2 months of the season (1/3 of the year…… less than the time the yankees thought they bought him for) how is he worth a super high price? Any GM who gives up a top prospect or a stellar young major league player like Joe Ross is a fool and his job security should be in question. Chapman should be worth no more than what Papelbon was acquired for last year by the Nationals – Nick Pivetta…….. a kid who is ranked as the 18th best prospect in the phillies system. He was the Nationals’ 18th ranked prospect as well before he was traded.
Recent price doesn’t really take effect. Is Shelby Miller still worth Swanson, Inciarte, and Blair?
Bro, do yourself a favor and don’t use trades that were universally seen as huge overpays at the time they were agreed upon to try and justify your argument. And Miller has regressed this year while Chapman has been his normal self.
If it were to be the Cubs I’d say Candelario and another lesser prospect. Just because of the fact that he just wasn’t able to show anything when he was called up for that brief amount of time
Yep. By his analogy, Arrieta is worth a backup catcher and backend starter cause that’s what the Cubs gave up.
Sorry. Meant to reply to thump with this
Agreed.. and that is less than what the Yankees paid for Chapman. So I guess by that logic the Yankees can get Arrieta for Chapman? Sounds good KB..
To compare the 2 statements is short sided. Arrieta has increased his value 10 fold since becoming a Cub while Chapman has done nothing to increase his. The Yankees were essentially trading for 4 1/2 months of Chapman which is why the value was low. So a team trying to trade for him now would be trading for 2 months of Chapman. If anything Chapman should be worth less.
While that may sound nice in your head, his value wasn’t low just because they were trading for 4 1/2 months of him. It’s amazing how people don’t realize that this domestic violence incident was a LOT bigger for an organization than just the time missed via suspension.
Explain how the baggage of domestic violence isn’t still attached to him? Just because he doesn’t have the impending suspension hanging over him doesn’t mean he isn’t still labeled as an abuser.
All about perception. He’s far enough away from it now that the heavy majority of people have either forgotten about it or no longer care. The impact that label has right after it happens is SIGNIFICANTLY more damning than it is months later. Not saying it’s right, but that’s just the way it is.
I totally agree but that doesn’t mean he is worth significantly more that what they gave up to get him. 4 prospects outside of the Yankees top 20 then should still not equate to even 1 prospect inside the Cubs, Dodgers, or Nationals top 5.
It does mean that he’s worth significantly more than what they gave up to get him if more teams are in the bidding now. He would’ve gotten significantly more than what the Yankees offered if he didn’t have the domestic violence situation hanging over his head. They were the only team willing to take him, and the Reds happily obliged because they didn’t want to deal with everything. Heck, the Dodgers even backed out of a trade with them. Now that the issue is “in the past” (again, not saying that’s right), all the teams that want/need a dominant reliever are back in the bidding. It’s all about supply and demand, and the demand is significantly higher than it was a few months ago after the incident happened. If the Dodgers wanted to trade for Chapman now, you better believe it’d take a heck of a lot more than the original deal that they backed out of.
The Yankees took the risk and didn’t mind the PR hit. It didn’t work out for them on the field because they have so many other holes, but it’ll more than likely work out for them VERY well in regards to their prospect return.
Right I understand supply and demand. The demand is obviously higher now than it was but that should still not set the bar at Joe Ross which is what the Yankees were asking for. Not saying the Yankees shouldn’t set the bar high in negotiations, but that is beyond high in compared to what they gave up for him. Any team trying to acquire him is going to reference that deal and while acquiring equal or slightly more than than deal is obviously reasonable asking for significantly more is outrageous.
Difference between Arrieta and Chapman is, Arrieta was a reclamation project. He was worth what the cubs gave up. Chapman on the other hand has always been a top closer in the game. The yankees bought him on the assumption he’d be suspended 80 games and they’d only have him for half the year………. pretty much what any team who gets him now is buying him for…. actually less seeing as there is only 2 months left in the season. The Yankees didn’t “buy low” on Chapman, they bought him for an assumed 1/2 season. Any team now is buying him for 1/3 of the season. Why are you people having a hard time grasping the basic logic here? As I said in an earlier reply, Chapman isn’t worth much more than what the Nats gave up last year to get Papelbon – Nick Pivetta, who was the Nat’s 18th best prospect. At the time of the Papelbon trade he actually had better numbers than Chapman has now. But I’m so crazy to think that Chapman isn’t worth much more than a 15th-30th ranked prospect from a team’s farm system. You people and your evaluations of players is insane. Anyone who has a big name in baseball according to most people on here is worth the likes of a Yoan Moncada or Kyle Schwarber. Idiots. All of you.
My guess for Mystery Team is Rangers.
I find it odd that this guy is even still allowed to play baseball, let alone be discussed as a valuable asset. It’s not just the DV incident – remember the thing with the prostitute in the hotel room? There are major character issues with this guy and I can’t quite believe they’ve just been swept under the rug.
It’s that way in all of sports. If you are skilled enough then teams are willing to look past almost anything you have done. Ray Rice not getting a second chance in football has more to do with his age (32 which is old for a running back) than it did with his domestic abuse case. That’s why Greg Hardy played last year and why he still gets tryouts this year. Chapman is one of the 3 best closers in the game and as long as he is worth the risk teams will keep taking the chance on him.
Exactly. If your talent > detriment, you’ll find a roster spot. Matt Bush went to prison and is on an MLB team this year.
Matt Bush has made necessary steps to improve his life. He has much more of a right to play in the MLB than people like Chapman, Jose Reyes, etc.
What? Bush served the punishment that he was given. So did Chapman and Reyes. I’m sorry if you don’t like it, but it is what it is.
Yankees surprise everybody and sends him to Giants
Wow. If they get Joe Ross Cashman has finally earned his salary and actually made a GM move. He turned the pile of crap prospects he gave up for Chapman into a very good starting pitcher. Well done………. .if it gets done.
Why the Nats would be willing to give up Ross is questionable strategy IMO. I don’t get why people are so overvaluing closers. At least to me they are. Why give up a SOLID cost controlled STARTER for a closer? Especially when you already have a good closer in Papelbon? A great backend of the bullpen is great to have……. as long as you have the lead. If I were the Nats I’d be more comfortable trading Giolito for Chapman than Ross. You already know what you have in Ross…… a well…. WELL above average 5th starter in your rotation. Giolito on the other hand……. who knows. I’d rather keep the known good starter in the 23 year old Ross than gamble with keeping the unknown skill level of 22 year old Giolito. That’s just me though. Actually, if it was me, I’d offer two random, no name prospects. I mean if the Yankees can get him for 4 crap minor leaguers/AAAA type players in the winter, why would he be worth more now?
First of all the article said that it’s nearly impossible that there’s “no chance” the Nats will trade Ross for a rental.
Second, you called Ross a well above average 5th starter…5th starter?? Really?? He’s a 2nd or 3rd starter, not a 5th.
Lastly, Giolito is THE NUMBER ONE PROSPECT IN BASEBALL. Enough said. He has the potential of an ace, although you may not know exactly what you’re getting with him there’s a really good chance he’ll become a front of the rotation starter barring any major injuries or setbacks.
Stop trying to rationalize with someone who knows nothing about baseball – it’s a losing fight.
Hey genius…. look where he is pitching in the Nats rotation. He’s their 5th starter. He pitches well above your average 5th starter, no? So therefore he is a WELL above average 5th starter. Look at Kyle Hendricks on the Cubs. Has like the 3rd best ERA in MLB, and has better career numbers than Ross. Yet he is the Cubs 5th starter. He too is a WELL above average 5th starter.
My God. You people on here are obsessed with prospect rankings. Giolito is the #1 prospect? According to which subjective list? I mean, it’s completely unheard of for top tier prospects to be busts, obviously. I mean it’s never happened in the history of the game. Right Jurickson Profar…… Dylan Bundy…… Matt Moore, and a laundry list of other former top 1-5 prospects. Giolito hasn’t exactly hit the ground running either with his 6 walks in 7.2 IP across 2 disappointing starts. Yes it’s insanely early, but if I had to pick between Ross and Giolito right now I’d pick Ross immediately.
You people clearly have a hard time comprehending the written word. No wonder the one guy earlier in this thread cried about me “writing too much.” Dealing with simpletons here.
Prospects can bust. Thank you for that revelation. The bust rate is factored into their value. If they never busted, they’d never be traded, because cost controlled, pre-arb players are the most valuable players in baseball.
The fact that they might bust is offset by the potential value that they contribute for very little pay. Every team knows this and every fan should take the time to actually understand this idea.
At one point in time, every American player and most every player in MLB was considered a prospect.
It’s apparently a revelation for wag2. I don’t get what your telling me other than stuff I already know and stated. Read the actual thread of comments before you try to educate and enlighten people.
So remember how I said “barring any major injuries”?? Well I hate to break it to you but all 3 players you named had major injuries that forced them to miss at least a year…Bundy underwent TJ surgery but has been good when healthy…Moore was an all star who won 17 games before having TJ surgery…and Profar missed a year but has been a solid player when healthy and is currently a top of the order hitter with a .290 average for the Rangers. Also Bundy and Profar are 23 and have a long time to reach their potential. So although none of those players are Mike Trouts right now, none of them have been a total bust like you made them sound like.
OK, how about Mike Montgomery. He was as high as the 19th best prospect in MLB according to Baseball America’s arbitrary list. Bit of a bust don’t you think? Already has lost the faith of the Rays, was almost cut from the Mariners before deciding to throw him in their pen due to injuries to their bullpen arms. He’s had a good first 4 months of the year this year as a reliever…….. but as far as the 19th best prospect in baseball as a starting pitcher……. BUST. Andrew Miller I’d say is also a bust. Yes he has put together 3 or so solid seasons as a reliever, but he was supposed to be a top tier SP. He sucked so bad as a starter though, but I’ll give Detroit, Miami, and Boston credit for trying so dam hard to make him into a viable starter. 6 failed ML seasons as a starter, like 5.79 ERA in 359 IP bad over those first 6 seasons. It’s amazing how in such a short time he has gained do much hype around himself people have all but forgotten he was a bust of a SP. His first 2 years in the pen really weren’t anything too terribly special either. It’s really only been since 2014 when he got to the level he’s at now. That said, here are some more top prospects that failed to live up to expectations/busted.
2007 #1 Daisuke Matsuzaka…………… smh
2007 #3 Delmon Young……….. so mediocre he is still a free agent at the age of 30
2007 #4 Phil Hughes…….. look at that, another bust of a pitcher in the top 5.
2007 #5 Homer Bailey……. ANOTHER pitcher, Reds fans can lie to themselves all they want, a 4.19 ERA and a 1.31 WHIP for a career is pretty mediocre on the verge of bad if not there already
2008 #3 Joba Chamberlain…………. big ol’ bust
2008 #4 Clay Buchholz……… So bad.
2008 #6 Cameron Maybin………. BOOOOM…… that was the sound of a bust.
2009, Matt Wieters was the #1 prospect. He’s got a career .257 BA, .319 OBP, and a .740 OPS. In the 4 years pre-injury, those averages were even worse, so you can’t use your injury excuse on him
2009 #3 prospect Colby Rasmus. .240 hitter with a .310 OBP and a .750 OPS…… I’d hardly call that top notch.
2009 #4, Tommy Hanson……. slowly got worse as his unfortunately cut short career moved along.
2009 #5 (2010 #1) Jason Heyward………. how’d he turn out? People love telling Cubs fans what a bum he is……. so I’m guessing he’s a flop.
2009 #6 Travis Snider………… pretty much the same stats as Rasmus, oddly though Rasmus has stayed in a lineup regularly and Snider hasn’t. Baseball is weird that way. One’s too bad to be an everyday starter, Travis, and the other is an everyday starter, Rasmus. Both are .240 hitters with .310 OBPs. Snider has been cast aside and is rotting in the Royals system now.
2010 #4 Jesus Montero……… doesn’t even play in America anymore.
2010 #5 Brian Matusz………. bombed
2010 #6 Desmond Jennings…….. never lived up to the Crawford comparison hype. Not even close.
These aren’t players I’d say are “untouchable” as they were likely called when they were prospects. That’s why when it comes to Ross and Giolito I’d wave bye-bye to Giolito if I had to make a choice. Notice how so many top ranked pitchers tend to fall flat. I just looked at the top 10 in each year on baseball america’s website. I picked the ones I clearly call busts and anyone who tries to rationalizes otherwise is just making a fool of themselves. So again, if the Nats were so dead set on getting Chapman and had to choose between Giolito or Ross in order to get him…… I’d stick with Ross 100% without even really giving it much thought.
Just go through the 2007 list. SOOOOOO many failed expectations on the list. Sure you’ll come across a star once in a while, but a majority of the list is just flat out mediocrity to sh**.
baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-1…
Looking at the 2007 draft Top 10.
#2 Alex Gordon
#6 Cameron Maybin
#7 Evan Longoria
#9 Justin Upton
#10 Andrew Miller
Point is, both sides of the argument can cherry pick. This exercise can be done with each year, but is time consuming, so I’ll let you do your own research. Cheers.
Yeah it’s easy to find a lot of players that haven’t become the best in the game, it’s also easy to find a lot that have:
Josh Hamilton
Josh Beckett
Mark Teixeira
Joe Mauer
Bryce Harper
Kris Bryant
Corey Seager
Also all mine are #1s, not top 5…I thought it was fitting because we’re talking about a #1 prospect here, not a top 5. Obviously not every player becomes the superstar that number one prospects are all hyped up to be…but in general, a majority of #1 prospects become solid mlb players, if you take away the ones who got injured(because everyone is prone to injuries…even Ross) then the number of successful #1s increases even more
Just go through the 2014 top 50…SOOOOOOO many solid players who have met their expectations or surpassed them
Very true…I just want KB to see the significance of being the #1 prospect. Gotta show both sides
This is possibly the most arbitrary and disjointed list ever assembled of anything, so I feel silly responding to it. But anyway:
Miller is the best relief pitcher in baseball. Matusz, Hanson, Wieters, Bailey all had TJ surgery. Maybin has been very good when healthy.
It’s quite easy to make a list when all you do is find the ones that busted or got hurt; confirmation bias. I remember the Padres took a guy named Donovan Tate in the first round in 2009. He was a bust. The Angels picked a guy #25 who turned out to not be a bust. This kind of selective listing doesn’t prove or disprove anything.
Was Kris Bryant ever a #1?
Trolling hard af..
You must have loved Vogelbach for Montgomery..
Oops that was for KB’s troll post..
Dodgers or Nationals. In the rental market the Cubs are looking for blue light specials.
FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal reports that the Cubs are “strong in mix” for Aroldis Chapman.
Source: “Floodgates Open”
I doubt they give up Schwarber though
Schwarber, Man with no position.
Even without a position a pre arbitration young left handed power hitter is way to much for 2 months of any relief pitcher.
they wouldn’t give him up for Miller, why would they ever give him up to rent Chapman?
People here need to think
Agreed, unless Miller or Betances is involved as well, Schwarber isn’t going anywhere
People here never think. Ask a Yankee fan and they’ll tell you Schwarber isn’t enough for 2 months of Chapman. They’ll need at least someone like Yoan Moncada. He’s the #1 prospect in baseball after all and you know arbitrary rankings always ring true.
(laying the sarcasm on thick……. have a feeling most people in this thread probably wouldn’t catch it, they’ve already established they have a difficult time comprehending the english language. Must be a lot of Puerto Rican – NYers in this thread)
Lol. Schwarber would not bring back Moncada
And no Yankee fan said Chapman would bring back Schwarber
And earlier you talked about obsession. It seems you’re obsessed about the Yankees return for Chapman. You seem angry that they might get something back better in value than what they gave up. Why that pisses you off I have no clue unless you’re bitter about it for whatever reason.
If he’s traded he will land in Chicago.
Interesting… from the reports, it sounds as though the Nationals can get him right now if they want. However, I don’t think you can justify Joe Ross for 2 months of Chapman. Mike Rizzo has never been one to completely overpay. HOwever, Chapman has always been the one that got away from Rizzo. He was sure he signed him from Cuba before the Reds got him at the last minute. We’ll see what he does. Maybe expand the deal to include Joe Ross if the Yankees add Gardner or something to that effect.
What do you think about Wade Davis for Joe Ross? Not sure if the nats would need to add a another lower pitching prospect so the royals can add pitching depth they lost last year in there trades to win it all.
Chapman is highest paid closer in baseball and is making $11.25 million. Miller is highest paid set up man and is making $9 million. The market has dictated top-end back of the pen talent to be worth a combined $20 million.
The Yankees think Schwarber is a 50 home run guy. Chris Davis is a 50 home run guy. The market gave him $23 million.
Sorry. But the market dictated that the highest paid closer and the highest paid set up man is worth less than 50 home runs … Yankees fans are completely ignoring the market with Schwarber requests. You want a potential 50 homer bat, then you can’t expect to get it just for Chapman or just for Miller …
well the nationals are off the table, I think it will be the cubs or rangers getting chapman
Agree with the idea of the post, but Miller would get more than 9 now and chapman more than 11.25 this offseason.
LMAO at Schwarber being a 50 homerun guy talk about hyping up a prospect.
I don’t think Chapman for Schwarber straight up is too bad for Cubs if you guys really want to end this curse.
You guys are getting 44 strikeouts in 31..1 innings with a .89 whip to go along with it.
If you want to be cheap and get lesser options go ahead we’ll get the right offer even tho he’s a rental he’s the best player aside from Chris Sale on the market.
“even tho he’s a rental he’s the best player aside from Chris Sale on the market”
Debatable .
“I don’t think Chapman for Schwarber straight up is too bad for Cubs if you guys really want to end this curse.”
Let me guess, you’re a Yankees fan? Chapman doesn’t guarantee anything. Speaking about him like acquiring him makes some tremendous difference in the cubs’ odds of winning a ws shows how little understanding you have of how the playoffs tend to unfold.
I agree Chapman doesn’t guarantee anything. However, Schwarber doesn’t guarantee anything either. But there’s Zero chance the Cubs give him up for Chapman.
Schwarber gives you an extra 5 years to get you something … Chapman gives you 2 months.
And Chapman gives the Cubs greater chances to win the 2016 WS. Schwarber doesn’t. But as I stated , Cubs won’t and shouldn’t do that deal.
Those are reports of what Cashman thinks Schwarber is … And yes, a lot of it is based off the short porch at Yankee Stadium. I didn’t pull that idea out of thin air.
Additionally this guy hit 21 homers in his first 309 career plate appearances at the big league level. That’s a pace of 41 homers spread out over a full season of 600 plate appearances. And that doesn’t even take into consideration easily attainable improvement that comes from experience nor does it take into account what he could do with that short porch at Yankee Stadium. There’s a reason Cashman thinks he can hit 50 per year for the Yankees. He’s got a special power bat. But you don’t acquire special power bats for short-term relief options no matter how good they are.
Given the awesome ability of Chapman and coupled with the competition to get him – I’d say the most the Cubs should be offering right now is two players… One from a group consisting of Jaimer Candalario, Eloy Jimenez, and Duane Underwood. Plus they can have Adam Warren back.
Are you guys stupid or even read what you post?
First off Chap for Swarb won’t happen – IF the Cubs turned down Miller for Swarb which they DID, why in the world would you take a rental instead. Chapman or not. That just stupid and the Yank laugh all the way to the bank. The Cubs would swap Swarb for Miller first, which they didn’t. You guys post some really stupid post sometimes.
#2 Chapman or Miller is not the answer to bringing the world series to Chicago. It could help no doubt. But is not a 100% in stone. Miller can pitch just as bad then as he did in the ASG. Strop and Rhondo can have perfect games as theyahave done many times. So to even say without them will cost the Cubs a WS. Your not very bright are you. Miller and Chap didn’t even bring NY to the play offs – So you think it will make a +11 game WAR difference in the play offs. – Get real. I love to have them but I have them but not just throwing money out their on something that not 100% and really will probably make very little difference.. Theo will figure it out. There is a week left time.
will tell. .- The Yanks thought they could get a King Ransome for Miller and no one bite. So now they can have him and still be a 4th place team. Chap will not bring back 3 – 4 prospects on a rental only to sign somewhere else this Winter. Want 3 prospects – Sign and tade Yanks if you ahve the balls.
I guess they read my post and are doing a sign and trade. hahaha See how that worked out LMAO
This is a very tunnel visioned approach to looking at an issue which has multiple factors. I’ll just offer one and leave the rest to the others. Schwarber is PROJECTED to hit 40 HRs (or 50 as you say), Chris Davis has ACTUALLY hit 50 HRs, once only btw. There is a huge difference there.
Since we’re both so pro free market, let’s just sit back and see the market dictate what Chapman is worth. The multiple teams involved will drive up the price for each other. Yay free market!
Chapman isn’t the highest paid closer in baseball, Papelbon is. David Robertson even gets paid more (although by only about $150,000). This will all change when he becomes a free agent after this year, because he’ll definitely get a contract worth more AAV than Papelbon’s.
Spotrac has Papelbon and Robertson st $11 million this year…. Maybe it’s wrong.
Why is Chapman worth more than then ‘talent’ it cost to acquire him earlier this year ?
Maybe he’s a proven commodity ?
Maybe teams that have a window to possibly win a Pennant / World Series would like to capitalize on a top talent to bolster their ‘window-of-opportunity” ?
Some really tough questions to grind out, no ?
It is all economics. Supply and demand. This might be a dumb question but why would the Nats want him. Their bullpen is solid.
They don’t trust Pap
Chapman to the Cubs for Adam Warren and a prospect.
The Yankees won’t do that.
Yankees definitely aren’t doing that, unless it’s a top 7 prospect.
That be a fair deal on a rental
Mark Zagunis for Chapman. If the Cubs give up any more than that Theo and Hoyer have turned into Billy Beane when he coughed up Russell and McKinney (and Straily) for Samardzija and Hammel. Don’t be Billy Beane, Hoyer/Theo – look what’s happened to that team since.
Over paying for rentals rarely works out. Hoyer and Theo need to hold onto their prospects for next year. Arrieta, Lackey, and Hammel will be free agents post-2017 (assuming they pick up Hammel’s option this offseason). They need to trade their prospects for top pitching prospects/young SPs if not now, next year. Not friggin relievers. So worried they’re going to bust their nut over him and over pay though. If the Montgomery deal is any indication I wouldn’t be shocked if they coughed up Almora, Happ, or Torres for Chapman…….. it will be a sad day if that’s the case. Only saving grace if they give up a prospect of that caliber is if they immediately sign Chapman to a 4 year deal.
Not going to lie though, a Strop, Rondon, Chapman closing three would be sweet, but likely at too steep a cost.
If they want Chapman their going to need to give up more than Zagunis. Cubs will have to give up a top 10 prospect, possibly top 5. Typical Cubs fan, thinking there farm system is so deep that they can get the best rental closer coveted by multiple teams for their #18 prospect. I can definitely see Chapman for Happ or Almora because thats what it will possibly take.
I never said I think they can get him for that. I am saying that is all I’d offer. Quit reading what you want to read and actually read what I wrote. Comprehension is not strong in this thread. You’re not alone.
If I’m the Cubs I’m all over happ for chapman. The bullpen is then set.
Been over 100 years since the Cubs won a World Series. Giving up one prospect to make the bullpen so much better is peanuts.
No. It’s not. It’s short sighted. Adding a reliever like Chapman doesn’t improve your chance to win a WS all that much. Sustained playoff appearances are how you maximize your chances of winning a ws title.
This idea that the cubs should be hot to trot to win right now is old. They have a team that is set up to contend for many years. They are not in a short window where they must win now before their main pieces depart
So you think giving up Happ or even Schwarber will cripple the Cubs for the future? You are aware that the Cubs are leading the division with absolutely ZERO contribution from either player this season, right? They are both good prospects, but there are tons of good prospects. There are not tons of 105 MPH throwing relievers. Even if they fail this year, giving up 1-2 prospects for a chance is not going to cripple this franchise.
No. I think the opportunity cost that comes with dealing them for Chapman hurts their future potential.
You understand what value is, right? Giving up a top 50 prospect for chapman is stupid. The fact that you’d even try to rationalize giving up schwarber for a chapman rental is embarrassing.
Why does it matter how hard he throws? Shouldn’t it be far more important how effective he is and even more so, how much his effectiveness actually increases a teams chance of winning?
I agree that giving up 1-2 prospects isn’t going to cripple them, but just because that is the case doesn’t mean you throw them away to add a marginal upgrade to an already good team.
Perhaps you missed the whole “compete for multiple years” thing.
Theo not stupid. The Cubs may say F^%K IT and throw their cash at him in the Winter. It not like we need him 100% – Really if he goes to Cleveland it is a victory anyway.
Funny people said we needed Price – See how his 217 Million doing this year. For that Boston better win a WS.
Miller Arz farm is gone, Atlanta laughing while S Miller sits in AAA and Arz begging someone to take him.
Zack haha on the DL 206 Million 34.5 for the next 6 years. Now Arz want to trade him while he is still haha young if 32 is young – Why cause they know at 33 now you have 172.5 Million to explain why someone should take him. At 34 103 Million, at 35 70 Million, Good Luck –
So for people to say this guy will bring you the WS or bring you over the top is just plain stupid thinking.
You know who should be laughing. WASH for signing Murphy. While all those idiot teams were fighting over Price, Zack G, Umpton, Zimmerman, Davis, Gordon, Jeff S aka Sharkkkk LMAO and Yes Heyward.
Who got deals Wash = Murphy
Cubs Fowler
Sometimes it is ok to take the long shot it might come in.
Come on Dodgers
Fedde is the floor. Wow! Indians have a higher offer out. Could it be Bradley, or as high as one of their top 2 OFs?
Clevinger would probably beat that offer and be more in line with what the Yankees are looking for that is a pretty steep over pay but both teams are in a position to overpay from a position of strength
You’re right. Clevinger would be more in line with what the Yankees would want. I hope Kaminsky is in the mix as well as the secondary prospect. Yankees were linked to him on draft day before Cards took him and we then took Ian Clarkin.
I really hope it’s not fedde. The guy is 23 and still in single A.
If Cleveland can get Aroldis Chapman without giving up Clevinger, Zimmer or Frazier my hat is off to them, and they probably become instant WS favorites. Adding the best reliever in baseball to a team thats already 14 games over .500? Watch out.
Allen/Chapman best relief combo in baseball if they can get him
Better than Betances and Miller?
That’s close, but I think chapman is better than Miller and Betances and Allen are about the same I think. So I’d have to give Chapman/Allen the edge
They are all A+ relievers, they are basically the best 4 or 6 relievers in the game. You’re splitting hairs here, its entirely personal preference.
Indians/Cubs WS is on deck, can we handle that?
Don’t do it Cleveland, not worth the price tag when you have other needs that could be filled cheaper.
Wow. So much to give up for just two months of a closer. IMO this is a redundant move for Washington. Their pen is pretty stellar as is, and I’m pretty sure they already have the best bullpen ERA in the game. This would be like the Nationals trading for Chris Sale, Actually, them trading for Sale makes more sense because Gonzalez has been awful and Sale would be a significant upgrade.
All I can say is, If this is the ridiculous price I hope Ricketts and his brother are sitting on both Theo and Hoyer, pinning them to the ground so they can’t get to their phones. Yelling at them, “Save the prospects for starting pitchers you fools!!”
Not to sound rude , but why are you so ticked off of the possible return package for Chapman? You seem to be so pissed the Yankees are getting more in value than what they gave up.
Agreed, much to give up for a quick rental who will walk away in 2 months with no compensation.
I don’t see why the Yankees would turn down that offer from the Nats.
Exactly. Fedde is a great get for Chapman. I don’t see why they would turn that down, or even worse, turn down a Clevinger package Indians would have offered to beat the Nats package.
Glover throws gas, he could throw the 7th for the Yanks, Fedde is a year or two away.
Fedde is 23 and still in single A. I don’t care if he’s rated 60 something, the guy will be 25/26 when he gets the call up to the majors. Id rather have the draft pick and take the chance on a young 18/19 year old.
thats just because he had the TJ surgery when picked.
he’ll be up by age 25, but why would that be a dealbreaker? you’d have him under team control for ages 25-32. sounds good to me.
Hope the Yanks get either Clevenger and Shefield or Fedde, Glover, and Bostick. Yankees should pull the trigger on this deal.
Who says no?
Chapman
Miller
Beltran
For
Zimmer
Frazier
Aiken
Indians wouldn’t go for two rentals, maybe if you switch Severino for Chapman.
No
Seems like a disconnect between Cashman and Hal, why would they want the best offer of teams if they’re not ready to move on it.
I suspect this is just a fabrication from Cashman, giving him more time to evaluate the trade alternatives.
Been following this way too intensely since last night. Stop wasting my time, Steinbrenner!!!!
Chapman is the MLB equivalent of Herschel Walker. Forget the long term viability of your franchise for a remote prospect of winning now. You’ve got to get through 8 innings in each game to get to him. Chapman’s not worth the prospects. Any team that weakens their farm system for a rental one inning pitcher is making a horrible decision. No closer in the history of the game ever guaranteed a championship. Rivera didn’t help Torre
Get the net, couldn’t disagree more
“Rivera didn’t help Torre”
LOL. Spoken like a fan of a team who hasn’t won anything since Polio was the leading cause of death in America.
Also, I’d hope you realize there are many prospects who never even sniff the majors. You honestly don’t have a clue.
Also, I’d hope you realize that even if they are just prospects, they still hold intrinsic value, regardless of whether they ultimately reach the majors. You honestly don’t have a clue.
Lol, value it would seem to trade for closers. Which is what you do when you’re the favorite the win the World Series. You honestly don’t have a clue.
My post was truncated. Rivera didn’t help Torre in the ALCS in ’04. Thanks for the reminder as to why I don’t post.
Yeah but read. There not doing the deal as a rental. Think Theo si stupid. READ MAN READ. BREATH RELAX. High A 10 years blocked, yanks wont see him for 3 – 4 years your crying about the best reliever who signing a 4 year deal. Come on man. Good thing todays game wasn’t 5-5 in the bottom of the ninth. I rest my case.
Torres scratched. Wow. Could be a huge get for Yankees if there’s a connection between Torres being scratched and all the Chapman talk … Of course, there’s always the possibility that Torres set his uniform on fire and got sent home.
Jon Heyman reported that the Cubs are willing to give up Torres and another prospect for Chapman.
ESPN is reporting Yankees close to Trading Chapman so Torres could be part of deal. Maybe other Yankees to like a SP.
So this isn’t a uniform debacle?
Torres scratched.
Heyman said there’s an offer. Torres Plus for Chapman.
Yeah, he didn’t say another prospect, but plus. Maybe Adam Warren would be the plus.
Hope its Richards LMAO
If they trade Torres for Chapman I will be furious.
That’s not a bad trade. Torres is nice but he’s in A ball. Chapman isn’t coming over to give you 1/3 of a season in relief. He’s coming over because in a playoff situation he can shorten the game by one inning. Not many people can do that.
CUBS GOT HIM BOYS!
This can’t be true. Gleyber is way more valuable than anything the Reds got in return for Chapman, AND they might be sending more to the Yankees? Crazy.
(SARCASM)
Hahaha!
Lol
Cubs want Yankees to give Chapman an extension first it seems.
Where you seeing that??? If that was the case the Yankees would just keep him or ask for more
Torres isn’t enough IMO if that’s the case.
Cubs wont do the deal wo a 4 year bid. Torres is High A and Blocked 3 ways so you knew that was coming.. Really it what i would have done at this point. – But WO the extention than the deal not happening. Yanks won’t see Torres for at least 3 years if not more.
If the Cubs are giving Torres plus chapman better resign
chicubbies85 – Theo not stupid. LOL The Cubs would not make this deal without the sign and trade, Theo wants 4 years! If the Cubs get 4 years sign and trade this deal is perfect. Don’t cry about a HIGH A top prospect blocked by 10 years. Theo not stupid. The man knows how to deal. Ask Red Sox.
What would it take for Cardinals to jump in and get chapman?
Wainofan – Nothing it over
Dang, sounds like it’s going to be the Cubs. That sucks. We could really use one reliever. But that’s ok. Hopefully we get a Starter and a outfielder. And when I say we I mean Dodgers. I like to act like I’m part of the team since I’ve been a fan for almost 30 years now lol. If it is the Cubs good for them. I like that they have turned things around. If it’s not my Dodgers I hope it’s the Cubs this year winning it all.
Thank You. I work in LA when I do film work so LA is my 2nd favourite team. But born and raised in Chicago. Haters and Trolls will say what they will on this trade. There was no winning team people will either say he was over paid or that was a stupid deal. Yank fans cried that the Cubs didn’t pull the Miller Swarb deal. So no win or loss on these boards. Glad it was Cubs, but the Cubs and Theo are not stupid. Without that 4 year extention there will be no deal. That is the only thing that will keep it from a big red breaking news on your computer screen. If the Cubs get Chapman with that 4 year extention than any prospect was worth it. Even our #1 who blocked 10 years anyway and in High A so who cares.
Hal Steinbrenner needs to realize the season is lost and that rebuilding for next year (and a few more) is the best decision for his team.
Thank you Flubbies, now Cleveland can look elsewhere for help that won’t walk away in a couple months.
If Cleveland is anything like the polish they’ll keep their prospects till they retire
Hilarious…brilliant…