In a stunning reversal, the Cubs have re-signed outfielder Dexter Fowler to a one-year deal with a mutual option for 2017, tweets Mark Gonzales of the Chicago Tribune. He’ll receive $8MM in 2016. The mutual option is for $9MM with a $5MM buyout (tweet). The Cubs have placed Zac Rosscup on the 60-day DL to make room on the 40-man roster.
Recent reports had Fowler agreeing to a three-year, $33MM deal with the Orioles, but Fowler denies he ever agreed to terms per Gordon Wittenmyer of the Chicago Sun-Times (tweet). Jon Morosi of Fox Sports (tweet) confirms the Orioles did not believe they had a deal in place with Fowler.
The signing reportedly fell through when Fowler demanded an early opt out after one season, tweets Bruce Levine of 670thescore.com. Per Jon Heyman (tweet), the Orioles did not want to lose a first round pick (compensation for Wei-Yin Chen) to sign a player for one season. When Baltimore balked, he turned down the $33MM guarantee for $13MM from Chicago.
The re-acquisition of Fowler also puts a new light on the Chris Coghlan trade which was announced about a half hour ago. The Cubs will now lose their second round draft pick for signing John Lackey. When Fowler appeared to be Baltimore-bound, they would have lost the associated compensation pick.
The addition of Fowler will give the Cubs plenty of outfield flexibility. They could opt to move Jason Heyward to his natural position of right field. Jorge Soler and Kyle Schwarber may share left field or another arrangement could be reached. Given that Fowler isn’t viewed as a positive defensive center fielder, it’s possible Heyward will remain penciled in up the middle. The club now has a wealth of outfield depth with Ben Zobrist and Javier Baez also in the mix for reps. At the press conference announcing the deal, GM Theo Epstein told reporters, “this is it. We’re not trading anyone else. We feel great about our outfield mix.”
Fowler’s high OBP profile should fit well anywhere within the Cubs lineup. Heyward and Zobrist are also candidates to bat first and second with Anthony Rizzo, Kris Bryant, Schwarber, and Soler as middle of the order threats. Fowler batted .250/.346/.411 with 17 home runs and 20 stolen bases in 2015. The switch-hitter has a history of better on base percentages including a career .363 OBP. His return takes pressure off Schwarber and Soler to perform at high levels.
It’s interesting to note that Fowler is now guaranteed less than the $15.8MM qualifying offer. The mutual option as structured appears very unlikely to be triggered by both sides. Way back in November, MLBTR’s Tim Dierkes predicted a four-year, $60MM contract for Fowler. Assuming the option is declined, Fowler will re-enter free agency prior to his age 31 season.
Photo courtesy of USA Today Sports Images.
What’s next, Gallardo back to Texas?
Breaking news: MLB cancels season! Cubs too good!
Okay, bad joke.
Fowler really wants to have fun this year. It’s worth $20 million to him.
He will get it back next year. Weak FA class and a ring in his hand. Plenty young enough
No..he will enter the 2016 off season as a top FA rather than a mid tier FA like this year.
Love the name ray. That guy had one of my favorite morning shows growing up.
I’m looking forward to the season.
….What is happening?
What
What
My jaw just hit the floor!
True.
This is a shocker but it also helps the cubs, heyward can now move to right or left, and folwer back to center
But, why block Soler?
Soler could be trade bait to bring back a pitcher or a bullpen arm
Yeah, the Cubs are not done, unless Fowler is in RF, Solar in LF, and Schwarber being Catcher and maybe LF at times..
Unless Solar goes next for a Starter (which I think the Cubs are still lacking)
They’re not moving Ross, I can;t imagine who would want 2 years of Montero…so I doubt Schwarber is full time catcher.
Sorry I mean if Heyward moves to RF
Soler for carrasco Ross or Tampa bay arm? Fowler stop gap for Almora McKinney ? Montero here for 2 years until contreras up
calm down cub fans. clev isnt going to hand a sp over for soler. neither is tb.
If the cubs offered maybe Schwarber in a package for sonny gray?
I could easily see a Soler-for-Tyson Ross deal (and more, possibly).
I just find Epstein’s remark about how no one else is going to be moved a bit interesting as they have a log jam in the OF, unless Schwarber really is headed behind the plate.
I also do not agree with this notion of having players playing musical chairs with their positions, it rarely works out for the player IMO.
Soler has been offered for these pitchers all off-season, but there have been no bites. I can’t imagine something changes just as players are reporting. But it doesn’t need to change now. Will SD hold on to Ross if they’re 15 games out of 1st place at the deadline? My guess is no. And not only will Soler be a very expendable piece in July, but it’s hard to imagine there will be many teams offering a player with more potential.
I disagree with the player flexibility comment. It worked well for Tampa Bay, and it worked well last year.
Did it now? I forget, how many rings does Tampa have? Most times it works out well IF you want a ton of ‘super utility’ guys on your club that all wind up middling at best. For many players, they need to be comfortable in their position before they can get comfortable at the plate, and you cannot do that by moving players all over the field IMO. I want to see excellent players at one their position instead of being average or slightly above but being able to be in multiple positions. A couple of Ute guys are fine, but not as regular players..
The Cubs are going to have so much fun this year. They will be comfortable.
Nope…. Will be platooned in left. Ability to rest guys a lot
“Musical chairs” is manager Joe Maddon’s favorite game. Not to worry. If healthy, all four of the regular outfielders will appear in at least 140 games and get a minimum of 450-500 plate appearances each. It’s his m.o. and will keep everybody fresh for the postseason.
If an injury occurs to one of the OF’s, the Cubs will still have 3 starters to trot out there each game. If the rotation sustains an injury or the back-end of Jason Hammel or Kyle Hendricks pitch poorly, the Cubs will have more quality OF depth to help bring in a significant addition by the summer trade deadline.
Wilson Contreras will be in the league soon enough. Projected # 1 catcher in the minors.
It’s only one year. Maybe they would rather stall Soler’s service time or they feel he isn’t ready. It’s depth either way. Unless they have a trade pending for Soler or someone else.
How about Soler plus a couple prospects for Carrasco Salazar or one of the rays pitchers?
Soler has a long team friendly deal
He does but he is also valuable for bringing in a solid number 2 pitcher and the cubs could sure use another pitcher.
Soler is way too much to give up for Carrasco….don’t ever think they’d do that
Know it’s been talked about for quite a while now, but i’m wondering if these moves are a precursor to the anticipated larger deal for a Rays SP…possibly something like Odorizzi for Schwarber or Soler – which I’d have serious mixed feelings about…
Hahaha. I hope you aren’t serious.
Somebody tweeted on high heat with chris russo for man bites dog, and they made a trade, Soler to the braves for julio teheran ? would you do that trade?
Carrasco is way too much to give up for Soler…don’t ever think they’d do that.
Two Things……..
Soler can Opt-Out of his contract financials and be Arbitration eligible once he has 3 years of service time. Sending him down for a couple months would delay that from happening in 2017….so maybe Chris is correct.
Theo said that they are “Done Trading Players”…..and that morethan likely, there could be a platoon in LF between Schwarber / Soler. Schwarber will get more PT because he can catch once a week in addition to playing LF. They traded Coghlan today as well (to the A’s), so they simply performed an Upgrade of their 4 best OF.
I originally didn’t think the Cubs should sign him, but at $8 million……it was probably worth it.
No Carrasco is way too much to give up for Soler…Tribe hangs up at that offer
Who’s suggesting Jorge Soler in a straight swap for Carlos Carrasco? Soler and another MLB ready player or prospects makes sense. Even with all their promotions of high level prospects to the 25-man active roster in the past year and a half, the Cubs still have 6 of the top-100 minor league players to potentially deal in addition to MLB ready infield and outfield depth.
Carrasco is hardly their only target either. His teammate Danny Salazar may be another, to say nothing of Jake Odorizzi or Drew Smyly from the Rays, Jose Quintana from the White Sox, Tyson Ross from the Padres or a host of other pitchers that may be available between now and the summer trade deadline. Potential aces like Chris Sale, Jose Fernandez and Sonny Gray may also be potentially available targets at some point. What team in MLB is better equipped than the Cubs to pull off a trade for any of them without significantly hampering their chances to win in the short or long term?
Trade in the works?
Shady
mind blown…..what does that mean for soler?? no way he signs a 1 year deal to be a backup…..what is happening?!?!
Trade coming?
What the heck happened?
Schwarber/Soler trade coming?
Please stop. The Cubs are NOT trading Schwarber.
Well he did add in Soler lol
Unless for an AL #2 rotation guy, you’re right
What if Schwarber was traded for Sonny Gray
YOU need to please stop acting like you know what’s going to happen!
Soler can play in left or right against tough left handlers. He can play left in the 20 games that Schwarber catches. Maddon will find enough playing time for everyone and keep them fresh. Having too many good outfielders is not a problem.
Dear Lord, that lineup…
Where would he go in the lineup though?
Leadoff easily
CF – Fowler
2B- Zobrist
1B- Rizzo
3B – Bryant
RF – Heyward
LF – Schwarber
C- Montero
SS – Russell
Bench: C – Ross; IF – La Stella; IF/OF – Baez; OF – Soler or Szczur?
Arrieta/Lester/Lackey/Hammel/Hendricks
Rondon/Strop/Grimm/Wood/Cahill/Ramirez/Warren
Not much different from last years team other than the addition of an overrated and overpaid OF in Heyward and a 37 year old pitcher coming off one of the best years of his life in Lackey. I get that the Cubs are on the up and up but they are a bit over hyped this year. Let not forget that the they are in a division with the Pirates and the Cardinals who are not going anywhere. Also the Cardinals won 100 games last year with basically their AAA team. So many injuries yet they pulled off 100 games. Not to mention the emergence of Piscotty. The Cubs rotation needs work and Im sure they will get it in a trade mid season with their dept in the OF. It would be impossible for Arietta to repeat the season he had last year and he is a large reason for their success. No to mention the dreadful “sophomore slump”. Too many rookies on that team no assume they will all had an above to elite 2016 season. Not trying to bash the cubs here just being realistic with all the hype. 4-1 odd to win the World Series??? Really, even Vega is buying into the hype. Either way should make for some great baseball. Glad to see the rivalry is back and the Pirates in the mix should make it a triple threat!
Hm, Redbird you and your cardinals sound a bit butthurt about this offseason.
Man when you see it on paper…. Wow
And Zobrist…
Cubs outplayed themselves in 2015
Cards outplayed themselves in 2015
But who improved for 2016?
Could be because the CUBS have the best lineup in MLB, Top 5 pitching staffs(starters and pen). Deep bench, depth….. STACKED
Not really, its simple economics. I honestly didnt see the point in the Cardinals to pay Heyward (our #7 hitter) a 200 Million contract. I am glad to see the cubs overpay for him. I felt the same way with Pujols at the time and now ESPN is calling his contract the worst in history. Im excited for the Cardinals and what they did this off season. They are allowing some young talent to get their chance and not trying to but a WS. They have plenty on money to spend if needed but why not take a look at what they have and continue their success. Im simply pointing out the fact that the Cubs are good however not much better than they were last year thus they are being over hyped. The only thing I can admit to being upset about this year is losing out on David Price, I thought that would be azamzing!
You’re forgetting that Heyward is one day younger than Anthony Rizzo. At 26 years old, you can’t compare a declining Pujols to him
“the Cardinals who are not going anywhere.”
Your words.
Too bad the games are not actually played on paper. Just remember how everyone KNEW the Nationals were the team to beat in 2015. Then many teams beat them. The term sophomore slump has been around for generations and the Cubs have many opportunities to keep it going in 2016. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them win the Central, but I also wouldn’t be that surprised to see them with a worse record that 2015 either.
I’ll take winning the Central with a worse record.
#7 hitter? Did he not bat in the 3 4 or 5 for the Cards in most games?
Cardinals fans are always going to hate on the cubs, won’t matter if we are the favorites for the world series or not this year.
Wow! Cards gave up Shelby Miller under control for 4 years for 1 year of their “#7 hitter?!?” Pretty dumb. Even dumber is hitting your “#7 hitter” 38 times in the 7 hole and over 400 times in the 2 through 5 holes. Matheny can’t count? Or are you just trying to delude yourself into ignoring the pain of losing out on EVERY key free agent they took a swing at and your fear of the Cubs breaking one off in the Cards again in ’16?
The lineup is better with Soler, not Fowler.
I agree with this. Fowler would be better in a platoon situation.
Fowler had a 110 wRC+ last year. Soler had 96. I”m aware it’s just a 1 year sample, but I’m wondering why your’e saying that (not saying you’re wrong, just questioning why)
I am basing it on how I feel each player will perform. With the overall team’s experience and lineup protection, I expect Soler to breakout. I’ve been a huge fan of his since they signed him out of Cuba.
Soler already has the eye at the plate, its some minor adjustments and he’s gonna be ridiculous. Just not many kids that young have that eye at the plate.
Agreed, I also really like his athleticism and build.
Soler was also god-awful in right. The Cubs’ outfield was looking scary-bad defensively with Soler and Schwarber both out there. Fowler isn’t a defensive gem, but he’s better than either of them and allows Heyward to move to his natural position.
I do believe Soler is going to be a good player one day, but I’m quite happy with this for next year.
It’s not either/or tho- now they have both. Remember, Maddon’s everyday lineup is never locked in
If Fowler had an agreement in place (pending you know…physicals and signing) with the Orioles and then suddenly returns to the Cubs…what in the world?
the O’s decided to **** over Gallardo and Fowler decided he’d rather not commit long term to a team like that and so went back to a ballpark very friendly to him to try and build up his value to take another crack at free agency next season?
he said “knowingly”
You mean mess him over by giving him the same money originally agreed on if he stays healthy? It’s the same AAV just one less guaranteed year.
Hey if anyone wants to mess me over by offering me 24 million dollars guaranteed. I’m all for it!
Apparently the Orioles failed Fowlers physical. Turnabouts fair play,.
Fowler never took a physical with the O’s so where are you getting that from?
It was a joke. Reread my post……the Orioles “failed” Fowler’s physical.
Not the other way around.
Read it again
Apparently you heard wrong?
Apparently you can’t tell when a post is a joke.
It’s always bad when a joke needs explaining. But I feel ya.
Lol
Its…. magical.
Thanks to crane Kennedy and tom ricketts …
Could this possibly mean a deal for Montero and move Schwarber back to catcher?
Schwarber is a single-A catcher at best unfortunately
Figured there was another shoe to drop after that Coughlan trade came out of left field (no pun). Would have preferred Jackson, but this gives them a bench full of legit starters. The way Maddon mixes/matches everyday, this could work out really well. What a fun year it’s going to be.
So… he failed the physical?
You guys may be guessing incorrectly
Maybe a montero trade??
Umm this is stunning. Now the Coghlan deal makes a bit more sense.
This is the offseason where hitters just go back to their old clubs.
Davis, Gordon, Cespedes, Kendrick, Rasmus, Weiters and now fowler. Probably missing a couple.
In other news: Dexter Fowler fires his agent.
Still got his 13m at least. 8m with 5m buyout next year
Yea but if he had taken the Qualifying Offer he would have $15.8M this year and still hit the market next year. If he was looking for a 1 year opt out why on earth wouldn’t he accept the QO?
How was he supposed to know the FA market would play out that way??? Just unlucky
What do you mean? Reports are saying he demanded a 1 year opt out from the Orioles. If he wanted a 1 year deal, there’s no reason to believe a team would offer something with a 1 year price HIGHER than the QO. See Stormie’s comment below. If he underperforms then the team buys him out and he could have made $2M more by accepting the QO. If he overperforms then he opts out and could have made $8M more by accepting the QO. To have a long-term deal break down because you demand a 1 year option, when a 1 year option was already presented to you at a higher price, means you are either very stupid or have a terrible agent. Or both
Wouldn’t that only apply if the team doesn’t pick up the option? If he is the one to walk, then he’s not going to get the buyout money; so he’s either stuck in a 2-year/$17m deal or makes $8m this year; not at all good no matter how you slice it, when he turned down a $15.8m qualifying offer..
Maybe a montero trade?
Huh? He’s their starting C. What does that have to do with the OF?
I would guess they’re trading Schwarber to an AL team so he can play his natural position, which is DH.
Yeah, dude, they’re NOT trading Schwarber. I have no idea what’s going to happen but I know they’re NOT trading Schwarber. I always thought that Heyward in CF was best case scenario because that would keep Soler in the lineup and in the field. His ceiling is incredibly high IMO and I did not want to see him moved. BUT now this SO…Soler would probably moved for starting pitching and Montero will be behind the plate or Montero is released or traded if they can find takers and Schwarber/Ross behind the plate. I’d take that 2nd option.
You honestly can’t put two and two together?
You question why trade Montero since he’s a starting C and not an outfielder, but then suggest trading Schwarber, who is also a catcher.
Simple: you move Schwarber to C and Soler to LF.
If Sale or Gray are available in a nearly straight up trade for Schwarber I think you have to take it.
This makes NO sense.
When I first saw this, I thought the website had reverted back to a year ago.
Montero trade??
Wow, the Orioles medical staff sure needs to get fired.
In the article it states that the Orioles rejected his demand for an opt-out. Nothing to do with medicals, maybe its an update you missed.
Os were right about Balfour last season but everyone just looks at the headlines. Balfour was hurt so the #Orioles staff should be rewarded. Gallardo agreed to one less deal do something was apparent in the physical.
Did Fowler fail his physical? If not this is supper shady, just like when the Cubs stole Eddy Julio Martinez from the Giants by making a back alley deal with his buscon when his real agent already had a deal in place.
Yeah could be a medical issue.
The buscones were supposed to get a deal, his agent that agreed with the Giants was supposed to finalize it. The buscones picked the Cubs offer but the agent didn’t know that
Jfisnasty. Plus 1.
He wanted an opt out, they said no… how is that shady? He never agreed to terms and even the Orioles have said that
Unless MULTIPLE reports were completely wrong, it seems like the contract was agreed upon, and then Fowler used the opt out to get out of the agree upon deal. An opt out isn’t just a throw in that you do at the last minute. I think it’s safe to assume the Orioles rejected that well before the deal may have been agreed upon. I guess we’ll know more if the O’s decide to do/say anything.
Cubs have to have a trade partner lined up for some sort of mutually beneficial swap of one of the following: Soler, Schwarber, or Baez. Question is what are they doing right now?
Soler or Baez could be trade bait for a solid number 2 pitcher, Carrasco Salazar Tyson Ross or one of the pitchers from the rays.
Baez doesn’t get them anywhere near any of those guys. Soler might get them Ross (and that deal sort of makes sense if the Cubs add a good prospect). Carrasco and Salazar no way. Rays OF is more than full.
This might sound crazy, I said this scenario plenty of times, trade Schwarber plus prospects to the A’s for Sonny Gray?
Stop that. The A’s won’t want Schwarber in one of the largest OF in baseball. Plus they already are stuck with Butler in the DH spot. Sonny Gray would require Bryant as a starting point. Just not happening.
So what’s happening with the Cubs OF? Have to think they didn’t give Fowler 13M to be a 4th OF.
Well Epstein had some pretty expensive benches in Boston, ya never know. But yeah I doubt that. Perhaps another trade upcoming.
This greatly helps Ian Desmond. No way the Orioles wanted to sacrifice their first round pick for a supposedly njured Gallardo and nothing else. I am quite positive Desmond will now be playing LF for the Orioles next season, even if it is just a one-year deal.
Desmond’s never played LF in his life.
Most scouts think he has the athleticism for it. He’s not as bulky as Hanley was. And he’s also a good insurance policy in case JJ Hardy or Schoop are injured/ineffective at 2b or SS.
On a one-year deal to rebuild value, I think the Orioles jump for a bat of his caliber especially if he only costs a second round pick. Already sacrificed their first rounder for Gallardo. This is pure speculation, but he’d probably be willing to take a cheap one-year deal, seeing as he would not have to uproot his family very far from DC to Baltimore. It seems like a good fit for both sides
There are so many reasons you are wrong. First, Dan Duquette has explicitly said he doesn’t want to sacrifice a draft pick for one year of a player. So the one year deal you mention won’t work. Second, do you know how much Buck values defense? There is absolutely zero chance the Orioles sacrifice a draft pick for a player to play in a position he has never played before. Third, the Orioles aren’t looking for a left fielder! They don’t think Kim has the arm strength to play right, so he will be the starting left fielder
Also, the fact that you consider the possibility that Schoop or Hardy could be “ineffective” at 2b/ss tells me you have never watched Schoop and aren’t aware of the multiple gold gloves Hardy has
I’d say bat is what he was talking about, not glove.
If he “wants” to play anywhere, it’s in TB – which is 30 minute drive from where he grew up in Sarasota. I just don’t see there being a fit after we traded Karns for Brad Miller – who is way too valuable to be a bench/util player.
I was referring to ineffectiness offensively, not defensively as the poster below said. I understand they are both good with the mit, which is why I suggested Desmond as an OF first, infielder second. Still, it wouldn’t be bad to try to deploy him as a Zobrist type.
About the draft pick, they already sacrificed their first rounder on two years on a supposedly injured Gallardo, so I do not see why a second rounder on a seemingly valuable player is so hard to grasp. I also wasn’t necessarily saying it had to be a one-year deal. Maybe a deal similarly structured to Uptons deal (opt-out after 2 years) and an extra 2 years on the deal otherwise. And as for Buck valuing defense, I think he’d also value a player who can potentially hit and play multiple defensive positions adequately
Also side note; Buck was willing to play Chris Davis in RF last year, and Desmond displays far more athleticism. I really don’t see the point there. And it seems far more bullish to be relying on a guy with zero MLB experience to play LF in Kim than a guy who’s been an above average hitter in the MLB and playing the MLB’s second most demanding position. That seems a bit unfair. Yes Desmond had a bad year last year and declined two years in arow, but that doesn’t destroy his value completely.
He played RF in 2009 and 2010 in the Majors, and CF in the minors so there is a good chance at some point in his life.he played left field in little league or otherwise.
Supposedly the Orioles rejected Fowler’s demand for an opt out after 1 year and the Orioles said no (not worth losing a pick for just one year, etc..)
The numbers make no sense. That is an amazing hometown discount. (which isn’t supposed to exist)
$8 Mil + $5 Mil buy out on the mutual option comes to $13 Mil. By structuring it with the mutual option, I believe he also gets around the possibility of a QO by making it a declined option. So in essence its a 1 year $13 million deal structured in such a way to let him hit free agency next year, in a weaker free agent class, without having to worry about potentially coming with the cost of a draft pick. All in all, not a bad deal for Fowler provided he performs well this year.
For Chicago you get him for 1 year (so you’re not really blocking Soler) and he’s very motivated to perform since its basically a contract year for him.
The qualifying offer system operates independently from options. So, the Cubs can extend a QO even if they choose not to pick up their half of the mutual option or if they select their half and Fowler declines his side. Even so, with an anticipated rise in the QO salary next year above $16MM — and with the experiences of Ian Desmond, Howie Kendrick and Fowler this year as well as the precedent of players accepting now (Rasmus, Wieters, Brett Anderson) — I foresee far fewer QO’s next year.
Does he even get the buyout though, if he’s the only one to decline the mutual option? Which will be the case, why on earth would the Cubs turn down the chance to have him for basically $4m in 2017?
Fowler defense has been sliding while CHC CF is small.
They are already disrupting Baez’s progression with Zobrist, so to do the same with Fowler and Soler will only hurt them long term.
Heyward was a great signing.
The CHC reached and are trying to hard with Zobrist and Fowler. They almost won 100 games while swapping Fowler for Heyward. With the development of the young players, especially Russell, Soler and Baez, they did not need the extra payroll or distractions.
Everyone remembers Schwarber’s bombs in the playoffs, but he was still platooned with the hottest bat in the playoffs while Soler raked just as much and has much more defensive value.
His defensive numbers improved last year after being traded away from Houston if I’m not mistaken.
Heyward to right fowler to center soler to left schwarbs catcher and miggy out or they just have schwarbs bounce around?
If they moved Montero it would be for Contreras to catch
So what does this mean for the O’s moving forward?
Mediocrity.
I hear it had something to do with the Orioles refusing an opt out clause. They continue to seem like a poorly run organization.
Not wanting to give the opt-out is not a sign of being poorly run. It would be stupid to give up a pick for potentially 1 year of him..
Very true! One thing about Fowler. If he has a sub par year this year. Are teams going to think that he has some kind of injury that would not pass the O’s physical?
Sucks for the O’s but no way could they give up the pick and include an opt-out.
Maybe the O’s look to trade for Soler now since he is the odd man out in Chicago?
Read the article. It says nothing about a failed physical. The process broke down when a opt-out after one year couldn’t be agreed too.
I guess if the Orioles are allowed to balk and restructure the Gallardo contract after their agreement then no one in the Orioles organization should utter a disparaging word against Fowler after he tried to alter the parameters of his agreed upon contract after the fact.
And so the hunt for a RF continues.
Interesting salary dynamics at play. He’ll get $13MM guaranteed ($8MM 2016 salary plus $5MM 2017 buyout), falling a bit shy of the $15.8MM qualifying offer. But should the mutual option be exercised, it’s a 2-year, $17MM deal (only $1.2MM above the QO for the second year). The mutual option almost functions like an opt-out in a 2-year contract. It becomes a $4MM decision for the Cubs to pick up their half of the 2017 option, which I expect they will. Then I expect Fowler to decline and bet that he can earn more than $4MM in 2017 (not to mention the chance at a lucrative long-term deal) in the thin 2016-2017 free-agent market.
Yeah that 2nd year is only if he gets hurt or is truly awful. He’s intending to enter next year’s FA class no question. I’ll bet (although it’s technically illegal) there’s a handshake agreement for no QO (if the system still exists) as well.
Why would the Cubs agree to that?
Hehehe
Betting Soler is moved soon for more pitching. No way they deal Schwarber unless the return is insane
No other deals in the works in my opinion this makes total sense. Fowler solid lead off and solid CF defense. This is a Maddon wet dream now that he has all of these puzzle pieces to tinker with. Soler platoons and late inning D replacement for Shwarbs without giving in to no O for late innings. Schwarbs an occasional start at C. Limiting aging Monterrey innings in the squat. Baez and Zobrist platoon at 2b, Baez sometimes spells Russell and Bryant as well.
Most solid bench in baseball no matter who is starting and who is platooning. I love the deal and it totally plays to the manager and his tinkering skills. He’s like coach Q putting his lines in a blender all the time. Mgmt knows the kind of Mgr they have and have catered to his strengths. Cubs pitchers and some position guys tired out in the playoffs last year, we will have more depth than anyone this year and are suited to a long, long (well into October) season!!!!
Love the move!!!!
Wow, didn’t see that coming, although the Coghlan trade makes some more sense. Happy to have Fowler back though- this move probably makes us the favorite in the NL, since there’s now some certainty at the top of the order
Wow, this came out of nowhere. I wonder if the Cubs have anything else up their sleeves before the season starts?
Funny thing is that Coghlan actually had a higher fWAR than Fowler last year. I guess the Cubs really wanted to move Heyward back to RF and are figuring the rest will fall into place.
I imagine there are some clubs out there royally ticked off that the Cubs just dumped Coghlan for nothing in order to make this signing. I can think of a few that could have used him.
Yes, Coghlan had a higher fWAR in 2015, but which one will be better in 2016? I’d bet on Fowler. And he can play CF.better than Coghlan. I liked Coghlan as a 4th OF, but Fowler improves the team for ’16.
Very shady. I don’t feel great about this. Cubs lineup looks great on paper, but it is never, NEVER a good idea to poach a player like this. Really hard to believe the Orioles and Fowler didn’t actually reach an agreement given the reports. Wouldn’t be surprised to see a lawsuit come out of this.
I would happily take Matt Szczur from the Cubs instead of some monetary settlement.
Orioles front office having stricter physical and medical reviews and announcing concerns about a free agent player to the world when a contract had been “mutally” agreed on is just as shady. They are hurting thata free agents value to other teams, ie Gallardo. Seems to me Fowler “Pulled an Orioles” on them with signing elsewhere because they did not want to give him an opt-out clause.
Not even close to the same. These deals are signed PENDING THE MEDICAL EXAM. If something goes wrong with the medical, they are absolutely able to back out. It appears that Fowler’s team agreed upon a contract without the opt out, and then changed their mind afterwards. That’s completely different.
Thank you. They peed all over a guy’s value who hadn’t missed major time since 2008, acted like something was wrong with him and announcing it to the world but still gave a multi-year deal when it fell to their price range. Seemed shady, and to me they deserved to be spurned.
You do realize that Gallardo still got the same money right? The third year isn’t guaranteed though. So yeah “potentially” he might get less. With the buyout 22 mil and the full contract is 33 mil.
Sorry made a mistake. With the buyout it is 24 mil.
You are assuming the the media reports are 100 percent correct about the so called agreement between Dexter and the Os. The reporters are good but not 100 percent good. It may have went down to a ‘source’ assuming the contract was as goo as agreed upon since there was nothing more than talk of an opt-clause to finish up. Dexter really wanted to go back out on the market the Os didnt want to lose a pick for a 1 year possible rental piece so the so-called agreed upon deal feel through. But you cant say that some part of the Os aggregiously difficult medical screening is not used as a barginning ploy which is shady. Oh well, tit for tat.
That’s nice but it takes both parties to agree, and it’s not an agreement until signatures are traded.
I’m guessing Fowler was disappointed with this year’s market and wanted to try free agency again on a thinner market next offseason.
Rough loss for the O’s, he really woulda strengthened that lineup.
I think it’s ideal to get Hammel out of that rotation and put him in a long relief/reserve role. Soler should be able to pull in a young power pitcher. Perhaps the Angels would make a good match for Heaney or Richards?
As an angels fan , I like that deal but the angels like the rotation as it is right now and Soler is on a very team friendly deal
Is the buyout only awarded if the Cubs decline the option or either way? I’d be surprised if he declined the mutual option and still got a buyout.
The buyout is paid regardless of which side declines the option. The contract guarantees a minimum of $13MM for the 2016 season. See AJ Burnett and the Phillies both declining a $15MM mutual option for the 2015 season, where Burnett received a $1MM buyout, for a recent example. (Burnett’s deal was a little more complicated in that, after declining the mutual option, he was left with a player option for a lesser salary).
He’s getting at least 13mil whether he declines the option, or the Cubs decline the option. I imagine he won’t be back next year, as this is just a play to make another run at a long term deal in a much weaker OF Free Agent class.
Whatwhathwhatwhatwhat?
Wow. This is definitely the offseason of the media getting ahead of signings/hirings…
Wonder if Fowler and Deandre Jordan have the same agent….
LOL
Won’t matter. Texas beats Chicago in the World Series this year.
Wow, leave the site for a couple hours to get some work done and I missed all the fun.
Not to be rude, but this is what the Orioles deserve. They talked Gallardo’s value down until they got the price they wanted. It obviously was a ploy, because they still signed him for two years anyway, and with the team option, for a guy who hasn’t missed real time since 2008. I could understand a one year deal if there was an issue, but now seems like they were being sorry butts. Good job Dexter, and good job Cubs. And best of luck Yovani…
Are you seriously bagging the O’s for “talking Gallardo’s value down”? It’s called negotiations. I’m not sure you grasp that concept. What are they meant to do in your eyes, run his value up? No, that’s for Gallardo’s Agent to do.
Gallardo didn’t have to sign anything.
Yes I am. They made it a huge issue and announced it to the world with him still unsigned, honest or not, devaluing him by millions. Once they salted his name he was pretty much going to have to take their offer or go back out in a late market with “tainted” medicals. You call it negotiations, I call it strong-arming. I’ve seen the undercarriage of a bus before, looks like Gallardo has too. I didn’t call BS until they still gave him a multi-year anyway(big medical issue huh but still want three years team control?). Just because shady is the norm doesn’t make it right. I’m glad he got his money(and a multi-year deal), he isn’t the best but he is a steady pro. The Orioles are going to turn themselves into the Rockies before long, so they better hope this contract is worth it. Can’t develop pitching, can’t sign pitching pretty soon. Huge fan of Buck Showalter, and they are a really good ball club, but yes in my opinion(and just my opinion) the O’s were shady. Don’t get me wrong, all front offices are, but this seemed wrong to me.
The Adrian Beltre, I agree and could not have said any of that better myself.
Thank you much, I am glad someone feels the same. Sad when a guy as decent and healthy as he’s been is lucky to get a two year deal…
At least they gave him a deal… I didn’t see anyone else stepping up to the table with a big offer… He should be appreciative of anything they decided to give him.
What an idiot! Can’t believe he gave up millions of guaranteed money. Better pray he doesn’t get hurt or have a lousy year.
Who the hell is moderating this thing? Get moving. Are you a Cubs or Yankees fan? lame.
How many good outfielders can the White Sox pass on in one offseason?
They can have Jackson or Venable as long as my Rangers get the other. Deal??
I wouldn’t consider either of them “good outfielders,” but I definitely wouldn’t put Venable in there. If it’s down to those 2, I guess I’d take Jackson.
This just proves Jerry was not serious about any of the big names.. Senile and needs to sell the team.. and fire Kenny W.
Uncontested? More like unkind.
Does anyone believe this: GM Theo Epstein told reporters, “this is it. We’re not trading anyone else. We feel great about our outfield mix.”? Also, Cubs defense just got a ton better than having Schwarber and soler out there. Schwarber is a platoon candidate based on his splits. I thought with Baez tho. Soler is likely to be on the bench. Look at the OBP down that line up. It’s sick. Go Cubs!
Schwarber catches for a year then fowler leaves Heward plays center and u get the draft pic for fowler
Oh and the only way they trade schwarber is for one of Chris sale, Madison bumgarner, garret Cole or Noah synderguard straight up.
Hahahahahaha! You Cubs fans crack me up. You’re talking about a guy who had a 500 point platoon split in his only year in the majors, and can’t really play anywhere in the field. He’s a very good platoon DH. You don’t get anywhere near an ace for him.
Theo isn’t trading Schwarber. 40 home run guys don’t grow on trees.
It’s a good thing you’re not being serious.
That’s ok go ahead and sign alvarez to dh let trumbo attempt to field and to those comparing this to the Os stance on physicals this isn’t even remotely the same thing he agreed upon a contract and should have kept his word he backed out for greed. The orioles are strict on physicals because they when they agree upon signing a healthy player if they discover something that was unknown upon agreeing to a deal they should renogotiate a deal. They are not getting what they originally thought. That’s the reason for the physicals before the signing
Fowler didn’t show up for the physical this morning for Baltimore. Nothing health related in this story. So try again. (2 chances remaining)
Fowler just pulled an Ian Desmond. How can you give up millions of guaranteed money?
So weird having players take less money to play for the Cubs. In my entire life I don’t think my Cubs have ever been the place players wanted to play for at literally any cost. First Lackey took a favorable deal for the team, Then Heyward flat out takes less money to come here. And now Fowler taking WAAAAAAY less money than he was not only offerend by the Cubs in the QO but also what was offered by the O’s. He has to be kicking himself hard now for denying the QO. The buyout for nest year is $5M so the total amount of guaranteed money to him is $13M……. $2.8M less than the QO. This year he is actually making less money than last year….. HELL of a deal by Theo. Just like how he swooped in and stole prospect Martinez from SF, he now swoops in and steals Fowler from the O’s. The dude is a boss. Rumor has it Theo himself is about to get about a $50M extension from Ricketts. That’s some serious dough for a front office man. He’s worth it though.
Having said all that. Since they traded Coghlan about 30 minutes before they announced this move, the top 4 OFers on the team are now my boy Schwarber, Heyward, Soler, and Fowler. Heyward is a lock as an everyday player due to the $$. That leaves the other three in what I’d assume is going to be an outfield rotation for the two remaining OF spots not fielded by Heyward. This blows, kind of, because I was hoping to see Soler and Schwarber get everyday ABs. But then again Maddon has to be loving this because he LOVES shuffling his lineups and starters on a daily basis. One thing is certain, they have insane OF depth now. For those saying a Soler trade is imminent now. No. No it’s not. After the Coghlan trade earlier today and the re-signing of Fowler, Theo announced they were officially done making trades this offseason. Now you can take that for what it’s worth, but I believe him. They have said many times they have no desire to move their young assets.
This lineup is looking pretty nasty now. Loaded with power, speed, and SERIOUS on base potential. Here is the potential lineup and what they have averaged over a 162 game season over their careers courtesy of baseball=reference. 2nd year players are what I think they are capable of.
CF Fowler – 11 HRs, 20 SBs, .363 OBP
2B Zobrist – 17 HRs, 14 SBs, .355 OBP
1B Rizzo – 28 HRs, 9 SBs, .356 OBP
3B Bryant – 30 HRs, 15 SBs, ..370 OBP
RF Heyward – 19 HRs, 17 SBs, .353 OBP
LF Schwarber – 30+ HRs, 5 SBs, .350+ OBP
C Montero – 18 HRs, 0 SBs, .343 OBP
P
SS Russell – ≈20 HRs, 20 SBs, .330+ OBP?
Bryant, Schwarber, and mainly Russell are my hopes. I think Bryant for sure and Schwarber will be just fine. Russell really struggled (somewhat quietly media-wise at least) offensively last year. He was a .300 hitter with a .377 OBP in the minors who had 20-20 potential. I am hoping we start seeing that potential at the plate in 2016, but it seems like both Russell and the Cubs really just want him to continue to focus on his stellar fielding and are hoping the bat just eventually lives up to the potential on its own. I really think/hope he’ll be the .280 hitter with a .350 OBP and 20 HRs and 20 SBs I thought he’d be before being called up.
Enough about Russell though, the rest of the players and their 162 game averages are pretty dead on on what I expect from them +/= 2-3 HRs or SBs for each player. HR-wise this lineup alone has at least 170 in them, and I think damn near 100 SBs…… that is nuts. Then you look at their OBPs……. I’m drooling. In this lineup above, there is the chance that not a single one has an OBP lower than .340. SIX guys in this lineup could have OBPs over .360. And 3 of them could flirt with .400 OBPs…. Rizzo, Bryant, and Schwarber.
April needs to get here ASAP
Better hope the O’s don’t crap out this year. Duquette might trade some guys to a division rival to spite Epstein. Lol! That would be hilarious!
Like who for instance? The Orioles aren’t dealing any of their impacting hitters who are tied up with long term contracts and even if they did the Cubs lineup will still trump their competitors. The Orioles have squat for pitching, none that would be a significant upgrade to another N.L. Central rival…which is the reason they just might “crap out this year”. (lol)
I’d like to add that their bench is looking pretty potent too. Soler, underrated La Stella, Baez, and Ross are now definitely on the bench…… Soler somewhat a bench player but he’ll be in an OF rotation. Depending on how many relievers they carry they only need maybe 1 more OFer….. or maybe IFer since Baez is going to get stretched out in the OF this spring to increase his versatility.
C Ross
OF Soler
OF/SS/2B/3B Baez
3B/SS/2B La Stella
?
It’s pretty nice to have only 1 question mark on this team from an offensive standpoint…… and that question mark being a bench player. Everyone so far on this bench has the potential to be .270+ hitters with .330+ OBPs and La Stella has the potential to be an OBP machine. In the minors La Stella played 300+ games and had a .404 OBP. Soler and Baez have 20+ HR power (obviously not going to reach that mark if they only play a platoon/bench role) and baez has 20+ SB speed. One thing is almost certain, this team is has serious depth on offense. Their pitching ain’t too shabby either. 100+ wins this year????? Possibly. Really depends on how the 2nd year players do. Sophomore slump? Or do they all improve, and build off last year’s success? If it’s the latter, look out. This team has the potential to score 900+ runs this year. That’s crazy. Especially when you consider they have pretty solid pitching to go with it. All I hope and pray for is that they don’t have a 2015 Cardinals-like year and get plagued with injuries.
The offense has a ton of potential, but there’s a lot more than 1 offensive question mark when you look at the roster.
Addison Russell and Jorge Soler are still much more potential than substance on offense. Russell hit .242/.307/.389 with 13 HRs and 4SBs. Projecting him to hit .280/.350/? with 20HRs and 20SBs next year is just ridiculous.
Ross is horrible and shouldn’t be on a roster (wouldn’t be without Lester), and Baez is a HUGE question mark on offense, unless you trust an extremely small sample size.
Admittedly, they do have a great looking lineup on paper for the most part, but I think your optimism is getting the best of you here.
Soler is still a question mark on offense? While he didn’t have an INSANE year he still managed a .262 BA and a .324 OBP with 10 HRs despite battling nagging injuries which limited him to only 101 games and 366 ABs. In his first kind of full year in the bigs I’d say that is a pretty successful campaign. Then there is the fact along with Schwarber he pretty much raked in the playoffs hitting 3 HRs in 7 games to the tune of a .474 BA and .600 OBP. Soler, had he played all year and garnered about 600 ABs instead of the 366, he was on a pace for about 16 HRs. Again, people seem to be forgetting his biggest problem last year was missing time with injueies. Which is what is more worrisome, or the question mark if you will in regards to Soler. We KNOW he can hit. His problem since the Cubs signed him is staying healthy. Including the minors I don’t think he has stayed healthy for a full season yet. That is why I think he might be just a platoon player since he has had a hard time staying healthy. Platooning him is likely in hopes he stays healthy all year.
As for Russell. I am basing it off the fact he tore it up in the minors. 13 Hrs is also not to shabby for a debut season. Especially seeing he did it in only 475 ABs. If he gets like 580 ABs that is a pace for about 16 HRs. So in other words to reach 20 HRs all he has to do is get more ABs and just slightly increase his HR rate from last year. Thinking he can increase his HR rate by not even hitting 1 more HR per month isn’t exactly making lofty predictions. 20 HRs is WELL within reach. I am actually surprised he didn’t steal more bases last year. He showed SOLID speed in the minors. In the minors he put up a pace that if carried out over a 162 game season would translate to about 29-30 SBS a year. He had 44 SBs in the minors in 244 games. Great thing about speed is you generally don’t magically lose it upon being called up. Odds are Maddon told him not to worry about stealing bases. I bet he lets him loose in 2016. So to think he can steal 20 bases is possibly underestimating his potential. So a kid who put up a 162 game pace in the minors of .300 BA, .377 OBP, 25 HRs, and 29 SBs……. to think he has the potential of a .280 BA, .350 OBP, and 20-20 potential…… yeah….. I’m way off base here.
Ross is a backup catcher. Name me a backup catcher who doesn’t blow at the plate.
Baez showed GREAT improvement not only in that small sample size on the ML Cubs but also on the triple A Iowa Cubs. His K-rate decreased a ton at both levels which is what his achilles heel was in 2014. Baez in 2015 had about the same amount of games played and ABs as Corey Seager. Baez hit a respectable .289 with a .325 OBP. HUGE improvements from the year prior. Yes, Seager had a higher BA and a higher OBP but the same HRs and similar doubles and stolen base totals as Baez. Yet people are freaking out about Seager. He’s hyped up to be the real deal despite success in a very small sample size. Baez has success in a very similar sample size but he is still a question mark? Got it. Me thinking he can hit .270ish with a .330 OBP is just about me expecting him to do what he did last year….. just continuing the improvement he made from 2014. It’s not me expecting him to do any better. A .270 BA is actually significantly worse than what he showed last year….. almost 20 points worse. Baez had a K-rate of ≈26% in the minors before 2015. In 2015 he reduced it to 24%. In 2015 at the MLB level he struck out 41% of the time. Last year he struck out 30% of the time. Or about the same rate at which Giancarlo Stanton strikes out at. (28% for his career). Baez’ 2015 debut was pretty bad. You know who had an even worse debut season than that who also plays for the Cubs but has turned out to be a stud? Anthony Rizzo. After his debut in San Diego EVERYONE was crying bust and expectations on him plummeted. Now look at him. One of the better fielding 1Bman in the game and definitely one of the best offensive 1Bmen in the game as well……. and after last year I’d say one of the best base running 1Bmen since he stole 17 bases last year. I think only Goldschmidt had more for full time 1Bmen.
Bottom line. Yeah, any of these young players can go either way. My predictions/what I think they are capable of doing isn’t exactly lofty. I think they are pretty conservative predictions as far as best case scenario predictions go. Sure, they all could have sophomore slumps and blow hard in 2016, hitting .100something with sub .300 OBPs and insane K-rates. Is that what you want me to put for my predictions though? Generally predictions are on the more optimistic side of things but still within some sort of reality…. which is what I did. Baez, Russell, and Soler have the potential to do even BETTER than what I predicted so I’d say my predictions/hopes are well within reason.
Shoot. Count the playoffs and Soler’s 2015 numbers in reg season and playoffs were: .272 Ba, .338 OBP, 13 HRs, 21 2Bs, 45 Rs, and 52 RBIs in only 108 games and 385 ABs.
If he played a healthy full season of 155ish games the other numbers he put up would transform into the following assuming the same pace is maintained. .272 BA, .338 OBP, 552 ABs, 19 HRs, 30 2Bs, 65 Rs, 75 RBIs…… I’d say that would’ve been a hell of a first full year had he stayed healthy.
Russell is just 22 years old, Baez 23, Soler 24. A lot of guys their ages are still in the minors..
There’s a HUGE difference between predictions and potential that you seem to be missing.
Yes, Soler is absolutely still a question mark on offense. He has the potential to be a monster (as seen in the playoffs), but he hasn’t done anything remotely close to that consistently yet. A .262 BA and a .324 OBP with 10 HRs is pretty mediocre… It’s not a bad first “full season” by any means, but it’s nothing to write home about. And nagging injuries weren’t his biggest issue last year. During spring training, he showed a GREAT eye at the plate, but once the season started, he started swinging at everything close to the plate – that was his biggest issue last year until the playoffs. The ridiculous stretch in the playoffs doesn’t “prove” anything about him except for the fact that he has a ton of potential. We KNOW he CAN hit, he’s just got to prove he can do it throughout an entire season, not just in a 7 game sample. He has a high ceiling, but he’s nowhere close to reaching it, especially if he can’t stay healthy.
As for Russell, I’m sure the numbers you stated are within reach if he has a great season. That’s a huge IF based upon what he did at the plate last year. There’s a HUGE difference between .242/.307 and .280/.350. I never said he didn’t have .280/.350 and 20-20 potential, but to think he’ll do that next year is being VERY optimistic.
Yes, Ross is a backup catcher, and most of them are bad, but you listed his name and said that they only have 1 offensive question mark on the roster. I guess you’re technically right if you don’t consider Ross a question mark though – we KNOW for a fact that he’s terrible.
Baez did show great improvement when called up last year, but it was in a very small sample size. 28 games doesn’t erase the fact that he struck out OVER FORTY PERCENT OF THE TIME in his first extended look in the bigs. He’s got a long way to go to prove that he can hit consistently hit big league pitching. In regards to Seager, he has never shown the swing-and-miss potential that Baez has shown. He puts the bat on the ball and gets on base at a high clip, all while showing good pop. Those are the kind of top prospects that pan out more often than not. Not to mention the fact that he tore up the bigs at a .337/.425/.561 clip with 4 homers, 8 doubles, a triple, 14 walks, and only 19 strike outs in 113 plate appearances. Compare that to what Baez did when he first got called up. Now you know why non-Cubs fans are much higher on him than Baez. Baez, like Soler and Russell, has GREAT potential, but he has a long way to go.
Bottom line, ALL of these guys (outside of Ross) have POTENTIAL to be excellent hitters. Predicting that they’ll turn into those hitters next year is VERY optimistic based on what they’ve shown so far. And no, predictions are not generally on the more optimistic side of things. Predictions are generally on the REALISTIC side of things. Don’t you think the Cubs would be predicted to win more than 92 games by PECOTA if the projections were based on “what they are capable of doing” rather than being realistic? That’s where you keep getting thrown off. You keep saying predictions, but then you say things like “what I think they are capable of doing” and your “hopes” for them. That’s why I said your optimism is getting the best of you.
Your pessimism sounds like it is getting the best of you however.
That’s called being realistic.
Except for Russell, who is a great SS, so I don’t care what he hits, you are talking about the Cubs bench players.
I’m completely aware of that…
I’m not dumping on the Cubs by any means. The roster looks pretty dang stacked. I’m just being realistic.
Baltimore continues to do what they do best.
They’d be insane to give up a 1st rounder for one year of an average player.
BINGO
They’ve made it clear they aren’t doing opt outs, and that’s what this came down to
Make good decisions?
Not fill their holes.
RF is the only hole in that lineup…………now starting pitching, that’s a different story
Love how the Cubbie fans think they are already in the WS this year. Sounding like Nats fans last year. Billy Goat Curse is still alive and well.
Whatever helps you sleep at night. If you think the Nats offense last year was as good as the Cubs offense, I can’t help you.
Nats offense wasn’t as good, but their pitching was better. IMO, the Cubs have a slightly better team overall and the best team in the league on paper, but that doesn’t guarantee them anything.
The difference between the Nats last year and the Cubs this year is that the Cubs have already proven they can win with the team they have in place. The Nationals never did that, it was just assumed.
Where do you see people saying this?
Saying that the Cubs are the best team on paper =/= assuming they are in the WS. Baseball is baseball, the best teams rarely win.
The 2016 cubs are better on paper than the 2015 nats and importantly, have depth that the 2015 Nats lacked.
I can say that I believe the Cubs are the best team in baseball at this point, that doesn’t mean I assume they make the WS, lots of stuff can happen over 162 (+ however many playoff games it would take to get to the WS).
I would love Soler to be traded to the Halos. Would most likely cost us Heaney or Skaggs though which I would not do. Would be neat if all it takes is Santiago and a prospect like Alcantara to get him. i doubt Billy can convince that trade though.
It would take more than that. Theo would MAYBE consider Soler for Richards. A pitcher in his late 20s who is a good #3 pitcher for a 24 year old with loads of potential still. Only knock on Soler is his ability to stay healthy all year. Including the playoffs last year he put up solid numbers last year for his first somewhat full season. Had he played 155ish games last year and maintained the pace he put up in 108 games across the regular season and the playoffs his numbers would been, .272 BA, .338 OBP, 19 HRs, 30 2Bs, 75 RBIs. Not eye popping, but still very good for a guy’s first full season. But again, he didn’t stay healthy and has yet to show he can. Still, Theo and Co. see the potential he has and will ask a lot for him. Honestly, I don’t think Richards is “a lot.” Pretty sure he was talking to Tampa this offseason and was asking for Chris Archer……. so there you go.
Soler is not worth RIchards but I can see Theo making that pitch as well as Archer. Cubs are in a great position where they have plenty of depth and they don’t need to make a trade for a pitcher until a team gets desperate.
Oh ye of little faith. I said this could happen, should happen and most importantly, it did happen! Now it’s time for the White Sox to jump in and make their best offer for one of the Cubs corner outfielders, part two of my hoped scenario regarding Fowler returning to the Cubs.
Despite the complementary news regarding the trade of reserve OF Chris Coghlan to the A’s for right-handed pitcher Aaron Brooks, the Cubs still have 4 potential starting outfielders for 2016. Brooks gives the Cubs some added depth to their rotation but is hardly the significant upgrade they would prefer in 2016.
Enter the White Sox, who should now make their best effort to acquire either Kyle Schwarber, Jorge Soler and/or Javier Baez, even if it involves trading a stud pitcher like Chris Sale or Jose Quintana. Any of these players might be centerpieces of of blockbuster deal that could prove mutually beneficial to both teams in the short AND long term.
I have thought, as a Cubs fan, to try to get Sale from the Sox. I feel an offer of Soler, Baez, and Vogelbach seems to be somewhere in the ballpark of what I would consider to be near Sale’s value.
It wold have to be more like Soler, Baez, 2 of Torres/Underwood/Cease, and probably 1 of McKinney/Almora to get Sale…..
Abreu’s presence really makes Vogelbach almost worthless to the sox.
Sox fans, not saying you SHOULD do it, but is that close to value?
Doesn’t sound awful, but probably only 1 of those pitchers not 2, and Vogelbach is going to be included in any blockbuster deals to AL teams unless there is some sort of DH announcement for the NL during the year. I also follow the Sox and feel that Vogelbach would be a marked improvement over Laroche later in the season in all likelihood, but I could be mistaken.
Any package for Sale would start with Bryant or Russell, or he won’t be going anywhere. It’s really that simple. Am I saying that SHOULD be the case? No. But I can all but guarantee it would be the case.
IF for some reason they decided they didn’t want either of those 2 guys, it’d be something like Schwarber + one of Soler/Baez + Contreras + a high end pitching prospect. Aces on great contracts don’t get moved often for a reason. It takes A LOT.
Any trade involving Sale would start with Kyle Schwarber, include Javier Baez and a rotation replacement like Kyle Hendricks.
Any trade involving Jose Quintana would start with Jorge Soler or Javier Baez and a rotation replacement like Kyle Hendricks.
Reinsdorf is to dumb and stubborn to trade with the Cubs. He would not run the risk of coming out on the short end of a deal with his #1 rivals. He definitely has a shortman-like syndrome when it comes to the Cubs. Theo has already stated after re-signing Fowler that they are done making trades this offseason/spring. So there’s that. Then there is the fact that Theo and Co. have already expressly stated time and time again that it would take A LOT to pry one of their young players away. So even if they were to entertain the idea of trading one of those three players mentioned it would have to include either Sale or Quintana….. or Fulmer or Rondon………. and/or Spencer Adams. So like Soler + prospect for say Fulmer and Adams. Or Soler for Quintana straight up. Or Schwarber for Sale and Adams. I mean they were talking with Tampa and were open to trading Soler but wanted Chris Archer. Tampa wanted none of that. But that is what it is going to take to get one of those three. That and Reinsdorf to quit being a stubborn tard. He’d deal Sale for just a prospect haul from another team before he deals Sale or any other high profile name to the Cubs. The last deal I can think of that was of any prominence that Reinsdorf gave the OK to do was in 1998 when they traded Matt Karchner for Jon Garland. That isn’t exactly an earth shattering trade. I think the very latest trade between the two was Neal Cotts for David Aardsma and Carlos Vasquez…… who never played in the major leagues……….. yeah. And that was before the 2007, so it’s been a while.
I don’t know about your opinion on Reinsdorf. I don’t follow the White Sox much so maybe you’re right but if you are correct about the Cubs asking price, I think THAT is more discouraging.
If your example of Sale AND Adams for Schwarber really is what the Cubs would need then Reinsdorf would have been stupid to push it through. You say he would have traded Sale for a bunch of prospects but that didn’t happen, so maybe that statement is not true? After all, you said yourself Reinsdorf simply doesn’t do trades. Seems there is some contradiction in your statement.
Most Cubs fans I know would be enthusiastic at a Schwarber for Sale straight up deal if that would be considered.
Also chicubbies1 said that Reinsdorf would not do trades with the Cubs, not trades in general. It’s called reading for content, I recommend you practice that a bit hanks1hammer.
And now is where I realize it’s not worth talking about being realistic with you when it comes to the Cubs. Seriously? Sale AND Adams for Schwarber? I really hope that’s a joke. It’d take significantly more than Schwarber alone to get Sale, let alone with Adams thrown in too.
I’ll tell you what, if Schwarber hits .280/.350/.600 with 30+ dingers this year, then you can ask the Sox for Sale + prospects. Until then, don’t even bother picking up the phone.
The Sox are not trading Sale or Quintana. Not going to happen this year.
This doesn’t have to mean that there’s a trade coming. Maddon likes to have guys at different positions all the time, this just gives him more of flexibility
The Cubs OF depth is simply unbelievable. When you can have a legitimate debate as to whether your fourth OF is either Fowler, Schwarber or Soler, you are in a good place.
People calm down on the whole now we can get Carrasco and other pitchers train. Carrasco is under control until 2020, unless the cubs want to eat the majority of his new deal there is little chance of him moving also a trade would have to involve at least another player besides Soler and the money. Tampa has multi players under control like Matt Moore until 2020, Cobb to 2017 (most likely to be moved), Smyly until 2018, and Archer until 2021 including his options. All those pitchers are under 5 million a year for Tampa other than Moore at 5.1 million. Sonny Gray is arbitration eligble until 2019 he is going nowhere unless the Cubs over spend on any of these players. Tyson Ross is also under control through 2017. Also Soler who through only 2 years of playing is a .268 hitter with an ops of .758 numbers just under your boy Dexter Fowler, but comparable. Also Happy birthday Soler, which no one mentioned today!
Fowler talked to Adam Jones of the Orioles and told him he was on his way to Sarasota:
Per Roch Kubatko who is the Oriole writer:
Center fielder Adam Jones told us yesterday that they spoke and Fowler was on his way to Sarasota.
So Fowler is lying about not having a deal with Baltimore but whatever, as an Oriole fan I don’t want anyone on the team that doesn’t want to be there. Fowler is such a shrewd negotiator: signs for less money than the QO and leaves $20 million more guaranteed on the table.
The Adam Jones quote needs to be reinterpreted. He said “He should be on his way here now”. That’s not a direct attribute to Fowler saying it, it was just an assumption by Jones.
While I do agree with you on the interpretation of the quote, I think there’s a pretty good reason why Jones assumed that… I’m not saying that Fowler ever claimed he was on his way or anything like that, but in some way or another, he certainly gave Jones the impression that he was going to be an Oriole.
The Cubs will definitely win the WS again this year if Maddon bats his pitcher 7th. That’s the key!
Os front office is a fraud.
Oh no we suck again. LMAO
Welcome back DF. Go Cubs!
I’m typing this on the fly so forgive any typos or English structure. As far as shady as some people think or as Northsider put it. Not as much as people think. I do Entertainment Law. Now I’m no sports agent or music agent I do film but it is all the same. Other than Balt front office and management and Flowler and his agent really no one knows the full story. I think and in my professional opinion this what happened. This long so bare with me please. I think a deal was close or at least talked about. I think someone jumped the gun and leaked to media. Kind of counting your chickens before they hatch. Balt has had a lot of pressure this off season to stay par with Boston – Toronto – NY. The Davis thing was almost no choice. So with that said I’m sure they did talk and a deal was set. But nothing set till that signature on paper. No matter what. To go public before a signature is not smart. Now 98% of the time is probably a done deal. But it not official till it is signed. Physical is on all contracts. But in this case it not the point. Unlike Dodgers thing with the Seattle guy. Do I think he was on his way no. But I think he did tell his agent he wanted to add the opt at the last minute and Balt said no that was that. By that time Theo being the mastermind he is took advantage of it and stole him for 8 mil. He’s best they better keep him for life. I’d offer him part ownership after this contract. There is no better than Theo E. Love him. So that’s that. There is no law suit. Because there is no case. Unless Flower signed that contract he can change his mind and say what he wants. In Law verbal agreements – gentle man agreements mean nothing. So ex sample – if you went to buy a car say Ferrari – talk to salesman 3 – 4 hours test drove it. Said I love it. I want it. He does up all paperwork sets up Friday for you to come in pay for it. Or say finance it. He is so happy. Tells all his co workers manager friends. I sold Ferrari now that big sale for a car salesman. Then you call him Friday and say I want 5 free oil changes also. Oil change for Ferrari expensive trust me lol. They say can’t do it. You say then I’m not buying it. Done. Now trust me if this was real they do the oil changes not to lose the sale. But same thing. Nothing signed no money down. No deal. Or the credit falls through. No deal. Can’t hold you to it by Law. Some states have 72 hour rule. Anyway same difference here. Flower didn’t sign he’s not obligated. So he did the Cubs. Theo probably watched that unfold. I’m sure Flowlers agent called Theo as soon as Balt said no opt. There you go sorry so long.
I agree, but it still cracked me up when you called him Flower.
Sorry that was the spell checker. Fowler
Chi Cubs you are higher than a damn kite if you think it would only take shwarber to land Chris Sale, hahaha he is a top 5 pitcher in all of baseball. The discussion would first start with Bryant if anything. cub fans need to stop praising this guy like he’s some sort of babe Ruth… News flash he’s not. Sure he has mad potential but lets see him put together consecutive years of 30+ homers and eclipse above .250 mark until then he hasn’t proven much
Sox fans are just mad because they didn’t land anyone. It not like they couldn’t. How long was the list of out fielders? You just have a cheap owner. To talk about KB on Russell in a trade for Sales won’t happen. First off you better think about the top 5 players not pitchers in baseball to even consider KB in a package. The Cubs are done now. I think never know what Theo planning. The dept is best in baseball. The next move will be a pitcher. Think Theo still uneasy about the rotation. Esp cutting Jakes time. But that be mid season. When he can measure were the Cubs are at. Rn no team before Spring Training ready to deal. When teams like SD – Oak – Miami – TB – Clev – Sox are at the bottom a move will be made. If the Sox are 4th or 5th Sales could go. The Cubs have the farm – players to do it. A pitcher would def be in that package. Teams Rn are seeing were they stand before they do anything. Trade deadline. But their not going to get as much as you think for him like it or not.
All of this commotion for a player who is going to bat .245 with 11 homers, 60 rbi’s and 15 stolen bases….
Wish the Phillies had anyone they could trade to get Soler… but Charlie Morton can’t even be traded for a steak at Morton’s at this point unless he goes back to mimicking everything about Roy Halladay, including his ERA.