The Dodgers, Cubs, Rangers, and Red Sox are among the clubs still interested in Cole Hamels, reports Ken Rosenthal in his latest video for FOX Sports. Boston is expected to scout Hamels’ start tomorrow, and we can assume other clubs will have a heavy presence as well. Talks with the Rangers aren’t dead, but Texas does expect other teams to make a better offer.
Interestingly, we’ve recently seen speculation that the Phillies could opt to keep Hamels past the July deadline. Other clubs wonder if uncertainty in the front office has hampered their ability to finalize a deal. As Rosenthal notes, Jonathan Papelbon should have been traded by now. Here’s more from Rosenthal:
- Health will affect the markets of Johnny Cueto and Scott Kazmir. Both hurlers have missed time with various ailments and will be free agents at the end of the season. It can be difficult to justify trading a talented prospect for 12 starts, especially when the player involved is at an increased risk to not make those starts.
- Short of an impressive streak in the second half, Pat Murphy is unlikely to manage the Padres next season. Rosenthal suggests that the culture change from Bud Black was too great. Murphy could join Craig Counsell’s staff in Milwaukee if he is relieved of his duties.
- As we now know, the Astros are open to adding a bat at the trade deadline. One star they’ve scouted is Brewers outfielder Carlos Gomez. Houston prefers a right-handed hitter, but may target lefty swinging Gerardo Parra due to a lower acquisition price. The Astros are open to trade Jon Singleton.
Ok. No Hamels to Boston, lets get that outta the way . They wanted to take the cheap all year on prospects, who are overrated like phillies prospects are. You Bostonian’s got Yoenis Céspedes for Lester, When he was becoming a FA pitcher at years end, You actually think the phillies would take that crap you offered for Hamels, Who’s better then Lester IMO, And under a reasonable contract for a few more years ? Ruben Amaro or whoever is making the Phillies trades….Quite easy frankly on what you should do…
1) No top flight prospect in the package coming back. DO NOT TRADE HIM. Keep him all year and try again after the year.
2) Keep repeating step 1 then hang up
So you don’t want the future hof’ers Swihart and Betts lol……………for Hamels……….
Yes Phillies fans do, but we know for fact that they aren’t available for a trade or else Hamels would be pitching in Boston right about now.
That’s a good way to manage your franchise into the ground.
Perfect strategy if you want the Phillies to wallow in mediocrity or worse for the next decade. Hamels’ value isn’t as high as you think it is, and it’s only going to get lower as time goes on and he gets older.
Hint: you get a lot more in return selling at the trade deadline than you do in the offseason. If you’re not satisfied with the returns you’re getting offered, then maybe you should reevaluate your own player valuation, instead of continually screaming that everyone else is wrong. At some point you start sounding delusional.
There have been dozens and dozens of articles explaining how Amaro’s player valuation methods are deeply flawed. I suggest you look into them.
Any team in on Hamels should also be looking at CJ Wilson. If the Angels are willing to part with Wilson then the team acquiring him would only be on the hook for one more year at twenty mil. compared to 70 mil for 3 years of Hamel. Wilson could be had for less in terms of talent and he is having a better year than Hamels at this point of the season.
He also doesn’t have Hamels’ great track record
Which is why he could be had for less. Sort of a poor man’s Hamel.
The Red Sox aren’t in serious contention this year, and would be long shots even if Buchholz were still healthy. They might want to get serious about Hamels this winter, if he hasn’t been traded by then, but there is no way they should consider trading a top flight prospect before then.
Hamels would make more sense to some of the other teams listed.
Gerardo Parra for Jon Singleton seems like an interesting trade idea. Singleton could get a shot to justify his contract in rebuilding Milwaukee and the Brewers could get the long term 1b that they have been searching for since Prince Fielder left town.
Even though he hasn’t hit in the Majors, Singleton is still doing very well in the minors this year (.280/.387/.553, 17 HR, 66 RBI). I think hes worth a lot more than a guy in Parra whos been below average defensively the last 3 seasons, and is having easily his best career offensive season. Not even mentioning hes an impending FA.
Below average defensively? He won a Gold Glove in 2013 with a 4.0 dWAR. He has been a part time player in 2014-15, so he couldn’t accumulate WAR, but he is still a great defender. So you DON’T want to trade for him because he is having his best offensive year? Would it be better if he was having a mediocre year?
As of right now, Singleton is Brett Wallace or Matt LaPorta. In short, he easily could be a AAAA first baseman. He has done nothing to prove he belongs in the big leagues despite the extended time he has seen ML pitching. He still has potential, but he is definitely a flawed prospect now. With Houston looking like a winning team already, he is not going to get a chance to fix himself there and they will want to get out from under the long term deal he is signed to.
Let’s not try to sugar coat things. He is average at best defensively and it is quite clear when I watch him. Still his bat and versatility should make him very attractive.
You aren’t watching closely. Parra takes great angles to balls, covers plenty of ground and has a decent arm. He misses cutoff men a bit too often but that’s really his only defensive flaw.
His routes are ok, decent range at the corners, arm is good, as you said cutoff man doesn’t exist, and lastly his jumps are bad. Loves to run in and get beat much like Braun does. He is an average fielder. He isn’t what he used to be.
I’d add Mike Olt and Matt Davidson to your list of Singleton comparisons. There have been countless highly rated prospects with big time power that can make enough contact to stick in the major leagues. If they wanted to, Brewers could hold on to Parra and just give him a QO, then wait and see if he accepts or signs elsewhere. It’s not like he’s washed up at 28.
Singleton may not be performing well for his talent, but he’s still better player than wallace IMO. He actually knows how to uses his lower half of his body and get into deep counts.
Not hitting in the majors is a rather significant flaw in Singleton’s game don’t you think? The Brewers have a 1B at AAA hitting .400/.456/.750 with 6 HR and just 9 K’s in 68 ABs. No on Singleton for Parra. No, he’s never been the highly rated prospect, and he’s already 27 but Jason Rogers has hit every where he’s been.
It’s complete nonsense that Parra’s “below average” defensively. All that shows is how poor defensive metrics really are. It’s mostly based on him making a few ill advised throws that allowed runners to move up.
No thanks I would want someone a little more promising. I think the Brewers could do better.
Exactly. A lot of teams could use Parra. Going after former highly rated prospects for him would be foolish.
I’m not against going after someone former prospect who still has some nice potential. But a guy who hit .170 in extended time and nearly striking out 50% is NOT something with a lot of potential. Very limited ceiling with those kind of numbers. I’d honestly rather have some A ball player.
What about Javier Baez? He hit poorly and struck out about 50% of the time in extended time. I’d bet most Brewers fans would trade Parra for him in a heartbeat. I’m not saying Singleton is Baez, but he was a very highly rated prospect. People have been getting spoiled with how quickly some rookies take to the majors. A lot of good players have an adjustment period. It’s too early to give up on Singleton.
.170 BA and 50% strikout rate is past adjusting. He may improve, but even then he isn’t anything with that and his defense. He would need to drastically improve.
Ever think Baez might be a flop too? Why are you assuming Baez is goi to be better?
Because Baez has had only 200 mlb ABs as a 21 yr old. Alittle early to call him a flop for that. And he was slashing 314/386/536 at aaa before breaking his finger. Not every 21 yr old is harper and trout when they’re called up
I loved Parra for years. He could beat an opposing team so many ways. He’s only 28. I don’t know what happened as I don’t follow the DBacks closely. Can only assume he had some sort of injury.
It’s probably been said a bunch already, but really, is holding onto Hamels past the deadline going to achieve much in terms of helping the return? After this season, RAJ will have a tough task ahead of him in trying to market Hamels during a FA with a pretty massive span of SP’s of all different levels, on top of Hamels having a half season less control, which really does mean something in terms of value. I don’t advocate them selling low on him, but really, I’d be hoping to no end that RAJ is busy as could be in the next 13 days and keeping an open mind in negotiations, because there’s not going to be a more prime time to collect on him.
I know that Amaro doesn’t really have the final say in trades anymore (he answers to Gillick), but really, if Hamels is still in a Phillies uniform come August, that should be the final straw that gets Amaro fired.
“It can be difficult to justify trading a talented prospect for 12 starts”
Teams do that quite often though, 13 Matt Garza starts bought in Carl (CJ) Edwards, Mike Olt, Neil Ramirez & Justin Grimm.
Is there a single scenario where the Cubs can get Hamels w/o giving up Russell, Bryant (lol) or Schwarber? I’d trade Schwarber & McKinney for him because IMO that’s a good value for both teams, but I doubt Theo does that.
If Theo/Hoyer threw out a Torres, McKinney, Edwards, Vogelbach offer I think the Phils would at least consider it. Torres’ stock has skyrocketed and I think he’s a nice sell high piece. Agree/disagree Phils fans?
I don’t see the Cubs getting Hamels without throwing in one of Schwarber, Bryant or Russell. But hey, you got Russell for a year and a half of one-season wonder Jeff Samardzija so…
It is laughable how much more valuable Russell is than Hamels. As for Bryant, well, you might as well have suggested the Angels would offer Trout for Hamels. It’s almost that ridiculous.
Uhhh Russell was traded for Samardzija and Hamels is way more valuable than he was at the time.
Russell was traded for Samardzija and Jason Hammel in what was clearly a “win now” move for the A’s. It was also pretty clearly an overpay. Considering that Hamels costs a lot more than either of those two, I’d also say you’re overestimating how much more valuable Hamels is than Samardzija was at the time (though I concede is more valuable). Not to mention that Russell has only gotten more valuable in the past year.
But don’t make the mistake of taking a trade or signing that everyone agrees in retrospect was a mistake, and using that as an estimate of player valuation going forward. That’s what huckster agents like Scott Boras try to do, and it has very little to do with the reality of how teams will actually evaluate players in the future.
Samardzija is a one season wonder who at the time of the trade had a year and a half of team control left. Hamels is a proven ace who is under contract for 3 more years with an option for a fourth whose total monetary commitment is about half of what comparable pitchers will get in free agency this coming offseason. He is way more valuable than Samardzija.
If I was a Cubs fan the only guys I’d want to trade would be Baez, Castro (if some team takes that whole deal) or Vogelbach.
With everyone being so young and good, holding tight and then just signing David Price in the offseason is so much a better move than playing trade deadline games.
I think my Padres would be willing to take Castro off your hands. Not sure how much you would get back for him tho.
The Cole Hamels trade rumors has been going on for a couple seasons now it would be nice to finally get this fiasco to end. That said the Phillies still need more time to evaluate prospects must be some kind of joke.
Its Roy Oswalt all over again.
As a Phillies fan, I cannot foresee any way that Hamels is traded to Boston. However, I think K. Giles would be a nice fit as their next closer. For the Boston fans, would you want to see Giles in Fenway, and if so, what would you think would be a fair trade? If both teams were presented with a Margot for Giles trade, who would hang up first…or would they both hang on to discuss?
I think a Margot for Giles trade is very much fair value in terms of a trade, but I’m not sure if the Red Sox do it. I think they will continue to hoard their prospects until they fix their rotation. Right now, they really need a top of the rotation arm for the future and I think they will keep all their prospects in order for them to be able to make that trade (if it ever happens). Having Margot included in a deal for an ace could be the deciding factor in a team agreeing to do the trade, so I think they’ll hang on to him for now. Also with this season potentionally looking like another bad year for the Red Sox (with the next few days being the deciding factor to their season), they might just choose to fix their bullpen problem via free agency next year while auditioning some of their relief arms in AAA for a potential role in 2016.
As a Red Sox fan, how can you honestly look at Hamels career performance in interleague and want to give up anything decent for him? He’s awful in the AL.
The Red Sox aren’t seriously in contention at this point, and should not be trading any of their top prospects at the deadline. I would be surprised if they were to pull any big deals either direction. Perhaps somebody will want Victorino or Napoli? Or Uehara may be useful to a contender?
I think they will be looking at pitching right now, so long as the pitching is controlled through next year at least. This season might be over, but that won’t stop them from making upgrades for 2016 and beyond.
Not at the price that Amaro has been asking for Hamels. If he doesn’t get dealt, there might be room for agreement in the off-season.
Yeah, I don’t think they deal for Hamels at this point, but I wouldn’t be surprised if they add a starting pitcher via trade if they see a great opportunity to do so. If the Red Sox don’t make a trade for a top of the line pitcher prior to the offseason, I hope they just go out and sign one of the ones available via free agency (they more than likely won’t however) so that way they can keep all the prospects and make sure they don’t trade away the one that could end up developing into a special player.
I don’t see that trade happening. Its rare to see a rebuilding team ( Which for all intents and purposes the Red Sox are and have been since the summer of 2012 beside the magic that was 2013.) trade for a top tier closer. I think Margot can be a piece they can try to develope into the offense or trade for a good arm with other pieces.
Thanks to you and Draven for your feedback. You’re both probably right that it won’t happen. If you care to entertain an outsider’s opinion on what the Sox should do, let me offer this.
I would not sacrifice the future for today. Nor would I wait around for the future to come. I would not trade the young talent that is already contributing at the major league level I would try more of a hybrid approach. The main thing is to improve the pitching staff. No offense to you guys, but I just don’t think the staff is very good.
Here’s my 10 point plan for the Sox. Some will be at deadline and some in off-season. I’ll warn you, this may hurt a bit.
1) Make a Don Corleone offer for Sonny Gray that Billy Beane cannot refuse. I don’t know what it would take, but it will definitely involve some pain. Here’s what I will throw out there but please feel free to call me an idiot and make your own suggestion. Moncado, Castillo, Owens, and Devers.
2) Trade Margot and JBJ and a bag of balls to Phil’s for Giles, Diekman and D. Brown (the bag of balls is for Dom Brown.)
3) Trade Uehara for prospects
4) Sign FA ace. I recommend Cueto.
5) Trade Rick Porcello for prospects. Sacrifice poor return for not eating any salary. Will help accommodate Cueto’s salary.
6) Trade Ramirez at deadline for prospects. (I know you love his bat but in the end you will be better off without him)
7) Trade Masterson for prospects
8) Trade Bucholtz for a good young outfielder to replace Ramirez.
9) Trade and Napoli for a good young 1st baseman.
10) Put Kelly in bull pen or trade for prospects.
Again feel free to call me an idiot. I will not be offended and we’re not exactly curing cancer here. You have to admit, it would be pretty sweet having a rotation of Cueto, Gray, E-Rod, Miley, and Johnson as well as a good, young, and inexpensive closer, and replace Hanley’s defense with a younger, good outfielder which I think you could easily get for Bucholtz, and a better 1st baseman.
I think the end result will make you better in the short term while staying young. With the trades suggested, I think you might even decrease payroll, even with the addition of Cueto. It also doesn’t require you having to decide if you are a buyer or seller.
That’s what I call an overhaul and I am sure Ortiz and Pedroia would want no part of that.
MLBTR, July 18, 2017
“However, some are now saying that the Phillies may hold on to Hamels until the offseason…”
Of course they will. The deadline ain’t exactly the right place to trade a player like Hamels. Other pitchers are available cheaper due to the fact that they are pure rentals. “go for it” mid/low-market teams teams will not shy away from that fact.
if Cole gets traded, I can actually only see 2 destinations: Boston and Dodgers. Both have untouchables (Mookie, X, Swihart, likely Devers and Moncada / Pederson, Urias, Seager), but also some interesting top 50 prospects who might be enticing enough for Philly to take as centerpieces. One decent Red Sox package for example: Margot (potential plus-plus defender in CF already in AA, Owens (lefty ; #3 upside with control issues) + fillers. Not saying it would be enough, but I bet it’s a lot closer than what the Phillies have been dreaming of for several months now. They have to let the Betts’ and Pederson’s (both are actually WAY more valuable than Hamels) go
Gerrardo Parra hits for very little power and doesn’t steal any bases. Why would the astros even consider him?
Carlos Gomez on that Astros team would be craaaazy.